hammerF:
COMMON SENSE IS NOT COMMON, THIS IS WAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING.

I HOPE NGOZI123 IS STILL FOLLOWING.

BINI ONLY HAPPENED AFTER THE COLONIALIST ARRIVED IN THE 15TH CENTURY. ARCHAEOLOGICAL DIG CONFIRMS IGBO WERE IN THE EAST BEFORE ANIOMA. THE EXPANSION TO PRESENT DAY ANIOMA WAS AT THE HEIGHT OF NRI KINGDOM.

I never said that the Igbos weren't in the East before the Anioma people. I said that my ancestors once lived under the Benin Empire, which they did. I agree with the theory of reverse migration; the Igbos were gradually migrating West but something caused them to go back to the East. It's the theory that makes the most sense to me but it's not concrete.

gerg:
Traditional rulers of Igbanke is not Eze. Everything about Igbanke doesn't scream Igbo. look for another lie

It seems you're either misinformed or you're deliberately trying to spread lies.. Sometimes last year or is it last two years the igbanke were screaming out for help that they're been marginalized culturally by Benin and they're even gave instances where they'd go to abudu,which is orhiomwon's HQ(igbanke is located in orhiomwon LG) and they're denied services because their names sound "Igbo" with some Bini callously telling them to go to Delta state and get whatever services they're looking for there. Now how can you tell a people that their land is located in Edo state to go to delta and get whatever services they're seeking for just bkos they're not Bini like you??
All these things is what's propelling the Igbanke to demand that their areas be either made a LG on its own or be ceded to Anioma(ie Delta).

Anyway all these is what makes me to seriously push for Anioma state so that the insults we suffer from Edoid folks like you would cease.

gerg:
I'm from Ika but I don't understand Owerri dialect of the Igbo language. The only similarity I noticed between my language and Owerri is "ri" as in ri mma and few others. Even all those Owerri singers, I don't understand anything they sing. It sounds like greek in an Ika man's ears except those that stayed in the East or does business there. So enough of this Ika and Owerri similarity stuffs I see here always.

That so called 'ri mma' and a few others, did you bother yourself to see if there could be any trace of a link between Ika and Owerre? Have you studied any ancient artwork from both sides? I have done so hence my comparison. I advise you do too then come back and say what you discovered. The Europeans who studied Ika extensively called them Western Igbos and not otherwise.

gerg:
Traditional rulers of Igbanke is not Eze. Everything about Igbanke doesn't scream Igbo. look for another lie

Firstly, I do not lie. Read this
4) Igbanke is made up of six (6) autonomous clans: Ake/Obiogba, Idumu-Odin, Igbontor, Oligie, Omolua and Ottah. These clans were governed by traditional rulers called ‘’Eze or Obi’’. These terms were of Ika origin, but have been forcefully changed to ‘’Enogie’’ a Bini term by the conquering Binis.
Below is another excerpt from an article online that highlights what the Igbanke people are suffering in their present LGA from their supposed brothers.

1)Most Igbanke indigenes who have Ika ancestral names like, “Emeka”, “Maduka”, “Chukwuka’’, “Chinyere”, “Amaka and “Ogorchukwu etc are often confronted with all forms of harrowing experiences when there are needs to visit our council headquarters, Abudu to process one official documents or the other. We are often denied the issuance of documents like, ‘’Certificate of Local Government of origin’’, Protest Letter’’, To Whom it May Concern’’ etc on the guise that we are Igbos not Binis.
2) Those who have the likes of the Ika aforementioned names, but can speak Bini language are rarely subjected to the above embarrassments and discriminations. This act goes a long way to vindicate our fear that there is a subtle, but carefully planned agenda to make us lose and abandon our ancestral linguistic and cultural heritage.
3) In order to escape from these unnecessary embarrassments, some have no other option left than to change their identity from Ika to Bini names.
4) Today, we, the good people of Igbanke are gradually losing our once envied linguistic and cultural identity.
5) Some of the eminent sons and daughters of Igbanke, whom out of their outstanding contributions to the development of the community, were recognized and given chieftaincy titles had had such titles changed from their original Ika origin to Bini equivalence. For example, few years ago, one of our sons who addressed himself as “Chief Orike-Eze” in Oba of Benin palace was shamefully harassed, insulted and forcefully forced, right in the palace to change the title to its Bini version. According to the palace, the title, “Orike-Eze” had its origin from Ika and Igbo nations.
You can see that I tell no lies. Your unreserved apology is demanded.

cheruv:

It seems you're either misinformed or you're deliberately trying to spread lies.. Sometimes last year or is it last two years the igbanke were screaming out for help that they're been marginalized culturally by Benin and they're even gave instances where they'd go to abudu,which is orhiomwon's HQ(igbanke is located in orhiomwon LG) and they're denied services because their names sound "Igbo" with some Bini callously telling them to go to Delta state and get whatever services they're looking for there. Now how can you tell a people that their land is located in Edo state to go to delta and get whatever services they're seeking for just bkos they're not Bini like you??
All these things is what's propelling the Igbanke to demand that their areas be either made a LG on its own or be ceded to Anioma(ie Delta).

Anyway all these is what makes me to seriously push for Anioma state so that the insults we suffer from Edoid folks like you would cease.

Igbanke said they want to be Anioma and never said they want to be Igbo. Get that into your thick skull

ehikwe22:
you ended up not making any sense. Ika is not Igbo so you can make a comparison of ika and Igbo. If Ika is Igbo and another person say ika is from Bini, the right thing to do is to place ika side by side with Bini and Igbo and make an in depth comparison of the Igbo and Bini elements found in ika. If we should do this with all those things I listed, ika is a million miles away from Igbo.

Ika as a language, is and will always be Igbo.

Whether Ika identifies as Igbo, is a different issue entirely.

You can't speak of "Igbo" element found in Ika, as there is no Igbo as long as Ika is concerned. You however can speak of Enu-ani elements found in Ika, which I know you would find many of, especially amongst Ika clans like Ekwuoma, Igbodo that border Enuani communities.

Yujin:

Firstly, I do not lie. Read this
4) Igbanke is made up of six (6) autonomous clans: Ake/Obiogba, Idumu-Odin, Igbontor, Oligie, Omolua and Ottah. These clans were governed by traditional rulers called ‘’Eze or Obi’’. These terms were of Ika origin, but have been forcefully changed to ‘’Enogie’’ a Bini term by the conquering Binis.
Below is another excerpt from an article online that highlights what the Igbanke people are suffering in their present LGA from their supposed brothers.

1)Most Igbanke indigenes who have Ika ancestral names like, “Emeka”, “Maduka”, “Chukwuka’’, “Chinyere”, “Amaka and “Ogorchukwu etc are often confronted with all forms of harrowing experiences when there are needs to visit our council headquarters, Abudu to process one official documents or the other. We are often denied the issuance of documents like, ‘’Certificate of Local Government of origin’’, Protest Letter’’, To Whom it May Concern’’ etc on the guise that we are Igbos not Binis.
2) Those who have the likes of the Ika aforementioned names, but can speak Bini language are rarely subjected to the above embarrassments and discriminations. This act goes a long way to vindicate our fear that there is a subtle, but carefully planned agenda to make us lose and abandon our ancestral linguistic and cultural heritage.
3) In order to escape from these unnecessary embarrassments, some have no other option left than to change their identity from Ika to Bini names.
4) Today, we, the good people of Igbanke are gradually losing our once envied linguistic and cultural identity.
5) Some of the eminent sons and daughters of Igbanke, whom out of their outstanding contributions to the development of the community, were recognized and given chieftaincy titles had had such titles changed from their original Ika origin to Bini equivalence. For example, few years ago, one of our sons who addressed himself as “Chief Orike-Eze” in Oba of Benin palace was shamefully harassed, insulted and forcefully forced, right in the palace to change the title to its Bini version. According to the palace, the title, “Orike-Eze” had its origin from Ika and Igbo nations.
You can see that I tell no lies. Your unreserved apology is demanded.

The kings of Igbanke are called Enogie. It would be nice if you provide the author of your write up. Anybody can fabricate stories and post them online

Yujin:

That so called 'ri mma' and a few others, did you bother yourself to see if there could be any trace of a link between Ika and Owerre? Have you studied any ancient artwork from both sides? I have done so hence my comparison. I advise you do too then come back and say what you discovered. The Europeans who studied Ika extensively called them Western Igbos and not otherwise.

I said I am Ika and I don't understand Owerre dialect. It sounds greek to me and every other Ika man. what else do you want me to study? You will be making a great mistake if you involve the Europeans into this. Most of their studies are absolute nonsense.

gerg:
Igbanke said they want to be Anioma and never said they want to be Igbo. Get that into your thick skull

You're obviously pained but seriously I don't care... Igbanke is seriously been marginalized by Bini in all aspects and that's what bothers me as an Anioma son.
Coming to the issue of thick skulls, everyone can see btwn us whose own is thicker especially for a Bini son like you that doesn't know Bini history but has to wait till an Anioma son like me schools you in it.
See, Anioma must march on and not even Idu can stop us

gerg:
The kings of Igbanke are called Enogie. It would be nice if you provide the author of your write up. Anybody can fabricate stories and post them online

Ok.
Igbanke is of the Ika tribe in Africa which constitutes Agbor, and up to the border towns of Alifekede down to Umunede. According to Omoregbe Nwanwene,
“six villages constitute Igbanke: these are Umoluah, Igbontor, Idumodin, Ake, Olije, and Ottah – all migrated from different places.”
It is also the case that the foundation of history of Igbanke indicates poignantly that for many centuries after the different villages of Igbanke had been founded, the Igbankes enjoyed absolute independence because they were not vassals of any other people. The name Igbanke arose from a combination of (the names of) two villages: Igbontor and Ake, after a thorough historical supremacy was established.
The government of Igbanke is presided over by the Eze, Enogies, Odioweres, Ndichies, Dikens, Okhiolors, and Okhialis. Each of these heads has his jurisdiction The jurisdiction could be stratified into three: The family level, the clan or hamlets and the villages. At the family level, the Okhilor (he is usually the oldest man in the family) presides. At the village quarters, the Okhilor is the head, while the Eze rules over the entire village.
https://www.nairaland.com/58455/ika-people-igbanke

gerg:
I said I am Ika and I don't understand Owerre dialect. It sounds greek to me and every other Ika man. what else do you want me to study? You will be making a great mistake if you involve the Europeans into this. [s]Most of their studies are absolute nonsense[/s].

Nonsense bkos they don't back your side of the argument isn't it?

gerg:
I said I am Ika and I don't understand Owerre dialect. It sounds greek to me and every other Ika man. what else do you want me to study? You will be making a great mistake if you involve the Europeans into this. Most of their studies are absolute nonsense.

I'm from Anambra with origin traceable to present day Ohafia in Abia state. When Ohafias speak I barely understand them because of the long time the founder of my town left there. I barely understand Owerre too so I wouldn't be fair to say that Ikas should be able to understand Owerre dialect. I only said you should try and study the similarities. It could help you understand better. Don't be quick to dismiss what I've written here. I've met and spoken with both Igbanke and Agbor indigenes.

gerg:
The kings of Igbanke are called Enogie. It would be nice if you provide the author of your write up. Anybody can fabricate stories and post them online

The money spent on your education was NOT wasted!! I once asked this question earlier, on another thread: "Why do the rulers of Igbanke clans bear Edo names?" Afterall, in this day and age, people are free to change their names back to their ancestral ones, if they feel their current names do not serve any useful purpose. Yet they are still bearing their Edo names with pride. Why??

Secondly, do you agree that sons and daughters of Igbanke land bear Edo names like Omorodion, Idabor, Olubor, Osunde, Eni, Ogbomor, Irabor, Oghumu, Edobor, Idahosa etc., which reflect an Edo heritage?

Finally, do you agree that they are no less Igbanke, than those who bear Ika names?

Yujin:

I'm from Anambra with origin traceable to present day Ohafia in Abia state. When Ohafias speak I barely understand them because of the long time the founder of my town left there. I barely understand Owerre too so I wouldn't be fair to say that Ikas should be able to understand Owerre dialect. I only said you should try and study the similarities. It could help you understand better. Don't be quick to dismiss what I've written here. I've met and spoken with both Igbanke and Agbor indigenes.

At times I wonder why he's arguing blindly... An ika elder by name Chief iduuwe wrote a book on the history of agbor where he claimed that the town was founded by one ogele like that around 700BC...even as recently as may 2015,during an interview with the Niger Delta budget monitoring group, the Dein of Agbor gave a little tip on the etymology and origin of agbor. It was from that interview that I got to know that Agbor is the Igbo for lineage which in Anioma is pronounced as "Agbò" while other Igbos call it Agburu.
Instead of him to go and read up on Agbor or should I say ika history, he's here arguing blindly

Ngozi123:


I never said that the Igbos weren't in the East before the Anioma people. I said that my ancestors once lived under the Benin Empire, which they did. I agree with the theory of reverse migration; the Igbos were gradually migrating West but something caused them to go back to the East. It's the theory that makes the most sense to me but it's not concrete.

Nice to have u finally contributing to the board.

Igbos are from the east always never from the west. Igbos settled in the west and traded with the East and other western tribes.

In the 15th century, the western igbo fell to the Benin Empire, during an attempted expansion of the kingdom.

This soon ended after a bitter confrontation with the British and Aniomas

The Benin empire relegated to the shores of the South west.

Whether everybody in Anioma are from Nri is highly unlikely, but the majority are from Nri.

Did people from the other western tribe end up across the Niger in places like Onitsha and Ogbaru, most likely.

RedboneSmith:


This is Wikipedia. Probably edited just a few minutes ago by a southeasterner. No Issele indigene will say his people came from Nri. None.

That is highly unlikely, the source that i was going to refer u to was not credible, neither is wikipedia but at least we get some basics from wikipedia.


Do u dispute these facts? if u do then specify the particular one that u dispute.

The community of Issele Ukwu is related to Kingdom of Nri.


Oral traditions said that the founders of Issele Ukwu and the people of Nri came from the same source.[1]



Issele Ukwu is part of the ethnic territory of the Igbo people.


The area is growing with immigrant communities of Itsekiri, Urhobo, Isoko, Ijaw, Hausa and Yoruba people .


tps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Issele_Ukwu

cheruv:

At times I wonder why he's arguing blindly... An ika elder by name Chief iduuwe wrote a book on the history of agbor where he claimed that the town was founded by one ogele like that around 700BC...even as recently as may 2015,during an interview with the Niger Delta budget monitoring group, the Dein of Agbor gave a little tip on the etymology and origin of agbor. It was from that interview that I got to know that Agbor is the Igbo for lineage which in Anioma is pronounced as "Agbò" while other Igbos call it Agburu.
Instead of him to go and read up on Agbor or should I say ika history, he's here arguing blindly

Another nonsense you just spewed. There is nothing like Niger Delta Budget Monitoring Group that interviewed the Dein of Agbor. I came across this your so called interview and I was surprised by everything I saw there. On digging deep I discovered that it was all cooked up. There is no limit you people can't get to make Ika look more Igbo . Sometimes I wonder how a people can be like this. It was in this same same interview they tried to give an Igbo meaning to Ominijie, a full Bini word. Even Agbon is a full Bini word and it has the same meaning in Ika

hammerF:



Nice to have u finally contributing to the board.

Igbos are from the east always never from the west. Igbos settled in the west and traded with the East and other western tribes.

In the 15th century, the western igbo fell to the Benin Empire, during an attempted expansion of the kingdom.

This soon ended after a bitter confrontation with the British.

The Benin empire relegated to the shores of the South west.

Whether everybody in Anioma are from Nri is highly unlikely, but the majority are from Nri.

Did people from the other western tribe end up across the Niger in places like Onitsha and Ogbaru, most likely.

Yes, this is what I've been saying all along. I don't believe that any Igbo person originates from the West but many migrated there probably for trade and lived under the Benin Empire. I believe that many of the people in Anioma, Onitsha, Ogbaru etc are the descendants of these people.

Ngozi123:


Yes, this is what I've been saying all along. I don't believe that any Igbo person originates from the West but many migrated there probably for trade and lived under the Benin Empire. I believe that many of the people in Anioma, Onitsha, Ogbaru etc are the descendants of these people.

ehn! e bia go kita!

There are different variants of Agbor origin. The ogele version , the Ominijie version and the Agbon version. They are all correct. These migrations happened at different times and the Agbon's was the most recent of them all.

Cire80:
There are different variants of Agbor origin. The ogele version , the Ominijie version and the Agbon version. They are all correct. These migrations happened at different times and the Agbon's was the most recent of them all.

We cannot write or rewrite history on nairaland and oral history are hearsay, hence not credible. however wat we can work with are evidence and the facts on ground.

First a credible timeline has to be placed on the Benin Kingdom.

Second, y did Benin not expand into Anioma wen their were no natural barrier, but the Nri Kingdom was able to overcome the River Niger to settle in Anioma?

Thirdly, Y is the Benin linguistic cultural sphere limited to Bini in Edo? Are their other groups that speak similar language to Bini as we have with igbos and yorubas?

Answer these three questions first.

hammerF:



ehn! e bia go kita!

On wikipedia, the first Oba name is registered as Eweka

Cant help but notice that the name is similar to the Igbo name called Emeka.

Wat does Eweka mean in Bini, does anybody know?

Could the name be a corrupt version for the igbo name Emeka?

Could igbos from Nri have founded the bini kingdom and due to mixing with yorubas created the bini dialect?

cheruv:

At times I wonder why he's arguing blindly... An ika elder by name Chief iduuwe wrote a book on the history of agbor where he claimed that the town was founded by one ogele like that around 700BC...even as recently as may 2015,during an interview with the Niger Delta budget monitoring group, the Dein of Agbor gave a little tip on the etymology and origin of agbor. It was from that interview that I got to know that Agbor is the Igbo for lineage which in Anioma is pronounced as "Agbò" while other Igbos call it Agburu.
Instead of him to go and read up on Agbor or should I say ika history, he's here arguing blindly

Why can't you use your senses? Dein of Agbor said all that in an interview and you chose to believe that interview was real? Agbor was formerly called Agbon before it was anglicicized. Lineage is called Agbon in Edo and Anioma and There is no relationship between Agbon and Agburu. Look for another lie. Dein never said this. Paste the link to this your interview let's see.

laudate:


The money spent on your education was NOT wasted!! I once asked this question earlier, on another thread: "Why do the rulers of Igbanke clans bear Edo names?" Afterall, in this day and age, people are free to change their names back to their ancestral ones, if they feel their current names do not serve any useful purpose. Yet they are still bearing their Edo names with pride. Why??

Secondly, do you agree that sons and daughters of Igbanke land bear Edo names like Omorodion, Idabor, Olubor, Osunde, Eni, Ogbomor, Irabor, Oghumu, Edobor, Idahosa etc., which reflect an Edo heritage?

Finally, do you agree that they are no less Igbanke, than those who bear Ika names?

Asking why the rulers of Igbanke bear "Enogie" title, is akin to asking why the leaders of Nigeria bear " president" title
Both are results of colonization.
King in Igbanke as is obtainable in all western Igbo communities translates to " Eze", and not Enogie.
Enogie is a vestige of Bini colonization of Igbanke.

ehikwe22:
Why can't you use your senses? Dein of Agbor said all that in an interview and you chose to believe that interview was real? Agbor was formerly called Agbon before it was anglicicized. Lineage is called Agbon in Edo and Anioma and There is no relationship between Agbon and Agburu. Look for another lie. Dein never said this. Paste the link to this your interview let's see.

Lineage is called "Ebo" in Enu-ani.

Known King/Emperor (Oba)
• 1180–1246 Eweka I [1]
• 1440–1473 Ewuare (1440–1473) would expand the city-state to an empire
Ovonramwen (exile 1897)
• 1978–2016 Erediauwa I (post-imperial)
• 2016- Ewuare II (post-imperial)


U will also notice that the time frame of Eweka reign is wrong becos of the gap between his reign and that of Ewuare 1440-1473.

Ewuare was credited with building the City of Benin and expansion of the empire both, North, East, West and South.

Clearly after his reign, the British showed up and it was no longer business as usual. Ovonramwen had to go into Exile.

That was the End of the Benin expansion program.

Second, y did Benin not expand into Anioma wen their were no natural barrier, but the Nri Kingdom was able to overcome the River Niger to settle in Anioma?


Rational question, especially when you consider the fact that there are non Igbo speaking community in Edo whose progenitors were Igbo speaking, Who migrated to Edo from western Igboland and as far as from present south East.

hammerF:



That is highly unlikely, the source that i was going to refer u to was not credible, neither is wikipedia but at least we get some basics from wikipedia.


Do u dispute these facts? if u do then specify the particular one that u dispute.

I dispute the Nri bit. Very much. Ogboli-Issele may have some connections with Nri. But Issele people will disagree strongly and tell you all of Issele, including Ogboli-Issele is from Benin. Anybody saying Issele is of Nri origin is definitely not from Issele or even Anioma.

Again, Wikipedia can never be a reliable source. If i want I can go now and edit Wikipedia so that it will read that Kano was founded by the Japanese.

Cire80:
Another nonsense you just spewed. There is nothing like Niger Delta Budget Monitoring Group that interviewed the Dein of Agbor. I came across this your so called interview and I was surprised by everything I saw there. On digging deep I discovered that it was all cooked up. There is no limit you people can't get to make Ika look more Igbo . Sometimes I wonder how a people can be like this. It was in this same same interview they tried to give an Igbo meaning to Ominijie, a full Bini word. Even Agbon is a full Bini word and it has the same meaning in Ika

Its a Federal govt project so whether its cooked up or not,the onus lies on the Federal govt not me

vicenzo:
Second, y did Benin not expand into Anioma wen their were no natural barrier, but the Nri Kingdom was able to overcome the River Niger to settle in Anioma?


Rational question, especially when you consider the fact that there are non Igbo speaking community in Edo whose progenitors were Igbo speaking, Who migrated to Edo from western Igboland and as far as from present south East.

I even read up somewhere that the igueben people in ishanland are descendants of awka blacksmiths

vicenzo:


Lineage is called "Ebo" in Enu-ani.

where are you from Vicenzo? An Anioma man said lineage is Agbon in his language and you're trying to correct him. Ebon is not lineage but kindred or kinsmen or family. Agbon and Ebon means different things. Like in Ika area we have Ebon which is a group of people from the same extended family.