ijawkid:


If Jesus says he is d alpha and omega its ur duty to find out in what way he's d alpha and omega........

Is it that he is Yahweh or that he is d alpha and omega in another sense..........

If some1 tells u now that Jesus is lucifer u'll run around d whole nairaland telling d person its heresy.....

But Jesus himself said he is the bright morning star(lucifer).........

But in another sense......

D title ""alpha and omega"" applies in its own way to Jesus not d way it applies to his Father Yahweh..............

If u ignore 1corinthians 15:27 $ 28 then ur nt willing to face d truth in front of u.......

Jesus is Alpha and Omega in the way God is, like no other , the everlasting father, the eternal God. There is no other sense. Lucifer means morning star in latin, that's not new knowledge. But general knowledge and common understanding should be noted. General knowledge refers to satan as lucifer. satan itself simply means adversary BTW. Generaly, when we say devil, it refers to that old serpent satan, same goes for the word lucifer. There are though a thousand and one other devils. It's like a painting of Jesus, we know that's not Jesus but simply an illustration, without unnecessary complicating things.
Jesus is Alpha and Omega, the first and the last, the Almighty, undeniable.

I'm not ignoring the corinthian passage, I just feel it's an unneeded complication in understanding the simple issue placed before us. The OP asks, is Jesus Almighty? Jesus Himself replies in Revelation saying "I am Almighty". settle that simple line first before throwing in what ofs and what nots

Image123: I'm not ignoring the corinthian passage, I just feel it's an unneeded complication in understanding the simple issue placed before us. The OP asks, is Jesus Almighty? Jesus Himself replies in Revelation saying "I am Almighty". settle that simple line first before throwing in what ofs and what nots

Now who told u it was Jesus that said he is d almighty in that passage u read in revelation??

Was it not Yahweh who made that statement

U have to really look out that 1corinthians to make ya final conclusions......

Or u might arrive @ d fact that in as much as Jesus is d almighty,an almightier being greater than Jesus exists.........

If not how wuld u explain 1corinthians....

And u didn't explain d lucifer thing well.....

Lucifer is not a title that belongs to satan or a world power alone....

Jesus also bears that name or title....

But it never makes him d devil or d same as d devil......

There r so many reasons that does refute why Jesus can't be d almighty......

Except u guys kill Yahweh.....

@ Image123,

One thing I have always encouraged you to do when you study (not just reading and memorizing, am not saying you just read and memorize anyway, just pointing) the word is to deal with context. Now, let's look at this,

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth Gen.1:1

AND

In the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God and the Word was God. John 1:1

In these two scriptures, the both have the phrase, "In the beginning" Do you think they are talking about the same thing or do you think both phrase mean the same thing? Context is the key my brother. Now, I will give you assignment to look up the Almighty you are referring to in Rev. 1:8 in the context and you may come back want to come back to explain to us what you found out. Yes, that verse say the Almighty but you need to get the meaning of that Almighty by the context. If Jesus is the "Almighty" in quote, then what position does God - the father (YHWH or Yahweh) take?

Also, looking at the John 1:1 quoted above. There are two people called "God" in the same context. Are they the same? No! There is a Word that was in the beginning that was called God, which is Jesus AND there is a "God" that the Word was "WITH" in the beginning. Kindly look up the meaning to the context of Almighty in Rev. 1:8 and you may wish to dig deeper on that,okay.

First of all we serve one God and not three. Also, the trinity is not a ranking system of sorts (my bible doesn't tell me so) Notice that before the new testament there was no Jesus Christ or Holly Ghost in operation so to speak. When Christ is prophesied about, It was literally describing God coming to dwell among men.
Matthew 1:23 Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel, which is translated, God with us.

Also, notice the description of the Child to be born as prophesied by Isaiah bears characteristics by which we describe the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit yet it is talking about one person.
Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Now introducing Christ in John 1, we see that He is God's Word made flesh and living among men. Jesus is only called the Son of God because of His incarnation (He was born of God). Study John 1:1-18. It is interesting to note that the only other man called Son of God is Adam (Luke 3:38. I believe this is because they didn't come by sex but directly from God.
This is also what is meant by being born-again.
John 1:12-13 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Also read John 3:1-21 especially 3-7
3 Jesus answered and said to him, Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus said to Him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mothers womb and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Do not marvel that I said to you, You must be born again.

Jesus Christ was fully God and also fully man while on earth, He aged, He was hungry, He got tired, He felt pain, He bled, He sweated, He cried, He urinated and defecated, He slept, He walked about, ate and drank, He was in every way a man and yet he was full of God and did not sin ever ..........and then he died for us, paying the full price for our sins. That's how much God loves us.

God as man was subject to God in Heaven and this would explain why Christ would pray to God. When Jesus promised us the Holy Spirit, He spoke of another comforter (John 14:16) which would suggest that Jesus was a comforter Himself and now the Holy Spirit prays for us with groanings that cannot be uttered (Romans 8:26) again "GOD with us - Immanuel".

God is one omnipotent and omnipresent Spirit. Perhaps the place the bible describe the relationship in the trinity is
John 17:21-23
I pray that they will all be one, just as You and I are one—as You are in Me, Father, and I am in You. And may they be in Us so that the world will believe You sent Me. "I have given them the glory You gave Me, so they may be one as We are one. I am in them and You are in Me. May they experience such perfect unity that the world will know that You sent Me and that You love them as much as You love Me.

You can also read John 8 culminating in verse 58 where He says before Abraham I AM,
or Philipians 2:5-8. I especially like how the NLT renders it;
You must have the same attitude that Christ Jesus had. Though He was God, He did not think of equality with God as something to cling to. Instead, He gave up His divine privileges; He took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When He appeared in human form, He humbled Himself in obedience to God and died a criminal's death on a cross.

So what have I been saying?
There is only one God Yahweh who is an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent Spirit, He is revealed to us in three personalities, The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. These three personalities are in perfect unity and are the same one God. It is not a hierarchy.
The perfect unity of the trinity is the same perfect unity of spirit that must exist among those who are born-again.

So yes, Jesus Christ is God Almighty.

Goshen360: @ Image123,

One thing I have always encouraged you to do when you study (not just reading and memorizing, am not saying you just read and memorize anyway, just pointing) the word is to deal with context. Now, let's look at this,

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth Gen.1:1

AND

In the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God and the Word was God. John 1:1

In these two scriptures, the both have the phrase, "In the beginning" Do you think they are talking about the same thing or do you think both phrase mean the same thing? Context is the key my brother. Now, I will give you assignment to look up the Almighty you are referring to in Rev. 1:8 in the context and you may come back want to come back to explain to us what you found out. Yes, that verse say the Almighty but you need to get the meaning of that Almighty by the context. If Jesus is the "Almighty" in quote, then what position does God - the father (YHWH or Yahweh) take?

Also, looking at the John 1:1 quoted above. There are two people called "God" in the same context. Are they the same? No! There is a Word that was in the beginning that was called God, which is Jesus AND there is a "God" that the Word was "WITH" in the beginning. Kindly look up the meaning to the context of Almighty in Rev. 1:8 and you may wish to dig deeper on that,okay.

Wow , this is where we disagree.

GOD is ONE, to suggest that GOD is 3 is just not right !

God is the Father, is the Son and has a Spirit called the Holy Spirit.

"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." - 1 Timothy 3:16

Mr_Anony: First of all we serve one God and not three. Also, the trinity is not a ranking system of sorts (my bible doesn't tell me so) Notice that before the new testament there was no Jesus Christ or Holly Ghost in operation so to speak. When Christ is prophesied about, It was literally describing God coming to dwell among men.
Matthew 1:23 Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel, which is translated, God with us.

Also, notice the description of the Child to be born as prophesied by Isaiah bears characteristics by which we describe the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit yet it is talking about one person.
Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Now introducing Christ in John 1, we see that He is God's Word made flesh and living among men. Jesus is only called the Son of God because of His incarnation (He was born of God). Study John 1:1-18. It is interesting to note that the only other man called Son of God is Adam (Luke 3:38. I believe this is because they didn't come by sex but directly from God.
This is also what is meant by being born-again.
John 1:12-13 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Also read John 3:1-21 especially 3-7
3 Jesus answered and said to him, Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus said to Him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mothers womb and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Do not marvel that I said to you, You must be born again.

Jesus Christ was fully God and also fully man while on earth, He aged, He was hungry, He got tired, He felt pain, He bled, He sweated, He cried, He urinated and defecated, He slept, He walked about, ate and drank, He was in every way a man and yet he was full of God and did not sin ever ..........and then he died for us, paying the full price for our sins. That's how much God loves us.

God as man was subject to God in Heaven and this would explain why Christ would pray to God. When Jesus promised us the Holy Spirit, He spoke of another comforter (John 14:16) which would suggest that Jesus was a comforter Himself and now the Holy Spirit prays for us with groanings that cannot be uttered (Romans 8:26) again "GOD with us - Immanuel".

God is one omnipotent and omnipresent Spirit. Perhaps the place the bible describe the relationship in the trinity is
John 17:21-23
I pray that they will all be one, just as You and I are one—as You are in Me, Father, and I am in You. And may they be in Us so that the world will believe You sent Me. "I have given them the glory You gave Me, so they may be one as We are one. I am in them and You are in Me. May they experience such perfect unity that the world will know that You sent Me and that You love them as much as You love Me.

You can also read John 8 culminating in verse 58 where He says before Abraham I AM,
or Philipians 2:5-8. I especially like how the NLT renders it;
You must have the same attitude that Christ Jesus had. Though He was God, He did not think of equality with God as something to cling to. Instead, He gave up His divine privileges; He took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When He appeared in human form, He humbled Himself in obedience to God and died a criminal's death on a cross.

So what have I been saying?
There is only one God Yahweh who is an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent Spirit, He is revealed to us in three personalities, The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. These three personalities are in perfect unity and are the same one God. It is not a hierarchy.
The perfect unity of the trinity is the same perfect unity of spirit that must exist among those who are born-again.

So yes, Jesus Christ is God Almighty.

Thank You , Well Said

This post is exhilarating, and may even produce sound healings. Thank you @ image123, Mr_Anony, frosbel, etc. If Nigerians, and Africans, can POSSESS such clear understanding, and worship of Jehovah, The Lord God of Israel, the creator of all things, there is indeed great hope, not only for the black race, but also for mankind as a whole. The disdain of Logic Mind, and his kind, serves very good purpose, but must be tolerated wisely, that is, never allow people like him to manifest their true nature, like Hitler, Stalin, etc.

Jesus of Nazareth is The Almighty God.

ckkris: Jesus of Nazareth is The Almighty God.

Laughing in tongues

@ frosbel,

I strongly agree in the concept of Trinity. Where there is a kind of confusion is the concept of "God". One being doesn't bear that name "God" in the Bible. So whenever you read in the scriptures the word "God", the context tells you what one is being referred to because the Father bears God, the Son bears God and the Holy Spirit also bears God. The scripture is clear as to the three being been distinct from one another but they are still God and they are one. "one" is the concept of the "unity", they never disagree but always agree not that they form one entity, so say they form one entity is to confuse the teaching of trinity. So as to Trinity, you and I don't have any disagreement, just that we might be saying things in different ways.

Goshen360: @ Image123,

One thing I have always encouraged you to do when you study (not just reading and memorizing, am not saying you just read and memorize anyway, just pointing) the word is to deal with context. Now, let's look at this,

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth Gen.1:1

AND

In the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God and the Word was God. John 1:1

In these two scriptures, the both have the phrase, "In the beginning" Do you think they are talking about the same thing or do you think both phrase mean the same thing? Context is the key my brother. Now, I will give you assignment to look up the Almighty you are referring to in Rev. 1:8 in the context and you may come back want to come back to explain to us what you found out. Yes, that verse say the Almighty but you need to get the meaning of that Almighty by the context. If Jesus is the "Almighty" in quote, then what position does God - the father (YHWH or Yahweh) take?

Also, looking at the John 1:1 quoted above. There are two people called "God" in the same context. Are they the same? No! There is a Word that was in the beginning that was called God, which is Jesus AND there is a "God" that the Word was "WITH" in the beginning. Kindly look up the meaning to the context of Almighty in Rev. 1:8 and you may wish to dig deeper on that,okay.

Goshen u see d reason why I like u.....

U reason so nice and good.....

These guys don't get to understand that Yahweh and Jesus are 2 seperate persons....

The day they come to realise it,that's d day it'll become clearer....

Thanks for ur explanation...

I told image 123 and frosbel that they'll have to kill Yahweh in order for Jesus to be d almighty......

That's y I quoted 1 corinthians 15:27 $ 28 to bortress my point on d fact that d Father and the son are so so not d same......

Ijawkid,
Are you saying that the word of your God is outside Him? Then this your dead and dumb God, is definitely not Jehovah Elohim, who SPEAKS His Word, and things appear into existence. His Word, which is always inside Him, was made flesh, and His Word is Him, Jesus of Nazareth, and there no controversy, 1Timothy 3:16

ckkris: Ijawkid,
Are you saying that the word of your God is outside Him? Then this your dead and dumb God, is definitely not Jehovah Elohim, who SPEAKS His Word, and things appear into existence. His Word, which is always inside Him, was made flesh, and His Word is Him, Jesus of Nazareth, and there no controversy, 1 Timothy 3:16

I quote 1 Tim. 3:16,

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

See the way you guys preach Trinity is sooo confusing. I believe in Trinity and I believe it can be understood. Now look at this 1 Tim. 3:16 and explain it. THE QUESTION IS WHICH "GOD" WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH? JUSTIFIED IN THE SPIRIT? SEEN OF ANGELS? PREACHED UNTO GENTILES? BELIEVED ON IN THE WORLD AND RECEIVED UP INTO GLORY? Do you think it is "God" the Father? Definitely NO and Capital NO because Jesus said No man has seen the Father but the Son (John 6:46). The "God" that manifest in the flesh is the "SON" Jesus who is also God. The same was the "God" that Preached and "RECEIVED" up, meaning ascended up into glory OR DID YOU EVER READ "GOD" THE FATHER WAS RECEIVED UP? The concept of Trinity is NOT complicated as some of you guys make it complicated. That's why people don't understand it. The context of 1 Tim. 3:16 clearly call proved it is "God" the son that manifest in the flesh, NOT the father but the Father, Son and Spirit are still God.

Image123: I'm not ignoring the corinthian passage, I just feel it's an unneeded complication in understanding the simple issue placed before us. The OP asks, is Jesus Almighty? Jesus Himself replies in Revelation saying "I am Almighty". settle that simple line first before throwing in what ofs and what nots

It will be better u read that passage of Rev 1 v 8 again. Jesus did not say he was the almighty, God Jehovah was the one who said so. Jesus himself said in John 14 v 28 that the father is greater than he is. Whn asked about the time of the end, he said he did not knw but only the father and in 1 Cor 11 v 3, the bible said the head of the christ is GOd. These scriptures among many others simply shows that Jesus and God are not equal or one.

The Word of God was made flesh. Please remember the SEMA, pronounced shema. Deuteronomy 6:4, Hear oh Israel , the LORD your God, (Elohim, plural in Hebrew), is ONE LORD.. Man, we are the people of The Book, The Book of Life. Rejoice! JESUS IS LORD.

Goshen360:

I quote 1 Tim. 3:16,

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

See the way you guys preach Trinity is sooo confusing. I believe in Trinity and I believe it can be understood. Now look at this 1 Tim. 3:16 and explain it. THE QUESTION IS WHICH "GOD" WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH? JUSTIFIED IN THE SPIRIT? SEEN OF ANGELS? PREACHED UNTO GENTILES? BELIEVED ON IN THE WORLD AND RECEIVED UP INTO GLORY? Do you think it is "God" the Father? Definitely NO and Capital NO because Jesus said No man has seen the Father but the Son (John 6:46). The "God" that manifest in the flesh is the "SON" Jesus who is also God. The same was the "God" that Preached and "RECEIVED" up, meaning ascended up into glory OR DID YOU EVER READ "GOD" THE FATHER WAS RECEIVED UP? The concept of Trinity is NOT complicated as some of you guys make it complicated. That's why people don't understand it. The context of 1 Tim. 3:16 clearly call proved it is "God" the son that manifest in the flesh, NOT the father but the Father, Son and Spirit are still God.

Remember that 1timothy 3:16 u quoted is a latin vulgate extract that has been debunked a long time ago......

The word word theos wasn't used there in 1tim in d original greek text, but as usual d catholics added it....

U shuld know that.........

My point is any1 can call Jesus God..,I don't care...

But I won't stand and hear people say Jesus is equal to his Father or is d same as d Father(Yahweh)..


Its complete heresy or a misconception....

They are different persons and 1 is greater than the other...

That's my point and my stand....

Ijawkid,
I'm glad you're on.

ckkris: Ijawkid,
Are you saying that the word of your God is outside Him? Then this your dead and dumb God, is definitely not Jehovah Elohim, who SPEAKS His Word, and things appear into existence. His Word, which is always inside Him, was made flesh, and His Word is Him, Jesus of Nazareth, and there no controversy, 1Timothy 3:16

If Jesus was Yahwehs literal words then who spoke from heaven during Jesus's baptism??


From ur notion ur implying that when Jesus came to d earth(because u literally think Jesus is Yahwehs voice),Yahweh was dumb.....

Couldn't utter any word because his voice or word has become flesh on earth.....

If we hold on to ur opinion then u failed my bro...

Yahweh spoke from heaven while Jesus was on earth,saying ""this is my son,d beloved,whom I have appointed""

Now u have to really understand what it means when it is said Jesus is d word of God.....


Ok let me tell u something...

We all call the bible the word of God don't we??

Is d bible physically God or Gods voice?

I want u to answer that....

Apart from Jesus,the bible is also called Gods word which we have in our homes..................


When Jesus is called d word of God,it doesn't mean Jesus is in Yahwehs vocal cords or that Jesus is literally Yahwehs mouth,lips and speech.....

It means Jesus is Yahwehs spokes man,just like moses,all d prophets of God were Yawehs mouth piece in a symbolic sense.......

Jesus told us a lot about Yahweh...

He came to sanctify his Fathers name...

He preached about Yahweh to all of us......

Now listen to these scriptures.....

John 5:19 $ 30

Do u hear Jesus speaking in those words??

It is what Jesus hears from the Father that he speaks not that Jesus is d literal mouth of Yahweh..because ofcus he isn't Yahweh.....

Jesus said he can't do a thing of his own initiative,except what d Father (Yahweh) tells him to do....

Jesus as an obedient son and servant of Yahweh declared d excellencies of Yahweh.......

In that sense he was d word of God........

ckkris: The Word of God was made flesh. Please remember the SEMA, pronounced shema. Deuteronomy 6:4, Hear oh Israel , the LORD your God, (Elohim, plural in Hebrew), is ONE LORD.. Man, we are the people of The Book, The Book of Life. Rejoice! JESUS IS LORD.

Sir, you are confusing your knowledge. I appreciate your but you are not putting the teaching right. Where you quoted, "The Word with upper case "W", is used as a title or another name for Christ and different from when the lower case "w" is used. You cannot have "W"ord of God because that will mean God of God because Christ is referred to as the "W"ord. Its one of the many names of Christ apart from the three being called "God". It is Christ, the "W"ord that was made flesh NOT the Father.

Also, you quoted LORD God....is One. This is where many confuse. Whenever you "LORD" (all capitalized) in scriptures, that is the YHWH which is being pronounced Yahweh in Hebrew and you will read it with the difference "God" attached to it. Elohim is God and it's plural as you said, meaning "God" is not the name of one person. For instance, Gen 1:1,

In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

This "God" here is Elohim and it is plural meaning, The Father is God, was in the beginning. The son is God, and was in the beginning. The Holy is God and was in the beginning. The is why "Elohim" is God in plural but still ONE.

logicboy:

When I was still a catholic, I thought that I could explain the Trinity with my mobile phone- the mobile phone is a calculator, a clock and a phone at the same time. However, that is just rubbish because, the calculator part of the phone can not exist apart from the phone unlike Jesus who can exist apart from God the Father.

who told u? Jesus never said he exists outside d father, he said both of 'em are one. Nd also he said what he does he'd seen d father do.

Ijawkid,
Hebrew 4:12, The Word of God IS alive, and they are Spirit and Life, John 6:63. If the written word (letters), doesn't lead to The Word, people will argue endlessly. The physical bible is not God, and cannot pursue evil spirits, as people assume. The Word of God is power. JESUS IS LORD. Honestly, I enjoy your views. Thanks.

yoji: This is jus absurd. Reason tells us dat the facts of a case naturally leads to its conclusion, but wat defenders of this trinity do is first arrive @ a conclusion, then look for pits and pieces to justify it. Its jus typical of rebellious mankind dat, when d bible says one thing, we turn round and say ours. When d disciples called jesus Good, jesus scolded them sayin, nobody is good but God! Yet someone wants us to blieve otherwise. The same jesus when asked for when d world would end said he didn't know but only God knew, yet someone xpects us to believe otherwise. And dat refernce to him sayin I and d father are one as him being d same entity as God is lame cos its like if ur boss sends u to represent him in a meetin and d other pple @ d meetin insist on seein ur boss, u can say u and ur boss r one in d sense that d message u r bringing is approved by d man they want 2 c as he sent u as a representative. All dat tries to do is get pple focused on d message and not d messenger. It doesn't mean he is d same entity as his sender. So if jesus was God, u mean he created a woman, then incubated himself in his own creation for 9 months?? If he was fully human on earth, wat kept d world togethr? Only someone who despises knowledge will ignore d historical fact dat trinity was a concept formulated long after d death of jesus but constantine to unite d various christian ideologies @ dat time to make his rule easier. Pls google council of nicea

sound point!

@ijawkid

Now who told u it was Jesus that said he is d almighty in that passage u read in revelation??

Was it not Yahweh who made that statement

Like i've earlier said, i do not possess the powers to open your understanding, neither do i guarantee anyone understanding these things. they are great mysteries, and praise God, you do not need them to obtain the basics of pleasing God, or even getting to Heaven as a pilgrim. It's more of theology, not grace. But nonetheless, accurate theology. one of you says it's not Jesus talking, the other says it's Jesus but the context. na wa oo. It's like A saying 2+2 = 22 and B saying 2+2 =4.0004.. None of you is right.
Firstly, it's Jesus that is speaking in Revelations. It is His Revelation BTW.


Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Rev 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
Those red letter bibles should help you since you have trouble figuring out who's speaking. But still, the chapter is clear as to who is speaking. I'm surprised i'm even having to explain this, this plain english.


Rev 1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
Jesus is God Almighty, just as the Father is God Almighty. they are both God and One, that's the mystery. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likenes[/b]s: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

U have to really look out that 1corinthians to make ya final conclusions......

Or u might arrive @ d fact that in as much as Jesus is d almighty,an almightier being greater than Jesus exists.........

If not how wuld u explain 1corinthians....

As you please..
[b]1Co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, [b]then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all. [/b]
The verse itself seems to suggest At face value that jesus is currently not subject to the Father, but will be in the future. If we read it with just structure, lexis and grammar, isn't that what that verse implies? Is that true, that Jesus is currently not subject to the Father? It would only lead to more confusion except god helps you, and you understand the sacrifice Jesus made for us. It was a sacrifice well encapsulated in a passage already quoted on this thread.
Philipp 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Philipp 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Because of us, for His love for us, He left His glory, and took on Him the form of a man, a Son, to save us. he did it for us, to set us an example, a perfect example. To bring us into Sonship, He became Son. He was the Son of man as well as the Son of God. He lowered for us. It doesn't in the eternal scheme make Him a lesser God, or of low quality. It's a positon He took for us, to save us. But He remains the Everlasting Father, the Almighty. It's like we are sitted in heavenly places, far above all powers, yet we are still on ground earth. It's a mystery we may not fully understand, at least not in this body. It's like explaining how 1+1=2 to a dog, you can take him to the best schools with the best teachers. it's not it's realm, and you would be quite lucky to get him to understand it. We are on a realm of faith, it's on that realm that we can ever hope to have at least a semblance of understanding this. A thousand illustrations and pages from me on NL may never suffice, still i may try.

And u didn't explain d lucifer thing well.....

Lucifer is not a title that belongs to satan or a world power alone....

Jesus also bears that name or title....

But it never makes him d devil or d same as d devil......

There r so many reasons that does refute why Jesus can't be d almighty......

Except u guys kill Yahweh.....

Everybody, even little children generally refer to that serpent devil as lucifer. We can't be into war of words on this. It's just like the picture of Jesus, it's just symbolic, nothing special or to exercise hard feelings over. It's even helpful in teaching children. but we could come here and argue for years on the color of jesus and length of hair, and whther he likes white and blue color or whatever, to no profit.
1Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Goshen360,
Thanks for referring to Genesis 1, where The Trinity was introduced. But everyone MUST bear in mind that Christianity isn't polytheism. God is ONE, whether reference is made to the Godhead, The Son, or The Holy Spirit, Colossians 2:9. Its all over, from Genesis to Revelation. REJOICE.

@ ckkris,

Again, I Strongly believe in Trinity BUT the way you guys explain it to folks sometimes is being complicated and confusing. We are trying to make it simple and understandable. This is the goal. Now let's breakdown Col 2:9 in context,

For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Who is the "he" in this context and who is the "Godhead" in this context. We are NOT arguing but just simple explanation.

@ Image123,

Can you please breakdown John 1:1 and 1 Tim. 3:16 you quoted for explanation?

In the beginning was the Word, the Word was "with God" and the word was God. John 1:1

Here is the "W"ord that was God and also in this text is the "God" that the "W"ord was with.....in the beginning. Can you tell us they are both the same and one person?

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16

In this context, which "God" was manifest in the flesh? and who or which God was received up into glory?

This quetion, is a question that had caused a lot of controvesies among people. To be sincere , the flesh can not reveal the answer to this question. If one to answer this with canal mind , he will say his not right to say Jesus is God . It is just like calling Jesus the son of God. When we know God does not have wife. You know some people can argue this with their lives.

By asking if Jesus is thesame as God is just like asking if father and son are thesame. We all know that father propertis belongs to his son. The father and son are one. A father can make his son expecially is only son to be incharge of all he has. If a son is put incharge of his father's properties he can fire anybody at any time and employed anybody at anytime to his father over his father properties.He only report to his father about new development. If what he did please his father he will be proud of his father and if what he did is wrong the father will advice him on how he surposes to behave. He is the head of all his father properties but his father is head of him.He represent the father in all aspect whatever things he says, when he represents his father people believed that it was saying by his father.And a good son must seek his father's opinion when representing him.They are one but diffrent body.

Thesame about Jesus and God. They are one but diffrent body. God was the most pownrful creator of heaven and earth and what there in and he created Jesus self. But Jesus is God representative on earth .God gave Jesus an assignment to do ,mission to accomplish. This mission is that Jesus who is not a sinner like Satan should come down from his glorious position in heaven to earth,put on man flesh and walk and dwell with sinner, to expirence what they are expirence, went through temptation from satan as they are, and offer himself as sacrifice for the sin of the world by diying on the cross.This things have never be done by anybody before, no one as ever come down from heaven to earth execpt him.

God confirms Jesus to be his representative on earth in the gosple of Mathew 3: 17 by saying "this is my beloved son, in whom iam well pleased."

for this things that Jesus did what we be his reward from God? God as a way of rewarding anyaody that is obedient to him.He rewarded Abraham when he called him out of his father land by making convenant with him. Let see the reward of Jesus christ.

In the book of Daniel 7:13 Daniel saw the visions of the past " I saw in the night visions, and behold, one like the son of man came with clouds of heaven and came to the ancient of day, and they brought him near before him and there was given him dominion and glory and a kingdom,that all people, nations and language should serve him:his dominion is everlasting dominion, with shall not pass away ,and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed "

The ancient of day in this above verses is God and and one like son of man is Jesus in man flesh.Here God gave him everlasting dominion over what God created.

Jesus also testified to this in the gospel of Mathew 28:18 it read thus " And Jesus came and spake unto them ,saying all power is given unto me in heaven and the earth "

God had gave Jesus dominion, power over all he created. Jesus is God representative on earth ,he said he says to us what he heard from God in gospel of John 8 :40 ( but now ye seek to kill me,a man that had told you the truth, which i have heard of God this did not Abraham.)

So Jesus is God for he is God representative on earth. But we have one God the father, whom we include Jesus worship.

Read the gospel of John 5: 2-23 to understand this better

Image360,
You're right. Anyone that REFUSES to acknowledge the uniqueness of Jesus of Nazareth, may hardly receive further revelation and insight. But its good to put things on record. So that people can always review them.

"Then He said to Thomas, "Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and a reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing." And Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and my God!" Jesus said to him, "Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. c Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." - John 20:27-29

In Revelation, an angel instructed the apostle John to only worship God (Revelation 19:10)- At this I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, " Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy..

Several times in Scripture Jesus receives worship (Matthew 2:11; 14:33; 28:9, 17; Luke 24:52; John 9:38 ).

" On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him. Then they opened their treasures and presented him with gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh." - Matthew 2:11

" Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.” - Matthew 14:33

" Suddenly Jesus met them. “Greetings,” he said. They came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him." - Matthew 28:9

'The most important reason that Jesus has to be God is that if He is not God, His death would not have been sufficient to pay the penalty for the sins of the world (1 John 2:2). A created being, which Jesus would be if He were not God, could not pay the infinite penalty required for sin against an infinite God. Only God could pay such an infinite penalty. Only God could take on the sins of the world (2 Corinthians 5:21), die, and be resurrected, proving His victory over sin and death.' - Gotquestions

@ frosbel,

No any bible believing and bible study student will argue that Jesus is NOT God. Jesus is God, I believe but the issue here is, Is Jesus (God) the SAME as the Father (God) or Is Jesus (God) the same being/person as the Father who is also God? This is the question we are talking about.

frosbel: "Then He said to Thomas, "Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and a reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be b unbelieving, but believing." And Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and my God!" Jesus said to him, "Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. c Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." - John 20:27-29

In Revelation, an angel instructed the apostle John to only worship God (Revelation 19:10)- At this I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, " Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy..

Several times in Scripture Jesus receives worship (Matthew 2:11; 14:33; 28:9, 17; Luke 24:52; John 9:38 ).

" On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him. Then they opened their treasures and presented him with gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh." - Matthew 2:11

" Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.” - Matthew 14:33

" Suddenly Jesus met them. “Greetings,” he said. They came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him." - Matthew 28:9

'The most important reason that Jesus has to be God is that if He is not God, His death would not have been sufficient to pay the penalty for the sins of the world (1 John 2:2). A created being, which Jesus would be if He were not God, could not pay the infinite penalty required for sin against an infinite God. Only God could pay such an infinite penalty. Only God could take on the sins of the world (2 Corinthians 5:21), die, and be resurrected, proving His victory over sin and death.' - Gotquestions

How can the almighty God die........

Then is he God again

U just rushed thru everything forgetting that d almighty cannot die,but Jesus did......

No do oo........


The explanations given on this forum are just enough......

Jesus isn't Yahweh.......

Yahweh is greater than Jesus.....

Yahweh and Jesus aren't equals....

Shikena....