₦airaland Forum

Ok, here's the deal: let's not discourage anyone of whatever faith to just come on here and ask questions about ATR. However, as I mentioned previously, if they do begin to indirectly say that my religion is right and yours is wrong, we can just remind them that this thread is not one for religious fighting and backstabbing. CuteMadridista, tell 'em!

orisa37:
There is "Orun-rere" where Oduduwa is in charge for Olodumare. This why we have "Sunre o", "Odigbere" in blessing them.
There is also "Orun-apadi" representing The Warehouse for evil.

Ok. Are you a believer in Ifa?

FOLYKAZE:
#unfollow thread

LOL... I may do the same.....

CuteMadridista:
Going through the thread cuz I wasn't active yesterday, can someone explain to me how this thread turn to "Christianity vs ATR"?

I know Shadeyinka brought up some Christian terms but it still fit into a question so its welcome but seems the last 2 pages have been dick measuring contest on ATR and Christianity when the thread wasn't intended to be

Unfortunately, this seems to be how almost all threads on subjects like this end up now on NL... it's pretty sad I must say. I am not and do not try to bash other faiths to come and seek knowledge about ones not like theirs, that's just fine. But when suddenly and oh so subtly they begin to start to try to get you to turn to their point of view, that's when I draw the line. If you want to seek knowledge, then by all means do so. Just try to not get others to suddenly say, "Oh my god, he/she is right... Christianity/Islam/Judaism/whatever is better than ATR, those wicked scum that practice such terrible terrible acts obviously will burn in Hell!"

Now, please note that I do not endorse the mocking/making fun of religions/spiritual beliefs, no matter what you believe in. But I swear I've seen some threads on here that really make me question the state of humanity.... all this fighting and arguing and all this poo just really needs to stop! It makes me sick......

shadeyinka:
A blood sacrifice is a symbolic representation of a seal on a bond between the spirit and the one making the sacrifice.

Just like the life of whatever is sacrificed cannot come back, the bond should remain. Its more akin to the red wax seal used on important documents.

The only problem with such blood bonds is that one doesn't get to know the full extent of the conditions of the blood bond.

A higher sacrifice and some other conditions may be able to replace a lower sacrifice.

Yeah, this is basically what I tried to explain LOL! But I wonder why some things aren't explained? Are you saying this because you yourself don't know all of the conditions of a blood bond?

FOLYKAZE:
You try sha. I don't know either why Fruits are been sacrificed to Emere. You're very about Abiku.

LOL! Yeah, I tried hahahaha

Maybe there's a deeper meaning? Hmmmmmmmm, maybe I'll have to incorperate that into my story! Ooooooh, this is going to be fun!

Magic is a tricky thing, don't you agree?

Folykaze, are you Yoruba?

FOLYKAZE:
A quick question please. What is the role of FRUITS that are usually sacrificed to Egbe Emere to prevent a woman from bearing Abiku?

Hmmmm... now that I'm unsure of.. I've never really heard of Abiku before really, I know that it's some kind of reincarnation of a child that dies at a young age and keeps coming back? Like ogbange or something?

Fruits may mean sort of the same thing as I said earlier, but perhaps since a fruit is sort of like the offspring of a tree, maybe the woman gives fruits to the egbe as a sort of substitute offspring... it's hard to explain... sorry!

chaarly:
when you comment on a thread, it automically makes you follow the thread. To change it, the box beside 'submit' you'll see 'follow this topic' click it and the mark will go. . unfollowed.

#yo welcome

Haha, thanks! Yes I know this but sometimes NL just seems to have me follow topics that I've never commented on all of a sudden.

Wow, again does him being an atheist matter? Yes I know this is posted in the religion section but seriously people.... let's just respect the dude, let's not insult him or whatever, let's keep this thread to a minimum of arguments please. You can say he's going to hell all you want or that he's there burning for eternity or whatever y'all believe, but at the end of the day that doesn't matter because he was revolutionary in changing the science world, again believe what you like but let's not force views upon others.

Hi all,

I'm wondering something... sometimes, out of nowhere, I suddenly seem to be following a topic that I have never followed in my life, and sometimes I don't even want to follow such a topic. I never hit the follow button, nor did I remember coming across that topic before. Does anyone have this same issue and is it normal/common? Is it a bug on the site?

And please please please let's not derail this thread by arguing about who hates and doesn't hate God, no devel-worshipping bs too... let's just focus on the subject, one of the greatest scientists who has ever graced this earth has died at seventy-six... and as I said although I really didn't take much time to study him I know that he was a pretty genius dude....

And he died on pi day! Shitt......

Whoa.... no way...... wow! This is pretty sad... damn..... I'll miss him! Never really took the time to study him much but wow... this is news surely. RIP sir, your legacy will surely live on!

FOLYKAZE:
Ifa is a collection of history of the world, orisha and people in the distant past. Orunmila though is the divinity that own Ifa. Just like Ogun own metal.

I personally do not know how the blood sacrifice work. But I believe it would be fascinating to know before disregarding it.

To be honest, I think I have a theory as to how the sacrifices operate. No, I don't really like this aspect of the religion myself if I'm being honest, but I can at least tollerate and accept it as it's not just kill a goat or a chicken and that's that, just to kill. Here's my theory:

Every animal, as Folykaze said, has its own ase (Ah-shay), meaning power/lifeforce/energy, like chi in the Chinese spiritual system. This ase, just as with the ase of anything, can be manipulated or controled. So, for example, one comes to a babalawo and tells them that they are having troubles with their children at home, that their children are not listening to what they have to say to them. The babalawo does a reading for them, and concludes that they are not raising their child propperly. And so they then promise to do such a thing. However, that's not quite how it works. The babalawo says that a chicken must be sacrificed in order for everything to take affect, but this, you see, is because the sacrifice sort of acts as a promissory note that they wil do what's being asked of them.

The ase from their promise to do good will then mix with the ase of the chicken, and as it's being killed, the chicken will then completely fill with that person's ase of promise. At this point, the blood is basically filled with that person's ase, the chicken's ase is completely void and gone.

This is just my theory on why this may be done. Unfortunately not much knowledge has come out as to why ebo of animals has been done, and there should certainly be more knowledge on the subject so then people won't instantly dismiss everything as gross and "fetish".

Emmanystone:
Am trying to get into your Moniker 'FeelDeMusic'. In a good way, as in to enjoy it or you or to endure it as a result of something bad i did?

Excuse me LOL What do you mean by this? My screenname just means to enjoy the music, to feel it in you, in yo heart and yo soul! hahaha That's all.

Emmanystone:
Sir, the satanists will disagree with you on this. To them satan is not bad at all. He blesses them with wealth, protection, Some get children from him (as they claim)

The call him the Humanist. They believe he is closer to them and answers them quickly when they call.

And they are names after him too. Devilin. Satin (female name for satan) Devellina, Devellon, Devellin, Devin, Devlyn,

Ok.. so you're trying to basically make a case that Esu is equivalent to Satan because the Yoruba Bible says so? Hmmmm..... well I honestly don't see what that has to do with anything. Perhaps Satanists feel the same about the devil, but, again, how does this relate? Basically you're just making a comparison that's pretty weak in my opinion. Of course people, no matter what sort of god/supreme being they believe in, they will think exactly what you just said the Satanists do, I mean come on dude. I've done some research on Esu before and Folykaze is right.. he's sort of a mixed guy.. he can bless but he can also curse, he can bring joy but he can also cause havoc. He is not like Satan though, he isn't anti Olodumare as someone said.. in fact he's basically one of the closest adversaries to Olodumare...

Folykaze, I replied to your email, did you receive it?

Hey, let's continue this thread!

shadeyinka:
You called my name like one who just concluded an incantation.

I hope it is well. My light is His reflection. Untouchable, unlockable, un-lookable and unquenchable! Its a light that slices the mountains and divides the seas...

Hmmmm, what does this mean?

shadeyinka:
OK.
We can't quarrel over small matters like this.

I know that the modern Yoruba ATR practitioners wish to establish a strict monotheistic concept on ATR to promote acceptability. The only way out is to say the Irumales and Orisas are energies.

If they are just energies, how can they be self aware.
I agree that Orishas are spirits: but spirits are personalities. If orishas are personalities, then they are gods.

And as I said, you're right. Perhaps the Orisa, as gods/goddesses, have their own energy, just as you have your own energy and I have my own. And perhaps praying/offering things to an Orisa is different than, say, praying or offering things to Zeus because their spirits are composed of different things. The energy you feel with Orisa may be different than one you feel with Jesus or Allah or whatever. Again, this is hard for me to explain.

shadeyinka:
The question i should pose then should be :
"Who/What are gods?"

I will accept that Energies are Inanimate
gods on the other hands are personalities (living beings)
It dosnt matter if the living beings are Physical or Spiritual. As long as they are "persons", they are gods.

You have described Orisa Ogun as a person, how then can he just be an Energy?

Ok, you're right. You're right. I guess I get confused with all this sh*t because I just don't know everything. Forgive me, don't expect me to know everything as I'm just learning myself. I don't want to have to start an argument.. my personal belief is that energies are things that can be manipulated, that may have sentience in a sort of way, they're not gods but they are self-aware in some sense... it's hard for me to explain.

Again, please let's not fight over things like this, I only came here to learn as did you.

FOLYKAZE:
Aje that I know about are antagonist of Orisha and Human being. They are popularly called Eleye

Ok.

shadeyinka:
..my point is that vaxx insists that orishas are not gods!

LOL! Well I wouldn't call them "gods" in the western sense, but they're certainly not just objects or whatever... they're energies, yes, but they're also, I believe, capable of being human or whatever they want to be.. I'm actually writing a story where Ifa plays a significant roll in the lives of these three characters, it's a fantasy novel, and I portray the Orisa as having a human form and a deity form... for example Ogun is tall, big, and muscular with a full head of hair, angular features, and arms and legs almost twice as long and thick as his body, this is his human form. However as an Orisa, he suddenly morphs into a human-looking creature, made of what looks to be a combination of iron and skin, you can almost see magma pulsing through his body, his hands are made of dirt and rock and his teeth are giant gleaming stalagtites... he carrys a huge belt with all sorts of weaponry, and he's probably around twenty feet tall!

shadeyinka:
Some are gods , from Zeus himself

Yes, you're right Shadeyinka... some Orisa were once humans who have been leveled up to god status.. and some are Irunmole... directly from Olodumare who have never been humans before ever.

Vaxx/Folykaze, what about the concept of irunmole? Aren't they spiritual beings that were never human? I read in the book that Orisa like Orunmila, Osun, Sango, Esu.... it said they were all irunmole.

Free is something we all try to be.

shadeyinka:
Of course shadeyinka is a Christian!

Just here for knowledge sake!

Haha, ok. Nothing wrong in that friend.

Yes, but don't you understand that there are unspoken rules that one must follow when interacting with a magical subspecies of human like me? (LOL)

Macof please come in ooo!

FOLYKAZE:
Another bullhii iit from Vaxx.

There is no Babalawo that would ask you to fast and pray. Where are you getting all these crap from?

Oh I see. You only copy this garbage from African American website and showcase it as if you are an authority.
http://www.akamara.com.br/cosmology_id1.htm
Pheww.

Orisha a gbe e

Hmmm, well Folykaze, you make a very interesting case and, from all of the information you've provided on this thread, perhaps you're a bit more truthful than Vaxx is. Again, I really can't say yes or no as I'm not extremely familiar with Ifa so I can't really say whether either of you is truly right in what you both say.

Also on the concept of aje/iyami, Vaxx proposed that they are not evil necessarily, but that they are not good either. They have powers both good and bad, and, from the book that I've read, the Yoruba believe that they control the world. Is this true?

0temSapien:
Laugh Wan Kill Me Die

Ah, ok. Well I'm not an expert in Pidgin yet (LOL)!