There was no doubt that everything we are doing in this country, including;
Education.
Religions.
Our social life.
Health.
System of govt.
Mode of dressing.
Communication. etc
were copied from the west, probably as a result of colonization of the land.
Actually,the political independent was achieved in 1960,and yet we are still struggling as a nation under the control of these so called west.We keep them as a friend,mediators,benefactors,role model&as our colonial masters.But in the real sense,they are the enemy of progress and development in Nigeria and Africa at large.A corrupt leader especially,the one that embacked on poor economic policy is their good friend,just to perpetuate their economic domination and exploitation of our country.
What i'm trying to say is that,as long as Nigeria and others third world countries are still fulling associating themselve with western countries,particularly USA,FRANCE,ENGLAND they will never ever developed.
My question therefore to you all is that,can Nigeria attain high level of development by reducing her interconnected with the west&form a union or economic cooperation with those countries in the middle east and the asian tigers?

How can one increase prosperity by reducing the number of people you can interact with? You want as many options as possible, not less..

I'm from the school of thought that at this stage, we've outgrown what the West can do for us - we need to look for alternatives. The west will never treat us as equals, and their gun-ho policies are not in the best of our interests.

The world is a free market - and it's high time we started looking for countries that can trade and do business with us on a level playing field - and not in a lopsided way. We've been cheated, raped, exploited, and manipulated by the so-called West for too long - it's time to woke up from the slumber, and take our destiny in our own hands.

And we also have to look inwards, and develop our human and natural resources. If Brazil can do it, then Nigeria can.

bittyend: I'm from the school of thought that at this stage, we've outgrown what the West can do for us - we need to look for alternatives. The west will never treat us equals, and their gun-ho policies are not in the best of our interests.

The world is a free market - and it's high time we started looking for countries which we trade and business with us on a level playing field - and not in a lopsided way. We've been cheated, raped, exploited, and manipulated by the so-called West for too long - it's time to wake up from the slumber, and take our destiny in our own hands.

and we also have to look inwards, and develop our human and natural resources. If Brazil can do it, then Nigeria can.

You are right in all you said but if you look at the level of ignorance around you you will notice that it is those people you are trying to save that would kill you and then run and embrace the west.
I was having a debate with some older and enlightened individuals and i concluded that with the subversive tactics the west currently employes in africa that what nigeria needs at the moment is not a LARGE WESTERN STYLED democracy but a small tight knit military dictatorship made up of patriotic men.
They all agreed with me but pointed out that africans has been brainwashed to believe that anything that the WHITEMAN recomends for them is the right thing. They would go against their saviour once the west screams democracy, the buhari and abacha regime was used as an example and how selfish elements within nigeria was used for disinformation and formenting civil unrest . After that lengthy lecture by those men i was lost on what to say next.
Does it we don't have a solution ?

thoth:

You are right in all you said but if you look at the level of ignorance around you you will notice that it is those people you are trying to save that would kill you and then run and embrace the west.
I was having a debate with some older and enlightened individuals and i concluded that with the subversive tactics the west currently employes in africa that what nigeria needs at the moment is not a LARGE WESTERN STYLED democracy but a small tight knit military dictatorship made up of patriotic men.
They all agreed with me but pointed out that africans has been brainwashed to believe that anything that the WHITEMAN recomends for them is the right thing. They would go against their saviour once the west screams democracy, the buhari and abacha regime was used as an example and how selfish elements within nigeria was used for disinformation and formenting civil unrest . After that lengthy lecture by those men i was lost on what to say next.
Does it we don't have a solution ?

I concur, brother. That's why I clown around and troll on NL most times. Most Nigerians are too indoctrinated - and most can't even differentiate their right hand from the left. Everything about them has to be Western - but we've tried it for more than 50years and we're still at the same point.

The irony of it all is that the most pro-western president Nigeria ever had was IBB - and we all know how he single-handedly destroyed Nigeria - yet most Nigerians still prefer the west. Like I always say, the problem with Nigeria is not Nigeria itself - but Nigerians. Nigerians need to change their mentality for the country to progress.

We can balkanize the country from now till eternity - but if we don't change our mentality - the mini-republics which will be created out of Nigeria will be hellholes just as Nigeria is.

It is amazing how we keep blaming the west for everything. Let be really here, IBB and co were not westerners but Nigerians like you and I and they allowed themselves to be used or should I say they destroyed our "great nation".

Let me give you an example, a company like Hitv or Innoson would not be patronized by Nigerians because they believe it is substandard but would go to made in England or Made in china products just because it is from abroad but not from Nigeria even though the product in Nigeria is better or still has room for improvement. It is not the west that is telling us not to patronise our indigenous company, it is Nigerians like you and me that have allowed ignorance (and sometimes tribalism) to blame ourselves to see OUR OWN SONS AND DAUGHTERS SUCCESSFUL.

Again take a look at our newspapers. Rather than make a topic as Mr Uche or Mr Ola was last night murdered by Mr Aminu(just an example) rather they would say A yoruba man was murdered by a Fulani herdmen. the the ethnic dimension introduced ! That why there is separation in those two ethnic group. I am yet to see a foreign newspaper say "A Scottish killed an English man".

About the religion, for crying out loud. Religion should not be a reason for separation or fighting in Nigeria. Also It is not the white man's fault. Even among Muslims we fight, Sunni and Shia. Among Christians they fight as well. Protestants and Catholic. So did the Westerners tell Christians to be fighting among themselves ? No.

The government system.

In life there is always an era. One dynasty comes and other's die. This is the era of democracy where the people hold the power and not some Old man who was given the power for free from his father. Most powerful empires in the world always leave an era of rule and go to the next if not rebellion would start. It has been taught in history over and over again.

Health is the same, people that still take Ogbo, Tsimansa, Udu nwalika ogwu etc you can and no westerner is stopping anyone

I can keep going on and on

alj harem: It is amazing how we keep blaming the west for everything. Let be really here, IBB and co were not westerners but Nigerians like you and I and they allowed themselves to be used or should I say they destroyed our "great nation".

Let me give you an example, a company like Hitv or Innoson would not be patronized by Nigerians because they believe it is substandard but would go to made in England or Made in china products just because it is from abroad but not from Nigeria even though the product in Nigeria is better or still has room for improvement. It is not the west that is telling us not to patronise our indigenous company, it is Nigerians like you and me that have allowed ignorance (and sometimes tribalism) to blame ourselves to see OUR OWN SONS AND DAUGHTERS SUCCESSFUL.

Again take a look at our newspapers. Rather than make a topic as Mr Uche or Mr Ola was last night murdered by Mr Aminu(just an example) rather they would say A yoruba man was murdered by a Fulani herdmen. the the ethnic dimension introduced ! That why there is separation in those two ethnic group. I am yet to see a foreign newspaper say "A Scottish killed an English man".

About the religion, for crying out loud. Religion should not be a reason for separation or fighting in Nigeria. Also It is not the white man's fault. Even among Muslims we fight, Sunni and Shia. Among Christians they fight as well. Protestants and Catholic. So did the Westerners tell Christians to be fighting among themselves ? No.

The government system.

In life there is always an era. One dynasty comes and other's die. This is the era of democracy where the people hold the power and not some Old man who was given the power for free from his father. Most powerful empires in the world always leave an era of rule and go to the next if not rebellion would start. It has been taught in history over and over again.

Health is the same, people that still take Ogbo, Tsimansa, Udu nwalika ogwu etc you can and no westerner is stopping anyone

I can keep going on and on

IBB wasn't a Western but he was the most loved president Nigeria ever had by the West - go figure. Open your eyes and stop burying your heads in some medieval book written by camel jockeys.

bittyend:

IBB wasn't a Western but he was the most loved president Nigeria ever had by the West - go figure. Open your eyes and stop burying your heads in some medieval book written by camel jockeys.

LOL, IBB was NOT our only president for 50 years you know ? Lets start from Nnamdi to Gowon, Obj, Shagari, Murtala, Abacha etc surly all these people were not all used by Westerners.

In fact let even say they were all used by westerners, Is it the westerners fault they allowed themselves to be used rather than think for themselves ? Is it ?

It is a case of a man killing another man with a gun and saying it is the gun's fault not him. C'mon !!!

@ekt_bear,u dont realy understood the purpose of this thread,d message was not abt how many nations to related with but whom to associated with that could aid our devlopmnt as a country.

For instance,We ve been following d west since 18th century with nottn to show for it but exploitation in various categories.China&North Korea are example of d countries that refused to followed western line of thought and ideology & yet still prosper and developed.So why can Nigeria do the same?

@Bittyend may God bless u.For alj harem,i wi jst advise u to read more abt Nigeria foreign policy since political independent in 1960.U wi realise dat all our former head of state excludn mayb murtala&Buhari are pro-west.

For instance,if u say dat Babangida was not among dem,then i wi like to remaind u of wat he did to dollas at d detriment of our Naira.And abt ur first post,d west make us feel inferior or think in such way,because we are also mentally colonized by dem.

D sage: @Bittyend may God bless u.For alj harem,i wi jst advise u to read more abt Nigeria foreign policy since political independent in 1960.U wi realise dat all our former head of state excludn mayb murtala&Buhari are pro-west.

For instance,if u say dat Babangida was not among dem,then i wi like to remaind u of wat he did to dollas at d detriment of our Naira.And abt ur first post,d west make us feel inferior or think in such way,because we are also mentally colonized by dem.

I agree with you, our former presidents were pro-western but THAT sir does not mean we are not the ones hurting ourselves.

The west controlling Nigeria economy does not in anyform makes me feel inferior. I know one day God would give to us a good leader even better than Awo and we would be out of the bondage one day. Until then pointing fingers at westerners is just deceiving ourselves and failing to take responsibility for our own actions

D sage: @ekt_bear,u dont realy understood the purpose of this thread,d message was not abt how many nations to related with but whom to associated with that could aid our devlopmnt as a country.

For instance,We ve been following d west since 18th century with nottn to show for it but exploitation in various categories.China&North Korea are example of d countries that refused to followed western line of thought and ideology & yet still prosper and developed.So why can Nigeria do the same?

I don't you even understand what you are suggesting here. What has our copying the West/or not, to do with the current situation in our Education, health or any department you speak of? Open your eyes for pete's sake . . . the rot that continues to be the Nigerian reality was perpetrated not by the west or by our copying the west/or not, but corruption and greed that has become the backbone of most every household in Nigeria today. Tell me if the west made that part of the prevailing culture too . . .


P.S Stop creating these silly threads all over the place. Your conspiracy theory buddies have 100's of them littering all of Nairaland archives. Learn to reuse . . . you don't need to west to tell you how much more sensible that would be.

I don't blame the west for any of our problems but lets for a while seriously look deep and analyse the subversive tacticts that has beed downed on Nigeria by the west, the assasinations,war, ethnic tensions and economic hardships you can simply see that people who openly challenge them would not last and it becomes a waste when even when something happenes to them the masses does not care or even protest.
The whole Abacha era if analysed is a long power tussle between Abacha who has a better plan for Nigeria and the destructive west and their agent(nigerians) who wants to loot.
And look any other place in africa if the country fiercly resists them what follows are sanctions and invasion using proxy nations or directly.
You should check out the interview of John Perkins the writer of economic hitman on youtube on which he mentioned Nigeria several times and also state the procedures by which their operations are carried out.

Kobojunkie,what i was trying to say tru dis thread is nottn but economic relationship btw Nigeria ans d west.And i can seen clearly from ur reply dat u kno little or nottn abt world economy/Nigeria foreigh policy.
Actually i agreed with you that,the corruption&greediness of our leaders was one of the factors responsible for our inability to developed as a nation,but d question is,what make them corrupt/failed their people?Of course,the system brought by the west.
The economic relationship which serves as a basis for development, btw Nigeria&these western countries are asymmetric in nature.for example,we are talking about industrialization every day,how many companies ve they established in our country despite having a close economic ties with them?i kno u wi say d environment did not encouraging(no electricity,bad roads,others facility etc) but is it not in the same environment that Indians,Lebaneses,Chinese came to setup their business.At least i knew some of their companies in Nigeria.
Pls wake up my brother,Nigeria to d west is just a market place to sell der manufacturing goods&simply a destination for obsolete technology.

D sage: Kobojunkie,what i was trying to say tru dis thread is nottn but economic relationship btw Nigeria ans d west[b].And i can seen clearly from ur reply dat u kno little or nottn abt world economy/Nigeria foreigh policy.[/b]
Actually i agreed with you that,the corruption&greediness of our leaders was one of the factors responsible for our inability to developed as a nation,but d question is,what make them corrupt/failed their people?Of course,the system brought by the west.
The economic relationship which serves as a basis for development, btw Nigeria&these western countries are asymmetric in nature.for example,we are talking about industrialization every day,how many companies ve they established in our country despite having a close economic ties with them?i kno u wi say d environment did not encouraging(no electricity,bad roads,others facility etc) but is it not in the same environment that Indians,Lebaneses,Chinese came to setup their business.At least i knew some of their companies in Nigeria.
Pls wake up my brother,Nigeria to d west is just a market place to sell der manufacturing goods&simply a destination for obsolete technology.

That silly line is used by every one of your conspiracy theorists to sanction your ramblings. For your information, telling someone that the person is not informed simply because the person does not take your side on an issue, reveals you are have absolutely no clue yourself. If you want to counter anything I have said, do so by stating your points or accept you are just another conspiracy theorist with too much time but not much in the line of anything reasonable to offer.

Again, enough of the silly threads to blame the west for the decay that the Nigerian Government, and people, continue to impose on themselves.

Kobojunkie,i didnt say u're ignorant for not reason wit me,wat i was saying is dat,if u actually understood/studies wat world economy is or our international relation,although u may fault our leaders to some extent,but u wont in anyway exonerating dem from our state of underdevelopment.

For example,the wrong entity call Nigeria would not ve came into existed if not these stupid west.Pls go and study or make more research on d effect of international relationship on a country economy.
If at dis stage of ur education&exposure,u dnt kno d negative effect of activities of these countries on our national economy& put entire blame on ur govt,i dnt tink u can resist der domination and exploitation if bcom a leader.Man, u're purely a pro-west&probably been mentally colonized,jst like d majority of Nigerians.

D sage: For example,the wrong entity call Nigeria would not ve came into existed if not these stupid west.Pls go and study or make more research on d effect of international relationship on a country economy.
If at dis stage of ur education&exposure,u dnt kno d negative effect of activities of these countries on our national economy& put entire blame on ur govt,i dnt tink u can resist der domination and exploitation if bcom a leader.Man, u're purely a pro-west&probably been mentally colonized,jst like d majority of Nigerians.

That is, in my opinion, moronic logic. I don't even think the above is worth poking with a stick as it is nothing but a desperate attempt to create an excuse for the squalor and decay that exists no matter where you go in Nigeria. Even at the local level, this decay is evident, so your attempt to blame it on the amalgamation of the various sub-units,many of which could independently flourish if that was the goal, is mindless at best.

IMO, I don’t think the development of Nigeria depends on the interaction with the west. The west has enslaved, colonized, and using their multi-national companies to indirectly colonize us again using our leaders as unwise partners in this endeavor.

It wasn’t for the interaction with the west that developed Japan, India, China, South Korea and the rest. After all while we interact with the west, these countries also did the same. The problem is lack of good leadership and corruption which the west openly condemns, but secretly cherishes so much because it is one of their highest revenue earners (70% of our oil revenue goes back to Europe through our leaders)

Until our leaders are ready to sacrifice greed for national course, until they realize that the future lies on their actions of today, until they abolish this present educational system (based on reading and writing) and put more emphasis on technical education, vocational education, craftsmanship, we are going nowhere (90% of Chinese expatriates in Nigeria have no university education and are better than our ‘PhD’ holders).
Our road-side mechanics, our laptop/TV/radio repairer, who I consider our real technicians, should be encouraged. It is ironical that our motor mechanics have left their work-shop to obtain UME form because of lack on incentive, low patronage and inaccessibility of loan to ply their trade (and this is the bedrock of any technological advancement)

This is no lie; the west can never help you develop no matter your level of interaction. It is the country that will develop her man-power resources, place greater emphasis on technical education, and modernize the agricultural sector (the most important). The increase in the number of universities now will only complicate the problem of unemployment (only 1 and out 9 are gainfully/just employed after school and the volume might increase to 1 out of 12 later).

What we need is more technical schools fully equipped and 4get about this west thing.

When oil finish maybe we will understand ourselves better.

the west helped europe to reconstruct it self and also helped south korea. So what are we talking about.

@tru2god,although your first sentence was quite contraditd what you eventually arrived at but you spoke the truth to some extent.

But let me ask you,did china&indian,you mentioned actually had a cordial relationshp with the west?i dnt think so,coz most of the countries in the middle/far east,except S.Korea&Japan detest America&other western countries.

Like you said,the west can never render any meaningful assistance to develop our economy,they would rather continue using our leaders to perpetuate their economic domination and exploitation.And thats why i was saying we should reduced our interconnected with them and seek for economic assistance elsewhere,probably from the developed countries in the east.

@Kobojunkie,i'm not sure you really read post before reply,pls check my previous post,did i totally excluded our leaders from economic hardship we were gone through in this country?no,what i was saying is that,we should all blame the west for using our leaders as an instrument of exploitation.

You may ask me,are we not a sovereignty nation,are they force our leaders etc.But remember that any attempt made by some countries to resist their domination usually led to economic sanction or even military intervention e.g Libya,Ivory coast,N.Korea etc.

@Souldust,Europe and north America are call west.So whether they help one another on their continent,is none of our concern because they belong to each other and ve somtin in common.Try to base your arguement on the effect of relationship between Nigeria and the west.

@tru2god,although your first sentence was quite contraditd what you eventually arrived at but you spoke the truth to some extent.

But let me ask you,did china&indian,you mentioned actually had a cordial relationshp with the west?i dnt think so,coz most of the countries in the middle/far east,except S.Korea&Japan detest America&other western countries.

Like you said,the west can never render any meaningful assistance to develop our economy,they would rather continue using our leaders to perpetuate their economic domination and exploitation.And thats why i was saying we should reduced our interconnected with them and seek for economic assistance elsewhere,probably from the developed countries in the east.

@Kobojunkie,i'm not sure you really read post before reply,pls check my previous post,did i totally excluded our leaders from economic hardship we were gone through in this country?no,what i was saying is that,we should all blame the west for using our leaders as an instrument of exploitation.

You may ask me,are we not a sovereignty nation,are they force our leaders etc.But remember that any attempt made by some countries to resist their domination usually led to economic sanction or even military intervention e.g Libya,Ivory coast,N.Korea etc.

@Souldust,Europe and north America are call west.So whether they help one another on their continent,is none of our concern because they belong to each other and ve somtin in common.Try to base your arguement on the effect of relationship between Nigeria and the west.