Those who hate arsenal can be subdivided into two groups.

One group of fans hate arsenal out of pure jealousy of its style of football and its prudent management system. That we havent won a trophy in 7 years is no big deal. Apart from ManU and Liverpool, when did other teams actually start winning trophies since their existence? We know those who bought their trophies with unsustainable expenditures. Yet, they sack their managers because their football style looks and tastes like vomit.

The second group artificially 'hate' arsenal because secretly, they actually admire it (otherwise, why would they take Panadol for Arsenal's headache?). Those are the low-lifes, the pathetic, self-denying morons who dont have the guts to clap for their team even when it loses. Why would a non-arsenal fan worry about arsenal in the first place? WETIN CONSYN YOU? Only ManU and Liverpool have the pedigree and record of Arsenal for as far back as 100 years. Class is permanent. So only ManU have the guts (and rights) to stick their tongue out towards Arsenal.

You will NEVER see an arsenal fan worrying about how well Chelsea, Liverpool or ManU have been doing in the league. We just dont care! Period.

We are Arsenal. We are the only club whose team will lose a match, but the fans can even feel better than the winning team. Eventually, football is JUST a game. Haters just dont like to see Arsenal fans enjoying their game, win or lose. Bad as e bad, Arsenal has the longest consistent stretch of Champions League football in the EPL...all on a slim budget.

Check the English papers of recent days and you will see honest analysis (of the EURO tournament) that England is not doing well in competitions because the players not hold the ball or attack well. In their knock out game against Italy, and they tried to play like Chelsea in the CL finals - (dem no tell dem say Chelsea own na Fluke). The same analysts also argue (including Harry Redknapp) that the future hope of England is to play good, ball-possessing and attack-minded football like is found in Spain, Italy and Germany...AND (this is the beautiful part) they confess that in the current England squad, only Jack Wilshere, Theo Walcott and Oxlade-Chamberlain (all of Arsenal) have the capacity and training to play such game.

All those who hate arsenal do so because they wish they could be like Arsenal. But their yeye pride will not allow them fess up and wear the red and white with pride.

ARSENAL!....Na today?

Erelu_Y: @drzed. TBH., I haven't been on NL since Nov 2011, or thereabout. This is because, constructive discourses, IMHO, weren't largely holding on the majority of the fora here on NL. But I find your responses very thoughtful, insightful and engaging. In fact, I cannot - broadly speaking - fault anything you've said. For example, I am one of those Nigerians who felt and still feel that Nigeria did absolutely nothing to make me who I am today. Nonetheless, on completing my studies here in the UK, I was ready to return home to contribute my own LITTLE quota to Nigeria's future or for posterity. But, I quickly realised how I could end up wasting away in Nigeria and I decided not to return home, at least for now. In spite of securing my dream job here in the UK, the 'racist card' including the 'Plastic British' politics, amongst other things, led me to raise a similar question on this site. I personally know many who have similar experience, share similar view and had taken the same decision. I 'met' a guy here on NL. He lectures here in the UK and wanted to return to Nigeria to teach, believing he has something to offer the future generations. He came to this site to seek opinions ( https://www.nairaland.com/449990/relocating-back-nigeria-lecture-university ). Not only was his thread derailed, he was vilified here on this site and he ended up shelving the idea. Before you think I am digressing, if it were to be a Caucasian British, American or Canadian, even a Romanian or Lithuanian, who posted a similar thread, fellow Nigerians are more than likely to welcome him with open hands and encourage him to relocate to Nigeria to lend a helping hand.

Don't forget that there were countless of intra-tribal and inter-tribal warfare across sub-Sahara Africa, which fuelled trans-Atlantic slave trade. Trading-off one another in this day and age, IMHO, translates into selling one another off into modern day slavery. It's, therefore, probably in our DNA.

Well, I am neither surprised that the guy was vilified here on Nairaland nor am I surprised that he shelved his plans. Anyone who ventures to bring their problem to Nairaland must first acquire a thick skin. In fact, my advice to people who cant stand the heat is: if you REALLY need help but dont have the time/patience to differentiate insult from advice on Nairaland, then quietly send internal email to selected people who you either follow or trust on Nairaland. They wont mind giving you honest advice, privately.

I have visited the link you posted above about your friend. Someone named violet told your friend the following:

violet: ....But you have been far too foolish to expect more (or less) than you've got so far. After more than 100 posts committed into Nairaland it should have dawned on you ages ago that Nairaland is full of teenagers, loafers, dimwits and sundry lunatics and so, hardly the place to go asking any serious question about matters that are close to your heart and especially matters on which your life may depend.

Those who attacked him probably did it out of childishness, envy, jealousy (probably a mixture of all three) or it was due to the good ol pure hatred for fellow Africans - which this thread is actually all about, i.e. Africans hating each other just for the heck of it.

Now just imagine what that chap of yours must have been thinking: "I asked for advice from Nigerians and I am being insulted and vilified....what will now happen when I actually apply for a job in Nigeria?" Trust me, if he is not careful, all that zeal and energy for 'come back home and contribute to my fatherland' will disappear in a whirlwind of tribalism, victimisation, bring-him-down, bad-belle and nepotism. That is after he has lobbied and bribed his way...to serve his OWN country. Many Nigerians dont respect or appreciate that line of thinking. Majority of us only respect money and dont care how you came about about it. And if you happen to speak with a foreign accent (through no fault of yours) you'd better be damned rich cos the bad-belles and haters will devour you like hyenas breaking their ramadan fast.

Anyway, maybe as you suggested, hating is in our DNA. There are truly two kinds of black people - Players and Player haters. And I have long decoded our people as generally happy to see you doing well.... but not better than them. So sometimes, it is actually clever to feign suffering or poverty just to avoid evil eyes.

Erelu_Y:


Thanks for expatiating fully on the viewpoint I initially expressed. I absolutely agree with your analysis which explains why I mooted the opinion that schools' curricula need to address this problem. From Wales to Scotland and from Northern Ireland to England , the British (i.e. English, Scotish, Welsh and Northern Irish) would never, unduly, privilege an immigrant over and above their own kith and kin. In fact, the idea of 'PLASTIC BRITS' is to further differentiate, delineate and alienate 'WHITE ETHNIC BRITISH' from 'NON WHITE BRITISH', including those who acquired BC through naturalisation. My gut feeling is that members of the various nations within the so-called Nigerian state need a new pattern of enculturation and socialisation through which clearly re-formulated notions of nationhood and citizenship is inculcated and entrenched. Our sociologists, anthropologists, historians, curriculum experts, etc, need to collaborate on this matter. Do you know if any intellectual discourses on this matter hold in our nations' educational institutions and, if they do, how could such discourses transcend mere rhetorics?

You have raised some interesting and valid points which resonate very well with me. Since leaving the university many years ago, I have long deduced that one of the most important (but underrated) agency in Nigeria is the National Orientation Agency (NOA). It has the mandate to change our perception and attitude of our country, but alas, most of what I see or hear is just jingles on NTA or FM stations. This is because the NOA lacks the capacity, the vision and the requisite leadership necessary to make it impactful.

Our historians, sociologist and curriculum experts in Nigeria can help, but the truth is few of them are actually very professional in their jobs. Many people who studied these courses did so because it was the last resort to getting a degree or diploma. They couldnt care less about their professional contribution to nation-building. But our schools and curriculum do hold promise to a new Nigeria. The challenge for the schools therefore is what the content or context of the curricula on nationalism, patriotism and tolerance should be. Again, I ask: what does it mean to be a Nigerian? People migrate to America for the American dream. Apart from coming to take advantage of our lawless society, tax evasion and corruption, which foreigner do you know that actually 'wants' to be a Nigerian?

A new Nigeria cannot happen overnight. It is along term project that requires a peaceful atmosphere, but peace itself cannot endure without justice and equality. Justice and equality can only be attained when people (out of their own free volition) agree to the terms of their existence. Nobody asked my tribe/kingdom whether they wanted to be part of Nigeria and today, I personally dont see how Nigeria has benefited me and my people who are just another of the many tribes in Nigeria. Yes, I and many people like me have listened to Kennedy's advice (think what you can do for your country and not what your country can do for you): but do you know how ANNOYING it is for someone to press buttons, pull strings, lobby (and be asked for bribe) simply because they offered their services to Nigeria? Do you know? Well, that is a summary of why many Nigerians travel out and why many of them abroad are not particularly eager to return to Nigeria.

Having said that, Nigerians are currently too aggrieved to talk and listen respectfully to one another. But the best way forward is to make the central leadership of Nigeria very unattractive so that people will focus on their towns and local governments, rather than salivating over the national cow; whose udders are being sucked dry even as we speak. Plato stated in his book (Republic) that: The state in which the rulers are reluctant to govern is always the best (and most quietly governed) while the state in which the rulers are most eager to govern is the worst.

I am not drifting from the subject matter, on why we Africans/Nigerians hate our own people, because clearly, you can see that it boils down to how we restructure our existence, our governance and our leadership systems in Nigeria. If we dont take necessary and fundamental steps, 50 years from today, our elections will still be decided on the tribe (and religion) of the contestants. This attitude can never bring progress. As bad as Nigeria is today, I fear that our kids may refer to our times as the good ol days.

The Nigerian economic and political system needs major overhaul and restructuring. Period.

moremi2008:


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!! And everyone thought the Cabal was bad? This one nah wire!

What do you mean?

passerby: contrary, ur children will love u more, cos wen the grow they will understand wat u did for them. like i do now

I agree. In fact, leaving their wicked father is the single best reason for you to opt out of this marriage today, and will be the single most important favour you can do the children's future.

awoloto: There has been no infidelity,when i say he knows i wont leave him, i mean that he knows my views about children having to be brought up in broken homes. I was a product of that too, and its not plesant at all. yes theres a lot that is not being said, but i have been a dutiful caring wife and wonderful mother to my four children.
i do love my self and have not made him a God, i have stuck in here for almost nineteen years because of God, but at the moment i am so fed up , and want to move on, but dont want to date anyone whilst still married, my friends are all fed up and have told me to move on and forget about him, but my kids will suffer in the end. they have tried to set up blind dates , but i am not interested.
he is simply nasty and abusive towards me, and reduces me to tears on a daily basis.
yes there are two sides to every story, he was just too imature and i never realised this. it was too late then.
thanks anyway for all your replies.
as for chaircovers post, it would have been much nicer if she had focussed on the issue to hand rather than on the number of children. it did feel like an attack, i joined just to seek out opinions and advice, i dont think its easy for anyone to bring their private life to a forum for thousands to read ( my close fried had four children in three years, its not impossible.)

I feel for you. To start with, you need to develop a thick skin on Nairaland if you dare to bring your problems to this forum. Some people only come here to vent their frustration on others. You dont sound to me like you need pity or further abuse from people who dont even know you. What you want is help or advice on how to move on.

As for your specific problem, I am afraid that your life is passing you by. Almost half of it is gone in fact, since you are already approaching 40. But for your 4 kids, I would have said you actually wasted all your adult life with this man. If you continue to remain with someone who is nasty, abusive and reduces you to tears on a daily basis, I hate to tell you this, but it is like you are committing suicide s-l-o-w-l-y. It may just be a matter of time before High BP or something like that hits you fatally. God forbid.

Yes, you came from a broken home. But is that an excuse to be unhappy for the rest of your life? You owe yourself and your kids the highly probable chance of being happier OUTSIDE this man's life. If you remain with this man, it is not only you who will suffer it. Your kids will grow up worse off. There are countless stories of strong, sincere, hardworking and independent women who made it on their own, in the absence of a loving husband. In some cases it was divorce. Others are widows. Life goes on and being married (especially to a mean person) is neither the beginning nor end of life. And with faith, God will provide a caring man for you along the way.

Take the plunge. Dump him as soon as possible and God will be on your side. Define your future happiness and success according to your own terms. Fortunately, it appears that friends and relatives around you are only too happy to see the back of your wicked/hopeless husband.

So what are you still waiting for?

My suggestions to are as follows:

1. Dethrone any Emir or Chief in whose domain BH are found to be active.
2. Declare a strict state of emergency in any Local Govt or even an entire State where BH is active.
3. Send a bill for State or Regional Police to the National Assembly and hold the legislooters by the balls until they pass the bill.
4. Declare Otedola's bribe $ 600K (approx. N100 Million) as prize money for information leading to capture first 25 BH leaders.
5. When the money in item 4 above finishes, add another 200 Million to the 'Wanted Dead or Alive' Jackpot.
6. Sincerely find the sponsors of the Political BH and the spiritual leaders of the Fanatical BH, and jail them for life.
7. Ask Buhari to come and lead the BTF (Boko Haram Task Force). He will be in charge of implementing items 1 to 6 above.

Patsey:

The Egyptians, though physically located on the African Soil, do not consider themselves as Africans, per say. Together with the likes of Algeria, Morocco, Lybia, etc, regard themselves and are classified/regarded as Arabs. And, please do not bring the book of fictions and folklores, called the Bible, into this crucially important debate that all Nigerians and, in deed, all Africans (South of the Sahara) should seriously be reflecting upon.

Majority of Egyptians and North Africans are not 'culturally' Africans, but even in Egypt of today, you will find aborigene people (Nubians). Similarly in places like Algeria you will find indigenous (non-arab) people known as Kabyle tribes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kabyle_people) among which the Berbers are the most prominent e.g. people like Zenedine Zidane are Berbers even though he has an Arab name. Also read the history of North Africa during the Roman Empire (Hannibal the warrior king, the city state of Carthage, etc). You will realise that North Africa has always been occupied by Berbers and other aborigine/nomad ethnicities. Arabs moved in and the region dominated much later, especially during the spread of Islam when Arabs colonised places as far as Spain (Andalusia).

So not-suprisingly, most North Africans (especially Egyptians) do not consider themselves Africans. The twarts! But can you blame them? Based on how we (other Africans) have conducted ourselves? But the real question now is: what does it mean to be African? Is it your ethnic group? The colour of your skin? Your geographic location? Or your propensity to violence and inter-ethnic hatred.

To answer this, Africa is a geographical expression and a location. But Africa is also partly a socio-cultural phenomenon. However, Africa is only marginally a linked to your race or your skin colour - because the dark skinned people of Papua New Guinea are definitely NOT Africans. Being African is therefore, a mind thing: just like being American is also a function of your mentality and belief in the American dream. Until we understand and respect these fundamental principles, we wont understand nationhood... or what it means to be a Nigerian for that matter.

shymmex: Slavery, colonization, and b1tchazzness.

To blame our attitude on slave trade is to bury our heads in the sands. Check your history: During the era of slave trade, the white men did not wage war of attrition around our towns just to capture us as slaves. They stayed at the coast in their ships and it was our own people that did the raiding and the capturing of the the slaves inland. All for what? In exchange for salt, guns and freaking mirrors!

But I agree that colonialism contributed (but is not an excuse) for our hatred for each other. This is because essentially, the white man drew imaginary lines around Africa and named some portions Nigeria, Ghana, Kenya, etc. And NONE of the people so encircled by these artificial boundaries agreed (at least not willingly) to be part of their so-called Nations. That is why virtually ALL contemporary wars in Africa can be traced to ethnic issues: (Nigeria, Liberia, Congo, Rwanda, Sierra Leone, Sudan) and even recently the civil strife over leadership in Kenya proves that most African nations are formed by 'incompatible' tribes.

This is why we in Nigeria need to stop deceiving ourselves. We are very different and the earlier we acknowledge our differences and respect the need to re-negotiate our terms of existence, the better for us. I always say, the only kind relationship whose membership is non-negotiable, is a cult. Seriously, what the eff does 'Nigeria' actually mean culturally to you and to me? The word 'Niger' is not native to any tribe in Nigeria. Must it remain so because Lord Luggard's mistress gave us that name? Wazobia is to me a more culturally relevant name for this country. But as Nigerians, many of us are allergic to change of the progressive type....and that is why we seem to be perpetually swimming in the same 5hit for over 50 years. Every aspect of nationhood matters - including a country's name, which is required for shared values, common identity and sense of belonging.

What does it actually mean to be a Nigerian? Think about it!

AjanleKoko:

African parents should teach their kids self-respect, and also how to respect others, no matter how different they look from their own people.
People should stop all the sweeping comments like 'awon ibo', 'Yoruba', 'malla' etc. These groups of people are all human beings.
We are people first, and anything else secondary. That's how I live my life, I treat everyone the same, and respect the choices of others, while not letting their choices directly influence mine.

There is a lot Hausas, Igbos, and Yorubas can learn from each other to make Nigeria great. If we get it right, other Africans will copy us. We are almost a quarter of the entire continent.

True talk.

Kids are born innocent. It is their parents, relatives, friends or immediate society that turns them into bigots.

For those of us above 35, there is not much hope because many of us have imbibed intolerance (passively or actively) into our daily lives. A typical Nairaland thread about politics is a good example of this intolerance. Although with discipline, it is possible to wean such bigotry out, but most people wont bother because they confuse bigotry with power or superiority.

A better future in my opinion, lies in our children and how we bring them up.

As a proud early-90s alumni of a federal government college, I can tell you that up till my SS3, I saw all my school mates as equals. I learnt a lot about their culture because we all came from different parts of Nigeria. Some swallowed their eba while others chewed it. We all shared the same hostels, ate the same type of food, cut the same grass and dodged the same bullying seniors - all at the same time. We had a spirit of togetherness. Till today, my FGC days contain the most treasured moments in my entire life.

Although, I thank God that I was brought up untribalised and I am still like that today, I know that I started 'noticing' or paying attention to other people's tribe and religion in my university days, particularly during the June 12 crisis when our so-called leaders polarised Nigeria at the very point when she was about to attain democratic greatness.

So back to the question of why Africans love foreigners and hate their own people? The answer in my opinion is because:

1. We Africans (especially Nigerians) generally tend to have either inferiority or superiority complex and so, attacking or hating a fellow African gives us a sense of relevance and power.

2. We Africans are generally crude socially in how we perceive human beings and human life. You can tell by the way most civil wars have been fought in Africa.

3. We Nigerians in particular can be accommodating (and even respectful) to foreigners but we lack basic empathy towards the welfare of our next door neighbours. A good example is the Nigerian phenomenon behind 'I pass my neighbour'. This mentality can be found in ownership of generator sets or cars, or house, or job, or educational qualifications...etc.

4. The feudal (I pass my neighbour) mentality is more pronounced among our poor people who ought to be united (or at least more understanding of) the poverty which they are all trying to emerge from. In other words, many poor Africans believe I am rich, as long as my neighbour is poorer than me, and thats why our people can go to ALL lengths to bring down someone who is doing better than them.

OYINBOGOJU: We had our dinner it was fun and everybody was happy

Infact they enjoy the picture more than planned poundo yam

I knew it will end happily. And those pictures are worth every pixel.

Billyonaire: Beautiful kids, I think they need larger space to play around....computer age deprives 21st century kids space to exercise their muscles. Indoor games alone dont cut it.

True talk!

@Poster: The kids are trying to give you a clue to the kind of games they'd rather be playing.
But mehn, such cute pictures of naughty kids.

You know what? Make a T-Shirt printout of their images and present it to them on their graduation (or wedding) day. Trust me, everyone will have a good laugh. And they'll appreciate it.

freecocoa: Aww so cute.

But omo if na my children,they will so kneel down,hands up and close their eyes for 30 mins.

Laugh wan kill me die!

sadyeek:

[size=16pt]don't get me wrong. I did not say she or any other person that has some sorth of personal experience to share shouldn't come on to NL, but the front page is reserved for a reason. I personaly like those kind of threads your talking about, but if it should make front page let it be a general thing like "what's was your fav cartoon as a kid" let it have a feeling of that generality not just personal "my husband impregnated house girl what do I do?" Why ask me was I there when you got married?? I hope you get my point?[/size]

1. I actually find your sarcasm very funny.
2. But seriously, some of us like to contribute to threads about cheating spouses, even though we did not attend the wedding.
3. I get your point on YOUR tastes for front page stories, and I respect that.
4. All I am asking is that you respect MY (and OTHER PEOPLE'S) taste for front page stories.
5. Perhaps we should ask moderators to clarify the criteria for front page stories.

....Meanwhile, @Pakavy: yes, the smaller kid one on the left did it! He looks like he was the one who planted the 'poundo bomb'.

Please, lighten up Sadyeek. Your right to throw a punch stops where other people's faces begin.

Cheers

sadyeek:


[size=16pt]this topic is a personal one has nothing to do with my family or family of any other person reading it. !this covers your 1st and second point
Infact it covers all your points![/size]

Agreed. It is a personal issue and has nothing to do with your (or my) family. And so what?

I put it to you, that some of the most interesting Nairaland threads (in my opinion) are about OTHER peoples personal experiences.

Sometimes, a thread is interesting because it is about someone whose wife/husband cheated on them. Other times, someone wants to sell Okada for 1.5 million Naira; or another person wants to buy a house or the latest Honda. There are also interesting threads about a job offer or whether someone should relocate from Naija to Yankee.

Eventually, many people derive pleasure in reading and/or contributing to a thread for various kinds of reasons. For many years, I for example, only came to Nairaland (unregistered) just to get a laugh at the witty and funny contributions made to some people's problems. Its all part of the fun and beauty of Nairaland. Some posts and threads here actually offend my senses and sometimes my personal beliefs. But not every food or drink sold in a restaurant must meet my personal taste.

There is room for ALL sorts of topics on Nairaland Front Page. Is it hard for you to accommodate (read: ignore) other people's interest?

Haba Sadyeek!

sadyeek: [size=16pt]and this made front page, HOW
Please mods, stop being bias and enough with the sentimental BS!!
Much more important things need to be placed on front page but some how they don't make it, just to come see some meaningless ru.bbish.[/size]

Dont take this personal, but let me explain HOW or WHY this made front page:

1. I dont think this is bias. It is more of 'balance' in terms of stories that make front page.
2. Sentimental BS? No, Some of us do not come to NairaLand to curse, spit and swear on each other or on our leaders!
3. Family and kids are actually very important to some of us o! Probably the most important outcome of life, in fact.
4. Dealing with kids growing up is not meaningless ru.bbish. Its the fun and challenging part of parenting.

Life is much more than political crisis, scandals, corruption, tribalistic hatred and unfounded gossip.

@OP please email me a high-resolution enlargement of those mug shots pictures of the kids, abeg.

@Mukina and other Mods: Please post more stories like these on front page. It is not by force for anyone to click on every link that makes the front page.

naijacloud: How exactly did dis make front page? Moderators,I hail thee o!

Well, I believe there is room in Nairaland front page for all sorts of stories. People have different interests in life.

It is not only Otedola, PDP, Boko Haram or GEJ that deserve front page. This is a micro-scandal for family-oriented people to enjoy....just look at the innocent look on dem faces! Kai, children!

cheers.

As disappointing as this will be to your in-laws, this is actually the beauty of kids. Those who have suffered or longed to have children will know what I'm talking about. Dont get mad at them. But let them understand how there actions mean no poundo for inlaws, and how sad the in-laws will be not to eat poundo. They are too young to be punished for 'having fun'.

Explain things to them, then hug them and tell them never to do it again. Many years down the line, you (and them) will treasure these pictures.

Nigerians (Aba people inclusive or especially) have made so many inventions already. It is our failure to appreciate home-made stuff that is killing their ingenuity and our collective progress.

Until Nigerians begin to appreciate local productivity and intellectual property, poverty will remain our unofficial watchword. Go to our polytechnics and universities and take a look at various inventions that are rusting away, especially in the Electrical and Mechanical engineering departments.

We would rather go to China and import (after specifically ask the Chinese to make) substandard equipment that we will bring back and sell to our own people. And then we blame our backwardness on the government or on bad leadership.

Our greatest enemy in Nigeria, our greatest obstacle to progress, is in fact, ourselves.

Ijogz K: A change would only happen if we can split up.. The country is too large for Illiterates to control.. Its easier for illiterate to manage small businesses and organization.. It takes an intellectual and experienced hand to manage a multinational organization... That's the exact case we have here in Naija

I am in support of this argument and your analogy.

Nigeria is just too complicated for mediocres and illiterates. An uneducated person is better suited to managing a wheel-barrow of Omo or Garri in the market place, than being the MD or CEO of Pfizer or Microsoft.

Although we do have intelligent ones among us, those who are asked to vote (and defend their votes) will view the candidates from the prism of tribe or religion. Therefore, let us simplify the equation. Break up the country or give each sub-region 90% political and economic autonomy. Whichever region elects a monkey should expect banana governance.

It is that simple, really.

proffmanue: we lack quality education and professionalism.
we claimed to be educated but I think we are "educated illiterate" because we
don't practice what we learn in sch.
what we are good at is stealing at both local and international level.
naija problems are not limited to the politicians alone because most Nigerians
in foreign countries are bad ambassadors there.
we all lack the ability to do the right thing at every level of the society, even gate-man self na oga.

Thank you for this. You spoke like a true Prof.

Big-man mentality is killing this country. Work culture is dead. Hard work and honest living is seen as weakness or failure. Most of us will do ANYTHING for money, just so that people will do 'rankadede' for us.

Nigerians are suffering from what I call 'Pythagoras syndrome' i.e. the unexplained tendency to seek a short-cut to anything, especially wealth and success, preferably through crooked means.

afam4eva:
What about bad followership etc.

Very brilliant question. In my estimation, followers are equally responsible for our problems.

Those followers who participated, encouraged, siddon-looked or allowed corrupt leadership to plant its root have no business expecting good things in their society. It is not magic or rocket science.

It is like scrabble. When you dip your hand into the sack, you expect (desire) a high-score tile. The probability of getting a high-score tile is directly proportional to the number of high-score tiles still left in the sack at any given time.

Using the smallest political entity in Nigeria (i.e. a local govt. ward), we can now say that the probability of getting a good councillor in a ward is directly proportional to the number of good people in that ward. With bad followers, good leadership is nothing but a pipe dream. Simplez.

Cine:

Yes I totally agree with you. Although not everyone's waiting for their turn. A lot of corruption stems from education (or lack of it) and poverty. I would love to see Nigeria look to leaders like Chavez and Morales as inspiration. Although I don't think there are too many left leaning parties in this country. It's way too conservative for my liking.

I agree with you. But there is actually only ONE left-leaning party, which has unfortunately been unable to sell itself to the rest of Nigeria. The (lack of) education you spoke of also counts a lot. I can bet that 90% of educated Nigerians dont know the difference between a left wing and a right wing party. What more do you expect from the illiterates among us who are in the majority?

This why all parties and political campaigns in Nigeria are about manifestos and not ideology. For example our politicians/parties would always campaign and say: I will give you electricity (HURRAY!) I shall build good roads (HURRAY!) Everyone will have meat in their pot of soup (HURRAY!!!!). I shall build a house for every Nigerian (HURRAY! HURRAY!! HURRAY!!!).

The ideological question is HOW do you go about providing these things? This where left wing ideology vs. right wing ideology comes into play.

A right wing party for example, will say something like: We shall remove subsidy, and use proceeds to improve infrastructure over the course of 7 years, taxes will remain the same, we will not increase minimum wage and we shall punish corruption with death sentence. A left wing party will say something like: We shall keep the subsidy, and in fact add more subsidy to diesel, healthcare and education, we shall increase taxes by 5% and punish corrupt people with life-sentence.

As you can see, Nigeria has a LONG way to go politically; and probably up to 90% of us dont even know how far and how hard the journey will be. This is the real tragedy of our system as it is today.

shymmex: What Nigeria lacks is the knowledge of self i.e the knowledge of what Nigeria is, and who Nigerians are..

We need to re-define what Nigeria itself actually means - and what being a Nigerian entails!!

What is Nigeria? And who's a Nigerian?

Once we re-define these terms, we will know what we really lack..

Bravo! Thank you for this.

leaks: With Corruption, Bombings, kidnappings, armed robbery, raping of young and old, cultist, ritualists, etc

I think we lack good Security, Protection Of our Lives, Properties and a functioning government.

what do you think we lack as a nation?

We lack a sense of belonging. Period.

If every Nigerian truly believed in the country and in the equality of his fellow citizen, (irrespective of tribe or religion) then the greed, corruption, kidnapping, bombings, etc would be eliminated. But most importantly, corruption stands out as a causal factor of the breakdown in law and order. However, even corruption itself is not our most serious problem. It is a symptom of the lack of collective sense belonging.

Corruption is a symptom of insecurity. People are not secure personally, economically, culturally or socially. So they steal from the treasury and fight other ethnic groups in order to satisfy the 'perceived' individual or existential threat. If we all truly believed that Nigeria will work (or is working) for us; that our kids will not struggle in future; that our ethnic group is not deemed inferior or will not be disadvantaged - then we would work for a better tomorrow.

Even Idiagbon (of blessed memory) as disciplined and as sincere as he was, cannot change Nigeria as it is today. A leader is only as good and as effective as the quality of followers he has. A leader was a follower yesterday, anyway. Most followers in Nigeria wont mind swapping places with the corrupt leadership. So, while many of us are eagerly waiting for that chance to pounce on the national cake, for the chance to loot our own share, for the chance to hammer overnight, we should not expect Nigeria to change at all.

To get a true sense of national belonging, we MUST sit and talk. Renegotiating our terms of existence as a country is long overdue. All options must be on the table. Why must we continue to agree to the white man's boundary? What does 'Nigeria' actually mean to YOU and to ME?

Those idiotic muppets who always shout that Nigeria's unity is non-negotiable are deceiving the gullible and the f00lish. The only relationship that is non-negotiable is a cult. Which Nigeria has become anyway. And we know who the chief cultists are. So, and until we get rid of the cultist (who are clearly benefiting from the status quo) a new Nigeria is just a dream.

ps. Those corrupt bas**rds in the national assembly are the least qualified people to discuss our future. They are the foot soldiers of the cult movement holding Nigeria by the jugulars. Have you ever seen any cult movement dismember or disband voluntarily?

marvel10: This 'us' vs 'them' mentality has to go.

A few years back, a Nigerian trained dentist relocated to the UK and started a practice after some research, as at that time, dentists were refusing NHS patients in favour of private clients. He found a derelict building in a town outside of London, where they had no dentists. In the first week of opening, they had registered 400 clients. It was the pastor of Jesus House, Agwu, who gave the testimony on the dentist's behalf gon.

Imagine if he had read the nonsense some ppl are spilling here, he would have been discouraged. He would lose out on the potential to become an employer and who is to say in years to come, give out scholarships, training, workshops etc
NLanders have a tendency to 'hate' and be biased on very simple matters, making it so dark and distasteful. The poster is a t.w.a.t. why do people relocate? Why do they have babies? Why do they get married? Stupid questions really. You'd have thought the answer is glaringly obvious. Cos they can!!!

I agree with you, @marvel10. I dont know why some of those who are 'against' diaspora have taken the fight personally. If you washed dishes while you are abroad, that is maybe because your skill, your mentality, your friends or your ambition is probably suited to dish-washing. Unless of course, you are an illegal immigrant, or you were on a student/non-working visa.

The whole matter of home vs. abroad is down to choice. Naturally, those who were frustrated out of diaspora would like/prefer to think that it is not worth it. I also detect a lot of bad-belle among some (not all) of those who have not stepped out of Nigeria at all, or who were forced to return home. The basic instinct is to convince yourself (and anyone who will listen) that abroad is not worth it.

I have over the years, also realised that some of us in Nigeria are a 'bad-belle bunch of people' who are happy to see others doing good....but not better than them. This is my observation. Those who live abroad may notice that when they come back, friends and colleagues are always eager to gauge/estimate your status: your salary, your house, your car, your clothes, etc. If you make the mistake of telling them (or they detect that) you are doing well, they always end the conversation with a silly comment like: "Me, I no need to go yankee, na for hia I go make". Who is stopping you from making it in Naija before?

Besides, the typical Nigerian measures success in terms of car, house, electronic gadgets, generator and expensive clothes. These issues are called Quality of Place (QOP) factors. Those living abroad, measure success in terms of functioning amenities, good food, healthcare, personal security, job satisfaction and bright future for their kids. These issues are called Quality of Life (QOL) factors. There is a huge difference between these two terms (QOP and QOL) and they are not my invention. Google them for more info.

Let me tell you why living abroad is attractive to some people (as per QOP vs QOL).

I know many friends here in Nigeria who live in beautiful houses and drive expensive cars. But every time they take a 'shyte' in the toilet, they must use a bucket of water to flush it. In fact, a plastic drum has permanent place in most Nigerian toilets. The only way these friends can enjoy constant electricity is by having a big generator. Some of them have never taken a shower in their houses before, except in a hotel. Some dont even know that hot water can flow constantly, out of a tap. Their houses have huge 'babylonian' walls and so no one can even admire the beauty due to fear of robbers. They dare not drive their fancy cars after 6:00pm - or more than 100km away from their towns/cities due to fear of robbers. This, my friends, is a classic example of of poor quality of life. They have the most expensive things but they cannot enjoy them. Any surprise why our life expectancy is 47 years?

Moral of the story: Quality of life is at a higher level of human achievement than quality of place. In fact, quality of place is at the very very bottom of Abraham Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Those are the basic, no let me rephrase that: those are the PRIMITIVE needs of man (i.e. shelter and surroundings).

Another Okija: Because it only dawns on them after spending time abroad that the grass isn't actually greener..

I am one of those who made that bold decision to return after spending 1 year in Canada (as a permanent resident).. I applied to all the big companies and they kept turning me down for one useless reason or the other. The county then employed me to carry dustbins.. Then I got another job as a construction site cleaner.. Omo life wasn't easy and that wasnt what I bargained for when I took up the offer to live abroad..

Then I saw a medical doctor that was flipping burgers at a mac donald, saw my friend who worked in an oil company that still had to work in a bank on his off days to meet payments on his credit card bills.. OMO!! I immediately realised that I just left a gold mine to come pick scrap metals..

The taxes back home are not as insane as it is abroad.

I booked my flight and returned home to a better life jor. We may not have steady electricity, but I have an inverter and a big generator and can afford diesel.. I may not have government water, but I have a borehole.. The roads may be ridded with potholes, but thats why I drive a brand new car so it lasts longer, the security may be bad, but thats why I also have a dog, a single barrel remington shotgun (registered).. and I have a job that pays for al my bills and leaves me enough to save..

And I know at least 7 different mates of mine who are doing exceptionally well in Canada. They immigrated starting from around 2004.

The difference between them and yourself is likely that:

1. They were under no illusions. No one promised you a job with 6 figure salary as part of the permanent residence (PR) package
2. They were patient and they studied the employment system, how it works and what their shortcomings were.
3. They realised Canadians were fussy about Canadian/North American qualifications, (without which its burger-flipping for you).
4. They understood that Canadians are wary of hiring people with degrees especially of the Nigerian sub-saharan kind.
5. They used their PR status to obtain RELEVANT post-grad cert/Masters/PhD degrees (usually with scholarship).
6. The extra (and RELEVANT) qualifications in their chosen fields enabled them to prove their competence (knowledge + skills).
7. Today they are living a life of their dreams and are regularly 'harvesting' their siblings and extended family out of Nigeria.
8. Their siblings 'harvested' annually from Nigeria are each made to go through steps 1 to 7...which can take up to 3-4 years.

Get the drift? How can you just land in Canada (or even US/UK) and expect everything to fall into place in just 1 year? Take a look at the Canadians citizens themselves and see if their own people make it suddenly after just one year of graduation. For an immigrant anywhere in the world, they usually have to work twice as hard, but the rewards are almost certain IF you keep your eyes on the prize.

We Nigerians simply expect to 'hammer' overnight. That is our problem.

Many a Nigerian wants to be a big-boy, drive a Jeep, wear a rolex and gucci shoes, earn an obese salary, live in a big house - and their is NOTHING wrong with such aspirations....except when you want everything instantly. Na akara?

pash4naija: @drzed: I respect your contributions. Very objective!

Thank you very much pash4naija.

I spent much time trying to adjust the (mis)conceptions of previous posters that I have not had time to properly address the subject matter in the way I would have liked. But I think we are all learning - and I have certainly learnt a lot, especially the mind set of those who view diasporans as 'frustrated dishwashers' LOL. Thats like villagers viewing all city people as houseboys and housegirls .

Now, let me address this subject from my own experience, circumstance and future plans.

The factors that would motivate me to relocate back to Nigeria is based on a simple formula which is used in evaluating the need for change. I cannot remember who exactly, but I think it was a guy called Webber who stated that:

Change happens when the Cost of the Status Quo is greater than the Risk of Change. In other words:

C(SQ) > R(C)

Where:
C = Cost; SQ = Status Quo; R = Risk

So in the context of 'Living Abroad vs. Relocating to Nigeria' this model (formula) implies that people need to first evaluate their current circumstance or the left-hand-side (LHS) of the equation, i.e. consequence of being abroad (e.g. tax, immigration, career, racism, inability to koboko your disrespectful kid, etc). Now, if you find that this LHS is greater than the right-hand-side (RHS) of the equation, i.e. risk of returning to Naija (e.g. armed robbers, boko haram, air crash, nepa, bribery, nepotism, tribalism, etc) - then it is time to return home.

As you may deduce from the equation, both the LHS and RHS of the equation will apply differently to different people - because our circumstances are different, and how we perceive risk varies from one person to the next.

By the way, this equation for change applies to all aspects of life. For example, if the consequences (i.e. cost) of putting up with an irritating and annoying boss (who pays monkey wages) is too much compared to the status (i.e. risk) of being unemployed, then one needs to quit that job sharp-sharp. Otherwise, he/she may just get a heart attack or strangle the boss one day.

Cheers.

passionate88:

he went to a foreign nation for medical check up and our late president went to his country for medicals..... isn't that ironic?.

Yes, it is rather ironic. But I think it still depends on what exactly his ailment was, or the stage of his disease/sickness. Not every country (especially developing ones like Saudi) have expertise in ALL areas of medicine. Even American hospitals sometimes bring in expert surgeons from Europe and Asia for complicated cases.

gbollykore: Where did people get the idea that everyone that live overseas wash dishes and do menial jobs,there are Nigerians that are professionals, business owners, and so on
Agreed some people might be doing odd jobs but when they think about their background they still thank God for the opportunity to be working in these countries, i know a guy whose family had it very rough growing up, He lives in the Usa and drives a cab and he has been able to do a lot for his family members, moved his parents out of the slum they grew up in, supported the younger ones and has even managed to build himself a house in Nigeria, just by driving a cab in the USA
the question is how many taxi drivers or how many carpenters are able to do this back home
Even though i live in the USA i love my country, and am very passionate about her, but lets face the fact we have a lot of unsolved problems in Nigeria, i always like to think in the context of an ordinary man in the streets of Lsgos , not the one that supposedly has a good job (that might not be there tomorow), if a family decides to stay abroad its their choice, they should therefore enjoy everyday of their lives
its not every Nigerian that live in the USA that wash dishes, some of us are employers of labour and have Americans that answer to us ( to the glory of God almighty)
lets not push the problem under the carpet, there are unaddressed problems in our country
Truly Nigerian

Thank you. This is precisely the point I have been trying to make.

People jump to assumptions that many Nigerians abroad are doing menial jobs, or they are illegal immigrants. These sorts of Nigerians are in the minority as far as being abroad is concerned. Nigerians that I have met/known abroad are probably the most intelligent and hard working people. We out-hustle everyone, including Indians and Chinese. Even in Ghana, they had to make laws that would make life difficult for Nigerians because we out-hustled the Ghanaians in their own territory.

To assume or imply that many diasporan Nigerians are frustrated and/or doing menial jobs (when they should have come back home) is therefore a misleading or inaccurate judgement. This is because (1) not everyone is frustrated abroad (2) not everyone has something better waiting for them back home (3) some people prefer to stay abroad just as some people prefer Port Harcourt to their village; (4) driving a taxi in New York is economically better than driving molue in Lagos; (5) many Nigerians are excelling abroad in ALL aspects of life (6) Most diasporans are contributing positively to the economic circumstances of their relatives back at home. Take it or leave it.

And what some people dont appreciate is that many of the decent, hard working Nigerians abroad are contributing positively to repair Nigeria's battered image abroad. I personally know of people in academia and industry who have confessed to me that they LOVE working with Nigerians because of their intelligence and hard work.

Yes, some Nigerians abroad are into crime, illegal immigration and some wash toilets. But like I always tell my Indian colleagues abroad: No matter what they do for a living, a st00pid or lazy Nigerian is a collectors item. He/she is very rare indeed.

So the issue of what motivates people who are abroad to return home boils down to either push or pull factors:

1. The Push factors:. These are the ORIGINAL circumstances that made them leave Nigeria in the first place (e.g. Abacha, ASUU strike, unsatisfactory education, joblessness, nepa, shina rambo, whatever) - and whether these circumstances are still valid today.

2, The Pull factors: These are the EMERGING circumstance that makes them want to return home today (e.g. Start-up capital, home-sickness, political appointment, a job offer, immigration status, whatever) - and whether the time is right to come back home.

Regardless of the motivation, for someone who has lived abroad for some time, returning to Nigeria requires risk assessment and risk management.

My experience has being that many Nigerians abroad prefer to be middle-class nobodies who enjoy the economic/personal security of their host countries, than the relative big-boyism in the midst of poverty/insecurity that obtains here at home .

Again, its down to personal choice and circumstances.

Sagamite: - Culture and sociability
- Career acceleration
- Money or improved disposable income
- Familiarity
- Family and friends
- Social class climbing (power) and chics that come with it
- Less rules and more flexibility
- No gays on the streets

A very beautiful list. Permit me to add a few possible reasons:

- Saved start-up capital for business
- Political opportunity/appointment
- Joint venture with local colleagues/mates

chreld_b:

[s]Firstly, there is no need to use foul language. We dey fight? We are here to share experiences or our opinion.

My point is, let us not simplify being abroad vs. returning to Nigeria in terms of frustration, deportation or economics. People have choices. Some people live in The Gambia not because it is better than Nigeria in all respects, but because that is where they have opportunities. Same way we have expatriates in Nigeria today working in our flour mills, bakeries, supermarkets, oil sector, schools and telecoms industries. It all depends on individual choices - and the circumstances that influence those choices.

This is why I always use the City vs. Village analogy. If my old man had remained in the Village, maybe I would have become the champion yam-farmer among my generation. He moved to a city and the rest is history. BUT, not all of my father's mates in the village are worse off today. Some did quite well. Including their children.[/s]

I really do not have time for this trash. my point is stop talking trash. you can continue in your fake pseudointelgence though that is non of my business. I REFRAIN FROM CONTRIBUTING TO THIS THREAD. I have said my own.
[s]
This was why (in my previous post) I agreed wholeheartedly with your earlier statement that 'diaspora no be heaven and Nigeria no be hell'.

Thats my point.[/s]

1. Please make your OWN statements clear.
2. Dont misquote me by inserting/mixing your comments in the quote. A honest mistake, I presume.
3. I do not claim any 'pseudointelgence' as you put it.
4. Would you rather I sounded like a pseudo-idyot?
5. If giving my opinion (devoid of any insult or personal attack) upsets you, then that is not my fault.
6. Take it easy. This is Nairaland, not Angerland (just kiddin).