₦airaland Forum

OliviaPope:
I was raised in a strong Christian household, got baptized when I was 12. My parents used to take me and my siblings to church every Sunday and for weekly services as well, we hardly missed any day. They made sure we were actively involved in church activities. They made sure to always remind us that heaven and hell were real, most especially hell.. In a nutshell, they did their best in raising me "in the way of the Lord"

The stories in the bible never actually made any sense to me but i knew not to ask questions or to have doubts so i kept silent. Each day I grew more skeptical about religion - Christianity. I wasn't totally convinced about the existence of non-existence of God. I was definitely not a Christian, I guess you could call me an agnostic, leaning towards atheism.

But i was still looking for answers, tried to be as open minded as possible. As we all know agnosticism connotes confusion and I needed to know where I stood, I became very uncomfortable being what I was - an agnostic. Christianity definitely wasn't the answer, been there done that.
So I started doing research, won't go into details about that though...


In the course of my research, I ran into an old friend, a Muslim, we exchanged numbers and got talking... He knew about my stance on religion so he brought it up.. Usually I would change the topic but i just thought " well fvck it".. He started teaching me about Islam, I was reading about it as well. It just made sense to me. As a Christian, I had to go on blind faith, but in Islam, there's room for logic. Islam welcomes doubts and questions that I could never ask as a Christian....

The Quranic description of a creator was much more different and the appeal to rationality and reason... So, after a long spiritual journey and a lot of learning, of course, I accepted Islam...


And I found peace

As-salamu alaykum!!

KingEbukasBlog:
.. they dont know

I'm good bro. Been kinda busy . But sadly winner01 has been banned for posting "distracting images" - an "offense" every known atheist on Nairaland commits . So why does winner01 get banned for this every damn time but not the atheists ?

Do you see what's going on here . Nairaland silences Christians by banning them ?

Atheists are guilty of the pictures too. Everyone in fact is.
But winner01 is notorious with the memes. He has loads of them with which he comments on almost every post.

analice107:
I dont know how a Christian can commit sin spontaneously and then drop dead without repenting. Something he took time to plan and strategize.
Otio.

It could be by accident or an illness or even in a fight.

analice107:
No nah, lets analyze this scenario. How person go commit sin now now die? i for like make we talk am.

Let me avoid hate arguments. It seems you don't want to understand my point. You just want to rubbish whatever I try to say.
Now you'd likely say that one can't die in an act of sin.

analice107:
Create a scenario.

Don't bother dear

0ubenji:
I stated wat it is, they do

Are we clear?

DeepSight:
Despiero - The above are the contradictions you asked I put to you.

My point is 'free thinking lead many to atheism'.

Then having arrived at this state, the individual most likely won't bother about trying to seek logical answers and evidence to prove that God exists or not.
ie He doesn't exercise free thinking in trying to prove or disprove the existence of God.

But he exercises freethinking in justifying his unbelief.

DeepSight:
No, he is not. I fear you are not reading properly.

He has lost me.

0ubenji:
I stated wat it is, they do

Arrh!! You're regressing o.

analice107:
lols. okay, ask the question again.

A Christian sins and suddenly dies on the spot.
Where does he go? Heaven or Hell?

The devil told Eve the truth by letting her know that she'd "be like God knowing good and evil". God later confirmed and said " man has come to be like us knowing good and evil". Infact, God rather hid that truth from Adam and Eve by not telling them that they'll be like him but instead that they'll die. So he's as guilty as Satan.

analice107:
You know doctrines, but don't know the Holy Spirit.

Well, i dont know what you mean by "The sins commit knowingly or unknowingly".

A believer who has the Bible and reads it, doesn't know what God forbids for his followers?

Anyone who prays such a prayer is someone who spends time in church hoping he will become a Christian.
The Bible is open before him, and the Holy Spirit is inside of him to convict him of sin, Yet he will commit an unknown sin? hahahahahaha.

How do you commit an unknown sin when there's a motive for every sin? pls...

Lol. Off course you sound like an unbeliever. Its only and unbeliever who will sound as u do.
But that's not why i joined in. Its the discourse that got me, not you.


Its actually what brought me in here. Any Christian who lives in fear of hell does not have assurance of salvation.

I think there's something we need to clear here.

There are some Christians who are ignorant of what salvation really is. They don't know that when their sins are forgiven, their sins are forgiven. They think God is like man who keeps record of past wrong doings.

Although they are saved but continue to live in guilt of who they were and what they did before getting saved.

Becos they lack the awareness that once forgiven, their sins no longer surface before God, so satan takes advantage of their ignorance and put them under bondage as long as it takes them to be aware.

What does it mean to blot? that's what the blood of Christ did to my sins, blot them out. No trace remaining. I have forgiven myself, knowing God has forgiven me, i dont live in guilt and self condemnation of who i was before being saved.

Do you mean attending Church is not a passport to heaven or being a Christian? I guess you don't know what it means to be a Christian. A Christian is someone who thrives to live the Life of Christ
not someone who attends church.

No one can be a Christian if he/she is not a born again and sanctified Christ follower.

Listen, Righteousness is not the absence of sin, but the DESPERATION TO PLEASE GOD. so being saved doesn't mean we don't fall.

Now, you said A Christian who falls into sin without repentance. Hmmmm, this is serious.
If only you know what you just said.

A believer, a spirit filled believer will sin and sit comfortable without repenting? If you have ever had the Holy Spirit inside of you, then because of your disobedience to his voice, he steps out from you for just a moment HAAAAAAA.
It's only those who have him in them that can understand what i am saying here. The restlessness? the emptiness? how disorganised you will be? You'll never concentrate to do anything right. You will ask for forgiveness as fast as you realize that you cant feel him. Its not as if he leaves you, he just keeps you quiet. hmmm.. Abeg oo.

Bros forget, its obvious u never encountered the Holy Ghost all through the time you were in Church.
Any Christian who is comfortable in that state has backslidden long ago. Without the Holy Spirit a Christian is shattered.

Am not afraid of dying, and hell doesn't scare me

More stories . I said I totally understood you, but again, you keep dodging my real question and that's not nice.

DeepSight:
Despierio...Oubenji is on point.

Mind you, there was a terrible contradiction in something else you said above.

You rephrase.

Put it to me

0ubenji:
:DU asked if they dey necessarily need to do something

And what's your response?

analice107:
My motive is to show that you never studied the word of God. You merely read it. No one studies the word without coming out with a Rhema.

Yesterday i got one. I was happy the whole day like a won millions.

You've already formed your conclusion even before making your inquiry. That's being prejudiced and biased; bad for healthy arguments.

By the way, congrats on the rhema of yesterday.

0ubenji:
their arrival at their state of unbelief is that something they do.

Rephrase

0ubenji:
U confuse me the more.
For clarity sake, So what does Atheism necessarily do?

Are they necessarily supposed to do something? They arrived at a state of unbelief from their enquiry and that's it. Unless the atheist is agnostic.
Please don't be confused bro. What are you driving at?

analice107:
Okay. Lets hear any Rhema you received studying any passage of the Bible when u were a Christian. Go on...

What's your motive?

0ubenji:
plz I'm curious as to the reasons that makes you fink Atheism restricts free thought...

May I add; restrictions are especially on the existence of god.
Atheism isn't necessarily seeking answers to proof or disprove Gods existence.

analice107:
That's good, that's what i wanted to hear.

You read the Bible, you never studied the Bible, that's why u remained at Logos level. No one ever receives the rhema of the word and turns to call Jesus a curse.

Here is where the scripture describes you...

For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
Hebrews:4:2


Guy, I wish you luck. The Holy Spirit speaks to me every day, that's becos i want to hear him.

Reading the bible didn't mean I wasn't studying the Bible.
Stop the false assumption. That's bad reasoning.

quivah:
Are you a christain? Yes?/And since you became a xtain, you've never lied? No? If at a point you lied,then slumped...where do you think you might end up?

Anas09/analice107 claims to be a Christian but at a point while defending god, she started throwing Insults around. If she dies at that moment, where will she go? Heaven or hell?

That's the very simple question I've asked since yesterday, they'll all come up with one unnecessary explanation while avoiding the question. Being crooked just to win arguments and save their ego.

analice107:
See? That is where you are wrong. No one commits sin by mistake. Every sin has a motive. Every single sin. Always premeditated. Any Christian who commits sin must first be cautioned by the inner witness against it, but if the Christian goes on to disobey, then...

I understand you but you're evading my question by poking holes in it. How am I wrong? By mentioning mistakenly? So Christians don't sin mistakenly (unknowingly) again?
Don't you mention that "God should forgive you sins you committed knowingly or unknowingly" in your prayers again? I believe you prayed for forgiveness in church today; if you attended. We're talking honesty here.

You probably just joined against me in my argument because I sounded pretty much like an unbeliever. In case you didn't know why I asked the question initially. " I was of the opinion that Christians are not exempted from the fear of death and hell. Since being a Christian isn't automatic passport to heaven". A Christian could still go to hell according to Christian beliefs if they default without repentance upon death.

So please spare me the endless teachings on Christian doctrines. I know 'em all.

larisoft:
Lol...I would say free thought is a journey, of which atheism is just the first probable bus stop. However, any traveller who remains at this bus stop is a lazy one. For absence of evidence, if anything, calls for a more thorough search. Not a conclusion!

Atheism is also probably just the last bus stop.

You should rather argue that atheism restricts free thought which I believe to a large extent is correct.

larisoft:
Indeed your mind is very logical. I (in my characteristic open-mindedness) chewed on every point, and am convinced that here 'Here is a thorough mind'. However, while I didnt find a section of your response that addresses this point squarely, I hope we can both agree that in the absence of evidence, research is just inconclusive. Anything other than that, is deviating from free thought, to cling to an idealogy.

Thank you bro.
I can agree with you that in the absence of evidence to proof beyong reasonable doubt, research currently is inconclusive on the existence of God/gods. Scientific research has only succeeded in debunking several religious beliefs and myths which was held by many as divine.

Our level of scientific inquiry perhaps hasn't reached the sophistication needed to solidly provide proof and answer questions bothering on the non existence of God/gods.
Its wise to keep an open mind

Most times, it takes a great deal of reasoning and experience to understand some people. Atheists are possibly the most misunderstood group of people on Nairaland. They're also responsible for this due to their often sarcastic response to religious arguments .

xendra:
Atheists are just a group of people with bad temper towards God. example, the guy above me, so they claim he doesn't exist. cos that just makes it easier for them.
while free thinkers are just....well, free thinkers.

You have a wrong impression about atheists, and you seem not to know who a freethinker is.

larisoft:
Atheism, as I perceive it, is the first bustop for youngsters in philosophy, whom basking in their new found freedom from restricted thought, fall prey to the logical abomination of reaching conclusions before conducting research.

Nice perception and correct in some cases. But the new found freedom you talk about is as a result of personal research which the atheist has conducted. He weighed his findings against the ascertions of religion and found it to be of more credence. Any so called atheist who claims to be one without first seeking truth is just following blindly.

larisoft:
The picture it paints is that of a man who says "God exists. How do I know? Faith". And after some time, he says "God doesnt exist. How do I know? Faith!"

It rather paints a picture of a man who grew up to find himself in a society where everyone believes in one God or the other and is compelled to believe in one but later questions his believe on close examination and dismisses it due to insufficient proof.

larisoft:
In what world does the absence of evidence to prove a thing constitute evidence to prove its absence?

Absence of evidence to prove existence of a thing doesn't constitute evidence to its non existence. It only stimulates unbelief in the existence of that thing. It depends on the individual. Belief in a thing doesn't make it exist; unbelief in a thing doesn't cause it to cease to exist either. Belief doesnt equal truth. Its your choice to belief or not belief with your reasons.

larisoft:
Why can't we be honest with ourselves and admit that our knowledge ends where it does and to know more, we have to resort to that old, slow, but reliable means of human advancement called research? And maintain a widely open mind while at it?

Admitting that our knowledge is limited is absolutely honest. While we may not know the ultimate truth about some issues, the question comes up. "Why do you believe in what you believe as true?" "Where's proof of what you believe in?". Admitting that you may be right or wrong is being open minded in a way. But people let their ego cloud their judgement (theist and atheist inclusive) especially on this forum

larisoft:
I dont see how a person can be an atheist and a free thinker...The thought process of an atheist is already bent on proving the non-existence of a thing, as opposed to drifting in consonance with the random waves of facts, evidence, and logic, towards an unknown destination.

A person can be an atheist and a freethinker. The freethinker has formed his opinion using enquiry, science and reason. If that leads him to a belief that God does not exist, then that's the case. However, it is largely dependent on the individual.

larisoft:
Atheism is not free thinking. Its just negative faith.

How is it negative faith. Define the terms here. 'Freethinker' 'Atheist' and 'negative faith' let's see how they correlate and differ.

driveiwe:
It's vital as children of God to understand how to prosper and survive others in times of recession;
# Maintain a positive confession;
As a child of God u shouldn't talk like the rest of the world, reason the bible says-
When men are cast down, then thou shalt say, There is lifting up; and he shall save the humble person.Job22:29

Agreed!

driveiwe:
#Work hard;
God expects His children to work and not fold their hands, see proverbs 14:23
In all labour there is profit: but the talk of the lips tendeth only to penury. So ya'all needs to work hard.

Agreed.

driveiwe:
# Pray regularly for your government;
Some might not be of this opinion but See 1timothy 2:1
First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way.

We pray to God for the government. The government prays to God too for a miracle. Let's be more pragmatic. Be a solution & don't wait for a failing government to determine your fate.

driveiwe:
#Pay your tithes and your offerings;
This might spark up reactions, but its a choice paying the tithe or not, but to me it's only telling God that He can trust you with much, when you pay your tithes...
It's just a show of love to the one who gave you the 100%.

The church asks us to depend on God for a miracle, yet they depend on our offerings. GOD DONT SPEND MONEY, MEN DO!! I'd rather help a neighbor or brother in need. "Whatsoever you do to the least of your brethren ..." Remember?

driveiwe:
#Invest wisely as a Christian;
This is another reason why you got the Holy ghost, cos He will guide you into investing wisely.
#Give to the poor amongst you;
No greater way to succeed as a Christian if you don't give, God gave Jesus to us, why can't we give back to the poor and needy.

Agreed! But don't wait for the Holy Ghost alone o. Consult experts and seek counsel in Investment.

AlfaSeltzer:
How can another human from another continent come and deceive you into beating up your children and perpetuating ignorance in Africa

You can't blame them that much. The missionaries offered them goodies and messages of hope. They saw advancement in them which stirred up trust & believe. Faced with same situation, with same limited knowledge and exposure they had, you wouldn't act any different. Those that rejected the gospel stories of course were tagged demons and witches and were treated inhumanly.

AlfaSeltzer:
We are suffering from the stupidity of our parents

Yes! to a large a extent. You can make a difference in your own generation.

AlfaSeltzer:
Stop "respecting" your parents. You are more intelligent than them.

Not a good approach. An eye for an eye will make the world blind. Act as the one with better understanding, especially in decision making.

AlfaSeltzer:
Leave them, if they misbehave for the sake of a foreign doG

Its up to you. They'll always be your parents. Irrespective of what happened, they obviously had good intentions for you.

analice107:
Here is your answer, but like Malvis said, you are a robot, so i expect you to keep asking the same question further.

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1 John:2:1

This is why you students fail exams.
Why not answer the question as required and leave out unnecessary explanations. Who asked for advocate of the sinner?

'A true Christian mistakenly commits sin and dies right before he genuinely repents' does he go to heaven or hell?

Reply with the correct option first then state your reason.