ichuka:

Thanks my dear Sis.
These is exactly the problem we have with Christianity of today.
mixing the old with the new.
most Christians don't even study there bible.
From Genesis to Revelation the bible talks about one Person, every other thing leads to Him.the bible is His biography simple.
any Christian that cannot see Christ and His Gospel of Grace in ALL the books of the bible has a problem.
most of them don't even understand the full meaning of the Law,how then can they comprehend the Gospel of Grace.
most don't know the real meaning of Love.talkless of them understanding that real Love is a Person!! lol.
I pray that God should help us all.the confusion is very embarrassing.

You're welcome. Thank God the Bible says the ministry of condemnation has glory but the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. Their ministry still has glory cos people get saved. Love is a person and grace is a person. His name is Jesus. The Lord knows how to reveal the real gospel to those who don't see His grace.

Awesome!

Kingdomtruth:

Amen o! God bless you

You too

Thattallgirl:
Or what will he and others like him say about Hebrews 10:16-17. Jesus Himself will write His laws on our hearts and He'll remember our sins no more. It's only through Him and Him alone.

Let's just hold on to 1 John 4:17 - As He is, so are we in this world. As Jesus is righteous, so are we in this world. As Jesus has everything, so do we in this world. Amazing grace

Thattallgirl:
Lol this girl you have time honestly. People like him focus on keeping the commandments on their own. They focus on themselves in keeping all that Jesus said. They end up looking to themselves and not Jesus. They believe Jesus is not all powerful to guide them and to be their righteousness.

I know right! Thank God Romans 5:17 says righteousness is a gift. Watch how he'll turn it again

Kobojunkie:
You did generalize and you continue to do so by bringing up the case of David as a sort of standard where God's Law and obedience of it is concerned.

God wanted a replacement for Saul who refused to obey His commands, and He chose David, whom He, God, declared was"a man after His Heart" .i.e. willing to obey His commands.

And this declaration was made before God made David King. God did not set David up as a standard of any sort. He simply chose David over Saul who refused to obey His commandments till the end. So I don't see the point in your continuing to hack at David's sin when it changes nothing of what God meant and the eventual choices David made.

You've answered none of my questions, and you keep deviating and deviating. Even you as a believer, you can't say you've not committed a single sin since you became a Christian (you may say you haven't sin and that's between you and God). That is why we can't obey any commandment on our own. Only through Jesus can we live a righteous life. Goodnight and thanks for the discussions.

Kobojunkie:
The best?
When did God make David the role model for His people as far as the keeping of His Covenants was concerned?

I didn't generalize David. I'm talking about David here. Even though God called him "a man a after my heart", didn't he still fail?

Kobojunkie:
Yes, David struggled with sin. And?

So you agree that even the best can break the law?

Thank you Jesus!

Kobojunkie:
I still do not see the point of your mentioning David's failings when God never holds David up as the standard by which He judged anyone in His Old Covenant, and neither in His New Covenant. How does one man's struggle with sin eclipse the victory the other's had over sin?
In the above passage, God made it clear to His people how He judges them for their sins against Him, David's included.

Here u are again deviating from my question. In 2 Samuel chapter 12, didn't God Himself tell Nathan to tell David that he had done evil in His sight? Meaning he had sinned?

Kobojunkie:
What has David's sin with Bathsheba to do with anything?

I said God called David a man after His heart and yet David still failed.

"Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in his sight? thou hast killed Uriah the Hittite with the sword, and hast taken his wife to be thy wife, and hast slain him with the sword of the children of Ammon.
2 Samuel 12:9"

So you were saying a man after God's heart didn't fail?

Kobojunkie:
Again, this has never been a question of whether you deserve it or not.... God's mercy is poured out daily on all of Mankind... regardless of whether they believe in Him or not.
That is not true because, in the same Bible, you are told of many righteous men who chose to keep God's rules and commandments and did not fail God. Do we toss out the baby with the bathwater? You have men righteous men like Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, Samuel, Jeremiah, Job, John the Baptist, Ezekiel, during the time of Elijah, God said He had at least 1000 others to take his place. You have Zechariah and His wife, Joseph, father of Jesus, Simeon...all of them declared worthy and righteous by God.
When Jesus Christ arrived on the scene, there were many righteous men living even then - men who had lived obeying the rules and commandments of God. Jesus Christ even said that He did not come to call the ones who were already righteous - they were perfectly fine as they were in God's eyes - instead, He came to call the sinners instead to God.
I am afraid you are wrong again! Those who are righteous are perfect in the eyes of God. And again, Jesus Christ made this known to you when He declared that He has not come to call the righteous but instead those who are still bound to sin - sinners - to God. And Jesus Christ offers His Contract(promises included a part of the deal) to those willing to accept and obey the terms and conditions stipulated.
You need to toss that filter you have there with you(doctrines of men), so you read the Truth of God as it is truly presented to you. None of what you continue to assert makes sense at all when put next to the facts as stated in the Bible itself. So, how can you not see that this idea you keep trying to throw in can never make sense where God is concerned?
You at least need to learn the teachings of Jesus Christ so you can know His Truth from the lies you have been told.

So David didn't sin by sleeping with Bathsheba and killing her husband by putting him at the front of the battle line?

Kobojunkie:
Again, whether they deserve it or not is and remains a non-issue to God and the many out there who don't even believe in Him. God pours out His mercy and compassion on mankind, even on the wicked and the ungrateful. It is that simple! Why make a mountain out of nothing?

No one can deserve or earn His mercy. No matter how well they keep any rule or commandment cos even the person God called "a man after My heart", David, failed. No one can earn His mercy, His blessings, His presence cos no man is perfect like Him. And that my friend, is God's Unmerited Favor in our lives. WE DON'T DESERVE IT. HE GAVE US BECAUSE OF HIS UNCONDITIONAL LOVE FOR US. A LOVE THAT HAS NO CONDITIONS. If u don't see this, then there's nothing more I can say to you.

Kobojunkie:
You are quite mistaken... God did not choose Abraham. Abraham chose God, just like Abel, Enoch, Methuselah, and even Noah before Him. God calls all of men to Him, from Adam, to Cain and all. But the decision to heed God's voice is left to men.
There is no such thing as a "sin nature". The same Adam to blamed as having transmitted such produced Righteous men such as Abel, Enoch, Methusaleh, and even Noah. In the book of Jasher, it is even claimed there are some of the line of Cain that were also righteous - you should maybe check it out.
As God told you through His prophets, His New Covenant, Jesus Christ, is His plan to create a more "compliant" breed of people.
Prophet Isaiah, tells us more the Jesus Christ, what He would deal with and His reward at the end of it all.

Jesus Christ also quoted Isaiah in His teachings, so any narrative that is different from that offered by Jesus Christ Himself, ought to be questioned.
Many of those healed by Jesus Christ did not end up believing in Him or become His followers. What that means is God's mercy is not just on those who believe in Him or follow Him, but instead as God Himself declares, on all of mankind.
God pours His mercy on all , including the wicked and ungrateful... so I don't see what "deserve" has to do with any of this still.
Jesus Christ is God's contract of rest offered to those who are weary and heavy-laden. He advertised Himself that way to the people.... basically calling all those who are weary and heavy-laden to come to Him and sign up with Him for a restful existence.
Any questions on whether one deserves the King of Kings, of Jesus Christ, is a non-issue when the contract openly announces to all that He is available for anyone who is interested, don't you think?

God's mercy is on all mankind, did they do anything to deserve it, yes or no?

Kobojunkie:
1) In the case of those of His Old Covenant with those of the blood of Israel, and the Kingdom of Canaan(of this world), God gains a People to rule over
2) In the case of those of His New Covenant with those who will believe in Jesus Christ, and the Kingdom of God(not of this world), God gains for Himself heirs... Sons of God. Jesus Christ is the Master clone after which all the other Sons of God are modeled.

Again, Abraham did nothing for God to choose him and make a covenant with Him. Neither did humans, with the sinful nature that Adam produced did NOTHING for Jesus to die on that cross. Nobody that Jesus healed when He was on earth did nothing to deserve healing even though He's the new covenant. Every single person Jesus healed were not righteous. They did not deserve Him. No human in this world deserves the King of kings, and the creator of heaven and earth to come down in flesh and go through all that happened to Him just for someone to say it's only a contract and all He gets from it are sons. So, again, since you weren't born when Jesus came, do you deserve Him dying for you and forgiving you of all your sins?

Kobojunkie:
Yes! God told you He would send His New Covenant(contract) to you, and that is what and who Jesus Christ is.

Only those who sign up for the New agreement and commit to the plan, will receive that which God promised through His prophets.

God offers man plans/contracts... it has been His way since He made man, and it remains His way. It is up to the individual to decide if the plan/Contract/Covenant works for Him - The default being Death anyways.

So what do Jesus get in return? Cos a contract will benefit both sides

Kobojunkie:
I am sorry what? What has "deserve" to do with anything?
Do you "deserve" the contract you have with your phone company or with your landlord or your employer?

Does anyone "deserve" any Contract /Covenant/agreement? You are presented with an agreement and you make the choice to either become a signee or not... what has the word deserve to do with any of it?
Are you somehow better than those who never got a chance at the same contract - those who were before the time of Jesus Christ, and those who the Truth of God did not reach before their death- or something?

So Jesus Christ came to earth, and bore all of that suffering, pain, humiliation just for you to say "it's only a contract"??

Kobojunkie:
Improve upon your comprehension skills instead.

Did you deserve Jesus and this eternal life that you call grace, did you do anything to deserve it?

Kobojunkie:
According to Jesus Christ, He gives it only to those who Obey His commandment to believe in Him(believe He is who He says He is, be baptized, and eat communion) in order to be saved from Death, and receive in it's place eternal life.

1. The passages say all those who believe will receive eternal life in place of Death(perish/condemnation).

2. In the passage below, Jesus Christ goes on to say that one much eat His flesh and eat His blood in order to obtain eternal life.

3) In the passage below, Jesus Christ commands that those who believe and are baptized are those who are saved


Acts of obedience are counted as works in the Kingdom of God... Faith, the purse that contains your accumulations of works done in your obedience to God's commandments.

Just yes or no?

reubenobi:
so if he can't speak in tongues, he can't pray abi?

Of course he can pray. Tongues is the Spirit in us praying to God...it's the Holy Spirit interceding for us. That's why there is power in it. There's power in prayer too. It's what I have I suggested to him.

Kobojunkie:
First of all, you being of gentile roots were never under Old Covenant Law that you should pretend you were somehow under it at any point in time. Before Jesus Christ arrived, the gentile world was never under the Law of Moses but was instead condemned to die by the Law God gave to Adam from the beginning. You were already judged guilty and condemned as a gentile.. no path to forgiveness or Law for you.

Second, Jesus Christ told you that He too is Law... recall that He proclaimed that He came with a yoke and burden for you, only a lighter one than the Old Covenant which had 613 commands, statutes and rules.

Third, recall that Jesus Christ informed you that He is the way, the Truth, and the Life? Jesus Himself explained that The WAY is to through Him, the acceptance and obedience of His teachings where the same teachings constitute the Truth of God that He is. The Life in Him is the eternal life, grace from Death, that you receive from Him.... He is eternal life(grace) that you receive when you obey Him. If you knew His Truth(His teachings) you would know this and more.

So, if eternal life is grace, did u do anything to deserve it? I mean you weren't even born then. Are you saying you deserved Jesus dying for you? I need a plain answer pls.

Kobojunkie:
Grace as mentioned in John 1 vs 17 refers to the eternal life you are given in place of Death. And grace can be spent in either of Heaven or Hell.. both of them found well in the boundaries of the Kingdom of God.

In John 8, Jesus Christ posited that in order to be free from the bondage of sin, you have to accept and obey His teachings (Truth) for only by knowing the Truth(His teachings) can anyone who follows Him can be set free from bondage to sin by the Truth(His teaching).

Jesus Christ taught you the Gospel of the Kingdom of God, and not gospel of eternal life(grace). He instructed His followers to go out and teach to the world the gospel of the Kingdom of God and not their own gospel formulation. If you reject the commandment of Jesus Christ, preaching instead for gospel, that which men have given you instead, can you truly claim to have been set free from bondage to sin by His truth(the Spirit of Truth - Spirit of Jesus Christ Himself)?

"For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ"...was eternal life written in that verse, yes or no?

The gospel of Grace isn't a message or a topic. It's the GOSPEL. Gospel of grace is here to stay thank God John 1:17 differentiated between law and grace. And truth is on the side of grace in that verse. And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set u free. John 8:32

Jesse1991:

Yes

There was a testimony of a man I read. He had several illnesses. One day, he heard God tell him to pray in tongues as often as he can. Though it didn't happen immediately but little by little things started getting better for him.

Jesse1991:

Yes

There's power in it. Have the habit of praying in tongues, as often as u can. I don't mean you should close your eyes or kneel down before you do. Even if you're working or doing anything. Thank God for face mask so it'll be easy for you to do in public places. Only Jesus can make your family whole. Just keep speaking, even if you do it for days. You'll be seeing gradual improvement by the grace of God.

jiggaz:
Good morning Lisa... I don't know of any Grace church in Nigeria yet...

You can always worship with Pastor Joseph Prince via his church live stream on YouTube every Sunday... That's what i now do. The name of his church is New creation Church Singapore.

Type into the search box on YouTube "New Creation Church Live Stream" and you will see the link to worship with them. They hold five services every Sunday like the 5am Nigerian time, 7.30am Nigerian Time, 10.30am and the last one by 1.30pm Nigerian time.

Good morning, thank you

jiggaz:
Yes

Hello dear, pls do you know of any gospel of grace church in Nigeria? Especially Lagos. Not been able to attend church for a long time cos of the law churches preach.

livingchrist:
For me the good friday and Easter is a remainder of the wonderful things Christ has done for me.

The most wonderful gift I have ever had is the gift of eternal life, price was beyond me but a loving father gave it to me through his son my Lord Jesus Christ free of charge.

Right!!! And I just keep reminding myself even if things don't go right that my Lord Jesus didn't die in vain. If He says He's done it, then He has. Such rest we have in Him.

livingchrist:

The gospel is beautiful

Really is

GeneralDae:

Jesus came to teach us the true ways of God (law or no law).

Where the law contradicts the teachings of Jesus, as a disciple of Jesus you go with that of Jesus. If the gospels says Jesus did not condemn the woman bleeding, then I as a disciple of Jesus would interpret it to mean that law was not so important in the first place. It simply means there are weighter matters to be considered. The problem would then lie either on the law itself forbidding bleeding women from coming out or on the way it was understood and practiced by men. Whatever the case, jesus was right not to condemn her and it wasn't about a so called grace, it was more about the worldview of jesus and how he saw things.

You don't have to invent grace anywhere, all you have to do is obey the sayings of christ and put them in first place over the law or anything else.

Well, 2 Corinthians 3:7-9 has stated everything plainly. We may not have similar beliefs which is okay. Cos the ministry of condemnation which is the law is actually glorious cos u know, people still get saved. But the ministry of righteousness which can only be gotten through Jesus exceeds much more in glory.

GeneralDae:

So you mean Jesus teachings were only for those under the law?
Jesus said why do you call me lord, lord, and not do what I say? was he speaking to only those under the law or to all who would call him Lord / Master?
Also what is grace? and how does Jesus explain it in the gospels?

You'll know the teachings that are under the law....that were meant for the Pharisees who place heavy burden on people. The Pharisees, according to the law, say that except you are caught in the act, you haven't sinned. Jesus said even if u look at a woman lustfully, you have committed adultery. Everything Jesus said is Holy. The law is Holy but it can't make u holy. Only Jesus can.

Did you notice the two different men in Luke? The rich young ruler and that short man? The rich guy boasted that he has kept everything till Jesus said he should sell all he has and give to the poor. Christians will say Jesus didn't really mean it but he did, and the guy couldn't even drop one penny. The other short rich guy...when Jesus went to his house, He didn't give a single law. But this guy touched by Jesus said he'll give almost everything he has to the poor and those he has cheated. And when Jesus wanted to heal people, most especially the woman that was bleeding. That woman broke the law cos she was unclean yet Jesus didn't condemn her or say something bad to her. That is the grace. Jesus Himself transforms. The law can't. Jesus showed and described grace in His every actions. And then He said "I have come to fulfill the law". Why did He need to do that since He's holy?

GeneralDae:

Cool. But do you agree that the Christians these days focus too much on the epistles and the difficult letters of paul which they take out of context rather than use all that energy on the gospels first?

You think the epistles are difficult? But I actually feel Christians focus more on what Jesus said than even the epistles. Cos the epistles show their righteous identity in Christ. But they go to the law that Jesus said to bring the Pharisees and those under the law to the end of themselves and see how difficult the law is, so they can see the need for grace(Jesus)