I have to do all the research for you? BTW, this is what's coming from an article PRAISING Belhaj.

http://www.middleeastmonitor.org.uk/resources/reports-and-publications/2784-who-is-abdul-hakim-belhadj-the-leader-of-the-libyan-rebels

However, the efforts of another Libyan opposition leader, Shaikh Ali Salaabi, ensured that Belhadj's role was not over, despite the hardship.

Salaabi took advantage of the relative level of openness in Libya during the last few years of Gaddafi's rule to promote a reconciliation project with the support of the dictator's son, Saif al-Islam Gaddafi, and some of his fellow liberals and Islamists living in London. Colonel Gaddafi was persuaded that the political direction of the Islamic Fighting Group was safe and that there was a need to turn the page on the past and move forward by releasing the Islamists.

His release in March 2010, along with 214 others from Abu Salim Prison, was the first time that something like that had happened in Libya's history. There was a great deal of media coverage of the event that was to change the course of contemporary Libyan history and lay the basis for ideological reviews in a number of other Arab countries.

Abdul Hakim Belhadj was one of the most balanced members of the Group; he believed that the confrontation with the Libyan regime in 1995 was premature and instigated by the Libyan security forces. Nevertheless, all members of the "free Libya" project understood that the overthrow of Gaddafi would only be achieved through force of arms.

Scores of demonstrators fell in Benghazi, the stronghold of the revolution, turning the quiet city into the nemesis of the colonel and his collaborators; but 2011 was quite different from 1995. Abdel-Hakim Belhadj and his companions carried arms and he was later appointed by the Interim Libyan Council to lead the most decisive battles against Gaddafi.

This is just one of many articles proving there were various instigators to the violence that started Feb 15th in Benghazi. This article fails to mention the extreme havoc the protesters caused in Benghazi and other Libyan cities before the crackdown began.

I have quotes, from reuters, regarding that also.

I read your replies and I will take the time to watch those videos and possibly download them before they go off YouTube. Thank you for that. I'm in Maryland, where are you?

I see what she's saying, but she is not even considering anything that goes against her CNN inspired beliefs. The reports from Feb. 15th clearly state that it had nothing to do with democracy.

Anyway, im in maryland too. We are probably right next to each other.

BlackLibya:

I see what she's saying, but she is not even[b] considering anything that goes against her CNN inspired beliefs.[/b] The reports from Feb. 15th clearly state that it had nothing to do with democracy.

Anyway, im in maryland too. We are probably right next to each other.

No make me call you mo=ron.

No make me call you mo=ron.   Undecided

im just saying sweetie, u must not have looked at the reports becuz if u did, u would see they were not protesting for democracy.

If you read the article i posted, you would see there were groups waiting for some type of disturbance to begin trying to depose Ghaddafi. If you think they were dumb enough to not expect the West to jump on board, then i dont know what to say to you.

Tunmi:

Kobo sees it as a fight for democracy. I know and you know and some others know it did not start out as that. When we pointed out her fallacy, she gave the "I didn't ask for that" bit. She can stick to her principles, and I'll stick to mine. Whoever has the time can peruse through these forums and make their own decisions as to whatever. 

The protests in Tunisia and Egypt had a lot of people assuming Libya would go the same way. And honestly, the "fight for democracy" has always been the best excuse to invade a nation. Iraq, check. Afghanistan, check.

I read your replies and I will take the time to watch those videos and possibly download them before they go off YouTube. Thank you for that. I'm in Maryland, where are you?

Again, you attempt EVADE the question, pretending instead that  YOU HAVE MIND READING ABILITIES. Please go back, read my questions to you, and FREAKING ANSWER THEM ALREADY!!

BlackLibya:

im just saying sweetie, u must not have looked at the reports becuz if u did, u would see they were not protesting for democracy.

If you read the article i posted, you would see there were groups waiting for some type of disturbance to begin trying to depose Ghaddafi. If you think they were dumb enough to not expect the West to jump on board, then i dont know what to say to you.

Like I said, do not make me deem you another one of them mo=rons with access to the internet.

Like I said, do not make me deem you another one of them mo=rons with access to the internet. Undecided

Can you show me a news report from Feb 15th that says they were protesting democracy? I dont see how I am being a slowpoke because I disagree with what you are saying.

I have shown you proof of what I say so you can see why im saying it. I dont want to seem closed minded, please show me a news report from Feb 15th that says they were protesting for democracy. I apologize if I offended you with the "cnn inspired" remark.

BlackLibya:

One does not need philosophers and such to make and propose ideas.

well,you would agree they have actually been the proponents of what we are enjoying now.all the isms, the social crusaders and social philosophers who paved the way for child rights,fundamental rights e.t.c

BlackLibya:

The African forms of govt were usually sufficient, and the African democracies were far superior than anything in the West. The problem with the European as opposed to African democracy, is that the European democracy is based on the individual. The democracy is setup to protect the minority at the cost of disrupting the majority. The legislative process itself is filled with so many checks and balances, that the only way to overcome them is with corruption. In the African democracy, if the group does not benefit, it does not go, because chiefs were truly accountable to their villages, by more than just being elected or not as you mentioned, lets not forget the religious element.

true but the western democracy introduced the concept of individual rights which in turn protected the vulnerable which wasn't so prior to the western incursion into africa while i agree with the above assertion like i have earlier stated in the old empires is where you find a king being buried with his living servants to go serve him in the thereafter,kings would set eyes on another man's wife and by fiat commandeer her into the palace.such would have still being going on if not for that individual rights which you are dismissing with derision

BlackLibya:

That is the concept of an empire or federation dear sir. A nation, is one people, one religion, etc, and etc.

i know,i was using the tenets to illustrate my point rather than the term itself the point i am making is that irrespective of the system of governance as long as different classes,religious persuasions,genders e.t.c have to be catered to,then one needs a form of governance that will give them all a say on how they want to be governed a pure democracy is the only form of governance apart from communism

BlackLibya:

In the European democracy, it is conditioned around the system of capitalism, which causes the aggregation of capital. Aggregation of one resource by one group causes imbalance, since capital and not barter is the means of all transactions in this system, aggregators of capital have undue influence over the paralyzed democratic system. This gives them absolute power.

well lets face it,which forms of governance does not have capitalism inter woven with it in the real sense of it?lets look at the african empires with the traders,the trade in slaves amongst villagers,cities e.t.c which fuelled wars and battles
speaking of the oyo empire which i am familiar with they even had a male and female equivalent of a chancellor of the exchequer i.e the iyalode and the otunba the point of my preamble is this the rich have always had undue influence over the general public that is a given but the checks and balances is what makes the difference

BlackLibya:

Communism is a centralized govt. Centralized govts cannot effectively distribute resources equally, because the nature of centralization requires hoarding of resources at one point. This creates imbalance, and leads to corruption.

well if you consider the basic and underlying ideals of communism then you will realise that resources are distributed strictly based on wants,so how is this not equal?corruption will be totally discouraged or cut down to the barest minimum because there is transparency and accountability at every step of the bureaucratic ladder.
the community leaders who gets delivery of the resources are accountable to the people and unlike other systems of governance can cut the red tape and complain to the superiors if they feel short changed as another advantage of communism is the open door policy.the only situation where you find corruption is when capitalism which i consider as a cancer to communism has been surreptously introduced to a communist govt.pls visit cuba or ask anyone who has been there and you will see the beauty of communism

BlackLibya:

agreed, except i dont think the west modernized it, they merely imposed their own system.

well then but you will agree in the wake of this modernity were some life saving additions some of which i mentioned in my comments above i.e fundamental rights of the individuals,the vulnerable

I find it odd that Nairalamd does not have private messaging capabilities. Anyway, to avoid the public display of personal information, send me an email.

Only uneducated mind are celebrating,i want to say here that africa will not produce a leader like ghadafi for a very long time;a leader that can stand face 2 face with the west,nobody can tell me catigorically that this is gadafi's crimes apart from long stay in power and curruption which is the fashion in africa for decades nigeria as a headquarter. I want to ask the FRENCH GOVERNMENT this question,if u help murder gadafi for over staying in power,what is preventing you from removing paul biya of cameroun that has been there before i was born,the america is always pocknosing in every countries affair especially oil rich countries.I JUST PITY LIBYIAN,because they do not no what they have done,six month is the period i am given to them they will no that gadafi was a great leader and he die as a HERO!

^^^^^^
six months is even way to long to wait,the feudal and tribal leaders in libya have started wrangling already over where to bury ghadaffi and his son.pro ghadaffi mostly from his hometown who make up on side want him to be buried in sirte,while anti ghadaffi are also wrangling within themselves with one side asking for him to be buried in secret while the other don't care.the frightening reality is that this will become gradually worse over the coming months so don't be surprised that by the time your 6 months prediction comes round suicide bombing will be the order of the day, something that wasn't exciting prior to the western "LIBERATION'

@all, please kindly disregard and ignore Kobojunkie, she is not here for any rational discussion, enligtenment or constructive argument.

@Kobojunkie, once again you did a good job of leading them on, thinking you have anything to contribute apart from asking questions, having them answered then evading the answers or any questions asked meanwhile following it up with new questions; all without ever offerring or backing up a single claim of yours. Guess you didn't record your CNN, FOX NEWS AND ABC brain-washing sessions.

Hope to see you attacking me when next you get on here to unwind and chill, enjoy and have fun at it(my free gift to you)!

sosodat:

@all, please kindly disregard and ignore Kobojunkie, she is not here for any rational discussion, enligtenment or constructive argument.

@Kobojunkie, once again you did a good job of leading them on, thinking you have anything to contribute apart from asking questions, having them answered then evading the answers or any questions asked meanwhile following it up with new questions; all without ever offerring or backing up a single claim of yours. Guess you didn't record your CNN, FOX NEWS AND ABC brain-washing sessions.

Hope to see you attacking me when next you get on here to unwind and chill, enjoy and have fun at it(my free gift to you)!

God bless you for this, you know when i argue i argue because i know what am saying without disregarding other people's opinion though, and i argue because i want to learn from other people's view, but when an opinionated female refuse to accept an obvious superior arguement? then i see it as medicority advert.

@all, please kindly disregard and ignore Kobojunkie, she is not here for any rational discussion, enligtenment or constructive argument.

@Kobojunkie, once again you did a good job of leading them on, thinking you have anything to contribute apart from asking questions, having them answered then evading the answers or any questions asked meanwhile following it up with new questions; all without ever offerring or backing up a single claim of yours. Guess you didn't record your CNN, FOX NEWS AND ABC brain-washing sessions.

Hope to see you attacking me when next you get on here to unwind and chill, enjoy and have fun at it(my free gift to you)!

It does make arguing with her rather pointless. If you tell her water is H2O and she asks you for proof, u show her proof, then she will just go on to something else, or never acknowledge that water is H20. She always tells you to show proof, but she never proves anything she says.

Tell me you people still think eliminating Gaddafi was the best thing that happened to the libyans.... *Spits*

I'm sure they are regretting it already

Just30:
I'm sure they are regretting it already

Thats why russia will not allow another western crusaders coup right at their backyard. I tell you a Hilary Clinton led USA would be bad news for peace and stability around the world.

A Trump one might be a bigger disaster.

movmentish:

Thats why russia will not allow another western crusaders coup right at their backyard. I tell you a Hilary Clinton led USA would be bad news for peace and stability around the world.

Ayomipoe:
A Trump one might be a bigger disaster.

Trump is bad news for americans, Hilary is bad news to the world... Are you american, my friend?

As Nigerian as Amala , Trump is even worse news for the world. I have not dug my bunker for WWIII yet . At least she knows what she's doing. And Hilary isnt bad news for the world, although her foreign policy is shit. The world is moving from the previous state of American imperialism/policing, with tech and media contributing heavily. If Trump wins, I might be very surprised.

movmentish:

Trump is bad news for americans, Hilary is bad news to the world... Are you american, my friend?

Ayomipoe:
As Nigerian as Amala , Trump is even worse news for the world. I have not dug my bunker for WWIII yet . At least she knows what she's doing. And Hilary isnt bad news for the world, although her foreign policy is shit. The world is moving from the previous state of American imperialism/policing, with tech and media contributing heavily. If Trump wins, I might be very surprised.

Did you read her nomination speech Hilary would advance its "imperialism/policing" around the world. And after the fiasco in libya, Trump just blabs and dreams of adding USA to his real estate portfolio

Against an aggressive and expansionist Russia? I read one of your earlier post about Russia not allowing America topple governments.
Like I said, their imperialism is fading, the myth they can fix/police the world, I think they are waking up to their own "almost certain implosion".
With Hilary, your getting corporate corruption still, freedom and less segregation.
Did you watch Trump's 3rd debate, the nigga cannot connect with anyone that isn't crazy. At least politically tho.

movmentish:

Did you read her nomination speech Hilary would advance its "imperialism/policing" around the world. And after the fiasco in libya, Trump just blabs and dreams of adding USA to his real estate portfolio

kcjazz:


So? Is it not the Libyans money?

A population of 6 million people plus oil money, I will do better
Plus why does any governement invest in Italy's largest bank if he is anti-western as all you folks claim, when no bank in Libya can compete with even Nigeria's GTB.
Why does Italy maintain its oil fields if he was anti-west?
Why invest in Juventus FC? Who invests in soccer clubs to develop their country? Manchester UTD is the most valuable club and even Leyman Brothers earned more money on their last year of bankruptcy than Manchester United

If he educated his folks really, how come he has Ukranian nurses taking care of him?
Have you read any book by a Libyan author or used any science inventions of a Libyan?
Why does he have African bloods on his hands? Chad, Sierra Leone, Sudan and even possibly Nigeria

When we speak of African heros who fought imperialism then you talk of a man named Thomas Sankara (google him), way ahead of his time in the world and Africa. He supported womens right, educated more women, refused foreign debt and reduced governemnt cost drastically and guess who killed him? Blaise Compaore the current President of Burkina Faso, who was trained and sponsored by your African hero Ghadaffi.

At the end if he were that good, why did his people choose to celebrate his death? The west brainwashed them? He is like the rich man in the village who feeds everyone but suppresses anyone who wants to be richer than him.
At the end will Libya be better? short term No. Long term yes. He ruined his countries institutions cos he was trying to grab unto power and so they will start from scratch now and that process is difficult.

Western puppet! how are you?

dinachi:
Western puppet! how are you?

lol no mind that mumu

movmentish:

Thats why russia will not allow another western crusaders coup right at their backyard. I tell you a Hilary Clinton led USA would be bad news for peace and stability around the world.

we are already in a situation whereby Russia may not support any solution to any conflict at the UN security Council cos of miss trust from the US

kcjazz:


So? Is it not the Libyans money?

A population of 6 million people plus oil money, I will do better
Plus why does any governement invest in Italy's largest bank if he is anti-western as all you folks claim, when no bank in Libya can compete with even Nigeria's GTB.
Why does Italy maintain its oil fields if he was anti-west?
Why invest in Juventus FC? Who invests in soccer clubs to develop their country? Manchester UTD is the most valuable club and even Leyman Brothers earned more money on their last year of bankruptcy than Manchester United

If he educated his folks really, how come he has Ukranian nurses taking care of him?
Have you read any book by a Libyan author or used any science inventions of a Libyan?
Why does he have African bloods on his hands? Chad, Sierra Leone, Sudan and even possibly Nigeria

When we speak of African heros who fought imperialism then you talk of a man named Thomas Sankara (google him), way ahead of his time in the world and Africa. He supported womens right, educated more women, refused foreign debt and reduced governemnt cost drastically and guess who killed him? Blaise Compaore the current President of Burkina Faso, who was trained and sponsored by your African hero Ghadaffi.

At the end if he were that good, why did his people choose to celebrate his death? The west brainwashed them? He is like the rich man in the village who feeds everyone but suppresses anyone who wants to be richer than him.
At the end will Libya be better? short term No. Long term yes. He ruined his countries institutions cos he was trying to grab unto power and so they will start from scratch now and that process is difficult.

You have a very poor sense of Judgement and you are easily deceived by what you hear than what you can sense..

yoji:
guys sorry to burst ur bubble bur gaddafi had it coming. firstly he toppled a government so stop givin d impression dat his pple put him there. now he ruled for 42yrs, probably hopin to die there and then allowing saif his son to take over and rule till death too!! haba
for most of u dat admire his anti western stance, sorry to say but 2 overstayd his welcome. if he was wise, he wud have eased himself out of d scene and installed a sham democracy. dat way he wud hav preservd his legacy and remained relevant.
and about this propadanda of d west coming for thia oil, is it free of charge or dont they pay for iit anymore?
its so convinient to blame d west for all our problems

Nigerians are just DULL

texazzpete:




Libyans have just gained freedom.

If it was just CNN and BBC showing videos of tens of thousands of ordinary Libyans jubilating, you dolts would have had an excuse. Even Al Jazeera and other Arab TV channels show the same footage. Libyans are genuinely happy to see this tyrant and despot gone. Why do you louts think you know more than the people of Libya?



How won't these indices be up when the nation was exporting a crapload of oil daily and had only 6 million mouths to feed? Even YOU would have been hard pressed to run Libya without the people seeing some of the oil proceeds. This is in stark contrast to Nigeria where we have 150+ million mouths to feed.

Libyans will not miss the era when stormtroopers could kick down the door, yank away their daddies and bury them in shallow graves with impunity. They will be pleased to have the power to select their own leaders. And they will continue to enjoy all these benefits of the oil because - as i'm tired of explaining to you simpletons - their country sells 1.5 m barrels of oil daily and has a population of only 6 million!

I only wish you cowards had the sense and the balls to be as passionate about rapes in Congo, suffering in Zimbabwe and genocide in Darfur. You people don't care about Africa, stop pretending. You're just a bunch of teenagers who scoff down anything they read on conspiracy theorist websites.

Your signature contracts your foresight ability

Kobojunkie:
Please go get for yourselves lives. The people he ruled over for 42 years are not complaining . . . na you go come matter?? Abeg shove it and look for the day you can become master of your own domain there for naija first.

Do you remember this comment? Are the people complaining now? That's if they are still alive. How is Libya now? Where is the democracy?

texazzpete:




Libyans have just gained freedom.

If it was just CNN and BBC showing videos of tens of thousands of ordinary Libyans jubilating, you dolts would have had an excuse. Even Al Jazeera and other Arab TV channels show the same footage. Libyans are genuinely happy to see this tyrant and despot gone. Why do you louts think you know more than the people of Libya?



How won't these indices be up when the nation was exporting a crapload of oil daily and had only 6 million mouths to feed? Even YOU would have been hard pressed to run Libya without the people seeing some of the oil proceeds. This is in stark contrast to Nigeria where we have 150+ million mouths to feed.

Libyans will not miss the era when stormtroopers could kick down the door, yank away their daddies and bury them in shallow graves with impunity. They will be pleased to have the power to select their own leaders. And they will continue to enjoy all these benefits of the oil because - as i'm tired of explaining to you simpletons - their country sells 1.5 m barrels of oil daily and has a population of only 6 million!

I only wish you cowards had the sense and the balls to be as passionate about rapes in Congo, suffering in Zimbabwe and genocide in Darfur. You people don't care about Africa, stop pretending. You're just a bunch of teenagers who scoff down anything they read on conspiracy theorist websites.

What do you see in Libya now?

akbahbah:
For sure, Libyans will live to regret this FOREVER!!!. I think they all clamour for democracy and now i think they are getting it. fine, 90% of the countries where democracy is being practised are not enjoying what libyans are enjoying. Well i will welcome libyans to the real era of TYRANNY. THEY HAVE CALLED FOR IT AND THEY HAVE FOUND IT.

If they are not regretting now, it may be that they are dead.

They're already regretting