₦airaland Forum

emmasoft:
@vanvickie please note mutual funds are in three investment class - Low risk ie MMF, Medium risk e.g Fixed income fund and High risk example is Balance or equity funds.
Each of this funds performs based on the underlying assets. All of them are good investment depending on your risk tolerance level.

MMF the least risky has Tbills and CPs as the underlying assets with the 90 days Tbills rates as the bench market.
Fixed income has what MMF have plus the FGN BONDS as the underlying asset. The rate here is relatively stable compare to MMF that rates are valued daily.

Balance fund like the example you observed is under the high risk with the underlying assets having a mixture of debt and equities and most times plus some real estate assets.
A major characteristics of the this type of mutual fund is that it's very volatile both the capital and interest can be lost, nothing is guaranteed hence it follow the basic principle of the higher the risk the the higher the returns.
Currently Balance and equity funds are doing well because the stock market is relatively doing well. If the market starts to perform otherwise over some certain period, the returns will drop.

As earlier noted, non of the funds are better option than the other your risk tolerance couple with some other factors will determine the one you should go for.
Don't forget: THE RETURN OF INVESTMENT IS TO BE CONSIDERED FIRST BEFORE THE RETURN ON INVESTMENT.

For those other funds there is more to them than can be understood. A number of times I tried it I regretted my decision.

Acidosis:
Not in the way you expect. Inflation affects everything in the same manner. Assume you have N200,000, and you intend to buy an Air Conditioner unit. You visit the market, and the seller informs you that the final price is N220,000. Unable to raise the full amount, you decide to invest in a 2-year bond with the expectation of returning with more funds to buy the AC later. However, you return after two years only to discover that the same AC unit is now being sold for N550,000. The amount you receive from the bond after the 2-year waiting period is only N280,000.

Very apt explanation. This just shows how inflation wrecks everything.

emmasoft:
Check my previous posts on fixed income fund particularly SFS fixed income fund which I'm involved in.

Most of the investors here tend to lean towards low-risk investment hence MMF is always discussed. Other funds like balance funds, growth funds, and equity funds carry more risk compared to MMF and fixed income hence most investors that will invest in such funds must have gained some confidence otherwise they remain with low-risk MMF. It's true that rates are low yet it's still better than leaving your money in a savings account. Remember it's a case of low-risk low returns and vice versa.

Another issue is the mode and duration of the returns on other funds, Some of them pay dividends once a year, and sometimes no dividends. The minimum holding periods of some of these funds apart from MMF are seen to be too long.

Personally, I advise my clients to invest directly in dividend-paying stocks instead of equity funds since it's practically the same risk involved.

Investing in equity fund is less risky than investing in stocks as an individual. The equity mix funds, particularly examples of those I had listed are split between money market and equity to further minimize the risks and with higher yields. Besides, you have experts managing same on your behalf. Fixed Income fund is basically not as yielding because it rides mainly on bonds, money markets, etc - hence it is called fixed income. There is actually no point investing on low income yielding investment these days except as a holding place in view of a major decision, and as opposed to savings in the bank. For someone like me with high risk aversion would readily settle for such mutual funds with history of satisfactory performance. So most saying invest in dividend stock should also advise that people look at these funds, which are a mix of equity and money market for the purpose of higher yield than money market alone. Especially here in this forum, where majority is like me - risk-averse investor.

sgtponzihater1:
Which are you invested in? Can you please share your experience as well?
Thanks

I have been investing in money market, treasury bills and mid term notes. But recently only in mid term notes and money market. Mid term notes by investment One used to be so juicy particularly in those days when the interest rate was as high as 24%. It has drastically fallen now like others and far below inflation rate just like TB and Money Market Fund. I have signed up for Iman and Balanced funds by Stanbic IBTC just few days ago for trial. I'll have to watch it for a year and more. I know these are more long term, sufficient part of these funds is invested in stock, which is generally likely to rally into the new year ahead due to present economic realities - political outlook, etc (IMHO). What I have committed is trial amount as I am not certain of anything here as of yet. But our funds on MM is actually eroding away due to poor returns.

I want to know what are the opinions of experts in the house.

Hi everyone, why is it that there is no discussion at all around other mutual funds like Balanced Funds, Fixed Income Funds, etc, in this forum?

Funds like Stanbic IBTC Balanced Fund, Iman Fund, which are also relatively less volatile, and some had yielded above 50% profit this year are never discussed here but only Money Market fund with abysmal return is getting so much attention. Is there any reason people are not interested in this category of funds?

Please let's hear from experts in this forum so many of us can learn.

Hello friends, who has information about naira denominated fund that accepts funds in Naira? Which of the available and registered asset managers offers this type of fund?

obamma:
You & emmasoft are misleading people here. To liquidate my fund your company said 3 working days. I have filled redemption form since last week Wednesday, today is Tuesday almost one week yet no response from anyone in your office. I contacted emmasoft but he is non chalant

The worst is the 7.5% they are promising which am not sure it is true as my online account is showing different thing. But will confirm this after full liquidation

Please check your account very well. Daily interest accumulates and shows seperately. Those in the last quarters already capitalized are added to your capital, and this will not change until end of current quarter. However, note that at the end of a quarter, closure and all they do to close the books sometimes lead to slow process of the usual daily computation of interest. This applies to many of the investment houses for this type of fund. There is actually no acceptable excuse for this delay at the close of a quarter considering the advancement and benefits of technology as at today. However, at the end of closure all interests are calculated correctly and so reflect in your dashboard. Investment one customer-care, Axamansard and StanbicIBTC, are among the best based on my experience. So when your request is being delayed make good use of their customer-care.

Iamblessed007:
So I registered with investment one VGIF and I decided to even try it by sending small amount of money to the account. I put my customer number in the reference when I made the transfer as advised. Since Thursday that I made this transfer, up till now the money hasn't reflected in my VGIF account. If they can be acting this way with small amount of money, I wonder what will happen when millions is involved. I no dey Naija, Am I supposed to be calling them for God sake? Abeg my people has anyone ever had this same issue before?

Like RoyalP101 advised, contact their customer-care, CustomerCare@investment-one.com, you can be sure of a swift response and speedy resolution of issues. I have been with them for some time now, no disappointment.

InvestmentOne is one of the best from my experience, and their Ziing mobile app for your portfolio monitoring and management is top-notch.

Deleted

reservd:
Avoid redemption/subscription close to the end of a quarter unless you don't mind any delays

This is very consoling. Thanks to you and ernie4life. I'll wait as advised as I was already contemplating moving out.

Guys, can you please share your experiences with your money market fund and others with United Capital?

It is the first time I'll place a partial refund from my MMF. Since last Sunday it's been from one story to another and up till now still no redemption. I have naira bond fund and money market fund (MMF) with them. I moved over there couple of months back from stanbic because of their seemingly higher interest. But the experience has been terribly horrible.

...

emmanuelewumi:
At 4% Treasury Bill is now for savings and not for investment

My curiosity is why would one neglect mutual fund to invest in today's treasury bills at this ridiculous rate? Some naira denominated mutual funds as at today are on or above 7.5%

ojesymsym:
Mutual funds is the hallmark of Stanbic. They are one of the best in the game.
Yes they also have the dollar aspect of their investment.

With about the poorest interest despite being with the highest NAV, or there about ☹️

ukay2:
This is why this contributory pension scheme should be voluntary, not compulsory

I need to invest my pension by myself

The story and experience is different if you opt for programmed withdrawal. What you painted above is annuity. With programmed withdrawal, your monthly pension gets reviewed upwardly from time to time, while your balance is reinvested. With the new pencom arrangement, you technically cannot exhaust your running pension balance. And on your demise, whatever is your balance is paid to your named beneficiary.

GregJames:
F150 Ford

2003/4 f150 or ranger 2004 available?

KINGreignn:
Come and buy my FORD F150 V6 2003 bro.

Interested. Can you show pictures if still available? 2003 F150 or 2004 ranger

I am starting my modern pig farm in Edo state.
Follow me on FB to see ongoing works and progress. Comments are welcome.

https://www.facebook.com/chennoy.farms.

Let's say the note is started to garner Edo State pig farmers together for both education, marketing and support for one another. I'm about venturing into pig farming here in Edo State, and have been sourcing for information particularly as it relates to the market. I have read everything available about the farming aspect. I have met with a few farmers. But not much has been found out about marketing, and that for me is very crucial. I think also that forum like this will enable different views and perspectives on issues to be made available. Let's harness the power of social media like this to make us all better informed, and for people with issues to easily find help. So who can help with information on sales of pigs in Edo state?

SinaAkinsanya:
Though I am still learning and open to ideas from others, i have learnt a few things in the 3 years or so that i have been involved. 300k is not likely to feed 500 animals in a month except they are all weaners which is even doubtful. I recall the target is to get the animals to about 70 kg in about 6 months. That requires quality feed and animals. These days maize is about 145/kg, brewery waste 25/kg soy bean 150/kg, pkc 45/kg; cassava cake 100/kg, gnc 135/kg; wheat offal 2900/50 kg. There are additional cost for pre mix ; lysine, methione, drugs etc. Perhaps some of us have been paying too much for these ingredients. From experience, not to use those ingredients is to slow down the growth rate of even the purest lines. We started with concorted breeds and fed them with mostly pkc and brewery waste and got about 60-70 at best in 1 year. We introduced good lines of LR. Again fed them mostly with pkc and brewery waste and got at least 100 kg in one year. We introduced maize, soy bean etc and the growth rates of all our breed, concorted and pure lines improved dramatically. We are hoping to get 80-90 kg in about 7-8 months without the animals building up too much fats. Most of our pure lines reached the target in about 8 months even though we really did not start feeding them well until january this year. The pure line are intended for breeding and sale to others as breeding stock.

That has been our personal experience. Open to ideas particularly on where and how we can source cheap ingredients. Our experience on pure lines vs concorted breed is that pure lines will almost double concorted breeds in weight in about one year.

Hi Sina, still in this biz, I need your contact for discussion and biz. I'm based in Edo State and currently constructing my farm

eazeefix:
hello I'm lagbaja's personal assistant and junior brother, you can get these items in a good feedmill. For the Baker's Yeast, any store selling baking materials will have in stock .

Hi Eazeefix, thanks for following up.
I have just acquired a piece of land, and about to start construction. I have seen different designs on the net. From your experience, what design pattern would you recommend? My dilemma is on the best pen size for weaners, glits, pregnant sow, and the farrowing pen?

The other concern is best approach to manure management. If a soakaway pit, what structure and size would be okay for a farm target of about 500 pigs, which is my mid to long term target?

I'll appreciate any area of this I get a recommendation. Thanks in advance.

Jejebabaa:
Chairman, you locked down your fund in Naira for 7 years. Omo mehn, you get mind oooo. You are playing with devaluations. Impossibility is nothing in Emerging markets especially Nigeria. Kindly bookmark this, your money will be worth less in dollars in 7 years' time.

There is a huge difference between certainty and uncertainty when it comes to making money. Besides, the above investment is not just a fixed deposit but one with interest. And as he summarized, he's going to compound the interest. That would amount to a lot at the end. There is a lot to speculative investment, which I guess you already know. There is also what is called time value of money. If one is sure of devaulation by 15% in 2yrs time for instance and a bag of cement today is N2,000.00, would you rather start to build your house now or wait until dollar rizes up in "2 years" time?. The effect of devaulation is actually much more than most can summarize because of it's devastating spiral effect. The effect in the above case for example would actually be more than 15%.

His decision is a wise one, and I personally regretted missing out in the 2017 offer whose interest rate was 17%.

NB: Check out fixed income outlook for 2019, a forecast by the almighty Zedcrest:

https://twitter.com/ZedcrestCapital/status/1081277667163455488?s=08

GonFreecss1:
Nope. You have it the other way round. The more it is devalued the more people would hedge.

I am beginning to think you guys I trying to heap optimism on an outcome you all know optimism can't help.

If the naira is stable people won't have a need to hedge, no one would even be thinking about it.

I will say this and I will say it again, how many of you low risk takers support Nigerian businesses? Buy stocks? Specifically businesses that will go on to export goods and services that earn forex that would ultimately increase supply of said forex? Because that is the only way. If supply is greater than demand. The truth is, many of you are fine with the Tbills low risk, which is okay, many more are fine with fixed deposits and many many more are fine with leaving their money in their bank accounts, and the banks? They are not lending anyone money, they are buying Tbills up and snacking on it like breakfast.

So I am wondering how a select few in Nairaland or a select few of Nigerians that choose to invest will create more devaluation for the naira, when the way the country is run does that exactly.

The funny part about this argument is if we begin to ask people what they think of this current Administration, many wouldn't have any good thing to say. I am now wondering why people have decided to be optimistic about whatever said government says about the economy you are complaining about. It's surprising and it's also not. My conclusion is bias, because of the low risk easy money. Many can't phantom a world without Tbills, a world without a low risk investment. A world with only high risk stocks is a no-no for them. That's my opinion.

Everybody can't be the same, same applies in the world of investment. A lot have been said on this divergent views already, and it just requires that people respect each other's opinions. This is where maturity comes in. This forum has been derailed by many porporting to false their approach to investment on others. It doesn't work that way. Some people just can't eat beans like that but will manage akara or moimoi. That is how God created us. Some people can't do business and succeed but they can help those in it and earn a living. Bottom line - they all make money. So let's respect this space of diversity in us and this forum will be helpful for those looking for easy and safest ways to make money. How I wish this forum has a more stringent rules and ways of enforcement then it becomes lively for young and old, mature as well as those coming up.

Please let's make this forum mature by learning to accept each other's opinion on his/her approach to making money.

billtommy:
What's the probability of further increase? Will Cbn not impose withdrawal limits again if one finds a way of buying up some good amount of dollars?

Just one of the pros and cons. Investment sucees is based on what you find out yourself, and of course experience. It is not necessarily just about anything you are told. In the way to financial success there are several weights and distractions. Determination and focus are part of the winning tips.

condomuser:
I did a 2 hours calculation on the Interest yield from TBills for a 3 year period at a stable 15 percent per annum and re-converted the yield and capital after 3 years to a more stable currency, my discovery was absolutely shocking.

In summary, Nigerian economy is unstable, inflation will continue to rise. Inflation kills proceeds from Investment at the International level.

All your Tbills proceeds in 10 years can be wiped out if a storm like what happened in Dec 2016 happens again. But keep investing and minimize risk through diversity.

Explain the emboldened in a more concrete terms so everyone including the newbies understand. Explain how the money will become wiped out under the condition you highlighted above.

Interesting financial piece for us without a cost.

https://punchng.com/you-can-earn-a-high-income-and-still-be-broke/

Make money, enjoy while it lasts and desist from abuse and insults.

https://punchng.com/fg-to-auction-n115bn-bonds-november-21/

jpphilips:
I have no interest in discussing the rudiments but dynamics, high interest rate means higher risk of default, that is a valid economic theory, however, when you domesticate it, you will realize it is not as straight forward as you think.
High interest rate means future expenditure for the state, if the state's earnings increase within the period (always does except for few years ago), that risk becomes inconsequential, the only down side is that it robs the government the liquidity for capital projects and creates other budgetary pressures, default doesn't come in.
The state has a way of creating equilibrium in those things, increase taxation, dispose assets, shrink budget like we just saw in the 2019 budget etc. its all about earning, once you earn enough, you can always repay your debts.
Lastly, some debts are left in a cycle that never ends, that's the reality of running a nation, a state doesn't run like a company where economic indices are cast in stone, just follow the dynamics.

Thank you for this.

ahiboilandgas:
in 2012 I had around 15m in tb that was around 100 k dollars In 2017 it grew to 31.5m naira suprisely it now 87500 dollars I lost 12500 dollar .3.6m by investing in treasury bills if I had know I would have kept my 100 k dollars In dorm accounts and sell when naira reach 500 I could have made 50m ...the naira has refuse to go back 152 for my money to be equal to 200k dollar and their is no hope ....cos of this I open a dorm account to always keep some interest from tb in dollar.....my people this is the reason osinbajo has 900 thousand pounds in his asset declaration and why MRS Jonathan has a huge dollar account....u think they don't know treasury bill.....best step is open a dorm account keep some interest from tb their to reduce devaluation risk....if u know u know

Good analogy. Good to diversify,and well done folks. But what none has hinted is at what "time" one converts his/her dollars to Naira in order to make profit. In 2016 when the exchange rate skyrocketed was partly because of scarcity of dollars. Banks put a cap on how much dollars you could spend off your dorm account whilst abroad. For the most part, withdrawing in Nigeria wasn't even as easy as the banks cried they didn't have dollars to issue out. I guess this was the case whether you wanted to buy off the counter or withdraw from your dorm account. Hence the black market rate headed far North. And this is the reason people matained warehouses and Ikoyi flats as their dorm account for easy access.When we analyse it's good we highlight the pros and cons. The reason majority invest in TB is because they are sure of their rates, interest and capital and the "time". If you stack your dorm account, which is good, but who says or knows when exchange rate would go again far up and juicy enough at which point you decide to sell? This is not known by anyone. We've probably had like the 2016 experience twice since 1999 or thereabout. Many people died while waiting.

That said the second issue is that everybody is not the same. Some are more risk adverse than others. Some would dare the risk with the hopes of higher returns, and we know that only a percentage of this actually make their money - make it big while others lose evrything or die due to hypertension. But those who like it small, and are careful investing in zero-risk ventures are free from the above hassles, they ALL make their money albeith surely and steadily.

The third is that it is not TB rate that determines inflation rate but the reverse. Hence the fluctuation. So those praying for higher TB rate should know. Higher inflation, higher TB rate and we actually don't pray for this. We pray intlation rates keep going down. So if you have money and you don't know the sure profitable business or venture to invest in, keep investing in TB. However, make sure you don't eat all the interest, make sure part of it is reinvested otherwise with rising inflation the actual worth of your money is reducing over time if you EAT all the interest.

So far all the analysis make a good read for me, and this forum has to be lively to educate and as well to thrill.

condomuser:
I once entered a vehicle for a 7 hours trip, the calibre of people i met while on the journey was alarming, i knew i had 7 hours boring time so i joined in the discussion.

I did some psychological analysis and realised the guy in the front seat whose mouth was the loudest had invested millions in MMM, i am not an advocte of ponzi scheme but guess what i deviated and started positive talks on the durability of MMM. It was at the time MMM closed and was to re-open in january which never happened.

The guy at the front seat who had the biggest mouth was so happy thinking he had seen his fellow MMM mugu, but i only joined the conversation to kill time. Unfortunately MMM never came back and he lost all.

Moral of the story : Someone who may claim to have 30 Billion is possible doing so to lay hands on your N1m, enjoy the conversation and stick to what you know.

Thank you for this post. And the wise will juxtapose this against all these negative vibes about TB.

TheSam:
Good day All, please is it a good idea to obtain foreign loan at 2% annual interest to invest in Tbills since interest rate is usually 10%-13%? I need candid advise so I can weigh the pros and cons.

Check again. I hope it is not 2% monthly?
2% monthly is different from 2% annually
2% monthly = 24% yearly. This is the approach by most loan shacks. Zedadvance and the likes will say less than 3% to get their loan. Whatever percentage they charge is monthly.

MssRose:
God bless you sir for this comment. you are absolutely right. just 3years ago I couldn't boast of a million naira. was busy buying the latest hairs and designers clothings in town but ever since I started following this thread silently, my life has turned around that I couldn't believe it myself. It's all about discipline.
please I would like to learn about stocks too. I've been following the thread too for some time but I still can't understand it. if you can put me through some certain things. Thanks

If you love stocks but don't understand the terrain, the best bet for you is to invest in equity based mutual fund. Equity fund are mutual funds invested heavily on stocks, and done on behalf of individuals by professionals. That way you will not lose your money easily like you stand the risk to because what you have just so done is entrusting management of your stock/portfolio in the hands of professionals. They understand the market much more than most individual stock investors. Many direct stock investors got burnt in 2008 and have never recovered since then. Check out portfolios of different managers of equity based mutual fund, Eg StanbicIBTC, ARM, AXA, etc. A host of others exists. Put your money there and go to sleep. Secondly, note that stock investment is a long term investment. It is not like treasury bills or Money Market Fund that you know before hand the interest you are likely to get, and monitored on a daily basis in the case of MMF. Happy investing.