seun001:

oga,i know an uncircumsized organ when i see one.comes to questions if u have actually watched pornos before.

http://videos.cuckold-wives.com/hosted-galleries5/10.jpg

Circumcised or not?

http://www.homenscalientes1.oi.com.br/jefferson/yunnyA007.jpg

Circumcised or not?

Fufuking,

      you need to chillax! I've been reading everyone's comments and you're attacking everyone who disagrees. I think you're taking this waaayyy too personal. It’s just a discussion. No matter what anyone says, no matter how many statistics or medical whatever, everyone will still believe what they want to believe. Finish.

  ps. You’re right circumcision is not a chrisitian thing but you’re misinterpreting these verses to say something it is not saying. You said

THIS PASSAGE IN THE BIBLE MAKES IT VERY CLEAR THAT CIRCUMCISION IS NOT THE CHRISTIAN THING TO DO:
Was someone called after he had been circumcised?  He should not try to
hide his circumcision.  Did the call come to another who had never been
circumcised?  He is not to be circumcised.  Circumcision counts for
nothing, and its lack makes no difference either. What matters is keeping
God's commandments.

No. It is saying as a Christian and in God’s sight being circumcised or uncircumcised does not matter but obeying God is what counts NOT[/color][color=#990000][/color][color=#990000][/color][color=#990000] that you should not be circumcised or Christians should not be circumcised. Abeg no twist scripture fit ur own agenda.

Fufuking,

am not interested in any jamb questions.

JeSoul:

 Fufuking,

     you need to chillax! I've been reading everyone's comments and you're attacking everyone who disagrees. I think you're taking this waaayyy too personal. It’s just a discussion. No matter what anyone says, no matter how many statistics or medical whatever, everyone will still believe what they want to believe. Finish.

 ps. You’re right circumcision is not a chrisitian thing but you’re misinterpreting these verses to say something it is not saying. You said

No. It is saying as a Christian and in God’s sight being circumcised or uncircumcised does not matter but obeying God is what counts NOT[/color][color=#990000][/color][color=#990000][/color][color=#990000] that you should not be circumcised or Christians should not be circumcised. Abeg no twist scripture fit your own agenda.

I am not TWISTING scripture, people are saying that they circumcise because of Christianity, but Christianity point blank says, that circumcision of the flesh is of NO WORTH to Christ. Therefore, it is unnecessary. If you do it, you do not do it in the name of Christianity. What have I twisted? I didn't say Christians weren't allowed to be circumcised, just that doing it in the name of Christianity is false because it is of no worth to Christ.

seun001:

Fufuking,

am not interested in any jamb questions.

I can see clearly now. Your non-answers provide speak loudly for you.

Fufu King:

I am not TWISTING scripture, people are saying that they circumcise because of Christianity, but Christianity point blank says, that circumcision of the flesh is of NO WORTH to Christ. Therefore, it is unnecessary. If you do it, you do not do it in the name of Christianity. What have I twisted? I didn't say Christians weren't allowed to be circumcised, just that doing it in the name of Christianity is false because it is of no worth to Christ.

   oh okay I understand where you're coming from a lil better. Going from ur words here "THIS PASSAGE IN THE BIBLE MAKES IT VERY CLEAR THAT CIRCUMCISION IS NOT THE CHRISTIAN THING TO DO" it sounded like you were saying christians shouldn't circumcise.

@TOPIC

When I gave a man a Head, it tasted awful and smelly because he wasn't Circumcised.
I recommend all men to get circumcised 'cause it looks beautiful without the extra flesh which feels cold in the mouth.

JeSoul:

oh okay I understand where you're coming from a little better. Going from your words here "THIS PASSAGE IN THE BIBLE MAKES IT VERY CLEAR THAT CIRCUMCISION IS NOT THE CHRISTIAN THING TO DO" it sounded like you were saying christians shouldn't circumcise.

Well it holds no significance in the faith, and I don't think they should do it. So I am saying that Christians shouldn't circumcise, but the Bible doesn't prohibit it.

Caradona:

@TOPIC

When I gave a man a Head, it tasted awful and smelly because he wasn't Circumcised.
I recommend all men to get circumcised 'cause it looks beautiful without the extra flesh which feels cold in the mouth.

I wonder what he thought your vagina tasted like.

@Fufuking,
are u uncircumcised? cos i see no reason why u turned this topic into a personal stuff that u keep vigil with.wot am i supposed to do,hmmm,follow the link and come back to report eh!abegi.i aint cut out for that.

and u are supposed to see the funny side to wot caradona is posting not taking it as a personal affront.

in fact wot the hell is wrong with u hmm.

seun001:

@Fufuking,
are u uncircumcised? because i see no reason why u turned this topic into a personal stuff that u keep vigil with.wot am i supposed to do,hmmm,follow the link and come back to report eh!abegi.i aint cut out for that.

and u are supposed to see the funny side to wot caradona is posting not taking it as a personal affront.

in fact wot the hell is wrong with u hmm.

Where did I turn it personal?

Is this not a message board forum? What is the problem, is it because I am advocating for the minority opinion?

I truly don't understand why it's a problem to say that males shouldn't be circumcised. People begin to get upset with that opinion.

nobody is upset,
and as i see it,peeps state their reason for not accepting wot the poster said and stated their reasons.
u dont have to be sarcastic about thier reasons afterall everybody is entitled to their opinion.

seun001:

nobody is upset,
and as i see it,peeps state their reason for not accepting wot the poster said and stated their reasons.
u don't have to be sarcastic about their reasons afterall everybody is entitled to their opinion.

And if I disagree with their reasons or think their reasons are unfounded, I am not allowed to challenge them?

I'm not the only one who has been sarcastic in this thread, so I still don't understand why I'm being chastised.

And I agree, everyone is entitled to their opinion. That doesn't mean they are entitled to having their opinion go unchallenged.

Isn't that what a message board forum is for? To debate and discuss?

u can challenge any post,thats why its a forum.

You are the only one that has sounded sarcastic and leaning towards bitterness about other peeps opinions on this thread.
anyways,suppose somebody just takes one of your replys the other way round,fight don start be that ehn.
anyways its not like u aint got a point in wot u are putting across but your wording is the problem.cheers

@ Fufu King: Hey, it's just a friendly disscussion! There are no prizes being awarded, and it's not "majority wins the vote"!  

Just don't get too passionate about different opinions, that's all, we're all friends here.   But, what you said to Caradona was a bit below the belt, and not very kind!  

But just one question, and I'm not out to offend - are you circumsised, or not? You don't have to answer, but it would just help some understand you a wee bit better.

Siena:

@ Fufu King: Hey, it's just a friendly disscussion! There are no prizes being awarded, and it's not "majority wins the vote"!

Just don't get too passionate about different opinions, that's all, we're all friends here. But, what you said to Caradona was a bit below the belt, and not very kind!

But just one question, and I'm not out to offend - are you circumsised, or not? You don't have to answer, but it would just help some understand you a wee bit better.

Are we all posting our status?

I am circumcised, but it was not my choice.

If I were uncircumcised would that mean my opinion was invalid?

And I don't think my comment to Caradona was offensive. I just wondered aloud if her male sex partner found her vagina to have a pleasant taste. That's all.

seun001:

u can challenge any post,thats why its a forum.

You are the only one that has sounded sarcastic and leaning towards bitterness about other peeps opinions on this thread.
anyways,suppose somebody just takes one of your replys the other way round,fight don start be that ehn.
anyways its not like u aint got a point in wot u are putting across but your wording is the problem.cheers

I'll admit, some of my wording was harsh, but that was in response to what I felt was offensive wording by others.

But I'll try to work on my wording. Cheers.

Fufu King:

Well it holds no significance in the faith, and I don't think they should do it. So I am saying that Christians shouldn't circumcise, but the Bible doesn't prohibit it.

  that's just what you think, ur personal opinion. And since you quoted scripture, I'll assume you're a christian, if circumcision, physically, is so bad why did God ask Abraham and ALL the Isrealites to do it?   No the bible doesn't prohibit it, it requires it in the OT. And I'll even go far as to say it was for more reasons than just a spiritual act. You no no say God smart pass all human reasoning? there's a reason he asked them to do it in the first place.

So I wouldn't say I recommend christians don't circumcize jus cos it is on no real value in Christ, I believe it is of value physically.

JeSoul:

  that's just what you think, your personal opinion. And since you quoted scripture, I'll assume you're a christian, if circumcision, physically, is so bad why did God ask Abraham and ALL the Isrealites to do it?   No the bible doesn't prohibit it, it requires it in the OT. And I'll even go far as to say it was for more reasons than just a spiritual act. You no no say God smart pass all human reasoning? there's a reason he asked them to do it in the first place.

So I wouldn't say I recommend christians don't circumcize jus because it is on no real value in Christ, I believe it is of value physically.

I'm confused by your statement. What value do you find in circumcision?

The Bible specifically says that circumcision of the flesh has NO spiritual value if you are a Christian. None.

God commanded the sons of Abraham to do this as a sign of a covenant with him. But guess what? Christians are not Jews. We are not bound by the laws that they live by.

And circumcision has no bearing on your standing with God. Remember God favored Adam and his children, and they were not circumcised.

Do you still sacrifice animals to appease God? That was done in the Old Testament as well. If you accept Jesus Christ, you no longer live by the Old Testament. Jesus and the New Testament replaced many things that the Old Testament did. For example, the Old Testament commands an eye for an eye, whereas Jesus says turn the other cheek.

Fufuking,
you're missing my point, I'm not talking about anything spiritual now, or that we're not jews or that it's a new covenant etc, I'm talking strictly physical. If circumcision is so bad why did God tell them to do it? He WOULD not ask any of His people to do anything that was harmful to them.[

I'm confused by your statement. What value do you find in circumcision?

The Bible specifically says that circumcision of the flesh has NO spiritual value if you are a Christian. None.

Yes the bible says that circumcision has no SPIRITUAL VALUE it does not say that physically it is no good.

God commanded the sons of Abraham to do this as a sign of a covenant with him. But guess what? Christians are not Jews. We are not bound by the laws that they live by.

would God ask the Isrealites to do something that was potentialy harmful to themselves? healthwise? don't we serve a good God?

And circumcision has no bearing on your standing with God. Remember God favored Adam and his children, and they were not circumcised.

Any christian knows that circumcision has no significance in Christ, it does not make God like you better.

Do you still sacrifice animals to appease God? That was done in the Old Testament as well. If you accept Jesus Christ, you no longer live by the Old Testament. Jesus and the New Testament replaced many things that the Old Testament did. For example, the Old Testament commands an eye for an eye, whereas Jesus says turn the other cheek.

Do you still obey the 10 commandments? there's still parts of the OT that are just as relevant today as they were thousands of years ago. We have a new covenant but does that mean you throw out the OT completely? No. There's parts that are still useful.

BESIDES all this is not my point, answer this one question my brother:
WOULD GOD ASK ANYONE, AT ANYTIME TO DO ANYTHING THAT IS POTENTIALLY HARMFUL TO THEM I assume you say no. Therefore He knows that circumcision is not harmful, hence He woulda never asked them to do it in the first place, covenant or no covenant!

JeSoul:

Fufuking,
you're missing my point, I'm not talking about anything spiritual now, or that we're not jews or that it's a new covenant etc, I'm talking strictly physical. If circumcision is so bad why did God tell them to do it? He WOULD not ask any of His people to do anything that was harmful to them.[
Yes the bible says that circumcision has no SPIRITUAL VALUE it does not say that physically it is no good.
would God ask the Isrealites to do something that was potentialy harmful to themselves? healthwise? don't we serve a good God?

Any christian knows that circumcision has no significance in Christ, it does not make God like you better.


Do you still obey the 10 commandments? there's still parts of the OT that are just as relevant today as they were thousands of years ago. We have a new covenant but does that mean you throw out the OT completely? No. There's parts that are still useful.

BESIDES all this is not my point, answer this one question my brother:
WOULD GOD ASK ANYONE, AT ANYTIME TO DO ANYTHING THAT IS POTENTIALLY HARMFUL TO THEM I assume you say no. Therefore He knows that circumcision is not harmful, hence He woulda never asked them to do it in the first place, covenant or no covenant!

You're switching the discussion.

Our discussion was on whether or not circumcision was a "christian" thing to do. According to the New Testament, it is not.

As for whether or not God would ask us to do something was harmful to us, I can only point you to the fact that the God of the Old Testament was VERY HARSH and quite CRUEL. Remember he drowned and killed the whole world, leaving Noah.

And let me leave you with this quote from Genesis:

[QUOTE]
38:7 And Er, Judah's firstborn, was wicked in the sight of the LORD; and the LORD slew him.
38:8 And Judah said unto Onan, Go in unto thy brother's wife, and marry her, and raise up seed to thy brother.
38:9 And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother. 
38:10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also. [/QUOTE]

The Old Testament God slays people without explanation and orders them to sleep with their brother's wives.

Also, Leviticus, which is the OT chapter that commands circumcision, also states that women that give birth to children are unclean. They have to follow a certain ritual to become clean again. Do you follow this?

[QUOTE]12:4 And she shall then continue in the blood of her purifying three and thirty days; she shall touch no hallowed thing, nor come into the sanctuary, until the days of her purifying be fulfilled. 
12:5 But if she bear a maid child, then she shall be unclean two weeks, as in her separation: and she shall continue in the blood of her purifying threescore and six days. 
12:6 And when the days of her purifying are fulfilled, for a son, or for a daughter, she shall bring a lamb of the first year for a burnt offering, and a young pigeon, or dove,
for a sin offering, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, unto the priest:     
12:7 Who shall offer it before the LORD, and make an atonement for her; and she shall be cleansed from the issue of her blood. This is the law for her that hath born a male or a female. 
12:8 And if she be not able to bring a lamb, then she shall bring two turtles, or two young pigeons; the one for the burnt offering, and the other for a sin offering: and the priest shall make an atonement for her, and she shall be clean.
[/QUOTE]


That is why I'm a Christian, not a Jew. I follow the New Testament.

You're switching the discussion.
Our discussion was on whether or not circumcision was a "christian" thing to do. According to the New Testament, it is not.

    I'm not switching, it has been my whole point all along! that God would NEVER ask us to do anything that was bad for us! and you know you would be wrong to say God would ask anyone to do anything that was harmful to them. You keep saying its not the "christian" thing to do like the bible says we shouldn't, whereas the bible simply says spiritually you're not better of if you do or not! It doesn't say physically we're no better off!!  how many times can I say this!

 

As for whether or not God would ask us to do something was harmful to us, I can only point you to the fact that the God of the Old Testament was VERY HARSH and quite CRUEL. Remember he drowned and killed the whole world, leaving Noah.

    God killed the whole world because of sin. God is and was harsh and cruel because He hates anything sinful. What does that have to do with circumcision? what did God ask anyone to do that was bad for them there?
God does not ASK or COMMAND us to do anything that is bad for us period! and you know it!

  You're quoting OT verses that I don't think are relevant to this discussion. I already said there parts of the OT that still apply today and parts that don't. I don't want to diverge by asking where did God ever God "slay people without explanation and orders them to sleep with their brother's wives"? all those have explanations. people died usually because of sin, and they slept with 'brothers wives' (only when the brother had actually DIED) in order to create offspring for the dead relative. A practice that the NT rules out today.

  Anyways all this is really besides the point. Please lets stay on topic. It doesn't really pertain to the real discussion and my real point: that God has never and will never ask us to do anything that is harmful to us! including circumcision!!!

@ JeSoul: I admire your passion, I think you're pretty cool!

I'd give a lot to see your expression as you type - I bet your keyboard's taking a pounding!

JeSoul:

    I'm not switching, it has been my whole point all along! that God would NEVER ask us to do anything that was bad for us! and you know you would be wrong to say God would ask anyone to do anything that was harmful to them. You keep saying its not the "christian" thing to do like the bible says we shouldn't, whereas the bible simply says spiritually you're not better of if you do or not! It doesn't say physically we're no better off!!  how many times can I say this!
[/QUOTE]

What does the physical have to do with a Christian act?! I say it is not the Christian thing to do, because circumcision has no value spiritually in Christianity. How many times do I have to say this?

Galatians 5:2-6:

Pay close attention to me, Paul, when I tell you that if you have yourselves circumcised, Christ will be of no use to you. I point out once more to all who receive circumcision that they are bound to the law in its entirety.

The New Testament even refers to circumcision as mutilation:

Philippians 3:2-4

Beware of unbelieving dogs. Watch out for workers of evil. Be on guard
against those who mutilate. It is we who are the circumcision, who worship
in the spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus rather than putting our
trust in the flesh though I can be confident even there.  If anyone
thinks he has a right to put his trust in external evidence, all the more can I!


 
  [QUOTE] God killed the whole world because of sin. God is and was harsh and cruel because He hates anything sinful. What does that have to do with circumcision? what did God ask anyone to do that was bad for them there?
God does not ASK or COMMAND us to do anything that is bad for us period! and you know it! [/QUOTE]

I know that Jesus, our lord and savior, does not like sin but he still loves all sinners. He does not kill us because we sin.

 [QUOTE]You're quoting OT verses that I don't think are relevant to this discussion. I already said there parts of the OT that still apply today and parts that don't. I don't want to diverge by asking where did God ever God "slay people without explanation and orders them to sleep with their brother's wives"? all those have explanations. people died usually because of sin, and they slept with 'brothers wives' (only when the brother had actually DIED) in order to create offspring for the dead relative. A practice that the NT rules out today. [/QUOTE]
And who are you that you get to decide which parts of the Old Testament are relevant and which parts are not? How come circumcision is still valid, but the sleeping with a brother's wife, even after death, isn't? Where is that written down? Who gets to decide that?



[QUOTE]Anyways all this is really besides the point. Please lets stay on topic. It doesn't really pertain to the real discussion and my real point: that God has never and will never ask us to do anything that is harmful to us! including circumcision!!!

All I can continue to repeat, is that the Old Testament God was brutal and vengeful. I follow the New Testament and Jesus Christ. In the NT, God was forgiving and patient. If God didn't ask us to do things that were harmful, why then did Jesus come and radicalize and replace many of the old ways? Most likely because they were harmful.

Siena
   

Siena:

@ JeSoul: I admire your passion, I think you're pretty cool!

I'd give a lot to see your expression as you type - I bet your keyboard's taking a pounding!

   
   thank you jare Siena , my expression is one close to frustration when a simple question cannot be answered. plus anyone who thinks I'm cool must be TWICE as cool!

Fufuking,
   wow, you wrote all that and still did not answer a simple question. I will resist the urge to quote and respond and correct all you've said cos you've gone waaayy off base and point. I don't want to turn this thread into something else other than about simple circumcision.

Nairalanders,
for those of you who believe in God, please can you answer this simple question: does God ever ASK or COMMAND us to do anything that is bad for or harmful to us? Yes or No?

  if the answer is no, then that means since He asked the Isrealites to circumsize themselves, it must not have been bad for them - spiritually or physically.

  End of story, simple, kapish, finish. I don't know why fufuking is bringing up all kind of wahala and quotes and etcera. I will let my fellow Nairalanders be the judge of this discussion. I'm out!

Circumcision to the Jews of the old testament was a form of physical covenant between them and God. That was why no uncircumcised male could eat of the passover.

Today our covenant with Christ is now spiritual, without hands. Whether we circumcise our male children or not it no longer has any biblical significance. I will definitely circumcise my boys if i have any, for purposes of hygeine strictly.

Seun,

So you made a huge decision like this based on a single article? I think not!

My guess is that what ticked you off was the phrase "Jewish tradition". You seem to be quite anti-establishment and want to carry it on to your unborn son.

If it had been an Arab man married to a Jewish woman (yes it exists) and the man was initially against circumcision based on his tradition, but after considering his Jewish wife's passionate plea went ahead to circumcise the boy to preserve the unity of the family, I'm 100% sure that you would not have made the same resolution not to circumcise your unborn baby boy.

JeSoul:

  Siena
       
   thank you jare Siena , my expression is one close to frustration when a simple question cannot be answered. plus anyone who thinks I'm cool must be TWICE as cool!

Fufuking,
   wow, you wrote all that and still did not answer a simple question. I will resist the urge to quote and respond and correct all you've said because you've gone waaayy off base and point. I don't want to turn this thread into something else other than about simple circumcision.

Nairalanders,
for those of you who believe in God, please can you answer this simple question: does God ever ASK or COMMAND us to do anything that is bad for or harmful to us? Yes or No?

  if the answer is no, then that means since He asked the Isrealites to circumsize themselves, it must not have been bad for them - spiritually or physically.

  End of story, simple, kapish, finish. I don't know why fufuking is bringing up all kind of wahala and quotes and etcera. I will let my fellow Nairalanders be the judge of this discussion. I'm out!

Tell that to the boys who suffer from penile adhesions, meatal stenosis and glans amputation. Look at the report I posted. If that is not physical harm, then I don't know what is.

I've answered all of your questions, the problem is the answer is not to your liking. You believe that it is impossible for God to have commanded an act which might have been harmful. I do not. Especially the when it comes to the Old Testament. If there was nothing wrong with the Old Testament ways, why did Jesus come and change everything? Thank you.

And you didn't answer any of my questions, which parts of the Old Testament have been thrown out and which have we kept as Christians?

i don't think circumcision today is a religious thing (except with jews etc). it is more health thing. i know my hygiene habits as a young teen, they were not the best. and there were dozens of guys like that in my high school. first of all, we discover masturbation. then we are not the cleanest. i find it hard to believe that the person who forgets to wear deodorant in the morning, will actually spend time washing the old semen trapped in his foreskin. you don't want to hear the smegma tales of horror i have heard in my life.

fair play if the OP can instruct his son in proper hygiene. it will probably work out for him. as i said, 'Raging Bull' is easier to clean and given most times im fighting a losing battle to be on time for things, i cant see myself spending the extra time necessary to clean my cock.

oh and it may havesomething to do with hot countries as well. the extra heat causes extra bacteria buildup i think. i know this cos my friend who's white but was born in saudi arabia (his parents are teachers who were teaching there at the time) had it done when he was born. its not a religious thing for them, they are devoutly unreligious, its more of a health thing.

and as far as i know, the method they used on me involved them starving the foreskin of blood, thus killing the nerve endings, and then cutting it off.

Fufu King:

Tell that to the boys who suffer from penile adhesions, meatal stenosis and glans amputation. Look at the report I posted. If that is not physical harm, then I don't know what is.

can see ur point.
well if u are educated,u definately wanna know the kind of people dats going to perform the circumcision.

@Jesoul,

I never saw it from that angle before now, thank you for bringing a new thinking into this, that is why i like this kind of discussions.

It is true that God cannot tell us to do what is bad for us, if we take a good look at those laws in the OT, God actually made some laws concerning health issues and general welfare of the people.

Fro example, laws concerning leprosy were to guide against an epidemic.

In the same line, it could be that God"s law concerning circumcision (in the OT) was for both spiritual and physical purpose.

I'm amazed at how people are so shocked by someone being anti circumsion.

My dick is fully intact and I am very happy to have it that way, I don't cut any other parts of my body off so why should anyone mess with the most important one!!! It was put there for a reason, let it STAY!!