₦airaland Forum

Angelou:
this isn't what i was taught to believe, this is what truly happened!! with all the paraphernalia of charms that the sub saharan africa possessed, why didn't they put up adequate resistance against western explorers (such as inflicting them with a deadly pestilence)

Why are there so many dead western soldiers in Africa and why are there so many crumbling European ruins if Africans didn't put up good resistance? Why did it take them so long to take Africa?

tevinsolt:
the most significant civilization that sprung in Africa was Egypt, there were small civilizations in comparison that also arose later. Civilizations like the Mali, Ghana, Oyo , Great Zimbabwe and Benin and so on. none after Egypt can compare with the [Rome Empire, Ancient Greece (Athens, Sparta), the various dynasties in Asia] these civilizations are so influential structures millenniums old are still standing, when go to these sites today, all you can do is stare in awe and wonder of those who came thousands of years before us accomplished............in sub Saharan Africa there's no such thing. The so much acclaimed Benin City was destroyed by mere British troops. Napoleon attacked Egypt and some of those acient structures are still standing til today.

British troops with machine guns. And this is after years of defeat by the Bini.

Did anyone on this thread forget about the punitive expeditions around Africa? You know, the invasions that actually caused the current backwardness by the burning of cities and exile of leaders?

wildikeman:
jesus! Sub-marine canoes! Libraries! Where did you get such crap lies!?? !!!!!! Your teacher head no correct o.

Wow! They really must've done you in didn't they. So much that you'd even deny official colonial admin documentation. One step to education is through books.
https://books.google.ca/books?id=XsHB69txxdEC&pg=PA92&lpg=PA92&dq=sierra+leone+alligator+society+submarine&source=bl&ots=DGdNOVuFSX&sig=MstOhxiYlXfFgAds1mkC6kw7-JE&hl=en&sa=X&ei=77ASVbKGJNOcyATixYLgBw&ved=0CCIQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=sierra%20leone%20alligator%20society%20submarine&f=false

wildikeman:
And which Education centres oo...for farm abi?
The ones that were very eager to educate your lazy a.ss.

[quote author=wildikeman post=31979809]And capital punishment ke for sacrifice? Man get ur facts right. Sacrifice was done to honor the gods using the first male or virgins. The criminal although were subjected to such weren't always chosen as they were seen as outcasts and couldn't be given to the gods or were seen as unfit to serve a dead ruler so were either sent to the place of no return or sold to the arabs or whites.

Jostor link: http://www.jstor.org/stable/4390897?seq=11

Wikipedia forum: Actually "ElliotJoyce", if you had bothered to read past the first page of the jstor article you provided a link to, you would have seen that the article actually emphasizes that human sacrifice was mostly limited to criminals, was not actually of great extent, and that much of what the British had seen in 1897 had actually been misinterpreted since they assumed some things were sacrifices that weren't. Try and actually read an article past the first page before citing it in the mistaken belief that it supports your argument rather than that of your opponent. Benin did not have the luxury of plagiarizing Judaic ethics/morality like most of the European countries that adopted Christianity, but the ethics Benin did have never involved human sacrifice on any grand scale like that of the Aztecs, and there are multiple quotes from European visitors to Benin from before its conquest that state that they executed mostly criminals in sacrifices. Try and actually learn about historical places before commenting on them. Ciao.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Benin_Expedition_of_1897

wildikeman:
As for election it was limited.

http://www.saylor.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Ashanti-Empire.pdf
It involved choice of the people who ruled them. And they had unlimited power to remove member of the government if they were dissatisfied.

wildikeman:
No again what has Africa invented?

Go back and read my previous post.

totima:
Then I was wrong then. The Ethiopian monuments are just that - underwhelming.

The Roman colosseum looks very grand in comparison.

Thanks for clarifying.

Are you praising an entertainment centre where people slaughtered each other for amusment? Over more sensible Ethiopians?
Oh the African: condones babarism as long as white folks are doing it.

wildikeman:
why talk about a culture that even the most primitive man could achieve. Blood thirsty human sacrificing Benin culture even till date. The Asante-hene culture that was even up to date. When we say civilization we speak of up to date government for the people. Not old dark bc civilization. What did those ones even invent! Sef? Tell me please.

Really? Primitive men have libraries, elections, advanced militaries, high production, education centres, built submarines out of canoes(Koonkoobery), diplomecy, etc?
"Bloodythirsty human sacrifice" sure is a funny way of saying capital punishment. I don't know how disposing of hardened criminals quenches some "thirst". Looks like its back to the books for you sleepy head.

dallyemmy:
Just like undeveloped Haiti close to developed nations is fetish, wicked and selfish so is Africa. They are intellectually lazy, generally believe more in fables than facts. They do everything for the wrong reasons!

Spreading lies about Haiti huh? Do not speak on subjects your are woefully ignorant about.

wildikeman:
The blackman can't think for themselves....when they were even in Egypt the first monument which is the sphinx or pyramids you see were built by Pheonician Decendents. And Berbers. The negrows were driven out during this time. We as Africans have to ask God what the problem is...and again our bloody culture that most Africans cling to are what's setting us back. We should do away with them and think in a most secular way.

Do away with the culture that brought us the mighty empires of Benin and Asante? Do you pride youself in perpetuating backwardness?

bezimo:
I asked this same question to a friend when I was in Nantes, France and he replied Africa was fighting with bow and arrow while Europe and the rest of the world were building underground tunnels, metros, developing infrastructure and robust institutions.Now the gap is more than 7 ups.Our past leaders were responsible having failed to do the needful.Till Jesus comes and rapture the church can Africa be like Europe? I am not sure.

Didn't know it was possible for someone to be so disconnected from history. You should open a text book sometime.

kayalla:
this was when life had a meaning.
if only technology didnt come,
if only oyibo man didnt open our eyes and brain,

To fundamentalism and armed robberies.

rabzy:
You could have been dead from small pox, chicken pox, cholera before you could say maami. Or worse u could have been an abiku cursed to die reborn and die for the nth time.

Yep. The invasion brought on a lot of diseases.

Meja:
Can't remember who said this but Swahili isn't an amalgam of Bantu and Arabic, it has a Bantu core, the only thing Arabic about it is it used to be written in the Arabic script and it has quite a number of bantunized Arabic loan words of technical terms and other concepts not found within Africa at the time of the interaction (e.g talak-divorce becomes talaka, qisas-revenge becomes kisasi, qariib-near becomes karibu, muhandis-engineer becomes mhandisi).

Lol, and English is an amalgamation of African, Arab and European because there are like 20 WA/Bantu/Arabic loan words in the English vocabulary(English might even be a Chinese language all together because of the sheer number of loan words from there).
These people are a complete joke, Kiswhili has nill to do with Arab or any other group but Bantu. Why this notion would gain such traction in a world where the most widely spoken languages have far more foreign loan words than Swahili is beyond my comprehension.

AmunRaOlodumare:
If you knew anything about Africa you would know no such thing exist. For Yoruba for example, past Kingdoms either subdivided Yoruba into smaller units or comprises people who were not Yoruba while leaving some Yoruba out of the Kingdom. You have an European/Abrahamic mindset. Leave the cultural homogeneity to Hitler.

Please note that. Those non-Yoruba who lived in Yoruba kingdoms were of conquered groups whom had no say in joining such kingdom. Following this, it would take several wars(and a ruling ethnicity with a dominant language) to achieve "one Nigeria".

KoloOyinbo:
WONDERFUL pictures. Thank you so much for posting them. The circular nature marks them as quite unique (even from the step pyramid in Egypt) but the 'layered' structure has been adopted independently by many ancient civilizations across the globe. I must find out more!

Some posters have commented (quite correctly) that much more needs to be made of West African history. This was illustrated to me recently. I was looking around the 'Currency Museum in CBN, Abuja and there was a small 'Benin Bronze'. I was fascinated and drew it to the attention of my colleague (who is another oyinbo) and the two Nigerian with us. Imagine my shock to learn that they had never heard of 'Benin Bronzes', THEY ARE WORLD FAMOUS! There was perhaps an excuse for my colleague, but for a West African (Nigerian or otherwise) not to know this was quite shocking for me!

Please, please, please realise and appreciate that the history of Nigeria did NOT begin with the arrival of the British and colonialism but predated that by thousands of years!

The Nigerian school curriculum apparently doesn't teach the important parts of Nigerian history.

jnrbayano:
Tony Uchenna wrote:

Osu caste system is an obnoxious practice among the Igbo in south east Nigeria which has refused to go away despite the impact of Christianity, education and civilization, and the human rights culture.

http://www.vanguardngr.com/2010/10/osu-caste-in-igboland/

The continued irrational justification of barbaric oppression of indigenous igbo civilization by foreign invaders isn't helping your case.

Crayola1:
Architecture
Mud Molding in Onitsha
[img]http://2.bp..com/-w65Fym20lzc/Tpb0vqBb_cI/AAAAAAAAAok/IfCLviEPiY4/s1600/models.jpg[/img]

How old is that molding? Is it a recreation of an earlier design? Whats the explanation for the wheeled vehicle there?
[img]http://raai.library.yale.edu/web/art/6/7/22308_images_image_6797_medium.jpg[/img]
There are wheels in Dahomey art as well. Why haven't historians made note of this?

KLand:
Not all aspects of our culture are idolatous. But some clearly are. I don't see why a Christian should take part in Igue festival. Better things to do........

Like molesting children...

@Rossike

Thanks for the read. I came out of here far more educated on ATR than when I came in.

A Definite yes. I was actually going to make a thread requesting this as well, but didn't think Seun and co. would think it was important enough(eg. culture section would suffice). A history section would greatly benefit this forum tremendously due to more centralization and focus on the subject than the culture section ever could allow.

Akinsnaira:
Only if the BLACK RACE could learn from history to appreciate today and forge ahead to build a better future for themselves.

I panned through some pix that show horror Ebola has inflicted on people from Sierra Leone, Liberia & Guinea this morning, I was gripped with fear of my life seeing body of people lying on the street like bird flu-struck chickens, all because of lack of proper planning, poor health care system and institution occasioned by bad leadership.

Africa needs to start investing on intellectualism no matter how little it is, what we are enjoying today in development is product of relentless efforts of people in the past and present who were able to see beyond their environment.

If only the black race could learn from their far more advanced past and use that as an insperation to return to the civilization of their forefathers.

The REAL Nigeria

kingston277: http://historum.com/middle-eastern-african-history/70114-african-culture-9.html
https://www.nairaland.com/1796503/traditional-african-boat-designs
http://historum.com/middle-eastern-african-history/58840-diversity-early-african-architecture-ruins-thread.html
https://www.nairaland.com/1249503/interesting-images-precolonial-early-colonial
https://www.nairaland.com/582176/benin-art-architecture/
West
www.nairaland.com/attachments/1423991_Benin_City__ca__1600_jpgc3a4c3a51515a5eed646b6a21b7ba1d0
https://files.abovetopsecret.com/files/img/ya51284efa.jpg
https://www.manswersonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/sungboeredo1.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sungbo%27s_Eredo
More...
https://i.imgur.com/QpTDdgx.png?1
https://i.imgur.com/coycsF8.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ERIeZwv.png?2
North
https://oi41.tinypic.com/33xho93.jpg
Nsibidi(East)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nsibidi
More...
https://www.nairaland.com/189030/african-script
Production
http://der.org/resources/study-guides/blooms-of-banjeli-study-guide.pdf
[img]https://www.nairaland.com/attachments/1554585_african-productivity_jpeg73ad16662aab95c5e70965fc917f4ece[/img]
Bathrooms
https://i.imgur.com/yTkf0BO.jpg?1
Science and Tech
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_science_and_technology_in_Africa
"Human sacrifice" was actually capital punishment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Benin_Expedition_of_1897
Human rights concepts
http://www.kentlaw.edu/faculty/bbrown/classes/HumanRightsSP10/CourseDocs/9BanjulCharterandtheAfricanCulturalFingerprint.pdf
http://eccentricyoruba./
http://www.postcolonialweb.org/nigeria/precolwon.html
http://www.postcolonialweb.org/nigeria/colonwom.html

I know its alot of links but its important for you to know. Plus the above is just West Africa/Central alone!

We are stopping ourselves from rebuilding our civilizations by perpetuating false teachings and dumbing ourselfs down.

yokiti:
gone are the days.
Thanks to civilization

Yes, bring back the pre-colonial days.
https://www.donstinson.com/scatt/artistsonline/BeninBronze.jpg

Elxandre:
I understand what you are pointing out, but what I was really trying to say was that the Africans looked more primitive compared to the Europeans in the picture you put up.

I hope you understand.

How? The Europeans were wearing dyed animal skins, pretty primitive to me.

AmunRaOlodumare:
So you don't consider them civilized because they are semi-nomadic herding people? That's where you put you fictitious line of civilization? That's bullcrap and you know it.

Firstly, I was responding to Elxandre using his logic. Which was why I asked why focusing on these particular lifestyles were relevant at all to the definition of "civilized".

Elxandre:
They don't look like pre civilized people tho.

Teepee-dwelling, semi-nomadic, reindeer-herding people from norway are as pre-civilized as you can get.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sami_people

GenBuhari:
The fact that your enemy has destroyed your own record of history is no justification to allow your enemy to write your history for you. In fact it is nothing short of foolhardy. This is akin to the jews allowing the Nazis to write their history during the halocaust, and trusting the Nazis to write a truthful account.
Or a criminal court of law only hearing and accepting the evidence of of the criminal (the defence) as the truth, without hearing from the prosecution.

I honestly don't know what other way I can educate you on this. All I can say is, Europeans simply did not have the military might during the 15th-19th centuries to take Africans by force. Both Western historians and local traditions state that Western slave catcher got ripped a new one by the local village navies when they attempted to acquire slaves by force. This is why they only conquered Africa at the turn of the 20th century. They needed 400 years to develop the technology to do so.

GenBuhari:
I am not sure how the picture you posted of some sort of animal or beast holding a gun and a machete proves your case that Africans accepted guns in exchange for live enslaved Africans.

So from what I'm getting from this, you don't believe Africans possessed firearms? But its on the wall. I was using wall art as evidence similarly to how archaeologists use ancient Egyptian wall art to learn about Egyptian society. Its right there for you to see, why are you denying. Heres more:
https://www.donstinson.com/scatt/artistsonline/BeninBronze.jpg
https://www.culture24.org.uk/asset_arena/3/58/76/467853/v0_master.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/Benin_Brass_plaque.jpg
Why would they depict themselves using firearms if they didn't actually have them? Where did they get these firearms shown in their artwork from?

GenBuhari:
So you are privy to European reasoning and policies. Yet you failed to address why people who claimed that they came to trade peacefully would bring so many guns ?(instruments of war) and also be trading in the bounties of war (allegedly enslaved prisoners of war).This is just not credible.

Answer the question then. Where did they acquire the guns they are using in the reliefs above?

GenBuhari:
That is purely your interpretation and is no basis for making such leaps in logic as to claim that Africans sold themselves as slaves to Europeans.
All you have said are mainly leaps in logic to jump to a conclusion that supports history as written by the caucasian historians. There is no independently verifiable evidence to support the white man's version of history so we cannot accept it as factual.

There are well documented sources from both sides of the fence stating that Europeans HAD to trade because they could not steal them by force. You seem to be under the impression (I'm guessing from self-haters that deface these kingdoms purely from their participation in the slave trade) that the selling of slaves is entirely from greed. I suggest you look up the slave trade in the Kongo and how that went down for the local merchants. I assure you the Kongolese elite received no benefits from it and were effectively forced by the Portuguese to supply workers to them. No greed on the elites part, but fear. Based on this example, I personally believe a similar thing occurred in West Africa where the elites were forced to trade slaves by threat of Europeans invasion, they were likely spooked by the advanced weapons carried by the European traders, and needed to arm their military with said superior weaponry to defend themselves from potential conquest.

Ploy:
That exactly is my point, then they lived separately but there was seemingly enmity among them. The weakness explored by the colonialist to exploit them.

https://www.worldatlas.com/webimage/countrys/europelargesm.jpg
https://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lskjbmla5I1qgfbgio1_500.jpg
I don't get your point. The Africans had larger states than the colonialists. And the colonialist easily could've fallen to the same fate if anyone wanted to conquer them.

Ploy:
The world of today has advanced beyond living a secluded life. English opened the window through which we interact with the whole world. There was never Nigeria before the colonial masters and there won't be Nigeria if we through their linguistic legacy into the dustbin of rivalry.

Secluded? Do you even know how states work? Let alone pre-colonial African states? You might want to catch up on what that is before I answer this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_(polity)

Elxandre:
I said earlier that maybe not all tribes.

The koma people still live by their ancient traditional cultures, and they give us a good reference Into what pre-civilized Africans looked like.

Even Niki minaj/miley Cyrus got nothing on this ladies.

https://www.thelovelyplanet.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/indigenous_sami_people_Europe.jpg
And these are pre-civilized Westerners who traditionally live the same lifestyle as those in your pictures. I don't get why you give so much attention to a few pre-civilized African groups. Every continent has 'em.

PAGAN9JA:
Why is a member of the Respected Nigerian Armed Forces being forced to carry umbrella over a politician like a common lackey/slave

Is this how our brave soldiers be treated?


This is Taraba Senator Aisha Jummai, a common man of no royal descent elected representative by and of the common people whos duty is service to the Nation. Why should he strut around lyk a King and abuse the dignity of the Government Uniform Cant he employ his own servant to the menial task? Will his skull burn with heat without the umbrella? Isnt he already wearing a mallam cap to protect his bald patch?

These are small questions that point towards bigger wahala tinz in our system. And we need to clean it asap.


May the GODS of ova forefather Bless Nigeria and guide her onto the right path.

Isn't holding a umbrella over an important figure customary? I personally think they should've gotten someone else to do it.

Ploy:
I disagree with you, English is rather a growing language. Any language that will not die must allow other members (grow).

Don't forget, that we now have Englishes: Nigerian English, Ghanaian English, American English e.t.c. That is the flexibility that is expected of any language that won't go into extinction.

In fact, Africans, especially Nigerians should be grateful to the colonial masters that solve the problem created by the kaleidoscopic linguistic situation on our nation(s).

About 6000 languages are spoken in the world, over 2000 are in Africa and about 515 are in Nigeria both living and dead.

English is, and will continue to be the unifying language of Nigeria; even if Nigeria disintegrates, linguistic problem will still strive. I can't fathom how Tiv people will succumb to the linguistic dominance of the Hausas.

In essence, it is behoved of us to harness the importance of English in Africa in general and Nigeria in particular.

Boy I wonder how they amassed such large states without a colonial unifying language.
https://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lskjbmla5I1qgfbgio1_500.jpg

Elxandre:
Africans probably exported unclothedness to the west! Lol.
Watch American movies from the 1920's and see how long their skirts were.
In contrast, Africans were virtually naked back then.
Haven't you seen pics of remote tribes who still wear bikinis made of leaves?
Heck!!!

I don't see leaves. Please point to where you see leaves
https://i.imgur.com/QpTDdgx.png?1

Elxandre:
They were so civilized and smart, yet the Europeans came and conquered them easily, packing them like sardines to the west.

The fact that they ended up being superior to Africa means they are smarter. (at least for now).

Just like how the mongols were smarter than all of China when they conquered it "easily" aswell.