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Self-taught Programmers / How Did You Land You First Job As A Self-taught Developer? / Why Self Taught Programmers Over “Exaggerate”. (2) (3) (4)

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Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by IamGoke(m): 1:51pm On Jun 28, 2020
Corporate2020:
Very interesting topic. I have a Masters degree in Computer Science. I also have Oracle and Microsoft DB Certifications.

I was working in one particular bank like that. I was in Database department. I had a senior in DB dept. then. He studied Mechanical Engr. but became a Database Admin. On one occasion when the system was very slow, the Database response was sluggish. Users across our about 500 branches were complaining bitterly. Then, I told my Senior DB Officer to let us increase the Memory of our IBM Server which housed the Database as a temporary measure while we investigate further. Funnily, he did not know what that will do. He did not know what increasing the Memory of the IBM Server will do to the problem at hand. This is because he does not have knowledge of basic computer architecture. He did not know that Memory capacity, Processor speed and some other factors determine the performance of the Server and the softwares running on the Server.

On some occasions when our Oracle Databse behaves crazily, then our Head of IT comes screaming, I just tell him the problem is from the hardware which is the IBM Server, that it is the Server that is behaving crazy. The Head of IT will run to Server dept and harras the guys there. The guys in our Server dept all studied Elect/Elect Engr. So, they too do not have a proper understanding of computer architecture. You cannot say that they are not qualified because banks employ the very best hands into specialized departments. So, when I send the Head of IT on an errand to Server dept, I and my Senior DB Officer will have time to investigate the problem at hand and solve it.

It got to a time, the Head of IT merged Database dept and Server dept because I was always pushing crazy problems to Server dept which the Servers guys will not understand. So, it became Databse and Server dept. So, we were brought to the same room, five of us then. So, any problem, we solve it together, no pushing of problems to other depts. I started learning about Server Administration while the Server guys too started learning Database so that we could stand in for each other.

Programmers in Software dept too who were formerly pushing their problems to Server Dept whenever their Software was running slowly could not do that again because I would sit down with them, analyse the problem and tell them why it is their Software that is sluggish and needs to be optimised and not the Server.

I have some other funny and crazy experiences in other bank and a telecoms company, but they are very specific and the people involve may be reading this, so I will just continue remembering them and laughing at professional gate crashers who jump into professions and start boasting.

In summary, the self-taught programmers that think they know all about computing and that studying Computer Science is waste of time, they are still working on small projects, when they handle big projects, then they will know that Alli Baba is not at the same level with Funny Bone.

I don't see reason why an Elect/Elect engineer can't fix server side problems which is part of there basic course in school!

You can school me more on this.

I believe in whatever you do, seeking for more knowledge to be highly skilled and proficient is very vital in your field of expertise. We should learn how to identify and distinguish incompetent from wrong course of study.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by ernieboy(m): 1:54pm On Jun 28, 2020
stanliwise:
web dev are people which are in the business of creating new technologies for web. End coder are frontend are backend.
Contributors are language designers, library’s designers.
Idea developer are people who contribute new web techniques to web word e.g Gang of Four

Should I go on?

Yet web dev is a sub sub of CSC.
a.coder or programmer is much more than a web developer, coding also encompasses areas such as desktop programming, embedded programming, console programming etc but a lot of u are using web dev and coding interchangeably like it is the entirety of coding.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by ernieboy(m): 1:59pm On Jun 28, 2020
tollyboy5:

That's what I'm trying to tell them o! I've been working on generating pure sine wave from a PIC micro controller and I want to integrate the system with esp so that I can control it from all over the world so I have to write server side code. So should I call my self an embedded programmer or a web developer? When im studying physics
thanls, u grasps what I am saying, a coder is programmer, often time he/she will specialist on an aspect of programming and web development is just one aspect or area u can specialise on

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 2:04pm On Jun 28, 2020
SegFault:

There is nothing wrong in being self taught, I am tutoring myself in multiple cs courses like OS development, Internet architecture, linear algebra, physics (for the sake of gameplay programming) and System Architecture (this is very good for programmers and CS students in order to spit out code that makes optimising compilers look like dumbos). I want to also continue on Calculus (edx tutors make this stuff seem like cake, shame on Nigerian lecturers and teachers) and some others. It just depends on how you see yourself, some see it as some stupid achievement that makes them smart like Tesla while I see it as a necessity. Even college students should do it.

True.

But you are an exception. The reality is that the Nigerian educational system hardly allows for in-depth perfection of the craft while balancing theories (and succeeding academically). Matter of fact, most Lecturers are theory heads(Not bad, but limiting).

Again in the industry in Nigeria, there's little funding/encouragement for long term thinking and investment in advanced Compute technologies.

I am totally against pride & Prestige (from the self taught Community) but for those underestimating the self taught, The question to them is, Were the individual(s) who drew up the First Engineering Syllabus Engineers?

Education and Standardization of Knowledge with Certifications is to establish base level knowledge. Those who are extremely talented in aptitude don't have to "go to school" beyond a certain level. They make their path.

4 Likes

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 2:08pm On Jun 28, 2020
ayoola27:


pls is the jetbrains working in ur browser...

I tried following up the lesson but it keeps telling me I'm offline...

I'm using operamini

Try Runestonecademy. It's an interactive, textbookstyle programming course.
https://runestone.academy/runestone/default/user/login?_next=/runestone/default/index
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 2:13pm On Jun 28, 2020
techmo:
To programme is a different thing, and to design a software is a very complex thing that you learn through C.S

I laugh at dunce who learnt a programming language and felt they have arrived lol, Computer scientists write the so called programming language for you and it's compilers, they write low level programmes , machine language and programme most appliances software


.

You are mostly right.
However, the question then becomes, Were the Individual (s) who developed the Original foundations of what is the Current Computer Science Syllabus themselves Computer Scientists?

If they were, It's hard to say that there wasn't a Large element of Heuristics involved.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Corporate2020: 2:17pm On Jun 28, 2020
IamGoke:


I don't see reason why an Elect/Elect engineer can't fix server side problems which is part of there basic course in school!

You can school me more on this.

I believe in whatever you do, seeking for more knowledge to be highly skilled and proficient is very vital in your field of expertise. We should learn how to identify and distinguish incompetent from wrong course of study.

Elect/Elect Engrs definitely can fixed Server hardware problems, but maintaining IBM Servers running AIX, Red Hat Linus, Storage O.S. NAS and SAN Storages, e.t.c. is more than just electronics knowledge.

2 Likes

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 2:19pm On Jun 28, 2020
crownedrookie:
I'm self taught and recognize the need to get a CS degree. Planning to, even discussed it with my boss and he gave me some good options for it. Has to be from abroad though, I'd rather do a memory wipe and learn again than get a Nigerian CS degree.
For now any one with knowledge of where I can find a structured playlist of CS classes from reputable institutions on YouTube should do well to let me know.
Searches like UC Berkeley Webcast and CS 10 - The Beauty and Joy of Computing give answers but rather scattered and random

Do you already have a BSc.
If you do an in a quantitative field you could go for an Informatics degree (MSc.) In Europe.

Otherwise Western Governor University has an Online Computer Science Degree Programme .

It's quite expensive though.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by stanliwise(m): 2:21pm On Jun 28, 2020
ernieboy:
a.coder or programmer is much more than a web developer, coding also encompasses areas such as desktop programming, embedded programming, console programming etc but a lot of u are using web dev and coding interchangeably like it is the entirety of coding.
were we not talking about web? And for your info coders are not more than web they only have an overlapped. Web dev is far more than coding.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Nobody: 2:22pm On Jun 28, 2020
Asour:


Do you already have a BSc.
If you do an in a quantitative field you could go for an Informatics degree (MSc.) In Europe.

Otherwise Western Governor University has an Online Computer Science Degree Programme .

It's quite expensive though.
I mean to stay in Nigeria for at least the next 3-5 years bettering my craft.
The online degree programme is what my boss suggested and the company will be footing the bill that has already been discussed.
I was asking for a structured YouTube CS playlist I can be using for now
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 2:25pm On Jun 28, 2020
golddare:



I think you should also look at why the CS major student are not making "waves" so that the road side guys can feel inferior or close their mouth.

Answer is "jack of all trade master of none" . You will observe that you were taught every bit of everything during undergraduate, you major in one aspect during postgraduate and so on. However, the road side guy had major in that tiny aspect for the 6-7years you have spent trying to know everything. You will agree with me you cant beat him or her in that tiny field and the only way to beat them is take them round all your courses but who cares.
I did MSSC 2006 at NIIT and was shocked the guru asked us to go and meet those road side guys if we actually want to be very good. This is the same reason a Prof in Mech Engine cannot stand the a good road side mechanic. It's not pride, they are good and it's the law of specialization but they dont have the right to disparage the CS major students and I will encourage any CS students to start going to the road side guys right from 100L to begin their journey into specialization, dont wait till PhD, in the world of CS school can be overrated.

Your take on Specialization is spot on. Totally agree. There's only so much the human mind is capable of excelling in at once.

However, you don't have to go to the "Road Side" guys for anything.

Inaccessibility to information made us to believe so but not anymore.

There are books /Videos and Courses on probably any Practical Technology under the sun on the internet today.

You just need the time /focus and motivation to scour and read/understand them. Forums too.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by olioxx(m): 2:25pm On Jun 28, 2020
Shepherdd:


Getting a cs degree for a back end development career might not be an overkill.

Back end development at major companies like FANG requires a solid understanding of Data structures and Algorithm, a good understanding of how the language you are using for the development and the hardware relates, knowing the inner workings of the hardware, and how computers work overall.

For example Google had to create their own programming language because the existing ones had some issues i.e Python is too slow, Java is verbose, C++ compiles like a snail in addition to the fact that you have to do memory management etc.

Imagine one million requests hitting your server at once in need of a database or file write operation? A cs graduate knows about how operating systems works and how to do efficient concurrency and maximizing the usefulness of the hardware, a boot camp graduate might not even be aware of process forking.

Methods like bit shifting to store user permissions are easy hacks for CS graduates while a boot camper might not even be aware of the roles of the binary system in computing.

Finally boasting about knowing more than CS graduates is just a show of ignorance. Yes you can, but my friend before you can reach that stage you would have studied a lot alone, and when you are done you would realize that a CS degree might even be the shortcut.
.
Very VERY good write up.
Most people fail to realise that the theory you learn during your Computer Science class goes a long way in furnishing your competency. I am still a CS student and I'm proud of that and I know it is not a waste of time.
You can never compare a CS student to someone who went to a bootcamp. They just dont compare. And to those Self taught coders that exaggerate and that think they are far better than CS student, OYO is your case. A lot of master invention are product birthed by CS students themselve. CS student establish the engine/core while self taught developer build on the engine. Your knowledge of some CS stuff along the years will make you a better programmer in any field of your choice.
Rob Pike co-creator of Go, UTF-8 was a CS student.
Dennis Ritchie co-creator C prog lang, co-creator of UNIX OS, co-creator of B prog lang was a CS student.
Ken Thompson creator of B programming lang,co-creator C prog lang, co-creator of Go, co-creator of UTF-8 was a CS student he is known for UNIX OS that is one of the foundation of modern computing.
Sergery Brin co-founder of Google and X was a CS student.
.
To every self-taught developer(that might think CS studying is a waste of time and effort), I want us play to a little game.
* Explain the internal workings of a compiler, and the possible phases a compiler can have.

* Explain briefly the Architecture of the CLR (Common Language Runtime), JIT(Just In Time) Compilation.
* What three core operation does a basic compiler work with.
* Write a simple Fibonacci series algorithm, where it will print out the series to the 20th term and where you can specify the nth term you desire.
* Write a simple algorithm that can give out the ASCII values you inputted
* Find the 2's complement of 11111000, 11001010, 6A3D, E9F
* As related to x86 architecture find the bit and hexadecimal of the following IP address 127.0.0.1, 956.56.0.0(use little endianess) .
* Briefly explain the internal working of cdecl, fastcall, stdcall. And which does Windows use for callng DLLs and APIs
* List out the possible components that enables Win32 API to access the Kernel Mode of a basics Windows NT Operating system, Briefly explain Native API as related to Windows OS.
.
Note this is for FUN.

2 Likes

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by stanliwise(m): 2:30pm On Jun 28, 2020
Crvrider:


When you do statistical analysis and the numbers seems to be in favour of one outcome over the other(s) you can safely predict based on the outcome of the highest frequency. Hence the reason most of us argued in favour of "people studied computer science solely to become programmers". This however is irrespective of the diverse discipline you could branch into with regards cs. In all honesty if you where aaked what the motivating factor was for you studying cs, what will the answer be?

Most likely programming.

We based our argument on numbers and not the diverse discipline of cs.
be it motivating or not. Computing science is not programming. You heard it clearly from me. Infact at some point you get with CSC. You don’t write any code. It is a misinformation to assume that programming is something core to CSC. Real computer scientist don’t spend most of their time writing code. They spend it majorly on computing data. Anyone writes code and programs. Computational Science core is not coding. Awkwardly it is difficult to see a computer scientist that can’t code. This is because most of the brilliant idea are useful when it works on a software and serve people but the brilliant idea was before the coding.

2 Likes

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by olioxx(m): 2:30pm On Jun 28, 2020
techmo:
To programme is a different thing, and to design a software is a very complex thing that you learn through C.S

I laugh at dunce who learnt a programming language and felt they have arrived lol, Computer scientists write the so called programming language for you and it's compilers, they write low level programmes , machine language and programme most appliances software


.
..
Nice writeup.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 2:34pm On Jun 28, 2020
crownedrookie:

I mean to stay in Nigeria for at least the next 3-5 years bettering my craft.
The online degree programme is what my boss suggested and the company will be footing the bill that has already been discussed.
I was asking for a structured YouTube CS playlist I can be using for now

Better go the Edx route.

YouTubers typically have their Niches.
Since CS syllabus is a Nexus between Maths, Statistics and a Plethora of Problem solving techniques for Computing you are better served by Edx which was developed by some universities themselves.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by onegig(m): 2:34pm On Jun 28, 2020
jackyraw09:
[font=Lucida Sans Unicode][/font]

I beg to differ, i am computer science graduate my
And I think the university education system in Nigerian has a way of numbing down the minds of aspiring computer scientists with just theory upon theory and little to no practical.

What separates the self taught guys how ever is that they are mostly practical and learn by doing as opposed to just cramming stuff.

I didn’t study abroad so I wouldn’t know how it is over there but from my own experience of computer science I’d say NIGERIAn education system doesn’t do much justice to the field in terms of what u gain after 4 years in the university.


It isn't that different overseas.. Just that they have more course work in terms of practical classes and much more streamlined course content. You can't do a broad CS in most Universities overseas. It has to be a key area, Web development, Multimedia, Information systems or of recent cyber security or security systems. This gives you a much more narrow range in terms of expertise instead of doing everything from Fortran to Laplace transforms.

CS is extremely wide and the way we teach in Nigeria is just where the trouble is . It needs to be unbundled to individual course content before students can appreciate it better. I redid a course last year which was targeted at 1st year students of computer science in the UK and difference in what i learnt was way advanced and useful than all i did in 100level to 200level here. In Nigeria we were bogged down with Plant biology, Physics and chemistry and i did only 2 CS courses in 100level here which was grossly inadequate.

Most of what i know now were leveraging what was taught and going further to seek more but you can't discard the basis it gives you. There is a clarity of purpose when you really studied CS. Why we think someone learning programming is much more better is because we don't use IT that deep. If you worked on embedded systems and you start understanding how low level machines react to every bit of code you wouldn't discard your understanding of Machine Language you learnt in CS and this can apply to everything from arrays to pointers.

5 Likes

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by jelel6: 3:02pm On Jun 28, 2020
Oops!!! I almost didn't see this interesting discuss. This can be a potentially long post... wink

A lot of interesting things have been said by those arguing for both sides. I think some of the disagreements are not really present or necessary as it has to do with 'semantics'. I don't think or see these things as a 'better than' or 'more than' argument. Hence, a Computer science knowledge will come in handy for many situations and circumstances likewise a 'self taught' will work for other situations or circumstances.

Now, computer science is synonymous with Information and communications technology (ICT) in many ways. The internet, is the fastest growing sphere in the modern world. So many of our lives as it is, is shaped as technology dictates. Now, I think it's foolhardy to believe a 4 year study in "Any" University, will make you an authority in every and any specialty under ICT

Computer science can be theoretical and very practical at the same time. Technology is where theories meet practice. Most of the things and techniques being taught in many schools, including the USA and Europe, does not prepare the CS grad for live in the Industry. Before, you come for me, take a minute and read similar opinions of Industry leaders on platforms like Medium and Quora.

Besides, how can a 4 year school curriculum encompass the fast-paced Internet/technology world as we have today? They don't teach or focus enough on an area to be of any 'specific' value to a company 'fresh out of school'. They'll still need to learn 90% of what they'll need to be ready to contribute to a company out of school or 'on the job!' That's how it is happening in the western world. And many CS grads are usually honest to say so themselves.

We can't all have a CS certificate. But we can all have the Knowledge. Free of charge. The major difference between how a CS students uses that knowledge during their stay in school is strikingly different from how a company NEEDS an employee to utilize that knowledge. You only need to know enough to get the job done, when the need arises. And not be a theorist for many years without knowing when or if there'll ever be a real life use cases for all that knowledge. That's just the system, not an attack on the CS persons. Just that with so many things to learn, studying so many things you may not ever use (highly likely in software/tech) doesn't seem like the best use of time.

4 Likes

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by selfdefence: 3:20pm On Jun 28, 2020
I think the whole idea is not just looking down on someone studying the course but challenging themselves that irrespective of whether they attended the degree course in University or not they can do much with what they learned outside school, it's just like me wondering why someone would stress themselves going to the banking hall for a transaction knowing fully well I could comfortably carry out any transactions from the comfort of my home by dailing *737# on my phone.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Grandlord: 3:21pm On Jun 28, 2020
stanliwise:

I already said you can learn computation outside school in my previous post.

Computation means the ability to be able use mathematical evaluation and critical thinking to work on data so as to reduce workload of searching on data, storing data, transferring data, operate on data. For example to search if a string is in a large amount of text. Anyone could simple write a code to find the string one by one but a computing scientist would find a mathematical evaluation method to ensure he finds it in the simplest possible time. In reality situation could have a lot of constrain ranging from small amount of memory to large (and concurrent access to data in a short time frame. A computing scientist job is to ensure how to find the best possible means to save company resources and yet make the service available.

Like you said someone coded an OS. It need extensive knowledge of computation to do that but anyone can do it. But a computing scientist would think so hard to optimize the system in such a way that it would work in best situations interms of speed and constrain to hardware.
Microsoft and Linux used hands of thousand computing scientist (not programmers) for ideas to reduce computation complexity.

Computation parent is mathematics.

Mathematics on data = computing science.

Although computing science field has broaden so much now and it has been coupled with some form of engineering, System Analysis and Human/machine Interaction and intelligence(AI), Graphics.

You will recognize I use the word “computing science ” rather than “computer science”. This is the accurate terminology.
Damn! You just made the whole concept of data structures and algo clearer to me. A thousand thanks.

Do you have more to add? Any learning resources you might recommend? cool

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by olioxx(m): 3:31pm On Jun 28, 2020
Asour:


True.

But you are an exception. The reality is that the Nigerian educational system hardly allows for in-depth perfection of the craft while balancing theories (and succeeding academically). Matter of fact, most Lecturers are theory heads(Not bad, but limiting).

Again in the industry in Nigeria, there's little funding/encouragement for long term thinking and investment in advanced Compute technologies.

I am totally against pride & Prestige (from the self taught Community) but for those underestimating the self taught, The question to them is, Were the individual(s) who drew up the First Engineering Syllabus Engineers?

Education and Standardization of Certification is to establish base level knowledge. Those who are extremely talented in aptitude don't have to "go to school" beyond a certain level. They make their path.


I want to believe you were joking asking that question. But if you weren't joking by that asking that question, then I'm speechless.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Grandlord: 3:43pm On Jun 28, 2020
avalon7:


In that case difference between a CS graduate and a self taught programmer are only paramount in big companies in developed countries i.e FANG... Who dey develope new OS for Africa kwanu?
cheesy grin
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by techstack: 3:45pm On Jun 28, 2020
ProfAmaben:

You guessed right wink. Backend is cool too but Frontend these days aren't frontend but more like an hybrid. Well done, what's your stack? MERN, knex, faker?

Yes, MongoDB, Express, React and Node.js
C# at work and Nodejs for private projects

But lately have been using Nestjs. NestJs is Typescript written on top Expressjs by default. you can change it to Fastify.
Nestjs has the same architecture as Angular.

I always get someone to do the frontend on the personal projects while I focus on the backend, unless at work when I have to do asp.net MVC

If you are cool with Nestjs I can let you in on a project. We have a team already. we are looking for more hands for the next phase

https://www.nairaland.com/5948132/anyone-here-used-nestjs-whats
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Asour: 3:46pm On Jun 28, 2020
olioxx:


I want to believe you were joking asking that question. But if you weren't joking by that asking that question, then I'm speechless.

I certainly wasn't.

Hans Leibherr wasn't an Engineer. The tenacity/Craftsmanship he's demonstrated (even though his Companies now employ Engineers) predates his Engineering "Qualifications".
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Nobody: 3:54pm On Jun 28, 2020
I've been wondering ; what would be the best way to learn programming for a beginner ? .
option 1 : just pick up some books and videos on a particular aspect and build lots of projects
e.g : Learn python the hard way
Option 2 : start by learning the basics of programming in a particular language by using MOOC's .
E.g : introduction to programming in Python.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by ProfAmaben(m): 4:22pm On Jun 28, 2020
techstack:


Yes, MongoDB, Express, React and Node.js
C# at work and Nodejs for private projects

But lately have been using Nestjs. NestJs is Typescript written on top Expressjs by default. you can change it to Fastify.
Nestjs has the same architecture as Angular.

I always get someone to do the frontend on the personal projects while I focus on the backend, unless at work when I have to do asp.net MVC

If you are cool with Nestjs I can let you in on a project. We have a team already. we are looking for more hands for the next phase

https://www.nairaland.com/5948132/anyone-here-used-nestjs-whats
You have a robust portfolio, it exhudes hardwork and determination. On your question, I am open to projects but this Typescript was the reason I ditched Angular for REACT. I prefer JSX in REACT due to its HTML and JavaScript hybrid platform. If you can give me details on the project, I can sacrifice a weekend to do a Nest.js crash course.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Daejoyoung: 4:26pm On Jun 28, 2020
ARCHEMEDESME:
I've been wondering ; what would be the best way to learn programming for a beginner ? .
option 1 : just pick up some books and videos on a particular aspect and build lots of projects
e.g : Learn python the hard way
Option 2 : start by learning the basics of programming in a particular language by using MOOC's .
E.g : introduction to programming in Python.
Learn the basics first, but don't spend time on the basics then immediately go to option 1, then go back to the basics, then go to option 1 again.
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Ayo081(m): 4:47pm On Jun 28, 2020
OP focus, eevery programmer is self-taught
Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by felixawe(m): 5:00pm On Jun 28, 2020
ARCHEMEDESME:
I've noticed a certain trend ; a lot of self taught

But that doesn't change the fact that some CS majors know nothing , I've come across some CS majors that can't code but that doesn't make a cs degree worthless.
But do you think such people are right ?

Computer science is very broad, depending on the area u are most skill... No one can exhaust CS. In Nigeria, most CS student don't know web development & design & programming & ordinary graphic design. I discovered, they where mainly taught mathematics & to have a certificate.
No one knows all in computer Science.
It saddens me when I see some CS fellow graduates who doesn't have a pc .

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by golddare: 5:06pm On Jun 28, 2020
Asour:


Your take on Specialization is spot on. Totally agree. There's only so much the human mind is capable of excelling in at once.

However, you don't have to go to the "Road Side" guys for anything.

Inaccessibility to information made us to believe so but not anymore.

There are books /Videos and Courses on probably any Practical Technology under the sun on the internet today.

You just need the time /focus and motivation to sclour and read/understand them. Forums too.

Yes you are right everything is on the internet but unfortunately that was over 14years ago, internet was still a luxury then, we were still queuing at the cafe and sometimes doing overnight so has to have enough time.

I think it's just a principle of life, just like the law of comparative advantage in economics, every individual needs to focus on where you think you are good, be excellent in it and you will definitely be successful.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Shepherdd(m): 6:19pm On Jun 28, 2020
shadeyinka:

The issue is that a vast majority of CS graduates are completely useless when it comes to problem solving and practicals except those who develop themself outside the Nigerian school curriculum.

One expects to see CS graduates making waves in solution provision but alas, self taught (including self taught CS graduates) are the king.

CS curriculum is too abstract and useless for now in Nigeria. It is one thing to understand data structures and OS, it is completely another thing to know how to IMPLEMENT the theories


Cc: Corporate2020
You have good points. It's an open secret that the education system is broken. But the thing is other countries also produces theoretical CS graduates even though they have better curriculum, teaching materials and better labs(not talking about laboratory here) but they mitigate the issue by one single factor which is quality internship.

Imagine a CS student in US looking for internship, he has companies like Intel, Nvidia e.t.c to apply if he is into cpus, or if he is into CNS Cisco and co are there, if he wants system engineering or programming then Google, Amazon, Microsoft are there e.t.c. All major countries provides quality internship to undergraduates but that's not the case in Nigeria and that's why I think we have self taught computer scientist graduates in Nigeria.

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Re: Why Do Self Taught Programmers Over Exaggerate by Shepherdd(m): 6:39pm On Jun 28, 2020
olioxx:

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Very VERY good write up.
Most people fail to realise that the theory you learn during your Computer Science class goes a long way in furnishing your competency. I am still a CS student and I'm proud of that and I know it is not a waste of time.
You can never compare a CS student to someone who went to a bootcamp. They just dont compare. And to those Self taught coders that exaggerate and that think they are far better than CS student, OYO is your case. A lot of master invention are product birthed by CS students themselve. CS student establish the engine/core while self taught developer build on the engine. Your knowledge of some CS stuff along the years will make you a better programmer in any field of your choice.
Rob Pike co-creator of Go, UTF-8 was a CS student.
Dennis Ritchie co-creator C prog lang, co-creator of UNIX OS, co-creator of B prog lang was a CS student.
Ken Thompson creator of B programming lang,co-creator C prog lang, co-creator of Go, co-creator of UTF-8 was a CS student he is known for UNIX OS that is one of the foundation of modern computing.
Sergery Brin co-founder of Google and X was a CS student.
.
To every self-taught developer(that might think CS studying is a waste of time and effort), I want us play to a little game.
* Explain the internal workings of a compiler, and the possible phases a compiler can have.

* Explain briefly the Architecture of the CLR (Common Language Runtime), JIT(Just In Time) Compilation.
* What three core operation does a basic compiler work with.
* Write a simple Fibonacci series algorithm, where it will print out the series to the 20th term and where you can specify the nth term you desire.
* Write a simple algorithm that can give out the ASCII values you inputted
* Find the 2's complement of 11111000, 11001010, 6A3D, E9F
* As related to x86 architecture find the bit and hexadecimal of the following IP address 127.0.0.1, 956.56.0.0(use little endianess) .
* Briefly explain the internal working of cdecl, fastcall, stdcall. And which does Windows use for callng DLLs and APIs
* List out the possible components that enables Win32 API to access the Kernel Mode of a basics Windows NT Operating system, Briefly explain Native API as related to Windows OS.
.
Note this is for FUN.

cheesy cheesy cheesy what a show off. grin grin grin abeg no kill us please.

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