creating policy by fiat and force are outdated and they will never stand the test of time.

Remind me of the opinion polls conducted by Soludo's CBN before initiating his Bank Recapitalization process.
If a CBN governor can not use his initiative to determine what is good for the economy and doing so is regarded as 'force', then maybe we don't need a CBN governor again, all of us should just sit down and determine every policy!

We have been undaunted by examples that ISLAMIC BANKING is practice in other part of the world.The problem is not the Bank,the problem is the type of Muslims we have in Nigeria who are mostly illiterates and who will bend the rules and Standard of such Banking ethics as they are known to be.

@Lagosboy, Akanbi, Jarus and co., i have been saying it to my fellow Nairalanders that this JAMALAH man is upto no good and i'm suspecting him of being on a mission to help distabilise dis country.

so many things about his personality makes me uncomfortable with him. the threads he always create are disturbing ones with always sphewing hatred and sentiment.

jamalah, repent ooo, cos u neva can last on the platform of falsehood and mischief.

^^ u just articulated d fears of d christians in Nigeria, the problem is not islamic banking,the problem is the type of muslims we have in Nigeria.

i as a muslim apologize to my northern people, but then, i need to let the below out on jamalah. he claims islam for the northerners as if it belongs to them; it does not.^^^^^You should blame the hausa/fulani/gambari axis that have bastardized Islam; a a way of life that includes entities in heavens. Alhamdulillah, i am a muslim, and just like entrepreneurs who started those banks in Nigeria, any wealthy Nigerian, including muslims and others, collectively or individually can start more banks and financial houses.

American Express and other outfits are banks, in the America you seem to know so well. Is it the word Islam that upset every persons standing against it, and should we blame Abdul Mutallab senior for his son's evil agenda, and wanting to help his father from Riba, he invited him to nothing better?

The messenger [as] said the RIBA of Abbas ibn Abd Mutallib is under my foot [not collectable, cancelled]. The young mutallab couldn't use this example to help his father.

Look, man. Islam does not belong to any ethnic group and definitely, not to the hausas. Alhamdulillah, eastern and others are muslims quietly while the north are copying the mentality of the arabs that ended the office the caliphate on the ottoman turks. Islam is not even that of the arabs.



[Quote]« #29 on: Today at 09:43:51 AM »

@akanbi
i am muslim but perhaps not your type of 'muslim'. let me tell you the issue here is pluralism. we need to respect the feelings and aspirations of each and every member of the society. look at the united states for instance. can you guess the percentage  of man-loving-men and lady-loving-ladies: 0.7% of the population and no politician will be bold enough to come out and castigate them or relegate their interest to the gutters. but here is a central bank governor boldly pronouncing over the bbc that he does not care for the concerns of 50% of the populace. imagine a politician doing that in the us, i am sure that is the end of his career.[/Quote]pat robertson of the 700 club in the 1988 or 1992 republican primaries, being a conservative was and still against same gender relationship to date. i think you based your assumption on what liberal north east spearheaded by NYS just did. law against sodomy is in the books in america.



[Quote]muslims, especially of the north still live with  the mentality of the middle ages when they held sway over arabia where the population was homogeneous. in a case like that of naija we need to fashion out a way lo live with others not in dominion but respect for each other.

it is the mentality of spiritual superiority that created the boko haram taliban and of course sanusi's constipated idea os islamic banking : that some very few pple know what is good for the whole populace and they must be forced to obey those wishes.[/Quote]more like ignorance, because arrogance, which superiority or supremacy mindset is part is not found in the affairs that was completed on Muhammad [as].



[Quote]creating policy by fiat and force are outdated and they will never stand the test of time.

in the first place banking is not the priority of muslims in the north. a populace that has been decimated by corruption, feudalism (the like promoted by sanusi and his fore fathers) illiteracy and many other unspeakable extremities does not need all this drama. you only save and invest when you have enough to spare. what with a person that is even yet to feed himself. let me tell you  i grew up in the heart of kano city and i know the level of poverty and deprivation suffered by our pple. when you talk of banks in kano, the biggest northern commercial hub it is clustered around a very small enclave of the kwari market and bello road and by and large they only service traders in sabon gari market and kwari textile market.[/Quote]when the northern muslims abandon the very foundation of islam, knowledge, the outcome is dire, as it on my country. no wonder the beautiful word; Almuhajiruun is wasted and ridiculed on the 'almajirins'. you need to preach to your people because i do not speak your language and you people [not all] have tarnished the noble religion.



[Quote]these are traders who only seek for a place to keep their money. they know very little about investment and dont even trust such ventures. a lot of them keep hard cash in their shops because their trading is not cheque-based and they cant be bothered with running to the bank every now and then. that is why when the annual fire occurs in these markets we hear of millions burnt to ashes in their shops.

the other banks are all salary 'banks'. when i used to work in kura local govt branch of afribank, the only activity is at the end of the month when the monthly subvention of cash comes from the central govenment. the chairman withdraws everything and tips us and the branch manager and that is it. we wait for another month ending. where is the investment? and that is why the jaiz bank never took off in the first place.

whether we like it or not the bulk of the banking activities, more than 80% by some estimates, are located in the lagos axis.

oue priority in the north are three things: education education education[/Quote]and you didnt blow the whistle on the corrupt ma? you seem to be part of the problem, or do you think you are part of the solution?

@Jarus, I appreciate your views but how much better if you will just restrict yourself to moderating.
You  have jumped into the fray one time too many and you may not be able to get out of it next time, thereby
reducing your influence as a moderator.

Jamalah's  posting  is upto no good and is  devoid of substance and concentrates on innuendo 's and baseless attack  on peoples' characters. From the ignorant remarks I doubt very much if Jamalah has ever been a muslim, He/She ( I dont know what sex , but literally Jamalah means a female camel) is an inept plant by mischief makers and had started other threads in the past specifically to attack the CBN governor.

In a country where we all  close our office on Sundays, ( Christian day of worship and rest)  we use the Christian calendar ( based on the birth of Christ) , English- a Christian language is our language of communication and indeed our beloved national language but strong feelings arise when an interest free banking( practiced in many Christian and non - Christian  countries world wide) is  being introduced alongside other forms of banking!! Simple reason - the word Islamic is used in it's description. Would you call this intolerance ? Would it help if we call the existing form of baking " Christian Banking"? Then we can have both and available to all by choice?

skydeexie:

@Jarus, I appreciate your views but how much better if you will just restrict yourself to moderating.
You  have jumped into the fray one time too many and you may not be able to get out of it next time, thereby
reducing your influence as a moderator.

Thanks. But being the moderator does not mean I should not voice out my opinions. I have personal political opinions which I have been voicing out before I became a Mod. A newspaper editor that is at the same time a columnist is free to express his personal take on issues in his column, and as editor, give everybody fair reportage. Threads bashing Islamic banking are proliferating in this section, despite the fact that I personally support Islamic banking, but I did not touch them because I believe people against it cannot be stopped from expressing their views and as teh Mod I must accomodate every opinions.

This Islamic banking is optional, so what exactly is the kerfuffle about?

@jarus
pls shut up your mouth.  i was responding to akanbi edu who questioned my islam. you dont have to prove that you are a sanusi ass licking bigot here and your being a 'nairaland official' does not make you an authority.  in spite of reading tons of religious essays written by sanusi you still cant decipher his mind set. only in nigeria can such a person (who has made his partisanship so clear in so many treatises) be made a central bank chief.

in the first place there is nothing like islamic banking. i remember an interview in the eighties with professor Muhammad Abdussalam the Pakistani and first Muslim nobel laureate. when he was asked about the idea of 'islamic scienc. and he responded that it was no valid than the idea of 'islamic football'. what muslims are concerned about and the quran mentioned is 'riba', loosely translated as interest. what the quran said was 'wala ta'kulur riba ad'afan muda'afan'. note, ad'afan muda'afan 'interest upon interest' the type that you can only attribute to loan sharks. this is a vast academic topic that i will not like to delve into on this forum. by the way interest rates in the advanced economies are temperate and used as a tool of fiscal regulations. in the us the rate is 0.25%. i dont think that can be classified as adafan muda afan.

it is absurd the way pple view islamic banks. i ve heard of pple salivating and dreaming of just walking into a bank and walking out with millions. lending is all about bankability. if you are not bankable forget it in the sense that you have a viable business plan and of course  a recourse inevent of a failure.

the last time they promised us that sharia will solve our problems. but we now know better.
enough of this hood wink.

Islamophobia I guess.

Jarus:

This Islamic banking is optional, so what exactly is the kerfuffle about?

@ nagoma
your guntin larabci is very funny. you and bashdecash i wonder which radio station you listen to to study arabic. i believe that was the way you studied islam too listening to cheap dubbed cassettes, not researching on your own and forming opinion in the most unenlightened and unreformed manner. for your information she camel is not called 'jamalah' in arabic but 'iblu'. i am not a camel but a human being and jamalh is a combination of my two names jamal and ahmad.

your last post reminds me of ustaz faruk chedi in kano in the late eighties and ealy nineties. he delivered a very famous lecture then. if you are a kano man or is conversant with the rumblings then in the name of islamic revival you will recall the lecture where he was calling for all the calendar months to be changed to arabic ones." jaunary. gunki ne! march gunki! ne april gunki ne!".
meaning january february march et al are all idols. this kind of intolerance are what led to the taliban destroying the budha statues in bamiyan. the belief that if we observe those holidays with our xtian compatriots we are also partaking in their festivities or church going. only a demented and totally obfuscated mind will ever think in such a line. ever wonder why gideon orkar tried to eject us from the nigerian federation?
by the way the aforementioned cleric was appointed the head of the morality police in kano when shekarau came on board. the man was so corrupt that even by shekarau's standards it was just much and had to be relieved of his job.

jamalah:

@ nagoma
your guntin larabci is very funny. you and bashdecash i wonder which radio station you listen to to study arabic. i believe that was the way you studied islam too listening to cheap dubbed cassettes, not researching on your own and forming opinion in the most unenlightened and unreformed manner. for your information she camel is not called 'jamalah' in arabic but 'iblu'. i am not a camel but a human being and jamalh is a combination of my two names jamal and ahmad.

your last post reminds me of ustaz faruk chedi in kano in the late eighties and ealy nineties. he delivered a very famous lecture then. if you are a kano man or is conversant with the rumblings then in the name of islamic revival you will recall the lecture where he was calling for all the calendar months to be changed to arabic ones." jaunary. gunki ne! march gunki! ne april gunki ne!".
meaning january february march et al are all idols. this kind of intolerance are what led to the taliban destroying the budha statues in bamiyan. the belief that if we observe those holidays with our xtian compatriots we are also partaking in their festivities or church going. only a demented and totally obfuscated mind will ever think in such a line. ever wonder why gideon orkar tried to eject us from the nigerian federation?
by the way the aforementioned cleric was appointed the head of the morality police in kano when shekarau came on board. the man was so corrupt that even by shekarau's standards it was just  much and had to be relieved of his job.

You missed what he was saying, we are not calling for removal of many things which have their roots in christian doctrine, why should they be that intolerant towards anything islamic?

Sweetnecta:

i as a muslim apologize to my northern people, but then, i need to let the below out on jamalah. he claims islam for the northerners as if it belongs to them; it does not.^^^^^You should blame the hausa/fulani/gambari axis that have bastardized Islam; a a way of life that includes entities in heavens. Alhamdulillah, i am a muslim, and just like entrepreneurs who started those banks in Nigeria, any wealthy Nigerian, including muslims and others, collectively or individually can start more banks and financial houses.

that's total rubbish, how dare say that

Akanbi_edu:

^^^

You don't have to worry about what they say. man got to live for something.

They all have a whole sunday to go to church while shouting "Nigeria is a secular state". They have christian universities where muslims are not accepted except you practice whatever they do. They have so many things we are not shouting about.

May we should start shouting too.

this is a valid point.if those igonorant and arrogant so called christian leaders are making noise because a bunch of muslim businessmen would like to use their money to start up an islamic bank,then it is also time for the muslims to lead a campaign to shut down all christian universities.infact those universities are missionary universities that try to impose christianity on nigerian students simply because they enroll in those universities.here we have a bank is that not asking christians to bank in it.yet we have some fools talking nonsense.

if this bank is not establish,then it is time for the government to close down christian-runned schools and universities.that is fair enough.

"When you fight corruption,corruption fights back".SLS has stepped on many toes in his quest to stamp out corruption in our banking system.you dont expect this people not to fight back with all they got.A group call the Reinnesance group sponsored by the Ibru clique took out millions of dollers in advert on Nigerian and foreign daylies for several months all with the aim of discrediting Sanusi.But in the end the truth prevails.
This group still exist and will take out name in various forum to achieve their purpose and the easiest catch to use is that of religion as its often the spark in Nigeria.
OMG Islamic banking what is the issue here dont get? It is not a national bank hence tax payer money is not use in it. It is not compulsory so you have the choice to join or not to. The modus oparandus is clear so it is not illegal.
Therefore whats the hue and cry about? OK i get,the word ISLAM? so much for our secularism.Just read some comments here , wow

@jamalah
Tanx bro.Jarus u dey fall my hand.

@poster
May your days be long for speaking the truth, I respect your objectivity.

odedele:

@jamalah
Tanx bro.Jarus u dey fall my hand.

who cares!

In my humble opinion,I just want to say here that Islamic Bank or not,a financial institution willing to offer interests free loan is not a bad idea,it is just so unfortunate we live in a country bedeviled by a perpetual battle of religious supremacy.
As I mentiond earlier the idea of an 'ISLAMIC BANK' issueing interest free loans is not a bad one,but it is pertinent to note that the Nigerian Nation at this moment is indeed in a very precarious and volatile state,(no thanks to the 'religious' attacks and killings in the Northern parts of the country),as such the CBN gov.of all people,being an intellectual of high repute oughts to know this is just not the time for the propagation and campaign for such sensitiv matter as Islamic bankin.The mere mention of Islam will surely raise sentimental dust from different quaters.He should shelve dat plan for now

What has islam done to contribute towards the development of this nation? Not to talk of Islamic banking hmm. This people are gradually pressing to turn this country into Islamic Country . I'v never sen any Islamic country without reoccurent histry of war. Their would be nothing like Islamic banking In Nigeria to breed ur terrorism een thou it's already gettin out of hand.

@Jamalah: see Akambi edu's last posting above you are missing or ignoring the point. I didnt call for any destruction or changes to calendars ; just asked for reciprocal tolerance to what is obviously optional. By the way are you on the payroll mentioned by dvee2 above. To restore corruption in CBN by bringing SLS down?

Beync:

What has islam done to contribute towards the development of this nation? Not to talk of Islamic banking hmm. This people are gradually pressing to turn this country into Islamic Country . I'v never sen any Islamic country without reoccurent histry of war. Their would be nothing like Islamic banking In Nigeria to breed your terrorism een thou it's already gettin out of hand.

No doubt, you have been effectively brainwashed. How many wars has America fought, how many people have died in those wars. Don't let us even go to the UK , you will be thoroughly embarrassed.
Lesson: Human beings every where fight wars. So start to think for yourself a little before hurrying to type something that makes you look ignorant when you really shouldn't be.

ugosly:

In my humble opinion,I just want to say here that Islamic Bank or not,a financial institution willing to offer interests free loan is not a bad idea,it is just so unfortunate we live in a country bedeviled by a perpetual battle of religious supremacy.

As I mentiond earlier the idea of an 'ISLAMIC BANK' issueing interest free loans is not a bad one,but it is pertinent to note that  the Nigerian Nation at this moment is indeed in a very precarious and volatile state,(no thanks to the 'religious' attacks and killings in the Northern parts of the country),as such the CBN gov.of all people,being an intellectual of high repute oughts to know this is just not the time for the propagation and campaign for such sensitiv matter as Islamic bankin.The mere mention of Islam will surely raise sentimental dust from different quaters.He should shelve dat plan for now

I know I have used some heavy words on this thread, but I am afraid that many of my people (Nigerians) are simpletons-in-thinking. Do we have government or not. You folks seem to be implying that there is no government capable of protecting people in Nigeria. If this is the case, what are you doing fighting the shadow and leaving the body that casts it? Engage your political representatives politically and let the government know that you have little tolerance for mediocrity.

First, it was we don't want Islamic banking. Now that we have thoroughly showed you how stupid that point is, it is now[i] Emmm, it is not that we don't like Islamic banking but "it is the type of Muslims we have in Nigeria",[/i] are you so unintelligent? If any human being breaks the law, you punish him (using adjectives is just moronic) so it is not a matter of a Christian, Muslim, Soldier, Police or Alien committed a crime. It is a matter of an individual committed a crime and the government punishes him for it.

Whenever a government fails in its responsibility of ensuring peace and justice, it should be shown the door democratically. Imagine the people of Senegal are currently protesting over power failure, my people here cannot even ask the government to do its duty of protecting lives and property, they are busy fighting Islamic banking that will bring billions of dollars into our next-to-bankrupt economy. Don't make me angry. I am good with words and will use them here without sentiments.

nagoma:

@Jamalah: see Akambi edu's last posting above you are missing or ignoring the point. I didnt call for any destruction or changes to calendars ; just asked for reciprocal tolerance to what is obviously optional. By the way are you on the payroll mentioned by dvee2 above. To restore corruption in CBN by bringing SLS down?

Seriously, jamalah's motivation doesn't look like money though.

@Jamalah

Gentleman, back down from your statements, you need not ask Jarus to shut up. Here you are trying to beautify riba and linking it to loan sharks alone. You could come to the islam for muslim section in the religious section and let us debate riba as it affects the current world economy.

You clearly have an agenda and you see every issue from this mindset, islamic banking is not for you in the north alone as you are trying to do, islamic banking is for all Nigerians who would like to invest in it or deal with the bank. It is optional , it is OPTIONAL, IT IS OPTIONAL. how does something which is optional affect you for goodness sake. If you dont like it simply dont put your money in it. Take your SLS bashing elsewhere as everyone has told you here islamic banking in Nigeria started with Joseph Sanusi in the late 90s.

Your hallucination linked islamic banking to umar faruk , your agenda set mind linked islamic banking to hausa fulani supremacy and your mindset again tried to focus on a logic that when a percentage of the population are aginst something then that issue should be dropped. Even in democracy it does not work like that , when did bankling rules become a subject of the populations desires.

Guy back down as you have exposed your mindset and your agenda here will lead no where as we cans ee beyond our noses here.

Mactunji or wat   one can easily decipher from u dat u and ur islam is not peacefull. at any little disagreement with wat u believ u result to name calling. the reason why Islam is not tolerant, always resulting to killing non belivers. I will still tell u the blunt truth thou am not expecting u to beliv that wat u defend is no close to peace but violent. Saying Islam is peacefull is like saying the sky is yellow gerrit!

Beync:

Mactunji or wat one can easily decipher from u dat u and your islam is not peacefull. at any little disagreement with wat u believ u result to name calling. the reason why Islam is not tolerant, always resulting to killing non belivers. I will still tell u the blunt truth thou am not expecting u to beliv that wat u defend is no close to peace but violent. Saying Islam is peacefull is like saying the sky is yellow gerrit!

Sister, have you ever thought that there is a difference between islam and muslims just as there is a difference between Christianity and christians and judaism and jews.

Beync:

Mactunji or wat   one can easily decipher from u dat u and your islam is not peacefull. at any little disagreement with wat u believ u result to name calling. the reason why Islam is not tolerant, always resulting to killing non belivers. I will still tell u the blunt truth thou am not expecting u to beliv that wat u defend is no close to peace but violent. Saying Islam is peacefull is like saying the sky is yellow gerrit!

Really, obviously a description of your lack of depth is name-calling in your books- so be it. I will not call you a genius when your posts prove the contrary. Feel free to keep saying Islam is not peaceful and let us see where it will get you.

Lagosboy:

Sister, have you ever thought that there is a difference between islam and muslims just as there is a difference between Christianity and christians and judaism and jews.

Please don't go into back and forth argument, it leads to nowhere. Lets concentrate on the topic.

Really

jamalah:

in the first place there is nothing like islamic banking. i remember an interview in the eighties with professor Muhammad Abdussalam the Pakistani and first Muslim nobel laureate. when he was asked about the idea of 'islamic scienc. and he responded that it was no valid than the idea of 'islamic football'. what muslims are concerned about and the quran mentioned is 'riba', loosely translated as interest. what the quran said was 'wala ta'kulur riba ad'afan muda'afan'. note, ad'afan muda'afan 'interest upon interest' the type that you can only attribute to loan sharks. this is a vast academic topic that i will not like to delve into on this forum. by the way interest rates in the advanced economies are temperate and used as a tool of fiscal regulations. in the us the rate is 0.25%. i dont think that can be classified as adafan muda afan.

"Jamalah" stop preaching falsehood on what the Quran says!

Holy Quran 2:275:
Those who swallow usury cannot rise up save as he ariseth whom the devil hath prostrated by (his) touch. That is because they say: Trade is just like usury; whereas Allah permitteth trading and forbiddeth usury. He unto whom an admonition from his Lord cometh, and (he) refraineth (in obedience thereto), he shall keep (the profits of) that which is past, and his affair (henceforth) is with Allah. As for him who returneth (to usury) - Such are rightful owners of the Fire. They will abide therein.

i still mantain that sanusi is not fit to hold such a sensitive post. he has no track record and his six months stint in sudan to study arabic does not make him an authority on islam nor is his obnoxious articles which are either attacking his enemies like kwankwaso or sheikh jafar or espounding the superiority of fulfulde (fulani) phylosophy over others or denigrating the minorites in niger delta for their agitation or  castigating the ibos and yorubas for their political  "comedy of errors". and he does it without apology after all he is a prince and respects no body especially the various commoners he comes across. i was brought up in kano in close proximity to the royal house and word can not desribe the daily humiliation and iniquity meted on commoners.

the leading islamic source of jurispudence the alazhar university in cairo in 2002  issued a fatwa or edict on interset-taking has and it will inerest you to see their conclusion on the subject. i am sure sanusi cant compete with them with his sudanese certficate  in elementary arabic. you will realise that all this controversy he is generating is totally ucalled for.

it will also interest you to read this little excerpt on the controversy and how the islamic banks are abused by the so-called promoters:


"Some Islamic banks charge for the time value of money, the common economic definition of Interest (Riba). These institutions are criticized in some quarters of the Muslim community for their lack of strict adherence to Sharia.
The concept of Ijarah is used by some Islamic Banks (the Islami Bank in Bangladesh, for example) to apply to the use of money instead of the more accepted application of supplying goods or services using money as a vehicle. A fixed fee is added to the amount of the loan that must be paid to the bank regardless if the loan generates a return on investment or not. The reasoning is that if the amount owed does not change over time, it is profit and not interest and therefore acceptable under Sharia.
Islamic banks are also criticized by some for not applying the principle of Mudarabah in an acceptable manner. Where Mudarabah stresses the sharing of risk, critics point out that these banks are eager to take part in profit-sharing but they have little tolerance for risk. To some in the Muslim community, these banks may be conforming to the strict legal interpretations of Sharia but avoid recognizing the intent that made the law necessary in the first place.[citation needed]
The majority of Islamic banking clients are found in the Gulf states and in developed countries. With 60% of Muslims living in poverty, Islamic banking is of little benefit to the general population. The majority of financial institutions that offer Islamic banking services are majority owned by Non-Muslims. With Muslims working within these organizations being employed in the marketing of these services and having little input into the actual day to day management, the veracity of these institutions and their services are viewed with suspicion. One Malaysian Bank offering Islamic based investment funds was found to have the majority of these funds invested in the gaming industry; the managers administering these funds were non Muslim.[42] These types of stories contribute to the general impression within the Muslim populace that Islamic banking is simply another means for banks to increase profits through growth of deposits and that only the rich derive benefits from implementation of Islamic Banking principles.
Hence, the controversy that surrounds Islamic Banking continues. Is Islamic Banking really Islamic? This is a question that still is a matter of debate among the Muslim academia"