Marlbron:

Tithing is real brother, don't kid yourself. Forget about Malachi for a moment. If you believe in God it should be pretty easy to understand that God created everything and owns everthing. Your tithe is a way of showing you appreciate Him. It should be collected by your pastor where youy worship and don't bother yourself with what he does with it. All you know is that you have done your part and blessings are sure to follow. God is a God of principles and till the earth folds those principles must always work. Tithing started from Cane and Abel. Abraham when returning from a war paid his tithe to the king of Salem and got blessed. If you are pastoring yourself, look for a man of God you respect and pay the tithe. It is not free will offering or charity, it is an acceptance that God owns everything.

Be rest assured that if you do not tithe, you will loose that money  and more  one way or the other no matter how religious or righteous you are! Your most precious thing that shows comitment is your money. Don't let greed and shortsightedness prevent you from doing the right thing!!!

My people perish for lack of knowledge. People like Lazarus and the woman with the widow's mite shld not have gone to heaven then.

WHEN ELIJAH SAID THAT HE IS THE ONLY PROPHET GOD TOLD HIM THAT THERE ARE THOUSAND OUT THERE.

MR POSTER IF U SAY THAT THERE ARE NO CREDIBLE CHURCHES PLS UR LIEING AS MINE IS AN EXAMPLE.

BUT HEAVENLY RACE LIKE THE BIBLE MADE US TO KNOW STATES THAT THE RACE WE ARE RUNNING IS AN INDIVIDUAL ONE.

NOW WHY MANY CHURCHES HAS FAILED IS THAT THIS IS END TIME IS ALMOST AROUND THE CORNER AND THE BIBLE SAID THAT THEY WILL TELL YOU THAT CHRIST IS HERE OR THERE BUT PRAY SO THAT U WONT BE DECEIVED AND SOME WILL DO SO MANY MIRACLES AND DUBIOUS THINGS ALL IN D NAME OF GOD BUT THEY ARE DOING IT WITH UNRIGHTEOUSNESS.

THE BIBLE SAID THAT THE GIFT OF THE LORD IS WITHOUT REPENTANCE SO U CAN HAVE MANY GIFTS BUT STILL UR NOT BORN AGAIN.


FIND ANY BELIEVING CHURCH OR BETTER STILL IF U CAN BE ON UR OWN AND UR SURE THAT UR SPIRITUAL LIFE WILL NOT GO DOWN THEN BE BUT KNOW THAT WHY FEW GO TO CHURCH IS TO BE SHARPENED COS THE BIBLE SAID THAT IRON SHARPENET IRON.

PRAY FOR THE REVELATION OF WHO GOD IS AND THIS ISSUE DIRECT TO GOD AND GOD WILL MAKE A LOT KNOWN TO YOU.


THANKS A LOT NIGERIANS

Myself2:

Krayola,krayola   ,oh I remember you,well it's delusional to suggest that for every doctrinal or dogmatic disagreement,christians should stop going to church

delusional? I respectfully disagree

Delusional would be knowingly sitting in a congregation led by a con-artist and expecting anything meaningful to come out of his mouth. I'm not generalizing here, I'm just saying that if the OP believes that churches, from his experience, are a fraud, his decision to stay away  is justified.

did you read the thread?

do you know what club i'm talking about or do you want to start a fight as usual.

did the A word you hate come out of my world.

don't start no shit buster

The truth is Penticostal christianity is a aman made invention and has nothing to do with Jesus Christ. Besides that on Penticostal christianity (especially in Nigeria) is nothing but glorified mamon worship. The rats in the church are not poor anymore no wonder some Christian multinationals have the funds and do not have any ethical qwalms about purchasing a private Jet (I wonder how many of the suffering masses will ever get to fly in them). What I find even more amazing is the justifications ADEBOYE and the like make for these crimes against conscience. I wish I could say God will help us but the truth is he won't

samorijack:

The truth is Penticostal christianity all institutionalized religion is a aman made invention and has nothing to do with Jesus Christ. Besides that on Penticostal christianity (especially in Nigeria) is nothing but glorified mamon worship. The rats in the church are not poor anymore no wonder some Christian multinationals have the funds and do not have any ethical qwalms about purchasing a private Jet (I wonder how many of the suffering masses will ever get to fly in them). What I find even more amazing is the justifications ADEBOYE and the like make for these crimes against conscience. I wish I could say God will help us but the truth is he won't

why dont u try to start your own church and see if you wouldnt get to where the churches you are criticizing are now in a few years !!!

davidylan:

I'm split between two things - the fact that the bible also encourages us to gather together in worship as often as we can and the fact that like kunle said . . . a lot of the churches of today are simply monuments to greed.

I grew up reading the "religious" books of the likes of Robert Liardon, Oral Roberts, Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland . . . men i once revered have turned out to be no more than salesmen in cassocks. Hawking prayer cloths, stealing from the poor to finance their luxury and promoting sins like homosexuality in the name of "love".

Does it mean that the church as a building is no longer relevant? No. Even Christ prayed with His disciples, the early apostles also fellowshipped one with another . . . the bible says iron sharpeneth iron so as much as the church is the people, the building is also important. The purpose for attending church is now more important than ever, are you going there to be fed a balanced spiritual diet or you are going there because it is the finest building in town and you'd like to be a part of the religious social club? Are you going there because they have a solid music band? Are you going because the pastor is the flashiest in town and the best babes abound there?

Much more than bashing the church, i think we need to do an introspection. Some churches will never be 100% perfect but so long as God is there and is the Lord crucified is preached . . . i will pitch my tent there until the Spirit guides to some place else.

Applause.

debosky:

There is no picture of Jesus that we know of that is correct. Even in the bible, people gathered to locations when they knew Paul would be there to preach or minister. The key here is that the motive behind using the pictures is to draw people in and reveal the truth of Christ to them. Human beings respond to name recognition - as always, the final aim is the key, if it will bring people to Christ, there is nothing wrong with it.

Great answer!

rich_john:

@kunleOshob
I must confess that the only aspect I differ on with you is about the football club you support I know these things you are talking about, they arent new I've taken my own decision long ago to stop all these fallacy, what is being pratised today in christianity is clearly 99% idolatry, is it christmas? or easter? or thieves collecting tithe? or jet purchasers? or the immoral scandals that takes places in 'houses of god', the hypocrisy? the wickedness or heartlessness in 'men of god'? MASSIVE CHURCH BUILDINGS? 'miracle' scandals? the crusades? inquisition? indulgencies? gay marriages? false speaking in tongues? my list could go on and on, 

My quest for the truth still continues but surely its not in modern day Christianity, too bad history has been greatly tampered with

You should try studying the bible with Jehovah's Witnesses. they are not a party to all of these celebrations you mentioned.
But having being to these other churches that could careless about God principles, It is quite hard for me to make the adjustment. Not anything goes there. If you are a homosexual, adulterer, woman/man beater, etc, they will disfollowship you after several counselling. there is no tithe, no collection being pass through in church. they however have a donation box in a secluded area where you may donate AFTER service! quite exceptional! but you know the road that lead to salvation is narrow and not everbody will find it. Cheers

slimfine:

If you are a homosexual, adulterer, woman/man beater, etc, they will disfollowship you after several counselling.

God doesn't love these people?

Surely this thread will get to the 100th page in no time.Very sensitive topic but I don't think the payment or non payment of tithe amongst others should make any serious christian decide to stop going to church.We all at one time or the other have sat in our churches to listen to our pastors make preachments that we did not totally agree with,but we didn't leave our churches.When such occur,the thing to do is to follow the example of the Berean brethren,go home,take your bible and prayerfully cross check the facts from the Bible against whatever your pastor preached that you disagree with,except of course the OP wants to tell us that his church is not a bible-believing church or that there's more to this post than meets the eye

Krayola:

God doesn't love these people?

I don't think he said that

rasputinn:

Surely this thread will get to the 100th page in no time.Very sensitive topic but I don't think the payment or non payment of tithe amongst others should make any serious christian decide to stop going to church.We all at one time or the other have sat in our churches to listen to our pastors make preachments that we did not totally agree with,but we didn't leave our churches.When such occur,the thing to do is to follow the example of the Berean brethren,go home,take your bible and prayerfully cross check the facts from the Bible against whatever your pastor preached that you disagree with,except of course the OP wants to tell us that his church is not a bible-believing church or that there's more to this post than meets the eye

You read my mind precisely.

slimfine:

You should try studying the bible with Jehovah's Witnesses. they are not a party to all of these celebrations you mentioned.
But having being to these other churches that could careless about God principles, It is quite hard for me to make the adjustment. Not anything goes there. If you are a homosexual, adulterer, woman/man beater, etc, they will disfollowship you after several counselling. there is no tithe, no collection being pass through in church. they however have a donation box in a secluded area where you may donate AFTER service! quite exceptional! but you know the road that lead to salvation is narrow and not everbody will find it. Cheers

My sister,I dare say that even that is not a panacea for the percieved anomalies in some "churches"
Remember ,Matt 24:12 ?? And because iniquity shall abound the love of many will wax cold, and Matt 24:13 But he that endures to the end,the same shall be saved.Just let the Bible be your final point of reference

The HYPOCRISY of you christian folk is shocking!
Some of the posts here gather around ''no church is 100% perfect'' and many more agree.
That's just plain stupid coz you hypocrites preach that jesus was perfect and only perfect people without sin will enter the kingdom of god.HOW THEN CAN THE CHURCH BE IMPERFECT? The many lies of the followers of a nazarene carpenter. . .

@Tùdor,

Tùdor:

The HYPOCRISY of you christian folk is shocking!

Yours is the most illiterate comment I ever came across in all possible worlds! How can you require objective thinking from others and you don't seem to demonstrate that in your engagement with Christians? Yours is precisely the hypocrisy you allege against others. Trying to discuss does not mean you have to barge into a thread and assume an accusative position.

Tùdor:

Some of the posts here gather around ''no church is 100% perfect'' and many more agree.

And just what is wrong with that? Just what is wrong with people agreeing and disagreeing?

Tùdor:

That's just plain stupid coz you hypocrites preach that [b]J[/b]esus was perfect and only perfect people without sin will enter the kingdom of god.HOW THEN CAN THE CHURCH BE IMPERFECT? The many lies of the followers of a nazarene carpenter. . .

[b]J[/b]esus is not "the Church" - the Church is composed of people who themselves are imperfect. If any particular church turns out to be imperfect, it does not therefore mean you have to belittle yourself with such crass  logic to assume an accusation as in yours.

This cheap atheistic bashing should put you guys to shame.

Pilgrim this is an unnecessary denial. . .
Isn't the church the BODY of christ? And can still remember jesus telling peter ''On this rock i'll build MY church and the gates of hell shall not previal''
its a shame you now deny the owner of the church.

@ poster, think you have to adopt the sayings of the Catholic father that says, "do what i say, and don't do what i do". Since you have a better understanding of the 'scriptures', then go ahead and make a change, who knows you might be that "God sent" messiah we are all waiting for. Do it now.
Best of luck,

Tùdor:

Pilgrim this is an unnecessary denial. . .

Tùdor, there's no denial in my response - and I don't think that it's a healthy interpolation into my post. The one thing that is a put-off in the atheist's discourses is the unnecessary far-fetched reactions that is all too characteristic of your position - and that is no way to discuss other people's worldview(s).

Tùdor:

Isn't the church the BODY of christ? And can still remember Jesus telling Peter ''On this rock i'll build MY church and the gates of hell shall not previal''
its a shame you now deny the owner of the church.

That does not amount to my denying the Owner of the Church - you just got you ideas mixed up. The fact that the Church is composed of imperfect people should be enough to make you realize that we're not "perfect". The Church is not built upon the 'church'; be that as it may, we all have our problems as well, yet we do not glory in them. The 'perfection' does not come from within us, but from Jesus Himself. An example: if an atheist deviates from atheism, should that be used to narrow all atheists around the world to that deviation? In the same way, you cannot assume that just because Christians have their own problems (a fact which the Bible does not hide), it does not therefore mean that an atheist should try to score cheap by resorting to the sort of unnecessary reaction as you displayed earlier.

@pilgrim
''The church is not perfect'' there-in lies your hypocrisy the bible says ''be ye perfect even as your lord jesus was perfect''
the original statement was ''NO church is 100% perfect'' if the church is imperfect as you say how can an imperfect church supposed to be the body,property and under guidance of a perfect jesus produce imperfect people for the kingdom where only the perfect are allowed? Is it possible?
Why the contradictions?

I am amazed how we decide to focus on inconsequential issues at the expense of the important issue.

The Bible says " BELIEVE in the Lord Jesus and you will be SAVED". Another part says " If you LOVE me you would do what i say".

For me, i think that we need to focus on believing JESUS and loving him with our ALL.

Paying tithe or not  paying tithe is, in my opinion, not the crux of the matter. I don't think it will, BY ITSELF, make you get to heaven or stop you from getting there. If you like pay, if you do not like do not pay.

That is definitely not a good reason to stop attending church.

Chei I didnt see this on time

Hmmm our own Bro Kunle is at it again ooooo

He'd been going to church whenever he felt like; now he has stopped going (he's making progress like someone rightly said)

The problem with many people (including the poster) is that they apply human wisdom (foolishness in zion ) in handling spiritual, and more precisely, christian matters.

If you knew that God dwelt in you, a petty matter as Church building bla bla bla would not bother you so much so that you decided not to go to church anymore.

As a christian, I know:  wherever I am, God is! He is in me. So if I gather with other christians in whatever BUILDING, God is there! not because of the building, but because of us!

Kunle, you really have to find out what Christianity is all about and stop rubbing your religiousity on our faces. And why did you have to announce your decision to us?

I think you should also stay away from this ''terrible and evil world'' for you to become blameless and righteous enough to enter heaven.

Lest I forget, close down your cyber cafe so that you dont continue to give yahoo boys a platform for them to defraud others, that ye might go to heaven  

Lol!You guys are a riot!The poster clearly stated that he is done with institutionalized christianity,and you guys are still offering him an alternative of the same thing,more institutionalized christianity in the guise of other denominations.

Tùdor:

@pilgrim
''The church is not perfect'' there-in lies your hypocrisy the bible says ''be ye perfect even as your lord jesus was perfect''

You seem confused, Tùdor. Now steady on and let me help you.

The church is not perfect, and that does not overrule the fact that she is urged to become what she is not. These two positions are not to be confused the way you display your hypocritic arrogance. If you're not something, asking you to go on to what you're not, does not mean that I assume you "already" are that same thing!

There are several "be ye" statements that demonstrate this point:

 (1) Therefore be ye also ready - Matt. 24:24, Luke 12:40

 (2) but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind - Rom. 12:2

 (3) be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another - 1 Pet. 3:8

In context, these are examples describing progression - they do not assume that believers already automatically have become "perfect".

Tùdor:

the original statement was ''NO church is 100% perfect'' if the church is imperfect as you say how can an imperfect church supposed to be the body,property and under guidance of a perfect Jesus produce imperfect people for the kingdom where only the perfect are allowed? Is it possible?

I knew you're reading issues from a wrong end. The One who is perfect takes imperfect people and brings them to maturity.

Tùdor:

Why the contradictions?

There is no contradiction besides what you have wrongly inferred.

Thank God for your life if you decide to leave the church for your personal beliefs. I want to respect your views and various articles that used to support your claims, but i want to believe its a personal decision (which i see no reason except to confuse people about the present day church and probably to convince people from attending churches and i am beginning to sense an anti-church and anti - Christ involvement here.)

The church you are leaving wont even feel you because i sense you are not deeply involved in any church activities (as you never told us if you are a worker in your church or not) and also i want to believe as you leave more than 100 will replace you.

In my own candid advise/opinion as you gave us the opportunity to express our mind towards your decision, i will advice that you run back and go and correct what you feel is wrong in your church rather than running away and then crucifying the church.

ogajin,

The story of Cain and Abel offering sacrifice to God is well known. The story of Abraham tithing to the King of Salem is well known. Every action provokes an equal and opposite reaction (you can call it Karma etc), but someone set up this world and owns it. That same being is worthy of your honour, thanks praise and adoration. Why should you think that paying homage to him with your tithe is too much? Was it not him that made it possible for you to own that money? You should actually be giving more than 10% if we are to show absolute gratitude!

Hi everyone, 

Pls check out www.lds.org and learn about the restored gospel of Jesus Christ.

1anonymous:

Hi everyone, 

Pls check out www.lds.org and learn about the restored gospel of Jesus Christ.

Aren't these people supposed to be racist.

Confused. Racist but they believe that the american indians are the lost tribe of Israel and when jesus left his disciples at the end of the gospels he flew to america to preach to the Aztecs and mayans before then flying up to heaven.

They are not, Kindly investigate the church with a sincere heart and real intent.

@ all
this is a tough one, wish i could say one or two things, But from a lay man view point. I would like to ask a question here.
Is the kingdom of heaven accessible to only those who attend churches or is just about loving your neighbours as urself among other righteous deeds ?