No matter how harsh any govt policy seems, There are one thousand and one reasons to take sides. I must commend the energy and doggdness you invest in defending Pdp and your head master oga joe. Even Aldof Hitler has supporters! But history has a special karma for your kinds.

Chubhie:

No matter how harsh any govt policy seems, There are one thousand and one reasons to take sides. I must commend the energy and doggdness you invest in defending Pdp and your head master oga joe. Even Aldof Hitler has supporters! But history has a special karma for your kinds.

Forget about me and worry for yourself. By the way, I think you and dplordx should hitch up, you both have a dark, leaden, unrefined aura of the night.
I prefer bright, cerebral types who blossom with idea's and are mentally agile. Thank you.

@beaf another questn, since there is no provision for d subsidy in d budget, n u claim govt borrows to finance d subsidy, where will d money for d SURE projects come from

Hardunnii:

@beaf another questn, since there is no provision for d subsidy in d budget, n u claim govt borrows to finance d subsidy, where will d money for d SURE projects come from

It will come from the FG's increased budget. It shouldn't take 1.3trillion to make a difference to the man on the street.

^^^^ you not cut down d cost of running govt and use d money to make d diff?? Why shud it have to be d masses to bear the brunt

^^^ y not

So we are to pay N1tr extra from our sweat to enjoy regular fuel alone. How come the fuel only became constant we smuggling was at its peak.
If Gej gov can go through over $70b with nothing to show 4 it, i wonder what $8b/year will do for them.

Beaf:

^
I would support it, but I wouldn't want it. In any case, there is no choice, it would have been impossible to keep the subsidy. We had very detailed warnings from financial guru's like Okonjo Iweala and Sanusi.

Were there fuel queues day-inday-out in Obj and Yar Adua's times? That should answer your question.
Abundant fuel costs much more than no fuel. Seen?

And, I do not know more about GEJ's govt than you do, I am a regular NLer like the next person.

^
The money you are talking about went into fuel. As you know, fuel isn't free; neither can we keep borrowing to feed a bad habit. Other countries borrow to grow their economies.

Hardunnii:

^^^^ you not cut down d cost of running govt and use d money to make d diff?? Why shud it have to be d masses to bear the brunt

Are the masses bearing the brunt? Its too early to say so; govts plans would have to fail first.
There will be pain, no doubt, but there is light at the other end of the tunnel. I want to trust GEJ for 6 months as he has promised. June is just around the corner and closer than we think.

As for govt cutting costs, I believe that demonstrations will aid that; it is impossible for one man to to face down the entire NASS and governors, but the streets can cause the NASS to eat humble pie. There is no reason on Earth why they should take more home than Obama does. Its just damn annoying and the generality of people need to make strong demands for the drastic reduction of their obscene pay packets and perks.

Beaf:

Forget about me and worry for yourself. By the way, I think you and dplordx should hitch up, you both have a dark, leaden, unrefined aura of the night.
I prefer bright, cerebral types who blossom with idea's and are mentally agile. Thank you.

Alas you puting your mouth where your pay comes from. I respect that. However, according to you and oga jonah the masses should endure the antecedent hardships for 6months? What you and Pdp are good at is giving hopless hope to the masses. It pains me that a guy as your headmaster rode on the goodwill of the masses only to jump ship? The end justifies the means? This goes to show that all politicians are rogues. My heart goes out to real men out there who battle against all odds in this jungle to stay afloat. This is a burden we must al live with-Headmaster GEJ.

Beaf:

^
The money you are talking about went into fuel. As you know, fuel isn't free; neither can we keep borrowing to feed a bad habit. Other countries borrow to grow their economies.

why not expand on the qouted comment above.
Benefits to the mass has now become a 'bad habit' because the govt can't keep corruption in check,

^
What quoted comment?

Chubhie:

Alas you puting your mouth where your pay comes from. I respect that. However, according to you and oga jonah the masses should endure the antecedent hardships for 6months? What you and Pdp are good at is giving hopless hope to the masses. It pains me that a guy as your headmaster rode on the goodwill of the masses only to jump ship? The end justifies the means? This goes to show that all politicians are rogues. My heart goes out to real men out there who battle against all odds in this jungle to stay afloat. This is a burden we must al live with-Headmaster GEJ.

I am not paid by anybody. You stick to such crappy stories because your brain is too weak and dried out to cope with the level of stuff I put out.
Try something else or head for the romance section were intelligence is not required and stup!dity might be admired.

I'm sure your English name is, dimwit!

sheyguy:

why not expand on the qouted comment above.
Benefits to the mass has now become a 'bad habit' because the govt can't keep corruption in check,

Chubhie:

Alas you puting your mouth where your pay comes from. I respect that. However, according to you and oga jonah the masses should endure the antecedent hardships for 6months? What you and Pdp are good at is giving hopless hope to the masses. It pains me that a guy as your headmaster rode on the goodwill of the masses only to jump ship? The end justifies the means? This goes to show that all politicians are rogues. My heart goes out to real men out there who battle against all odds in this jungle to stay afloat. This is a burden we must al live with-Headmaster GEJ.

why are you even asking an apologist for corruption and incompetnec outside nigeria who has no idea what is happening?

beaf is posting from the luxury of uninterrupted power supply, maybe from a train, maybe from a cafe with wifi -

he is as clueless as his master, spamming this board with empty platitudes that mean nothing.

there is no benefit in this for the average nigerian, immediate, future or otherwise

what we have right now is an increase in our cost of living.

this will not have any cushioning effect whatsoever on our foreign reserve because we are still importing fuel. the foreign reserves will still go down

all the bloated govt parastatls will further revise their budgets. you think those advisers and ministers will pay for this out of their pockets

ditto for NASS.

the only immediate winners are marketers. tho who have plenty of petrol in their depots will make a crazy killing. happy new year from gej to the major marketers

i suspect otedola has millions of litres of petrol in storage right now

Mumu Policies In Action

I am very sure massive savings will be found - In reducing the cost of Government. The Culprits who inflate fuel import figures - why not tackle that leakage.

show me any sane leader that spends 1 billion naira on food for himself and family.

^
Did you spot any smugglers on your way to work?

Enjoy your pdp blood money while it lasts. I Have seen lots of your kind in govt before. Goodluck with your spining.

How could anybody's English name be, dimwit?

Beaf:

How could anybody's English name be, dimwit?

Beaf, many nigerians,especially those who live in lagos, are lamenting that they are not able to go home now because they cannot afford to due to the hike in fuel price. They have spent most of their money while at village and only saved up as much as they thought they needed to arrive back home. Had they been given an exact date of the subsidy removal, they would have tread back on their spending,but, because of the surprised removal they had no way of knowing to do so now they are stuck. How is this to be remedied? Also take into mind, Jonathan admin said that the subsidy would be removed  some time in april i believe. why the sudden change with no announcement before hand, at least around mid december? How is it that a state of emergency and fuel subsidy can be announced by the pres all at the same time as if it is a game or a big surprise gift? It makes it seem as though he waited for a build up or special time(New Years, Christmas, Halloween, Easter,Igbo Day,etc.). Why would a leader play around with lives like that?

,,,,,,,,,

@oyb: I'm still not convinced. Yes, the legitimate marketers suffer slightly in that they have to compete against subsidized oil. Yes, the smugglers are criminals and probably have connections to unsavory elements.

However, if your neighbor is spending $7 billion a year, you would do well to vacuum as much of his money away as possible and bring it into your own economy

If the city next to me spend decided to subsidize McDonalds out of their pocket, the McDonald's in our town would suffer, but in the aggregate we would win. A huge win, not a small one either.

Anyway it is all speculation, we don't have #s to back it up. But I know which way I'd be betting, at least.

And of course I agree that the government doesn't benefit. But the people of the country benefit.

ekt_bear:

@oyb: I'm still not convinced. Yes, the legitimate marketers suffer slightly in that they have to compete against subsidized oil. Yes, the smugglers are criminals and probably have connections to unsavory elements.

However, if your neighbor is spending $7 billion a year, you would do well to vacuum as much of his money away as possible and bring it into your own economy

If the city next to me spend decided to subsidize McDonalds out of their pocket, the McDonald's in our town would suffer, but in the aggregate we would win. A huge win, not a small one either.

Anyway it is all speculation, we don't have #s to back it up. But I know which way I'd be betting, at least.

The key point here is the incompetence of the Nigerian government. Should the Nigerian people suffer because the Nigerian government looks the other way while petroleum products are smuggled out of the country? Shouldn't the government's first task be to end smuggling operations? I am not impressed with the smuggling angle because the government isn't even truthful enough to admit its incompetence/complicity in the smuggling shame.

As for economic benefits of subsidy removal, there are none because wealth is not created, it is merely transferred to the coffers of the Nigerian government which will be mis-managed and stolen as usual. Secondly, the disposable income of the average Nigerian will reduce considerably and consequently, hurting many non-essential industries such as telecomms, entertainment, hospitality.

ekt_bear:

And of course I agree that the government doesn't benefit. But the people of the country benefit.

The supposed benefits to the Nigerian people are lost on me; can you elaborate on the benefits of subsidy removal?

Those of u swearing and cursing Beaf sound like fuel smugglers, and subsidy removal sound like bad busines for u guys.

This is the time to think to see what opportunity of subsidy removal can benefit u and the citizen, the communication sector is a success story why can't energy be a sucess story if  government implement their plans?.

The fuel price is just 0.75 euro cent.

Katsumoto:

The key point here is the incompetence of the Nigerian government. Should the Nigerian people suffer because the Nigerian government looks the other way while petroleum products are smuggled out of the country? Shouldn't the government's first task be to end smuggling operations? I am not impressed with the smuggling angle because the government isn't even truthful enough to admit its incompetence/complicity in the smuggling shame.

As for economic benefits of subsidy removal, there are none because wealth is not created, it is merely transferred to the coffers of the Nigerian government which will be mis-managed and stolen as usual. Secondly, the disposable income of the average Nigerian will reduce considerably and consequently, hurting many non-essential industries such as telecomms, entertainment, hospitality.

The supposed benefits to the Nigerian people are lost on me; can you elaborate on the benefits of subsidy removal?

Heh, you missed @oyb and I's discussion. We were talking about the benefits to the Benin Republic of Nigeria keeping the subsidy in place.

Regarding Nigeria, I maintain the position I have always had. If the Nigerian government spends the money saved on the subsidy removal on meaningful infrastructure projects that benefit Nigerians, then you'll get a larger b[i]a[/i]ng for the buck than spending those dollars subsidizing fuel.

So really what it boils down to is, do you believe the Nigerian government will be earnest this time?

I don't blame anyone for being skeptical. I do see and understand that the Nigerian government has a credibility gap.

But I think that this step has potential, if they come up with good plans for the money and actually follow up reasonably well.

And the way GEJ has done this, he is risking his entire reputation and legacy on it. Okonjo-Iweala and the rest of them too. So again, it boils down to how much faith you have in them.

Is this thread still up? Heavens shut it down!

ekt_bear:

Heh, you missed @oyb and I's discussion. We were talking about the benefits to the Benin Republic of Nigeria keeping the subsidy in place.

Regarding Nigeria, I maintain the position I have always had. [b]If the Nigerian government spends the money saved on the subsidy removal on meaningful infrastructure projects that benefit Nigerians, then you'll get a larger b[i]a[/i]ng for the buck than spending those dollars subsidizing fuel.

So really what it boils down to is, do you believe the Nigerian government will be earnest this time?

I don't blame anyone for being skeptical. I do see and understand that the Nigerian government has a credibility gap.

But I think that this step has potential, if they come up with good plans for the money and actually follow up reasonably well.

And the way GEJ has done this, he is risking his entire reputation and legacy on it. Okonjo-Iweala and the rest of them too. So again, it boils down to how much faith you have in them.[/b]

Nigeria earned in excess of $60Billion (i think) from sales of crude oil last year and has averaged over $40 Billion annually in the last decade. Successive Nigerian governments did fork all with those receipts; are we to believe that the incompetent and corrupt Nigerian government will do something meaningful with the additional $6/7 billion? It is like saying that a man who mis-manages his trust fund (yielding $500,000 annually) will suddenly become George Soros with an additional increase of $20,000 to his trust fund. I have no faith or trust in the current crop of politicians including Okonjo-Iweala. Like they say, he who pays the piper, dictates the tune. These chaps don't care about reputation when they know they can retire with billion dollar pensions courtesy the Nigerian people government.

I am almost certain, nothing good will come out of this move for the Nigerian people.

@ ekt_bear

There is no 'If' theyll spend the money meanigfully. A guy spending [size=13pt]$16000[/size] a day on food is not a man you can trust   PDP is definition of corruption money will be chopped or stashed for them to Rig in 2015 liek they rigged in 2011 unless they are toppled before then  

Also, the Nigerian government's inability to control its borders is nothing new.

Honestly I'm not even sure it is that easy in general, when you have the existing wealth/cost gradient between Nigeria and its neighbors.

Hell, how effective is the US at patrolling its border with Mexico? That border is basically wide open as far as drugs go, and pretty permeable as far as human beings go.

A policy (like the fuel subsidy) that implicitly depends on your ability to secure your border, in a country where:

a) the last military dictator (Abacha) was from Chad
b) and supposedly this Buruji Kashamu fellow in the Ogun PDP is from the Benin Republic

probably isn't going to work out too well, lol.

ekt_bear:

Also, the Nigerian government's inability to control its borders is nothing new.

Honestly I'm not even sure it is that easy in general, when you have the existing wealth/cost gradient between Nigeria and its neighbors.

Hell, how effective is the US at patrolling its border with Mexico? That border is basically wide open as far as drugs go, and pretty permeable as far as human beings go.

A policy (like the fuel subsidy) that implicitly depends on your ability to secure your border, in a country where:



probably isn't going to work out too well, lol.

think israelis and their security fence. think the berlin wall. i remeber in some

a) the last military dictator (Abacha) was from Chad
b) and supposedly this Buruji Kashamu fellow in the Ogun PDP is from the Benin Republic

go easy on the conspiracy theories , u're supposed to pass it not hold onto it

ekt_bear:

Also, the Nigerian government's inability to control its borders is nothing new.

Honestly I'm not even sure it is that easy in general, when you have the existing wealth/cost gradient between Nigeria and its neighbors.

Hell, how effective is the US at patrolling its border with Mexico? That border is basically wide open as far as drugs go, and pretty permeable as far as human beings go.

A policy (like the fuel subsidy) that implicitly depends on your ability to secure your border, in a country where:

a) the last military dictator (Abacha) was from Chad
b) and supposedly this Buruji Kashamu fellow in the Ogun PDP is from the Benin Republic

probably isn't going to work out too well, lol.

The US example you gave is different because the US isn't losing money across the border. US assets are not smuggled over the border into Mexico. It is the responsibility of the government with rare commodities/assets to prevent it being smuggled across the border. Is Libyan oil smuggled into Egypt/chad in huge quantities? Is Venezuelan oil smuggled into Colombia/Guyana in huge quantities. Let me give another example; P&G products are cheaper in Poland than in Russia. On the Russian border to get into Belarus, the guards don't check for such consumer goods but on the same border to get into Russia, Guards check for cheap consumer goods coming from Poland because they are significantly cheaper in Poland and the Russian Government together with the cartels in Russia try to limit the flow of Polish goods getting into Russia. Similarly, US customs don't check your goods when driving into the US from Canada but Canadian customs will search your car for cheaper goods from the US. I understand that it is impossible to completely eliminate smuggling but the Nigerian government is not even attempting to prevent/reduce smuggling.

I maintain, the Nigerian people shouldn't suffer for their government's inability to maintain its borders. There are quite a few policies that the government could have pursued to reduce smuggling before it chose to remove the subsidy. Secondly, this $6/7 billion subsidy removal is capable of contracting the Nigerian economy leading to job losses, wealth destruction, and an unbalanced income distribution. In plain language, money will be taken from the people and embezzled by government officials.

Katsumoto:

The US example you gave is different because the US isn't losing money across the border. US assets are not smuggled over the border into Mexico. It is the responsibility of the government with rare commodities/assets to prevent it being smuggled across the border. Is Libyan oil smuggled into Egypt/chad in huge quantities? Is Venezuelan oil smuggled into Colombia/Guyana in huge quantities. Let me give another example; P&G products are cheaper in Poland than in Russia. On the Russian border to get into Belarus, the guards don't check for such consumer goods but on the same border to get into Russia, Guards check for cheap consumer goods coming from Poland because they are significantly cheaper in Poland and the Russian Government together with the cartels in Russia try to limit the flow of Polish goods getting into Russia. Similarly, US customs don't check your goods when driving into the US from Canada but Canadian customs will search your car for cheaper goods from the US. I understand that it is impossible to completely eliminate smuggling but the Nigerian government is not even attempting to prevent/reduce smuggling.

I maintain, the Nigerian people shouldn't suffer for their government's inability to maintain its borders. There are quite a few policies that the government could have pursued to reduce smuggling before it chose to remove the subsidy. Secondly, this $6/7 billion subsidy removal is capable of contracting the Nigerian economy leading to job losses, wealth destruction, and an unbalanced income distribution. In plain language, money will be taken from the people and embezzled by government officials.

May many more blessings come your way for speaking the truth as it is.

Bawss1:

May many more blessings come your way for speaking the truth as it is.

Amen

Thank you; happy new year to you.