LordReed:


Read my post again maybe it will finally make sense to you.

What then happens after discussing the merits and demerits of Islam for instance?

Let me put my mat here and start drinking my palm wine

LordReed:


In other words you cannot objectively show that religion brings more evil than good, therefore your statement is a subjective one and should be stated as such.

I think I agree with what hellvictorinho is saying. Religion makes rational people do stupid things. (Yes! We have good religious people, but most evil are done on the name of religion and there’s enough empirical evidence)

hakeem4:
I think I agree with what hellvictorinho is saying. Religion makes rational people do stupid things. (Yes! We have good religious people, but most evil are done on the name of religion and there’s enough empirical evidence)

Love makes rational people do stupid things, is love evil?

gensteejay:

What then happens after discussing the merits and demerits of Islam for instance?

I don't know, maybe we gain more insight into Islam?

LordReed:


I don't know, maybe we gain more insight into Islam?

Slavery is not my favorite subject to discuss (Muslims call themselves slaves of Allah as Qur'an commands).

gensteejay:

Slavery is not my favorite subject to discuss (Muslims call themselves slaves of Allah as Qur'an commands).

LoL!

LordReed:


Love makes rational people do stupid things, is love evil?

Maybe he is referring to how some poor people give offerings and tithes in the name of religion thereby staying poor.
Or how religion causes differences among people which causes them to attack or despise or detest or maltreat one another.

..

gensteejay:

Slavery is not my favorite subject to discuss (Muslims call themselves slaves of Allah as Qur'an commands).

Back when I'd call myself a believer, I'd always replace the word slave with servant, because it made me uncomfortable. Lol..
Not like it made a difference.

LordReed:


Love makes rational people do stupid things, is love evil?

No! Love isn’t evil.

Love is a feeling, while religion is faith based.

Love does not have any doctrine, religion has both doctrines and dogmas.

That’s why no sensible person can say “atheism” is the cause of most pogrom, because it doesn’t have any tenets or dogmatic doctrine.

I don’t need to give you examples of evils caused by religion in Nigeria. I can give you more example

The belfast riot, 9/11, ustache massacre. I can go on if you want me to.

In love there is no authority (by authority I mean someone who gives command to those in love). In religion we have authorities such as imam, pope, pastor etc and these people can give commands to cause evil and mayhem based on their doctrines

LordReed:


I imagine the question is best answered by the religious, me I am wearing my objective observer hat.

You surely know how to retreat.

Dollywood:


You surely know how to retreat.

You are funny. What am I retreating from?

hakeem4:
No! Love isn’t evil.

Love is a feeling, while religion is faith based.

Love does not have any doctrine, religion has both doctrines and dogmas.

That’s why no sensible person can say “atheism” is the cause of most pogrom, because it doesn’t have any tenets or dogmatic doctrine.

I don’t need to give you examples of evils caused by religion in Nigeria. I can give you more example

The belfast riot, 9/11, ustache massacre. I can go on if you want me to.

In love there is no authority (by authority I mean someone who gives command to those in love). In religion we have authorities such as imam, pope, pastor etc and these people can give commands to cause evil and mayhem based on their doctrines

Who gave orders to the military to shoot protesters? An authority. Does that make the military evil?

LordReed:


I don't know if I would consider myself a freethinker but I certainly am not religious. What makes you think I have changed? BTW I imagine a freethinker would celebrate my challenge, it's a call to critical reasoning. Should we simply condemn religion because we find it distasteful or should we be free to discuss its merits and demerits?

We condemn religion because it does not bring any merits but only demerits, the religion be thought will bring peace and love, brought hatred and crime, look at Nigeria and other countries with at 70% of the population are religious, you will notice the high crime rate, and the criminals are either a Christian or a Muslim, look at Norway and China, for instance, they don't practice any religion but look how peaceful and progressive their country is.

We don't need to know what is wrong and right, and religion ain't the gateway to success either, but these Nigerians make it seem like if you're not religious you will either die by some sort of spiritual attack or something.


Religion doesn't even bring development to the country all you see are grown-ass men praying and wishing for their imaginary friend or angel to fix the problem of their country.



Religious people are mentality enslaved and trapped with fear, especially those Jargons I hear at Church and fake miracles when they preach about "Spiritual husband and wife, demons and witchcraft, curses from my father or mother house" all those bullcrap will be used as their prayer point in churches, the average Christian will be scared to death if he forfeits or renounces his belief thinking those spiritual attack will hunt him down and kill him because he longer has the imaginary friend as his lord and savior anymore.

Everything is false, fake, illusional, there's nothing like witchcrafts or demons.

gensteejay:

Yea, location matters.

About saying one's views about God or religion to one's boss, I said that because I know some atheists or irreligionists are/were known publicly in the past (or present).

And some Nigerians are the ones that actually spread the news not the person in question specifically.

When I left religion between 2017—18, I realized how difficult it's to live in Nigeria as a freethinker/atheist when one's stance about religion/God is known publicly.

I wonder how Wole Soyinka, Tai Solarin, Seun, and the likes cope/coped.

Your location matters bro, since you know you live in an environment where people are intolerant and vicious, it is better you don't disclose your belief to anyone of them. Especially when you live in the northern part or at the South-South.

LordReed:


You are funny. What am I retreating from?

From my question, "what good has religion generated for humanity"

But you're telling us not to toss out the merits of religion and focus on the demerits.

Now I am asking you what merit has religion brought to Humanity compared to the ones science has done and will continue doing.

LordReed:


Read my post again maybe it will finally make sense to you.

This is how most people who try to sound intelligent on nairaland reply a counter-attack retort instead of admitting the validity or at least say something back.

Dollywood:



We condemn religion because it does not bring any merits but only demerits, the religion be thought will bring peace and love, brought hatred and crime, look at Nigeria and other countries with at 70% of the population are religious, you will notice the high crime rate, and the criminals are either a Christian or a Muslim, look at Norway and China, for instance, they don't practice any religion but look how peaceful and progressive their country is.

We don't need to know what is wrong and right, and religion ain't the gateway to success either, but these Nigerians make it seem like if you're not religious you will either die by some sort of spiritual attack or something.


Religion doesn't even bring development to the country all you see are grown-ass men praying and wishing for their imaginary friend or angel to fix the problem of their country.



Religious people are mentality enslaved and trapped with fear, especially those Jargons I hear at Church and fake miracles when they preach about "Spiritual husband and wife, demons and witchcraft, curses from my father or mother house" all those bullcrap will be used as their prayer point in churches, the average Christian will be scared to death if he forfeits or renounces his belief thinking those spiritual attack will hunt him down and kill him because he longer has the imaginary friend as his lord and savior anymore.

Everything is false, fake, illusional, there's nothing like witchcrafts or demons.

You are committing a fallacy of composition. That some people practice their religion in such ways that are evil or bad doesn't mean all people who practise religion are similar. Have you ever heard of Jains? If you haven't you should look them up. Jain extremists won't even kill an ant, how does that make them evil? What of Buddhists, do you think Buddhists are evil because of what they believe and practice?

Dollywood:


From my question, "what good has religion generated for humanity"

But you're telling us not to toss out the merits of religion and focus on the demerits.

Now I am asking you what merit has religion brought to Humanity compared to the ones science has done and will continue doing.

Dollywood:


This is how most people who try to sound intelligent on nairaland reply a counter-attack retort instead of admitting the validity or at least say something back.

What part of I am not religious has you stumped? You falsely assume I am out to defend religion when instead I am asking you to think of the things you are saying. If you can't comprehend that from my posts then you need to read them again and again until you do.

HellVictorinho:

What do you want to hear or see?
The benefits of religion are just monies and goodies distributed among few people.
In other words, religion only benefits religious leaders and people that get help from religious leaders.
Concerning the bad side,it causes division, irresponsibility to some extent and confusion.
The division leads to conflicts and other things like that.
The irresponsibility contributes to poverty and suffering
The confusion is just confusion.

Do you agree that Hitler was evil? If you do can you list out what parameters you used to consider him evil?

Dollywood:


Actually you're wrong here.

Nobody will ask what your religion is before he/she gives you a job.

Nobody will ask for your religion before he/she will render a favour. Atheism/Agnosticism is still minor, I don't really let most people know about it because they are too many religious extremist out there that will annihilate you because you're not religious or label you as a demon.

To add to that if you are rich or successful no one cares if u are an atheist or not,even pastors would dine with u
But for an average Nigerian sometimes you need religion to socialize,depending on the environment

LordReed:


Do you agree that Hitler was evil? If you do can you list out what parameters you used to consider him evil?

your new members don't know these old old people, they're on another wavelength.

LordReed:


Do you agree that Hitler was evil? If you do can you list out what parameters you used to consider him evil?

How is this related to the matter

LordReed:


Who gave orders to the military to shoot protesters? An authority. Does that make the military evil?

well, the duty of the military is for them to protect the sovereignty of the nation. In my humble opinion what they did was evil, but the law recognises them. But religion is not recognised by the law.

The duty of religion is just to bring people together and follow a particular doctrine.

I’m not saying all religion is totally I’m just saying it’s the cause of most evil and wars in the world

hakeem4:
well, the duty of the military is for them to protect the sovereignty of the nation. In my humble opinion what they did was evil, but the law recognises them. But religion is not recognised by the law.

The duty of religion is just to bring people together and follow a particular doctrine.

I’m not saying all religion is totally I’m just saying it’s the cause of most evil and wars in the world

Religion is recognised by the law or else why would they be given tax exempt status?

Most of the wars? How many wars in human history have been about religion?

HellVictorinho:

How is this related to the matter

Indulge me and I will show you.

LordReed:


Indulge me and I will show you.

I don't have anything to say about Hitler.

LordReed:


Religion is recognised by the law or else why would they be given tax exempt status?

Most of the wars? How many wars in human history have been about religion?

But divisions have been associated with religion.

HellVictorinho:

I don't have anything to say about Hitler.

Really? That's interesting. As in, you have not thought about the subject or you just don't want to share your thoughts?

HellVictorinho:

But divisions have been associated with religion.

Land, water and other resources continue to cause divisions till tomorrow.

LordReed:


Land, water and other resources continue to cause divisions till tomorrow.

Hmmmmm,
So, you're saying religion can be compared to other things.
But I think your comparisons should stop.
Focus on religion!!!!
In fact,religion should be considered as unnecessary because those Gods can't exist.
But it's obvious that being a religious leader can be very profitable considering the number of people that believe in offerings,tithes,XYZ seeds,etc..
The so-called charity done by religious leaders don't take people out of poverty, completely.
So, you should also stop asking what the merits of religion are because there's nothing about it that can favour everyone.
Miracles don't really happen or/and there's no God that cares about anyone.