₦airaland Forum

TV01:
Nope, the word allah is not a personal name, it's a generic word for god. Yahweh, The I Am that I Am, is a name revealed in both the Hebrew & Christian scriptures. Neither is there any connection or continuity between the Judeo-Christian scriptures and the koranic text.

And no again, the god of muhammed is not the god of the Hebrew or Christian scriptures. Is the god presented by muhammed a Father? Are followers of the god of muhammed not expressly named as slaves?

I didn't interpret it, neither did I translate it. As presented, it reads expressly and unambiguously. I only posted the one verse in response to the claim that there is not one OT verse. There are others, across both testaments, which present a compelling portrait as God presenting in a multi-faceted manner.


I appreciate that may be the case and will not deny anyone's right to believe as they will and proselytise accordingly - as long as they do not compel or do any harm.

But hinging on "pure monotheism" is mans insistence on how God must be, not Gods clear revelation of Himself to man - and indeed, "The Lord our God is One"

Christianity is attested to prophetically, historically, archeologically and, most importantly in some respects, by it's practical outworking. The so called ROP produces anything but. And, the ROP has no recorded positive impact on humanity or, record of eliminating societal pathologies - only embedding and amplifying them.
TV

The term “Allah” has been used as the proper name for the Creator by Arab Jews and Christians long before the advent of Islam, and it continues to appear in the Arabic Bible today. So, the argument that it refers to a different deity simply doesn’t hold up. The Bible often refers to prophets as servants/slaves of God, which means that Islam using the same term doesn’t imply the existence of a new God. When Isaiah 48:16 is quoted, it’s important to recognize that it’s poetic language, not a doctrine suggesting multiple divine beings which is something that even Jewish scholars would agree on. While Christianity later developed the concept of God into multiple persons, Islam maintains the straightforward monotheism that Abraham and Moses practiced. Moreover, the notion that Islam has contributed nothing to the world is easily debunked by a millennium of scientific, medical, and intellectual advancements that even Western historians acknowledge.

TV01:
Here' an Old Testament reference for you. Not necessariiy because you gainsaid, but for anyone who truly wants revelation. God is real and Hs name is not allah. Hs name is Yahweh, The I am That I am. Come to Christ and be saved.

Isaiah 48:16 - “Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; From the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord God and His Spirit Have sent Me.”


TV

Be assured that Muslims absolutely acknowledge the God of Abraham, Moses, and Jesus. The name Allah isn’t a different deity; it’s simply the Arabic word for the same One God that you refer to as Yahweh. In fact, Arabic-speaking Christians have been using Allah for centuries without any issue.

When it comes to Isaiah 48:16, Christians often interpret it through a Trinitarian lens, but Jews who have preserved that text don’t see it as evidence of the Trinity. This highlights that interpretations can be more about theology than straightforward facts.

When you say come to Christ, that reflects your faith perspective. Just as you extend an invitation to Christianity, Muslims invite others to embrace pure monotheism not out of animosity, but from a place of genuine belief.

True belief is most powerful when it’s grounded in evidence and reason, rather than simply passed down through tradition.

@BlackfireX
You totally failed to tackle the questions but just sidestepped them. Not a single Old Testament prophet ever taught about the Trinity, and you didn’t provide any evidence to the contrary. When God said, Let there be light, it wasn’t about a second divine person it was simply God speaking, not a Trinity. Jesus referred to the Father as the only true God (John 17:3), which completely undermines the idea of co-equal Trinitarian claims. You didn’t show any verse where the Holy Spirit is worshipped by any prophet or apostle. Doctrines that pop up centuries later in church councils aren’t original revelations they’re just later interpretations.

You should take advantage of the 5 days time frame given you to respond.

@BlackfireX
You totally failed to tackle the questions but just sidestepped them. Not a single Old Testament prophet ever taught about the Trinity, and you didn’t provide any evidence to the contrary. When God said, Let there be light, it wasn’t about a second divine person it was simply God speaking, not a Trinity. Jesus referred to the Father as the only true God (John 17:3), which completely undermines the idea of co-equal Trinitarian claims. You didn’t show any verse where the Holy Spirit is worshipped by any prophet or apostle. Doctrines that pop up centuries later in church councils aren’t original revelations they’re just later interpretations.

https://www.arabdict.com/en/en-ar/details?la=ar&ids=464235&term=blessing


https://www.arabdict.com/en/english-arabic/%D8%B5%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%A9

In the Hebrew Bible, the root word barakh illustrates how Semitic languages can use a single verb in various ways, depending on the subject, similar to the Arabic salah. When God is the subject, barakh translates to bless or bestow favor, as seen in Genesis 12:2: I will bless you.However, when humans take the subject role, the same verb shifts to mean praise or glorify God, like in Psalm 103:1: Bless the LORD, O my soul. Interestingly, this root can also imply kneeling, which signifies physical humility, as mentioned in Nehemiah 8:6. No Jew or Christian interprets this to mean that humans are empowering God or that God kneels. Instead, they understand that the meaning changes based on who is performing the action. This concept is mirrored in Arabic, where sala and yusallu in the Qur’an demonstrate how one root can convey multiple meanings, all shaped by context and subject rather than a rigid, one-size-fits-all translation.

olabrad:
Salat in Arabic means prayer or praise in English. there is no other meaning.

Writing long post will not change the fact that allah prays for muhamed or praised muhamed.

The first instances shows that there is someone greater than allah. The second instance shows that muhamed is greater than allah.

Lying and twisting facts can't save Islam. The world is wiser now.

Ok. Read the verse in Arabic and ascertain who makes salat for Muhammad is this what Allah does? Just show that what Allah does is Salat.

BlackfireX:
i ask you a simple question what is the meaning of salaat ?


throwing up words wont help you. since you are mixing things up ... lets start from the basics


what does salah means? infact that is even the topic of this threaad ....what is Salaat?



let me ask you again what is salat ? forget the explanation ...lets start from the basics


what is salaat?

please this time don't tell Mickley mouse story.

Don't divert from mecca to medina

Don't allow shaitan to use black dog to scare you


What is salat in arabic?

Aha! Exposed he doesn't know what salat is in Arabic. Cannot detect it in the Arabic of the verse or any other place and he is here blabbing. It's very obvious you don't know what you state.

BlackfireX:
What is salat?

Is the problem the reading or the understanding?

Explore2xmore:
For humans, it refers to prayer; for angels, it’s about supplication; and for Allah, it conveys mercy, blessing, and honor not prayer.

Do you not have a grasp of what you are saying or is it quickly forgotten?

BlackfireX:
You should take your own advise

Now the word used is salat which means prayer.

Now the words you are using that it means blessings is not salaat instead it is barakat


Saaaalat means prayer
Barakat means blessings [/b]



O Allah send your Salat to/ on muhamed


[b]If salat is prayer who is Allah praying to on behalf of Muhammad ? Or is he prayimg to Muhammad( the High One, the one that should be praised, the intetcessor) all this from muhamed 99 names .



Salat is prayer
Don't play altaqiyya with me

You came to conclusions on what salat is on at least two occasions in response to my post. Remember you say you love Arabic but it appears you don't understand what you claim to love?

Haven established one meaning of salat at least for one context. Now show this exact word Salat in Arabic or transliteration in Quran 33:56 unless you now accept your lies and agree to your unsubstantiated mocking of mischievous intent.

Then provide a definition of altaqiyya from the Arabic you love.

Remember too:

Explore2xmore:
You state being in love with Arabic in your response to Olabrad but loving something and properly understanding it are not the same.
In the phrase Allah sends salah upon the Prophet pbuh . The verb form of salah used shifts its meaning depending on who’s using it. For humans, it refers to prayer; for angels, it’s about supplication; and for Allah, it conveys mercy, blessing, and honor not prayer. In Qur’an 33:43, when it says, He is the One who yusalli upon you, it highlights Allah’s role in guiding believers from darkness into light, showcasing His divine favor. [b]Is Allah praying to believers here? [/b]Compare to the one you apparently are critical of as it applies to prophet Muhammad pbuh; Quran 33:56 Indeed, Allah and His angels yusalluna upon the Prophet…”

Classical scholars like Ibn al-Athir and al-Tabari clarify that Allah’s salah is more about commendation than worship. When believers send salah, they’re simply joining in the act of honoring the Prophet pbuh.

olabrad:
So, the best solution is to pay off the bandits so that they can be encouraged to come back for more kidnapping?!

You condemn nnamdi KANU but try to protect bandits that commit murder and kidnap people!


I won't be surprised if you are a Muslim.

Small time, you'll lie to yourself that Islam is a peaceful reliigiion that doesn't support the bandits.

Keep on lying to yourself!

Mr Ola perharps you can share some of this ola towards attaining the country of our dreams. However you should understand that Islam does not endorse banditry; in fact, the Qur’an (5:33) prescribes severe penalties for crimes like kidnapping, murder, and acts of terror.
Paying ransom is a sign of governmental failure, not a principle of Islam, and it's important to note that Nigeria is not governed by Islamic law, so we can't attribute its policies to it. As it is the Chief of Defence, IGP and Head of Military intelligence are not Muslims. Banditry flourishes due to weak security, corruption, poverty, and political manipulation, rather than any religious doctrine.

Islam denounces all forms of crime whether committed by Muslims or others and advocates for justice, even when it involves members of one’s own community. Criticizing one group doesn’t mean endorsing another; crime is crime, no matter the ethnicity or faith involved. People of all religions in Nigeria are affected by banditry, and everyone deserves to feel safe. The focus should be on improving governance, not on blaming entire religions for the actions of a few.

Criminals are criminals, not representatives of any faith.No religion teaches kidnapping, murder, or injustice.Only dishonest people turn crime into a religious weapon to divide society.

We should defeat the misguided lie of alleging these bad acts are rooted in any religion which is clear at least in both Christianity and Islam. Are we unable to learn from history?

Let's encourage the arrest and bringing to justice all that are culpable. If the apparent immediate non arrest is strategic we hope posterity reveals better than more terror.

BlackfireX:
Is very simple


What does salat means?

That has long been established. Show this salat in the Arabic or transliteration of Quran 33:56 or is this not possible?

BlackfireX:
Funny how one need to study Arabic to understand qquran Islam and muhamed...

Then you learn Arabic the next you will hear is the classical tongue, 7 ways of understanding Quran ....ask yourself what kind of confusion is this?

My friend I have answered you even on your ignorance...

Saalaaaat means prayer.
The way Muslim deny Quranic verses eeh.

I updated my response please check. Then I don't know what your native tongue is but obviously certain words in it have meanings determined by context.

Can you clearly pick out the Arabic word salat in the verse you refer too? Do this so we can close

BlackfireX:
You should take your own advise

Now the word used is salat which means prayer.

Now the words you are using that it means blessings is not salaat instead it is barakat


Saaaalat means prayer
Barakat means blessings



O Allah send your Salat to/ on muhamed


If salat is prayer , who is Allah praying to on behalf of Muhammad? Or is he prayimg to Muhammad( the High One, the one that should be praised, the intetcessor) all this from muhamed 99 names .



Salat is prayer
Don't play altaqiyya with me

Can your Arabic expertise show you the difference between Wa aqimu as-salata lillah
;And establish the prayer for Allah.(Q 2:110)

compared to:

Huwa alladhi yusalli ʿalaykum wa malaʾikatuhu
He is the One who yusalli upon you, and His angels (also). (Q 33:43)

Can you differentiate the linguistic difference between yusalli and yusalluna in the verse of your concern?

Do you know what is called Fusha and how it relates to the Quran and native Arabians study this?

+
Did you read or skim through my earlier response?

Explore2xmore:
In Qur’an 33:43, when it says, He is the One who yusalli upon you, it highlights Allah’s role in guiding believers from darkness into light, showcasing His divine favor. Is Allah praying to believers here?

Then give a definition of altaqiyya please.

BlackfireX:
Ok nice attempt.


I learn Arabic is that a crime ? And I am sure you ain't an Arab. Which means you still need to learn it. Imagine to know the mind of Allah you a non Arab must learn Arabic language to understand your Allah.

Now back to the topic.

What does salat means?

Let's start from there.

No point getting reactiive mate.

Explore2xmore:
The verb form of salah used shifts its meaning depending on who’s using it. For humans, it refers to prayer; for angels, it’s about supplication; and for Allah, it conveys mercy, blessing, and honor not prayer.

BlackfireX:
O Allah send your prayer or praises to Muhammad..... what does that mean? Allah praying to Who?


An one of the purpose of this is for forgiveness of sin.... so sins are forgiven by sending praises to Muhammad?

Is that not contradiction? Can a sinner save a sinner?

You state being in love with Arabic in your response to Olabrad but loving something and properly understanding it are not the same.
In the phrase Allah sends salah upon the Prophet pbuh . The verb form of salah used shifts its meaning depending on who’s using it. For humans, it refers to prayer; for angels, it’s about supplication; and for Allah, it conveys mercy, blessing, and honor not prayer. In Qur’an 33:43, when it says, He is the One who yusalli upon you, it highlights Allah’s role in guiding believers from darkness into light, showcasing His divine favor. Is Allah praying to believers here? Compare to the one you apparently are critical of as it applies to prophet Muhammad pbuh; Quran 33:56 Indeed, Allah and His angels yusalluna upon the Prophet…”

Classical scholars like Ibn al-Athir and al-Tabari clarify that Allah’s salah is more about commendation than worship. When believers send salah, they’re simply joining in the act of honoring the Prophet pbuh.

olabrad:
Research shows that the Arabic word used in the verse is solat, which means prayer.

Meuslims try to lie by saying solat means blessing. Blessings in Arabic means barakat.

You can't deceive people anymore

Kindly present the actual research result not bland unsubstantiated statement please. Is this how you are taught? Answer without process or clear explanations? Please present the Arabic text or transliteration and show you understand what you say.

olabrad:
Menslims will go and be praying to an aila dat prayed for Minhamed (Qu. 33:56)

When aila prayed for Minhamed, who did aila pray to?!

Stop following without care. Allah sent blessings on Muhammad pbuh and believers are encouraged to do same. It is an honor and Allah prays to no one.

I believe you can do this research and correct yourself.

Hope the process and aftermath are well handled. The guilty and innocent will be afflicted though this is no excuse to allow wicked disorder fester.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DQrzCJhktEP/

DeltaFire:
BAQT: AFRICANS KNEW GOD. BUT ISLAM OPENED THE DOOR TO BREAKING THAT RELATIONSHIP, THEN LATER WHITE JESUS RELIGIONS WORSENED IT.
Christianity for Africans, Facebook
12 October 2025

As we know, the Chosen People are a Black people. This is how Africans weakened themselves by the entrance of Arabs and their Islam into our world. Here is a little history of it:

Makuria was a Nubian kingdom in what is today southern Egypt and northern Sudan.  It came into being after the collapse of the Kingdom of Kush in the 4th century AD. The Makuria Kingdom existed from the 6th century AD until the 14th century AD.

In 651 an Arab army invaded Makuria Kingdom but it was repelled and a treaty known as the Baqt was signed to prevent further Arab invasions in exchange for 360 slaves each year plus other conditions. This Baqt treaty lasted for a very long time, until the 13th century AD.

Baqṭ was a treaty between the Bible-believing state of Makuria and the new Arab Muslim rulers of Egypt in the 7th century AD. (Remember that Ethiopia and Nubia had scrolls of the Scripture long before Europeans came with their version of the Bible).

King Qualidurut of Makuria was the ruler who initially agreed to the Baqt treaty with the Arab Umayyad Caliphate in the 7th century AD.


This history is for us to analyse today in light of the Bible.

King Qualidurut signed a treaty with the enemy, the Ishmaelites (Arabs) because although he was not defeated he FEARED being defeated in the future. Why did this king not turn to Yahuwah God and trust that as Chosen People, if he and his people kept to the Covenant, then Yahuwah would help them to defeat the Arabs? When David and his men were at Ziklag their families were taken away as captives by the Amalekites. They did not give in but inquired of Yahuwah God who instructed them to pursue the enemy, they did so and recovered their families. The Arabs had not defeated King Qualidurut yet he FEARED!

Then again, this was an evil treaty where the Ishmaelites required a yearly amount of 360 slaves! In the Old Testament being a Hebrew slave was a temporary condition lasting a maximum of 6 years, and being freed in the 7th year. Plus they had to be treated humanely. What King Qualidurut did by giving away 360 Black lives as slaves each year was sinful and the Arabs were very cruel to the African slaves.
Additionally, the Old Testament severely condemns kidnapping, specifically for the purpose of selling people into slavery, and requires the death penalty for this crime. Exodus 21:16 states that "whoever kidnaps a man, whether he sells him or is found in his possession, shall be put to death". Deuteronomy 24:7 reinforces this law, commanding that "if a man is caught kidnapping any of his brothers among the Israelites and treats him as a slave or sells him, the kidnapper must die. You must purge the evil from among you". 

The strength of the Chosen People is in Yahuwah God. With obedience there is protection from the enemy and other blessings. But, with disobedience that protection would no longer be available. This is how our African ancestors got weaker. Then, as the Arabs kept on imposing themselves, their religion of Islam also began to spread. As we read from history books, Islam was spread by trade and also the sword so if in that way our ancestors would have joined out of fear and desperation, then they would teach their children that foreign religion, and worship of the true Yahuwah God would progressively get forgotten.

As we know, Satan will take advantage of every situation to keep the Chosen People separated from Yahuwah. In this more weaker condition of Africa, witchcraft that is condemned in the Old Testament eg in Exodus 22:18 and Leviticus 20:27 began to get bold and seek customers, and up to today we have the sorcery practices in Africa.
Leviticus 19: 31 states:
“Do not turn to mediums or seek out spiritists, for you will be defiled by them. I am the LORD your God.”

Even with all that, there were still people in Africa who were worshipping Yahuwah God, so when Europeans came they recorded that in their notebooks. However, White people added to the near-complete elimination of Yahuwah God from Africa with their identity theft White Jesus and Christianity that debases Blackness as it elevates Whiteness. Therefore, while deceived that they worship God, it was White culture, White thinking, and a White god that Africans worship.

We today have a lot more Light than our ancestors had. We know that the biblical Israelites were a Black nation. We also know the racism and cruelty that we face from Whites and Arabs, and we know that global systems are worked to be against us rising. Yet, we also know from Deuteronomy 30 that Yahuwah God has promised to restore us to Him and to the place He wants His special Chosen People to be at this time.

So Africans, I hope from this information we can see how we weakened ourselves by fearing foreigners which made them tell us what to do and control the way we should worship and live. Look at our Church denominations and Mosques, who has set the programs for them? Is it still Whites and Arabs? Does that make us stronger or weaker?



#Yeshuanity4Africans (formerly #Christianity4Africans)

#BlackMESSIAH



https://web.facebook.com/Christianity4Africans/posts/pfbid04dYoVczvHVmmp9JpWX6FQ38TNgPaB1nCFaoMWK8Uc4MjzWj39FvHrdvmvxogN5jVl

Interesting write up.

Remember though that after the fall of Kush in the fourth century, Africa’s Nile Valley rose again through Christian kingdoms like Nobatia, Makuria, and Alodia. These were Bible-believing African nations that worshipped Yahuwah long before Europeans brought their version of Christianity. In 651 CE, an Arab-Egyptian army invaded Makuria but was repelled. King Qalidurut, though undefeated, feared future war and signed the Baqt Treaty with the Muslim rulers of Egypt. It brought centuries of peace but required a yearly tribute of around 360 slaves a grievous sin against Yahuwah’s law.

The Scriptures forbid kidnapping and human trade. Whoever kidnaps a man and sells him shall be put to death (Exodus 21:16). Hebrew servitude was temporary and humane, yet this treaty handed Africans to foreign masters. The king’s fear, rather than faith, opened a door for spiritual decline. As covenant obedience faded, protection weakened. Islam spread through trade and influence, and in that spiritual vacuum, witchcraft and spiritism grew bold despite the warnings of Leviticus 19:31 and 20:27.

Islam, however, also changed the meaning of slavery. The Qur’an made freedom the rule and enslavement the exception, commanding mercy, brotherhood, and the freeing of slaves as a virtue. In spirit, it abolished ownership of humans, though later societies often ignored this ideal.

Centuries later, Europeans arrived and erased much of Africa’s memory of Yahuwah through their White Jesus religion that exalted whiteness and belittled blackness. Africans were made to worship a foreign image of God while their true covenant heritage was hidden.

Today we know more. The Israelites were an olive to brown skinned including black people, and Deuteronomy 30 promises that Yahuwah will restore His Chosen People when they return to Him. Our weakness began when we feared foreigners and allowed them to dictate our worship. Our strength returns when we stand in faith, reject imposed systems, and seek again the covenant relationship with Yahuwah our God.

Kavara:
Some people may have gone through what I am going through now and generally I am tired of my situations currently and I need change.

I can't really share some here personally because 9f public space but if I can talk to someone it will help

Try not to be so hard on yourself. Life is a continuous process, quite often a mix and no one has it all in one jolly good direction. Keep looking to be better.

See you mentioned restitution. I don't know what for and truly will rather not know. You resolve not to repeat and perharps may find a way to compensate and maybe in time openly seek forgiveness/restitution with whoever is directly afflicted. No fuss. Keep being better and stop being tied to what's passed. It can't be undone. Do the best with now and strive to better tomorrow.

Cheer up and be grateful for the little positives, try to do more but don't break yourself in the process.

We more likely wouldn't come to an agreement however consider that the relationship within the Christian Trinity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit sharing the same essence, or homoousios, the scriptures hint at a hierarchy that deserves a closer look.

Take John 5:19, for instance, where it says, The Son can do nothing of his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing.

This verse really highlights how the Son relies on the Father, showing that Jesus is all about fulfilling the Father's will instead of acting on his own.

Then there's 1 Corinthians 11:3, which states, The head of Christ is God, pointing to an eternal order within the Godhead and suggesting that the Son continually submits to the Father's authority.

Moreover, 1 Corinthians 15:28 talks about the Son eventually being subjected to the Father, reinforcing this hierarchical relationship that goes beyond just temporary circumstances.
And in John 14:28, when Jesus says, The Father is greater than I, it emphasizes the different roles even among those who are equal in essence. So, while the Trinity embodies unity in being, there’s definitely a clear order of authority at play. The highest being the One True God that everything including Jesus and the Holy spirit submit to.

TenQ:
Check above Mr Explore2xmore

Jesus and his disciples were part of the Jewish community, and his earliest followers belonged to a Jewish sect. However, most Jews did not accept Jesus as the Messiah because he didn’t fit their expectations, and his teachings—especially as they evolved over time—strayed from traditional Jewish beliefs. As a result, Christianity developed its own path, while Judaism continued to reject the notion of Jesus as the Messiah.

When it comes to genetics, we have some strong insights, but we can’t yet guarantee or perfectly predict how a child will look. Our knowledge is expanding, but human traits come from intricate, layered genetic systems rather than straightforward one-to-one mappings.

Law represents a structured set of rules enforced by the state to uphold social order, whereas morality reflects an individual or collective sense of right and wrong. It’s important to note that laws can exist independently of moral values, and people can still be guided by their moral compass even when laws are absent.

Morality is influenced by certain principles of right and wrong, while law is shaped by political, social, and practical considerations—and sometimes, these two don’t quite match up.

It pains you about the marriage eh ya. You missed out on that didn't you for your societal norms. Eh ya!

I mentioned your Jewish brethren's error to point out their error. The hadith doesn't refer to gender of offspring. Does it?

TenQ:
Hello Mr Explore2xmore,
As usual, they delayed two posts connected to the reference above

Here it is again

It's a big pity you cannot discern difference in what he said compared to what the Jews said. Some poor degree in intelligence and discernment.

You can keep repeating or regurgitating your old statements

Does the science you believe have absolute understanding? No! Hahaha

The Qur’an lays out a clear and organized list of those who are prohibited from marrying in Surah An-Nisa (4:22–24), addressing biological, foster, and in-law relationships. On the other hand, the Bible has this information more scattered, less systematic, and primarily focuses on biological relatives. The New Testament tends to emphasize moral behavior rather than detailing specific marriage restrictions. In summary, the Qur’an provides a more straightforward and legally precise approach to marriage prohibitions compared to the Bible.

In all the Quran speaks in terms that are understood and people know. People had a knowledge of Jesus and what he preached.
It is a shame that the original Hebrews or jews have no name for the book of Jesus.

Jews do not have a Gospel or an equivalent because of differences in belief about prophecy, scripture, and Jesus.

TenQ:
That was not the question sir.
What we are saying is that the Talmud was written by non prophets AND they are WRONG.
But your prophet copied them while telling lies that it was Jibril!

Could Jibril have made such a blatant ERROR that the baby resemblance is a function of who ejaculates first?



A child is ADOPTED only because there is no biological relation to the parents. They become CHILDREN of the parents by Legal Pronouncements. So, if Joke Silva is Adopted, she is a Child of the Parents because they are not related by blood.

You say, Islam does not cancel ADOPTION!
So, why can you ask a Muslim man marry the Wife of your Son (by Adopted)?



This was why Mohammed was indeed an illiterate!

The sperm and ovum each contain 23 chromosomes, which are haploid sets. These 23 chromosomes include: 22 autosomes (non-sex chromosomes) that are the same in both sperm and ovum 1 sex chromosome (allosome),

Autosomes are the 22 pairs of non-sex chromosomes inherited equally from both parents, carrying thousands of genes responsible for a wide range of traits such as eye color, height, and susceptibility to diseases

Therefore, it is NOT who ejaculates First between the man or the woman BUT the mix of the thousands of genes chromosomes in the specific Ovum and Sperm.

Your prophet was WRONG!
It was a lie that Jibril told him this ERROR!


You find the Qur'an verse disgraceful!?
I can understand!
Can you please give me your own translation of
Qur'an 33:37
And [remember, O Muhammad], when you said to the one on whom Allah bestowed favor and you bestowed favor, "Keep your wife and fear Allah," while you concealed within yourself that which Allah is to disclose. And you feared the people, while Allah has more right that you fear Him. So when Zayd had no longer any need for her, We married her to you in order that there not be upon the believers any discomfort concerning the wives of their adopted sons when they no longer have need of them. And ever is the command of Allah


I do perfectly understand!
When something is Left out of a copied document, it cannot be said to be perfectly preserved. When things are abrogated from the copied document, it cannot be perfectly preserved! When memorisers forget parts of the original, whatever you have cannot be perfectly preserved.

It is simple logic sir!



The question was:
So, tell me why your God gave the name of the book given to Jesus a Greek influenced name?

Well that's your problem being that Jews consider the Talmud as essential to Jewish law and religious practice. Particularly important for interpretation of the Torah.

Glad you realise the act of adoption doesn't confer biological relations.

Facial features like nose shape, eye spacing, lip fullness, etc. are influenced by many genes spread across several chromosomes hope you have enough understanding of how exactly the one that manifests cones to be?

Did you not requote Quran 53:19-20 to display your habitual mischief? You're now trying to parry by speaking of a verse in Surah Ahzab.
Is there a lie here?

And He [i.e., Allah] has not made your claimed [i.e., adopted] sons your [true] sons. That is [merely] your saying by your mouths, but Allah says the truth, and He guides to the [right] way. Call them [i.e., the adopted children] by [the names of] their fathers; it is more just in the sight of Allah. But if you do not know their fathers, they are your brothers in religion…" (Quran, 33: 4-5)


Do you expect Allah to speak in incomprehensible terms?
In reality though which of the four Gospels was written or documented while Jesus was alive? Absolutely none.

TenQ:
Meaningless rattles!


Only with you does a simple question requires evidence.
Are the opinion Zakir Naik or Ahmed Deedat scriptures to you?




Islam doesn't cancel adoption but you can marry the wife of your adopted son!?

Qur'an 33:37
And [remember, O Muhammad], when you said to the one on whom Allah bestowed favor and you bestowed favor, "Keep your wife and fear Allah," while you concealed within yourself that which Allah is to disclose. And you feared the people, while Allah has more right that you fear Him. So when Zayd had no longer any need for her, We married her to you in order that there not be upon the believers any discomfort concerning the wives of their adopted sons when they no longer have need of them. And ever is the command of Allah


You have an adopted son, but you can marry his wife!?
SMH!!



The GENE'S are in the chromosome sir. It has nothing to do with we ejaculates first.

It is an error the least Angel of God will make such a silly error!


Didn't In show you the correlation with the names of the daughters of Allah!?

By the way, if Allah is the name of your God, what does Allah mean?




When something is Left out of a copied document, it cannot be said to be perfectly preserved. When things are abrogated from the copied document, it cannot be perfectly preserved!




So, tell me why your God gave the name of the book given to Jesus a Greek influenced name?

The Talmud is far more central to Judaism than the works of Naik or Deedat are to Islam.

There is no blood relation there. It is your wish and you failed to answer if Joke Sylvia has a biological relation with her adopting parents.

Genes on sex chromosomes (X and Y) do influence facial features to some extent, but they are not the main contributors to why a child resembles their mother or father.

Genetic inheritance of facial features is not linear or predictable. The exact mechanism is far more complex than the generic understanding suggests.

In the verse you fabricated by adding what isn't there and incerting a wrong inconceivable word or phrase in Arabic grammer? Keep exercising yourself in falsehood and make belief.

It will be correct if there indeed was a copy to copy that from? Sure you don't understand that all that was compiled existed in written form and had those who had memorized.

The injil of Jesus wasn't documented and the four gospels you hold on to were not written in his lifetime. Don't they disagree with each other in certain reports?

TenQ:
Again,
Then last part of my post

You should take up your deleted post with the platform not me or wrongly assume the reason for. In any case you tend to prefer WRONG Q and it's who you are.

Where are the books of Deedat and Naik taken as sacred outside your mistaken manufacturing? Please tell and give evidence. Their opinions are largely impressive and revered but not to the extent of being sacred. Only you christians do that in promoting a messenger of God. A creation of God not God.

You can have your faulty conclusions and opinions within your rights.

Unable to differentiate that adoption isn't forbidden but an overreach corrected. Will Joke Sylvia's genetic test now show she us a biological descendant of her adopting parents?

How queer is your reasoning? Is that the meaning of the Q in your pseudonym or quarrelsome?

Sadly you are too far gone to see prophet Muhammad pbuh didn't refer to gender inheritance. It is your jewish brethren's view. Can you tell from your 23 chromosomes which exactly influence physical similarity in appearance? If this were the case what then is the point for going as far as cloning which isn't absolutely successful. Warped sillly thoughts you choose to have?

Show where and how lah is a standalone word. You can't. Keep lying to yourself and unthinking following friends.

Regardless of your erroneous thoughts the Quran is perfectly preserved. The Qiraat have influence of the other harfs of divine revelation and there's nothing you can do about it.

Ireneus of Lyon said "There are four zones of the world… and four principal winds… it is fitting that the Church should have four pillars…”

This is not a theological or historical reason.

Goslel book titles were assigned later, possibly to lend credibility to anonymous texts.

The final form of Scripture had imperial sponsorship, which raises questions about independent spiritual consensus.

Texts that contradicted what came to be considered “orthodox” things like, that Jesus wasn’t divine, or that God didn’t create the material world—were excluded as heretical.

The process of canonization was as much about defining orthodoxy as preserving historical truth.

The Gospels were often chosen based on what they excluded, not just what they included.

Go figure that or query that instead. It will be more productive use of your time.

Bye!

TenQ:
There are prompts that trigger the Bots: check if you could find any with my post. Only a human will delete posts scanned as pictures. The number of my posts deleted on this thread will be up to SIX.
Tell the overzealous moderator not to be afraid of the Truth!

Victim mentality playing out?

TenQ:
What a silly argument!
Do you have access as a Muslim to their Qur'an as Muslims?
At least In have shown you hadiths and the Qur'an to prove my case..

Do you deny saying:

TenQ:
You will notice that I have concentrated just between the Qur'an of Mohammed and the Qur'an of Abubakar and I have shown you discrepancies you cannot dispute.

You say:
You will notice that I have concentrated just between the Qur'an of Mohammed and the Qur'an of Abubakar and I have shown you discrepancies you cannot dispute.
This strongly suggests that you believe you have:

- Compared the “Qur'an of Muhammad” with the “Qur'an of Abubakar” referring to the revelations recited by the Prophet versus the compilation made during Abu Bakr’s time as caliph);
- Noted differences between the two;
- Centered the discussion exclusively on these two versions, rather than considering other compilations or recensions, like Uthman's.

This implies that you had access to both versions and has performed a comparative analysis.

So, yes — the statement indicates that you claim to have examined both texts.


Try save face and correct my understanding and English.

TenQ:
Then quote the full text and burst me!?
It is simple!
Only a Muslim will see untruths but hold on tightly to it.

Keep deceiving yourself on what you clearly see despite also knowing there are varied revelations that have the same core meaning.

TenQ:
Unfortunately, it is you who have created Allah in your own image. Allah looks exactly like the Dajjal except that the Dajjal has one eyes but Allah has two. The oneness of Allah is like the oneness of things on earth!

No wonder you believe the supreme God has to become his creation to salvage his creation. You have diminished your God and as such easily fall for the deception of the antichrist Dajjal

TenQ:
The Qur'an was collected BUT not collected.
The Qur'an was written BUT not written
The Qur'an was memorised BUT abrogated

Mr limited limiting knowledge.
Do you remember every single thing you were taught in school to the very detail. That's even going too far. Do you remember every single thing you did just yesterday to the exact time point. This is where Allah, the almighty God is far above you.

TenQ:
Either Jibril dictated to Mohammed as Quran things not in the Qur'an of Allah
OR
The Qur'an is NOT a copy but an abridged summary of the Qur'an of Allah.

Which of the two is it?

Definitely not. Revelation came down over time and injunctions came and were relaxed as needed and appropriate. Why does this exist in your Bible?I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. John 16:12

TenQ:
But Adoption wasn't abrogated gradually!
SMH!
Marrying your adopted sons wife wasn't abrogated gradually!
SMH!

If alcoholic drink is from Shaitan , why gradually abrogate it?.

Is there good reason why adoption still takes place in the world today?
Is it not a fact that regardless of papers and process an adopted relative can never be the same as a biological relative.

How many immediate alcoholics automatically and instantaneously stop consuming alcohol. Sure you can see no wisdom in how it became forbidden? Even you compilation advices against consumption to drunkenness yet many fall short.

Don't you see your emotional and sentimental error?

TenQ:
You have to explain the error of Mohammed for him again!?

According to your prophet
As for the child, if the man's discharge proceeds the woman's discharge, the child attracts the similarity to the man, and if the woman's discharge proceeds the man's, then the child attracts the similarity to the woman."

This is COMPLETELY scientifically UNTRUE and INCORRECT?

Sorry mr scientist. Science can largely explain genetic inheritance and its connection to physical traits but it does not yet fully explain every detail or does it?

TenQ:
Another standard islamic narrative to explain away previous lies.
Were the abrogated verses in the eternal uncreated Qur'an of Allah in paradise or NOT?

They have zero divine value o!
They are writings of different Jewish scholars and scribes.

Are the Books of Ahmed Deedat divine for you as Muslims ?
Are the Books of Zakir Naik divine for you as a Muslim?

You asked a direct question and it was answered but you are angry!
Because Al-LAH is not YHWH is he?
Because Al-LAH is a subset of the Universe, isn't he?

There is no such Arabic as Al-Lah.

You can as well have all Christians and Jews desist from attending church and temples to have their clergy preach or explain the scripture. Perhaps explaining things they don't readily understand.

TenQ:
Mr Explore2xmore,
Your Muslim Admin as usual has gone to delete my post. Why are you guys like this?

Part TWO

Very shameless of you to label the automate system as Muslim controlled when you know it is an automated system you fall foul off and is religion independent.

In any case you claim to restrict your analysis to between prophet Muhammad pbuh and Abubakar yet you don't have access to any of their material you claim to reference. Are you fooling yourself?


You deliberately quote just a word from these alone verses because you know your lie will be exposed otherwise. Shame on you!

Why not? Do you think there is anything that occurs in this life that is outside the record, allowance and command of Allah? Keep creating your supreme deity in your own image.


The Quran was collected in the lifetime of prophet Muhammad pbuh. In the sense that it was fully revealed, explained, recited, written but not in one collection during his lifetime.

What was willed to be collected into the Quran is. Remember it was revised twice in the final year.

What was to be retained remained in the memory of the companions, was found written and all what was abrogated wasn't found in memory and written form.

You see the gradual abrogation of alcohol consumption,verses that were abrogated during the Prophet’s lifetime,verses that were recited but not written like the so-called stoning verse but remain in the law.

Fluid prevalence can be metaphorical for genetic domination. In any case it will be great to understand all factors that influence gene domination.

In essence not all abrogation means deletion. Sometimes the text remains, but the ruling changes as in alcohol verses). Also both text and ruling are lifted where such cases are called naskh al-tilāwah.

You deny that the divine authority residing in the Talmud, Mishnah, and Gemara stems from their reliance on the foundational truths presented in the Tanakh and Torah?

Well since you asset so high wisdom to yourself and claim to challenge Allah (may he be praised above all this and as is due to him) it is best to ignore you and leave you to Allah the almighty.

All this trouble to divert from your lies of actually comparing your said Quran of Muhammad pbuh and Quran of Abubakar? You never had access to what you claim of either but say too much and don't know or remember when you lie.

TenQ:
I don't explain hadiths, I ask questions about them. Honesttalk21 repeatedly did not answer most of my direct questions on the hadiths. I didn't ask for explanation of hadiths I asked that you answer my questions and here you both failed.

You don't explain hadith but first explained it to yourself and question for the sake of mockery since you understand it wrongly?

This is pathetic deceit and shameful hypocrisy.

TenQ:
According to your prophet
As for the child, if the man's discharge proceeds the woman's discharge, the child attracts the similarity to the man, and if the woman's discharge proceeds the man's, then the child attracts the similarity to the woman."

Is this scientifically true and correct?


So, tell me where the Jews got this information from their scripture. If it is in there Scriptures, then I believe it!
Is this in the scripture of the Jews or their scholars invented it?

The hadith where properly stated doesn't deny both parents contribute to the child and refers to aspects of the physical appearance of the child.

As for your Jewish brethren it from what they have to explain their scripture or is that not true? Define and explain the Talmud.

TenQ:
1. Was the verse of stoning adulterers in the Qur'an of Abubakar? No! But it was in the Qur'an according to Mohammed
1. Was the verse of breastfeeding an adult man in the Qur'an of Abubakar? No! But it was in the Qur'an according to Mohammed

There was indeed a verse in the Qur’an that mentioned stoning, but the specific wording was later abrogated, even though the ruling itself remained in effect. The fact that it’s not found in the Qur'an reflects a deeper divine wisdom in legislation, yet the ruling has been preserved through practice and hadith.

Regarding breastfeeding "Forbidden to you [for marriage] are: your mothers... and your foster-mothers who breastfed you, and your foster-sisters..."(Qur’an 4:23)

The absence of any objects where it was written and non clear remembrance of the verses is divine and proof of the abrogation/lifting of these verses.


Show where you saw the Qurans of Muhammad pbuh and Abubakar. You liar.

TenQ:
Explore2xmore

Here are just TWO where verses mean different things between the Warsh Qur'an and Hafs Qur'an

1. Surah Al-Imran (3:146)
Hafs version: The verse uses the word "قاتل" (qātila), meaning "fought". It says the prophets fought alongside many godly men.
Warsh version: The verse uses the word "قُتِلَ" (qutila), meaning "were killed". It says many prophets were killed along with their companions.

Is it possible to fight but not killed?

2. Surah Al-Baqarah (2:140)
Hafs version: Uses the word "تقولون" (taqulūna), meaning "you say", addressing the Jews and Christians directly.
Warsh version: Uses "يقولون" (yaqulūna), meaning "they say", referring to them indirectly.

Who said what to who?


Here is Allah's promise again as I am giving it to you for the second time in this thread.
Qur'an 87:6-7
"We shall make you recite, so you will not forget, except what Allah wills. Indeed, He knows what is manifest and what is hidden."

Tell me how the Qur'an of Mohammed can be identical to the Kalam Allah if Mohammed forgot just one word of it?


Not identical word for word, dot for dot! I have shown you evidences from your sources.


Ibn Mas'ud's Qur'an
1. Ibn Mas'ud’s mushaf did not include Surah al-Fatiha (the Opening) and the two final chapters, al-Falaq and al-Nas (collectively known as al-Mu’awwidhatayn)
2. The order of surahs in Ibn Mas'ud’s mushaf differed from the canonical arrangement established in Abubakar's Qur'an

https://www.icraa.org/surahs-mushaf-ibn-masud/

Ubayy's Qur'an
1. Ubayy’s Qur'an is reported to have included two additional surahs not found in the Uthmanic (and thus Abu Bakr’s) mushaf: Surah al-Hafd and Surah al-Khal’ (sometimes numbered as 115 and 116)

https://www.icraa.org/no-of-surahs-in-ubayys-mushaf/

Quote the two verses in full not just the single word differences let's check the effect on the whole meaning?


Are you challenging Allah causing his creation to remember and forget? It seems you also tend to claim to never forget?

You imagine that what is in the Kalam Allah doesn't contain this too? Please tell another lie that you have also seen that.

You are wrong as you will need to show discrepancy in every Qiraat though the centuries. Don't forget that the Qiraat are divinely supported.

Ask for information about why Ubay had additions and Ibn Masud omissions.
You hold on to what have good reason to support your falsehood.

TenQ:
It is amazing that honesttalk21 didn't provide evidences nor did he answer any direct questions BUT according to you, his repeating of the standard Islamic Narrative is a superior answer to evidences he couldn't respond to!

Honesttalk21 properly explained the hadith you misunderstood. Should he have given new hadith to buttress the point?

TenQ:
Isn't it a shame that your prophet who should receive from Allah is regurgitating wrong information written by Jewish scholars in their books.

You see your eagerness to run with your misconceptions? Is what the prophet pbuh said exactly like the what the jews said? Please don't rush to wrongly conclude, read and compare so you know.


If the Jews had problems with Jesus did you not even expand on what these wrong are? Did Jesus call you christian or ask you to disobey the old laws not the wrong priestly actions and interpretation,

TenQ:
Is it not true that ANYTHING of Doctrinal value that Mohammed speaks is directed by Allah?


If it is TRUE, you have a problem that Mohammed was transmitting scientific errors as from Allah

You won't believe in any case.
Which scientific errors did the prophet Muhammad pbuh transmit? Rather you are the one in error.

TenQ:
You will notice that I have concentrated just between the Qur'an of Mohammed and the Qur'an of Abubakar and I have shown you discrepancies you cannot dispute.

Fantastic! You now lie that you have a Quran of Muhammad pbuh that is different from that of Abu Bakr?

Please share some verses of each i.e of prophet Muhammad pbuh and Abubakar, to prove and validate if you don't characteristically lie.

TenQ:
Hafs Qur'an
Warsh Qur'an
Qalun Qur'an
Al-Duri Qur'an
Khalaf Qur'an
Ibn 'Amir Qur'an
Abu Ja'far Qur'an

Are all different, so which one is the exact copy of the Qur'an of Allah in paradise?

Please these are Qiraat (recitation types). In total they are 20 not 32 and you can fit your false claim of 32 into them.

None give any core difference in core meaning. Try prove me wrong!

TenQ:
He was born about 600 years after the Hijrah but he is your authority on the Qur'an against testimonies of Ibn Mas'ud and Ubayy!?

What did he say against Ibn Masud and Ubay? For him to have said and be recognised is simply because verifiable information was available for him to study, reference and give valid views about. Nothing was or is hidden?

TenQ:
You did NOT answer my questions sir.
AGAIN:

Cc: Honesttalk21 and CreativeOrbit

1. You just agreed with me that the Qur'an was collected and written down during the lifetime of your prophet.

I still ask the Question
Where is the Qur'an of Mohammed written on pieces of clothes?

2. You said:
The Qur’an we have today is complete not because it includes every word ever revealed, but because it includes everything Allah *willed* to remain. This view is upheld by both Sunni and Shi’a scholars,
BUT, the claim of modern Muslims is that, the Qur'an has been perfectly preserved word for word, letter for letter even up to the diacritical marks.

So, my question remains
Which of the over 32 Arabic Qur'an in existence is the EXACT copy of the Kalam Allah/ the Qur'an of Allah in paradise from which Jibril recited the Qur'an to Mohammed?

Don't put your words into my written responses. The Quran was written and the prophet orally informed which verses and surahs went where. The Quran wasn't compiled into a single book in the prophet's life.

Which irrelevant question exactly did I not answer?

Why do you ask of Prophet Muhammad pbuh 's Quran when you already have it to have compared with Abubakar's? You were lying so easily forgot?

TenQ:
You will notice that I have concentrated just between the Qur'an of Mohammed and the Qur'an of Abubakar and I have shown you discrepancies you cannot dispute.

You showed discrepancy between Muhammad pbuh's Quran and Abubakar's?

TenQ:
Where is the Qur'an of Mohammed written on pieces of clothes?

This may become your reknown archaeological find when you find it.

There's no surviving example of Quran written on cloth that has been authenticated to date as being from the 7th century,from Medina or Mecca that was written during the Prophet’s actual lifetime.

Cloth is much less durable than parchment or bone, especially in Arabia’s climate. It likely decomposed over time, unlike more robust materials.

TenQ:
2. You said:
The Qur’an we have today is complete not because it includes every word ever revealed, but because it includes everything Allah *willed* to remain. This view is upheld by both Sunni and Shi’a scholars,
BUT, [b]the claim of modern Muslims is that, the Qur'an has been perfectly preserved word for word, letter for letter even up to the diacritical marks.

What is your problem here? What is to be is, a few verses abrogated are seen along with what abrogated them.
Yes I repeat what is preserved and protected by Allah is what is available to the very exact. Inclusive of the variations you ignorantly yap about as different.

Repeating already answered questions will be ignored.

SIRTee15:
Exactly the argument. Standardised Quran is a collective compilation NOT the solo dictation Jibril gave to Muhammed.
If different sahabas were reciting different Qurans, it shows there was a divergence at the beginning which was later harmonised thru coercion and intimidation.

That Quran was preserved from Muhammed downwards is a fallacy.

How do you make a confirmation based on speculative phrases. The premise isn't certain

SIRTee15:
Exactly the argument. Standardised Quran is a collective compilation NOT the solo dictation Jibril gave to Muhammed.
If different sahabas were reciting different Qurans, it shows there was a divergence at the beginning which was later harmonised thru coercion and intimidation.

That Quran was preserved from Muhammed downwards is a fallacy.

You agree the dictation/revelation was in different ways?