Daejoyoung:

I read hell fire in the bible as utter destruction, it is simply death without the hope of resurrection, and because of this, the body is burnt and not given an elaborate burial as expected in the jewish customs. The fire used to burn the body is compared to that of ghenna( a refuse dump in Jerusalem where the fire is always burning and worms are always there).

The Bible did not really say much about what happens after death.. Ecclessiatics 12 :7 says the spirit returns to God who gave it and the body to the earth where it was taken...

The person who would have given us a good description would have been lazarus.. But nobody deemed it fit to ask him.. And he did not record anything for us.. He just exited the story as much as he Was introduced... The hallmark of a fictional tale...

MuttleyLaff:
"No one can take my life from me. I sacrifice it voluntarily.
For I have the authority to lay it down when I want to and also to take it up again.
For this is what my Father has commanded.”"
- John 10:18

"¹⁹Jesus answered, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up again.”
²⁰“This temple took forty-six years to build,” the Jews replied, “and You are going to raise it up in three days?”
²¹But Jesus was speaking about the temple of His body.
²²After He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this. Then they believed the Scripture and the word that Jesus had spoken."
- John 2:19-22

Offpoint , His death truly in some many ways, is a sacrifice. One of the ways and reasons why it is a sacrifice is that God in spite of His sovereignty came down to earth, became a human being, mingled with human beings et cetera, simply just to achieve a do-it-yourself (i.e. DIY) necessary with a personal touch ring to it and that is evident because He could have done the necessary with a fiat, but He didnt

Your last line caught my attention... God came to earth in form of human or He sent His son?

sonmvayina:


The Bible did not really say much about what happens after death.. Ecclessiatics 12 :7 says the spirit returns to God who gave it and the body to the earth where it was taken...

The person who would have given us a good description would have been lazarus.. But nobody deemed it fit to ask him.. And he did not record anything for us.. He just exited the story as much as he Was introduced... The hallmark of a fictional tale...

Lazarus didn't say anything most likely because he was simply in a deep sleep and there was nothing to say.

Offpoint:
Your last line caught my attention... God came to earth in form of human or He sent His son?

Jesus is God incarnate nah. Dont tell me you're just hearing that.

MuttleyLaff:
Jesus is God incarnate nah. Dont tell me you're just hearing that.

Then explain Matthew 27:46 in your own understanding, who was He talking to here.

And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”

Offpoint:
Then explain Matthew 27:46 in your own understanding, who was He talking to here.

And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”

I would easily and humbly explain Matthew 27:46 or even equally Mark 15:34 too to you, if you will confidently tell me what language is “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” spoken in? Mind you, I'll put my cards open and facing upwards, so you'll see that my curiosity in what language was “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” made in, depending on how you respond, will move on, to me next asking you, who were the target audience's hearing was “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” made for and why, as in meaning, whats the reason for saying “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?”.

I hope I haven't knocked you dazed with any of, how I am coming at you and where I am going with each and/or all of them?

MuttleyLaff:
I would easily and humbly explain Matthew 27:46 or even equally Mark 15:34 too to you, if you will confidently tell me what language is “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” spoken in? Mind you, I'll put my cards open and facing upwards, so you'll see that my curiosity in what language was “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” made in, depending on how you respond, will move on, to me next asking you, who were the target audience's hearing was “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” made for and why, as in meaning, whats the reason for saying “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?”.

I hope I haven't knocked you dazed with any of, how I am coming at you and where I am going with each and/or all of them?

Knock who off bro? Give me an answer to what I asked of you.... What language did Jesus spoke when He was on earth if it wasn't Aramaic Mr man?

sonmvayina:
The Bible did not really say much about what happens after death.. Ecclessiatics 12 :7 says the spirit returns to God who gave it and the body to the earth where it was taken...

The person who would have given us a good description would have been lazarus.. But nobody deemed it fit to ask him.. And he did not record anything for us.. He just exited the story as much as he Was introduced... The hallmark of a fictional tale...

Sheol in an oversimplified or elementary manner can be grave or has been referred as grave

Grave/tomb/sepulchre/cementry sites are merely places of deposit for a corpse. When people die, their souls do not hang about, don't hang around, don't linger in the air. Souls do not stay in limbo. Souls do not haunt a place. Souls do not make revisits. Sheol is the realm of the dead or departed souls. This is where souls end up at.

Until Jesus' teaching in the New Testament, Sheol in general, without necessarily distinguishing between righteous or unrighteous souls, has ordinarily been the realm of the dead or abode of the dead

We have verses in the Old Testament (e.g. Psalm 9:17 et cetera) suggesting that the wicked go to Sheol but it was Jesus in the Bible, the New Testament to be precise, who brought things into perspective when He shared the hyperbolic illustration of Sheol with the story of the Rich Man being elsewhere and Abraham with the Poor Man being on a different side. Now someone like sonmvayina, might in trying to rubbish this might say, nah its a joke, but needs to remember that just because something is a joke, it doesnt necessarily mean the joke is devoid of some element of truth and reality in it, lmao.

Anyway, Sheol (i.e. the original Hebrew concept of afterlife) now has gray lines shared with Gehenna (i.e. the refuse dump in Jerusalem hyperbolically referred to by Jesus in Matthew 5:29 Matthew 18:9 and Mark 9:47) and Hell (i.e. a Greek mythology and Greek concept of afterlife) which arent really understood. The etymology of afterlife from a Jewish concept (i.e. Sheol, with 2 sections) has changed over time and Sheol, since, has being interchangeably replaced with Gehenna and Hell/Hades.

With the above since now brought to fore, no one can again try to say that the Bible did not really say much about what happens after death, when in fact evidence(s) of the bible saying quite a bit has there here just being shown

Daejoyoung:
Lazarus didn't say anything most likely because he was simply in a deep sleep and there was nothing to say.

If Lazarus had stayed more than four days, it'll probably have had something to say about Sheol.

Another explanation, is that there isn't cross consciousness between both realms. The dead have no connection with the land of the living and the vice versa the living with the dead. Once Lazarus was brought back he simply is unable to recollect whatever it is that transpired or happened in Sheol

Offpoint:
Knock who off bro? ...

I didnt say knock anyone off, but what I typed was "I hope I haven't knocked you dazed with any of, how I am coming at you and where I am going with each and/or all of them" meaning the advanced warning of where I'll be heading with the original question I am asking you about what language was "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" said in

Offpoint:
... Give me an answer to what I asked of you.... What language did Jesus spoke when He was on earth if it wasn't Aramaic Mr man?

Thank you for your answer, Mr not a lesser man than I am.

I am glad you have admitted that "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" was spoken fully, totally and completely in Aramaic, that is meaning each and every word in that utterance, "sabachthani" included.

I'll give you an answer. I will answer your question, but not yet, not before we establish a fact or two. I had already hinted you that I'll be very much interested in know from you who you believe, saying “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani" was targeted at and why for the targeted audience's hearing was “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani” said, but at this juncture of you admitting that Aramaic was used entirely in saying “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani", then it is imperative to ask you what is the meaning of “sabachthani" and/or what is “sabachthani" from Aramaic translated to English.

Please judiciously and appropiately respond so we can get some meaningful traction and move on to other aspects.

Every covenant is ushered in with blood to make it binding. God asked Abraham to sacrifice Isaac for a covenant, but ended up using an animal in the bush. God also used the blood of Egyptians to enter a covenant with the children of Israel. Jesus was precious and a supreme being. Coming down to earth to be humiliated and killed by mere mortal was a big sacrifice. Think of the years he spent on earth without his glory, and the pains he went through when he was killed.
I wouldn't go through that to get a range rover!

Offpoint:

Your last line caught my attention... God came to earth in form of human or He sent His son?

Jesus is God

Offpoint:
If he knew, then was his death truly a sacrifice?

Wouldn't anyone whom is asked to destroy his bicycle and promised to be given a latest model car gladly destroy his bicycle?

I need seek answers from highly spirited Christians.

I've been trying to wrapped my head around this for long.
Saying he wasn't aware will defeat the purpose of TRINITY

Righteousness89 you're needed here.

Cc:
Lalasticalala
Dominique

As a mighty spirit being who have always existed, dying for three days (tasting non-existence) is a big challenge but Jesus trusted in JEHOVAH his God and father {John 20:17} the arrangement was for a perfect person to pay for the sin Adam brought upon all his descendants! Psalms 49:7-9

So an angel from heaven will have to be born just like human and lay down his perfect human life to redeem obedient ones amongst Adam's descendants! Daniel 12:1

Jesus died for three days! During those three days he went to a state of non-existence, something he has never experienced right from the time God created him {Proverbs 8:22-31} Jesus' death brought great fear upon demons who have also existed for long that God has the power to send them back to non-existence! 1Peter 3:19

Hoping that his faithful father will bring him back! Hebrew 5:7

When it's time to pay for the price, God retrieved all the spiritual powers that Jesus could use to sustain himself, so he cried out loudly {Mark 15:34} surely it was a great test of FAITH!

So he knew that he is going to die and believe God who created him can bring him back from the dead {Hebrew 11:17-19} that's why Abraham's faith was such remarkable that God made Abraham his friend! James 2:23

Thanks!

MuttleyLaff:
I didnt say knock anyone off, but what I typed was "I hope I haven't knocked you dazed with any of, how I am coming at you and where I am going with each and/or all of them" meaning the advanced warning of where I'll be heading with the original question I am asking you about what language was "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" said in

Thank you for your answer, Mr not a lesser man than I am.

I am glad you have admitted that "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" was spoken fully, totally and completely in Aramaic, that is meaning each and every word in that utterance, "sabachthani" included.

I'll give you an answer. I will answer your question, but not yet, not before we establish a fact or two. I had already hinted you that I'll be very much interested in know from you who you believe, saying “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani" was targeted at and why for the targeted audience's hearing was “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani” said, but at this juncture of you admitting that Aramaic was used entirely in saying “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani", then it is imperative to ask you what is the meaning of “sabachthani" and/or what is “sabachthani" from Aramaic translated to English.

Please judiciously and appropiately respond so we can get some meaningful traction and move on to other aspects.

Lol, you're deviating from my question and leaning towards linguistic.

The word 'sabachthani' is more of Greek transliterated-Aramaic. The original Aramaic word is "shavaktani" which is both translated to "Forsaken me" or "leave me" "Abandoned me"
Mind you, this is not the entirety of the origin of the word and its meaning. I'm not here to talk about linguistic.

Oghenerobo2002:
Every covenant is ushered in with blood to make it binding. God asked Abraham to sacrifice Isaac for a covenant, but ended up using an animal in the bush. God also used the blood of Egyptians to enter a covenant with the children of Israel. Jesus was precious and a supreme being. Coming down to earth to be humiliated and killed by mere mortal was a big sacrifice. Think of the years he spent on earth without his glory, and the pains he went through when he was killed.
I wouldn't go through that to get a range rover!

You're the only one who have said a reasonable thing so far.

Oghenerobo2002:

Jesus is God

If Jesus is God, then who is that that seated at the right hand side of God?

Who did He cried out to on the cross?

Who did He asked to forgive their wrong doing for they know what they are doing?

Offpoint:

If Jesus is God, then who is that that seated at the right hand side of God?

Who did He cried out to on the cross?

Who did He asked to forgive their wrong doing for they know what they are doing?

How did the devil turned into q serpent and deceived Eve?
How did God appear like a burning bush before Moses?
God is not a mortal and all immortal beings have some ability we cannot comprehend at the moment. God has been able to manifest himself in 3 which is the father, son and spirit. Each of this being has its purpose. The spirit lives in us to guide us, the son intercedes on our behalf to the father, God.
In summary, God can appear in any form (human or objects) to achieve an objective

Offpoint:
Lol,

I am dead serious here and not anywhere mucking about

Offpoint:
... you're deviating from my question and leaning towards linguistic.

Far from it I am deviating from your question and leaning towards linguistic, but rather I am corralling us to clinically have your questions correctly and convincingly answered.

Offpoint:
The word 'sabachthani' is more of Greek transliterated-Aramaic. The original Aramaic word is "shavaktani" which is both translated to "Forsaken me" or "leave me" "Abandoned me"

Please show me in the Bible, using verses, where the alleged "... original Aramaic word is "shavaktani" ..." is being used as meaning and/or translated to "Forsaken me" or "leave me" or even "abandoned me"

Offpoint:
Mind you, this is not the entirety of the origin of the word and its meaning. I'm not here to talk about linguistic.

I am not either here to talk about linguistic, just want to get to the bottom of the real meaning and all of "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani" so to then afterwards, get to answering your original question with my focus specially put on "... lama sabachthani"

Oghenerobo2002:

How did the devil turned into q serpent and deceived Eve?
How did God appear like a burning bush before Moses?
God is not a mortal and all immortal beings have some ability we cannot comprehend at the moment. God has been able to manifest himself in 3 which is the father, son and spirit. Each of this being has its purpose. The spirit lives in us to guide us, the son intercedes on our behalf to the father, God.
In summary, God can appear in any form (human or objects) to achieve an objective

There are countless times in the Bible Jesus rebuke those who regarded him as God. He simply let them know His not God, rather He was sent by God.

You simply didn't answer my question....

If you're going the TRINITY way, that's another topic for another day.

Offpoint:


There are countless times in the Bible Jesus rebuke those who regarded him as God. He simply let them know His not God, rather He was sent by God.

You simply didn't answer my question....

If you're going the TRINITY way, that's another topic for another day.

He rebuked them because he don't want to take the glory of God. Like u said, the trinity I not a topic we can just dive into, but there are several mysteries we can't uncover as mortals

MuttleyLaff:
I am dead serious here and not anywhere mucking about

you're deviating from my question and leaning towards linguistic.Far from it I am deviating from your question and leaning towards linguistic, but rather I am corralling us to clinically have your questions correctly and convincingly answered.

The word 'sabachthani' is more of Greek transliterated-Aramaic. The original Aramaic word is "shavaktani" which is both translated to "Forsaken me" or "leave me" "Abandoned me"Please show me in the Bible, using verses, where the alleged "... original Aramaic word is "shavaktani" ..." is being used as meaning and/or translated to "Forsaken me" or "leave me" or even "abandoned me"

Mind you, this is not the entirety of the origin of the word and its meaning. I'm not here to talk about linguistic. I am not either here to talk about linguistic, just want to get to the bottom of the real meaning and all of "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani" so to then afterwards, get to answering your original question with my focus specially put on "... lama sabachthani"

You mean I should show you in the Bible where the original Aramaic word is " shavaktani?
For real?
I clearly let you know it wasn't the entirety of the word translation.

If I ask you to show me in the Bible where the Bible was translated into English language, will you show me any verse(s) or chapter that says so?

Even the verse in Bible stated *Which mean* it never said from which language, but from personal studies you dug out the language which it was translated from.

About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?".

Your question is totally baseless

doubled

doubled

MuttleyLaff:
"Jesus said to them,
“If God were your Father, you would love Me,
for I proceeded forth and came from God;
nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me."
- John 8:42

"Exerchomai" is the Greek original word translated as "proceeded forth". By definition, it means, to go or come out of, with mention of the place out of which one goes, or of the point from which one departs. John 8:42 above, makes no mistake, where from Jesus proceeded forth and came from.

blue\Agent & okosun\ehis, Jesus Christ is God and even god sef, just as I've earlier said and especially if that's how or a way Hairy\rapunzel understands to put it.

No, I am not blue\Agent & okosun\ehis, implying that Jesus and God are the same entity, but I am emphatically saying that Jesus and God are the same entity.

blue\Agent & okosun\ehisit , listen and watch this. I put on different attire colours to reflect my mood and image I am trying to project across. I could put on a red dress to make a statement that I am fiery, vibrant and lively. The colours are not me, they are images reflecting certain aspects of me. It's the same with God, the maleness and femaleness is not God, they are just constructs made in the image of God. God really isnt male nor female

We all know what kind of image one is projecting when wearing black colours, it could be for mourning or for trying to look sexy

The "the only begotten" means the only person uniquely gotten this way. The phrase has nothing to do with God biologically giving birth to Jesus, as a mother, like women do.

blue\Agent & okosun\ehis, God is formless. God is a Spirit, and so has no form. God however does have masculine and feminine distinctive personalities plus characteristics associated with man and woman

Before either of youse step and slip on my "God is formless" banana skin comment, let me make myself clearer with the comment, by adding to it, that God is shapeless and formless like water. When you pour water in a cup, it becomes the cup. When you pour water in a bottle, it becomes the bottle. When you pour water in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. When you pour water into a drum, it becomes the drum of water. That is why when Moses asked God who should he say sent him, if asked by the Israelites, God said to him, say, I AM I AM sent you.

I AM I AM, in that narrative, means I shall be that I shall be, also means whatever it is necessary for God to be, that, God will be. God willl be a pillar of cloud in the day and become a pillar of fire to give them light at night. God is formless, yet God can take on any form. I know it sounds like an oxymoron thing to say it that way, but God, though truly is formless, can manifest Himself in any form, just as in that Nebucadnezzer fiery furnace and etcetera

---

---

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Oghenerobo2002:
Every covenant is ushered in with blood to make it binding. God asked Abraham to sacrifice Isaac for a covenant, but ended up using an animal in the bush. God also used the blood of Egyptians to enter a covenant with the children of Israel. Jesus was precious and a supreme being. Coming down to earth to be humiliated and killed by mere mortal was a big sacrifice. Think of the years he spent on earth without his glory, and the pains he went through when he was killed.
I wouldn't go through that to get a range rover!

Offpoint:
You're the only one who have said a reasonable thing so far.

That is why I stamped my like on the post, lmao

Offpoint:
If Jesus is God, then who is that that seated at the right hand side of God?

Jesus, God, the Son

Offpoint:
Who did He cried out to on the cross?

God, the Father

Offpoint:
Who did He asked to forgive their wrong doing for they know what they are doing?

God, the Father

Oghenerobo2002:

He rebuked them because he don't want to take the glory of God. Like u said, the trinity I not a topic we can just dive into, but there are several mysteries we can't uncover as mortals

How can someone you claimed is GOD doesn't want to take GOD GLORY? His own Glory?

Bro you need to take time and do personal studies, you're contradicting yourself here.

Offpoint:

How can someone you claimed is GOD doesn't want to take GOD GLORY? His own Glory?

Bro you need to take time and do personal studies, you're contradicting yourself here.

I have low ba3. We'll continue later

Oghenerobo2002:
Every covenant is ushered in with blood to make it binding. God asked Abraham to sacrifice Isaac for a covenant, but ended up using an animal in the bush. God also used the blood of Egyptians to enter a covenant with the children of Israel. Jesus was precious and a supreme being. Coming down to earth to be humiliated and killed by mere mortal was a big sacrifice. Think of the years he spent on earth without his glory, and the pains he went through when he was killed.
I wouldn't go through that to get a range rover!

Anyone would do that to become a king and a god forever. I know i would.

Offpoint:
You mean I should show you in the Bible where the original Aramaic word is " shavaktani?
For real?

I clearly let you know it wasn't the entirety of the word translation.

If I ask you to show me in the Bible where the Bible was translated into English language, will you show me any verse(s) or chapter that says so?

Even the verse in Bible stated *Which mean* it never said from which language, but from personal studies you dug out the language which it was translated from.

About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?".

Your question is totally baseless

Look at you with eggs smeared on your face. You are unable to show me in the Bible, using verses, where the alleged "... original Aramaic word is "shavaktani" ..." is being used as meaning and/or translated to "forsaken me" or "leave me" or even "abandoned me" because it does not exist, lmao.

All I asked you was a a simple verification and validation question to show where in the bible, have you verses that translates "shavaktani" to be "Forsaken me" or "leave me" or even "abandoned me" or even vice versa, I don't mind, but instead to say I am sorry , I can't or I am sorry I am unable to, you resort to a "Your question is totally baseless" frustrated outbusrt, lmao

How you managed to equate "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" to meaning "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" is just smh appalling, especially when you are unable to bring forward a single instance in the bible of "... lema sabachthani?" ever used to mean "forsaken me" or "leave me" or even "abandoned me"

You should be thankful that we didnt get to me pulling you up on where in the original text you got the idea of the question mark symbol at the end of "... lema sabachthani?" from, lmao.

At the rate and state you currently are you most likely are going to wallow in your ignorance, continuing to take delight and bask in the glory of your bad learned interpretation of Matthew 27:46 and even equally Mark 15:34.

Daejoyoung:

Lazarus didn't say anything most likely because he was simply in a deep sleep and there was nothing to say.

Is that not what God says death is.... A deep sleep..
Death is like a night between two days, and life is like a day between two nights...

sonmvayina:


Is that not what God says death is.... A deep sleep..
Death is like a night between two days, and life is like a day between two nights...

He also emphasized the resurrection out of that deep sleep,remember he said that the dead in Christ Shall rise first.
We cant meet God in our mortal bodies but our soul goes back to its creator and then this flesh is silenced forever because it is from the dust.

Offpoint:
There are countless times in the Bible Jesus rebuke those who regarded him as God. He simply let them know His not God, rather He was sent by God.

You simply didn't answer my question....

Big fat lie. Here you come with making an outlandish statement you can't substantiate. If you are sure you aren't telling porkies, like you did with that "... lema sabachthani?" alleging it to mean "forsaken me" or "leave me" or even "abandoned me" then show where in the scripture, Jesus rebuked those who regarded Him as God.

Provide the bible verses, where Jesus ever told anyone off for perceiving Him or calling Him God.

Offpoint:
... If you're going the TRINITY way, that's another topic for another day.

Going the TRINITY way, is just a red herring and shouldn't be any another topic for any another day. God might have revealed Himself to us in terms of trinity, God however is INFINITY and not limited to TRINITY.

Offpoint:


There are countless times in the Bible Jesus rebuke those who regarded him as God. He simply let them know His not God, rather He was sent by God.

You simply didn't answer my question....

If you're going the TRINITY way, that's another topic for another day.

You are a liar

Acehart:


You are a liar

Mr liar what did Jesus meant by... "why do you call me good? No one is good EXCEPT GOD?

In Mark 10:18...

Get back to me with what you understand about this statement " No one is good EXCEPT GOD"