ooman:

maybe I dont understand your concept of god, can you expatiate more on that.

presence of anatomical junks like toes, appendix which are not useful to us biologically shows lack of intelligence. biological explanation is that toes are used by our ape ancestors who climbed trees and so need it for grasping. appendix is useless in humans, if it has any function at all, its to cause appendicitis. intelligence would know to perfectly mold the human body

presence of mistakes called mutation in the molecular state shows that no intelligence was involved in its origin. scientists can now make a perfect genome by adding some synthetic genes which are not part of the genome. if an intelligence was involved in the origin of dna, it would know to prevent mistakes, the mistakes which has taken millions of live as embryonic lethal mutations, cancer, diabetes among money genetic diseases both inherited or developed.

there are many more examples that shows lack of intelligence in the universe: the earth is not perfect for life, the sun harm us, cause cancer, cosmic rays are very dangerous, solar flares, earthquake etc. this are junks of nature. A PERFECT INTELLIGENCE would know to clean them up, so they won't harm the people for whom he created all things, but such intelligence is missing.

Please ooman are you absolutely sure that the appendix has no use?

GooseBaba:

Bros ooman, I still no gree on that concept..if that is correct how do you explain the ever increasing growth of human population. That means homo + population control no work...am I right or am I right? Bros talk true...

actually it works in other organism, research shows that when rat population are over carrying capacity of their habitat, they become depressed and females are resistant to males, cannibalism and homosexuality develops until the population is reduced. here is the analysis: depression makes them aggressive so they indulge in cannibalism, killing and eating themselves because of lack of food, since females are resistant to males, males mate with eachother again reducing their population. once their numbers is within carrying capacity, everything returns back to normal. no one cannibalism because food is now present, because of the comfort, females accept males again and homosexuality is subdued until another population explosion.

the homosexual gene hasn't recorded much success in humans probably because the heterosexuals produce too much children. since a couple may have 4 children when the reasonable number of children is 2 for all families.

.

chukkynwob:

Please ooman are you absolutely sure that the appendix has no use?

the apparent use of the appendix is that it contains cells of immune system. this makes it a vestigial organ because the immune system it contains are very useful in homo erectus. however, in sapiens, the bone marrow is doing great in producing and the lymph node is storing specialized immune cells. this makes the appendix useless. its presence only cause illness for people as it. accumulates crystals that cause appendicitis.

many people have had their appendix removed and never complain of any side effect. it is a vestigial organ, its not important to humans. other organs now perform its function efficiently

also is the nails, they have no use to sapiens but needed by habilis for tearing.

ooman:

the apparent use of the appendix is that it contains cells of immune system. this makes it a vestigial organ because the immune system it contains are very useful in homo erectus. however, in sapiens, the bone marrow is doing great in producing and the lymph node is storing specialized immune cells. this makes the appendix useless. its presence only cause illness for people as it. accumulates crystals that cause appendicitis.

many people have had their appendix removed and never complain of any side effect. it is a vestigial organ, [size=21pt]its not important to humans[/size]. other organs now perform its function efficiently

also is the nails, they have no use to sapiens but needed by habilis for tearing.

Please allow me to quote a professional in the field and yes before you shout appeal to authority

The strength of this authoritative argument depends upon two factors:
1.The authority is a legitimate expert on the subject- professor of physiology at Oklahoma State University,
2.There exists consensus among legitimate experts in the subject matter under discussion-he wrote on Scientific American's website

Loren G. Martin, professor of physiology at Oklahoma State University, replies:

"For years, the appendix was credited with very little physiological function. We now know, however, that the appendix[size=21pt] serves an important role in the fetus and in young adults[/size]. Endocrine cells appear in the appendix of the human fetus at around the 11th week of development. These endocrine cells of the fetal appendix have been shown to produce various biogenic amines and peptide hormones, compounds that assist with various biological control (homeostatic) mechanisms. There had been little prior evidence of this or any other role of the appendix in animal research, because the appendix does not exist in domestic mammals.

excerpts from http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=what-is-the-function-of-t


Guess its YOU vs HIM

chukkynwob:

Please allow me to quote a professional in the field and yes before you shout appeal to authority

The strength of this authoritative argument depends upon two factors:
1.The authority is a legitimate expert on the subject- professor of physiology at Oklahoma State University,
2.There exists consensus among legitimate experts in the subject matter under discussion-he wrote on Scientific American's website

Loren G. Martin, professor of physiology at Oklahoma State University, replies:

"For years, the appendix was credited with very little physiological function. We now know, however, that the appendix[size=21pt] serves an important role in the fetus and in young adults[/size]. Endocrine cells appear in the appendix of the human fetus at around the 11th week of development. These endocrine cells of the fetal appendix have been shown to produce various biogenic amines and peptide hormones, compounds that assist with various biological control (homeostatic) mechanisms. There had been little prior evidence of this or any other role of the appendix in animal research, because the appendix does not exist in domestic mammals.

excerpts from http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=what-is-the-function-of-t


Guess its YOU vs HIM

that is an unproved argument, pls refer to en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vermiform_appendix you will find many argument against the dr's hypothesis and many other proposed but unproved uses of appendix.

also is what its presence lead to. an excerpt from the website:"However, other research
showed that there is a
significantly greater rate of C.
difficile infection among people
with an appendix, with more
than 80% of the infections
occurring among patients with
an intact appendix."

ooman:

that is an unproved argument, pls refer to en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vermiform_appendix you will find many argument against the dr's hypothesis and many other proposed but unproved uses of appendix.

also is what its presence lead to. an excerpt from the website:"However, other research
showed that there is a
significantly greater rate of C.
difficile infection among people
with an appendix, with more
than 80% of the infections
occurring among patients with
an intact appendix."

so from the article we can we safely assume that his hypothesis is probable?

ooman:

maybe I dont understand your concept of god, can you expatiate more on that.

presence of anatomical junks like toes, appendix which are not useful to us biologically shows lack of intelligence. biological explanation is that toes are used by our ape ancestors who climbed trees and so need it for grasping. appendix is useless in humans, if it has any function at all, its to cause appendicitis. intelligence would know to perfectly mold the human body

presence of mistakes called mutation in the molecular state shows that no intelligence was involved in its origin. scientists can now make a perfect genome by adding some synthetic genes which are not part of the genome. if an intelligence was involved in the origin of dna, it would know to prevent mistakes, the mistakes which has taken millions of live as embryonic lethal mutations, cancer, diabetes among money genetic diseases both inherited or developed.

there are many more examples that shows lack of intelligence in the universe: the earth is not perfect for life, the sun harm us, cause cancer, cosmic rays are very dangerous, solar flares, earthquake etc. this are junks of nature. A PERFECT INTELLIGENCE would know to clean them up, so they won't harm the people for whom he created all things, but such intelligence is missing.

you make many untrue assumptions based on unconfirmed facts. The appendix is not entirely useless, [url=en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vermiform_appendix]APPENDIX[/url] I think it is wiser not to draw conclusions from semi knowledge. Do you know that the spleen was also considered useless just a few years back? Know this, science is still trying to understand our world fully and right now it doesn't have all the answers. Stop flying off on unestablished facts.
Its not a case of science vs god my friend, you need to understand that.

As for your first sentence, I have no concept of God. I'm still trying to understand some things so you can say I'm still searching. I don't have all the answers but I can say this...there's an intelligent designer, the uncaused causer.

Kay 17:

BUT God from whom all things come from + the Universe, is causeless??

Its hard for you to believe that God can be causeless but you seamlessly and without question accept the idea that your very life and the existence of the earth is causeless? It takes greater faith to believe in a secular explanation for life than it takes to believe in God.

ooman:

maybe I dont understand your concept of god, can you expatiate more on that.

presence of anatomical junks like toes, appendix which are not useful to us biologically shows lack of intelligence. biological explanation is that toes are used by our ape ancestors who climbed trees and so need it for grasping. appendix is useless in humans, if it has any function at all, its to cause appendicitis. intelligence would know to perfectly mold the human body

the toe and appendix as anatomical junk? and these are the "scientists" we have to deal with here. Perhaps you should chop off your toes and try walking without them.

ooman:
presence of mistakes called mutation in the molecular state shows that no intelligence was involved in its origin. scientists can now make a perfect genome by adding some synthetic genes which are not part of the genome. if an intelligence was involved in the origin of dna, it would know to prevent mistakes, the mistakes which has taken millions of live as embryonic lethal mutations, cancer, diabetes among money genetic diseases both inherited or developed.

there are many more examples that shows lack of intelligence in the universe: the earth is not perfect for life, the sun harm us, cause cancer, cosmic rays are very dangerous, solar flares, earthquake etc. this are junks of nature. A PERFECT INTELLIGENCE would know to clean them up, so they won't harm the people for whom he created all things, but such intelligence is missing.

Well you can try Jupiter.

Frankly this post was so s.tupid to bother responding to in full. I am more convinced that atheists, at least on nairaland, are mostly irredeemable idiots.

davidylan:

Its hard for you to believe that God can be causeless but you seamlessly and without question accept the idea that your very life and the existence of the earth is causeless? It takes greater faith to believe in a secular explanation for life than it takes to believe in God.

Fail.

Normal human beings dont argue from ignorance. They know that the earliest time we can do back in the history of the universe is the big bang. Does anyone know what caused the big bang? No.


However some people infested with a religious/theist virus choose to come and claim that a god did it with no single evidence.

ooman:

the apparent use of the appendix is that it contains cells of immune system. this makes it a vestigial organ because the immune system it contains are very useful in homo erectus. however, in sapiens, the bone marrow is doing great in producing and the lymph node is storing specialized immune cells. this makes the appendix useless. its presence only cause illness for people as it. accumulates crystals that cause appendicitis.

Well for starters, the immune system is a combination of several organs so cannot be "contained" in the appendix. Idiocy.

ooman:
many people have had their appendix removed and never complain of any side effect. it is a vestigial organ, its not important to humans. other organs now perform its function efficiently

also is the nails, they have no use to sapiens but needed by habilis for tearing.

If you had your tonsils removed you would be just fine. If you removed the lymph nodes in your neck you will live to 90 if your foolishness does not kill you... does that render lymph nodes as vestigial organs? Opari!

ooman:

the apparent use of the appendix is that it contains cells of immune system. this makes it a vestigial organ because the immune system it contains are very useful in homo erectus. however, in sapiens, the bone marrow is doing great in producing and the lymph node is storing specialized immune cells. this makes the appendix useless. its presence only cause illness for people as it. accumulates crystals that cause appendicitis.

many people have had their appendix removed and never complain of any side effect. it is a vestigial organ, its not important to humans. other organs now perform its function efficiently

also is the nails, they have no use to sapiens but needed by habilis for tearing.

Darwin once called the thymus a vestigial organ. Well we do know that the thymus is the "T" in T cells. Well feel free to search google on how important T cells are... start from the mode of action of the HiV virus.

brokoto: you make many untrue assumptions based on unconfirmed facts. The appendix is not entirely useless, [url=en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vermiform_appendix]APPENDIX[/url] I think it is wiser not to draw conclusions from semi knowledge. Do you know that the spleen was also considered useless just a few years back? Know this, science is still trying to understand our world fully and right now it doesn't have all the answers. Stop flying off on unestablished facts.
Its not a case of science vs god my friend, you need to understand that.

As for your first sentence, I have no concept of God. I'm still trying to understand some things so you can say I'm still searching. I don't have all the answers but I can say this...there's an intelligent designer, the uncaused causer.

you cannot remove any other part of your body with an apparent physiological function and continue to live as when you remove the appendix. no other body part also cause more unnecessary illness than the appendix, the link I gave confirmed this.
it is a medical fact that the appendix was useful in erectus and not in sapiens. it. is degenerate, it stays with an apparent use in us because we inherited it from erectus, THE LINK I GAVE CONFIRMS ALL THIS.

@davidylan: I never said the appendix contained immune system but cells of the immune system there is a difference so cool down. if you remove your tonsils, YOU WILL NOT BE JUST FINE, YOU WILL SUFFER FROM INFLAMATION OF UPPER RESPIRATORY TRACT, i never mentioned tonsil, if you remove your lymph node, most especially if you live in africa, you wont live past one day, dont imply what I didn't say. I never said thymus was a vestigial organ.

toes are prehensile organs, humans are not ARBOREAL anymore, our ancestors were and that makes toes useless in us, we only have toes because we inherited it. toes are not needed for balance. THIS HAS BEEN BIOMETRICALLY PROVEN .read with a witty mind before writing, no one is competiting with you here.

also for others, read my links thoroughly before you make comments.

I maintain that a perfect god would know to make all environmental factors best for human living but nature does not behave as if it cares for life, it doesn't show intelligence control.

@brokoto: if you have no concept of god, on which god do you base intelligent design, are you a xtians, muslim, ifa worshipper etc?

why do you assume an uncaused causer, why do you assume he is uncaused since its the term of the intelligent design's proponents is that "nothing comes from nothing". where does this intelligent DESIGNER (ID) come from.

science thinks all things came from energy which has been proven to be uncreated and which cannot be destroyed but only convertible based on location in space. and that the ban.g's explosion caused the formation of baryons from which matter came. we also think that concentration of energy caused the ban.g same way as concentration of hydrogen in the sun will cause a supernova in some 7 billion years to come, this will destroy everything in its path including the earth. however, its debris will form another star, just like a supernova some 10billion years ago provided debris from which our solar system spontaneously firmed.

Oh Lord, the ONE who makes the heaven the earth and everything therein; I ask that you visit anyone who makes genuine contribution on this thread.

You said, I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, no one cometh to the Father but by Me, therefore step in at this moment including the OP.

.

dipotech: Oh Lord, the ONE who makes the heaven the earth and everything therein; I ask that you visit anyone who makes genuine contribution on this thread.

You said, I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, no one cometh to the Father but by Me, therefore step in at this moment including the OP.

if your god can show himself to me, then I ll rest my case.

Oonan, you are doing great.

Brokoto, I love your arguement of intelligent design (ID, according to ooman). you are great, you would have been greater than ooman but you didn't offer any explanation like ooman, you just assume everything must be designed. offer proves like ooman, links too and perhaps, I will join you.

DAVIDYLAN, YOU POISON EVERYTHING, PLS GET OUT OF HERE. YOUR STUP.IDITY AND CRAZI.NESS MADE YOU IMPLY WHAT OOMAN NEVER INTEND. YOU ARE TURNING EVERYTHING UPSIDE DOWN HERE. ooman never mentioned thymus, tonsil, you did. you always love to make ooman look stup.id, I have been following you. on the contrary, you are stu.pid instead for doing that. you are a crazy bi.tch

chukkynwob, I love your counter on the appendix issue even though ooman gave a rebuff back. you are great too. keep it up, dont let ooman turn us to illiterates here

I think ooman is making sense though and needs to be understood. he is the only atheist scientist here among many xtians, so pls excuse him for some mistakes

brokoto, pls enlighten me more on your philosophy, I love it. I want to believe it, it seem to make sense but pls start with who designed god if everything is designed

deepsight, I also saw you.

macdaddy, you are a disappointment for your comment that one guy does not represent all atheist . what are you implying about ooman, just shut up.

goosebaba, I think ooman is right on the homosexual stuff.

let ooman and brokoto continue this debate, others may join but davidylan, do you always poison everything good everywhere you are? you dont make sense here, get out, you are not wanted.

ooman:

you cannot remove any other part of your body with an apparent physiological function and continue to live as when you remove the appendix. no other body part also cause more unnecessary illness than the appendix, the link I gave confirmed this.
it is a medical fact that the appendix was useful in erectus and not in sapiens. it. is degenerate, it stays with an apparent use in us because we inherited it from erectus, THE LINK I GAVE CONFIRMS ALL THIS.

@davidylan: I never said the appendix contained immune system but cells of the immune system there is a difference so cool down. if you remove your tonsils, YOU WILL NOT BE JUST FINE, YOU WILL SUFFER FROM INFLAMATION OF UPPER RESPIRATORY TRACT, i never mentioned tonsil, if you remove your lymph node, most especially if you live in africa, you wont live past one day, dont imply what I didn't say. I never said thymus was a vestigial organ.

toes are prehensile organs, humans are not ARBOREAL anymore, our ancestors were and that makes toes useless in us, we only have toes because we inherited it. toes are not needed for balance. THIS HAS BEEN BIOMETRICALLY PROVEN .read with a witty mind before writing, no one is competiting with you here.

also for others, read my links thoroughly before you make comments.

I maintain that a perfect god would know to make all environmental factors best for human living but nature does not behave as if it cares for life, it doesn't show intelligence control.

@brokoto: if you have no concept of god, on which god do you base intelligent design, are you a xtians, muslim, ifa worshipper etc?

why do you assume an uncaused causer, why do you assume he is uncaused since its the term of the intelligent design's proponents is that "nothing comes from nothing". where does this intelligent DESIGNER (ID) come from.

science thinks all things came from energy which has been proven to be uncreated and which cannot be destroyed but only convertible based on location in space. and that the ban.g's explosion caused the formation of baryons from which matter came. we also think that concentration of energy caused the ban.g same way as concentration of hydrogen in the sun will cause a supernova in some 7 billion years to come, this will destroy everything in its path including the earth. however, its debris will form another star, just like a supernova some 10billion years ago provided debris from which our solar system spontaneously firmed.

let me ask you one question...
You find no qualms believing that energy was never created but you can't believe that there's a God that was never created?
It seems you are just eager to know my religion so you can make an ad hominem argument. You make many baseless assumptions and frankly I'm tired of addressing them one by one.

brokoto dont forget to answer my questions. explain further on your arguments. you said an intelligent designer designed everything but who designed him. remember you have failed if you say he is causeless and undesigned because as ooman says, its the term of believers in design that nothing comes from nothing , so what did your god come from?.

ooman says energy is eternal and it does not have consciousness and everything came from it, that makes more sense than to say a highly intelligent being just came from nothing and made all things. pls explain further.

brokoto: let me ask you one question...
You find no qualms believing that energy was never created but you can't believe that there's a God that was never created?
It seems you are just eager to know my religion so you can make an ad hominem argument. You make many baseless assumptions and frankly I'm tired of addressing them one by one.

for your questions, I think the answer lies with you answering poopli.

what you worship is your business. you are the one bashing my views not me bashing yours so dont feel like a victim here.

if you want to go, thats fine by me.

I believe in energy because it is mathematically proven, I dont believe in god because nature lacks intelligence and perfection.

poopli: brokoto dont forget to answer my questions. explain further on your arguments. you said an intelligent designer designed everything but who designed him. remember you have failed if you say he is causeless and undesigned because as ooman says, its the term of believers in design that nothing comes from nothing , so what did your god come from?.

ooman says energy is eternal and it does not have consciousness and everything came from it, that makes more sense than to say a highly intelligent being just came from nothing and made all things. pls explain further.

in order not to sound mean or condescending, is ooman your source of authority? You keep saying 'ooman says' as if his word is bond. If ooman says its this does that make it so?
Now, if you wanna know how I came upon my belief in a creator I will explain it systematically over time. Mind you, you should not look at it from a xtian perspective because that is my issue with ooman. He seems to think that because the Christian concept of God is not feasible therefore there's no God.

Ooman, science does not have all the answers and sometimes it can be wrong as has been proved overtime. It does not mean that we should dismiss it as false. No! I dunno if you read the link I posted concerning the appendix. What I concluded from that link was that it has not been categorically proven that the appendix is now useless so it will be premature to assume so and therefore draw a conclusion based on that. That is where I have issues with you. What you quoted was from that link but you conveniently ignored the other parts about its usefulness which to me I think its an intent to deceive.

If you care to continue this I'll gather my materials and open a separate thread for such an argument although I doubt it will make any difference to you.

davidylan:

Its hard for you to believe that God can be causeless but you seamlessly and without question accept the idea that your very life and the existence of the earth is causeless? It takes greater faith to believe in a secular explanation for life than it takes to believe in God.

Where did I say that??

brokoto: in order not to sound mean or condescending, is ooman your source of authority? You keep saying 'ooman says' as if his word is bond. If ooman says its this does that make it so?
Now, if you wanna know how I came upon my belief in a creator I will explain it systematically over time. Mind you, you should not look at it from a xtian perspective because that is my issue with ooman. He seems to think that because the Christian concept of God is not feasible therefore there's no God.

Ooman, science does not have all the answers and sometimes it can be wrong as has been proved overtime. It does not mean that we should dismiss it as false. No! I dunno if you read the link I posted concerning the appendix. What I concluded from that link was that it has not been categorically proven that the appendix is now useless so it will be premature to assume so and therefore draw a conclusion based on that. That is where I have issues with you. What you quoted was from that link but you conveniently ignored the other parts about its usefulness which to me I think its an intent to deceive.

If you care to continue this I'll gather my materials and open a separate thread for such an argument although I doubt it will make any difference to you.

like I said, excuse ooman for some mistakes, we are all still learning. am sure everyone knows science does not have all the answers but also, everyone knows the the xtians creation does not also make sense. it doesnt agree with biology. ooman is a geneticist according to him so forgive him

pls continue in this thread, the title makes it the perfect thread to explain your philosophies.am waiting.

before you start, let me make my view clear. am a field biologist with reason to doubt the xtian god and like ooman, intelligent design too, the muslim god is not an option for me so I am an agnostic, this is why I want to learn your philosophy so dont make the mistakes of thinking you are talking to an illiterate.

poopli:

like I said, excuse ooman for some mistakes, we are all still learning. am sure everyone knows science does not have all the answers but also, everyone knows the the xtians creation does not also make sense. it doesnt agree with biology. ooman is a geneticist according to him so forgive him

pls continue in this thread, the title makes it the perfect thread to explain your philosophies.am waiting.

before you start, let me make my view clear. am a field biologist with reason to doubt the xtian god and like ooman, intelligent design too, the muslim god is not an option for me so I am an agnostic, this is why I want to learn your philosophy so dont make the mistakes of thinking you are talking to an illiterate.

My only problem with Ooman is he presents halftruths to conviniently suit his arguments.
On a certain thread he even implied that as an electrical electronics engineer that I am @best a tv repairer
So I have taken it upon myself to counter him,anywhere on NL where he presents half truths or pass his personal opinion as scientific facts.

The debate of the existence of God is one of the oldest debates of all times and so no matter what we say here,the deabate cannot and will not end with us.

My appeal to all(atheists,Deist,Theist) is that we abide by an ethical code of not mixing personal opinions(including worldviews) with scientific facts.

There are methodologies of establishing scientific facts,I hope we can adhere to that.

I am a bible believing christian by the way

chukkynwob:

My only problem with Ooman is he presents halftruths to conviniently suit his arguments.
On a certain thread he even implied that as an electrical electronics engineer that I am @best a tv repairer
So I have taken it upon myself to counter him,anywhere on NL where he presents half truths or pass his personal opinion as scientific facts.

funny.

chukkynwob:

My only problem with Ooman is he presents halftruths to conviniently suit his arguments.
On a certain thread he even implied that as an electrical electronics engineer that I am @best a tv repairer
So I have taken it upon myself to counter him,anywhere on NL where he presents half truths or pass his personal opinion as scientific facts.

you say I present half truths but they are truths afterall and they are scientific facts, just because you reject them does not change them and your opinions makes no difference to science.

a simple fact is TRUE: there is no God.

ooman2:

you say I present half truths but they are truths afterall and they are scientific facts, just because you reject them does not change them and your opinions makes no difference to science.

a simple fact is TRUE: there is no God.

I SMH for you. So you actually know what you are doing? Deceiving gullible people. I made an error arguing with you in the first place.

brokoto: I SMH for you. So you actually know what you are doing? Deceiving gullible people. I made an error arguing with you in the first place.

am waiting for your philosophies.

@poopli

Yes ooman is right! Homosexuality as a form of population control exist with rats not humans.

I believe God is energy, the source of all living things that we cannot do without. This energy is within our essence as human beings. Therefore, the need to harness our capabilities from within comes in different forms as dreams, faith, hallucinations or simple physical strength.. Or our mind..

Also, there is a sense of spiritual well being. For I believe we are all spiritual being and when life ends the spiritual energy goes back to the source. However, such energy can still be harness, hence the need why we fear things that we cannot see... The air one breaths is God, because it sustains life and ends it... And the best part you don't have to learn how to use it or worship it, it belongs to every living things and it never discriminates...

GooseBaba: @poopli

Yes ooman is right! Homosexuality as a form of population control exist with rats not humans.

I believe God is energy, the source of all living things that we cannot do without. This energy is within our essence as human beings. Therefore, the need to harness our capabilities from within comes in different forms as dreams, faith, hallucinations or simple physical strength.. Or our mind..

Also, there is a sense of spiritual well being. For I believe we are all spiritual being and when life ends the spiritual energy goes back to the source. However, such energy can still be harness, hence the need why we fear things that we cannot see... The air one breaths is God, because it sustains life and ends it... And the best part you don't have to learn how to use it or worship it, it belongs to every living things and it never discriminates...

are u a xtians or muslim

poopli:

are u a xtians or muslim

Non of the above... Why do you ask?