₦airaland Forum

afrodoc:
i never said stats should be thrown out,i only said said they are not d core tool but an adjunct AND I was talking exclusively(and i made dt clear) about PLAYER PERFORMANCE not league position of clubs or awards like highest goal scorer.dt is y d golden ball winner of d world cup or d MVP of a tournament might not have d best stats of players in his position.

so how do you determine the best player of a tournament without stats when we all know people's opinion would always differ?
statistics is the only truth - the only factual parameter. how many passes made, how many completed, key passes, assists, goals, interceptions, etc.
are you aware if all statistics of every player are combined chronologically, you can recreate a match by following each statistics recorded?
statistics can give you a picture if you know how to read it well.

afrodoc:
typical coogar ,very quick to add insults to his points.it degrades u,if u dont know.lets TRY n b above dt

i didn't insult you. . . .

dayokanu:
Can coogar print this and read it every morning?

Try and watch games live and not on the pages of Newspapers

you're a bavarian asswipe!

stats are not important but you are quick to use it to determine torres' goal ratio and blah blah blah.
what a hypocrite bayern's form has made you become?
stats are not important - united went away with 3 points, spurs were the better team for large parts of the game but they ended up with 0 points.

did the result(stats) tell you under which circumstance spurs lost?
did the result show spurs were understrength without bale, van der vaart and parker and united had a stronger team on show?
dayokanu, are you a troglodyte?

afrodoc:
which means u would hav to ask some1 who rily did watch d match.proving my point which is "stats can't tell u d specific circumstances under which those passes were made!" just reeling out stats without assessing actual game play is misleading IMO.stats r an ADJUNCT tool when assessing a player's performance,they r not d core tool in assessment. if not scouts searching for buys would just log on to opta n view stats when looking for talent.watching a game esp in person at d stadium is most important.some players r stats machines n r not as gud as their stats,others r better than their stats n for others d stats give an accurate picture.
and yes d backward pass is meant to b d surest pass,giggs messed up big time

stats can't tell you the specific circumstances under which those passes are made? really?

the stats showed forward passes which we all know is often difficult than sideways or backwards.
the stats even showed the number of stats made in the attacking third where the pressure is intense from the markers.
fecking hell. . . . .one thing is certain when reeling statistics. . . .stats are facts, not sentiments. . . .if not, let's give the title to tottenham or arsenal as they have played the best football this season.

we can give the golden boot to suarez too as he has hit the post more times than anyone.
without stats, how would you judge the winner of a league, the highest goal scorer, etc?
how can you rule out statistics from football. ever heard of pro zone stats that alex ferguson even uses to choose his players for matches?
i won't be wrong to say you are unlucky to be born in the wrong century.

afrodoc:
carrick 89% giggs 89%!
but did d stats tell u dt giggs with his 89% overall pass rate and 100% short passing rate ROLLED d ball under LITTLE PRESSURE to one of d premier gunslingers in d EPL?

yes it did.
his backward pass was 13/14. . . . .carrick's backward pass was 14/14.

even if i didn't watch the game, i would be curious to know what happened to giggsy's misplaced pass knowing it was a back pass.
back passes are the surest passes ever, no?

afrodoc:
nice one.like i told u before u rely TOO MUCH on stats! can opta tell u wether his missed passes were made when his CBs were out of position or maybe he passed d box in front of d 18 yard box to an opponent while his own full backs were galloping forward on d overlap?
if u read my post well i complained abt him giving d ball away in SENSITIVE areas.
anyways mr opta wt r giggs stats for d match?

the stats tell you all you need to know.
forward pass, backwards pass, square passes and the passes made in the attacking 3rd.
what else do u need to know?

giggs:

pass completion(25/28) - 89%
received passes - 25
attacking third - 9/10
long passes - 2/2

short passes - 9/9
forward passes - 6/8
backward passes - 13/14(the misplaced pass gave spurs the goal, that b@stard giggsy! )
square passes - 6/6

afrodoc:
d goal was totally giggs fault cos he gave d ball away under no pressure.having said dt united started playing much better after giggs came on wit his gud short passing and his superior movement to paul scholes

off to opta sports to see carrick's passing stats. . . .

carrick:

pass completion ratio(72/81) - 89%
received: 66 passes
attacking third : 4/5
long pass: 1/2

short pass: 20/22
forward pass: 33/39
backward pass:18/18
square pass: 21/24


modric:

pass completion(41/48) - 85%
received passes: 38 passes
attacking third: 16/17
long pass: 2/2

short pass: 13/17
forward pass: 14/19
backward pass: 14/14
square pass: 13/15

afrodoc:
he is 20 actually   but i agree with you dt he has great potential.however to prevent him from becoming an O'shea Fergie has to decide what he is a CB,RB,DM or watever! d guy is athletically gifted but dt shouldnt give d coach carte blanche to use him in all positions

the blame should go to fergie. . . .i actually think he's better as a centre back.
yes, he would make mistakes. who hasn't made one in his career? he's 19 and his mistakes would be magnified cos he plays for the 2 of the biggest football institutions in the world. i like phil jones a lot. he's rugged, fast and has a football brain. he knows what to do with the ball when in possession and that's what makes him better than o'shea, brown, etc who never that much intelligence when they were @ old trafford.

the da silva twins are our best right backs but they are too short. with evra on the pitch against teams like stoke, liverpool, fulham, etc then it doesn't make sense to have 2 midgets in a 4-man defence unit. smalling is a centre-back, not a right back.
it is all this confusion that has added to de gea's woes this season. he had a good game today and shouldn't have conceded a goal if not for ryan giggsy's brain farts.

chamotex:
What the phack was that?

ryan giggs is a disgrace
hoofing it to row z was a better option and yet people are blaming jones.

dayokanu:
Now everyone now sees that Jones is a defensive liability

he's better than badstuber. . . .he's just short of match fitness.
there's nothing wrong with jones. . . .he was stuck in the deep end today and he's just back from a long lay-off.
it takes a toll and this boy is only 19! he starts for his country and he plays for the biggest team in his country.
i think he's got massive potential. massive one!

[quote author=Mr_TA link=topic=871307.msg10328338#msg10328338 date=1330883551]None of them have been as bad as Jones though. We've pretty much played this match with 10 men. Even at 0-3 up he's playing poorly.[/quote]carrick has been absolute class.
watch his short passes in the mid and the cross-field passes!
now giggs is beside him and making those little runs in and around.

dayokanu:
Anytime young gets the ball he tries to bend it to the far post, Everyone and their momma knows that yet this time gets on the ball and Spurs defender (Who have conceded 8goals in 2 games) still back away from him.

When Young gets the ball close him own quickly and he doesn't have any trickery to get past a traffic cone

SPurs defenders were simply useless.

A player like Nani for example has many things in his arsenal to punish but someone like Young?? Pleaseeee

yet when dzeko scored from the same position in the 1-5 mauling of spurs, you were fellating on his phallus.
you are a disgrace!

coded guy:
Now you blame the defenders for not closing him down, Give credit to the player for his brilliant display and stop misyarning abeg.

don't mind the charlatan.
how many times has modric, lennon, assou ekotto found themselves in the same position in this game and couldn't score?
even at 20 yards, young still had a lot to do to put the ball in the net.

exquisite finesse shot from the holy books of careca.

united have sodomized london clubs enough this season.

man utd 3-1 chelsea
chelsea 3-3 man utd

man utd 8-2 arsenal
arsenal 1-2 man utd

man utd 3-0 spurs
spurs 1-3 man utd

qpr 0-2 man utd

fulham 0-5 man utd.

we rule in london!
only 2 points dropped in 6 games.

dayokanu:
Spurs defenders are just amateurs.

Young is a one trick pony. Yet he gets on the ball and the Spurs defenders dont close him down.

The same naivete that ruined them vs Arsenal caught up with them again

he scored against holland.
dutch defenders are a one trick pony too.

why don't you just accept you know nada about football.
they cannot close him down cos united's strikers ran into space. . . .they dragged the defenders away from him.
that's football intelligence.

starboard and dayokanu should apologize to ashley young.

this dude is the real deal.
he makes goals, he assists and he hates london clubs.

afrodoc:
@coogar how do YOU watch football?
carrick has bin so careless with d ball in sensitive areas and modric,assou ekotto and lennon are taking turns to sodomise jones who is one  more ill timed tackle away from a red card.
anyway i dont blame you after all torres is ur football god

carrick is not the prioblem. . . . lack of movement is the problem
you can tell how many times scholes has waved his hands at the front four from their lack of movement towards him.
welbeck can't just sort his head straight. rooney was piss-poor minus the goal. the wingers haven't been isolated in a one on one situation.

without a team mate making himself available to receive a pass, you put the player in possession in confusion.
he either makes the wrong pass or he waits n waits till he's dispossessed. welbeck keeps running away from the ball immediately scholes is in possession.
rooney runs with welbeck and they leave a vacuum of space between the midfield n the attack.

players must make themselves available to the player in possession. i dunno if these boys don't watch football.
with busquets on the ball, like 7 players run towards him and he has options to pick a pass everytime. if they run away from him, he wouldn't find a pass to pick. hopefully, fergie would correct that.

chamotex:
We've scored 13 headers this season . . . it shouldn't be a shock

how many have we scored directly from corners? i think this is the 2nd goal all season.
our corners have been poor.

tottenham would come out more in the 2nd half and i think welbeck should make way for chicharito later.
the midfield 2 should be helped and scholes/carrick should be trying to find passes that would isolate nani with assou-ekotto or young with walker.


assou-ekotto is just having a stroll on the pitch - he's now the berbatov of left backs.
he could play that position with a cigarette in his mouth. what a class player he's become.

afrodoc:
yes carrick n jones hv bin d worst so far in a poor team performance

carrick n jones abi rooney n welbeck. . . .

how do you watch football?
tottenham's energetic mid-2 are putting pressure on scholes/carrick. . . .not even allowing them to look up and play a pass.
rooney n welbeck move too further away when scholes is with the ball. one of them should be making himself available for a forward pass to at least make scholesy's passes unpredictable. there's no movement at all upfront. . . .they are too static.

another ashley young assist.

danny welbeck deciding to do it alone again with plenty of options he can pass to.
lay it to the wingers n make a run to the box and pick their crosses.

the boy's football sense is beginning to piss me off.

chamotex:
I agree but remember in last season's CL final at Wembley . . . Berba didn't even make the squad, Owen was drafted in instead.

fergie n his brain-farts. . . .there was absolutely no reason to start 2 strikers that day.
barca are better than us. start with rooney as a striker, frustrate barca till the 70th minute in a flat 0-0 draw.
then introduce chicharito to come run at the tired mascherano and pique and we woulda gotten a chance.

nateevs:
It's me against the world. . . .

not really. . . . .it's just that you didn't really address the core problems of working at chelsea.
villas-boas would have been successful in mid-table teams like fulham, stoke, west brom where the immediate pressure to deliver is non-existent and where he won't be compared to jose mourinho.

only established managers can work at chelsea.
managers who have won it all and who can tell lampard to kneel down with his hands raised.
only few managers have that clout - villas boas isn't one of them.

ritchboy:
No Parker, VdV, Bale and Modric(left-wing?)? If you don't beat Spurs 10-0, I'll go on hunger strike!

i would have preferred if the big players of spurs are playing to be honest.
united players have a way of underestimating their opponents. . . . .you would see them on the pitch now with a false braggado that they only need to turn up and win the game 4-0. tottenham's rookies might surprise us.

denzel2009:
You think Jenny doesn't know about your sexcapades? Bro she is well informed, take it from me!

jenny is part of the sexcapade!

[quote author=c.fours link=topic=881313.msg10324835#msg10324835 date=1330828168]no comment.[/quote]i thought as much!

dempsey with a brace. . . .what more can you ask for from a midfielder.

chicharito played against columbia in[b] mexico [/b]on wednesday and spent 72 mins on the pitch.
obviously, he musta been jet-lagged and since welbeck only played @ wembley. . . .hernandez would be more tired than welbeck.
it makes sense. . . .if things go awry, hernandez can always come on and do the damage.

ritchboy:
Rubbish. The thread was created in April 2006, no way Torres was better than RvP in 2006.

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pay attention to the details.
the real discussion started in 2009. . . .your first post on this thread was in 2009.

Anyways, I'm glad nuccahs who think RvP started playing well yesterday are finally outing themselves as soccer illiterates. FYIz, RvP's worst performance in an Arsenal shirt is circa 7.5/10, and that was his debut season(04/05) @ 20-21. The only problems he had were his temperament(first season in particular) and not having enough time to prove himself because of injuries. It's not a coincidence he received universal acclaim the very first time he's managed to stay fit for a year.

Show me a season(you have EIGHT to choose from) RvP wasn't brilliant and I'll show you your vagi[color=Black]n[/color]a!

04/05
05/06
06/07
08/09

van persie was utter w@nk these seasons and you wouldn't put him in the top 5 strikers in the league at any time throughout these 4 seasons.

BlueDiva:
Abrahamovic interferes too much, i agree.
He has made mistakes in the past but sacking the rookie ain't no mistake.

The old players gave us the double less than 24mths ago.
You don't completely throw out the old, you do it gradually.

In the next few seasons all the old players will be history. It is inevitable.

24 months ago is a long time for players who are on the wrong side of 30.
drogba of 2 yrs ago is not the same drogba. same as lampard, malouda, terry, cech, essien, ashley cole, ivanovic, etc.
you cannot expect them to deliver the same set of results after 2 massive years. not every player does yoga like ryan giggs to keep fit.

if they were in their mid-20s when they delivered the double, then your theory would make sense.
the difference between age 31 and 33 is equivalent to age 21 and 29.
once they hit 30, they lose a yardage of pace per year. . . . .

dayokanu:
Pogrenbyak has been taking the shine off Dempsey

Good thing I sold Ba after the AFCON

that is because demspey has been moved back to his natural position.
just before pogrenbyak was acquired, dempsey played as a striker and he takes penalties for fulham as well. his stock rose in that period.

afrodoc:
and welbeck starts

it's inevitable. . . .i am sure hernandez went to mexico or some obscure country to play internationals.
he would be jet lagged. . . . .no gareth bale for tottenham so no real reason to start da silva twins.

anderson on the bench makes me happy. he's finally back.
by next week, we should have everyone back apart from fletcher, vidic and the best player on the planet(bebe).

clint dempsey to the rescue. . . .what a player. . . .
sessegnon red is a big blow, mcclean didn't deliver, ba missed a pen. . . .and bale is not playing.
this is officially the worst week for most managers unless dempsey scores a hatrick.

Ibime:
The new manager does not only have to see the old brigade through to their end. . . he has to see out these duds.

i would tear up the contracts of drogba, lampard, kalou, ashley cole, bosingwa. . . .
john terry is the only old dog i would leave in the squad with the hope that he can tattoo the ethos of the club on the brains of the new recruits.

BlueDiva:
I want to believe that sacking AVB was just to show displeasure with his style.
RDM himself is also a rookie.

I don't know if the season would be salvaged, i mean Wenger is no fool.
He is an excellent manager who wouldn't want the advantage to slip from his grip.

However, i look forward to a future without AVB in it.
I expect some dead players to go and i expect we would hire an experienced manager.

I expect we would mount a serious challenge next season if we can build the right team.
A team with experience and youth side by side.

I might be critical of Torres and call him all sorts of names.
I want Torres at Chelsea next season. With good nurturing from a decent manager, FT will pick up.
Very unlikely we will get the old FT but i expect some returns from the investment made on him.

Sacking AVB is not a magic wand that will restore the season.
However, i sincerely believe it is a very good move.

chelsea fc is a joke and i can bet if chelsea don't get rid of the mafians in the club(drogba, lampard, terry, ashley cole), the club would never progress.
it's a damn shame that roman abramovic allowed these players to have so much power to do and undo @ chelsea.
if they don't like a manager irrespective of the form of these players, they call roman up to yap yiddy yadda about the manager, they then put up shoddy performances that would result in 3 wins in 12 games which would then get the manager sacked.

how many managers has roman sacked now since he bought chelsea?
ranieri, mourinho, grant, scolari, ancelotti, villas-boas and i am sure di matteo won't last 8 moons before he gets replaced.
how does one manage a club like this in the 21st century.
the dumbest owner on planet earth is the russian billionaire.

it is on a day like this i am thankful to the glazers. . . .they might have piled up debt on man utd but they don't interfere with the football matters in the club.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria?topic=673205.msg8560620#msg8560620

not even surprised - i saw this coming that chelsea would ruin the record of this young manager.

i am willing to bet he won't survive a season in the premier league. villas-boas is an excellent manager but asking him to swim with the sharks in the premier league at this stage is premature. he won't succeed like mourinho because of one single fact - mourinho was given the resources to revamp the squad in the way he wanted. what is villa-boas going to do to the cache of old armoury already in chelsea? sell them and get new ones or he'll just continue to walk with the old dogs?

then there's the issue of the media pressure attached to managing a club like chelsea. . . .the role was bread and butter for jose mourinho. it was something he craved even before coming to england. is villas-boas that kind of man? will he act normal when skysports journalists stick their mics in his face after a bad loss? will he cope or sink under pressure like scolari did? these are the issues. chelsea will ruin this charismatic excellent manager cos if he fails to succeed, his stock will sink and it will be damn too unfortunate.

nateevs is frustrated. . . .

i hope the mods keep this thread safe till the next 12 months when we will be discussing villas-boas performance after one season - we could be discussing his departure as well. i trust nateevs though to cook more excuses. lethargic reasons like qpr's win ratio was better than chelsea's or villas-boas slept with roman's mistress and all sorts of nonsense

fear? he will be another ferguson's bi[i]t[/i]ch . . .roman keeps signing them, fergie keeps beating them and getting them sacked. the only people you can use the word fear for are the fans of arsenal, man city, tottenham, etc. . . .i support man utd and my team has won more league titles than chelsea since the roman revolution that have spent over £1 billion on chelsea.

no one here is saying villas-boas is not good enough. . . .he is an excellent manager but not suited for chelsea with the quick fire and tyrannical approach roman deploys when there's a little title drought. in any other club willing to build a squad for a short period, the young manager will excel 100%. with chelsea, where titles are meant to be delivered immediately regardless of the shape and balance of the squad, it's almost impossible.

villas-boas is an excellent manager - he pays attention to every detail. i saw one of his leaked scouting report for jose mourinho when they once worked for chelsea and boy-o-boy, i am yet to see a more detailed pre-match analysis showing the strengths n weakness of their opponent(newcastle). chelsea ended up winning 3-0.

the only glitch here is. . . . . .will chelsea create an enabling environment for this man to thrive? in any other club in the top 5, i will be very wary of what villas-boas will add but @ chelsea, i don't think so. the question of power player is there(john terry, frank lampard, drogba), then there's the owner who behaves like a tyrant and there are other issues as well.

i can't wait for next season. . . . .it looks promising already