Have always known tithing and speaking in tongues are fraud, at least in obodo Naija.

cremeandchic: If I have a bowl of garri on my table,u can't convince me it is rice when I know perfectly what I have on my table.

No man of God will FORCE you to pay tithes or even give offerings.They would only ENCOURAGE you.

As for me,I'm a faithful tither and I know the difference between when I pay my tithes and when I don't.Malachi 3 is clear.

God doesn't need your money afterall.Anything you give to God or do for God,at the end of the day it's for your own benefit.

When u pay tithes,the blessings come back to you,when u obey the commandments,it's for your own good and the good of people around You.

It doesn't mean if you don't pay,God won't bless you.He's a merciful God afterall.But there's a reason tithing was introduced.

Assuming we all stopped paying tithes,how would the children of levi(the pastors who have no other source of income) survive?

I'm not in support of pastors coveting church resources into personal selfish uses though.But it's between them and God afterall.Pay ur tithes and move on.

In order words tithe is the bribe your god takes to bless you ba?
People wey no dey worship god no dey chop ba?

Igbo-smoking-pastor-worshipping-people

I will rather give my tithes,I av tried it and I av seen d effects on my finances and my family. Since it is not a sin if I pay my tithes,when did u become God's spokesman? And be careful of d kind of words u use against Men of God. Touch not my annointed... Who made u a Judge...

before i write anything on this topic, i'll like to first say femi aribisala is a consummate rėtard.

tithing is essential in the church. it is what expands the church, it pays the salaries of full-time pastors and its the fuel needed to drive the gospel.

It should be tithe for all not just farm produces or animals. Historically, the Israelite were farmers and they raised animals. Read about the first tithe given by Abraham in Genesis 14:20 and you will realize it was tithe of all.

asudan:
may God forgive your ignorance as it is not all pastors that depend on tithe or offerings for survival.

brain washed idiots

Atlast this thread makes front page.

For those who are new to the argument, know that it is probably the most intense subject discussed on the religion section and hundreds of threads can testify to it. My own thread https://www.nairaland.com/1239719/questions-frosbel-tithing on the subject was simply explosive. At the end of the argument I joined the host of those who do not pay tithe and have not payed tithe for two months now, having payed tithe for 15yrs following my conversion to Christianity.

This thread, on Femi Abirisala, writing against tithe, has only rejuvenated the argument against it. Old foes meet here again and the argument will most likely be as it had been on other thread. The only difference now is that we will have a lot of "outsiders" contribute to the discuss.

I predict that the anti-tithers will win (again) bc the idea of couphing out 10% of tones gross pay will never go down well with anyone. But nonetheless let me summarise how the discuss will go:

Pro tithers will say: Jesus supported the tithe in Matthew 23:23 by a single statement "... do not leave the others undone...". They will also say that Malachi 3 is an OT injuction which still applies to NT Christians. ETC.

Anti tithers will say: The law has been abolished in the NT. Tithing today is according to Mosaic law and there is no point tithing when we do not follow other Mosaic injuctions. They argue that Abraham paying tithe is not a basis for arguing for tithe pre-law, as Abraham only payed tithe that once, also he tithed spoil not his income and that after that practice he returned the remaining spoil to the owners. (I add there too that Circumcision, as Abraham practiced, was pre-law but no one circumcizes their children today on the eight day; those who do, do it on medical and hygeine basis).

So welcome to a religious section discuss but ensure that your contribution is according to the word.

English Standard Version (©2001)
Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse lepers, cast out
demons. You received without paying; give without
pay.
Kings james V. Go rather to the lost sheep
of Israel. 7 As you go, proclaim this
message: ‘The kingdom of heaven has
come near.’ 8 Heal the sick, raise the
dead, cleanse those who have leprosy,[a]
drive out demons. Freely you have
received; freely give.
9 “Do not get any gold or silver or copper
to take with you in your belts— 10) no
bag for the journey or extra shirt or
sandals or a staff, for the worker is worth
his keep. I do not have any problem with tithes(And if anyone gives
even a cup of cold water to one of these
little ones who is my disciple, truly I tell
you, that person will certainly not lose
their reward.”) But my problem is with compulsory extortion of SEEDS! New year seed. Fruit of d womb seed, car seed! Single ladies seed! Family seed! House seed! Protection seed! U don't have 2 buy God's blessing as many seed as u give 2 those pastors its only ur heart nd soul nd God requires not earthly wealth!

Story story

DrummaBoy: Atlast this thread makes front page.

For those who are new to the argument, know that it is probably the most intense subject discussed on the religion section and hundreds of threads can testify to it. My own thread https://www.nairaland.com/1239719/questions-frosbel-tithing on the subject was simply explosive. At the end of the argument I joined the host of those who do not pay tithe and have not payed tithe for two months now, having payed tithe for 15yrs following my conversion to Christianity.

This thread, on Femi Abirisala, writing against tithe, has only rejuvenated the argument against it. Old foes meet here again and the argument will most likely be as it had been on other thread. The only difference now is that we will have a lot of "outsiders" contribute to the discuss.

I predict that the anti-tithers will win (again) bc the idea of couphing out 10% of tones gross pay will never go down well with anyone. But nonetheless let me summarise how the discuss will go:

Pro tithers will say: Jesus supported the tithe in Matthew 23:23 by a single statement "... do not leave the others undone...". They will also say that Malachi 3 is an OT injuction which still applies to NT Christians. ETC.

Anti tithers will say: The law has been abolished in the NT. Tithing today is according to Mosaic law and there is no point tithing when we do not follow other Mosaic injuctions. They argue that Abraham paying tithe is not a basis for arguing for tithe pre-law, as Abraham only payed tithe that once, also he tithed spoil not his income and that after that practice he returned the remaining spoil to the owners. (I add there too that Circumcision, as Abraham practiced, was pre-law but no one circumcizes their children today on the eight day; those who do, do it on medical and hygeine basis).

So welcome to a religious section discuss but ensure that your contribution is according to the word.

you left the peak of intelligence and jumped into the pits of idiocy.

you stopped paying tithes so how progressive have you been since then? what have you done with the 10% you have refused to pay? you probably spent it in beer parlours or in whorehouses?

ask yourself this question - without the funding, would the catholic have reached africa and the other parts of the world? without televangelism, would the gospel have reached everywhere like it is today - what do you think pay for these things? manna from heaven?

django1:

In order words tithe is the bribe your god takes to bless you ba?
People wey no dey worship god no dey chop ba?

Igbo-smoking-pastor-worshipping-people

It's not a bribe sir.
God himself attached a promise to it.

Like he said in malachi 3:10

Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this,” says the Lord Almighty, “and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that there will not be room enough to store it.

It's not like u won't be blessed or starve to death if you don't pay. You will but God attached an "incentive" to tithing.

Let me use a workplace setting as an example.
There are certain incentives attached to performances at work.e.g Bonus and Commissions.

Your Boss can say if ur are able to achieve this,you are entitled to 10% commission.It doesn't mean you won't be paid your normal salary at the end of the month if you are not able to achieve the target.You would still be paid but that commission is something like an extra to motivate you.

God cannot be bribed.

Thank you for this piece,but its a shame Nigerians are far gone-they sold their souls to their pastors,they love the religious rituals and church society,but love is far from them.selfish,proud,hypocritical gossipers...maybe they think their tithes will take them to heaven.dummies.
How can we neglect the important commandments of love,humility and fruits of the spirit and focus on mere sayings in the old testament that mentioned tithing.
How many times did Jesus mention tithe in the bible,compare that to countless times he spoke of love,empathy and peace with our fellow men.
These pastors are unscrupulous,even them know it.they know they have derailed from the path,they are enjoying their heaven here.

asudan:
may God forgive your ignorance as it is not all pastors that depend on tithe or offerings for survival.

Why should pastors and other thieves survive on tight, clearly that's the only reason why they are running a business and not preaching the Gospel.

It's really sickening to hear that Men of God are abusing and taken advantage of Church money.

@ OP what is trending now is no longer d paying tithe but d sowing of seed.

[quote author=cremeandchic]

It's not a bribe sir.
God himself attached a promise to it.

Like he said in malachi 3:10

Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this,” says the Lord Almighty, “and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that there will not be room enough to store it.

It's not like u won't be blessed or starve to death if you don't pay. You will but God attached an "incentive" to tithing.

Let me use a workplace setting as an example.
There are certain incentives attached to performances at work.e.g Bonus and Commissions.

Your Boss can say if ur are able to achieve this,you are entitled to 10% commission.It doesn't mean you won't be paid your normal salary at the end of the month if you are not able to achieve the target.You would still be paid but that commission is something like

[size=15pt]OBADIAH777, what is your position on this pls?[/size]

Well i think the writer here had a problem with understanding the scriptures he quoted from. In Mathew 23:23, Jesus never condemned the paying of tithes but instead told the people to adhere to the whole teachings of the scripture as there are more important aspect to it like justice, mercy, and faith and not to choose the one to keep (tithe) and leave the others. Meaning that Christianity is far more than food, drink, cloths, money and other material things. It is about your life, the way you live it and how positively it affects the lives of other people especially around you. In fact he advised that it should be practiced in addition to other teachings. Tithing is for your own good like every other giving as God's principle of sowing and reaping so if you choose not to, it is to your own peril but if your pastor loves you, he must preach it. Please sir if King James Bible is too complicated for you, try the New Living Translation or Good News Bible, Mathew 23:23 (NLT)“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you are careful to tithe even the tiniest income from your herb gardens, but you ignore the more important aspects of the law—justice, mercy, and faith. You should tithe, yes, but do not neglect the more important things". Mathew 23:23 (GNB) “How terrible for you, teachers of the Law and Pharisees! You hypocrites! You give to God a tenth even of the seasoning herbs, such as mint, dill, and cumin, but you neglect to obey the really important teachings of the Law, such as justice and mercy and honesty. These you should practice, without neglecting the others". I went through all the bible quotations and realized that our writer was writing out of context as he lacked understanding of what the scriptures were saying. My counsel here to ALL is, be careful of what you criticize maybe because you don't understand or don't like, you may just be displaying your ignorance to the whole world without knowing it. Mind you i am not a Pastor or Priest but one who is still working out my salvation and aspiring to be a perfect child of God by His grace.

dederocs:
You are lost,God does as he pleases,money you give to a man you do not know where he got his calling from...how does that concern or affect your relationship with God?
What. You quote is in the old testament...think about this-why would "pastors" abandon some old testament sayings and use the ones that benefit their purse.
For example an eye for an eye e.t.c.
People open church these days to make money.

and how does that stop you from doing your own duty? we should not put money in the banks because armed robbers can go there or the banks can liquidate?

arsenal fans should stop buying season tickets because they are promised league titles every season and yet the team does not deliver? your logic makes me want to vomit.

cremeandchic:

It's not a bribe sir.
God himself attached a promise to it.

Like he said in malachi 3:10

Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this,” says the Lord Almighty, “and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that there will not be room enough to store it.

It's not like u won't be blessed or starve to death if you don't pay. You will but God attached an "incentive" to tithing.

Let me use a workplace setting as an example.
There are certain incentives attached to performances at work.e.g Bonus and Commissions.

Your Boss can say if ur are able to achieve this,you are entitled to 10% commission.It doesn't mean you won't be paid your normal salary at the end of the month if you are not able to achieve the target.You would still be paid but that commission is something like an extra to motivate you.

God cannot be bribed.

Hmmm, chairman, go back and read the OP!

plaetton: ^^^ :
Need to be careful about what? What is at steak here, your livelihood and the hordes of rapacious hayenas calling themselves mog?

Shouldn't everyone , especially the exploited, deserve to be enlightened?
Isn't this discussion long overdue.
It is barely starting and you are already pooing on your pants.
He he he.

Am pretty sure you have never paid and noone says you must.therefore, there is no point in discouraging others who are blessed through such. No one is making it compulsory for you but am sure there is no fulfilment and life of satisfaction if u don't pay.
Note:what u don't giv to God u must be ready to pay the devil. Make your choice.

Without tithes, half of the business centers, oh sorry I mean to say churches will close down. Unemployment rate will go up and crime rate will increase.

Na u be thief

I will make my comment base on a paragraph from Femi Aribisala's write-up. I quote: "Pastors hide from church-members the fact that money was not acceptable as tithe. The tithe was a tenth of the seed and fruit of the land and of the animals which ate of the land. (Leviticus 27:30-32). That is why God says: “Bring all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be FOOD in my house.” (Malachi 3:10). He does not say “that there may be MONEY in my house.” The food was used to feed the Levites, the poor, widows, orphans and strangers."

I think as at the time before and after of Christ, money was not of so much use as at then, there were situations of trade by barter(ie, exchange of goods and services for the same like) that may be widely used then. And if i am not wrong in my own opinion, the context, FOOD, as it is been used in (Malachi 3:10) in the old could represent MONEY in the present because as at the old, most of the people then were peasant farmers,hunters and fishermen whose live-Li-hood depends on the direct products of their labour and may be the rest in excess are been exchanged for other goods and services they might need. Comparing to the present today, live-li-hood has gone so viral that virtually everything a man needs for his survival all depends on MONEY for him to procure his needs. There are no enough lands for man to farm again because all those empty lands of the old have been structurally developed by the government and man to occupy the growing urban development. Even if you want to farm now, you will still need MONEY to pay for your bills(light, water bills). So, in other to make the tithing easier for a modern generation, comes the use of MONEY for the payment of tithe.
I was once so sceptical about this tithing of a stuff and i did a lot of research on it just to protect my hard earned money been given out ignorantly but one thing i have come to understand about tithing is this: Tithing is not all about you rendering one tenth of it or how much your tithe is, it is all about individual givers belief, sacrifice, and faith that for which you have given so shall you receive the favour of God in any way (either financail growth, promotions, blessings, longlive, good health,security, shelter, food, and etc) as God did promised in His words in Malachi 3:10 not minding whether the tithe you rendered to your church was been used for the purpose it is intended for. Some pastors and leaders of churches may divert this tithe for their selfish purposes but i tell you, they are only building the wrath of God upon themselves because they have stolen from God and shall be definitely punished by God in any way unless they repent of it. If i may ask, why do we complain of a tenth been given to God for all He has been providing for us while we pay as much as 25 per cent of our income, happily, as tax to our government who could not account for how the taxes are spent?

I honestly did not want to join the fray here because now that the thread is front page, those who will contribute will no longer be the religious section adherents and thus to many opinion and long thread, while Seun smiles to the Bank. But here is a familiar one directing this to me and let me lend a voice here:

[quote author=coogar]

you left the peak of intelligence and jumped into the pits of idiocy.

Wow. Kinda judgemental, don't you think? Thanks for the compliment! LOl!

you stopped paying tithes so how progressive have you been since then?

Progressive. Hmm... you mean have joined ACN? Or you are refering to my experiences. Whether by this time, the "devourer" would have had me for lunch? Well, since you asked, my experiences have been fine. And I cannot remember scripture saying that our practice of religion should be based on our "experiences". Last I checked the just shall live by faith. Or you want me to change gods like that king in the OT, who left Jehovah for a foreign god because he felt that god was "blessing" those people. No wonder folks are deceived into tithing. It is all for an experience: a seeking after blessing. I am blessed; I do not need to do anything to add or subtract from it. Again, my experience has been good.

what have you done with the 10% you have refused to pay?

Do you want it? Lol!!
I have used it for what people use money for: SPEND IT! I have honored the Lord with my finances which means being a faithful steward of it: giving of a free will; looked after my family so I am not an infidel; payed rent; etc.

you probably spent it in beer parlours or whorehouses?

No I didn't. And that statement betrays a hidden thought in you. To him that is pure, all things are pure. Why should it be whores and beer parlour your mind wanderered to? Is it possible they are your secret fantasies but religious bondage has held you down?

ask yourself this question - without the funding, would the catholic have reached africa and the other parts of the world? without televangelism, would the gospel have reached everywhere like it is today - what do you think pay for these things? manna from heaven?

To stop to tithe after 15yrs, I have asked myself hundreds of questions and my final decision is based on the answers I derived. Do your studies well, most orthodox churches did not spread the gospel on the strenght of tithing but based on free will offering. Hudson Taylor went to China and without any support based, talkless of tithe, formed the greatest mission society of his time.

How much tithe did Paul receive to conquer nations with the gospel, in his numerous missionary journeys? He wrote over and over again how his ministry was funded: 1. He made tents - he worked with his hands. 2. He had support from very few churches like the Phillipian church. 3. He had those who hosted him in all his mission journeys.
How much tithe did Jesus receive to carry out his mission work?

Now you are talking of tithe being used for mission. How many tithe collecting churches support missionaries, mission works or even have lively misssionary activities? Do we not see what they use their monies to do: 1. Build bigger building. 2. Make Pastor comfortable. 3. Build businesses likes schools, etc. 4. Buy and maintain private jets.


Now the only argument for the tithe that I have not found a convincing answer to are those who claim to have seen visions of heaven and hell and who say Jesus said those who don't pay tithe will go to hell. But even that begs the question: how come Jesus never speaks of those who misuse the tithe and offering and also tell us what their end will be? Could this vision be clearly designed to further bind God's people into the tithe bonday?
I found my own answer to the vision this morining in Jesus words about the last day (matthew 24). Jesus said we should beware of those who will come to deceive us, they will say they are Christ (or better still have a message from Christ): vision and all, that cannot be coroborated in scriptures.

I'm still praying and studying the tithe subject; for now most of what I have found speaks against tithing. The day e Lord convinces me about tithe paying, I will come here and open a thread about it (with the hope it makes front page). While I agree with Aribisala on his position on the tithe(as he has used sound scriptural references), I do not neccesarilly agree with everything he writes on religion.

I enjoy paying tithe,and I will continue paying tithe. No one can command me to pay tithe,I know the benefit that is why I'm doing so. I didn't register as a tithe payer by collecting tithe card in the church because I know it's wrong.
The willingness to pay tithe should come from within not by pressure from the pastor. I understand church needs members' resources to reach out to the lost souls. Preaching the gospel,paying tithes,offerings and making sacrifices are the ways I think a christian can contribute to the growth of God's kingdom.

tpacalipse: Whenever I say these to my friends, most of the time drawing my argument from Levticus, they always end up telling the devil dey use me. But in the end, we shall know who is being used by the devil. If tithes and offerings are removed from churches, I bet 99 per cent of our pastors will run away from being pastors and the remaining 1 per cent will be the true men of God. Happy private jetting Sunday to all.

i also use to think so dat if tithes and offerings are removed most pastor will run not until i see another device employ . Ave seen a pastor who call on members of the church who are seeking employment to pray 4 them inorder to get a job bt told them 2 make a vow dat if they get a job they must giv thr 1st salary to the church . How about dat

elviszzz: “Do NOT think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, TILL heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.’ (Matthew 5, 17-20). Most say tithing is under d law n shouldn't be regarded cos we r under grace.pls explain the verse above.

Fine, can you explain why Christians no longer have to avoid eating pigs, separating menstruating women, stone adulterers, practice eye for an eye, make burnt sacrifices etc?

coogar:

you left the peak of intelligence and jumped into the pits of idiocy.

you stopped paying tithes so how progressive have you been since then? what have you done with the 10% you have refused to pay? you probably spent it in beer parlours or in whorehouses?

ask yourself this question - without the funding, would the catholic have reached africa and the other parts of the world? without televangelism, would the gospel have reached everywhere like it is today - what do you think pay for these things? manna from heaven?

ofcourse it was stated in the scripture that u should use ur tithe 2 drink strong drink(beer) and whatever ur soul desireth. Deuteronomy 14:25-26

How many pastor have you seen on pulpit brandishing gun and forcing church members to pay tithe? Why should this be an issue ? since everyone can keep their MONEY and not let go. You are an individual with a choice to make,Most of the people shouting about tithe do not pay ANY and some that are paying are looking for reason not to pay. Why should that bring any argument or stir up any can of worm? Please could you tell me the people that are being exploited? The uneducated?,the foolish?imbeciles,or....? And since when have you been nominated to be their saviour/spokeperson. lIFE IS ALL ABOUT YOUR CHOICE. Kindly keep your MONEY to your self and STOP DISTURBING THE HOUSE.

mollie12: 1 Corinthians 9:14 - "Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel".

Even though several 'men of God' have abused the ministry of money collections and exploited it for their selfish purpose, we would be operating in almost the same level of error to label every pastor that collect tithes a thief.

Pastors request for money collections to support the aspects of ministry (church maintenance, outreach projects, etc) and to also support themselves. Yep, you heard that right. THE OFFERINGS ARE TO SPENT BY THE PASTORS. That is what operated in the Levitical era. The grey area - which is where, I believe, ethics and morality should come into play - is HOW MUCH money should they spend on themselves. If the church gives an offering of $1 million, does that mean they should splurge on a Ferrari or some other luxury piece of property? That is the real issue we should be dealing with as a church, not whether we should make money offerings or not. Most of the time, people singing this "don't pay tithes" thing are not really seeking the mind of God but just want to pursue their own selfish agenda, and keep all their money to themselves.
Notice I'm doing my best to steer clear of the 'tithe' label. That's because the tithing requirement of the law, as far as I've been able to read in the Bible, was fulfilled in Christ. But money collections for servants in the Lord's vineyard was never removed and will always continue till the end of time.

God bless you for this objective analysis. I hope many will open the eyes of their understanding.

What an epiphany! CAN and PFN will roast this man alive. The Holy Spirit is revealing Himself more.