₦airaland Forum

Gabrielshow24:
We are saying completely different things.
Infact what you have done here can be categorized as straw man fallacy!

Am not claiming the gaps in the knowledge of men is the basis of the existence of God!

Am borrowing from the mathematical statements and definition of an axiom which by itself is unprovable but in itself is a truthful statement!

This is not exploiting the gaps of science this is using one of the most known aspects of science, "the existence of axioms".

This is also to show you that there exists things in the physical world that by themselves have no proof but are the standard or method of proof for all other things!

Sit down and learn!
You just keep showing your faults in thinking for the world to see.

Can you show how the existence of a god is an axiom?

MaxInDHouse:
Should i remind you how many times you have said this?

But it's like atheists don't even live by their own words not that you people don't believe God alone even your own self you don't believe.

What a pity!

I haven't said that specifically about you, Mr. Liar. If I have, show me screenshots. So I'll engage you again, Mr. Liar

advanceDNA:
Jesus made his life worse??
Like wtf are u saying?

This is the op and I highlighted the point I'm making

I want to share a personal story that taught me a profound lesson about respect and humility. As a Muslim, I deeply respect Jesus (peace be upon him) as a beloved prophet of God. However, in the past, during a time of ignorance, I insulted him. after that, I had a vivid dream where Jesus looked at me with anger. Following that dream, my life took a downward turn, with hardship.

Overwhelmed, I sincerely repented to Allah (God) and sought forgiveness. Slowly, my life began to improve, and I regained my stability. I share this story not to preach but to remind us all of the importance of honoring those God loves, regardless of our faith. I hope this story inspires reflection and understanding.

Gabrielshow24:
In a different thread, I explained to you that even from scientific reasoning you can come to the conclusion that God exists.

And given the separation of states of the well known creator and creation paradox. He exists independently outside of creation!

Arguing from silence is a well known fallacy.
That's the fallacy you are committing when you question God's existence!

Infact contrary to your premise lots of evidence point to the existence of a supernatural creator.

And this was my reply
The entity of god is not an axiom. Obviously you don't know what it is.
The god factor is fixed in by theists. No scientist proved the existence of a god via scientific means.
There was a lot of phenomena that science couldn't explain, from flood, rain, lightning etc. Theists inserted their god as the origin of such phenomena. But we now know where they all came from as of today. The god of the gap fallacy is what you have been committing all along

MaxInDHouse:
His wish is that we recognize His presence in the midst of imperfect humans through their peace loving organization {Isaiah 2:2-4} not the sinful traits each of them is battling. Romans 7:15-25

Bro, maybe I'll stop debating with you. You don't answer questions, but instead deflect it to answer a different question.

MaxInDHouse:
Your grievances won't change what we read in the Bible.

Another deflection tactics. Please answer the question

Gabrielshow24:
If you still want to believe the universe is an uncreated entity as a reply to God being an uncreated maker. That's just pure delusion.
You can't be uncertain about a certainty(absolute fact) hence as a result the universe as a verifiable point of existence is well documented in writing.

You can only be uncertain as regards things that have facets of both.

God could be put under the scrutiny of uncertainty but still sharply plays out into everything being uncertain and the question of existence begins to what, crumble!!

That's why as an axiom, God is certain because primordial absolutes such as truth needs a beacon.

Do you now get why you can't place God and the universe on the same par?

The entity of god is not an axiom. Obviously you don't know what it is.
The god factor is fixed in by theists.
There was a lot of phenomena that science couldn't explain, from flood, rain, lightning etc. Theists inserted their god as the origin of such phenomena. But we now know where they all came from as of today. The god of the gap fallacy is what you have been committing all along

MaxInDHouse:
Ok so i don't have a left shey?

All these deflection tactics won't work
I'm here cos you r here. I have no business here as an atheist, but so do you. I just chimed in cos I saw your post, not that I have a contribution.
I dont contribute to christian posts only posts where atheists are invited to.
So please leave. Take this post as my last on this thread.
Have a good day ya'll

MaxInDHouse:
Wait o!

Are you also a PIMO attending Churches but coming to speak against your religion on Nairaland?

Because i don't know what exactly is your business here!

So what are you doing here? At least I have a right. So answer my questions

MightySparrow:
This folks pretend that they don't see truth in others but it is a lie. YouTube is replete with exjws that witnessed to wrong persons and got converted themselves. I have pointed it out here severally about one Carl olof Jonsson, who had a student that questioned the 1914's claim of Jehovah's Witnesses's Jesus' invisible ruler. The man went into the library, and studied for twelve years after which he came out with a treatise to the leaders of Jehovah's Witnesses. Initially, one Professor Furuli, a professor of assyriology, an adherent and apologist of JW's doctrines resisted Jonsson. After some years of scholarly struggle, he was disfellowshiped. So was one Franz that wrote the famous book The Crisis of Conscience. Another book by one adherent, Kicked Out of the Kingdom. The later delivered a baby with a clubbed feet, she had been told that their Jehovah does not answer prayers anymore. She was not satisfied with this mispresentation of God. She prayed and fingers grew on the feet . Upon talking about the healing in their kingdom Hall against Jehovah, she was Kicked out but her testimony remained. Her perspective about God changed. You see there is no argument against evidence.

This people have pharaoh like stubbornness even when they are wrong, they don't accept.

The boos I mentioned are available as PDF and also on Amazon.

Any evidence of the highlighted?

MightySparrow:
I know you are sincere, only that you are sincerely wrong. Anyway, you don't have the power to stop anybody from thinking, hence their opinion. So, you cannot force your opinion on any or everybody. It is a free world only that with your theology is laced with tension and a cultured jittery about others opinion.
I am a pentecostal, a trinitarian, tithe payer. I feel good serving my God with no fears of any Armageddon to kill me and hope in the resurrection of the just.
I believe others who have similar hope are good for God's kingdom too, when my own Jesus returns.

Why do you pay tithes?

Courz:
Mad MaxinDhouse and Janosky with his maggot infested brain do not believe in the No University education rule in JW. But they are scared to say it before they will be disfellowshiped.

Really? MaxinDhouse is it true you guys frown at University education? I thought it is just capping

essentialone:
Ok. No wonder you don't have sense

May the Flying Spaghetti Monster bless you. The guy no get one single sense

Gabrielshow24:
Are you serving them or God?

Church is not a scam, most of the early education of this country was due to the evangelical and missionary capabilities of the church.

So if some elements have decided to walk in the path of Balaam. Leave them, in their own time their Judgement will come.

Any evidence of this god?

MaxInDHouse:
Generally sin is everywhere, what is peculiar to people in one geographical location may not be the case in other places but one thing is sure all disciples of Christ were one time sinners who are gradually recovering from their sinful nature {1Corinthians 6:9-11} the cleansing is a gradual process that's why the Bible said sinners who have washed their robes in the blood of the lamb are qualified for everlasting life! Revelations 7:14-17

So what will be happening among them?
That's what is found written in the Bible book of Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3 as for CHARACTER each human has his or her own sinful nature to battle! Romans 7:15-25

So they were 'recovering from their sin' but somehow u believe they are the best performing group and epitomize yhwh's wish?

MaxInDHouse:
Did they live in the first century?
We are talking about people who saw Jesus face to face and wish to be just like him in all they do not people who accepted the faith through the words of his disciples!
So those listening to Jesus that day wanted to imitate his faith that's why his disciples felt they shouldn't have married at all {Matthew 19:10} but since they're married before joining him they must stick to their partners in the faith.
People who later became Christians through the faith of the Apostles got marriage after learning that one can still have faith as a disciples in marriage! Hebrews 13:7


So let's not deviate from what we were talking about faithful people don't feel like having anything now whatever you see with them is just for sustanance their minds are fixed on God's Kingdom where whatever they have will be permanent! Matthew 6:19-21

Any evidence they saw Jesus?

Gabrielshow24:
Check history you will see the major adversary to creationism is good ol materialism which spiraled into different forms.

It doesn't necessarily mean all atheist are materialist but the core teachings of materialism is visible in atheism.

Whether it's a spaghetti Monster or not it is rather inconsequential because the axiom that determines shape can assume any shape. The same way 3D encapsulates any lower dimensions!

Hence this axiom can both be dimensionless or have infinite number of variations.

You just accepted God's existence.

It seems you didn't read through my write up.
The universe has a verifiable beginning hence it can never be uncreated!

Thus you have a conundrum because you have to look for something older than the universe but due to the nature of materialism there is none!

Now if a "singularity" brought about the universe and what we know of it today.

I can as well say what brought about this singularity,
In the first place also singularity is oppositely immaterial.

I could as well postulate that there are infinite number of singularities and all singularities exist in some higher order infinite plane.

Then I go one step this infinite plane must exist within another plane!

Do you see how cumbersome your logic is!
That's why it's called a paradox.

And the axiomatic explanation is the most plausible explanation.

You ignored the part of my post whereby I stated that the universe could be an created entity, just like you believe there is the uncreated maker. Do you believe that?

MaxInDHouse:
Simple answer because he's the only person you can think of since he promised to do it.



Child molestation is everywhere as God is not forming His organization from among aliens from another planet it's humans on this planet with their several filthy acts that God is using to fulfill His promises that's why Jesus said he came to call sinners. Luke 5:32

What God promised that this sinful humans will achieve is written in the Bible book of Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3

Despite their filthy acts they will stop making, buying, selling and using weapons in their midst.

Ọmọ that's what God promised!

So child molestation is amongst the characteristics of yhwh's children?

Gabrielshow24:
First of all, materialism a sect of Atheism concludes the Universe came a ball of gas and matter which in turn doesn't have a definite mode of existence. Or rather put a singularity!

Simple logical reasoning suggests that if you follow suit in that thought patterns you have a paradox as it creates an infinite cycle of what created what.

Hence abstraction tells you along with cause and effect that an axiom must be at the center of existence in the same vein axioms are present in science which by themselves are unprovable but are used as substances to prove all things.

If that can exist we know therefore in the spirit of axioms that whosoever or whatsoever that caused all to exist is an axiom that cannot be determined by anything it brought about but itself can be used to determine all things.

This thought process places God as an immovable, absolute and axiomatic being that brings forth all other concepts.

Hence mathematics and in turn science cannot be used to fully prove God and in the same vein as all axioms we must accept this unprovable fact to be true in order for all other things to be true!

As regards the universe, we have no idea to tell whether it's infinite or not, we do not have special tools or devices to be able to precisely conclude that the universe is infinite but rather evidence suggests the universe is rather finite and if what we know as the universe is finite we then need a way to consolidate with the fact that there infinite finite numbers within infinity which brought the present thought of multiverse(multiple universes).

And who knows as our understanding grows we start to see that maybe perhaps on some invisible plane our so called universe could just be a simple pebble and what we know as multiverse the galaxy equivalent to the collection of these so called pebbles.

Hence the universe is not infinite!
On some certain scale it will always be finite!
This leads to a paradox finite-infinite based on perspective.

Science even confirms that most likely all particles came from the condensation of energy.

Big bang asserts invariably that protons and the likes spun from "thin air" 👀

God is the most probably conclusion for the existence of life as we know it.

All other theorems and postulates fall flat on its head!

And cannot by itself explain everything, it might be correct in some aspects but it fails miserably in others!

1. First of all, materialism isn’t related to atheism at all. Please yall should take it easy in the lies. Materialism is a philosophical concept believed by anyone, whether theist or atheist.
2. Like I said, I don't know how the universe came about. If you insert your god there, how do we know its your specific and not Flying Spaghetti Monster?
3. If you believe your god is an unmovable maker, why can't you believe the universe be an uncreated entity?

MaxInDHouse:
I know you will lie for atheism that's why i didn't ask you who killed her rather i asked you the question any investigator will first ask you:

Who do you suspect?

So don't kill yourself simply because you want to be an atheist!

I'll suspect the threat but it doesn't mean he killed my wife.
So how does all this fit into the question I asked you?
How do you know your organization that is known for graping children, be doing the work of god?

MaxInDHouse:
I've answered you guy if have something to say go ahead.
If someone threaten to kill your wife and you later find her in a pool of blood who should be the number one suspect?
God promised something in the Bible and it's happening exactly as He promised yet you're asking how we can know that He is the one doing it.
Please use your brain now, i know you love to be an atheist but that shouldn't stop you from thinking straight!

If someone threatens to kill my wife and I later find her dead, it doesn't automatically mean the threat killed her ,duh. Use a piece of your brain

MaxInDHouse:
I love all people even though you don't believe in God so i read motives not just speeches you have always asked for the presence of God and that means you will like to settle so many scores with Him if possible you can see Him.
So i know it's not your fault the condition you find yourself determines how far you can think!

Answer the question. Stop deflecting

MaxInDHouse:
When what He promised is happening in their midst!

Please answer the question

Dtruthspeaker:
As you see a House do you not automatically know that it has an.Owner? Do you not ask who get that house for....?

Whats the house here?

MaxInDHouse:
According to the Bible what are the things the disciples desire abi you think it's not to be applied first on those listening to Jesus that day?

So you know what the disciples desire? Aint you wonderful, MadMax?
Btw, what are you doing in a thread made for atheists to respond? Do you wanna turn atheist?

MaxInDHouse:
Can you show me where He promoted that?

Come on, i'm talking about what He promised and fulfilling not what your pastor told you nah!

U dont read your fairy tales properly

LordReed:
Is the god finally going to restore a missing limb to an amputee?

No, he works only in 'mysterious' ways
He can make people to pass exams but doing something as stupid as restoring amputations is not in his bucket lists

MaxInDHouse:
Oh there is!
You may not appreciate since you choose to close your eyes but people who have experienced wars and killings of their loved ones by the same people they knew as well meaning neighbors will know our God is doing something UNBELIEVABLE!

A load of gibberish coated with a wonderful coat of incoherency

MaxInDHouse:
You can't see a Spirit {John 4:24} but you can feel His presence when He is working in the midst of His Organized worshipers! John 13:34-35

How do you know he's the one working through all those 'organized worshippers'?

MaxInDHouse:
Most of them are sincere because they're tired of all the lies their religious leaders have told them in the past so wherever i meet atheists i do pity them!

See this one wey him organization is in charge of raaaping children. E dey here dey convulse

FxMasterz:
There a thread here in the link below that completely destroys their concept of how the universe came to exist. All the prominent atheists on this forum avoided the thread like a plague. The only atheist that attempted the challenge was just dotting all over the place addressing issues that were never raised. Only one agnostic made an effort to rescue the atheists but he failed woefully too as he could not address the matter headlong. He was found beating around the bush and using a lot of fallacies that eventually put him in trouble. He had to abandon the thread too and run for dear life.

It was there I understood that atheism is a religion of some sort, not in the usual way religion is imagined but in a very idiotic paradigm. It's a religion of idiocy for the losers and frustrated individuals of this world. They're so fanatical about atheism that even obvious truths won't change their minds. How can any sane adult say he has never experienced the spiritual in his life? I can't just understand. They first interpret their past and present spiritual experiences as illusions, then dismiss them as an unreal experience before lying to themselves that spirituality does not exist. The thread I referenced is here:
https://www.nairaland.com/8193100/completely-destroys-atheism-renders-atheists

I know you're a bumbling dishonest dude but I didn’t know its this terrible.
That thread was fully populated and analysed by many atheists, namely my humble self, hopefulLandlord, Judas1X,kingxsamz and the admirable lady JessicaRabbit. She even invited you to an online debate which you ran away from with your tail between your fearful legs. You couldn't even understand basic concepts from your posts. And to make matters worse, you kept on lying your way through the thread. You pointedly denied points in your posts. You initially lied that you are the original poster but we found out your lie that it was AI. Then you started ignoring points.
See bro, your life is so incredible with lies. Pretend to be honest for once

TruthofGod:
Atheism is the most irrational, illogical nonsense. In rejecting the logical reality of God, the atheist has blind faith in a causeless universe where matter, energy, time and space came from literal nothingness. This isn't just blind faith in an unscientific premise, it's belief in magic.

You simply cannot get something from nothing and what's more, atheists think their blind faith in something from nothingness isn't a contradiction. After all, if everything can come from nothingness, then under the "logic" of the atheist, God can come from nothing too. Atheism is self refuting.

However, the theist position isn't to support something from nothingness. Rather, the theist position is that God is eternal and this is in agreement with all the logic of the Prime Mover argument which is backed by scientific principles such as causality. Ultimately there had to be an eternal source at the beginning from which everything else proceeded from. This is simply logic.

Logic agrees with theism, whereas atheism is based on mere fantasising and denial of scientific and logical principles.

1.So you believe everything came from something, but you don't believe your god came from something? You have committed at least 3 fallacies in this little post. Have you heard of the fallacy of Special Pleading? If you believe your god is eternal, why dont you believe that the universe is eternal too?
2. In your creation story, your god made humans from the mud/earth, so where did the earth come from? Yup. Came from nothing. Where did the animals pop out from? Yup. Your god snapped his fingers Thanos-esque and all sorts of animals, including dinos, popped outta thin air. Yet you accuse atheists of being dumb. You're even dumber
3. Atheists, at least the ones I have come across, dont believe the universe came from nothing. We simply say we dont know. Simple