₦airaland Forum

mustymatic:
Where? When? Why? He also promised hell as well.

mustymatic:
Eternal life will not exist in this world.. it's a fact.

mustymatic:
[b]
Talk true first, then I'll tell you why.

Unlike other religions, Islam is not named after its founder or the community of its birth. Islam is an attributive title that signifies obedience to God, the Creator of the Universe. One of its main beauties is that it acknowledges the complete perfection,
Islam's timeless and beautiful message is the same message of all Prophets, including Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad (peace be upon them all). They all called their people to “Submit to the One True God” which, in Arabic, means to become a “Muslim”. This submission to God; Islam, enables one to fulfil the purpose of life by acknowledging the greatness of God and sincerely worshipping him alone.
God is One and Unique:
*.God has no partners, no equals and no rivals.
*.God has no father, mother, sons, daughters or wives.
* God alone is worthy of all worship.God is the All-Powerful.
*.God has full authority and power over all things.
*.Obedience to God does not increase His Power, nor does disobedience decrease His power.God is the Most High.
*.There is nothing above or comparable to God.
*.The attributes of God do not resemble that of His creation.
*.No part of God is present in anyone or anything.God is Perfect:
*.God does not have any human limitations, such as resting on the seventh day after He created the universe.
*.God always maintains attributes of perfection and does not do anything to compromise this perfection such as “becoming a man” as claimed by other religions. God does not do ungodly acts, so if God became man and took on human attributes, he would, necessarily, no longer be God.
[/b]

dijam:
Alhamdulillah I am a muslim and I am very happy to be one. Christians pls where did Jesus say "I am your Lord and savior"? What has jesus done that has not been done before for him to be classified as Lord? I think Jesus and Moses have the same God, are you people saying God did not ask Moses and prophets before to fight wars, what changed about that God? Pls answer with proof and sincerity

mustymatic:
My brother no Christian will remain on earth alive forever, that's a fact, there's no hypocrisy and lies in Islam, All prophets and people will all die, Jesus will descend to and all the disbelivers will believe him a messenger of God, and he will die too. Malvisguy212 you will also die!

mustymatic:
Hehe, Jesus practised Islam,
No Paul no Christianity indeed

Rilwayne001:
Lool..Its like this 'No Paul, no christianity'.

PastorAIO:
Somehow I don't see atheists complaining to God for anything. By very definition of Atheist I imagine that they'll try an infinite number of other measures before they resort to complaining to God.


I have absolutely no idea how you can understand that from anything I said. I've said no such thing.



I neither said eliminate the idea of God. I said that Morality is no evidence for the existence of God. This has no bearing on whether or not I believe in the existence of God.

what about Moral Value? Please explain. What about it?

this world isn't just divided up into christian, muslim, or atheist. I believe a great variety of things.

PastorAIO:
Why must morality be objectively binding and true?




If that is your problem then you'll have to find a way to get over it, but not by inventing some fictitious god to buttress what is patently obvious to all to be nothing but your own personal bias.

PastorAIO:
Let me repeat this point:

Morality is instinctive in humans AND Morality can be explained by the Theory of Evolution without recourse to a God.

PastorAIO:
What is the distinction between Supernatural and Natural. I believe that those are terms that you are using without any definition or clear idea of what you mean by them.

mustymatic:
Yeah that's right.

PastorAIO:
I said don't worry about that Good and Evil part. We are discussing Morality are we not.

-So far we have concluded that Gentiles have Morality written on their hearts.

-According to Jeremiah the Jews didn't even have an innate Morality.

-Morality manifests variously in different peoples.

-I then claimed that Morality can be explained without recourse to a Moral law giver. Specifically, The Theory of Evolution can account for Morality.

This is where we have to continue from.

PastorAIO:
No, Actually it is a promise that one day it will be written on their hearts. Paul on the other hand admits that the Gentiles have always had the law written on their hearts.

menesheh:
I've written a thread about this similar topic before but in a more different intonation to this one.

There is this saying, 'extraordinary claims requires extraordinary evidence'
Since the evidence for the existence of god and its claims is not strong enough and scientific findings are continuously going against stuffs writen in various holy books like the bible.

Should we use faith to accept that god exists and also accept various divine claims written in those holy books or should we rather do away with those stuffs, change our presuppositions and embrace scientific facts with evidence and proofs?


Faith is a feeling, conviction, or belief that something is true or real, not contingent upon reason or justification. Believing a proposition when there is no evidence in support of.
It is confidence or trust in a person or thing or a belief not based on proof. It may also refer to a particular system of religious belief.

Scientific evidence is evidence which serves to either support or counter a scientific theory or hypothesis. Such evidence is expected to be empirical evidence and interpretation in accordance with scientific method. Standards for scientific evidence vary according to the field of inquiry, but the strength of scientific evidence is generally based on the results of statistical analysis and the strength of scientific controls.


MuttleyLaff
malvisguy212
nobilis
winner01
CaptainJune

PastorAIO:
This one is more than circular, it loops and dives and 'boomerangs' upon itself in a variety of ways.

1) From the very start, you have God right there in the premises. 'God created everything'.

2) Why bother with the evil part. why not just say, God created Good and there are good things in the world so therefore God exists. The evil part is an extra appendage.

3) Evil is not a thing, and neither is Good. It is a functional state of things. Both are. A knife chopping vegetables for dinner is good for the diners. a knife stuck in someone's gut is evil. Good and evil functions can be found for just about any object. None of these suggest the existence of God in the slightest.

4)The idea of evil as a lack of deficiency of good is Rubbish. when a knife is slicing your guts nothing in the knife is deficient. The knife remains intact. Rather Good and Evil are interwoven like Yin and Yang. They are two sides of a single coin. You cannot say one side is based on the other side. The nonexistence of one is also the nonexistence of the other. There is no such thing as UP if there is no such thing as DOWN.

PastorAIO:
Now to put the lie to that unorthodoxy that Paul wrote....

It would seem that God favoured the Gentiles more than the Jews in regard to this his moral law. Why?

Well he said this to them through Jeremiah:


For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

So the gentiles had the law of God written on their hearts which the Jews didn't so they had to be given the written code and only promised the one written on the heart later. Why would God deprive his own people so? Unless someone is BS-ing us. Either Jeremiah or Paul.

Or maybe the Jews were so morally depraved that they didn't have access to the law on their hearts and so needed to get it in written form first.

Belvine33:
You are not frustrated, you're obsessed. Let it go! You don't know anything about Islam or the Holy Qur'an. You come here posting fake things you got from the internet claiming you know the Qur'an. Do you read Arabic? If no you've not read the holy Qur'an. Face your religion, people being muslims should not upset you.

Teekrayne:
........ Yes I am!

Teekrayne:
...... What verse of the Quran used plurality for Allah?

Teekrayne:
...... "Our" and "us"....... I vehemently disagree! The usage of "us" and "our" does not justify the fact that God is not one!

Teekrayne:
......... But you agree that he is/was a mere Messenger/servant and not God sir?

Teekrayne:
....... How can God(the unseen) have more than one personality It would be impossible for any part of God, even if incarnate, to decompose in any way and still be regarded as God! The everlasting, one God, in whole or in part, does not die, change, disintegrate or decompose; ...................................... See what the book of (Malachi 3 vs 6) says " For I the lord do not change"........

Teekrayne:
..... Now I am convinced that you have read the post.... It might be a typographical error. No one is above mistake!! I meant to post what Muhammad(SAW) said. I don't write, I type! Remember How come I didn't notice? And even the person I posted it to didn't bother to call my attention, to show that some do not really mean to objectively debate with you. They just do it to say trash and provoke the "animal" in someone. Anyways, thanks for calling my attention to it. Perhaps in the process of explaining, I might have derailed, posted before realising that there are errors. May God be with us all.

Teekrayne:
...... With utmost respect, it would be wrongly wrong for you to say that Jesus is God as the bible refutes this. Besides, we all know Jesus was/is a human. The book of (Numbers 23 vs 19) says.... "God is not a Man".... The book of (Hosea 11 vs 9) says.. "For I am God, and not a man. Read up (John 8 vs 40), (Acts 2 vs 22) and get it right..... If you claim that Jesus is God and the HOLY BIBLE says a different thing, then there are limpid contradictory verses in the bible( with due obeisance)..... I mean no harm. We are only trying to learn from one another

malvisguy212:
THE QURAN GIVES AUTHORITY OF THE BIBLE:
The Qur’an, itself, the highest authority
for all Muslims, gives authority to the
Bible, assuming its authenticity at least
up to the seventh-ninth Centuries.
Consider the following Suras:

Surah 2:136 points out that there
is no difference between the scriptures
which preceded and those of the Qur’an,
saying, “ …the revelation given to us…and
Jesus…we make no difference between
one and another of them .”

Surah 3:2-3 continues, “Allah…He sent
down the Law (of Moses) and the Gospel
(of Jesus)…as a guide to mankind .” Sura
h 4:136 carries this farther by
admonishing the Muslims to, “ …Believe…
and the scripture which He sent before
him .” In Surah 5:47,49,50,52 we
find a direct call to Christians to believe
in their scriptures:
“ …We sent Jesus, the
son of Mary, confirming the Law that had
come before him. We sent him the
Gospel… Let the people of the Gospel
judge by what Allah hath revealed
therein, if any do fail to judge by the
light of what Allah hath revealed, they
are (no better than) those who rebel…”

Again, in Surah 5:68 we find a
similar call:
“People of the Book!…Stand
fast by the law, the Gospel, and all
revelation that hath come to you from
YOUR LORD. It is the revelation that has
come to thee from THY LORD.”
To embolden this idea of the New and
Old Testament’s authority we find in Surah
10:94 that Muslims are advised to confer
with these scriptures if in doubt about
their own, saying: “If thou wert in doubt
as to what We have revealed unto thee,
then ask those who have been reading
the Book from before thee. The truth had
indeed come to thee from thy Lord .” And
as if to emphasize this point the advice is
repeated in Surah 21:7, stating;
“ …the
apostles We sent were but men, to whom
We granted inspiration. If ye realize this
not, Ask of those who possess the
message .”

Finally, in Surah 29:46 Muslims
are asked not to question the authority
of the scriptures of the Christians, saying;

“And dispute ye not with the people of
the book but say: We believe in the
revelation which has come down to us
and that which came down to you.”

If there is anything in these Suras which
is clear,it is that the Quran emphatically
endorses the Torah and the Gospel as
authentic and authoritative revelations
from God. This coincides with what
Christians believe, as well.
In fact, nowhere is there any warning in
the Qur’an that the former scriptures had
been corrupted, nor that they were
contradictory. If the Qur’an was indeed
the final and complete revelation, if it
was the seal of all former revelations the
Muslims claim, than certainly the author
of the Qur’an would have included a
warning against that which had been
corrupted in the earlier scriptures. But
nowhere do we find even a hint that the
Bible was contradictory, or indeed that it
was corrupted.


WHY WILL A FINAL REVELATION NOT GIVE WARNING OF THE CORRUPTION OF THE FORMER REVELATION?

Teekrayne:
......... Am grateful. Also, why do some Christians refer to Jesus(Pbuh) as "our lord Jesus"? Is Jesus(Pbuh) a servant or a God or Son of God I anticipate your response

Teekrayne:
.......... Go through the content of my post again before you ask me that question.

Teekrayne:
........ Sir, what is the stand of the holy bible as regards the number of GOD? Do we have only ONE God or we have God the father, the son and the holy spirit? Am I asking to much sir?

Teekrayne:
................. Its not a mandate you accept!!! You asked me to defend the "error" according to you and I did! I am not trying to convince you here, I did exactly what you asked me to do.................................................... The words "sister", "brother", "son" and "daughter" in Arabic usage have very wide connotations. On this basis itself, modern day Western scholarship has rejected the claim of "confusion" between the two Marys, i.e., Mary, mother of Jesus, and Miriam, sister of Moses and Aaron........................................................................... For example, A. J. Wensinck writing in the Encyclopaedia Of Islam says:

"Maryam is called a sister of Hārūn (sūra XIX, 29), and the use of these three names ‘Imrān, Hārūn and Maryam, has lead to the supposition that the Kur'ān does not clearly distinguished between the two Maryams, of the Old and the New Testaments. The Kur'ān names two families as being especially chosen: those of Ibrāhim and of ‘Imrān (sūra III, 32). It is the family of ‘Imrān, important because of Moses and Aaron, to which Maryam belongs. IT IS NOT NECESSARY TO ASSUME THAT THESE KINSHIP LINKS ARE TO INTERPRETED IN MODERN TERM. THE WORDS "SISTER" and "DAUGHTER", like their male counterparts, in Arabic usage can indicate extended kinship, descendance or spiritual affinity.................. This second ‘Imrān, together with Harun, can be taken as purely Kur'ānic...................... Muslim tradition is clear that there are eighteen centuries between the Biblical ‘Amram and the father of Maryam. ................................................................................................................................................................. The controversy surrounding the honorary epithet “Sister of Aaron” applied to Mary, mother of Jesus, in the Qur'an, has been a characteristic of Muslim-Christian dialogue from the very beginning of the Prophet’s mission. The Christians of Najran queried the use of this epithet, suggesting the Qur'an had confused Mary, mother of Jesus with Mary, sister of Aaron and Moses. This observation developed polemical overtones beginning in the 9th century in the form of Nicetas of Byzantium's trenchant criticisms and general Anti-Islam polemic.

Believing the Qur'an was simply a hodgepodge of Jewish and Christian texts, Western scholarship continued to transmit this alleged historical contradiction until recent times, where a balanced and fair look at the relevant texts shows no such anachronism exists. Though descriptions such as ‘Children of Adam’, ‘Children of Israel’, ‘mother of’ ‘brother of’, ‘sister of’, ‘son of’, etc., may presuppose direct physical consanguinity, they cannot in all instances be understood as such, without imposing a patently absurd, nonsensical understanding of the text...... May God help us all

dolphinheart:
The scriptures made us to understand that there are many gods, a god is anything that you give might and veneration you can read psalms 86:8 and 1cor :5,6.

But it also tells us which god is the true god, our father the almighty and our creator. Psalms 96:5
His name is jehovah/ yaweh .

So despite the fact that there are many gods, we have only one true god who jesus Christ prayed to in john 17:3 . This true god is the one Christians worship , this true god is the one who sent jesus to use to be our messiah and savior. This same god is the one jesus referred to when he told Mary that he has not yet "ascended to my god and your god".

No where in the bible is jesus or the holy spirit called almighty gods or is equality to almighty god attached to them . There is no "god the father, god the son, god the holy spirit" statement in the bible.

No you have not asked too much .