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The Glamour Of Atheism - Religion - Nairaland

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FAITH=DOUBT, RELIGIOUS FAITH= Extreme Form Of Atheism. We Are All Atheists(2) / Myopia Of Atheism / The Cowardice Of Atheism (2) (3) (4)

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The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 9:26am On Oct 15, 2014
The title of this article risks overstatement. Consequently, I hope the reader will do me the courtesy of not regarding it as a cheap ploy for attention. My aim is simple: I wish to examine an aspect of atheism’s imaginative appeal. Christians are frequently accused of wishful thinking, of retreating to the church in the face of a vast and pitiless universe. Though this is clearly a double-edged sword (wishful thinking works both ways), my reason for focusing on the “glamour” of atheism is not so much to craft a rejoinder as to train a lens on a frequently overlooked issue.

 

Atheism, like any belief system, makes a loud appeal to the imagination, and if we overlook this striking fact we turn a blind eye to one of the key sources of its persuasive power. Specifically, I want to suggest that death is atheism’s ultimate appeal, and that death lends atheism its special glamour. It is in the arena of popular culture in particular that this glamour frequently announces itself most vocally. My hope is that this thesis will seem less controversial and even less outrageous as we progress.

Atheism is a zero-sum game, a philosophy of death that can offer nothing but death. This is why the rising tide of secularism in the Western world is fostering an indefatigable culture of death. Forged in a crucible of nothingness, we wander as cosmic orphans back to the yawning void from which we were so tragically ejected. In such a stark context, anything more than death, or on the side of life, or even minimally optimistic must be regarded with either pity or callous derision because it is obviously deluded, naïve, or dishonest.

 

The existentialist philosopher Jean-Paul Sartre said “existence precedes essence.” In other words, we have no stable or fixed identity that precedes us. The burden of identity, selfhood, and meaning rests solely on our shoulders. But, again, if we came from nothing and are returning inextricably to nothing, life is a temporary accident, and death is the only authentic currency at our disposal. Why is death authentic? Because it is life that is artificial and nothingness that is essential. It is not that this worldview tries to be especially morbid—in many cases it makes a valiant attempt to be life-affirming—it’s simply that it has literally nothing else to offer, or, rather, it has precisely nothing to offer.

 

Please don’t misunderstand me. I am not saying that it is impossible for atheists to lead exemplary and even noble lives. Clearly, many do. What I am saying is that, from the standpoint of scientific naturalism, such behavior is an anomaly because naturalism, devoid of any and all metaphysical underpinnings, can provide neither the motivation nor the justification for a truly selfless life. Such values must be borrowed, or smuggled in, so to speak. In a provocative article, the journalist Matthew Parris, himself an avowed atheist, reluctantly concedes that removing Christian evangelism from the continent of Africa would be disastrous. Why? “In Africa Christianity changes people’s hearts. It brings a spiritual transformation. The rebirth is real. The change is good.”[3] My point is not that atheists can’t be good people. My point is that it is manifestly impossible for atheism to “change people’s hearts,” to inspire transformation and rebirth on its own steam. Those wishing to find the ethical resources for such an undertaking must look elsewhere.

The apostle Paul tells us that the mind set on the flesh is death (Romans 8:6). An honest materialist will agree with this statement. If the material universe traces its lineage back to a cosmic accident, then life cannot be regarded as anything other than alien, an intrusion where emptiness will ultimately prevail. So, the materialist mind is set preeminently on emptiness and death.

 

Part of our unique and pastoral mission as Christian men and women is to revive in people a love of life in a culture of death. We need to work carefully to restore the appeal of life in all of its vital glory. We need to remind this culture of death that life, not emptiness, is essential, primal, and original. In fact, we have value and purpose precisely because we have been created by a personal God in his image, fashioned for intimacy and joy with God as well as with others. We can preach nothing less than eternal life, because anything less than eternal life is simply a temporary loan from a bankrupt universe. Indeed, the poverty of atheism is so total that it is powerless to offer anything more than death.

 

It is this life offered by Christ that stands in stark contrast to the materialist mindset. As RZIM colleague Os Guinness says, “Comparison is the mother of clarity.” My intent has not been to isolate those who resolutely deny any kind of divinity. Rather, my honest hope is that the radical nature of the life that Christ offers us might come into sharp focus when set against the unsparing backdrop of consistent materialism.

 

David Bentley Hart has said that we have only two options at our disposal: Christ or Nothing.A casual survey of our cultural landscape makes it abundantly clear that our love of life is in desperate need of resuscitation. I believe Christ alone can accomplish this resuscitation.

 

Cameron McAllister is a member of the speaking and writing team at RZIM.

http://www.rzim.org/just-thinking/the-glamour-of-atheism/

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Liveair: 10:01am On Oct 15, 2014
See, reality is that when you are an adherent of any religious position, you perceive everything on that backdrop. You tend to think that yours is all there is.
You become delusional that you have an inner feeling and conviction which only those who are similarly inclined to your belief can experience.
This is fundamentally flawed!

In reality, those who do not fall under your belief system are also convinced beyond doubt, to exactly the same degree, that theirs is the ultimate.

Regarding life, death and depth of human experience, there is no rule that requires anyone to first be religious so as to inspire others.
Matter of fact, religious people have over time, drawn concepts and understanding from non-religious folks such as; "Believing In Yourself" to achieve success in life.
Most Atheists draw inspiration from the concept of "What will I be remembered for" in order to give their best while still breathing.

Its therefore, not surprising that the best the world has been endowed with in terms of Innovators, Inventors, Bussiness moguls, Academics, et al, are non-religious or outright Atheists.

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Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 12:29pm On Oct 15, 2014
Believe in urself actually borrowed from the 'religious' folks, not the other way around.
Nobility of life is actually smuggled into the atheistic world view (according to the author) because it has no place in the actual world view in the most basic sense
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 12:38pm On Oct 15, 2014
Liveair:
See, reality is that when you are an adherent of any religious position, you perceive everything on that backdrop. You tend to think that yours is all there is.
You become delusional that you have an inner feeling and conviction which only those who are similarly inclined to your belief can experience.
This is fundamentally flawed!

In reality, those who do not fall under your belief system are also convinced beyond doubt, to exactly the same degree, that theirs is the ultimate.

Regarding life, death and depth of human experience, there is no rule that requires anyone to first be religious so as to inspire others.
Matter of fact, religious people have over time, drawn concepts and understanding from non-religious folks such as; "Believing In Yourself" to achieve success in life.
Most Atheists draw inspiration from the concept of "What will I be remembered for" in order to give their best while still breathing.

Its therefore, not surprising that the best the world has been endowed with in terms of Innovators, Inventors, Bussiness moguls, Academics, et al, are non-religious or outright Atheists.

And u forget to add that the 'best' are talking about are less than 10% of world population? Are u then trying to imply that atheism makes u better in things dt u do? Can u prove that?
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by ihedinobi2: 1:02pm On Oct 15, 2014
Very true indeed.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by ihedinobi2: 1:14pm On Oct 15, 2014
Liveair:
See, reality is that when you are an adherent of any religious position, you perceive everything on that backdrop. You tend to think that yours is all there is.
You become delusional that you have an inner feeling and conviction which only those who are similarly inclined to your belief can experience.
This is fundamentally flawed!

In reality, those who do not fall under your belief system are also convinced beyond doubt, to exactly the same degree, that theirs is the ultimate.
So we all including the irreligious are deluded. Something very important for atheists to remember when they claim to have found the truth.

Regarding life, death and depth of human experience, there is no rule that requires anyone to first be religious so as to inspire others.
Matter of fact, religious people have over time, drawn concepts and understanding from non-religious folks such as; "Believing In Yourself" to achieve success in life.
Most Atheists draw inspiration from the concept of "What will I be remembered for" in order to give their best while still breathing.
In the Bible we have David's story where he and his men had just lost their families and property to raiders. He fell into great depression but eventually ENCOURAGED HIMSELF in the Lord.

There are various places too in the New Testament where apostolic writers told believers to "quit yourselves like men", "gird up the loins of your mind", or just "gird up your loins". Were those imported from irreligious persuasions too?

Its therefore, not surprising that the best the world has been endowed with in terms of Innovators, Inventors, Bussiness moguls, Academics, et al, are non-religious or outright Atheists.
A remarkable lie. Was Isaac Newton irreligious? Mendel of Genetics? Strive Masiyiwa of modern African business?

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by onetrack(m): 1:24pm On Oct 15, 2014
Actually, it is not we atheists who have a philosophy of death; we have every reason to live and no reason to die since it is the end of our existence. It is you who believe in a paradise after death (Christians, Muslims, etc) that have a reason to die. You are the ones who look forward to death.

3 Likes

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 1:40pm On Oct 15, 2014
onetrack:
Actually, it is not we atheists who have a philosophy of death; we have every reason to live and no reason to die since it is the end of our existence. It is you who believe in a paradise after death (Christians, Muslims, etc) that have a reason to die. You are the ones who look forward to death.

If death is d end of existence, then what is the use of life? Merely an accident between two nothingness. Morality, then will be useless because there is nothing after this accident called life.
If however there is an afterlife or a deity who either rewards or punishes in d afterlife, the outlook is indeed not as gloomy and we can use him as a standard of measurement in morality

1 Like 1 Share

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by asalimpo(m): 1:48pm On Oct 15, 2014
Liveair:
See, reality is that when you are an adherent of any religious position, you perceive everything on that backdrop. You tend to think that yours is all there is.
You become delusional that you have an inner feeling and conviction which only those who are similarly inclined to your belief can experience.
This is fundamentally flawed!

In reality, those who do not fall under your belief system are also convinced beyond doubt, to exactly the same degree, that theirs is the ultimate.

Regarding life, death and depth of human experience, there is no rule that requires anyone to first be religious so as to inspire others.
Matter of fact, religious people have over time, drawn concepts and understanding from non-religious folks such as; "Believing In Yourself" to achieve success in life.
Most Atheists draw inspiration from the concept of "What will I be remembered for" in order to give their best while still breathing.

Its therefore, not surprising that the best the world has been endowed with in terms of Innovators, Inventors, Bussiness moguls, Academics, et al, are non-religious or outright Atheists.


this isnt true! Theyve been notable people from the religious side as well in all walks of life.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by onetrack(m): 1:48pm On Oct 15, 2014
Bobbysworld28:


If death is d end of existence, then what is the use of life? Merely an accident between two nothingness. Morality, then will be useless because there is nothing after this accident called life.
If however there is an afterlife or a deity who either rewards or punishes in d afterlife, the outlook is indeed not as gloomy and we can use him as a standard of measurement in morality

It's true that life is very much an accident, but I find my own meaning in life, and I like that.

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by asalimpo(m): 1:56pm On Oct 15, 2014
Without God and accountability of man. Without justice in this life and hereafter, morality , becomes baseless and useless. If life is just a meaningless struggle for survival ,
nobody shud b punished for doing anythng to better his lot.

Atheism is a hopeless religion.

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Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by plaetton: 2:26pm On Oct 15, 2014
Liveair:
See, reality is that when you are an adherent of any religious position, you perceive everything on that backdrop. You tend to think that yours is all there is.
You become delusional that you have an inner feeling and conviction which only those who are similarly inclined to your belief can experience.
This is fundamentally flawed!

In reality, those who do not fall under your belief system are also convinced beyond doubt, to exactly the same degree, that theirs is the ultimate.

Regarding life, death and depth of human experience, there is no rule that requires anyone to first be religious so as to inspire others.
Matter of fact, religious people have over time, drawn concepts and understanding from non-religious folks such as; "Believing In Yourself" to achieve success in life.
Most Atheists draw inspiration from the concept of "What will I be remembered for" in order to give their best while still breathing.

Its therefore, not surprising that the best the world has been endowed with in terms of Innovators, Inventors, Bussiness moguls, Academics, et al, are non-religious or outright Atheists.
Thanks a million for the concise and effect rebuttal of the op's numerous fallacies.

The first error in the op is the claim that atheism is belief system.
I find it incredibly hard to believe that with all horrors of religion, past and present, some people continue to delude themselves and continue to sell the lie that religion makes people good or inspire people to do good things.

If someone needs religion in order to be good, then I can safely boast that I am a more reasonable and better person, because, I can be all good without religion.

5 Likes

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 3:00pm On Oct 15, 2014
plaetton:

Thanks a million for the concise and effect rebuttal of the op's numerous fallacies.

The first error in the op is the claim that atheism is belief system.
I find it incredibly hard to believe that with all horrors of religion, past and present, some people continue to delude themselves and continue to sell the lie that religion makes people good or inspire people to do good things.

If someone needs religion in order to be good, then I can safely boast that I am a more reasonable and better person, because, I can be all good without religion.

Whenever anyone comes along and claims atheism is not a belief system, it shocks me!
Ok, let us assume that atheism is not a belief system. It believes in no deity (which in itself is a belief), it believes in no absolutes too (this is where secularity spins off from) & since it is not a system there are no boundaries etc.
What an empty thinking. Very hollow & unable to sustain its own weight in any useful argument. Like a ship without an anchor, it floats & drifts aimlessly. Is this what u r proud of?

What drives u, what defines morality in ur worldview? You say u r a good person, how? By what measure do we ascertain ur 'goodness'?

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 3:09pm On Oct 15, 2014
plaetton:

Thanks a million for the concise and effect rebuttal of the op's numerous fallacies.

The first error in the op is the claim that atheism is belief system.
I find it incredibly hard to believe that with all horrors of religion, past and present, some people continue to delude themselves and continue to sell the lie that religion makes people good or inspire people to do good things.

If someone needs religion in order to be good, then I can safely boast that I am a more reasonable and better person, because, I can be all good without religion.

Ur phobia for religion is like saying u wont use a vehicle for transportation because of numerous accidents u have seen. You forget dt trekking is actually a mode of transportation.
Horrors have been commited by people in d name of religion while countless more have been saved as a result. A stroll down history lane show dt those who have issues with religion commiting abominations ( much worse than those of their 'religious' counterparts).
So u cut ur nose in order to spite ur face? Goodluck with dt

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 3:19pm On Oct 15, 2014
Liveair:
See, reality is that when you are an adherent of any religious position, you perceive everything on that backdrop. You tend to think that yours is all there is.
You become delusional that you have an inner feeling and conviction which only those who are similarly inclined to your belief can experience.
This is fundamentally flawed!

In reality, those who do not fall under your belief system are also convinced beyond doubt, to exactly the same degree, that theirs is the ultimate.

Regarding life, death and depth of human experience, there is no rule that requires anyone to first be religious so as to inspire others.
Matter of fact, religious people have over time, drawn concepts and understanding from non-religious folks such as; "Believing In Yourself" to achieve success in life.
Most Atheists draw inspiration from the concept of "What will I be remembered for" in order to give their best while still breathing.

Its therefore, not surprising that the best the world has been endowed with in terms of Innovators, Inventors, Bussiness moguls, Academics, et al, are non-religious or outright Atheists.

Well said. It's only god that'll bless you for this piece grin. Kudos!

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by asalimpo(m): 3:46pm On Oct 15, 2014
Every living person has a belief system which they adhere to in regulatg and judging their actions.
Every1.
Religion is what dictates ur belief system. So every1 has religion and worships somthg.

Atheism borrows many christian concepts too.
Christianity never told a person to believe in himself.
The secular mumbo jumbo for conscience - ethics - is just a secular name for something we all know exists but can't see?
Yet atheists try to allude tht life is all physcal.
Then y expect people to act with a fair conscience - ethically - in secular affairs? People know the human conscience is a moral judge.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by plaetton: 5:24pm On Oct 15, 2014
Bobbysworld28:


Ur phobia for religion is like saying u wont use a vehicle for transportation because of numerous accidents u have seen. You forget dt trekking is actually a mode of transportation.
Horrors have been commited by people in d name of religion while countless more have been saved as a result. A stroll down history lane show dt those who have issues with religion commiting abominations ( much worse than those of their 'religious' counterparts).
So u cut ur nose in order to spite ur face? Goodluck with dt
I wonder which history you are referring to.

A vehicle made of faulty parts is dangerous to both the driver, the passengers, other road users, as well as pedestrians.

Do you obey traffic signals because of your fear of police, or do you obey traffic signs because you understand the importance of road safety?

Those of us who don't need religion to be good, moral and useful to society are like drivers who obey traffic signs even when police is not looking because we fully understand and appreciate the importance of road safety.

Isn't it surprising that god- infested countries like Nigeria have far greater road accidents and deaths because the police is seldom there to scare drivers into doing the right and safe things on the roads.?

3 Likes

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by plaetton: 5:30pm On Oct 15, 2014
Bobbysworld28:


Whenever anyone comes along and claims atheism is not a belief system, it shocks me!
Ok, let us assume that atheism is not a belief system. It believes in no deity (which in itself is a belief), it believes in no absolutes too (this is where secularity spins off from) & since it is not a system there are no boundaries etc.
What an empty thinking. Very hollow & unable to sustain its own weight in any useful argument. Like a ship without an anchor, it floats & drifts aimlessly. Is this what u r proud of?

What drives u, what defines morality in ur worldview? You say u r a good person, how? By what measure do we ascertain ur 'goodness'?
Kindergarten logic.
Sorry, but I dealt with too many kindergarten thinkers on this forum already.

The best truth spoken on this forum, from a religious person , is that religious faith is irrational.
So, my friend, being rational cannot be a belief system.
Case closed.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by davien(m): 5:32pm On Oct 15, 2014
asalimpo:
Every living person has a belief system which they adhere to in regulatg and judging their actions.
Every1.
Religion is what dictates ur belief system. So every1 has religion and worships somthg.

Atheism borrows many christian concepts too.
Christianity never told a person to believe in himself.
The secular mumbo jumbo for conscience - ethics - is just a secular name for something we all know exists but can't see?
Yet atheists try to allude tht life is all physcal.
Then y expect people to act with a fair conscience - ethically - in secular affairs? People know the human conscience is a moral judge.
You do know that atheism predates christianity right? undecided and is an unbelief in "god/gods" and the "supernatural"...

so your "atheism borrows christian concepts" is a blatant lie apart from that atheism is just an unbelief not a philosophy....try to read on what a philosophy is and you'll find it concerning beliefs majorly and not an unbelief undecided ………pick up a book besides your bible for once..

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 5:48pm On Oct 15, 2014
plaetton:

Kindergarten logic.
Sorry, but I dealt with too many kindergarten thinkers on this forum already.

The best truth spoken on this forum, from a religious person , is that religious faith is irrational.
So, my friend, being rational cannot be a belief system.
Case closed.

I am aware that the alphabets u learned in kindergarten are the instruments u use everyday in a more complex manner, therefore u cannot dismiss kindergarten.
That said, do u dismiss my logic as kindergarten or is it because it is true and it hits the foundation of ur beliefs (or lack of it)?

Let us then start from basic principles: what (to u) is atheism? What are the rules guiding it? What is right and wrong (based on your worldview)?
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 5:55pm On Oct 15, 2014
davien:
You do know that atheism predates christianity right? undecided and is an unbelief in "god/gods" and the "supernatural"...

so your "atheism borrows christian concepts" is a blatant lie apart from that atheism is just an unbelief not a philosophy....try to read on what a philosophy is and you'll find it concerning beliefs majorly and not an unbelief undecided ………pick up a book besides your bible for once..

Again, the hollow argument. Atheists equate lack of knowledge of an issue with a total rejection of the issue. VERY WRONG!
Unbelief will mean I am aware of a subject (and probably related with it) then I choose to reject it. How then can a rejection of a concept predate the knowledge and revelation of the concept? So, atheism cannot predate the knowledge of deity (else all inanimate objects are atheists lol).
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by plaetton: 6:10pm On Oct 15, 2014
Bobbysworld28:


I am aware that the alphabets u learned in kindergarten are the instruments u use everyday in a more complex manner, therefore u cannot dismiss kindergarten.
That said, do u dismiss my logic as kindergarten or is it because it is true and it hits the foundation of ur beliefs (or lack of it)?

Let us then start from basic principles: what (to u) is atheism? What are the rules guiding it? What is right and wrong (based on your worldview)?
Atheism is simply the acceptance of rationality in understanding and dealing with existential issues.
Atheism rejects the concept of god because if its multitude of contradictions.
The idea of god is self-contradictory, even to those who promote and accept it.

There are no guiding rules. Only rationality.

Now, do you agree that religious faith is irrational? Yes or no?

1 Like

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 6:25pm On Oct 15, 2014
plaetton:

Atheism is simply the acceptance of rationality in understanding and dealing with existential issues.
Atheism rejects the concept of god because if its multitude of contradictions.
The idea of god is self-contradictory, even to those who promote and accept it.

There are no guiding rules. Only rationality.

Now, do you agree that religious faith is irrational? Yes or no?

No sir!
U believe in rationality yet there are guiding rules for rationality. That is akin to believing in traffic rules but having no rules to obey. Thats a recipe for chaos.
If what is rational to me is to pick up a gun & shoot u, that means I am right (in ur view) since there are no boundaries, right?
There must be an order, a system perhaps to make sense of it all.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by asalimpo(m): 6:27pm On Oct 15, 2014
davien:
You do know that atheism predates christianity right? undecided and is an unbelief in "god/gods" and the "supernatural"...

so your "atheism borrows christian concepts" is a blatant lie apart from that atheism is just an unbelief not a philosophy....try to read on what a philosophy is and you'll find it concerning beliefs majorly and not an unbelief undecided ………pick up a book besides your bible for once..

atheism strted with the scientifc era, specifically after darwin's theory of evolution gathered steam. Before that it was unquestioned even in science that man was made by God.
Division of Science and Religion is a recent thing,it wasnt always so.

Atheism isnt just a belief,it is a movement with adherents.
It is a religion in the abstract sense of the word.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by davien(m): 6:42pm On Oct 15, 2014
Bobbysworld28:


Again, the hollow argument. Atheists equate lack of knowledge of an issue with a total rejection of the issue. VERY WRONG!
Unbelief will mean I am aware of a subject (and probably related with it) then I choose to reject it. How then can a rejection of a concept predate the knowledge and revelation of the concept? So, atheism cannot predate the knowledge of deity (else all inanimate objects are atheists lol).

Wow flawless logic! ....apply your definition to your unbelief in allah and you'd be saying you know allah exists but reject it undecided ...
Has your willfull need to justify talking snakes and donkeys that high that you'd have to lie and re-define the most basic of things undecided
perhaps you should realise that the "god" or the "supernatural" has been long rejected countless times due to lack of evidence and/or for evidence strongly against it....
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by davien(m): 6:48pm On Oct 15, 2014
asalimpo:


atheism strted with the scientifc era, specifically after darwin's theory of evolution gathered steam. Before that it was unquestioned even in science that man was made by God.
Division of Science and Religion is a recent thing,it wasnt always so.

Atheism isnt just a belief,it is a movement with adherents.
It is a religion in the abstract sense of the word.
asalimpo i finally believe i'm justified to call you a r3tard!... because if 150 year old scientific theory began "atheism"....how did the greeks....ancient africans and others arrived at the unbelief.... smh!
i can see now that flying dragons....talking snakes.....talking donkeys must be verified by you all the time anyway....anyhow.... undecided
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 7:00pm On Oct 15, 2014
davien:
Wow flawless logic! ....apply your definition to your unbelief in allah and you'd be saying you know allah exists but reject it undecided ...
Has your willfull need to justify talking snakes and donkeys that high that you'd have to lie and re-define the most basic of things undecided

The concept of Allah and not Allah himself. I can choose to reject dt he exists because I have heard someone claim he exists. Gerrit?
If I have never hrd of Allah, how can I reject the concept dt he exists? I cannot be said to disbelieve that davien exists on Nairaland if I hv never evn hrd of the name before, can i?
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 7:07pm On Oct 15, 2014
davien:
Wow flawless logic! ....apply your definition to your unbelief in allah and you'd be saying you know allah exists but reject it undecided ...
Has your willfull need to justify talking snakes and donkeys that high that you'd have to lie and re-define the most basic of things undecided
perhaps you should realise that the "god" or the "supernatural" has been long rejected countless times due to lack of evidence and/or for evidence strongly against it....

unbelief
[uhn-bi-leef]
noun
1.
the state or quality of not believing
; incredulity or skepticism, especially in matters of doctrine or religious faith.
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by plaetton: 7:35pm On Oct 15, 2014
Bobbysworld28:


No sir!
U believe in rationality yet there are guiding rules for rationality. That is akin to believing in traffic rules but having no rules to obey. Thats a recipe for chaos.
If what is rational to me is to pick up a gun & shoot u, that means I am right (in ur view) since there are no boundaries, right?
There must be an order, a system perhaps to make sense of it all.

If religious faith is rational to you, then kindly give us your definition of faith.

For example, how rational is it to hold that the Islamic faith is the most truthful and purest form of faith?
Is that a rational argument?
Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by finofaya: 7:36pm On Oct 15, 2014
This OP is rather pointless.

The OP says christians are accused of wishful thinking.

Christians are frequently accused of wishful thinking, of retreating to the church in the face of a vast and pitiless universe.

He then goes on to confirm that this accusation is true.

As RZIM colleague Os Guinness says, “Comparison is the mother of clarity.” My intent has not been to isolate those who resolutely deny any kind of divinity. Rather, my honest hope is that the radical nature of the life that Christ offers us might come into sharp focus when set against the unsparing backdrop of consistent materialism.

Does this paragraph mean anything other than that we should accept Christ because compared to "the unsparing backdrop of consistent materialism", it is more comfortable to do so? The entire argument is that atheism is too harsh and Christianity is softer. That is not a good argument. With his kind of reasoning, if we can find another God that guarantees an afterlife and deals with wrongdoers in a milder way than Yahweh, then we all should flock to that God. Buddhism, anyone?

2 Likes

Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by finofaya: 7:46pm On Oct 15, 2014
@asalimpo

The bible verse "the fool says in his heart: there is no God", is it a prophecy?

The bible recognizes atheism and yet you say that atheism is a recent development. That is dishonest, man.

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Re: The Glamour Of Atheism by Nobody: 7:51pm On Oct 15, 2014
finofaya:
This OP is rather pointless.

The OP says christians are accused of wishful thinking.



He then goes on to confirm that this accusation is true.



Does this paragraph mean anything other than that we should accept Christ because compared to "the unsparing backdrop of consistent materialism", it is more comfortable to do so? The entire argument is that atheism is too harsh and Christianity is softer. That is not a good argument. With his kind of reasoning, if we can find another God that guarantees an afterlife and deals with wrongdoers in a milder way than Yahweh, then we all should flock to that God. Buddhism, anyone?

You are welcome. Your point has been noted.
I will deal with the concept u raised later on.
Thank you

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