₦airaland Forum

Spy360:
This post is full of so much bullshiit to make a mountain. Any way let me just take it as you trying to be funny or finding a back door to escape analytical annihilation.

Jodi my dear friend you must not win every argument o. Nna m just accept or L in this one. Daalu

Lol...
Take L say Giroud and Van Persie dey on par?

Na only you fit talk that Kain nonsense!!!

Spy360:
We lost because we couldn't break a low block. Havertz would have maneuvered the spaces to create clear chances for goal. That's what a raumdeuter does.

Don't worry, Havertz will play today you will see difference.

Delulu.!!!
How many clear cut chances have Havertz created?

Lol.
You're beginning to sound like a troll at this point

Spy360:
As per the bolded you think it's about feelings? It's you that feels when you open your mouth whaooo like Roman Reigns without having evidence. Football is mathematics. You may 'feel' that Man United and Chelsea have better players than Aston Villa, but look at the league table, Aston Villa has more points than Man United and Chelsea. It's not about feelings it is about evidence.

Football is all about feelings that's why it's called an Entertainment!!
All those shouts, and emotions, what do you think they are?? Mathematics?
No make me laugh

The good thing I love about football is the process. And everyone who knows me well here (at least according to my posts) knows that I look at performance over results. The season is long, but one thing I can bet on is that as long as Man u play what they play and Chelsea play what they play so far, Chelsea will topple Man u at the end of the season . You can take that to the bank.

You can keep on looking at Stats and ignore what your very eyes sees and enjoy.

I wonder why you dey watch ball when you suppose deh watch am for livescores and opta. That would have been better cos you don't need "feelings".

mostob:
Gbam! You just summarized everything. Using this your context, Giroud is the striker A here while VPersie is striker B. I'm glad you can see how a flash in the pan performance can hide a lot of inconsistencies.

I saw that nonsense example he gave and I just gave up.

But then, I don rest for the matter. Thank goodness Dave.P no use agenda talk say Giroud dey on par with Van Persie

Amigoss:
Calm down ,it was not that deep and I said that light-heartedly,I mean he has defeated the top teams we have struggled against resoundingly....

I love the man,want him to bring as much and all the success to Anfield and to surpass Bill shankly...For all the great he has done,he has just 1epl which he didn't celebrate with the fans and 1ucl which is "banter-able"😢😢...

This matches we are dropping points in is the reason we have always finished 1point less city,we are loosing Salah and Endo and I can bet my life we ain't signing anyone,city easy next 6fixtures can kick-start their crazy and usual winning run and they have kdb and haaland back ..

.Just one good season without high BP,having other teams do us a favour like Aston Villa crazy last 15mins two seasons ago,just like the 19/20 season is all I pray for to make it 20....

See the way you cooly and slyly undermined the trophies Klopp won and then you'll open your mouth and say "it's not that deep"

Spy360:
You fans can be funny.

Havertz missed one game and Arsenal lost 2-0 at home to West Ham. Think about this. When I said it is Havertz that makes the tactics to work with his space control you guys think you know ball more than me. Dey play.

Thank God Havertz played against Aston Villa and Newcastle, if not I know say you for add that dirty yarns to this turkey yarns you just spewed now

Modified: I just remembered that Havertz played against this same West Ham in league cup and we lost.
Agenda must always agend sha

Spy360:
As per the bolded you think it's about feelings? It's you that feels when you open your mouth whaooo like Roman Reigns without having evidence. Football is mathematics. You may 'feel' that Man United and Chelsea have better players than Aston Villa, but look at the league table, Aston Villa has more points than Man United and Chelsea. It's not about feelings it is about evidence.

If you need me to provide evidence to you (An arsenal OG) that Van Persie was better than Giroud in arsenal shirt just so that you'll be satisfied then you're on a long thing.

A very Long Long Thing!!!!!

Chukwu aju!!

daveP:
I am talking about downplaying Giroud cos of those mocking him for WC show.

His stats never won him Golden boot for Arsenal. Rvp got Boot at Arsenal and Man U. 30 and 26goals respectively.

Giroud can't lace RVP Arsenal boots. Let him try Yakubu Aiyegbeni fes. Who was the last person to score 26G/A for Arsenal sef? Auba?

Well, like I've always maintained (which was my bullet point to Spy) that Giroud was very very average at arsenal. I don't care nor does it concerns me what he does outside arsenal cos I'm neither a Giroud Stan nor do I support those clubs.

Spy brought stats and says he's on par with Van Persie and Auba and your tone initially seemed to agree so.

daveP:
Error initially. "Without stats" corrected.


I can't call them to be at par. We should never forget the style of play is totally different even if they are both forwards. That's why i was laughing when i saw some comments mocking Giroud for not scoring at the WC. I just shake head. That guy was the intro to a new style of play for national teams.


His goals surpassing Igwe in national team is also indicative, not conclusive. OG sha was wasteful at Emirates sha.

If you can't call them to be at par, then what are supporting the stats for?

And please don't say we have different styles during both of them era. Both played under Wenger and Giroud immediately replaced Van Persie, so you can't say the teams or style was different

mostob:
Joderaaaaa

All these scholars no do pass this one. You deserve an honorary degree abeg.

Lol...
To even go on with the argument tire me.

It's a big disservice to Van Persie I swear

daveP:
Yeah. They SHOULD NOT be ignored either. They spice up the analysis. Anyone wey wan analyze with stats dey play. Not, e no dey play. The person dey gba!! Students of Statistics know these things.

So you agree that Giroud was on Par with Van Persie and Auba during their time here?

Spy360:
You will keep arguing even when the facts are laid bare to you. It's honourable to accept arguments that are made with facts that are verifiable. Even if you don't believe the facts at least accept them. If someone says he is a billionaire and I doubt it. If the person shows be his bank balance at least I should accept even if I still have my doubts. Any body can wake up and call Giroud 'very very average'.

It's funny because it is similar to you accusing Hausa for saying that Saka and Martinelli are average. There is no difference then between the both of you.

Football no be mathematics wey I wan dey use stats as all in all.

I no be stats person but if you feel say Giroud dey on par with Van Persie and Auba, then good for you.
And if you and H.ausa feels that Saka is average, Congratulations!!!

I rest my case for this matter.

daveP:
Borrowing the words of komek on super Eagles thread

"Stats are indicative, not conclusive"

And we all know that one has to still react to indications for maximum output regardless of what one is comfortable with. Hence....

Any football fan that relies solely on stat is just trolling.

Spy360:
You hate stats because they tell you the truth that you don't want to hear. Like Jod.era when people carry preconceived notions they close their eyes to reality. I have used their performance records to show that Van Persie, Adebayor and Giroud are all on the same level for Arsenal yet you doubt.

We should be bold enough to accept fact when it is laid before us.

Stats is just like Mini Skirt, cos it don't reveal the main important things.

That's why you'll be bold enough to say Nketiah is a better player than Jesus in arsenal because he scores more goals than him. That's why you'll say Giroud is on par with Van Persie, Adebayor and Auba in arsenal shirt. Mind you, 2/3 of the trio have won golden boot while the last one was a golden boot contender.

If you don't think Stats is to complement what we watch and not a "stand alone" criteria, then you can be watching your football in livescores/sofascores. They give good stats

Spy360:
I gave you goals to games ratio you are still doubting. Why don't you do the bolded because if I did you will still not believe.

Cos goals to games ratio is scam.

Everyone knows Van Persie was injury prone during his years here and most of the times, he'll be coming as Sub to gain fitness before finally breaking into first 11. The only season he stayed throughout without injury, he hit 30 goals sharp.

Same thing with Adebayor who was in a two striker system with Henry. The season the latter was Sold, and Adebayor became the main Man, he hit 24goals sharp.

Giroud have always been the main man yet he scored 16 goals highest and you're comparing him with those two?

Giroud name no suppose dey the same sentence with any "Van".

You got jokes sha

BlueRayDick:
I don’t need any further PGMOL review to confirm anything . I watched the match live and from the VAR footage it was obvious the ball was out just like the Newcastle match.

It just doesn’t make sense to dwell much on that cos we failed to score ourselves , so there’s no way we can claim Ojoro made us lose . If we had scored 2 goals to match their 2 goals then we can argue we didn’t win because of the poor officiating .

I hope going forward our players work on getting the ball into the opposition net as my as we can ; then leave Arteta to drag FA or PGMOL for any decisions he feels doesn’t go our way in the post match presser

Yeah... I'm not of the opinion that Var made us lose that's why I didn't even weigh in on the issue after the match. We needed to win that game irrespective of the first goal.

My issue is how simple things like this, Var officials would say it's inconclusive. Omorr, it just looks as if all the people watching ball worldwide no know book

We need Var to confirm say this ball no dey out of play.

I don dey somehow suspect say most of these officials no go school

Shegzdave:
This is one of the reason I hate those stats

Like person go look stats finish say Van Persie and Giroud dey the same category for arsenal shirt.

I kukuma no blame Spy sha

mostob:
Maybe it's due to injury.

Probably. Cos the decline is so steep

mostob:
I tire o. You can't suggest yet you dey criticize.

Anyways sha.

Na him Sabi

mostob:
If you can't suggest, why criticize the ones we have?
Salah was a journeyman until that famous Basel match. Mane started small at Southampton. Both clicked under Klopp. They were not ready-made neither did they fell from the sky.

Sterling at Liverpool was so wasteful and reckless. Until Leceister won that league, who knew Mahrez?

The players you mentioned above have once passed through the phase Saka and Martinelli (whom you're criticizing) are currently passing through but their coaches didn't ditch them because they're neither models nor are they following Kim Kardashian.

When you see destructive criticism, it comes with that nature.

They'll tell someone to improve but can't pinpoint where the person will improve on

They'll a team they need to get better players but out of the pool of players worldwide, they can point one or two players to improve the team

Their own is just to critique and critique and critique all day long!!!

It's now he knows it's management that's paid the big bucks for that.

Those Kain people, I dey fear them for real life cos they only see mostly see flaws and never a positive. Always to pull down.

I just hope his online characteristics is different from his real life tho.

Spy360:
Which is good and which is average? I'll take Henry as good for Arsenal. Who should I take as very average?
Goals per games PL only

1. Henry 0.6
2. Aubameyang 0.56
3. Van Persie 0.47
4. Adebayor 0.43
5. Giroud 0.42
6. Lacazette 0.34

3 to 5 are in same category

Van Persie and Giroud in the same Category?
Someone that scored 30goals for us

Adebayor, the only season he played lone striker for us (without Igwe), he churned out 24 goals.


Why don't you drop their minutes per goal ratios for clearer understanding?

Everyone knows Laca was very very average for us

mostob:
I think it is the system. White is part of the '3' in our 3-2-5 formation. Overlapping means he would be exposing our defence to counterattack. I think that's why he is wary of bombing forward.

But White Overlaps more last season compared to this season. In fact, he was more daring.

Na why I even defend am last season

Mrviktor:
in d last 5 games

arsenal have won just 2,
lost 2
and draw 1

manutd have lost 2
won 2
draw 2

but its manutd thats a disgrace and eth is a waste coach

Last five games, yet na man u own be 6.

Also, EPL football started in the last 5 games.

Oga, if you wan defend your coach, defend am, no deh use arsenal dey do attaché abeg

mostob:
Well understood. That he should move central doesn't mean he should stay central throughout the whole match. You do know that by staying frequently on the wing, he is limiting Saka's space.

True... But he do move central sometimes.

I think Tomi would have helped out. Last season, White was good in overlapping runs. I dunno whether it's injury but White this season just seems off.

Something is just not right

Hausa:
I came here and said before that I've been following Arsenal bumper-to-bumper for over 20 years, and people said I'm being cocky.

The fact that Saka, Martinelli, and Odegaard are exciting is not in doubt. They are.
The question is, CAN THEY TAKE US TO WHERE WE DESIRE TO BE?
The Answer is NO. They can't.

Like I said somewhere (not on Nairaland), if Arteta thinks this squad can take us to where we desire to be, then he's a BIG joke.

There's a chance that the defenders can take us far. But that attack? Forget it.
It is not about getting 3 points against City, United, etc.
As the Heat begins to grow, they'll likely fall apart.

Saka, Martinelli, and Odegaard don't have the experience, the balls, the cojones, the know-how.
Because they've never been there and they've never done that.
If you're really into football, you'll realise their talents were never fully developed before they were plunged into First team football. Apart from that, an important factor is they had no MODELS.
Saka is still trying based on Sanchez, Ozil, Aubameyang, Lacazette, etc., that helped Model him. But at that point, they were toxic for the team. And it was not enough for him to develop into becoming a TOTAL FORCE. Today he's unplayable, tomorrow he'll leave you wondering.
And then we start saying he's playing too much or not being helped by Ben White.

But that is not a characteristic of players that are considered TOP QUALITY.

It is also my opinion that eventually, the fans will turn on Arteta.
Because he also lacks the know-how to take us where we desire to be.

Tell us the realistic attackers that you feel can take us to that next level.

Who do you recommend to fill in that front line?

mostob:
Anytime the chance present itself for ESR to nail a spot, he usually gets injured. I don give up on that guy.
Same thing with Nelson.

Lol.... I don't know about ESR. The surgery was suppose to help him become injury free. I dunno why it's not. Omorr, I missed him sha.

As for Nelson, I've never really rated him. He should go. I dunno why we extended his contract especially when Arteta doesn't really trust him. Arteta fvck up for that one

Spy360:
As per the bolded.

Average means not good. Very average means basically very poor. This is based on comparison.

Who do you want us to compare Giroud with to prove that he isn't very very average as you put it but in fact he was quite good? Choose two players (apart from Giroud off course). A very good striker for Arsenal and a very poor striker.

Van Persie
Henry
Adebayor

(Please, strictly arsenal appearance only)

I see people talking how Odegaard should be more central instead of going to the wings and always hiding behind Saka.

The thing is, according to our formation, this has always been his game even right from last 2 seasons. No be today e start. We've always been playing 433 symmetrical. Tomi/white —Odegaard— Saka trident on one side while Tierney/Zinny — Xhaka — Martinelli trident on the other side(reason I always call it RHS and LHS respectively). DM and striker acts as the link to the build up to such trident or the link to the passage of one trident to another.

So with this, we can see that Odegaard acts as RAM/RCM, while Xhaka acted as an LAM/LCM. So with this, it's the duty of Odegaard to always feed Saka and have an understanding with him, same way it's for Xhaka (and presently Havertz) to always feed Martinelli and have an understanding with him (as well as the FBs too). On occasions tho, They'll tilt towards the middle to retrieve ballbut that's how far they can go. And the aim is to do that in order to win the ball or build up straight to their assigned attackers (except on few occasions the opposite attacker is free and a cross field pass is necessary). Rarely will you see Odegaard or Xhaka switch wing. This positioning Is called Juego de posicion and that's what Arteta system plays.

It's the reason why I want Havertz to be up and doing in his creativity task cos leaving everything creativity on Odegaard/Saka wing is too much. It'll be like a person walking on one leg. Obviously the person would walk but it'll be with difficulty, pressure and imbalance. And that's what's happening to this team.

Until our LHS gets it right, our RHS will continue to suffer. Saka have been trying very well, but he's no Messi. If he doesn't gets help and distraction, we might keep on complaining and complaining!!!

mostob:
You have said it all. Let me also add that Martinelli shares the biggest blame here. Both White and Zinny doesn't overlap yet Saka is more productive. Carlos Cuesta needs to sit Martinelli down and do his magic on him. I really can't pinpoint exactly what went wrong with Martinelli.

And, to get the best out of our wingers, we need to stop being rigid. Nothing stops Jesus and Martinelli switching.

Na just Martinelli previous seasons dey make me calm for am cos I no just understand this Martinelli.

He can't even beat his man one on one again. He's not that dangerous again in the box, and his goalscoring which is his greatest asset that endeared us to him, he's losing touch of that quickly. I mean, the two big things that endeared us to him(goalscoring and beating opponents), he's fast losing it. I don't just understand.

We need that fluidity in front line. Last season, GJ was predominant moving to the LHS, this season he's now moving to the RHS more. Omorr.

But all in all, Martinelli needs to step up. I just wish Esr can come back to his main form and push Martinelli big competition in that spot. I'm not too feeling Trossard there. Havertz also should be helping in creativity. I watch Odegaard and even though his creativity have dropped but that's partly due to Saka been crowded out so there's no much space for him to thrive.

Silentgroper:

Lol...
You try

Ray07:
come join my club Girona
We dey ball die

Lol... Man city junior brother?

I can't fit