₦airaland Forum

Image123: i didn't see the importance or impact of the miracle in your post, you are the only one seeing things here. Even the early christians didn't attach such awe as you've shown. You still have no proof except baseless accusations that the events that happened in the lást three months aren't as important and are stage managed. Is assumption your foundation?

I say again, read through my post. The Jew didnt celebrate the return of dead saint because such stance was not recorded by matthew. But note one thing, if you have a love relative which lost his/her life and came back, wont you celebrate it. So logically, the even will be momentous. This is what I wrote. Take time to read pls.

The walking dead according to matthew is more important than any staged miracle we have on tv today from pastors. There are different type of history ranging from personal history, family history, to national history, and to world history. An event is said to be important base on the impact it had on the way people lived, worked or thinking. Either way it change the way people live, work and think..


The matthew walking dead is an event that is the first of it's kind to the jewish nation which many dead saints were seen in jerusalem (a town more than 10,000 people). There is no record of where mass resurrection happened in Jewish nation so if this really happens, it will make a big history. The Matthew event is also momentous only if the event lead to a new way of thinking or new ideas. The people in Jerusalem will have a fresh thinking about resurrection and will be amazed to have their old dead relative back amidst them.

This incident if really happens can postulate new mentality and theory on souls cuz they are experienced.
The time it takes to be resolved or to end, the number of people involved and the range in where it happened can generally give some ideas on whether it will be remembered or not.

It is far more important to today miracle because:

Unlike this common pastors miracles which are mostly staged, most of the testimonies giving to miracle in churches are mere hear-say. And repetition is very common. Most of those stuff they claimed to be miracle are lies or naturally healings. A man will come on stage and tell the world he had headache. After the pastor's prayer, the headache was healed. This happens naturally. Poor business change testimony can be revert by business solution. A man had accident and was not dead, it happens naturally. A woman give birth to birth to a baby after ten years of marriad can be medical problem and solve medically. A man having some medical problem took some drugs and surgery but the thing didnt work but after prayer, he was healed, this are fake stuffs. A man with HIV was healed.

^^^^those things are termed miracle in churches today but they are natural things. Millions are healed with drugs and if someone comes to church to tell us he was healed from sickness is nothing special.



If miracles like this happen, then it will surely make history

amputee healing cuz such miracle cant be staged. Why not a man that was heal of cancer? Why not a child paralyzed healed?

If something like this happen, it will make history.

I remember the news about Adeboye driving a car without fuel from Ore to Lagos, even this incident are not proven to be right but it makes world attention. If this really happen and tested, then Adeboye will be superman. He will make history and 50 years later, he will be remembered.
All through, as dead saint is momentus event as lot of people were aware and witnessed the incident of dead relatives coming home. But no historical record to actualize this event which makes it fable. Matthew was not the only disciple that wrote the gospel. His mates would have witnessed this incident too but non of them record it despite it importance to the society. This is fable indeed

Ask question after reading my post. And stop the game of dont know, dont see. Your answer is up there

God was living in man's imagination before the the beginning.

I remember XTC, God creates us after we create him.


For those that will question what that mean, let me explain it.

After a man design a God for himself or his society, the God will brand the man, change his life and relationship with his society. A man that doesn't believe in God will not have a special day of worship but the day he start believing in God, he chose sunday, saturday and friday designing himself into a new man (new mentality and way of life).

Una won kill me with laugh

Image123: please calm down and reduce the length of your replies/answers, they are quite greasy.
So how important exactly was this Matthew miracle you mentioned. You're the first person I've seen attach this much importance to it. Tell me the significance, and the reason why you feel that all the pastors i mentioned and all the miracle performed at their events in the last three months were stage managed?

You didn't bothered to read my previous post. Pls read it again. Your answer is contained therein. The bold answer it all

Image123: you should calm down i advice. What makes the Matthew event very important, and these pastors i mentioned their events unimportant? Do you know that uncountable miracles happened in these pastors events?

The walking dead according to matthew is more important than any staged miracle we have on tv today from pastors. There are different type of history ranging from personal history, family history, to national history, and to world history. An event is said to be important base on the impact it had on the way people lived, worked or thinking. Either way it change the way people live, work and think.

The matthew walking dead is an event that is the first of it's kind to the jewish nation which many dead saints were seen in jerusalem (a town more than 10,000 people). There is no record of where mass resurrection happened in Jewish nation so if this really happens, it will make a big history. The Matthew event is also momentous only if the event lead to a new way of thinking or new ideas. The people in Jerusalem will have a fresh thinking about resurrection and will be amazed to have their old dead relative back amidst them. This incident if really happens can postulate new mentality and theory on souls cuz they are experienced.

The time it takes to be resolved or to end, the number of people involved and the range in where is happened can generally give some ideas on whether it will be remembered or not.


Unlike this common pastors miracles which are mostly staged, most of the testimonies giving to miracle in churches are mere hear-say. And repetition is very common. Most of those stuff they claimed to be miracle are lies or naturally healings. A man will come on stage and tell the world he had headache. After the pastor's prayer, the headache was healed. This happens naturally. Poor business change testimony can be revert by business solution. A man had accident and was not dead, it happens naturally. A woman give birth to birth to a baby after ten years of marriad can be medical problem. A man having some medical problem took some drugs and surgery but the thing didnt work but after prayer, he was healed, this are fake stuffs. A man with HIV was healed. Why not a man amputee? That miracle cant be staged. Why not a man that was heal of cancer? Why not a child paralyzed healed? If something like this happen, it will make history.


I remember the news about Adeboye driving a car without fuel from Ore to Lagos, even this incident are not proven to be right but it makes world attention. If this really happen and tested, then Adeboye will be superman. He will make history and 50 years later, he will be remembered.



All through, as dead saint is momentus event as lot of people were aware and witnessed the incident of dead relatives coming home. But no historical record to actualize this event which makes it fable. Matthew was not the only disciple that wrote the gospel. His mates would have witnessed this incident too but non of them record it despite it importance to the society. This is fable indeed

striktlymi: Stopped reading after noticing the flaw in the first statement...

Just concentrate on the OP and forget I posted.

yawn

striktlymi: Evening Foly,



Empty!!!



Can you tell us which snake the man killed? Or are you saying that snakes in general are not harmful?



Refer to the above questions...



When you have kids of your own and you notice a large snake in their room at the dead of night, ask them to go back to sleep that the snake won't harm them...



...one needs to study about African traditional religion in order to have a 'wholesome fear' for snakes?



...and you would know because you were a pagan?



Ah mehn...my head aches...



...and you know this because the OP revealed this to you?



When you have kids of your own and you notice a large snake in their room at the dead of night, ask them to go back to sleep that the snake won't harm them...



...is this post struggling for meaning or it is just me?

it know by the people there that snake is not harmful. The pastor that built a church in such area will be familiar with this story.



Someone that keeps cheetah as pet knows that this animal is wild. But if a pastor that see this animal in a community shoot it and kill it is very stupi.d. Since this Animal are harmless, the pastor should be probe for violating the people's right and culture.



A critical example is a festival named Okute or Ore in Okitipupa, Ondo State. It is celebrated for like two months. When they are celebrating this festive, people in the town are not allowed to beat drum or any instrumental. You can only sing and clap. Those that claimed to be christians that played were charged to customary court and those that restrain the community laws are either not allowed in town again.
You can come here with your kids to play music and drums. Then you can claim you are defending their rights. I will be the first person to give you dirty slap.

In some areas among the Urhobo people, crocodile are not allowed to be eaten. If crocodile move to your compound, are you going to kill it for your own meal cuz you are not forbidden to eat crocodile. Play by the rules of a society.

Tomorrow when the people are celebrating Ogungun festival, tell your wife to go outside pls. I promise she will be killed in your own presence.


You are to play in accordance to the law and rule of people in the land you reside.

The snakes there are harmless and that deraiged pastor that built a church in the village would have been living there more than a year. He would have know about this stuff. He killed the snake for his own silly belief. He did it cuz they are demonic to his own belief. He killed the snake because he want to fight against and destroy idols. Thats his motive. The man should be dismiss from the community. His likes are dangerous to cultural values. His likes are ready to destroy other people's heritage. He should be probe.


Tradition prevails your dogmatic belief

striktlymi: Good day peeps,

The story is rather funny...are the elders saying that they are now without a god since their god has been killed? What happened to the usual shout of allow the gods to do their own fighting?

Anyways, seriously now...the pastor should have been quiet about the whole ish and warn his folks to keep it to themselves that would have prevented this dilemma he finds himself in.

I believe he is right to have taken the action he took because he has a right to protect his family from any harm...indeed it is only proper to respect the traditions of the people but this situation he found himself is really a tight one...the snake came to his house and threatened his kids...

Is this guy a Nigerian or a foreign man living in Nigeria?

The snakes are not harmful. I got some of Igbo friends that pick snakes here and play with them. It also practise in some place in Asia. They honour snakes base on culture and tradition. Why must a man kill something that is harmless?

It like you need to study more on African Traditional Religion. God in Africa doesnt really mean sky daddy. I have some people in yoruba land worshipping their toes. Some worshipping their ancestors. The idea of God in African metaphysics is not a transcendental one like that of the western world you are following. Rather, God is regarded as an integral part of a single totality of existence. God in Africa are viewed from the human perspective and this is why most African communities identify specific occupation with specific Gods. In that community of snake worshipping, it either those snakes helped them in war or are used in security term or community protection. So they give honour to them.

So worshipping snake is in term of utility.

And why must a pastor kill what a community adore? Can he burn quran if his children brought one home and complain about the hilarious hell in it? Even in the catholic, some people honour and worship dead saints portraying them with an image. Can the pastor break down the scruputures cuz it scary for it little child? This is madness. If you are in rome, you behave like a roman. He should respect people, their culture, their land and their heritage. They have given him the due respect for not tearing down his church and he must respect them too.

musKeeto: Consider this:

All Scripture is banished and destroyed. Centuries later, the postings of Ihedinobi, Goshen, Frosbel, Qkeyxyz and Italo are discovered on Nairaland's servers...

A new Bible is then published based on their posts.

What do you think would happen?

Exactly what's happening today with the Bible and Jesus' teachings.

The only thing we will have is fake documents.

No one has ever seen an original copy of the bible; what we have today are copies of copies of copies translated into many different languages. Not even one complete page of the original bible exists today. The Oldest complete copy of the New Testament is in the Codex Sinaiticus, from the fourth century. A codex is the modern form of a bound volume. This document was hand written four hundred years after the death of Jesus.
{If we don’t have the original copy to compare the copies with, how can we be sure that what is written in the copies is exactly the same thing that is written in the original?}


Thats the reason we have lot of errors in the bible. Before the invention of the printing press in 1455 the only way there was to duplicate and distribute the Bible was to copy itby hand. Yes, all 66 books, that is a total of 774,746 words, had to be copied by hand. {No wonder there are so many Contradictions, Absurdities and Inconsistencies in this so called Holy BOOK.}

Lot of the factual stories lost and the rest are fable invented by the first council

Image123: can you calm down? and reduce the words? little by little? Fortunately, you're reasoning along the exact line i hoped. From your post, it seems you didn't have idea or awareness of most of those events. Yet they happened, right in your country, in the presence of many thousands of people, for each preacher mentioned. And there is internet and free to air tv and other media, yet you were not aware, neither were they recorded on the front page of any popular website or news media. The only source that we have for these things that happened just last month are the churches and their members! No reputable historian(whatever that means). What will we say in fifty years time, that the event didn't happen because only the church files are saying it happened?
Even if all the 66 books of the bible recorded this resurrection account, you'll still find an excuse not to believe.

You still didn't get my point. What this pastors are preaching is what we hear on daily basis which are heaven, faith, joy, prosperity, etc. So I or any historian record cant record mere repetition of things. But that does not stop this stuff not to be documented either with the church or it members.

A very good example was when I was a christian, I will write in detail every sermon I heard in the church. I also have the sunday school book and text written by my pastor. This make no difference cuz thats what I hear everyday.

But here, we are talking about a momentous event. When I experienced the first eclipse was recorded. It was unique and amazing. Everybody witnessed it including me. And the historian dealing with geography will have this documented for future reference. The same applied to the dead saints. They were not mere revelation but occured which people see with their own eye. Another example was the civil war in Nigeria. It was bloody and was a great experience for those that witnessed it. Are they not recorded? Are there not document from historian about it? And do you really want historian to keep record of what and time I eat? Nope, but they do if I eat a whole elephant on my own. Cuz it special and momentous. How can such thing not recorded about the dead saints walking in the street of jerusalem? How can something a lot of people experienced which is very important and amazing experience not recorded by the witness or historian of those days? It not just possible or it was some men work to make the scripture in volume.

You want me to believe in the 66 books without evidence to prove them? Nope

Though I support some of the stories and teaching therein. Like the book of proverb and some Jesus teachings. Nothing more, nothing less

cyrexx: Really?

If that's the case, boko haram and other radical islamists should not be against education and they should engage their pen, not their swords, against the infidels.

Religion of peace indeed

Delafruita: and "speaking in tongues"?

and "believing in trees which fruit is knowledge, talking snake, talking donkey and rod turning to snake"?

ninja4life: lol then there wont hav been private jet seekers pastors if he exist and is serious with his word which is twisted by his children to suit their deadly purposes.

Jesus is like unicorn.

If he had existed, there wont be this ocean of confusion, denominations and evolution of new sects.

Qkeyxyz: "Absolutely" everybody(including you @OP) fails to understand the words of Jesus because they interpret literally and based on human\societal values and traditions. It's not their fault though, because god did not reveal(in fact, he hid them) the true meanings to them.

Absolute failure


the truth of god is hidden for man that seek to worship god with all there life. So what is the basis of finding something hidden for a purpose of not revealing?

The misinterpretation of Jesus message deeply shows that the message is not jesus own. If I produce a message contradictory your copyright, you will sue me to court for your right. Jesus was up in the imaginary sky, looking at how is message was tampered by man. He was silent for years when man has played the game of hide and seek and cherry picking to his message.

From this illustration, the jesus message is mere man composed. Jesus didnt exist, he should have protect his message from corruption and misinterpretation.

In Matthew 5:17, Jesus says:

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them."

As days go, the teaching evolve as he often did re-interpret these laws, or add to them, sometimes in very radical ways. As a result, some of his teachings were very controversial. According to Luke 4:28-30, some people in his hometown of Nazareth became so angry at him that they tried to throw him off a cliff.

Even today, some of his teachings have evolve from what the first christian really welcome to something that seem very radical to many people. Here are some of the best-known examples:

VIOLENCE

In Matthew 5:38-39, Jesus says:


"You have heard that it was said, 'eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also."


Some Christians, such as the Amish, the Mennonites, and the Quakers, try to strictly adhere to this principle of non-resistance. Some of them have been putin prison, or even executed, for refusing to participate in wars.

In Matthew 5:44 Jesus says "Love your enemies." Some people interpret this as it evolve to mean that you should try to help them rather than harm them. Others say that any needed punishments should be left to God.

But many modern and Nigerian Christians consider these ideas to be unrealistic. They believe that it is sometimes necessary to defend oneself, or even to launch the initial attack. Many people also believe that evil-doers must be punished for their crimes, or at least locked up to prevent them from doing further harm.

Wealth


In Mark 10:25, Jesus says:

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God."


Some scholars think that the word "camel" in this statement resulted from an accidental mis-copying of a very similar word which meant "rope". Thus, Jesus may have actually said "It is easier for a rope to go through the eye of a needle ...", which is a more natural metaphor.
But whether he said "camel" or "rope", his point was that it is very hard for a rich person to go to heaven. In fact, Mark 10:17-22 indicates that the only way a rich person can go to heaven is, in Jesus' words, to "sell everything you have and give to the poor."
It evolve as some people try to avoid this conclusion by pointing to Mark 10:27, which says "all things are possible with God." Thus, God can make it possible for a rich man to go to heaven. Certainly this is true. But the context of the statement indicates that God would accomplish this by inspiring the rich man to reform his life and willingly give his money to the poor.
Jesus also warned against the accumulation of wealth on several other occasions. In Matthew 6:19 he says "do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth", and a few verses later, in Matthew 6:24, he says "You cannot serve both God and Money". In Luke 6:24 he says "woe to you who are rich." Jesus disapproved of wealth because he thought it was wrong for some people to live in wasteful luxury while others starved.
According to the Book of Acts, his original followers tried to live by these teachings after he left them. They formed a community in Jerusalem, known as the Nazarenes, in which everyone "had everything in common" (Acts 2:44), and any new member had to sell his or her possessions and give the proceeds to a common fund.
But many modern and Nigerian Christians disagree as the verse evolve as pastors fly jet, buy limo and estates with these ideas. They see nothing wrong with acquiring money and wealth. And people who do become wealthy are often admired by others. This is religio-org evolution.

Non-Marital Relationships
In Matthew 5:28-30, Jesus says:

"But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell."

In an effort to follow this teaching, some people have become hermits, or found other ways to live in total celibacy. Some of the men in the Heaven's Gate cult even castrated themselves. But most people aren't willing as it evolve to take such drastic measures where girls wore bikini and jumper to churches, and many doubt that it's really necessary.



Christianity remains till today because it change with time, environment and people that handle it.

RELIGION EVOLUTION INDEED





#edited

# God can not heal amputee

Just cant believe that most christians here cant reason with the bible. Yet they will accuse Atheist that they lack understanding of the bible. This is what im expecting from christians to quote. A prophecy of Isaiah

Isaiah
Chapter 26 verse 19-21
19 But your dead shall live, their corpses shall rise; awake and sing, you who lie in the dust. For your dew is a dew of light, and the land of shades gives birth.
20 Go, my people, enter your chambers, and close your doors behind you; Hide yourselves for a brief moment, until thewrath is past.
21 See, the LORD goes forth from his place, to punish the wickedness of the earth's inhabitants; The earth will reveal the blood upon her, and no longer conceal her slain.


----That could mean to be happy to be dead, because zombies will rise and cover the earth----


I see the reason the likes of mazaje and Delafruita called the stories in the bible as fables.

By relating this bible story with our tradition, it seem that the author of that verse stole the story from somewhere which is not primarily jewish tradition. It either they do to formulate fulfilment of Isaiah prophecy or make Jesus death more horrible.

In yoruba, there is a term known as Egungun.

According to wikipedia:

It the broadest sense of the word, Egungun refers to all types of masquerades or any masked, costumed figure. [ 1 ] This same word, however, when used in its more specific, common sense, refers to the Yoruba masquerades connected with ancestor worship.
Function [ edit ]
Amongst the Yoruba , the annual ceremonies in honor of the dead serve as a means of assuring their ancestors a place among the living. They believe the ancestors have the responsibility to compel the living to uphold the ethical standards of the past generations of their clan, town or family. The Egungun is celebratedin festivals, known as Odun Egungun , and in family ritual through the masquerade custom.
In family situations, a family elder known either formally or informally as "Alagba" presides over ancestral rites. He may or may not be initiated into the local Egungun society. In matters that deal with whole communities, Egungun priests and initiates who are trained in ancestral communication, ancestral elevation and funerary rites are assigned to invoke and bring out the ancestors. They wear elaborate costumes in masquerade. Through drumming and dance, the Egungun robed performers are believed to become possessed of the spirits of the ancestors, as manifested as a single entity.

The point I want to bring out here is that, are this formation of dead saints from Yoruba and was formulated by the first church (catholic) which equals what we today called HALLOWEEN?

Halloween is used to honour dead saints which original grows from a tradition is Africa that have existed thousands of years before christianity emerge.

In my home town here, people still celebrates this egungun, they keep food and money outside and custom their houses for the dead family member to eat when sleep when they are visited. But some Jewish slaves Idolized this. They called it works of the devil and demonic. Meanwhile, their Halloween was stolen from Africa.


Matthew 27:53 is an urban legend from Africa. Such fable didn't exist in Jew or Israel but only in Africa. There Halloween was framed to mimic African ancestral belief but it remains mythical. That verse is pure work of some men that want to delude folks.

The whole bible, Christian faith and doctrine is a big hoax!!!!

ijawkid: Of what use would it be to invoke the power of God to shield me from bullets just for showy display??..........


All to prove to atheist(who are denying reality) that there are powers beÝond what we see as humans??.......

Make them go rest for dustbin....there body go tell them something soon...

To prove his Omnipotency. And that he is for real and works for you. Period

ijawkid: So Àll you want is for me to pray to God and then come forward for a gun shot test..??...smh!!!!!.......


And then what do I gain by doing that??...the last time I checked the holy spirit that was poured out was to enable me preach the goodnews about Gods kingdom down to the end and not to test run bullet§ from a Gun with it...........

the greater works Jesus was talking about was in reference to the preaching work and not the performing of miracles........

Don't quote scriptures you don't understand.........

Thats the christian way of dodging challenge. If anybody quote bible to battle your ground, you say they dont understand.

Explain what I dont understand before accusing me pls.

Your God is all powerful. Pray to him and make this happen or agree he is not powerful. If you refuse to do this, we both agree that the African Traditional Religion is more and far better in nature than your Renowed Jewish Religion.

ijawkid: So I shouldn't say what I've seen??.......

seeing doesnt make things fact. Lets verify this on you. Im not speculating on shooting. You can do some stunts with your bible or pray to your God to make a stone shift it position. This is some of stunts your bible promised you. If you can do this, I will believe in your bible and God till death.

Nope


The root cause of the problem we have in Nigeria today is Religion. From political, educational, economical, security, etc are stems and branches of rooted RELIGION. With religion, the country is divided into two. Northern-muslim and southern-christian. The political settings collapse. It hard for a christian to run some post in the north and muslim to run an office in some part of the east. People politically are not working together again. The northern people are predominantly illiterates. Their females marry mostly at teenage. They dont normally go to western school but prefer islamic school for themselves. The nations economy is sinking cuz the churches out there were the holy fraudsters and corrupt leaders stealing from people through tithes and zakat in the mosque. These are the people that rule the people at there door step so they got nothing to do with corrupt politicians since they will come to church for thankgiving the following sunday. Cecilia Ibru is a critical example. And on the issue of our security, we are very sure that the violence that erupt from tribalism and land dispute is minimal when compared with religion crisis. It bomb, gun and fire today and tomorrow. Every pages of the newspaper is religion wahala. To me, Religion is the basic and fundamental problem of this nation.

### I suggest will kick out this disease (religion) out of Africa