₦airaland Forum

jonbellion:
please tell him oo
Diests and thiests are not the same
Diests reject religous Gods same with athiests
Even on this forum Diests are mistaken for athiests

I've seen plenty theist address 4kings as an atheist. Diesm and theism are not the same. They do not have the same God concept in mind. Why he dishonestly tries to link them together is what I fail to understand. He forcefully wants to make athiests accept the existence of some God. He even goes as far as saying pantheism which is atheism is some kind of God belief.

This thread just shows that humans àre the creators of various God ideas end of story. Why the OP thinks this is something very special is what is beyond me. All God concepts and ideas are man made that is why there are different ideas and concepts of Gods created by men. End of story.

KingEbukasBlog:
No one is saying it . What you atheists are doing here is called religious skepticism . And this does not mean atheism or agnosticism .

Read more here : https://www.nairaland.com/3500235/must-read-god-without-religion

I just dislike your sheer dishonesty. What do you call a person that disbelieves in the existence of man made Gods like Yahweh, Brahma and Allah for example? And for the record a theist and a deist do NOT believe in the same concept of God. They do not share the same idea of God. Why you keep trying to make it seem as if they do is beyond me.

I've noticed that you have started hiding your God idea to mean a supreme being that is a creator. Your evidence to show that the universe was created by one being alone is WHAT?

KingEbukasBlog:
I see dalaman , looks like uncle d realized that he said a lot of rancorous things against God and Christians .

OP needs to be banned. He's a plagiarist.

The God hypothesis is a failed hypothesis and does no real work in reality. Either way God always wins. If a tragedy strikes, God wins. If it doesn't God wins as well. People will always excuse God and place the blame on other things and even on themselves when things go wrong. When things go right God gets all the credit.

If there is a drought and people pray to God for rain and no rain falls, the same people will give excuses as to why God didn't answer their prayers. If the rain falls after they have prayed they'll shout and praise their God for the rain. The God hypothesis does no real work in reality. It's always a win win situation for the God.

Where are all the pastors that claim to have the ability to raise people from the dead? There are many dead people they can bring back to life in Uyo. Where is naijadeyhia, 4everGod? His resurrection abilities are needed in Uyo.

If death is pure gain as christians claim why then are they crying instead of celebrating when people die? The Uyo Church collapse comes to mind.

KingEbukasBlog:
More contributions please

How much did you contribute to your pastor today?

Image123:
You are a sinner and a child of satan, i am a believer and a child of God. You cannot claim to understand my people as i do. Jesus clearly said that He did not know when He was coming back, why do you deliberately choose to ignore that?

You are a liar and a person that spin and churn out lies just because you choose to believe and accept ancient mythology and fiction. Jesus said he did not know the day or hour of his return and not the period. He was specific about day and hour. He never mentioned the period. It's a lie to claim he did not know the period since he has stated to different people that he'll return during their lifetime. He was clear about not knowing ONLY the time and hour. Remember he also told the chief priest that he'll see him coming from the clouds with power and glory on his return when he asked him if he was the son of God.

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Just as the days of Noah it says. Noah knew the flood was going to happen during his generation and the life time of the people he was talking to. What he didn't know was the specific time and hour the rains will begin. Same as Jesus, Jesus told the people he'll return during their lifetime but the specific time and hour he says he does not know. So he told them to be ready at all times.

Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
Mar 13:33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
Mar 13:35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
Mar 13:36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.

Jesus was more interested in the hour and day, so he told his desciples to take heed and be ready at all times. He was specific about hour, morning, evening or midnight. He never mentioned period only specific hour and day. So you fail with your spin. Only day and hour he said he doesn't know. He talked about returning during the generation of the peoplehe was talking to. He specified by saying THIS generation will not pass away without this things happening.

The context of the above two passages is so clear and unmistakable. Jesus is talking about His second coming and referring to the time of His second coming as a time that even Him does not know. How then can He claim in another place that He would come before a particular time. That would either be a clear contradiction or a misunderstanding. Of course, you do no want it to be a misunderstanding on your part. You just simply choose to twist them to conform to your beliefs.

Sure Jesus was talking about his second coming but he wasn't talking about the period. He was specific about not knowing the hour or day and not the period in which he'll return. He stated it about 3 different times to different people that he'll return during their lifetime. His prophecy failed and is a major concern to you that is why you are all over the place spinning his words and telling lies. The bible is filled with endless contradictions that is why there are uncountable number of Christian sect mostly disagreeing with each other on doctrinal matters and other faiths related issues. This is one clear case of failed prophecy on Jesus's part.

Firstly, When you look at the direct(redletter) words of Jesus, some parts are clear and straightforward enough."Go and call your husband", "Go into all the world and preach". Some parts are not so clear, even to disciples and believers, Some are not clear to unbelievers like Him speaking in parables. That is one reason why you should ask us what Jesus means instead of JUMPING to conclusions and staying lame despite making a bad landing.
Secondly, the words of Jesus are eternal words. Many of His sayings are not just directed or spoken to the direct audience but to the entire body of Believers yesterday, today and forever. He has that peculiarity of His words not passing away. So if you in your small, limited view decide to be stubbornly myopic with the words of Jesus, it is your loss and malunderstanding, not mine.
In Matthew 10, Jesus calls 12 disciples and says about 37verses, some of which directly apply to them and their immediate task, and MOST of which applies to ALL BELIEVERS not just the 12.
Like when He says Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: This is for their IMMEDIATE task and not even applicable to them in a few years after in Acts 1.

In Mat 10:14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet. This surpasses just the immediate listeners and time. It is for all time, it applies till tomorrow. So if you miss the context and Spirit, you miss not me.

In Mat 10:18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. Evidently, this does not happen to them immediately, it does not even happen to many of them but it is for the whole body of disciples till tomorrow.

Mat 10:21 And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.
Mat 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mat 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

These verses above clearly surpass the immediate task and audience. Brother delivering up brother, children rising against parent, being hated of ALL men, enduring to THE END, these are messages for the church and body of Christ as a whole. It is not a myopic and local address. Historically and factually, the 12 disciples did not even have to flee around the cities of Israel. They conveniently settled in Jerusalem and continued to expand. It was OTHER believers that fled and were scattered abroad. Till next month, they are yet to flee around the cities of Israel, so the Son of man coming is still within frame. Stop ignoring the clear teachings of jesus that nobody knows when He will come, it makes you an hypocrite.

Saying that it surpasses the immediate listener is your own making and spin. Other christians have interpreted this verse very differently from you here on nairaland. You are just giving it your own twist and opinion just the way they have giving theirs and alll your opinions and spin differ. I cam give you links to their own different spin and opinions. We've debated this verse before with other christians. You guys just spin it differently. If the message is for the end church which cities in Israel is Jesus telling them to run to? Don't come up with your spiritual Israel spin because it is a lie and will be your own making . Jesus was specific in his message according to the story. He told them to run round the cities of Israel specifically and before they finish runninghe'll return. If the message is for the future church as you are claiming why did he mention cities of Israel?

Even from the bible you'll read that they disciples suffered persecution even in Israel. After Jesus was arrested his disciples had to run. Peter had to deny him three times because he his followers were to be arrested and face persecution. Paul was going after them within Israel and it's environment. According to writings in the new testament, Paul was dedicated to the persecution of the early disciples of Jesus in the area of Jerusalem before he encountered Jesus on his way to Damascus. It is a lie that christians expanded from Jerusalem. Majority of the people living in Jerusalem are Jews as majority of the Jews never became christians . Very few christians have lived and are living there. Christians started expanding from gentile lands. Disciples were first called christians not in Israel but in the gentile land of Antioch which was a Greko Roman land in present day Turkey. So again you are just mixing facts up. Stop spinning the messages of Jesus with regards to coming during the lifetime of the people he spoke to. He was specific, doing so only makes you a desperate liar.

KingEbukaNaija:
This should help
https://www.nairaland.com/2845259/all-different-religions-how-know

You are to provide objective evidence to show the true God and religion assuming one exust not give people's opinion.

KingEbukaNaija:
Some religions immolate children , it does not make it right . This is an argument about the true God in disguise .

Which is the true God? How do you know? Is there any objective means of testing and knowing?

KingEbukaNaija:
My parents complain about my introversion and always encourage me to go outside and meet people , since introversion limits social interaction , does it make introversion morally wrong ? All I'm saying is that your second reason is not a good reason . Is what you feel , it does not make it wrong .

I agree that it's not a good reason. You asked for my personal view and I stated it. Your reason that God said it is also not a good reason at all. You can not convincetwo adults siblings that want to have sex for pleasure that God said they shouldnt. It's not a cogent reason. Because some other Gods see nothing wrong with it. Your God before he changes his mind saw nothing wrong with it.

You growing up with the idea of it being wrong isn't a cogent reason either . Why should God's moral laws still influence your decisions as an atheist.

Again I admit it isn't a cogent reason. It's not God's moral law because it just happens to be the law of the society I grew up in. Allah doesn't see anything wrong with some type of incest and as such he doesn't frown at it and says it is allowed. So which God is the source of human morality again? Tell me pls.

4everGod:
Lmao. So there are no victims...issorrait!

Who are the victims of consentual sex between two adult siblings for pleasure?

KingEbukaNaija:
The question is just to evade giving an answer . I'm used to arguing with uncle D . He is the king of circumlocution . You have to always stay focused so you can nail him .

He has said this exact thing on this thread before

Did your GodGod not know that incest was wrong wen he allowed Abraham to marry his sister? Why did he change his mind? Isn't he all knowing again? Which God is the source of human morality when Allah allows muslims to practice incest?

4everGod:
Ebuka are you are!

Incest is not a sin! its only wrong by human standards and will affect xternal procreation.

Nna just negodu

Incest is a sin according to who? Allah the creator of the universe says it's not. Who are you to say it is? Even the founder of your religion was an incestuous man. Didn't your God know that incest was wrong when he allowed Abraham to marry his sister?

KingEbukaNaija:
Ok sir , I understand sir

Please can you now answer the question . Is incest for pleasure to you , right or wrong ? Uncle D , why are you evading this question ? I hope you know that response above is circumlocutory .

If you walk in on your adult children having consensual sex , would you reprimand them ?

Incest to me is wrong partly because I grew up with the idea that it is wrong. Secondly I feel it is wrong because it will stop people from going out of the family to look for mates. If I walk in on my children have sex I'll repremand them for the reasons outlined. Incest leads to offsprings with genetic disorder.

KingEbukaNaija:
Nobody is denying this . God has now commanded against incestuous relationships . So tell me , as an atheist who had denied the source of morality which is God , is incest for pleasure right or wrong

Was incest right when God allowed it? Didn't he know that incest was wrong before he allowed it? The truth of the matter is that the Jews that felt incest was right later decided it was wrong and they used their God as an enforcing mechanism. Incest is neither right or wrong, it just depends in the society you are living in.Muslims happily practice incest by marrying their first cousins because Islam allows it. Are they doing the wrong thing? Allah their God says it's right . By the way which God is the source of human morality? I just told you that Allah allows incest. So which God is it?

There is something about this deepsight guy. Can't place it but the guy is deep.

foladara777:
That one still small... God killed a man because he didn't want to have sex with his sister in law.. I mean who does that?

Yahweh does.

foladara777:
Why are u scared of changing the topic to the bible?? Are u scared it will be exposed as a book of incests? Even Jesus had a product of incest in his lineage

Abraham the founder of their religion was an incestuous man. Issac was a product of incest.

KingEbukaNaija:
Still open

What is still open? That Abraham was an incestuous man who marred his sister?

Richirich713:
He asked "Show me where I insulted you in my comment so i can take you seriously" implying that he thought I insulted him by insulting his mother. If he thought that, he shouldn't be suprise that I took his comments as an insult.

Lies. He asked you why he insulted his mum and you said he insulted you first.

frank317:
U resort to abusing his mum [/b]because he tries to explain how impossible ur imaginary God is. Foolish Christians everywhere

Then you claimed he insulted you first.

Richirich713:
[b]U idiot, he insulted me 1st , he could have made his point differently but he didn't, so I just returned the favour.
U atheists think u can just speak like u want to theists, when sum1 starts mocking, insulting u guys, U wanna cry like babies, guess what deal with it, respect comes both ways.
It's funny that u tryin to lecture me on insulting people, any1 who just browsers thru ur posts will realize that's ur specialty.

He never insulted you at any point unless if you are Yahweh.

Richirich713:
I said he's mom retarded, is he is mom?

He said you insulted his mum, and you answered by stating he insulted you. When did you become Yahweh.

Richirich713:
Are u ominiretarded? U can't seriously see wer he insulted me?

He said Yahweh if he exist should be tagged ominiretarded. Are you Yahweh?

Image123:
Where did He say these? Of course, a human is more likely to understand human communication better than an animal will. The words of Jesus are spirit and life, i understand them better than a sinner does. It's commonsense.

You dont understand them better than anybody. You just simply choose to twist them to conform to your beliefs.

Matt 10: 21-23.
21. Brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death, 22 and you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved. 23 When they persecute you in one town, flee to the next, for truly, I say to you, you will not have gone through all the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes

He clearly told his desciples that they will suffer persecution but they should keep running from one town to another, before they finish going through the towns of Israel he will return. That was 2000 years ago.

Image123:
Many people misunderstand Jesus, even His disciples. However some do not want to understand Him, i hope you are not in such class as you will be a total waste of time and space for me. Jesus made specific statements about His second coming that make it clear that it can't be what you think it is.

John 21:22 Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. 21:23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?

For instance, in the above passage, some disciples thought Jesus meant that John will not die before the second coming, but John himself says that wasn't what Jesus said or meant.
Jesus CLEARLY said no one, not even Him knows when He's coming except God the Father. Why people like you choose to ignore or disbelieve something so clear and specific is beyond me. You choose to believe what you want to for your own perceived gain, not for truth or understanding.

Jesus never said he was coming back in 2000 years time. He mentioned more than once that he'll come back during the life time of his disciples. He even told someone specifically that the person will see him coming from the clouds. Bit as usual no body understands the words of Jesus only image123

jonbellion:
for the umpteenth time
Mist umbelibers on this forum were once Christians
If yo go to a muslim country it would be the same thing
Look at it this way
You were born you got dedicated to god in church, you got a kids bible, your parents bought you christian CD's and sh*t you go to thing children's church, you do CRK in school you have a fellowship that you attended
You are basically an ex christian
It's only natural to talk about the faith that you were indoctrinated into because that is what you would have most knowledge on
Though when I became and unbeliever I got a Quran in my search for truth as encouraged by a muslim friend and that was even more shittier than the bible

I've tried reading the Koran but can not understand it at all. Parts of it is just repetitive disjointed speech.

KingEbukasBlog:
Again I ask , is 'God does not exist ' not a man idea and conception

It is just as the "God exist" is also a man made idea and conception.

KingEbukasBlog:
How will this stop God from existing

How will it make God which is an idea to start existing in reality? Your God remains a man made idea and conception.

Image123:
Or, so He did exist and died on the cross? Good, very good. Why then do you think that His coming and promise to permanently end tears is mythical?

Why won't it be mythical. People that die remain dead. Remember the same Jesus promised his followers that he'll come back during their lifetime.

Image123:
Is Jesus alive? Did He exist? Did He die on the cross?

How can a dead man be alive?

Image123:
Why do you and dalaman imply that hurricanes and tsunamis are evil? Some people think thunder and lightning is evil, but others harness them.

What good does a tsunami do?