true2god: Before u go jumping up and down in exceitement, i said u r doing a good job as regards this thread. I appreciate that. Even a person charged for obvios murder can hire a good lawyer to present a good case for him. His death penalty might be commutted to life imprisonment, he might even be set free if the lawyer can proove that his client is mentally deranged.

Put urself in the shoe of the lawyer i mentioned above, thats y i said u r doin a good job, even tho' u r presenting a wrong evidence.

On the issue of christ coming, only the father knows that, thats does not mean that the son is no longer mighty God, everlasting father, prince of peace... (isiah 9:4). That does not mean he is no longer the first and the last, the alpha and the omega, (revelation 22:12&13), that does not mean that the father did not ask all angels, including angel michael, to worship the son (heb 1:6), that does not mean the world had not been subjected to him, but never subjected to any angel, not even angel michael (heb 2:5), that does not mean he no longer has the father's nature, or form, but has to submit\humble himself (Philipian 2:6).

Of course the father is greater than the son. And u will agree with me that bilogically a father cannot create his own son, but he is (the son) his bloodline, his flesh and his vry nature and his essence is replicated at birth. that is y the pharisees attempted killing Jesus for calling God his father, making himself equal to God (John 5:18).

Are JW thinking like the pharisees of John 5:18?

From the above, the case is closed. he knows what Jesus doesn't know. he is greater than Jesus.

true2god: Before I respond to you I would like to knw, from you, if he is an angel. This will guide me in responding to ur post.

Please tell me the Hebrew word for angel.

TroGunn:


Christ is no doubt God's messenger - he does what God commands him to do.

John 12:49 "I don't speak on my own authority. The Father who sent me has commanded me what to say and how to say it".

Malachi 3:1 ""Behold, I send my messenger, and he will prepare the way before me; and the Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to his temple; and the messenger of the covenant, whom you desire, behold, he comes!" says Yahweh of Armies". WEB

However, Christ towers above angels ( meaning "messengers" ).

Hebrews 1: 4 "This shows that the Son is far greater than the angels, just as the name God gave him is greater than their names".

Christ commands angels and he's associated with the term the Archangel (Chief or Commander of Angels).

1 Theses 4:16 "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first":

(Feel free to refer to this thread and others where Archangel was discussed deeply - https://www.nairaland.com/1446860/archangel-michael-jesus-christ/22)

In terms of nature, Jehovah, resurrected Christ and angels are all spirit beings. In terms of hierarchy in heaven, Jehovah is highest, Christ follows and then angels. Christ and angels obey Jehovah.

(Note that humans who go to heaven to rule with Christ in heaven will also be above angels - 1Cor6:3).

Once you cut out bias/traditions and follow the scriptures, it's pretty simple to grasp.

I never expected u to post this long post. I short what u r saying is that Jesus is an angel. Read the first book of Hebrew again and again and again, u will discover that many distinctions were made between angels and Jesus. Jesus is never an angel, lets not go there again cos i have talked so much about it.

The issue i will only touch is the point u made in ur earlier post where u said Jesus is the firstborn of all creations. I will respond to ur post, just hold.

@JMAN05

do you noticed that True2God after quoting your post below;

JMAN05:

What do you people believe about the beasts of revelation. Tell me what they all stand for. eg Rev. 13

Your trinity has already been trashed here. You ve not responded to all my responses to your comment on that. eg the question I asked on hebrew.

he then accused you of prevoiusly using another username ID Barrister, but now he believed that you are matured, read it;

true2god: U need to create a thread on AG doctrines that are false. This thread is for the JW to answer questions relating their weird teachings.

Similar thread had been created to 'test' the validity of some of catholic doctines. I wont engage u in unnecessary argument, we've done it before wen u were using ur seccond ID, BARRISTER. So u need not xpect me to continue in that path.

One thing i admire u now is that u r more mature, unlike before.

On the issue of the trinity, go back to the early page of the discssion, u will see my stance on the person of the holy spirit. We christians (not JW), belief in the person of the holy spirit, as the bible teaches, and not an active force, electricity, battery, non-living thing (as being taught by the JW). So the person of the holy spirit form part of the core argument of Trinity which im not ready to back to now.

Read the first three pages of the thread, open ur bible, close ur watchtower magazine, u will understand wat im talking about.

JMAN05 can you see how confused true2God is right now! check this on page 15.

Oga true2God so JMAN05 is also having an ID BARRISTER? thats so serious true2God you are confused

@true2god

who is satan? is satan an angel? do you believe that satan was an angel? then please show me where it was written in the bible directly that satan is an angel, im not talking about metaphorial usage

BERNIMOORE: @JMAN05

do you noticed that True2God after quoting your post below;



he then accused you of prevoiusly using another username ID Barrister, but now he believed that you are matured, read it;



JMAN05 can you see how confused true2God is right now! check this on page 15.

Oga true2God so JMAN05 is also having an ID BARRISTER? thats so serious true2God you are confused

Thank you very much, I never read all that cos I hate it when people leave the main issue to discuss trifles.

You see another lie? I dont know whether that is what she learns in her church. When did I answer Barrister pls?

@true2God

answer this please;


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unfulfilled_Christian_religious_predictions#Assemblies_of_God_Church

During World War I, 1914–1918 The Weekly Evangel, an official publication of the Assemblies of God, carried this prediction:

"We are not yet in the Armageddon struggle proper, but at its commencement, and it may be, if [size=14pt]students of prophecy[/size] read the signs aright, that Christ will come before the present war closes, and before Armageddon...The war preliminary to Armageddon, it seems, has commenced.

After the prophecy of first wwar failed 1914-1918, then, Assemblies of God's light gets brigther and brigther, they see more prophecies in 1934 1935.,

The Assemblies of God students of prophecy, are they true or false prophets, considering Deuteronomy 18:21-22?

italo, im still waiting for response

youguys, where are you?

Una no dey tire?

@ JMAN05

Thank you very much, I never read all that cos I hate it when people leave the main issue to discuss trifles.

You see another lie? I dont know whether that is what she learns in her church. When did I answer Barrister pls?

bolded above said it all, the guy hates jehovahs witnesses with passion such that he/she forgets himself in any thread that says negative things about them

what i follow is the truth, im not a jw, but i want constructive argument without bias with sound evidences, and you can see that he is not ready to learn, i was told by my brother how to deal with such people, as you can see until i came on board he was talking about 1914, but when i faced him with his church stand on the issue and even the student of prophecy of the assemblies of God failed prophecies, he/she said they are wrong, but cant he/she just say they are false prophet considering Deuteronomy 18:21-22

@italo

your turn to defend.

https://www.nairaland.com/newtopic?board=17

@Bernamore

that is how people are. it is for those who do not love the truth. I hate the guy because he lies alot.

true2god: I never expected u to post this long post. I short what u r saying is that Jesus is an angel. Read the first book of Hebrew again and again and again, u will discover that many distinctions were made between angels and Jesus. Jesus is never an angel, lets not go there again cos i have talked so much about it.

The issue i will only touch is the point u made in ur earlier post where u said Jesus is the firstborn of all creations. I will respond to ur post, just hold.

My post was long to explain things clearly, with supporting Bible verses - useful to those who appreciate clear bible truths.

To repeat, In terms of hierarchy in heaven, Jehovah/Yahweh is highest, Christ follows and then angels. Christ and angels obey Jehovah - Christ is no doubt still God's messenger - he does what God commands him to do.

And here are the verses again:


John 12:49 "I don't speak on my own authority. The Father who sent me has commanded me what to say and how to say it".

Malachi 3:1 ""Behold, I send my messenger, and he will prepare the way before me; and the Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to his temple; and the messenger of the covenant, whom you desire, behold, he comes!" says Yahweh of Armies". WEB

Read the Bible and derive your beliefs from there, like JWs. When you hold preconceived ideas of dubious origin and try to twist the Bible to conform, you end up with problems and confusion, like the trinity farce you are desperately and unsuccessfully trying to seek biblical backing for.

Yooguyz: Una no dey tire?

Even this one, the most lauphable character to claim "christian" in this forum is also opening a thread for Jman. Well, maybe Jman have the time for your kind of hypocricy.

JMAN05: @italo

your turn to defend.

https://www.nairaland.com/newtopic?board=17

I will be very surprise if he does, dont you know he is a deceit ?

Let him go there and defend his catholic church let us see.

@ITALO

I have formed another thread without your name as the subject. make I see another reason you have to dogde.

https://www.nairaland.com/1522201/defend-catholic-teachings-here

loveroftruth:

Even this one, the most lauphable character to claim "christian" in this forum is also opening a thread for Jman....

i may be the most laughable, but at least give some credence to my sincerety and honestly, i don't vendor facts to my taste, just like some people in this thread.

TroGunn:

My post was long to explain things clearly, with supporting Bible verses - useful to those who appreciate clear bible truths.

To repeat, In terms of hierarchy in heaven, Jehovah/Yahweh is highest, Christ follows and then angels. Christ and angels obey Jehovah - Christ is no doubt still God's messenger - he does what God commands him to do.

And here are the verses again:


John 12:49 "I don't speak on my own authority. The Father who sent me has commanded me what to say and how to say it".

Malachi 3:1 ""Behold, I send my messenger, and he will prepare the way before me; and the Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to his temple; and the [b/ messenger of the covenant, [/b] whom you desire, behold, he comes!" says Yahweh of Armies". WEB

Read the Bible and derive your beliefs from there, like JWs. When you hold preconceived ideas of dubious origin and try to twist the Bible to conform, you end up with problems and confusion, like the trinity farce you are desperately and unsuccessfully trying to seek biblical backing for.

you are wasting your time with true2God, he is a determined individual that habitually does not contribute or build a topic, he only try to wind you like a table clock, and after all your effort to explain things, he will just confine your effort to the dustbin until you are tired, know how to treat your pearl....who the cap fit let him wear...save your effort, put them where they belong. im not your member though!

JMAN05:
the purpose of the earlier comment has been realised. create no diversion.

OK

Nature possessed by God's spirit creatures.

God's spirit as in... or you mean Jesus was a spirit like God?

Why are you disturbing yourself on simply things. Do all humans have the same natural abilities like similar IQ?

I've shown you how attributes are different from NATURE hmmmm

Your dad gave birth to you,

I agree with you what do ypou want again?

so do you have the same knowledge as your parents cos you possess the same nature?

Knowledge is an attribute not THE FORM THAT I EXIST hmmmmm

Does a man and his wife being the same nature mean that the woman has the same strength like the man?

Stop this your childish attitude......<<<<BOTH EXIST IN HUMAN FORM BUT THEY MIGHT HAVE DIFFERENT ATTITUDE>>>>

Do you even look the same physically?

Yes!

Pls you guys should produce things that make sense abeg.

Talk to yourself

No matter how you look at it, no two humans have the same attributes, even twince. there must be a difference that may command advantage over another.

What of someone who has more attributes than His/Her parent?

Apart from the assistance which God's spirit give him, you still will not equal Jesus in knowledge cos he now have a human form, will you? Even we humans have differences among each other not to talk of someone who came from heaven.

Is ATTRIBUTES and NATURE the same...just simple question henn?

inshort Why does God, his equal, have to give him those things for him to look different? Equal in knowledge. Does Jesus know when the end will come? Why does His Father have to teach him, since they all are omniscience?

Your problem is still lies in understanding that Phil 2:7 "Make himself of no reputation""""or Emptieth Himself" if God didn't put His own Spirit on Jesus, Jesus will fail in His mission

Thank you for indicating that there were differences between us and he. But he was still human which is the form he assumed. He was not in the spirit nature/form which Paul described he stripped off.

He was in Human's form on earth but in His early life He was in NATURE OF GOD....simple statementt

One of the attribute of God is also that he is more knowledgeable than Jesus. Col. 1:15
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;

You and your Co often use this verse but what you people failed to notice from this verse is the usage of the word FIRSTBORN and FIRST CREATE I believe you always read from Hebrew word being used in the Bible.....
The word firstborn...is Prototokos in Greek, while
The word first created...is Protoktioti
If Paul wanted to say Jesus was created, he will have used this word "Protoktioti" rather Paul used the word "Prototokos". Paul is referring to the Jewish use of the word fiorst-born which not only means first one born but also is used as a title of SOVEREINGNTY and PRE-EMINENCE.
Example can be found in Psalm 89:27 God says of David, "I also shall make him My firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth" Is David the firstborn of Jesse? NO. he is the eighth and youngest son of Jesse. stick this into Col 1:15 it fit perfectly, verse 18 clearly shown that Paul was talking about pre-eminence not as first created.

Jesus was never created John 1:1 "In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God"

Prov. 8:22
“Jehovah himself produced me as the beginning of his way, the earliest of his achievements of long ago.
Compare John 1:14, ie begotten.

I'm one of those who strickly believe Prov 8:22-36 meant for Jesus....though some who want to discredited pre-existence of Jesus will say it's a dramatical impersonifcation of Wisdom and folly....nevertheless I chose Jesus for many reason from this chapter.
But what I see people missed out from this verse is this....phares...."as the beginning of His way" the question is did God has a beginning? I believe your answer will be NO! then what does this verse mean? you will realise that Jesus has been in existence with God.
Some version use "possessed me"

Emusan:

OK



God's spirit as in... or you mean Jesus was a spirit like God?



I've shown you how attributes are different from NATURE hmmmm



I agree with you what do ypou want again?



Knowledge is an attribute not THE FORM THAT I EXIST hmmmmm



Stop this your childish attitude......<<<<BOTH EXIST IN HUMAN FORM BUT THEY MIGHT HAVE DIFFERENT ATTITUDE>>>>




Yes!



Talk to yourself




What of someone who has more attributes than His/Her parent?



Is ATTRIBUTES and NATURE the same...just simple question henn?



Your problem is still lies in understanding that Phil 2:7 "Make himself of no reputation""""or Emptieth Himself" if God didn't put His own Spirit on Jesus, Jesus will fail in His mission



He was in Human's form on earth but in His early life He was in NATURE OF GOD....simple statementt





You and your Co often use this verse but what you people failed to notice from this verse is the usage of the word FIRSTBORN and FIRST CREATE I believe you always read from Hebrew word being used in the Bible.....
The word firstborn...is Prototokos in Greek, while
The word first created...is Protoktioti
If Paul wanted to say Jesus was created, he will have used this word "Protoktioti" rather Paul used the word "Prototokos". Paul is referring to the Jewish use of the word fiorst-born which not only means first one born but also is used as a title of SOVEREINGNTY and PRE-EMINENCE.
Example can be found in Psalm 89:27 God says of David, "I also shall make him My firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth" Is David the firstborn of Jesse? NO. he is the eighth and youngest son of Jesse. stick this into Col 1:15 it fit perfectly, verse 18 clearly shown that Paul was talking about pre-eminence not as first created.

Jesus was never created John 1:1 "In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God"



I'm one of those who strickly believe Prov 8:22-36 meant for Jesus....though some who want to discredited pre-existence of Jesus will say it's a dramatical impersonifcation of Wisdom and folly....nevertheless I chose Jesus for many reason from this chapter.
But what I see people missed out from this verse is this....phares...."as the beginning of His way" the question is did God has a beginning? I believe your answer will be NO! then what does this verse mean? you will realise that Jesus has been in existence with God.
Some version use "possessed me"

Here are parallel translations of Prov 8:22 which should clarify Christ as being a created being, the Aramaic Bible in Plain English being particularly clear:

New International Version
"The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old;

New Living Translation
"The LORD formed me from the beginning, before he created anything else.

English Standard Version
“The LORD possessed me at the beginning of his work, the first of his acts of old.

King James Bible
The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
The LORD made me at the beginning of His creation, before His works of long ago.

International Standard Version
"The LORD made me as he began his planning, before his ancient activity commenced.

NET Bible
The LORD created me as the beginning of his works, before his deeds of long ago.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
“Lord Jehovah created me at the beginning of his creation and from before all of his works.”

This verse simply supports Col 1:15, where Christ is called "the firstborn of all creation".

Dance around all you want, firstborn is firstborn. Meaning is simple - Christ is first to be created by God.

This is also in line with yet another verse - Rev 3:14, where Christ is called the "the beginning of God’s creation".

Yet another expression used for Christ shows his beginning. Christ is often called "only-begotten" Son as in John 3:16. Now begotten means "to father or produce as offspring" - vocabulary.com

Clearly, God created Christ first, and then empowered Christ with authority to carry out God's purposes, including creating other things. And Jesus Christ continue to show us sterling example of being humble to God - never seeking prominence but being occupied in doing his Father's will. We all should learn form the wonderful example of Jesus Christ, the 2nd highest person in the universe.

Emusan:

OK



God's spirit as in... or you mean Jesus was a spirit like God?

that sentence is clear. I should be teaching that.


[quoteI've shown you how attributes are different from NATURE hmmmm[/quote]

1. So having the same nature doesnt connote equality in everything?

Knowledge is an attribute not THE FORM THAT I EXIST hmmmmm

Stop this your childish attitude......<<<<BOTH EXIST IN HUMAN FORM BUT THEY MIGHT HAVE DIFFERENT ATTITUDE>>>>

In the same vein, God has an attribute which make him different from Jesus, though both possessing a divine nature.

Yes!

You lied. You cant look like your father, something must show the difference physically.

What of someone who has more attributes than His/Her parent?

Is ATTRIBUTES and NATURE the same...just simple question henn?

That is just my point. there being of the same nature, doesnt mean equality as trinity holds.

Your problem is still lies in understanding that Phil 2:7 "Make himself of no reputation""""or Emptieth Himself" if God didn't put His own Spirit on Jesus, Jesus will fail in His mission

Then he was not the same as God, cos God would not need any help from what he has. that he emptied himself does not mean that he became powerless, but that he left heavenly position and came as a man.

The question remains, does he know when the end will come?

He was in Human's form on earth but in His early life He was in NATURE OF GOD....simple statement

Since being in human's form didnt make him the replica of us in all things, neither does his God's form make him God's replica.

form - divine nature.

You and your Co often use this verse but what you people failed to notice from this verse is the usage of the word FIRSTBORN and FIRST CREATE I believe you always read from Hebrew word being used in the Bible.....
The word firstborn...is Prototokos in Greek, while
The word first created...is Protoktioti
If Paul wanted to say Jesus was created, he will have used this word "Protoktioti" rather Paul used the word "Prototokos". Paul is referring to the Jewish use of the word fiorst-born which not only means first one born but also is used as a title of SOVEREINGNTY and PRE-EMINENCE.
Example can be found in Psalm 89:27 God says of David, "I also shall make him My firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth" Is David the firstborn of Jesse? NO. he is the eighth and youngest son of Jesse. stick this into Col 1:15 it fit perfectly, verse 18 clearly shown that Paul was talking about pre-eminence not as first created.

God said He shall make him, not that he is. verse 18, Paul meant that he is firstborn from the dead, the first to be resurrected from the dead to an immortal life.

It is says "the firstborn of ALL creation". the firstborn is associated with creation, not just firstborn. compare Rev. 3:14

And to the angel of the congregation in La·o·di·ce′a write: These are the things that the Amen says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God,

John 1:1 is not stating that the Word had no beginning. compare verse 14, namely, begotten.

I'm one of those who strickly believe Prov 8:22-36 meant for Jesus....though some who want to discredited pre-existence of Jesus will say it's a dramatical impersonifcation of Wisdom and folly....nevertheless I chose Jesus for many reason from this chapter.
But what I see people missed out from this verse is this....phares...."as the beginning of His way" the question is did God has a beginning? I believe your answer will be NO! then what does this verse mean? you will realise that Jesus has been in existence with God.
Some version use "possessed me"

Beginning of his WAY, not talking about God's beginning. verse 24, the process of birth was brought to the fore. so produce/create is what the context implies.

italo: Rutherford said that in 1925 Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and the prophets would return to Earth, and for them he prepared a mansion named Beth Sarim in San Diego, California. He moved into this mansion (where he died in 1942) and bought an automobile with which to drive the resurrected patriarchs around. The Watch Tower Society quietly sold Beth Sarim years later to cover up an embarrassing moment in their history, namely another failed prophecy.

True or false.

My Brother you are very correct with your writings here....but first do note that the bible itself says that the truth gets brigther and brighter each day..when Rutherford made that statement his understanding of the bible and the truth had not gone far the way it is now....and one of the sole aim of building that house was for him to rest after he came out of prison an has health issues.But he said that the building would be a place for the princes to stay when they come based on his wrong calculation at that time..But note he was never a false prophet.

A few years after Brother Rutherford’s death, the board of directors of the Watch Tower Society decided to sell Beth-Sarim. Why? “The Watchtower” of December 15, 1947, explained: “It had fully served its purpose and was now only serving as a monument quite expensive to keep; our faith in the return of the men of old time whom the King Christ Jesus will make princes in ALL the earth (not merely in California) is based, not upon that house Beth-Sarim, but upon God’s Word of promise

At the time, it was believed that faithful men of old times, such as Abraham, Joseph, and David, would be resurrected before the end of this system of things and would serve as “princes in all the earth,” in fulfillment of Psalm 45:16. This view was adjusted in 1950, when further study of the Scriptures indicated that those earthly forefathers of Jesus Christ would be resurrected after Armageddon

It's well

obxddon:

My Brother you are very correct with your writings here....but first do note that the bible itself says that the truth gets brigther and brighter each day..when Rutherford made that statement his understanding of the bible and the truth had not gone far the way it is now....and one of the sole aim of building that house was for him to rest after he came out of prison an has health issues.But he said that the building would be a place for the princes to stay when they come based on his wrong calculation at that time..But note he was never a false prophet.

A few years after Brother Rutherford’s death, the board of directors of the Watch Tower Society decided to sell Beth-Sarim. Why? “The Watchtower” of December 15, 1947, explained: “It had fully served its purpose and was now only serving as a monument quite expensive to keep; our faith in the return of the men of old time whom the King Christ Jesus will make princes in ALL the earth (not merely in California) is based, not upon that house Beth-Sarim, but upon God’s Word of promise

At the time, it was believed that faithful men of old times, such as Abraham, Joseph, and David, would be resurrected before the end of this system of things and would serve as “princes in all the earth,” in fulfillment of Psalm 45:16. This view was adjusted in 1950, when further study of the Scriptures indicated that those earthly forefathers of Jesus Christ would be resurrected after Armageddon

My friend, are you on Medication ?

If you are, what kind ?

And dont forget to complet the doses o.

Infact, ensure you consult you doctor again to see if you need to take more stronger ones.

You seem to have some privilaged information unknown to some of us.

JMAN05 you seem to insinuate that am dodging your question on angels... note quite... this is what you asked and how i answered

JMAN05:

The bolded. Why do the bible call angels and humans gods (elohim)? I see you are a babe when it comes to greek/hebrew.

JMAN05:

What is the hebrew word for angel please?

From the above, you asked what is the hebrew word for angels and human when they are refered to as "gods"?

angels in hebrew is refered to as malak but when angels are referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt] mee'2lohiym [/size]

Human (man) is aadaam but when man is referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt]'2lohiym[/size]

But only YHWH is referred to as [size=18pt]Elohim [/size]

Now that i have shown you that [size=18pt] Elohim is used only for YHWH, [/size] why did thomas according to your NWT referred to Yahshua as "My Lord and My God" ...

hisblud: JMAN05 you seem to insinuate that am dodging your question on angels... note quite... this is what you asked and how i answered

From the above, you asked what is the hebrew word for angels and human when they are refered to as "gods"?

angels in hebrew is refered to as malak but when angels are referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt] mee'2lohiym [/size]

Human (man) is aadaam but when man is referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt]'2lohiym[/size]

But only YHWH is referred to as [size=18pt]Elohim [/size]

Now that i have shown you that [size=18pt] Elohim is used only for YHWH, [/size] why did thomas according to your NWT referred to Yahshua as "My Lord and My God" ...

And My God in that verse is Elohim.
May Thomas look at Jesus and said my Lord and look up and said My Elohim. So that we can go to the original manuscript to change the verse like this "And Thomas after he has looked at Jesus he said to Him my Lord and then raised his eyes up and looked into heaven and said My Elohim"
OR out of fear Thomas said to "Him My Lord and My God" so that we can change it again.

@JMAN05
Please NWT says in Gene 1:2 that the God's active force(which other versions use "spirit of God" was moving upon the the deep"(we all agree that JWs believe that Holy spirit is an active force of God.
Your book also agreed that God will put "His spirit on Jesus"(which is also the same Holyspirit) Isaiah 42:2
Now John 3:34 your book also agreed that God gave Jesus spirit not in measure!

My questions are,
*why do they use [size=14pt]active force for Spirit of God in Gen[/size] and use ordinary spirit in Isaiah & John?
*what kind of spirit did God put upon Jesus?

Pls don't post any link.

Shalom!

hisblud: JMAN05 you seem to insinuate that am dodging your question on angels... note quite... this is what you asked and how i answered

From the above, you asked what is the hebrew word for angels and human when they are refered to as "gods"?

Please re read this post and tell me how you drew that meaning from it.

1. The bolded. Why do the bible call angels and humans gods (elohim)? I see you are a babe when it comes to greek/hebrew.

What is the hebrew word for angel please?

angels in hebrew is refered to as malak but when angels are referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt] mee'2lohiym [/size]

If only you will be humble, I will tell you where your problem is. what you brought for me is "godlike ones" NWT. You ve not given me the one for god only. check strong definition 430 of Psalms 8:5.

Human (man) is aadaam but when man is referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt]'2lohiym[/size]

Strongs number 430 of Psalms 82:1

But only YHWH is referred to as [size=18pt]Elohim [/size]

Now that i have shown you that [size=18pt] Elohim is used only for YHWH, [/size] why did thomas according to your NWT referred to Yahshua as "My Lord and My God" ...

You really have a long way to go if you really said this with your clear mind.

Emusan:

And My God in that verse is Elohim.
May Thomas look at Jesus and said my Lord and look up and said My Elohim. So that we can go to the original manuscript to change the verse like this "And Thomas after he has looked at Jesus he said to Him my Lord and then raised his eyes up and looked into heaven and said My Elohim"
OR out of fear Thomas said to "Him My Lord and My God" so that we can change it again.

This will help you. 1 cor. 8:5

@JMAN05
Please NWT says in Gene 1:2 that the God's active force(which other versions use "spirit of God" was moving upon the the deep"(we all agree that JWs believe that Holy spirit is an active force of God.
Your book also agreed that God will put "His spirit on Jesus"(which is also the same Holyspirit) Isaiah 42:2
Now John 3:34 your book also agreed that God gave Jesus spirit not in measure!

My questions are,
*why do they use [size=14pt]active force for Spirit of God in Gen[/size] and use ordinary spirit in Isaiah & John?
*what kind of spirit did God put upon Jesus?

Pls don't post any link.

Shalom!

God's spirit is the same thing as His active force. Active force tells you what the spirit is, not a person but a force.

JMAN05:

Please re read this post and tell me how you drew that meaning from it.

1. The bolded. Why do the bible call angels and humans gods (elohim)? I see you are a babe when it comes to greek/hebrew.

What is the hebrew word for angel please?




If only you will be humble, I will tell you where your problem is. what you brought for me is "godlike ones" NWT. You ve not given me the one for god only. check strong definition 430 of Psalms 8:5.



Strongs number 430 of Psalms 82:1



You really have a long way to go if you really said this with your clear mind.

Hahah.. ok WHY? Godlike... interesting... yes they are divine beings... but as divine beings, they have thier [size=18pt]various description[/size] and this are the various description for divine beings...

angels in hebrew is refered to as malak but when angels are referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt] mee'2lohiym [/size]

Human (man) is aadaam but when man is referred to as "gods", they are called [size=18pt]'2lohiym[/size]

But only YHWH is referred to as [size=18pt]Elohim [/size]

Now that i have shown you that [size=18pt] Elohim is used only for YHWH, [/size] why did thomas according to your NWT referred to Yahshua as "My Lord and My God" ... [/quote]

Helep me understand what the greek/hebrew means of angel and humans as gods.. godlike...

btw.. do you think i can be referred to also as "god" like moses? and if no, what qualified moses to be called a "god"?

JMAN05:

This will help you. 1 cor. 8:5

Another story, the next verse says and there is only one God. The verse you recommended used "gods" in any versions whrreas in verse 6 they used "God"

Did Thomas call Jesus gods or God?

God's spirit is the same thing as His active force. Active force tells you what the spirit is, not a person but a force.

So you believe God put His active force in Jesus?
if we should insert the word in that Isaiah 42:2.
Now how this inanimate force help Jesus to achived all His mission?
Finally, do you agree that the word "spirit" means only force?

hisblud:

Now that i have shown you that [size=18pt] Elohim is used only for YHWH, [/size] why did thomas according to your NWT referred to Yahshua as "My Lord and My God" ...

Thomas did call Yahshua/Jesus My God because Jesus is a Mighty God( Not ALMIGHTY) according to ISAIAH 9:6. But saying Jesus is the YHWH/ The Father means Yahshua/ Jesus is a big liar when he said," My Father is greater than I"-JOHN 14:28, "I have not ascended to My Father.....,My God...."-JOHN 20:17, "My GoD,...My God,....My God,....My God.."- Revelation 3:12.

NB: The fact that Thomas called Jesus a God does not Necessary mean Jesus does not have a God he answers to as the other scripture stated.