₦airaland Forum

pazienza:
I don't know about the Jewish angle.
But I detest the fact, that these same Igbophobic Nigerians who nearly wiped my people out of the surface of the earth, and there after implemented the most inhuman Post civil war reintegration program on my people, would have the guts to come to public and try to sell the picture Of a tribal harmonious and peaceful Nigeria where everything is Ok.

I call this bullshit, and would not stand and let them have their way.

I am neither yoruba nor hausa but pls stop all this.
All Nigerians have their faults in every evil plagues in Nigeria and your Igbo tribe are not saints either.

You the big 3 majority groups are the ones responsible for the problems Nigeria is facing, so stop painting a picture as if the Igbos are clean saints who were hunted down because that is far from it.
If there are any group of people who should cry for injustice in nigeria or threaten seccesion more, it has to be those from the minority groups.

PissedYagami:
The past already happened. I think it is time to forgive them and live as humans

And pls stop this, it disgusts me.
Yes, we are all sad for what happened in the past, but believe me, the Igbos share faults and blames in all that lead to the war too.
I hope we do not go into that here and derail this thread especially now that it is becoming more enlightening and friendly.

pazienza:
Please, stop this misinformation already.
I understand you are Yoruba and is trying to place your group in good light. I am Igbo and my allegiance lie with my Igbo nation only.

There have never been an ethnic census in Nigeria.
The only ethnic estimates we have are those left by the British, and it placed the Igbos as the second largest ethnic group in Nigeria, second only to the Hausa-Fulani.

https://www.nairaland.com/3400415/1931-population-figures-nigerian-ethnic

The very idea of Yoruba being more populated than Igbos is a Post civil war Yoruba media propaganda that had been left unchallenged all those years by Ndiigbo, because we were more concerned with the business of survival, after our civil war loss.

Desist from spreading this poisonous propaganda and blatant falsehood in the future.

Personally, i believe that Igbos are the largest tribe in Nigeria, but to avoid issues, we just agree that Hausa, Igbo and Yoruba are the 3 major and largest groups. It is best this way.

Both yorubas and Igbos are more than Hausas, just that the Hausas and fulanis have formed a sort of alliance promoted by the british who placed more northern minority groups under their control to make them look large and intimidating to the southernerns.

PissedYagami:
Kenya has 3 major language groups ianSweets. Bantus, Cushites and Nilotes. Tanzania has 2, Bantu and Nilotes. Uganda has 2, nilotes and Bantus. Bantus from these three countries will look like one another. Nilotes will look similar. A Bantu from somewhere in Kenya looks similar to a Bantu in Uganda or in Tanzania or any other Bantu country. Nilotes will look similar too, countries are just physical boundaries not cultural boundaries my sister. Like the Masai are in Kenya and Tanzania, Kuria are in Kenya and Tanzania, Luos in Kenya and Tanzania. Karamajong and Teso are in Kenya and Uganda. Somali are in Kenya, Ethiopia and Somalia. Oromo in Ethiopia and Kenya etc. There is no constant look for a country.
But Tanzanians are nicer generally and polite when you compare them to Kenya. Tanzanians are less aggressive compared to Kenyans. Actually they dont like Kenyans and coz Kenyans are capitalistic in nature. They actually call Kenyans thieves. Thats why they are opposed to the idea of a unified one country. They fear their jobs, business, culture will be ruined by Kenyans

Exactly. That's d way it is all over.

Good thing u accepted the fact that Tanzanians are friendlier, warmer and more social than Kenyans are. I mean it is obvious to discerning people.
Kenyans are just like the Nigerian Igbos too i'd say, very capitalistic and enterpreneural.

gallivant:
You need to stop. I understand your obsession with looks but in East Africa we are raised better. Stop classifying us on looks, that's an extremely shallow mindset.Okay?

It seems like u are looking for every opportunity to nail me. Don't take this thread back to it's emotional state pls. I did not mention only looks for heaven's sake but u chose to capitalise on that only. Why?

gallivant:
They can sing all they want. Almost everything they use is made in Kenya, let them sing. I thought you were trying to educate yourself about East Africa!

U are taking everything personal. Stop it!
Tanzanian and Kenyan economy is almost the same. Well i think u guys are unique in your own ways. And pls never underrate the power of entertainment influence and the money it can generate.
Do u know that the American entertainment industry is worth as much as the entire Nigerian economy (Africa's largest economy)?
I think u Kenyans need to catch up in the entertainment aspect because to a large extent it helps outsiders to know more about you. For instance i think if am asked the East African country i'd like to visit first, Tanzania would be on my mind. Tanzanians on the other hand need to catch up with u guys economically cos it seems u guys are trying in that aspect better than them. That's the way it is, no hard feelings.

MtuMsuper, Muafrika2

For the southern zones. To my best knowledge.

SOUTHWEST ZONE

No need to break it further. It is the ethnic yoruba zone where i think over 95% of the natives are yoruba speaking, with a few minority groups like the Ijaws and Egun.
Although because Lagos is situated in this zone, it has attracted a very great cosmopolitan population here and made it the most populous zone in Nigeria. (About 50 million people or more).
Religiously it is difficult to tell this zone, although i'd say by the native population, the christians should be slightly more (about 55-60%) or maybe a 50-50. The yoruba people are not religious fanatics, they are very religiously tolerant and liberal.


SOUTHEAST ZONE

No need to break it further too. This zone is the Igbo ethnic zone, with almost every native here being Igbo. This zone has the least population because Igbos are very widely travelled and for some reasons best known to other Nigerians we hardly migrate to settle here.
The Igbos are overwhemingly christians, i have never met an indigene who is a muslim.


SOUTH-SOUTH ZONE

This is the zone dominated by minority groups in the south. This zone should have up to 70 ethnic groups or more. The oil rich zone of Nigeria.
The inhabitants here are just like the Igbos (overwhemingly christians) and infact some of them are Igbo and yoruba speaking but may insist on identifying themselves differently.
Some of the major ethnic groups here are Ijaw, Ibibio-efik, Urhobo, Edo, Ogoni, Itsekiri, Ejagham and Igbo speaking tribes like Anioma, Ikwerre, Etche who may not identify themselves as Igbos.

iblawi:
I wonder how Kenyans sit thousands of kilometers away and feel they know what's happening in West Africa. Even in Nigeria you most win 2/3 of the states before you are declared winner. It's not just about simple majority.

North Central Nigerians are not Hausa.
In this region you will find:
Yoruba and Fulani dominate Kwara state.
Igbira, igala and Yoruba dominate Kogi state.
Tiv, and idoma dominate Benue state.
Lantang, etc in Plateau state.
Gwari, nupe etc Niger state
Igbira Toto, Gwari etc Nasarawa state.


In the South South
Yoruba, Benin, Estako, Esan dominate Edo state.
Ijaw, istekiri, Irobo, etc in Delta state.
Ijaw, nembe etc Bayelsa state.
Calabar people in Cross river state.
Calabar in Akwa Ibom state.
Ijaw, etc still in Rivers state.

South West region is Yoruba second largest tribe by population and landmass.

South East is Igbo third largest tribe by population and landmass.

North West mainly Hausa/ Fulani

North East mainly Hausa /Fulani.


How did Kenyans come up with their useless assumption?

You tried my brother, but let me help you out.
Muafrika2, MtuMsuper.

I begin from the

NORTH-EAST ZONE
(a minority dominated zone, with significant fulani population, about 70% muslim, 30% christian, Hausa is the general lingua franca here and many communities here face serious hausanization).

1) Borno state - Kanuris are the major ethnic group here. About 65% of the population. Other major tribes include Bura, Marghi, Kyibaku (chibok), Kanakuru and over a dozen others. About 75% muslim, 25% christian.

2) Yobe state - Kanuris are also the major ethnic group here at about 55% of the population. Other tribes include Bade, Ngizim, Bolewa, Karekare e.t.c. About 90% muslim, 10% christian.

3) Adamawa state - Fulanis are the largest group here but just only about 25% of the population. They have absolute power here because they historically conquered most of the other tribes here and traditionally rule them.
Other major tribes are Bwatiye, Marghi, Higgi, Chamba e.t.c. Christians actually have a slight majority here but muslims (mostly fulanis) will not agree because they have more political and traditional power.

4) Gombe state - Fulanis are also the largest group here at about 35-40% of the state. Other tribes include Tangale, Waja, Bolewa e.t.c. Muslims about 60%, Christians 40% (but most muslims will think it's less and christians will think they are more). Politically the minority tribes dominate the fulanis here.

5) Bauchi state - This state has serious ethnic identity issues because most ethnic groups here are being Hausanized (dropped their ethnic languages for Hausa).
Hausas are not originally native here but they have culturally overran the state together with the fulanis.
Other tribes here who have managed to maintain their identity are the Saya people who are christians. The Nigerian speaker house of reps is from this tribe.
The state is 80-85% muslim and the remainder christian.

6) Taraba state - This is the most ethnically diverse state in Nigeria with over 60 distinct ethnic groups. However the largest are Jukun, Mumuye, Fulani, Chamba, Kuteb e.t.c. This is the only clearly christian dominated state in the north-east where muslims do not domimate politically. It is like 65% christian (muslims will argue it is less while christians think it is more).



NORTH CENTRAL ZONE

This zone is where am from, practically it is supposed to be called Central Nigeria but politics zone us as northernerns. We are the most ethno religiously diverse zone. Over 100 ethnic groups here and almost equal christian and muslim populations. Although the muslims will argue they are more here, the christians will also.
Hausa is used as the lingua franca in 3 of the 6 states here and the FCT.

1) Benue state - Tiv is the major ethnic group here (65%). Others are Idoma and Igede. Overwhemingly christians (over 95%)

2) Niger state - Nupes are the largest group here (40%), others are Gbagyi, Kambari, Dukawa, Shingini and over a dozen others. Hausas and fulanis are also many here, they settled here and through influence of Islamic jihad and coquest in the past assimilated here. The state is about 70% muslim, although muslims will claim they are more.

3) Kogi state (my native state) - Igalas are the largest tribe (40%). Others are Egbirra, Okun (Yoruba subgroup), Bassa e.t.c The state is about half muslims half christians, although muslims will argue that they are more because they have the political upper hand.

4) Plateau state (my home state) - Beroms are the largest tribe here but just merely (15%) of the population, to tell you how ethnically diverse it is. Over 40 other ethnic groups. Christians are the overwhelming majority here (85%) and most muslims here are hausa and fulani settlers.

5) Nasarawa state - Perfectly situated at the centre of Nigeria. Eggon-Madas are the largest ethnic group here (about 40%) of the state. Others are Alago, Gbagyi, Nungu and over a dozen others. Christians have a slight majority here (55%) but muslims will argue because they dominate politically.

6) Kwara state - This state is supposed to be in the southern part of Nigeria because ethnically it is a dominantly yoruba state and South-west Nigeria is the yoruba ethnic zone. It is the same politics of northernization between the hausa-fulani islamic caliphate and british colonialists that made it this way and this has made many of the yoruba speakers here to face ethnic identity crisis due to heavy northernization and islamization. 70% yoruba speaking. Other groups are Nupes, Baribas, Fulanis, e.t.c About 60% muslim, but muslims will argue they are more than 60%.

7) FCT - This is the federal capital territory zone where Abuja is situated and Abuja is dominated by people from all over Nigeria.
However the natives still dominate the countryside and other smaller towns here and the Gbagyis are the major ethnic group (70%), others are Gade, Gbari, Egbirra, Nupe e.t.c Dominantly christians at about (70%).



NORTH-WEST ZONE

No need to break this zone any further. This zone is the predomniantly ethnic Hausa and Hausanized fulani zone, where they form about 85-90% of the population. This zone is overwhemingly muslim (About 90%). It also has a large population (About 45 million).



The southern zones coming next.

MtuMsuper:
around 9-15%. Somalis and Swahili people's are overwhelming Muslim. i mean totally. I have met real life Somali Christians also. isn't that odd ?

Hmm, muslims are quite small in Kenya. Just like South-south and South-east Nigeria where muslims are barely up to 3 % in each zones.

MtuMsuper:
First things first, your change in tone is welcome. I hope it lasts. I welcome anyone who chooses to learn, am a free education activist in my spare time.
Now to your question regarding EAC: It has always been the most successful sub regional organization in Africa (better than SADC which is a South African dominated entity and true integration a mirage:see how they treat Zimbabweans). In terms of its successes its down to a close cooperation between Uganda,Rwanda and Kenya. Tanzania is the major stumbling block as they are constantly filibustering and quarter backing to use an American phraseology. They are never pro active and belong to both SADC and EAC. Some say they are too east to be southern Africa and not southern enough anyway. Free movement between Uganda and Kenya is possible whereby i can go to Uganda with my national ID and a Ugandan only needs a voters ID to cross into Kenya. Many of our tribes are similar too hence we even look like Ugandans. Very close cooperation between Rwanda and Kenya to the extent that kenyan teachers are overwhelmingly preferred there due to an image that kenyan teachers are hard workers and strict. Remember the borders were drawn in Berlin in 1884!
I think ECOWAS doesn't work because the vast majority of west Africa countries are francophone and firmly under the thumb of Paris under that disgusting system called francafrique. They cannot exercise free decision making and the language barrier is a hindrance.

Ps the proper term to use is kiswahili not Swahili (the word Swahili is an adjective, hence terms like Swahili cuisine or architecture ). Our Tanzanian brethren love to parade this fallacy that they "own" the language. Its origins lie along the loooong stretch of coast from kismayu in Somalia to sofala in Mozambique. What is not in doubt however us that it's a bantu language in syntax and structure. Loan words are plenty even in English. There are several dialects such as kiamu(from Lamu), kimvita(Mombasa), chimiini(southern Somalia ), kitumbatu and kiunguja(Zamazibar), Comoros kiswahili. Kiswahili was standardized in 1848 and used the template of the Zanzibar dialect known as kiunguja as its dialect. I guess you can say the language situation of kiswahili is akin to that of German where there are several dialects and they also standardized theirs using Prussian as the main stem. I think Hausa also has several dialects, which one is the central or standard?
There are two councils that regulate the tongue known as baraza la kiswahili(kenya) and chama cha kiswahili (Tanzania ). It's only in Kenya however you can obtain a PhD in kiswahili, hence any doctor of kiswahili must have been trained in Kenya, to the eternal chagrin of our neighbors.
I am not so much into commentary regarding music but the musical flavors you listen to are African, not middle eastern, you most definitely heard of taarab music which i personally enjoy because the women singing them poke nasty jabs at each other.

Ok, splendid elucidation.
What you said about francophone countries is so true. How can these people allow France to control their lives like this even to this present day? It's really sickening. No wonder they are very backwards compared to Anglophone countries.
However, i think Ecowas is working as well if not better than EAC. In the aspect of peace keeping Ecowas is doing well. You can see what is happening in Gambia, if it degenrates any further, expect to see Ecowas armed forced invading the country and overthrowing Yahaya Jammeh. You can see how Ecowas played a great role in the last Malian and Ivorian political instabilities.

Free movement is allowed all over West Africa for west Africans.
Economic integration is the only aspect we seem not have made progress as such.

I think Kenyans and Ugandans truly look more alike than Tanzanians do with any of u. But personally i seem to love Tanzanians so much and i really can't say why. Maybe it's because of their music and good looks, but i'd say i think Tanzanians appear friendlier, warmer and more social than Kenyans and Ugandans, or am i wrong?
U Kenyans really seem to be complaining about Tanzania's policies. I think i'd really like to hear their own side of the story.
I think it's a good thing u Kenyans have playmate neighbours. We Nigerians do not.

How do Kenyans and Rwandans get along considering the language differences?

Kenyanstar:
Kiswahili is a compulsory subject in all schools both oral and in literature form. Any person that has gone to school in Kenya has no option but to undertake swahili.


Maasais in Kenya mainly in urban centers speak swahili, thou Maasai are the most deeply inclined in their culture they are adopting swahili in their daily lives coz its the main spoken language everywhere in Kenya.


KITOGO-
KIDOGO- Little
WEWE- You
MTOTO- Child or slang for hot girl
MDOGO- Small

Great!

mkenya254:
It is hard to know since there are 42 different communities. But here are some stereotypes that are very popular and most of the times true according to Kenyans.

The Luo are the most flamboyant community particularly the men. Dress nicely and drive the nicest cars regardless to the situation of their wallets and most of the ones in cities only speak English. They are usually well built and are perhaps the darkest community in Kenya.

The Luhyia are the most heavily built group and everyone jokes about how they like to eat. They contribute the largest number of players on our national rugby team. There is a joke that a Luhyia never gets full, it's the food that usually finishes. Their men are rumored to be the best in bed and their women usually have the behinds that Kenya is known for... Lol. Usually dark but not anywhere near the Luo

The Kikuyu. The most business minded community and the richest community. Everyone says they love money way too much.. Lol. You will find them running majority of the large businesses across all areas in Kenya. Make for good business partners but when crossed will go to all ends of the earth to exact revenge. Majority are light skinned.

The Kalenjins. Probably 90% of the athletes you have seen from Kenya marathon etc come from here. They are tall and dark. They also make up for majority of the army and the police and any comedian mimicking the police will use a Kalenjins accent

The Kambas. Rumored to have the best women in bed. It is very rare to see a dark Kamba. Men are famous for poor taste in fashion with too much passion on bright colors especially yellow for some weird reason.

The Maasai. Tall and light skinned usually. Their women especially the ones that live in the city are the model types because they are very tall and slender. Very similar to Samburu and Borana.

The Taita and other coastal tribes. Rumored to make for the best wife material since they are arguably the best cooks and the most beautiful. Generally light in color and love making is only rivaled by Kamba women.

The Meru and Kisii. Very similar though they live in totally different geographical areas. Most famous for their short temper and are definitely not one to cross on a personal level. I come from one of these though.. Hehe

Ok great.
I think Kenyans are good looking especially your women, but i think we Nigerians look better.
Nigerian fulanis have some of the most facially beautiful women in Africa.
Igbos have some of the most facially handsome men in Africa. They are also very muscular in stature.
For the yorubas in Nigeria, for physical features they are known for dark beauties and their ladies are usually voluptious.
Although every tribe in Nigeria will always argue that they are more beautiful and handsome than each other. LoL.

Kenyanstar:
This is my own personal opinion & experience when going to Uganda an EAC country from Kenya.
My home town Eldoret is 130 kilometers from the Kenya-Uganda border town of Malaba.
The immigration office is situated right at the border of both countries.
The major language is Swahili followed by English and other tribal languages.
Movement within Malaba border towns is free and enjoys almost zero restrictions.
The unit of currency used is either the Kenyan Shilling which retails at 1 Kenyan shilling to 38 Ugandan Shilling.
Taxation on goods is minimal except on imported container goods from the port of Mombasa.



This horn of Africa countries are majorly Semitic and mainly have suffered the vulgarities of war & conflicts between each other that have made it impossible to partake of a common union. Ethiopia- Eritrea war, Ethiopia- Djibouti war, Ethiopia- Somalia war, South Sudan- Sudan war etc.


The idea was mainly to have a single currency unit, on the issue of single country is almost totally impossible due to African leaders greed.
In terms of speaking swahili the language has been able to spread far and wide due to the presence of different nationals from various east and eastern African countries in the EAC countries. Swahili is a Bantu language spoken in Tanzania, Burundi, Congo (Kinshasa) Kenya, Mayotte, Mozambique, Oman , Burundi, Rwanda, Somalia, South Africa, Comoros, Uganda, UAE and the USA. Around 5 million people speak Swahili as a native language, and a further 135 million speak is as a second language. The S. Sudanese nationals numbering over a million in Kenya and Uganda who were displaced by war have exported the language back to S. Sudan and also the presence of thosands of Kenyan businessmen in Juba.
Rwanda adopted the language due to the common border they share with Tanzania, Congo also has a large majority of the Northern part of it who speak swahili as they share a common border with Tanzania.
Somalis who have lived in Kenya are also prime exporters of the language to Southern Somali and parts of the central Somalia.
Northern Mozambique and Zanzibar are the other countries that speak Swahili albeit with different accents

Very nice explanation. I have really been enlightened.
I really commend Kenya, Tanzania and Uganda for maintaining relatively peaceful political borders compared to their neighbours (Congo, Sudan, Somalia, Ethiopia e.t.c). This has really helped u guys become very influential in that East African axis. This is why i really wished to see a greater co-operation between these 3 East African countries but unfortunately as u said, greed may never allow African leaders to take some certain decisions for the benefit of the masses.

Those Horn Africans really have a problem and until they sit and re-examine themselves they would always remain where they are. Their problem if u ask me is a false sense of pride and superiority due to their very rich history in the past. Somalis for instance are quite terrible, you don't want to know what most of them think about other black Africans. Most horn Africans even deny being black africans and they want to be Arab by all means. This is very sickening.

naijalander:
The Hausa and Fulanis share larger numbers in the Nigerian army so I think they run the country. And they are full of aristocratic ideals; they are also strictly Muslim and have Arab-Berber affiliations.

And by the way the North has a lot of tribal nationalities especially in Kaduna South, the Christians amongst them (some of them migrant Southerners [Igbo, Erik, Ibibio, Yoruba, Ijaw, Ikwerre, Edo, etc.] ) bear the brunt of Jihadist reactions to spreaching the gospel, last year a woman in the outskirts of Abuja (the capital!) was beheaded for preaching publicly every morning, you know how zealous some Christians get. But all in all, it's all good, it just gets bad when someone tries to out do the other one. So the idea is that the core Norah has not separated Church from State, they apply Sharia law in some states and they want it entrenched in the constitution.

The problem in the South is corruption and stupidity.

Exactly brother. The north also has many ethnic groups. Infact northern Nigeria is more ethnically diverse than southern Nigeria but the problem is that ignorance allows most of u southernerns to conclude that all northernerns are the same.
99% of Southerners for instance do not know that states like Adamawa, Taraba and Kaduna for instance have over 50 ethnic groups each and that most of them are even Christians.
The hausas and fulani elders during colonial times connived with the british colonialists to supress these northern christian minorities and use them to their own political advantage.

So many southernerns were shocked when they discovered that 99% of the chibok girls were indigenous northern christians from Borno state. Even from the core north, Chibok LGA in Borno state is overwhemingly christian but most southerners will not hesitate to generalize them as hausa muslims.

Muafrika2:
Nigerians are not open to entertainment from other African countries. We listen to music from all over the place, watch all kinds of African movies


Diversity is not so bad at times, it gives more people an opportunity to grow. But we do consume alot of productions shared around East Africa. Music, TV programmes, etc

Your population comes to your advantage here. There is a big market within your borders and local productions sell more at home.


French? Didn't know that

I've seen some west African movies spoken in french. Sometimes I can't tell if it's Nigerians. Someone tell those people to enlarge their English titles. They are such a strain Ghanaians are similar to Nigerians in their productions. I love their movies. They've got some good actors too.

No pls dont say that. We are opened to other African entertainment industries just that ours is so powerful that you have to be extra good (better than us) in order to attract our attention.

Take for instance, during the mid 90's to the early 2000's when congolese music dominated Africa, almost every Nigerian home purchased congolese makosa and soukous music, this was the major music used in Nigerian occasions, clubs and what have u. Infact till date i have not recovered from my love for congolese music. I really wonder what happened to the mighty Congo that made Nigerian music now to take over Africa. I really wish Congo recovers and battle Nigeria for their lost music domination over the African continent.

There were also some periods when Ghanaian music dominated Nigerian markets. Their movies too are very well watched in Nigeria even till date, but it is declining sha because Nigerian producers and musicians are really taking over completely and making strides by the day.

It's just like telling Americans that they do not watch or listen to movies/music outside Hollywood. Believe me, u have to give them a very good reason to do so because their own producers and musicians give them almost everything you can offer and even more.

French was declared Nigeria's second official language by late Sani Abacha, a former military ruler of Nigeria due to pressure from Ecowas. We learn french in our secondary schools, but it was not enforced as it should be by subsequent administrations. I wish it was cos we live in perpetual isolation with our french speaking neighbours.
Most Nigerians also feel French lang has nothing to offer them and i don't think they are wrong. See how terrible francophone countries are doing in Africa.

I myself speak French to a considerable extent.

Muafrika2:
Naijalander isn't being honest. Just browse this forum for the Yoruba vs Igbo hate threads, Easterners vs what not. Buhari was voted in by a fulani/hausa/yoruba alliance.

Pls make no mistakes. The kind of yoruba-igbo hatred you see on nairaland is no applicable in real everyday Nigerian life. I just don't know how that of nairaland evolved.
It is there no doubt, but not as intense as you see it on nairaland. Yorubas and Igbos have never clashed in real life.
The people who yorubas and igbos have clashed with in real life battles are the Hausas. Yorubas and igbos are more educated and have been heavily influenced by christianity unlike the Hausas and fulanis.

mkenya254:
I just used Yoruba and Hausa so that it is easier for Nigerians to understand. Here voting is tribal. No one really gives a hoot about religion. So you will never be passed on a promotion, secluded on the basis of religion unless you are a devil worshipper. Lol.. For people whose belief on Christianity is pretentious at most, everybody fears Illuminati and the likes. So you will not be accepted

Pls, what is the % population of muslims in Kenya? Which ethnic groups are muslims in Kenya?

@mKenya254

You said that most Tanzanians hardly speak English. But most educated tanzanians i have seen or come across om social network or the entertainment industry speak perfect English.

mkenya254:
Most Kenyans do not know a thing or two about Burundi. It's just like that neighbour you never speak to. Not because you hate them but because their is very little in common with you. Plus Burundi has some civil unrest right now.

Now Rwanda is Kenya's best ally in East Africa. Their Swahili is extremely different perhaps since they don't speak it very actively opting for French and Kinywaranda most of the time. I have been to Rwanda and could barely understand their Swahili. Also a very small percentage of their population speaks Swahili. I would compare that with the number of Tanzanians speaking fluent English, they are there but extremely difficult to find and are usually the ones that travel a lot to other countries.

Tanzania has no notion of tribal conflicts despite having more communities that Kenya due to socialism which was introduced by their first president. They adopted Swahili as the only language and even all their subjects were taught in Swahili in school. This led to tribal languages becoming redundant after sometime and eventually most of the cultural tribal things were eroded which led to a more united people since there is nothing going like I am Yorba, you are Hausa kind of things.

For Kenya, Swahili was adopted as a national language to enable people from different communities to be able to communicate at the same time Kenyans continued with their tribal languages as well. SWAHILI was just a plus. Now this easened communications since all Kenyans speak Swahili and is the main language in cities but the tribal alignment was never rid of. So at times political differences will often lead tribes to form alliances against each other. For example, when there is an election and all people in Southern Nigeria, yoruba etc vote for someone from the south and the Northern tribes, Hausa etc only vote for Hausa leaders. Tribes that have larger populations e.g. Kikuyu, Kalenjins and Luo have the larger say. The advantage is that we were able to retain our cultures but the disadvantages is that this cultural differences are exploited by politicians for their own gain. There is nothing of the sort in Tanzania

There are no religious conflicts in Kenya as well. Majority of Kenyans are Christians by name but from day to day activities behave like there is no religion e.g. Never attend church or even read the Bible after finishing school etc. Sort of like the way the US is. A lot of people say they believe in religion but in reality don't care much about it though if you ask them do you believe in Jesus they will say yes

Majority of schools actually will have a church and a mosque. Those that don't have resources to build will usually use different places in the school to accommodate both. For instance I attended a Catholic missionary school in lower level but the Muslims were let to be on their own.

Hmm, very revealing.
I think communism is the way out for African nations because it is obvious that tribalism is such a bitter pill that most Africans have to swallow on a daily basis in their countries. No amount of preach for unity can stop tribalism.
Countries like Nigeria are hit by tribalism and religious favoritism at the same time. It's just sad and i really wished we can get a way across this.
It's so bad in Nigeria that some people from a particular part live in fear or dread to migrate to some other parts of the country.

Nigerians are also very religious especially people from the core-northern part of the country who take islam too far. Only the kind of Tanzanian treatment can ever make Nigerians one.
What makes Nigeria's case so bad is that the stupid british colonial masters left us with 2 major religions who are almost equal and 3 major ethnic groups who are also equal.

PissedYagami:
Even tribal radio stations are illegal in Tanzania. On one side it promotes unity but on the other hand indigenous languages die fast. So it is good and bad at the same time

I think the advantages outweigh the disadvantages.
Ethnic and religious differences will always do more harm among Africans than a dying language would ever do. So, kudos to Tanzania for achieving such unity if you ask me.

mkenya254:
About Swahili I believe the origins have been explained. People in coastal kenya speak same with Tanzanians and Lamu on the Kenyan North coast is probably the most Swahili a town can get... In terms of food, architecture, history etc

Now Kenya has 42 tribes though divided into 3 large groups, Bantus, Cushites and Nilotes. Cushites live in the drier parts of the country(North Eastern and Northern Kenya). Bantus live in the wetter areas since they were predominantly farmers. Nilotes live in the rift Valley and comprise of Kalenjins; who form majority of the athletes you see representing Kenya and the famous Maasai.

All Kenyans start speaking in their tribal language. So if you go to a Kikuyu town you will get many people speak Kikuyu. If you are Maasai for example you speak in Swahili everyone will understand you from a baby to an elderly person.

Then English is also taught in schools from kindergarten level and is the official language so everyone knows it.

The Kenyan closest relative to Nigerian pidgin English has to be Sheng not Swahili. Sheng is urbanized swahili which is found in most Kenyan songs. It is a mix of Swahili, English and some tribal languages. It emerged from Nairobi and is more popular in cities. It was popularized by Kenyan HipHop and is mostly popular among young people who usually come up with the most creative of words. It is steadily evolving which means vocabulary gets out of date/fashion very soon and doesn't become cool anymore once a cooler term comes up.

Swahili is taught in schools and when writing essays and every student has to use correct Swahili. But outside classrooms most students default to the 'cooler' sheng. Just think of how an HipHop artist like Kanye West for instance would use proper English in a formal place and urbane English(what's poppin, Holla, bro, my Nigga etc) when hanging out. Now Tanzania has nothing like this and everybody always uses proper Swahili. Same with the coastal region in Kenya

Wow, i really get.
So does this mean your elderly people cannot speak sheng?
Pidgin is well spoken by even elderly people in the south-south urban areas of Nigeria.
How well is the use of sheng promoted? How different js sheng from swahili? What percentage of mutual intelligibility can u say both languages have?

Between English and Swahili, which does an educated Kenyan have greater mastery over? Do u guys use swahili is any of your legislative, judicial or executive settings?

mkenya254:
To be honest the East Africa Community mainly sucks because of Tanzania.

Kenya is a very capitalistic state and Tanzania is still reeling from effects of extreme socialism that were advocated by its first president Nyerere who was a great president btw

The effect is like trying to get USA(very capitalistic) and Russia(recovering from communism) to effect the same beliefs and be part of the same community. So all the time decisions on policies will take forever will Kenya being aggressive and Tanzania very passive on the implementation or passing of any bills or laws.

Kenya gets along very well with Rwanda especially.

The East Africa becoming one community is a fairy tale that is never going to happen any time soon.

Wow, i get the gist. I never knew Tanzania was socialist in the past. I only knew Nyerere enforced oneness and unity in the country by banning the promotion of tribal languages.
Nevertheless, i can say Tanzanians benefitted more from this. Tanzania is like the most united country in diversity. I wish we Nigerians were involved in such a system. In Nigeria we have so much ethnic and religious divisions, preferences and discrimination.
Tanzania's case is truly the best for African nations believe me. Ethnic and religious differences has done Africans more harm than good.

Well, on EAC, I think you guys should not relent. I really wish to see a powerful east African country or workable union at least.
Larger nations usually have more potentials. See the way Nigeria for instance is dominating west Africa and if not for the fact that we were misled by the military rule for decades after the civil war, we would have been far ahead our current status. Although larger nations also have their issues too although for the case of the EAC i believe it would be less because it would be a union entered into by mutual understanding and agreement on so many principles.

How do Kenyans and Rwandans get along well despite the anglophine francophone difference?

Muafrika2:
Swahili is spoken EVERYWHERE in Kenya. In Turkana, Wajir, Kisumu, Isiolo etc. It's easier to get around Kenya with Swahili than with any other languages.

Hmm, ok. But even down to the interior villages in all the tribal territories?

Muafrika2:
IanSweet
I just lost a few paragraphs on Kikuyus and politics, business and numbers

And then grading of towns into cities by the Kenyan government

Here is my home town, Kakamega

Kk, cool town. What is the population of the town?

Muafrika2:
Kikuyu, Kikuyu and Luo

Luos are tall

hmm, interesting. We hardly see kenyan movies, musics and celebrities more often. Why is this so?
It seems your people are less into entertainment. I wish all you east Africans unite and have a single entertainment industry. U guys would have been able to give we Nigerians a run for our money or don't you think?
We Nigerians unfortunately are surrounded by french speaking countries. Ghanaians are the only English speaking neighbours we have, we do movies together with them a lot to the extent that almost every famous Ghanaian artiste is well known in Nigeria and 100% welcomed. Infact, some of us can't tell a Nigerian actor from a Ghanaian one sometimes.
I wish we Nigerians understood french, then we and our neighbours would have flowed better. Actually, french is Nigeria's 2nd official language but 99% of Nigerians don't know that and are not interested in the language though. It was not enforced by our govt.

gallivant:
Okay lets not focus on revisionist history but facts! You have been explained the roots of the language, it's earliest settlements and closest tribal cousins(Mijikenda). You have also been told why most Tanzanians speak Swahili, it's their national/official language and their medium of instruction in all national institutions.In Kenya and Uganda its different. English is the official language while Swahili is the national language.

Yes i get it well.
So why does Kenya and Uganda not promote swahili like Tanzania? I guess this is the reason why it seems like Tanzanians have a greater mastery over the language and sing more melodious musics in it?

gallivant:
You can't really tell. Kenyans come in all shapes, sizes and colour.

Well, at least u should be able to guess.
One of u just claimed that you guys are divided into cushites, nilotes, bantus e.t.c and the physical features are glaringly different.
If it'd were to be Nigerians i can give a very close guess where they're likely to b from

PissedYagami:
Yes Elani are Kenyan.
I know who Ali Kiba is. I guess I have known him for more than a decade now. But, to be honest I do not listen to his music. I listen to a different genre of music. So I cannot rate him

Kk

PissedYagami:
In Tanzania they tried to discourage tribal languages and they taught every subject in Kiswahili. Plus they tried to get rid of European languages there. Thats why almost everyone speaks Swahili there. In Kenya everything is taught in English. Very few Tanzanians can speak in English. Most Kenyans are trilingual: Mother tongue, Kiswahili and English.

Perfect explanation. It perfectly worked for Tanzania i guess. It unified them a lot. I guess other African countries can take a cue from them or what do u think?

PissedYagami:
You should listen to Elani

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZUoUxAhJmQ
And Kiswahili is not owned by anyone iansweets. It is not Kenyan or Tanzanian. It is East African. Swahili language was as a result of trade where Arabs and Bantus mixed. Actually the closest related language to Kiswahili is Mijikenda, which is Kenyan. Swahili culture stretches from Southern Somalia, Kenya, Zanzibar, Tanzania, and Northern Mozambique. Actually the earliest Swahili culture developed in the Tana Valley and the Lamu Islands(which is in Kenya), from indigenous Bantu speaking population, around the sixth century. By the 10th century, Islam was beginning to take root as it was reported that Kanbalu was run by muslims. Trading opportunities saw the arrival of Arab, Persian, and Indian merchants. In 916, Al-Masudi visited the Swahili coast or "Land of the Zanj." Between 1050-1200, a wave of immigration from Persia seems to have occurred, causing a southern migration from Shungwaya and Lamu to Zanzibar, Pemba, Mafia, and Kilwa.
http://www.afropedea.org/swahili-city-states

Swahili accents are very different even here in Kenya. Yes, Tanzanians speak nicer swahili than Kenyans generally but, I think people from the Kenyan coast have the sweetest Kiswahili accent. There is the standard Kiswahili then people from differnt regions have different lahaja(dialects). Even in DRC they have some dialect, the same way English has variants, Indian English, Nigerian English etc

K, great. I guess av learned. I guess i just concluded that swahili has more roots in Tanzania because of their sweeter tone of speaking and singing it, the cultures of Zanzibar and the fact that most online reports claim that 99% of Tanzanians speak swahili of which a large percentage are first speakers compared to Kenya with a lower percentage of first and second language speakers of swahili.

The song Elani, i guess it's Kenyan right? It's nice.
Do u know Tanzanian Alikiba? If yes, how do u rate his music? Cos the way that guy sings his swahili melts my heart (i could learn swahili just because of his music). That's the kind of swahili (bongo) tone am talking about.

Muafrika2:
Differences between tribe are easy to pick out. Kenya is where you find Bantus, Nilotes and Cushites. They are physically different. There are also differences within the tribes that make the groups.

Hmm, so i guess you'd be able to tell me which Kenyan tribes these individual handsome Kenyan men below are from .
I find this kind of Kenyan faces very attractive, especially this first man.

Muafrika2:
We still have tribal territories. Swahili is helping with communication but people do still speak their own languages when at home, back in their villages, etc.

It's in places like Nairobi where I would say it's unifying factor is felt the most because it's not an ethnically exclusive area. People have learnt to live with other different communities there. .

Hmm, great explanation.
From what i can conclude, the case of swahili in Kenya is almost the same as Pidgin english in southern Nigeria (especially South-south and somehow south-eastern Nigeria) where pidgin is the everyday language in the urban areas.
Infact going by what you are saying i think Nigerian pidgin is stronger in south-south Nigeria (about 35 million ppl) than Swahili is in Kenya because even in most semi urban areas and rural areas (among young people) in south-south Nigeria, pidgin is preferred.

gallivant:
If I may add, we have already established Swahili is linguistically a bantu tongue with maybe 2% Arab loan words. The common misconception is that the coastal Swahili is the classic form of the language which is far from the truth. You have realized the more inland the you go the language evolves and looses its Arab influence. For example, 20 in classic Swahili is ishrini but in Uganda, Congo etc. its makumi mbili; a direct translation to any bantu tongue from Kamba, Kikuyu, Shona even Zulu. My point is, the purest form of Swahili is the one spoken far inland in the Great Lakes Region and not the Coast.

Since swahili evolved around the coasts and spread hinterlands then i think coastal swahili is unarguably purer. It's just like the Nigerian pidgin which also evolved around Nigeria's southern and southwestern coasts and truly the best speakers of Nigeria's pidgin who speak it more often are those from the Niger-deltan (southern coastal) areas of Nigeria.