USAfall2024:


Let your Foden get a FIFA or Balon D'or podium finish before we start any conversation on him being a top player. Foden hasn't done shit to deserve building a whole England National team around him. Ronaldo, Messi, Zidane were all top 3-5 players in the world before they had super teams built around them. Foden needs to do much more before he can get such perks!

Even KDB had to force his way to be City's main man under Pep. He wasn't given on platter. I don't have any argument with you bro. I just wanted to clear you on this fact: Foden isn't shit until he proves it!

Where is Jude's podium finish? Kane's nko?

Take note: I never called Foden the best player in the world or anything like that. I am strictly discussing his talent quantity.

Leyqute:


But Phil Foden played 42 games for his 28 G+A in a team that just won the trebble. You can’t compare that to what Messi did in 2008.

First, I'm not comparing it to Messi. I am showing you those numbers were not otherworldly or fantastic. So no, it was not numbers that prompted Pep to build around Messi. It was talent quantity. Messi was just too talented to be used as only a winger.

I compared Foden's numbers to Jude's. Somehow one is not consistent even though his best games have come as a 10 while the other is best player in the world even though his numbers are from playing in a more advanced position- and in a significantly weaker league.

USAfall2024:


The Zidane take is so off-point that it doesn't deserve a response.

What is off point about it? Before I accuse you of not knowing what it means to be off point.

USAfall2024:


@the bolded: Messi finished 2nd in 2007 FIFA World Best voting. He came 2nd again in 2008 based on his 2007/08 performance. This was before Guardiola became Barca coach. Bros abeg stop yarning nonsense

I assume you were going to make a point at the end of this but you must have forgotten to.

I can point out your folly if you need me to, game?

Messi was FIFA best last year 2023. Did you agree with it?

USAfall2024:


Ajax also trashed us 4-1 at home in 2018/19. That game was even more embarrassing to me than the Man City game. Barca has trashed us 5-0, 4-0. Same for Tico who gave us 4-0. Bad games like these aren't uncommon to Madridstas. City beating us 4-0 was a bad day so no need making it seem like it was our doomsday. Madrid was bad last season and City capitalized on our poor form to humiliate us. We couldn't even win the league against an average Barca side.

We're better this season (topping La liga) and on better form. These QF matches will be interesting. City might be the favorites (55-45), but I am confident we will go triumph City across both legs.

That Ajax game maybe embarrassing to you but your players called City game their worst. It was a complete humiliation. Some even say that first half is the best piece of football ever played in history. Come on.

I am not saying the same would happen now. I actually respect RM. I even said City being home in the 2nd leg without away goals is my slight hope for beating you guys.

Leyqute:


29 goal contributions in 40 games being coached by a finished Frank Rijkaard is moin moin?

How many goal contributions does your Foden have?

16 goals and 13 assists does not justify being placed over Ronaldinho and Etoo the latter who scored more than Messi in less games.

It was Pep who knew that Messi could score and assist a lot more if used rightly. He built the team around him and made sure he got the ball at moments he could do the most damage and then Messi became a 50-goal a season player.

Foden has 28 G+A this season already. Same number as Jude Bellingham by the way but one of them has played as a striker for most of the season.

forgiveness:


If you don't know, ask. This is not about thinking but pure verified facts.

The data will also show you how it was scored. Understand?

See how he scored. Does it look like pk?

Who is playing LW in that picture you uploaded?

forgiveness:


What brings a player individual accomplishment? Lamba!?? Kkkk

You're very funny.

If I tell you talent volume you start asking why Foden has not won EPL player of the season award.

What is EPL player of the year if not an individual accomplishment?

Again I ask, do you even understand what is being discussed?

Leyqute:


Nah. Not credit. He was there in 2006 but the team wasn’t built around him.

By 2007 his numbers were becoming consistent and when Pep joined in 2008, building around him was a no brainer.

Aha! Only problem is this is not true in any way. This was Messi's numbers in 2007/08 before Pep.

Bacteria8:


Why are you trying to make a mountain out of a molehill ??

We also did same to them back in 2022...when we run them down from 4-2 to 4-5.

And the following season, they didn't have any "PTSD"
Because that's football.

I love your logical analysis... until you started becoming emotional letting your bias get the better of you. Calm down cheaf. Stick to logic, not emotions.

2 things.

1. City were better than you both home and away when you won. So what will bring the PTSD? Have you not lost games to teams you were better than?

2. City did not eke out a win against RM. You were absolutely walloped. PTSD is coming from the fact that it literally looked like Men vs Boys. It was not 2-1 or 6-5. You were disgraced 5-1.

Don't forget.

airmark:


If Sterling and Philips could win an award that Foden hasn't won at 23 that Kane won it, then he is not him.

You are even dancing up and down because of an u17 award that one Sani Emmanuel won. You are shameless.
Kane was Epl golden boot winner at 23. List any individual award won by Foden at 23 in Epl.

What about being the PFA and EPL Young player of the year BACK TO BACK?

Hope you know this implies not just better than players from England but all players in and around the same age playing in England.

Kane won it ONCE. Foden TWICE.

Airhead.

Leyqute:


Pep took over Barca in 2008. Messi was part of the team that won the UCL in 2006. Go figure. Pep never coached a younger Messi.

Apart from that, not all teams are built around one particular player.

Are we giving Messi credit for 2006 UCL?

Please look at Messi's numbers in 2006 and 2007 before Pep and see if you can reconcile that with his numbers in 2008.

airmark:


If Sterling and Philips could win an award that Foden hasn't won at 23 that Kane won it, then he is not him.

You are even dancing up and down because of an u17 award that one Sani Emmanuel won. You are shameless.

Kane was Epl golden boot winner at 23. List any individual award won by Foden at 23 in Epl.

You are trying to compare ENGLAND player of the year with WORLD player (at under 17 level).

Do you know how silly you sound? You're comparing how a player compares to others from his Nationality to how a player compares (not only to those from his country) but to others from other countries who were adjudged to be the best from their country.

I cannot continue having conversations with such an uneducated mind.

Leyqute:


A wise manager builds around consistent, top performers. SAF didn’t build around CR7 when he was inconsistent. Pep never did the same for a younger Messi. It was when those guys started showing promise on a consistent basis that their managers decided to build around them.

Foden hasn’t gotten to that level yet.

Messi did not show any consistency when Pep had announced that the team will be built around him.

Zidane has never been consistent in his life.

A manager just has to believe in a player and deploy how to maximize him by signing players that complement him and using the formation that helps said player express himself.

Zlatan vs Pep issue comes to mind here.

forgiveness:


Focus on the topic of discussion, Rooney vs Foden and stop deviating.

Now, who is better? Why has Foden not won shingbin epl player of the year? Dem hold em destiny?

The discussion is talent level. Foden still has ways to go to meet Rooney's accomplishments.

Let me break it down for you. By 2005 Ronaldinho was convinced that he was not the most talented player at Barca - Messi was yet Rijkaard could not see it right?

Did Messi have 2 WPOTY awards or Ballon dors @ the time? No. Yet Ronaldinho knew that Messi's talent superceded his.

Talent does not always correlate with accomplishments. Neymar is more talented than any version of Mbappe. But Mbappe has a world cup and looks like he will accomplish more.

forgiveness:


Look at the goal ratio and tell me he can't play 3 positions adequately. Slowly.

What if 3 of those 5 goals came via a spot kick? Did your data show you that?

How does your data account for playing that position adequately? Goals? You mean like Julian Alvarez having almost double digit assists this season playing mostly from midfield meaning he does it adequately?

Critical thinking should be a major degree on its own.

forgiveness:



Are you joking or what? Or do you mean Foden is on the same level with Rooney? Hmmm!!!

Why has your Foden not won shingbin epl player of the season?

Mr man, off and drop the mic.

I hope you understand what you are responding to.

Every player in the world is better than City players. Every manager is better than Pep.
But a fraud manager and his overrated players keep winning all and by the end of the season again I'll be reading "how can anyone compete?".

E no dey hard una. Shameless people.

airmark:


List all individual awards won by your Foden before clocking 24. Let's compare with Kane's.

1 England's player of the year award sinks all the local govt awards Foden got.

LOL.

An award won by Kalvin Phillips and Raheem Sterling? That award? The one you can get with no recognized competition within a year - just friendlies with ninnies?

But winning a world cup at U-17 for your country as the best player of the whole tournament is everything to sneeze at?

LOL

forgiveness:


What's my business with Foden's position? Did I argue that?

The point remains your claim was false. Kane can play more that 2 positions. EOD.

He cannot is what I am saying. He has to be VG (very good) enough to add it in his repertoire. Messi has scored headed goals - as has Haaland but nobody will pen it down as a "skill" they have because of its ineffectuality.

Otherwise I can claim that Alvarez is also a midfielder because Pep has played him there few times. He is not because even though he may have scored a goal or 2 playing from there- he does not play it very well enough to add it to his positions.

Read. Slowly.

andrewbaba44:


At least it’s Kane

My guy talk say foden na better talent than Rooney

If you are referring to me I said Rooney isn't and has never been a FAR FAR superior talent to Foden. I have always put them on equal footing. Nobody will ignore KDB or Haaland to build around Rooney based on a seriatim.

No manager that wins as much as Pep will do that. SAF built around CR7 vs Rooney. Even though Rooney showed more promise at a younger age. A wise manager builds around who can more than likely guarantee winning. Benzema vs CR7 etc.

What did Dortmund win with Haaland out and the team built around Jude? Not directed at you. I'm just laughing for future sake.

Leyqute:


LooL.

Foden couldn’t dislodge Riyad Mahrez, Rahim Sterling and even Bernardo Silva who isn’t a proper winger. He just looks lost in that English squad.

I’m waiting to see what Southgate will cook up this summer tho.

You know Foden had an appendix issue last season?

Bacteria8:

Lol
That's why they're professional players. That's not even the first time Vini and Valverde will get their asses dunked by 4goals in the UCL!

Don't worry baba... we will see

Where they did not pass the ball more than 13 times in more than 20 mins of football?

A whole RM?

forgiveness:


It's now adequately!!!?

Oga, just admit Kane can play more than 2 positions. Shikena!!!! All this one na. Grammar.

There is a reason I am selective about people I engage.

Do you know transfermrkt is also indicating different positions for Foden than I had even mentioned like LM and RM? Does that not mean Foden plays 7 positions now or I can ignore that one for Foden since it does not help your illogic?

Jodera:

You're still buttressing my point.

All these examples you gave, they're all spines/core players in their clubs and I mean top clubs.

Zidane(Madrid)/Henry(arsenal)— both are core players in top club not just in one season

Xavi(Barca)/ Fabregas (arsenal)— both are core players in top club not just in one season

And so on.

In this England squad, Kane(Tottenham/Bayern), Bellingham (Dortmund/Madrid) and Saka (arsenal) are real core players in their respective clubs. So it's natural for any coach to build his team around any of them.

Foden(until this season) wasn't a core player. While it's not his fault due to the presence of Kdb, how do you expect a national team coach to build his team around him?

They are real core players in teams that win less than City and whose core players are not as good as City's core man?

Will any team build around Jude over KDB and not be treated like a useless team?

Bear in mind, Mou was going to build Barca around Ronaldinho and leave Messi as a winger. How would Messi's career have turned out if that was the case?

For context, look for Messi's performances when he was not the core man - like PSG. What did the French Press think about Almighty Messi?

airmark:


Android17 Eruditor, can argue that Garri is made from groundnuts and post 100,000 words to defend it.

Not that one won a world cup at the age the other was struggling at Leyton Orient?

Not that any individual award Kane had, Foden has doubled it?

You tried to squeeze in World Cup in 2018 when Kane was 25 years? When will you ever learn to be shameless?

Jodera:
Android say make dem build England around Foden.

Why not Man City build around Foden first let's see how good and consistent he is before thinking about England doing so.

Any player whom a top country builds around must certainly be a big player in his club. The Saka, Kane and Bellingham are all starters at top club for at least 2 years and they're all spine in their teams but no, England should leave them and build around Foden on a platter.

Na so

The same reason France was built around Zidane not Henry when both were playing. KDB is in conversations for being the greatest ever player in EPL history so Foden has to adjust for him. Same way Fabregas was not deployed in midfield when better midfielders like Xavi, Iniesta and Alonso where in the national team.

Same reason Saliba cannot get a shirt for France. Or will Odegaard play 10 for City with KdB? Or will Arteta build his team around Saka vs KDB?

Leyqute:


Bellingham is def more direct than Foden. The duo may have the same goal contributions but Bellingham has impacted more games than Foden. His contributions are spread across more matches whereas Foden has had peak performance in a handful of games.

Furthermore, Jude has created more chances and goal actions than Foden has. He’s very dangerous in and around the opposition’s box because of his immense quality on the ball.

That kind of player is easy to build around going into competitions like the World Cup or Euros because you can easily slot him into your strategy.

SAF had enough games to build a team around a budding CR7, and it was a gradual process with several experts in their positions. Replicating that with Foden in a short period with an English squad filled with talents and easy replacements is a lot of unnecessary work.

There might be a role for Foden, but based on what he’s been on about, Bellingham suits the team better and should start. Maybe Foden can up his game and carve a starting role when he comes on from the bench. Anything is possible.

Fair enough. Time will tell. Remember England have won nothing thus far. I also want them to test run Jude so that when the team fails, the matter will now depend on another coach who can use Foden better.

This will be another Oscar vs KdB issue.

Leyqute:


Foden is not as effective as Bellingham in the no 10 role. His game might be more suited to the role, but Bellingham has better numbers and even technique when he gets into that position.

But that's beside the point.

Foden at 23 might be close to Kane at 23. You may even consider him to be the better player at that age, and I won't argue with you.

The problem is that Foden is not consistent as Kane is, or hasn't shown the level of consistency that Kane has shown over the years. With Foden, you never know for a certainty what you're going to get going into a game.

No sane coach would build a team around players like that.

Everyone you mentioned - CR7, Messi, etc, had a level of consistency to their games. It's easier to build a team around someone like that.

That's why Bellingham edges him in my books. He's still young and can develop into a fantastic, consistent player but he hasn't hit that phenomenal level just yet.

Bellingham was never playing the 10 role until this season. And even at RM most of his goals have come from him being in the false 9 position not even as a 10. Their numbers (G+A) are the same this season

You're right that Foden is not consistent but that is because even at City he is not used in his best role consistently. After his MoM performance against Brentford the other week as a 10, Pep shoved him to the RW the very next game.

CR7 was not consistent until the team was built around him in 2006/7. Maybe you've forgotten when that was the criticism he used to get from 2003-2005. I think SAF even placed a bet with him on scoring 10 goals in a season. Rooney never had great numbers until CR7 left and the team was built around him. He quickly showed he was a 30goal a season player. Prior, Rooney used to do 15 goals 15 assists etc and people accused him of being inconsistent too.

WhoDeyHause:

When they call you to manage england, you ca build your team around foden.

Time will tell who is right.

Leyqute:


I think we’re yet to see the best of Foden but you’re over exaggerating his current output or talent.

Fodden might excel in several positions but he’s second best in those positions in the English squad.

He needs to up his game to be the best in one of those positions. Man was practically useless at both AM and RWF against Brazil. Bowen came on and the difference was clear as day.

Nah I am not. Half the people here just can't read.

Foden is not second best to Jude as a 10. He might be second best to other players like Saka or Rashford in the RW or LW positions but he is the best 10 at England's disposal. But that will depend on if the team builds around him.

England can decide if building around Foden is worth it versus building around say Kane or Jude. Until that he will huff and puff like Scholes did for England.

Imagine if Argentina was built around Lautaro instead of Messi or if SAF built around Rooney instead of CR7 when both played together.

All that to say, no matter how good some players are, you'll never see it if the system is not built around them. Palmer is good for Chelsea but was meh at City because the team was not built around him. City just couldn't build around him because it made better sense to do it around KdB or Haaland.

I'm indirectly saying, if England built around Foden they'll more likely win than if it was around Kane, Saka, Jude etc. And I stand by that.

airmark:


Kane got 2 Epl golden boots at 23 before clocking 24. YES or NO?



Were you at Yabaleft, eating mango peels, when you typed the emboldened below regarding Kane's goal scoring ability?




Eruditor, do you want to lose your testes this time?

Stop wasting my time with your childish rigmaroles. Had Kane won more individual awards at the same age?

Foden is a midfielder so he is not expected to score at the level of an elite striker but he had already shown better scoring ability than Kane from their breakout days. That is the interpretation to people who understand English. It means when given the chance earlier in their careers, Foden showed he could do it faster than Harry Kane.

Therefore Foden's ability to adapt to anything is more advanced at an earlier stage than Harry ended up showing. That is credit Foden.

You should consider a career in working drill bits 'cos you're a boring tool.

forgiveness:


Kane's positions

This is not exactly telling right? Son and Richarlison never really played the striker role with Kane on although that is what the formation will suggest right?

And Tottenham can win a penalty with Kane playing as the goal keeper. He will still take it and most likely score.

The data you're presenting is not very representative. Kane plays 2 positions adequately.