LordReed:


Neither do I care that you believe in this stupid idea that a giant being is watching all you do and is just silent while people slaughter themselves when he has all the power to stop them, then he will punish all these people both the killers and the killed in an eternal lake of fire. You are free to believe this nonsense and I am free to point out your nonsense.

Believe what you will my brother.
I tell you, you are deluding yourself. The intellect is limited to space and time and will not understand anything beyond space and time.
Peace.

Uyi168:
..
This doesn't make sense.. But it's ok..

It may not now.
I only advise that you have an open mind.
When you seek earnestly, help will come.
This I know.
Peace.

Daejoyoung:

So are you saying God only knows based on the freewill we are using, or he knows beforehand, which is it? is God merely predicting the results of our freewill, or he already knows what they would be even before we were born?

What is the essence of life?

cjfbn:

Believe what you will my brother.
I tell you, you are deluding yourself. The intellect is limited to space and time and will not understand anything beyond space and time.
Peace.

See how deluded you are? You claim there is something beyond human comprehension yet you are here claiming knowledge of the very thing you said is beyond human comprehension. You are truly deluded.

cjfbn:

Young man,
We ask these questions because of our lack of knowledge of re-incarnation.
God is perfect. Thus, his laws are also perfect. What you sow, you reap.
Do you know of the past life of the girl in question?
Why are some born blind and some born normal?
Why some are born into rich families and some born into abject poverty.
The answer to all these questions will cease when you get a good grip of creation as a whole.
Peace

Kid,
I asked a simple question and you went on a long winding off tangent answer.
I have a simple piece of advise for you. If you don't know the answer to a question it is better to just keep quiet and wait for those who know the answer to come and give it.
Using ad hominems to answer questions is one of the methods baby Christian's like you use to answer questions you don't know the answers to.

Just look at how you are casting aspersions on the poor girl that sought sanctuary in a church and god could not protect her. So in your silly logic the poor girl was raped and killed because of her past life?
Let me tell you something this night,judgemental Christian's like you disgust me. Instead of sparing a moment to think about this poor girl who lost her life in a mindless assault you are here defending your god by ignorantly casting aspersions on the poor girls past life. And even if she was a prostitute in the past,does any human being deserve to die in such a manner?
Please do not respond to this post Mr holier than thou christian because I will not respond!

cjfbn:

Young man,
We ask these questions because of our lack of knowledge of re-incarnation.
God is perfect. Thus, his laws are also perfect. What you sow, you reap.
Do you know of the past life of the girl in question?
Why are some born blind and some born normal?
Why some are born into rich families and some born into abject poverty.
The answer to all these questions will cease when you get a good grip of creation as a whole.
Peace

But how is reincarnation just, seeing that the girl cannot even remember her past life, if what you said is true?

These are the kind of questions I used to ask when younger. It didn't take me long to realize the answers I was given made absolutely no sense. Most times, I was even told I misunderstood the scriptures, asked too much questions blablabla

I'm pretty sure your daughter will soon come to that conclusion as well

Erm, op just an advise for the future

Your daughter is absolutely normal and just very logical. Don't annoy her with verses that make no sense.

We atheists aren't as bad, you know and I'm welcoming your daughter into our society

fieryy:
These are the kind of questions I used to ask when younger. It didn't take me long to realize the answers I was given made absolutely no sense. Most times, I was even told I misunderstood the scriptures, asked too much questions blablabla

I'm pretty sure your daughter will soon come to that conclusion as well

Wie geht's? wo bleibst du im deutschland?

It's a theology you follow, you should be able to answer it...explain why logically or tell her you don't know if you don't, but don't dismiss her or cover it up with out of context verses

Daejoyoung:

Wie geht's? wo bleibst du im deutschland?

Erwartest du jetzt von mir, dass ich dir meine Adresse gebe?

On an online forum?

fieryy:


Erwartest du jetzt von mir, dass ich dir meine Adresse gebe?

On an online forum?

Lmao I don't even understand but I get the gist

ibkayee:

Lmao I don't even understand but I get the gist

Lool, ain't nobody kidnapping me o

But I guess he just wanted to know the state I live in sha, but I'd rather keep that to myself

Daejoyoung:
If God knows that I would be what I would be, then why does he get angry when I do evil?

Anger, is an emotional expression.
Are you trying to deny God displaying a displeasure and/or feeling over something bad you've done. Oh o, you rather God pull you over in His Arms, give you a cuddle, a kiss and pat on the head for you being a badass, hmm?

Daejoyoung:
God already knew Adam would sin, and man would fall, so why does he act surprised in the bible when they do these things?

You seem to be mistaking questioning for surprised. God wasn't surprised, rather God was questioning Adam after what he Adam did.

Daejoyoung:
for instance, God regretted at some point that he had made man. How could this be, if you say God was already expecting it to be so? God even said in the old testament, that it never crossed his mind that the people of judah would burn their children as sacrifices to moloch (Jer 32v35). Why is God acting surprised in all these?

"⁵Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great upon the earth,
and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was altogether evil all the time.
⁶And the LORD regretted that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him in His heart.
⁷So the LORD said, “I will blot out man, whom I have created, from the face of the earth
—every man and beast and crawling creature and bird of the air
—for I am grieved that I have made them.”"
- Genesis 6:5-7

"And also the Glory of Israel will not lie or have regret,
for He is not a man, that He should have regret.”"
- 1 Samuel 15:29

The word translated as regret is the Hebrew word "nacham" and it carries a sense of meaning interpreted as an expression, saying, to be sorry, comfort oneself for something about to do or is going to do. God was in effect sorry that He'll have to blot out man, whom He created with His own very Hands. It is only a cold indifferent person who wouldn't have a sense of sadness, using their own hands to inflict unpleasant or not necessarily nice things upon the creations of their hands.

I remember when growing up in high school, there used to be this teacher, who when he is about to reprimand with a few strokes of the cane, with tongue in cheek and said with audacit, say, before beating, that the beating, is going to hurt him more than it will us.

Daejoyoung:
Everything cannot be for the benefit of the testee, the tester also have a purpose for testing the testee, in Islam for instance allah created man to test him, and is same in some versions of christianity, if this is the case then allah or God wants to find out something from this test, isn't that so?

On the contrary sire, everything is for the benefit of the testee. For the simple fact that God is Omniscient, that He is all knowing, then by implication, there is nothing for God to find out. Everything is for the benefit of the testee, and that is for the record, that the testee prove himself/herself. The testee needs to go through the motions, the process, measures, the et cetera, so to check the quality, performance, reliability of the testee, especially with a single and simple test with the Tree of knowledge of Good and Evil (i.e. TKGE) just before the testee gets rolled out into the widespread world, lmao

Daejoyoung:
The big question here is this, if God can already see what would happen or what we would decide, then nothing can change that, it would mean that all that happens have been fixed already, and this is why God has access to that knowledge, right??

You are not getting it. Everything and everyone must be allowed to evolve according to what and/or how their nature is. Ordinarily some are innately good or innately bad, but fact isn't an excuse nor a licence to discriminate and not permit either to come into existence.

It isn't about concerned about anything per se changing, but rather it is about having the fundamental right to come into existence and exist to express yourself according to whatever your nature is. However do express yourself, however you use the freewill gift you have been blessed with, God is able and capable to successfully work round it, so that His purpose, expectation and will are achieved

MuttleyLaff:
Anger, is an emotional expression.
Are you trying to deny God displaying a displeasure and/or feeling over something bad you've done. Oh o, you rather God pull you over in His Arms, give you a cuddle, a kiss and pat on the head for you being a badass, hmm?

You seem to be mistaking questioning for surprised. God wasn't surprised, rather God was questioning Adam after what he Adam did.

"⁵Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great upon the earth,
and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was altogether evil all the time.
⁶And the LORD regretted that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him in His heart.
⁷So the LORD said, “I will blot out man, whom I have created, from the face of the earth
—every man and beast and crawling creature and bird of the air
—for I am grieved that I have made them.”"
- Genesis 6:5-7

"And also the Glory of Israel will not lie or have regret,
for He is not a man, that He should have regret.”"
- 1 Samuel 15:29

The word translated as regret is the Hebrew word "nacham" and it carries a sense of meaning interpreted as an expression, saying, to be sorry, comfort oneself for something about to do or is going to do. God was in effect sorry that He'll have to blot out man, whom He created with His own very Hands. It is only a cold indifferent person who wouldn't have a sense of sadness, using their own hands to inflict unpleasant or not necessarily nice things upon the creations of their hands.

I remember when growing up in high school, there used to be this teacher, who when he is about to reprimand with a few strokes of the cane, with tongue in cheek and said with audacit, say, before beating, that the beating, is going to hurt him more than it will us.

On the contrary sire, everything is for the benefit of the testee. For the simple fact that God is Omniscient, that He is all knowing, then by implication, there is nothing for God to find out. Everything is for the benefit of the testee, and that is for the record, that the testee prove himself/herself. The testee needs to go through the motions, the process, measures, the et cetera, so to check the quality, performance, reliability of the testee, especially with a single and simple test with the Tree of knowledge of Good and Evil (i.e. TKGE) just before the testee gets rolled out into the widespread world, lmao

You are not getting it. Everything and everyone must be allowed to evolve according to what and/or how their nature is. Ordinarily some are innately good or innately bad, but fact isn't an excuse nor a licence to discriminate and not permit either to come into existence.

It isn't about concerned about anything per se changing, but rather it is about having the fundamental right to come into existence and exist to express yourself according to whatever your nature is. However do express yourself, however you use the freewill gift you have been blessed with, God is able and capable to successfully work round it, so that His purpose, expectation and will are achieved

MuttleyLaff, it is no longer freewill when it has already been known and even predetermined by the divine.

Freewill means it could go in either direction, or something could change. But what your arguement portrays here is that what would be would be, and nothing can change that. All we are doing is roll out the script of destiny and fate, and no amount of freewill can change that, isn't it?

God is simply acting his part of the movie by reacting the exact way he already knew he would react, and we are just playing out our roles as it is in God's foreknowledge. You can't have it both ways at a time, for it becomes a contradiction. You are simply against freewill just like the calvinist but it seems you don't realize it yet.

frank317:


What then is the point of God overseeing his children like a good father would of he will just watch his good daughter get raped and do nothing because he is not ready?

Ooooooh! I just finished having lengthy arguements with you lot since Saturday to Sunday and Always on these Repeating and Repeatory Questions, and I am exhausted. I really do not want to go into lengthy debates now.

But my position will never change and Antichrists like DustReed will never be able to prove His Guilt before me. So I answer you thus.

If you are a father, you would know this, that there is one period of time when you see your children doing wrong one to another but you did not interfere in it, why? Every father knows this answer, we all do it.

There is another time that you are seething and raging in anger, yet you stopped yourself from acting, why? Every father knows that answer too.

And One (I did not say the whole answer) of such answers, is that you are waiting for the wrong doer to either change and remedy his wrongs (which we know he would not do) or to see the FULLNESS OF HIS WICKEDNESS, how far and how long is his Wickedness.

And when the father can't take anymore, (as we say E cup don full), then you know that Great and Terrible Day, when even his wife, mother of the children would not be able to enter to restrain him, Not even his Neighbours and friends will stop the Judgements that will fall on that evil child!

Every father knows this!

Daejoyoung:
MuttleyLaff, it is no longer freewill when it has already been known and even predetermined by the divine.

Freewill means it could go in either direction, or something could change. But what your arguement portrays here is that what would be would be, and nothing can change that. All we are doing is roll out the script of destiny and fate, and no amount of freewill can change that, isn't it?

God is simply acting his part of the movie by reacting the exact way he already knew he would react, and we are just playing out our roles as it is in God's foreknowledge. You can't have it both ways at a time, for it becomes a contradiction. You are simply against freewill just like the calvinist but it seems you don't realize it yet.

Daejoyoung, nwanne, brother, you're trying to say that there is no freewill, and so then implying because of that, human beings can't be held morally responsible for their actions because according to you "que sera, sera" what would be would be, and nothing can change that coming from an argument that all everyone and everything, humans, animals and things are each and all doing is following the lines in a scripted destiny and fate existence.

Daejoyoung:
You are simply against freewill just like the calvinist but it seems you don't realize it yet.

I am not against freewill. My having freewill is part of what sets me apart from an animal, object and/or whatever phenomena you can imagine.

Whether freewill is exercised or not exercised, freewill is intrinsically present in every human being and to be made use of as of from when maturely able to. Adam & Eve were matured enough to put freewill into use, so they did and the rest is history.

Now, please tell Daejoyoung, do you really believe that you don't have freewill?

Eulalia:



Why would you ask me a question meant for God?

Anyways, like my mentor jiggaz said, God didn't want us to be robotic in our worship to Him so He gave us free will to chose whom to follow so people like you and danted will not still come and ask why he created us without giving us free will to operate and how its now forcing people to do his biddings.

Now, every one has a free will to chose life, in God or death in the devil. Remember not everyone that calls Him father is truly worshiping Him. In other words, not everyone going to church is recognized by God. And God can only protect His own. If you know what that means.

Shalom.

Thanks... So if I get u right... The reason why God gave us freewill despite knowing the outcome of the freewill will not be good is because he didn't want us to be like robots and didn't want people like me to come and ask why didn't he give us freewill?

Do u guys actually know what u talk about when u call the name God?

MuttleyLaff:
Daejoyoung, nwanne, brother, you're trying to say that there is no freewill, and so then implying because of that, human beings can't be held morally responsible for their actions because according to you "que sera, sera" what would be would be, and nothing can change that coming from an argument that all everyone and everything, humans, animals and things are each and all doing is following the lines in a scripted destiny and fate existence.

I am not against freewill. My having freewill is part of what sets me apart from an animal, object and/or whatever phenomena you can imagine.

Whether freewill is exercised or not exercised, freewill is intrinsically present in every human being and to be made use of as of from when maturely able to. Adam & Eve were matured enough to put freewill into use, so they did and the rest is history.

Now, please tell Daejoyoung, do you really believe that you don't have freewill?

The simple understanding of the idea of Freewill vs Foreknowledge is Seen and Explained in a Father and Children Relationship.

Every father here has seen and experienced that he is Sometimes Able to Predict and Foresee what his children shall do but Does He interfere? No, he does not!

He watches to see what his children shall do! As was done to Cain and to Sodom and Gomorrah and all over the Bible, even right now!

Why? Every father here knows the answer! Which is to either Bless with more Goodies or whip and Cane dey come or some other plan wey d papa get, but na d papa na Im go get plan. Pikin can NEVER know I'm papa. All E fit do na to dey calculate and speculate and to dey watch I'm papa to see if him fit find I'm papa plan!

cjfbn:

Oga sir,
Thanks for understanding and rephrasing it for me. I might not be too bright. My apologies.
I want to answer your question with a question.
What is the essence of life?
Peace

I will answer ur question.. But I want to be clear... Essence of life for who? For us? GOD? or nature?

For us: our parents have sex like wise theirs and a human is conceived... He finds himself in a world where he tries to survive and be happy then dies one day and he is gone... No one hears about him... That's life u can find ur one essense in the circle I just described.

For God? Well he has not proven himself and has left is with speculations (if he exists) it seems he is having a hard time figuring out why he created the world in the first place.

Nature: I'd say, nature does not give a fuxck

Pls remember to answer my first question, don't derail.

frank317:


Thanks... So if I get u right... The reason why God gave us freewill despite knowing the outcome of the freewill will not be good is because he didn't want us to be like robots and didn't want people like me to come and ask why didn't he give us freewill?

Do u guys actually know what u talk about when u call the name God?

I have answered you up there, I'm awaiting your response if any!

cjfbn:

Believe what you will my brother.
I tell you, you are deluding yourself. The intellect is limited to space and time and will not understand anything beyond space and time.
Peace.

U are like someone who has never been to Ghana, never heard or watched a vedio about what happens in Ghana, but u start telling people things about Ghana and when certain questions are raised about what u say about Ghana u quickly say what ever is in Ghana is beyond us.

If u don't know and accept we will never understand about anything beyond space and time, then let it go and stop telling us meaningless stories about space and time.

frank317:


U are like someone who has never been to Ghana, never heard or watched a vedio about what happens in Ghana, but u start telling people things about Ghana and when certain questions are raised about what u say about Ghana u quickly say what ever is in Ghana is beyond us.

If u don't know and accept we will never understand about anything beyond space and time, then let it go and stop telling us meaningless stories about space and time.

I have answered you

Dtruthspeaker:


Ooooooh! I just finished having lengthy arguements with you lot since Saturday to Sunday and Always on these Repeating and Repeatory Questions, and I am exhausted. I really do not want to go into lengthy debates now.

But my position will never change and Antichrists like DustReed will never be able to prove His Guilt before me. So I answer you thus.

If you are a father, you would know this, that there is one period of time when you see your children doing wrong one to another but you did not interfere in it, why? Every father knows this answer, we all do it.

There is another thing time that you seething and raging in anger, yet you stopped yourself from acting, why? Every father knows the answer.

And One (I did not say the whole answer) of such answers is that you are waiting for the wrong doer to either change and remedy his wrongs (which we know he would not do) or to see the FULLNESS OF HIS WICKEDNESS, how far and how long is his Wickedness.

And when father the father can't take anymore, (as we say E cup don full), then you know that Great and Terrible Day, when even his wife, mother of the children would notbe able to enter to restrain him, Not even his Neighbours and friends will stop the Judgements that will fall on that evil child!

Every father knows this!

A young probably innocent girl has been raped and killed... What else can make God's anger say enough is enough.

I am a father, I cannot watch my neighbour's dog bite my child and still be waiting for when enough is enough.. Guy please.

Dtruthspeaker:
The simple understanding of the idea of Freewill vs Foreknowledge is Seen and Explained in a Father and Children Relationship.

Every father here has seen and experienced that he is Sometimes Able to Predict and Foresee what his children shall do but Does He interfere? No, he does not!

He watches to see what his children shall do! As was done to Cain and to Sodium and Gomorrah and all over the Bible, even right now!

Why? Every father here knows the answer! Which is to either Bless with more Goodies or whip and Cane dey come or some other plan wey d papa get, but na d papa na Im go get plan. Pikin can NEVER know I'm papa. All E fit do na to dey calculate and speculate and to dey watch I'm papa to see if him fit find I'm papa plan!

[img]https://s4/images/orijin-bitters.jpg[/img]
I trust you really weren't addressing this response to me sha but actually was directed at daejoyoung

Whoever you had in mind, still have this chilled bottle of orijin plus a truckload of kolanuts and after, sharp sharp, be next governor of your state of origin.

Right on point on all accounts. Wehdone Sir! Please drink responsibly though.

Dtruthspeaker:


I have answered you up there, I'm awaiting your response if any!

U didn't come close to answering my question.

If I KNOW that giving my child a gun will make him use his freewill to shoot his sister and himself, I will never give him the gun.

Ur God knows freewill will bring a mess to man and the world he still went ahead to give it... He could have done better... Except u are saying the only choice he had was to give man freewill or create man as robot.

Dtruthspeaker:


I have answered you

Thanks.. Go and sleep

MuttleyLaff:
Daejoyoung, nwanne, brother, you're trying to say that there is no freewill, and so then implying because of that, human beings can't be held morally responsible for their actions because according to you "que sera, sera" what would be would be, and nothing can change that coming from an argument that all everyone and everything, humans, animals and things are each and all doing is following the lines in a scripted destiny and fate existence.

I am not against freewill. My having freewill is part of what sets me apart from an animal, object and/or whatever phenomena you can imagine.

Whether freewill is exercised or not exercised, freewill is intrinsically present in every human being and to be made use of as of from when maturely able to. Adam & Eve were matured enough to put freewill into use, so they did and the rest is history.

Now, please tell Daejoyoung, do you really believe that you don't have freewill?

I exercise freewill, but I am arguing from the point of view of God in order to make the Christian arguement consistent. Are you saying God already knows how I would use my freewill? In that sense, you can't say I have freewill even though I use it in this world, but to God it is useless, if he already knows my fate beforehand.

When God created us. He didn't have a predestined destination (hell or heaven) for anyone. He gave us the ability to choose, and that is our problem. Sinning is a choice

Oghenerobo2002:
When God created us. He didn't have a predestined destination (hell or heaven) for anyone. He gave us the ability to choose, and that is our problem. Sinning is a choice

In other words, God didn't know everything that would happen beforehand.

Dtruthspeaker:


The simple understanding of the idea of Freewill vs Foreknowledge is Seen and Explained in a Father and Children Relationship.

Every father here has seen and experienced that he is Sometimes Able to Predict and Foresee what his children shall do but Does He interfere? No, he does not!

He watches to see what his children shall do! As was done to Cain and to Sodium and Gomorrah and all over the Bible, even right now!

Why? Every father here knows the answer! Which is to either Bless with more Goodies or whip and Cane dey come or some other plan wey d papa get, but na d papa na Im go get plan. Pikin can NEVER know I'm papa. All E fit do na to dey calculate and speculate and to dey watch I'm papa to see if him fit find I'm papa plan!

Is God merely predicting how we use our freewill, or he already knew how we would use it even before he created anything?

Daejoyoung:

In other words, God didn't know everything that would happen beforehand.

He does!!