James taught that the gentiles must be circumcised according to the law of moses to be saved.

Now let me respond to your long empty letter. Those guys Paul talked about were from James. James was the pastor of the church in Jerusalem, he took over leadership from Peter. Probably because he was a blood brother to Jesus christ. So people feared him even Peter feared him. Look at the authority with which he spoke at the conference in Jerusalem after the uproar. Paul that was more anointed would not even talk to his elders like that.

Deeper life will not invite pastor Adefarasin they will have issues with skirts and trousers. That's the issue with Paul and James.

Paul was rebuking the church under his care. He started those churches. He was their father spiritually . He was only dealing with unrully members who looked down on his apostleship.

Joagbaje:

Acts 15:13-22.
And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:.
Then he went bla bla bla like altheia the time waster. And ended up in the  law of Moses as usual.

Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Tonye-t:

Why should Oyakhilome send converts to Oyedepo's church when they both have different administrations. Like why would Zenith bank send its recruits(converts) to Oceanic bank when the both have different strategies even though one mission.

Comooooonn! 

aletheia:


^Thank God for the Bible because today on this thread, it will be established that both Joagbaje and Tonye-t are wolves masquerading as sheep and lying through their teeth against the Bible.
#1. What doctrines of James that Paul didn't approve of? List them here for us now
#2. What revelation or assignment from Jesus is different from Matthew 28:18-20; unless it is the revelation and assignment you dreamt up for yourself, which is why it will differ between joagbaje and tonye-t.

In fact what comes out clearly in both of you people's response is the shoddy and relativistic way that you handle truth.

Aletheia, from inception i could easily deduce you have an issue with 'Trepidation' and it shows again and again. you always jump from no where and end up asserting your usual gibberish. like seriously dont you think and reason wide before talking? if u no know wetin to talk cant u just remain silent behind your LCD,? na wa oh!  

For you to come here and make folks believe the only revelation or assignment Jesus gave was matt. 28:18-20 goes to tell us the term "napkin" is still useful in the dictionary at least for yoursake. Was Matt.28:18 the only assignment Jesus gave to his disciples?

While you still hallucinate and ^{prolly think of what to insult an elder brother}  , let me make clear to you the varying forms of assignments.

Doctrines are set of guildlines made by leaders that are laid down for followers. In scriptures paul talked of various forms of clergies, like bishops, Apostles, Teachers etc. Now these clergies could be masters yet have different believe-system (i'll quote scriptures) its called the spheres of faith (also scriptural) and when they teach God's word they also influence their followers to these dogmas. For instance, John the baptist believed so much in fasting, while Jesus' disciples were almost opposite.

Having several belief-system is not wrong so long as it has and maintains its validity within the context of the HOLY SCRIPTURES. For instance, a leader who still believe in the LAW of Moses could raise his own followers and make them believe in his believe-system.

. . . Another could come and do the other way and his followers are also influenced likewise too. Now what matters to God is the DESTINATION of these souls under their believe system.

Here is how bible puts it:

One man's ministry could accept certain modes, while the other does the different, but good a thing is it if they both do it unto the Lord. Now dont you think the meat-eater may never invite the non-meat-eater on the grounds on the varying believe system, but yet they both still have validity under scriptural context, they both can make heaven as well as their followers. this could be the scenario btw chris and Oyedepo. (only a baby will still argue over this).

I rest my case while the bullies come with their bullions of pride and ego to condemn other folks contributions.!  

aletheia:

^And thereby proves the point he's arguing against. Two different "banks", two different "administrations" that is to say two different spirits but one "mission" to take your money-read to lead men astray. But I wonder why his example is coached in terms of Mammon? Doesn' t that tell us something?

The True Church has Only One Head-Christ Himself and only One Administrator-the Holy Spirit.

gooosshhh this is the dumbest assertions of the day coming from the self-acclaimed elite .


pls tell me where in this thread i argued against different adminstrations, maybe i cant remember.

must your post be always childish and dumb? cant you cool down b4 replying post? i understand your adrenaline rush, but atleast if you cant exhibit patience fake it.  it will make some sense.

aletheia:

The True Church has Only One Head-Christ Himself and only One Administrator-the Holy Spirit.

Aletheia! Aletheia!! Aletheia!!! how many times i call ya name, be careful with you heresies . ^{sometimes i really wish i could see the faces of these dudes on Facebooks.}

aletheia:

^ :
Agnomen for the non-domesticated species of the genus Equus =>Zebra: I think you meant domesticated species of the genus Equus rather=>A*SS(Spambot was rendering it Backside or Behind. See how profanity is robbing us of perfectly good words  )
3rd vowel based on the latin alphabet=>I
DCCXXVIIII(You used the older Latin form since 729 would now be written as DCCXXIX); so 729^1/3=>9 (NINE)

So A*SS+I+NINE yields Asinine.

Couldn't resist that.

Edit: Thought about it some more and realize you are right. Got fixated on Zebras ("Madagascar" running thru my mind). This particular species of the genus Equus does run wild too! And one of them rebuked Balaam.

JeSoul:

  nice work Dr.!

aletheia:

Praise be to God that today on this thread, he has exposed your lies for all to see^If you knew the Truth than you would have been set free. But the truth dwells not in you, otherwise you would not be here lying brazenly and trying to pass it off as truth. Our Master said it best:

KJV: John Chapter 8:44. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
You can term it street fight or whatever but the time for dialogueing with wolves who ravage the flock of Jesus is over! No negotiation with the devil! God's command is clear: Resist the devil. . .
Unlike you who is steeped in spiritual pride, I can admit when wrong and accept correction but the question is can you dare do such?
What do you understand by the phrase: "Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away."? You lot bandy that whenever your lies are challenged. It is the fig leaf you try to use to cover your abject unclothedness like the Laodicean church! To you Jesus says:

KJV: Revelation 3:18. I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy unclothedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

^Again you repeat the lie. Thank God for the witness of Acts 15 which clearly establishes that you are a liar.
^Hypocrite! When the post indicts you; it becomes unnecessarily long as if you yourself don't have long posts. A large part of the post is Acts from the Bible. Maybe "time management" is what makes you read the bible upside down.
"The letter killeth": Another scripture wrenched out of context, twisted and panel-beated to say what you want it to say. Silly man, have you looked up the meaning of the word synecdoche yet? In the context of scripture doesn't that phrase "The letter killeth" refer to the Law and how no-one is justified by keeping the Law? If James had said anything favorable about tithes: then he would have been your darling, you greedy follower of Balaam.
^Keep lying that the world will see the truth about you false pastor.
Firstly, the events of which Paul wrote in Galatians are clear for anyone with even a modicum of understanding. Summarized as follows:
#1. Peter, Paul and Barnabas were in Antioch.
#2. They were certain Jews who were preaching that Gentiles had to be circumcised (Peter was not one of them).
#3. Some people sent by James arrived
#4. Peter, Barnabas  and some others bowed to "public opinion" and separated themselves from the Gentiles (contrary to the gospel that they had hitherto preached)
#5. Peter was to be blamed because he knew better. Galatians 2:11, 14; Acts 10 [God had already shown him that the Gentiles had a share in the gospel]
No where in this account does it say that the men James sent came and preached that Gentiles had to be circumcised. It is astounding that you are brazen enough to lie like this when Acts 15 is there for you to read and see what James himself said on this matter.

Secondly, you wrote this nonsense above: "James was the pastor of the church in Jerusalem, he took over leadership from Peter. Probably because he was a blood brother to Jesus christ. So people feared him even Peter feared him. Look at the authority with which he spoke at the conference in Jerusalem after the uproar. Paul that was more anointed would not even talk to his elders like that."

Again you betray your lack of understanding compounded by willful error. Did you suppose that the True Church of God is structured like the false churches that you are so proud of? God arranged that leadership of his Church be provided by a plurality of elders, each holding each other accountable before God as Paul did for Peter. And as Paul himself also subjected himself to accountability before Peter, James and John in the same Galatians that you are trying to twist.

KJV: Galatians 2:2. And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
And:
KJV: Acts 21:18. And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present.

As you can see from Acts 15 and 21 and referenced by Paul in 1 Cor 15:1-4: it is a plurality of elders. James was preeminent no doubt but where do you find it written "that people feared him" or "Paul more anointed". Stop this nonsense now! Every true Christian has the same anointing [the Holy Spirit] but different gifts.
^Proof needed. Show me the thread where I acknowledged myself as a teacher. Apparently the baby food is giving you logorrhea.
^Childish tantrums? Now you want me shot (presumably dead). And why such a response from one who claims to be a follower of Christ. Did I not say thank God, that on this thread it will be fully revealed that you are a wolf, a false teacher, for it is wolves who desire the death of those who tell them the truth. Your response is in keeping with your father, the devil: He was a murderer from the beginning and abode not in the truth.

KJV: John 3:19-21.
And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

aletheia:

Post script: I missed addressing this part of your post. More insidious lies to lead the sheep of Jesus astray.
And thus you dismiss the following as the Law of Moses:
#1. Abstaining from pollutions of idols.
#2. Abstaining from fornication.
#3. Abstaining from blood and things strangled.

Anyone reading this will know that these are the things that occult practitioners, and followers of the enemy delight in, (they have serious spiritual implications as seen in the history of the Israel) yet Joagbaje dismisses the command that Christians abstain from these things as "Law of Moses" forgetting that these commands of God predate Moses (Genesis 9). To him it would be justified to partake of them since they fall under the rubric of the Law of Moses (How convenient for him that tithes don't fall under the Law of Moses).

Joagbaje is no Christian but a false teacher, a wolf ravening the flock of Jesus.

aletheia:

^I am not in hiding.  Though you want me dead.

Very soon you will mobilize mabel & co to come and post on this thread.

[/quote]

what I only see you expose is your ignorance. And insincerity

[quote]My, what big teeth you have!

Joagbaje:

You were dead in ignorance tey tey

Are you scared? The ones you mobilised are doing just fine.  But you're right, I should make few calls.  MBA emeka, where are you?

[quite] They are welcome to come see how your lies against the Bible have been exposed
You created the teeth for me and it will bite liars and manipulators like you.

Joagbaje:

James taught that the gentiles must be circumcised according to the law of moses to be saved.

aletheia:

Post script: I missed addressing this part of your post. More insidious lies to lead the sheep of Jesus astray.
And thus you dismiss the following as the Law of Moses:
#1. Abstaining from pollutions of idols.
#2. Abstaining from fornication.
#3. Abstaining from blood and things strangled.

Anyone reading this will know that these are the things that occult practitioners, and followers of the enemy delight in, (they have serious spiritual implications as seen in the history of the Israel) yet Joagbaje dismisses the command that Christians abstain from these things as "Law of Moses" forgetting that these commands of God predate Moses (Genesis 9). To him it would be justified to partake of them since they fall under the rubric of the Law of Moses (How convenient for him that tithes don't fall under the Law of Moses).

Joagbaje is no Christian but a false teacher, a wolf ravening the flock of Jesus.

JeSoul:

Aletheia, you try self.

It would appear our brother Tonye thinks: different administrations = different "ministries" . . . and by administration, he equates that to something along the lines of each one running their own seperate "organization".

JeSoul:

Aletheia, you try self.

It would appear our brother Tonye thinks:  different administrations = different "ministries" . . . and by administration, he equates that to something along the lines of each one running their own seperate "organization".

When in the biblical reality, administration simply refers to different gifts - not each one given their own organization to run. It is: different gifts, working together towards the same ministry, the ministry we've all be been charged with of making disciples. And if we are one body working towards building Christ's church, will the hand ever say to the leg "wetin concern me with your ministry?" or will the eye say to the hand "you no fit come preach for my church since we get different 'ministry'"? will the mouth reject the foot and say "my own no concern you oh!" . . . but yet, T-boy is insisting they have "different administrations" and "one no concern the other".

na wa oh. . . some folks can go any length to defend their twaddles especially when their errs have been exposed. . .another issue of 'ego syndrome'.

In their minds they'll be thinking aometihing lilke this -  [size=5pt]why would i accept this truth. . .if i do my colleagues may think i am dumb and a loser so let me go on and continue saying stuffs. . .you never can tell[/size].  no wonder someone called it the "religious section circles" i concur with a better tag "religious section circles of dumb elites" a synonym for "Pharisees".

Sister Mi when has ADMINISTRATION come to mean the same thing as GIFTS. hmmmmm very sad! 

aletheia:

^^I guess that part is missing from Tonye-t's Bible.

Tonye-t:

For instance, Peter was still busy preaching the circumcision after the flesh, while Paul came up with the circumcision after the word. And yet their both conceptions will pass for salvation.

aletheia:

[. . .]
Specific lies uttered on this thread
[. . .]
[b]Tonye-t's lies
While Joagbaje drips his own in little by little. Your's is concentrated poison for the Biblically undiscerning. Two sentences=3 lies. You are a master.

Lie #1.
Peter was still busy preaching the circumcision after the flesh, while Paul came up with the circumcision after the word.
^Herein is revealed that you have no understanding the gospel that you claim to profess. What was the difference between the gospel preached by Peter and Paul or any other Apostle? Who first preached to Gentiles: Peter, some other disciples, Barnabas or Paul?
Here is the Bible evidence against your lies:

KJV: Acts Chapter 11:1-4.
And the apostles and brethren that were in Judæa heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God. And when Peter was come up to Jerusalem, they that were of the circumcision contended with him, Saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them. But Peter rehearsed the matter from the beginning, and expounded it by order unto them,[. . .]
As Acts Chapter 10 & 11 show (as anyone interested in the truth will see); Peter was God's instrument for opening the gates of the Kingdom to Gentiles. Paul's missions did not start till Chapter 13!
Moreover verses 20 & 21 of Acts 11 reveal:
And some of them were men of Cyprus and Cyrene, which, when they were come to Antioch, spake unto the Grecians, preaching the Lord Jesus. And the hand of the Lord was with them: and a great number believed, and turned unto the Lord.

Verdict: Tonye-t lied

Lie #2.
. . .while Paul came up with the circumcision after the word.
^So in your words Paul invented the gospel he preached. He "came up with. . ." Ok.

Paul denies you:[/b]KJV: I Corinthians Chapter 15:1-9.
[b]Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve: After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep. After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles. And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time. For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.

Lie #3
And yet their both conceptions will pass for salvation.
^Good grief. There are now two (according to Tonye-t) Ways to salvation
But unfortunately for you: There is Only One Lord Jesus. You are comfortable saying that there are two "conceptions" (the gospel has now become a concept abi?) because you have crafted for yourself a man-centered gospel of works and tried to merchandise the free grace of our Lord.

Your lies are exposed today; both of you. No matter how you twisted scriptures in the past, today, the Bible testifies against you that you have both lied. If you like call it "hard meat." Anything contrary to the Word of God is a lie!

ttalks:

1Corinthians 12:3-6
(3) Therefore I want you to understand that no one speaking under the power and influence of the [Holy] Spirit of God can [ever] say, Jesus be cursed! And no one can [really] say, Jesus is [my] Lord, except by and under the power and influence of the Holy Spirit.
(4) Now there are distinctive varieties and distributions of endowments (gifts, extraordinary powers distinguishing certain Christians, due to the power of divine grace operating in their souls by the Holy Spirit) and they vary, but the [Holy] Spirit remains the same.
(5) And there are distinctive varieties of service and ministration, but it is the same Lord [Who is served].
(6) And there are distinctive varieties of operation [of working to accomplish things], but it is the same God Who inspires and energizes them all in all.

There are different ways of accomplishing God's task for man. They are different probably in execution,style or manner; . . . . but are all in harmony/or make up a complete and non disagreeble unit when brought together.

They must conform to what the word of God says they are.

All these different administrations(of the gifts of the Spirit) are needed by every christian, so we can't say it is only a select set of people that are in need of a particular administration.
I guess this has to deal with the growth of a Christian. There are those administrations that are needed at the beginning stage, there are those that are needed at the middle stage
and then there are those that are needed at the matured stage(1st foundation - 2nd Building / 1st planting - 2nd watering) <<<< that sort of analogy

Therefore,every form of[b] God recognized[/b] administration has to be available one way or the other to every christian.

My take.

Elbow is designed to make a joint, therefore it doesnt need any finger to make it a joint, else nails will be growing from one's elbow (try and picture this scenario). It rather needs other parts of his members to make it a joint and not some finger somewhere.

Finger is designed to grow nails and not to digest food, it doesnt need the stomach to make it a finger, it only needs the stomach to make them a complete body, because if the stomach is not there, the finger will still be a finger by shape.

Waist is there to connect the upper-parts with the lower-parts by design and it has its own members to make it function as a waist. Heart is there to pump blood cells.

Heart is there to administer blood cells through the body and it has its own members to make it complete now this is where administration comes to play it doesnt need the members of the waist to make it a heart.

Bringing this analogy to play will mean Oyedepo having his own design and ministry for instance he could be the neck, while Oyakhilome has his own design too and he could be the kidney. Now is a neck the same as a kidney or are they created to play the same role? i certainly dont think so! but yet they all fulfill the harmony of making a BODY.

Now no one should get me wrong, i never insinuated they maynt need each other, I only said they are different in design and probably may not augment each other. _{because alot of folks here suffer alot from consternation}.

Talk to me!

Tonye-t:

Bringing this analogy to play will mean Oyedepo having his own design and ministry for instance he could be the neck, while Oyakhilome has his own design too and he could be the kidney. Now is a neck the same as a kidney or are they created to play the same role? i certainly dont think so! but yet they all fulfill the harmony of making a BODY.

Now no one should get me wrong, i never insinuated they maynt need each other, I only said they are different in design and probably may not augment each other.

Tonye-t:

2nd: when we talk about dynamisms in christ (which is what this thread is all about), we'll have a scenario where the hand is the hand and the feet is the feet, the waist is the waist and the elbow is the elbow. They are different by design and so cannot harmonize each other they only harmonize the body.

aletheia:

Lie #3
And yet their both conceptions will pass for salvation.
^Good grief. There are now two (according to Tonye-t) Ways to salvation
But unfortunately for you: There is Only One Lord Jesus. You are comfortable saying that there are two "conceptions" (the gospel has now become a concept abi?) because you have crafted for yourself a man-centered gospel of works and tried to merchandise the free grace of our Lord.

JeSoul:

Tonye, no problem. Whether na administration abi gift abi organization or ministry, I don talk my own finish. It is obvious to the casual observer there is little to no unity within what is labeled the 'church' today. And the reasons why, I hope, should even be more obvious. God bless ehn.

J-babe i swear i love you die! you have said it as it should be. There is little or no unity in the church today. . .yes. . . very correct. . . but my notion is that no one should come up here and say the reason why Oyedepo has not been invited to chris' church IS BECAUSE of hatred. It is simply some cheap conclusion that has no basis for true chrisitian discourse. I hope you've learnt not to jump into unhealthy conclusions . . . its immature.!

Tonye-t:

J-babe i swear i love you die!

Tonye-t:

There is little or no unity in the church today. . .yes. . . very correct. . . but my notion is that no one should come up here and say the reason why Oyedepo has not been invited to chris' church IS BECAUSE of hatred.

Tonye-t:

It is simply some cheap conclusion that has no basis for true chrisitian discourse. I hope you've learnt not to jump into unhealthy conclusions . . . its immature.!

omo~fat:

Just another example of the disunity within the body:

I go to a church that was bringing in a 'celebrated' US gospel artist into town for a one-day concert. As part of the whole publicity effort for the event, it was advertised on radio, tv, posters, etc. They sent a batch of flyers to other churches in the city to help promote the event.

One church in particular returned the flyers - because they weren't the 'first' to bring this artist to this city.

Approx 6 months later, they had an event of their own and they then invited this same person to come sing.

Their initial reluctance to publicise the first church's event had nothing to do with anything they had against the singer, or the church even. Twas just unclothed, raw bellus. That my friends is a typical example of what we have to deal with in today's "church".