₦airaland Forum

plainbibletruth:
Tell us these:
1. Where did the Quran give the genealogy of Mary?
2. Where is it in that Quran passage that:
" after the Angels have already given her the news and were not present she then prayed to Allah after she got curious and an angel was sent."!
3. If, like you said about the Quran:
"no one knows its [true] interpretation except Allah"
How do you now KNOW whether this your INTERPRETATION is "true"?

In a bid to confuse issues you run from the Quran to the Bible but still claim the same Bible you quote is not quite right. 
Why not stick to the Quran and let's see the sense it would make. 

Do you see how you're starting to tie yourself up in knots?

We are beginning to see who the real jester is! 
Aren't we?

NO muslim will answer this, instead they will insult you. Nice one friend.

RagnarLodbrok:
Uhhmmm! Actually, the explanation is the same, the prophet gave a straight forward answer but you gits seem to always want a further elaboration, hence the need to explain it to you.

I bear witness that none has the right to be worshipped except Allah, alone, without partner, and I bear witness that Muhammad is His slave and Messenger.

Jesus was also a slave and a messenger, BTW.

let me repeat myself again, NO were in the bible,Jewish scripture or any other religious book, they refer the old saint's as sister and brother, if there is , bring it let see.

Demmzy15:
Stop acting dumb and look at the pictures!

smh

RagnarLodbrok:
First verse in the sequence, clearly this speaks on Angels giving good tidings to Mary, does it not?



Continuation of the good tidings from Angels.


Now here you claimed she was having a discussion with the Angel, lol! When did the Angel become her lord? Obviously he isn't, and if they were having a discussion, why didn't she address him? This is because it was after the Angels have already given her the news and were not present she then prayed to Allah after she got curious and an angel was sent.

Again it's quite simple really

I now see your confusion!!! Why Mary called the angel LORD ? That was the first time Mary saw an angel , it must be new to her , take for instance when Moses saw the Glory of God and he thought he had seen God face to face.

Demmzy15:
I didn't just bring up the definition from my head, I gave proofs. "Masjid" means "place of prostration". Read my posts again, stop deluding yourself. I guess you're shocked that a Muslim could have replied you right?!

yes, masjid is a place of worship and Al-asqa is the building located in Jerusalem.

RagnarLodbrok:
Haha.

better you stay mute than to tell lies.

RagnarLodbrok:
Note: she wasn't called sister of Moses, she was called sister of Aaron. Obviously due to the connection I pointed out below, I'm sure every sane person gets it now. Let malvis wallow in his shame and self hatred.

you have NO idea what you are saying here, as a matter of fact, when the christians in nijran ask muhammed why he called Mary sister of Aaron ? The answer given by muhammed is even different from what you are saying, muhammed say the people called refers there saint's as "sister" and "brother" but here you are saying different thing . Who are we to believe ? However, there is NO were saint's are reffere to sister or brother, they were only called by SON and DAUGHTER. Your lies is soo embarrassing, are you sure you are a muslim?

RagnarLodbrok:
Loooool! Then it's simple, is masjid a place or a building? Give me a straight forward answer.

ok masjid is not a building, what about Al-asqa mosque ? Not a building right ? Keep on believing in lies.

RagnarLodbrok:
It's called faith. Christians wouldn't understand.

offcorse christians don't know this because the bible does not teach blind faith.

Demmzy15:
Mosque in Arabic is known as 'Masjid' which can be translated as "place of prostration" So when you hear the word 'Masjid' it doesn't necessarily mean a building with a dome! The Prophet also made mention of something similar when he said the earth as a whole is a Masjid for him(hadith #323 in Sahih al-Bukhari).


Correct!


Any place on the earth is a masjid for Muslims. Therefore, whether there was a building or not when the Prophet made his heavenly trip, it is the location of the "Farthest Mosque" that is intended by the verse and not a building per se because the location where it lies was blessed by God as mentioned in verse 17:1 "the Farthest Mosque, whose precincts We did bless".

Imam Ibn Hajar confirms this opinion in Fath al-Bari (his commentary on Sahih al-Bukhari):

[b](the earth has been made for me a "masjid"
means a place for prostration, i.e., prostration is not restricted to any particular place of the earth. It may also be a metaphor of a construction built for prayer. This is due to the fact that once prayer is authorized everywhere on earth it becomes like a mosque for that purpose. Ibn al-Tin said: "The earth has been made for me a masjid and a means of purification" both were given to the Prophet, peace be upon him, while it was only a place for worship for others and was not a means of purification, because Jesus used to walk around and pray whenever prayer was due. Al-Dawudi said likewise before him. It was also said that they [the previous generations] were authorized to perform prayer in places known for sure to be pure, whereas this ummah is authorized to pray anywhere on earth except in the places known for sure to be impure. The strongest opinion is that of al-Khattabi who says that earlier nations were authorized to perform prayer in special places like synagogues and churches. This is confirmed by the wording of the narration of Ibn Shu`ayb "And before me people prayed in their churches." This is a controversial[?] wording but the specificity was established [??]. This is supported by the narration of al-Bazzar from the hadith of Ibn `Abbas similar to the present hadith which includes "Prophets did not pray until they reached their chamber".[/b]

The building you're referring to that was built after the Prophet's death is called 'Dome Of The Rock' and I attach some photos below. I also attached photos of 'Masjids' in occupied Palestine!

masjid is mosque in English, And the quranic verse I provide indicate
the name of the masjid (mosque) is al-
asqa mosque , the al-asqa mosque was not build as at that time.

vedaxcool:
No, he begged God to forgive. . . Father forgive them . . . Jesus was no more than a messenger of Allah, didnt Jesus say by myself I can do nothing? Or do you people select verses from the bible that soothes ur sore throat?

Jesus has TWO nature, fully God and
Fully man , God did not override the
nature of christ , CHRIST is MAN, there
are things which are not allowed to
revealed to the human nature of christ .
The eternal Son, as God, by his
omniscience, and as man, by knowledge
imparted to him, knows perfectly the day
and the hour of the future judgment. But
Christ as MAN , and as the MESSENGER
from God to men, did not so know it as to
be able to reveal it to men. The
ambassador.

MizJanet:
Lol , point out the bible that said 'david go to heaven ' ? None

Take this :

" david died and was buried , but david did not went to heaven" Act 2:29 and 34

You can argue with your bible .

not only David, all the rest did not go to heaven first, Hebrew 11:32-33 were mentioning the men of faith:

Hebrew11:32-33
And what more shall I say? I do not
have time to tell about Gideon, Barak,
Samson and Jephthah, about David and
Samuel and the prophets, 33 who
through faith conquered kingdoms,
administered justice, and gained what
was promised; who shut the mouths of
lions


Hebrew 11:38-39
the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and
mountains, living in caves and in holes in the ground.
39 These were all commended for their
faith, YET none of them received what
had been promised,

Since the promise is yet to be fullfiled , they did not went to heaven first, here what verse 40 say:

40 since God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect.

In other word , now that the promise has been fullfiled " TOGETHER WITH US"
We will be made perfect with them (old testament prophet) since they can
only be perfected in heaven.

And also,Jesus did not go to the bosom of Abraham and the scriptures do say they were set free(after the ressurection of Jesus) psalm 68:18 and Ephesians 4:8 .

plainbibletruth:
Where did the Quran state this your sequence dummy?

The events have taken the following sequences:

First:
the angels went to Mary 

Then:
 Mary started wondering and prayed 

[Note: Here she didn't ask the angels but she prayed and asked Allah. 
This means that the Angels have already gone. If the Angels were still
there then why she didn't ask them.?] whose footnote us this; yours or the Quran's? So you have craftily created A GAP between verses 45 and 47: angels were talking to Mary but according to you she never asked the angels what bothered her about their message. Was it out of fear or what? Maybe your 'creative' mind should tell us. 

Even though it's not there in the Quran you also added this:
So, after she prayed and asked Allah sent one angel to Mary to give her His answer in the second part of verse (3:47) "… 

Finally:
After a period of time Allah  sent the angel Gabriel to grant her a pure child. This is in verse (19:19).

Clap for yourself, dummy!

the guy is not making sense at All.

RagnarLodbrok:
There is a very simple explanation, which can be understood from the Qur'an.

The events have taken the following sequences:

First:
Allah (swt) sent the angels to tell Mary (p) about the glad tidings. This
is in verse (3:45).


Then:
After the Angels left Mary (p) she started wondering and prayed to Allah
(swt) asking Him in the first part of verse (3:47): "O my Lord!, How shall
I have a son when no man has touched me…"

Note: Here she didn't ask the angels but she prayed and asked Allah (swt).
This means that the Angels have already gone. If the Angels were still
there then why she didn't ask them.?

So, after she prayed and asked Allah(swt), Allah (swt) sent one angel to
Mary (p) to give her His answer in the second part of verse (3:47) "… He
said: So (it will be) for Allah creats what He wills. When He has decreed
something, He says to it only:"Be!"- and it is."


Finally:
After a period of time Allah (swt) sent his messenger, the angel Gabriel
(p), to grant her a pure child. This is in verse (19:19).

In this time she didn't ask Allah as in verse (3:47), but she asked the
Angel Gabriel (p) because he was in front of her and she was afraid from
him: " How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, nor am I
unchaste?" ,verse (19:20)

The angel answered her as mentioned in verse (19:21).

Isn't this a simple explanation? Clown!

you mean, when the angel told Mary she will have a son , the angel LEFT and leter Mary ask "how can this be "? You are a liar, and a twister.

Surah 3:45-47: Behold! the angels
said: “O Mary! God giveth thee glad
tidings of a Word from Him: his name
will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary,
held in honour in this world and the
Hereafter and of (the company of)
those nearest to God…She said: “O
my Lord! How shall I have a son
when no man hath touched me?” He
said: “Even so: God createth what He
willeth: When He hath decreed a
plan, He but saith to it, ‘Be,’ and it is!
(Yusuf Ali)

Mary and the angel was having a conversation here , the angel did not left , every question she asked , she was given a direct answer straight away.

RagnarLodbrok:
Why Quran calls Mary, a Sister of Aaron ?
The verse in question is;

"O sister of Aaron! Thy father was not a man of evil, nor thy mother a woman unchaste!" (Al-Qur’an 19:28)

It does not mean that here Qur’an calls Mary, the real sister of Aaron, the Prophet who was hundreds of years before her. Here she is only being called a female person of the family, from the Noble lineage of Prophet Aaron.

The Qur’anic usage:


In order to understand Qur’anic language one must look into other Qur’anic passages.

Qur’ans calls Prophet Shoaib as the brother of the people of Midian. Qur’an says;

“And unto Midian (We sent) their brother, Shu'eyb." (Al-Qur’an 7:85)

And similarly Qur’an calls Prophet Salih, the brother of the people of Thamud. It says;

"And unto Thamud (We sent) their brother Salih." (Al-Qur’an 11:61)

In both these examples it is never meant that the Prophets were the real brothers of the each and every person of that tribe. It’s only way to address them. It means that Shu'aib was a (male) person from the people of Midian and similarly Salih from the people of Thamud.

So in the very same manner when Qur’an describes Mary, the mother of Christ as 'Sister of Aaron', It means that she is being referred to as a (female) person from the people, the lineage of Prophet Aaron.
This is infact an Arabic idiom, a way to address. In Arabia a person from the tribe Banu Mudhar may be addressed as Ya Akha Mudhar, meaning 'O the brother of Mudhar'.

The Prophetic answer to this question:

Mughira b. Shu'ba reported: When I came to Najran, they (the Christians of Najran) asked me: You read" O sister of Aaron", whereas Moses was born much before Jesus. When I came back to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) I asked him about that, whereupon he said: “The (people of the old age) used to call names (of their persons) after the names of the Prophets and pious persons who had gone before them.” (Sahih Muslim, Book on General Behaviour, Hadith 3962)

The Holy Prophet (PBUH) meant to say that Mary’s relationship with Prophet Aaron was mentioned because she was of his lineage for among Semites it was common to associate a person with his lineage.

This fits the context as well. The people thought that Mary had done something unworthy of a chaste woman and thus as they rebuked her, they first made a reference to her noble ancestry and then testified that even her own father was no wicked person (verse 28).

Observations from the Bible:

1- One thing we need to consider is that Qur’an does not call Mary ‘Sister of Moses’ but ‘Sister of Aaron’.

2- Aaron (PBUH) we know was the first in line for the Israelite priesthood.

3- New Testament clearly tells us that Elizabeth, the mother of John the Baptist (PBUH) was from the lineage of Aaron (Luke 1:5). Also it tells that Mary was a cousin of Elizabeth (1:36). Therefore we can easily call them both ‘Sisters of Aaron’ i.e. from the lineage of Aaron.

4- Infact we have evidence of the similar usage from the Bible. In Genesis 13:8 Abraham and Lot are called brothers while certainly they did not come from loins of one individual. It reads;

“And Abram said unto Lot, Let there be no strife, I pray thee, between me and thee, and between my herdmen and thy herdmen; for we be brethren.”

A certain Christian commentator, Adam Clarke says in his commentary to this verse;


‘[It means] we are of the same family, worship the same God in the same way, have the same promises, and look for the same end.’

Was the same not true in case of Mary and Aaron? Were they both not from the same priestly family and of same faith?

So the conclusion is that this is only a beautiful way of expression in the Arabic language and to try to twist it some other way speaks only of ones inner wickedness and that’s all!

INDEED ALLAH KNOWS THE BEST!

you failed woefully, you say the Arab knew the meaning of the ïdiom used in that verse ? The Arab christians understand there scripture very well , and the reason they question muhammed was that the knew people of the old never called saint's "sister" or "brother" the saints were only called "SON" and "DAUGHTERS" the christians in najran knew this hence the question given to muhammed followers. If there should be a place were this idiom is used, its got to be in the bible , but there is NO place in the bible the new tastament called the old testament saint's "sister" or "brother" NEVER. When the NT refers to people being called after saints of old, it calls them, "son" or "daughter". Jesus is called "son of David" in Matthew 21:9, and Elizabeth
is called, "daughter of Aaron" in Luke 1:5, etc. Abraham is referred to as "father" by the Jews in John 8:38. But never are these people called, "brothers or sisters" after any of the previous saints. There's an America organisation called DAUGHTER OF REVELATION


I'll also note that Aaron is mentioned
about 20 times in the Quran. Only Mary
is called "sister of Aaron" after him.
Moses is mentioned I would say about
150 times, more or less. In no instance, is anyone called, "brother or sister of
Moses" metaphorically.

you this man , you are one of the most bias muslim here. Masjid is an Arabic word which means mosque in the English language.A masjid is a place where Muslims perform prayers and worship Allah . http://www.linktoislam.net/islamic-articles/article.aspx?id=1

And the quranic verse I provide indicate the name of the masjid (mosque) is al-asqa mosque .

malvisguy212:
God bless you my brother, here is another one:
the Quran claims that one night, God took Muhammad to the "al- Aqsa" mosque is in Jerusalem:
"Exalted is He who took His Servant by
night from al-Masjid al-Haram to al-
Masjid al-Aqsa, whose surroundings
We have blessed, to show him of Our
signs. Indeed, He is the Hearing, the
Seeing." - Quran 17:1
The Muslim army conquered Jerusalem
in 637 AD and the al-Aqsa mosque was
completed in 705 AD. The problem with
the above passage in the Quran is that
Muhammad died in 632 AD, which was 5years before the Muslim army reached
Jerusalem and 73 years before the al-
Aqsa mosque was built.

RagnarLodbrok:
Malvis, I've always known you were a foool but this, lol! This is far beyond even you,

Masjid is not a building dumbo. Why didn't you ask the same question when muslims used to use the aqsa as their qiblah?

Malvis is assuming that a Masjid (سجود) is a structure or building with four walls and a roof. This is incorrect thinking, as a Masjid is a place where sujood (سجود), where prostration occurs.

Therefore, as we can see, there is no need for a physical building to be present for an area to be considered a Masjid. Summarily, any place in which sujood/ prostration is done can be called a Masjid. This is also similar to the word Church (ἐκκλησίαν), which merely means the place of an “assembly or congregation”,
and not particularly four walls, a roof and a bell tower. The individual who brings forward such an argument would therefore have to be greatly ignorant of Islam, and is merely seeking to conjure a straw man argument (a fallacious argument) by attempting to present an anachronistic error in Islamic teachings.

^^^ read it again .

RagnarLodbrok:
Quran 3:7

{Sahih International
It is He who has sent down to you, [O Muhammad], the Book; in it are verses [that are] precise - they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those in whose hearts is deviation [from truth], they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking an interpretation [suitable to them]. And no one knows its [true] interpretation except Allah . But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All [of it] is from our Lord." And no one will be reminded except those of understanding.}

the quran is a joke indeed, "NO one knows its true interpretation except Allan" then what the points of sending the book ? How can they know the truth if know one can no the true interpretation? " But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it." how can you believe in what you have no knowledge of ?

MizJanet:

Lol , wetin Janet no go hear for nairaland

Reply to your writeup :

1. NONE of the bible verse u gave said babies go to heaven .

2. If the bible God knows that babies dont know good from bad , why did he send Saul to kill all the little babies and sucklings of the Amalekites ? Why ?

3. Since u deduce that babies go to heaven , how can jesus claim that no man has ascend to heaven since many human babies are there ? John chapter 3 vs 13

you are not truthful, let me quote the verse again:

2 Samuel 12:23 that “now that he
is dead, why should I go on fasting? Can I bring him back again? I will go to him,
but he will not return to me.”

Here, the child died and David say ,"the child cannot return to me "because he (the child) is dead , but David say "I will go to him" the only thing we need to know is this " where is David,heaven or hell ?

David is in heaven is clear from
Hebrews 11:32-40. David is named in
verse 32 with other faith heroes. Then in verse 40 it says, "together with us would they be made perfect" (since they can only be perfected in heaven).

So when David say He will go to him ( the child) this indicate the child is in heaven . Accepts it or not , I reply you because of thoes you want to deceive.

plainbibletruth:
Indeed this is one of the several areas in the book that is said to have descended from heaven and still has the original in heaven; where well known historical facts were muddled up. 

Mary is said In sura 3:35-41 to be the sister of Aaron; having been given birth to by Amram's (Imram) wife who is the mother of Aaron and Moses. This is a disaster to Islam. Aaron and Moses his brother died over 1,000 years before Mary the mother of Jesus was born! 

The truth of the matter is that whoever wrote this part of the Quran mixed up the "Miriam" or "Mariam" sister of Aaron and Moses with the "Mary" the mother of Jesus whose name can also be called "Mariam". 

So, who made the mistake, Allah or Mohammed? This is a big question that awaits answers. 

Also, the Quran says Mary and Zachariah were present in the sanctuary when the prophecy about John was given. The truth is that      1. Mary and Zachariah did not live in the same town. 
2. Zachariah received the message about John and his wife was already pregnant for six months before Mary heard about it at all. 
3. It was after this that Mary visited Zachariah's house in Judah to spend 3 months with his wife, Elizabeth who was Mary's relative. 
4. Mary had already conceived before this trip to Zachariah's house. 

The Quran even contradicts itself as to how many angels visited Zachariah/Mary. Was it one or many? Sura 3:35-42 says "angels" but sura 19:17 says "our angel" (singular) appeared before Mary "as a man in all respects". 

Actually, one Jewish book of fables - The Protevangelion's James the Lesser -written before Mohammed around third century A. D. had all these tales. But Jews and Christians could differentiate between their scripture and folktales. Apparently the writer of this part of the Quran couldn't. This is one of the calamities of the book. 

God bless you my brother, here is another one:

the Quran claims that one night, God took Muhammad to the "al- Aqsa" mosque is in Jerusalem:

"Exalted is He who took His Servant by
night from al-Masjid al-Haram to al-
Masjid al-Aqsa, whose surroundings
We have blessed, to show him of Our
signs. Indeed, He is the Hearing, the
Seeing." - Quran 17:1

The Muslim army conquered Jerusalem
in 637 AD and the al-Aqsa mosque was
completed in 705 AD. The problem with
the above passage in the Quran is that
Muhammad died in 632 AD, which was 5years before the Muslim army reached
Jerusalem and 73 years before the al-
Aqsa mosque was built.

MightySparrow:
I go with that of Al ~ Koran. It talks about miracle of Allah

the quran is a joke.

[quote author=DJ2HOT post=35691094][/quote]ezeauditore . What do you have to say here ?

MizJanet:
Lol , old testament saints went to heaven without jesus dyin for their sins , that shows how useless the death of your jesus is .

@ underlined , lie ' David did not went to the heavens' Act 2:34

you are not a lady, you are a man.

INTROVERT:
Was Mary.

thank you for the correction.

The Bible gives a good idea but not an
exact number of years on how old Mary
was when she gave birth to Jesus. the
onset of menstruation - during her
teenage years, and the wording in the
Bible points to this range:

Luke 1:26-34
"Now in the sixth month the angel
Gabriel was sent by God to a city of
Galilee named Nazareth, to a virgin
BETROTHED TO A MAN whose name was Joseph, of the house of David. The
virgin’s name was Mary. And having
come in, the angel said to her,
“Rejoice, highly favored one, the Lord
is with you; blessed are you AMONG
WOMEN!” But when she saw him, she
was troubled at his saying, and
considered what manner of greeting
this was. Then the angel said to her,
“Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have
found favor with God. And behold, you
will conceive in your womb and bring
forth a Son, and shall call His name
Jesus. He will be great, and will be
called the Son of the Highest; and the
Lord God will give Him the throne of
His father David. And He will reign
over the house of Jacob forever, and of
His kingdom there will be no end.”
Then Mary said to the angel, “How can
this be, since I do NOT KNOW A MAN?”

She is called a "VIRGIN," but also "AMONG WOMEN." When Gabriel announces her impending conception, she already is "BETROTHED TO A MAN " and expresses knowledge of the need for sexual intercourse to conceive: “How can this be, since I do not know a man?”
According to the Bible, Mary was a teenager.

But according to the Quran, Mary was about 1,500 years old.

Quran 19:27-28
"Then she brought [Jesus] to her people, carrying him. They said, "O Mary, you have certainly done a thing unprecedented. O SISTER OF ARRON, your father was not a man of evil, nor was your mother unchaste." -

Quran 66:12
"And Mary, the DAUGHTER OF IMRAN , who guarded her chastity, and We breathed into (her body) of our spirit; and she believed in the words of her Lord and of His revelations, and was of the devoutly obedient."

But the Mary who is the "daughter of
Imran" (spelled "Amram" in the Bible)
and the "sister of Aaron" was the sister
of Moses who lived in the 15th century
BC:

Numbers 26:59
"The name of Amram's wife was
Jochebed the daughter of Levi, who
was born to Levi in Egypt; and to
Amram she bore Aaron and Moses and
their sister Miriam."

Therefore, unless Mary was 1,500 years
old when she had Jesus - indeed, unless
Joseph married a 1,500 year old virgin -
Muhammad mistook two different
women in the Bible as the same.

Demmzy15
after I paste the two story for you, yet you still want to remain in deception ? There are soo many mistake muhammed made ,how about this.

For example, the Quran claims that one
night, God took Muhammad to the "al-
Aqsa" mosque is in Jerusalem:

"Exalted is He who took His Servant by
night from al-Masjid al-Haram to al-
Masjid al-Aqsa, whose surroundings
We have blessed, to show him of Our
signs. Indeed, He is the Hearing, the
Seeing." - Quran 17:1

The Muslim army conquered Jerusalem
in 637 AD and the al-Aqsa mosque was
completed in 705 AD. The problem with
the above passage in the Quran is that
Muhammad died in 632 AD, which was 5
years before the Muslim army reached
Jerusalem and 73 years before the al-
Aqsa mosque was built.

dsquare33:
This is an insightful analysis especially for those of us who are looking forward to the coming of Jesus Christ.I once heard this word of knowledge on the six day creation representing six thousand years before the millenial reign of our LORD.Thanks to the HolySpirit, you really dig deep.

remain bless

Rilwayne001:
Indeed, argueing with a fool will only make one foolish.
Hmmm...this quote comes to mind

' Never argue with an idiot.They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience' - George Carlin

Have a nice day malvis.

did you come straight and answer my question? I ask , did Jesus say worship Mary? All what you did was to quote from a catholic book which is NOT the word of Jesus. Go back and read the post of that first gentleman that comment, he make sense more than you.
Good night to you too.

MizJanet:
Are you a preacher of afterlife ? Kindly help answer that question cause your fellows have failed woefully .

1st Pastor : when i asked him , he replied " babies dont know sin, they are not sinners so what do u expect ? They will go to heaven "

GBAM! Do u realize that this pastor failed , I know you wont see his error because you also belive in afterlife . I wont use Logic to disprove him , I will use the bible . Open your bible to romans 5:12 and romans 3:23 it says " ALL have sinned" ! , ALL includin that baby is a sinner . So pastor prediction failed .


Pastor 2: when I asked him , he replied : " little babies are not born again , they have not confess&give their lives to Jesus , they are still siners , so I wont be suprised that those babies are going to Hellfire" !

GBAM ! I couldnt belive my ears , what a monster god who will even torture babies in fire for eternity , am suprised at his response which shows how religion could harden the heart of a man to say such .

Any other views ?

can baby knows that they are in a sinful state ? And only Jesus can saved them ? babies cannot possible discovered they have broken the law of God.the bible say our God is a just God ,God of mercy. Let me give you one example of God mercy.

In the old testament, when the isrealite angered God,God did not allow them to enter the promise land. Listen to what God says about the children in Deuteronomy 1:39,
“And the little ones that you said would be taken captive, your children who do NOT YET KNOW GOOD FROM BAD THEY WILL ENTER THE LAND . I will give it to them and they will take possession of it.”

Can it be any clearly than this ? If you are not satisfied, here is another example:

Isaiah 7:14-16 the prophet records this about Jesus:
“Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. He shall eat curds and honey when he knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good. For before the boy knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land whose two kings you dread will be deserted.”

Here, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, God has Isaiah record the fact that “before the boy knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good”
shows positive proof that the boy in
fact any boy or girl, can not know at a
young age about choosing to refuse good or evil.

Where do this babies go after death ?
Remember David and Bathsheba’s ? David lust over her and she bore a son (we all know the story ) so to cut it shot, the boy died , concerning the child after life , here what David say :

2 Samuel 12:23 “now that he is dead, why should I go on fasting? Can I
bring him back again? I WILL GO TO HIM , but he will NOT RETURN TO ME .”

Because the child could not return to David, he said that “I will go to him.” Since we know that David’s throne is to be established forever in the Kingdom of Heaven, David must be thinking ahead to that Kingdom and realize that he will see this child again someday.

Psalm 132:11 says, “The LORD has sworn to David, A truth from which He will not turn back; ‘Of the fruit of your body I will set upon your throne.”

Furthermore,David has been prophesied to reign in the future Kingdom, “to they will serve the Lord their God and David their king, whom I will raise up for them” (Jer 30:9).

So ALL BABIES GO TO HEAVEN BECAUSE THEY HAD NOT REACH THE AGE OF ACCOUNTABILITY.

Rilwayne001:
Where did Jesus command you to collect tithe? are catholic christians or not?

as they say "if a man answer a question with a question is just to avoid the question being asked"

What has tithe got to do with this thread ? Were did muhammed got the idea that christians worship Mary ?and you are talking about tithe. Smh

Rilwayne001:


[b] Well, you can save all these^ trash in your ass. I have stopped being the type of muslim that would validate the Quran with what was written in the buybull ever since you and plainbibletruth were bursted on this thread https://www.nairaland.com/2172133/question-did-jesus-read-bible/15 Like i said on the thread, I quote: "IT has often been said, that anything may be proved from the Bible, but before anything can be admitted as proved by the Bible, the Bible itself must be proved to be true; for if the Bible be not true, or the truth of it be doubtful, it ceases to have authority, and cannot be admitted as proof of anything." So, you will hardly see me validate anything from the buybull. You can engage me again on this by discussing with me the authenticity of the bible by either referrimg to that thread or starting a new thread here.

The only question I have for you here is that, why is it tthat this your god a.k.a Jesus have no idea when THE HOUR WOULD COME? [/b]

I reply this post but the mod hide it.

Jesus has TWO nature, fully God and
Fully man , God did not override the
nature of christ , CHRIST is MAN, there
are things which are not allowed to
revealed to the human nature of christ .
The eternal Son, as God, by his
omniscience, and as man, by knowledge
imparted to him, knows perfectly the day
and the hour of the future judgment. But
Christ as MAN , and as the MESSENGER
from God to men, did not so know it as to
be able to reveal it to men. The
ambassador, if he is asked
concerning the secret counsels of his
sovereign, may truly answer that he
knows them not so as to communicate
them to others. For as an ambassador he
only communicates those things which
are committed to him by his sovereign to
deliver, and not those things which he is
bidden to keep secret.

If you want to discuss if the bible or quran is the word of God , visit here https://www.nairaland.com/2381817/contradictions-analyzed-bible-quran

Jesus as a man did Not speak his word .
The inspired Word of God makes it
abundantly plain: The "good news" that
Jesus Christ brought was about the
KINGDOM OF GOD! The "gospel of Jesus
Christ" is simply the message of good
news that Jesus preached not a
message about Jesus.;
And Jesus went about all Galilee,
teaching in their synagogues,
preaching the gospel of the KINGDOM,
and healing all kinds of sickness and
all kinds of disease among the
people. ( Matthew 4:23)
» And Jesus went about all the cities
and villages, teaching in their
synagogues, preaching the gospel of
the KINGDOM, and healing every
sickness and every disease among the
people. ( Matthew 9:35)
» Now after John was put in prison,
Jesus came to Galilee, preaching the
gospel of the KINGDOM OF GOD, and
saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the
kingdom of God is at hand. Repent,
and believe in the gospel." (Mark
1:14-15)
» [Jesus] said to them, "I must preach
the KINGDOM OF GOD to the other cities
also, because for this purpose I have
been sent." ( Luke 4:43)
» Now it came to pass, afterward, that
[Jesus] went through every city and
village, preaching and bringing the
glad tidings [gospel] of the KINGDOM OF
GOD. (Luke 8:1)
» The law and the prophets were until
John. Since that time the KINGDOM OF
GOD has been preached, and everyone is
pressing into it. And it is easier for
heaven and earth to pass away than for
one tittle of the law to fail. ( Luke
16:16-17)
So you failed WOEFULLY!!!

Demmzy15:
This guy is damn dumb!!!

smh. here is one.

Quran 16:103-104
"We know indeed that they say "It is a
man that teaches him." The tongue of
him they wickedly point to is notable
foreign while this is Arabic pure and
clear. Those who believe not in the Signs of Allah, Allah will not guide them and theirs will be a grievous Penalty." (Yusef Ali's translation) [1]

Why did Muhammad's contemporaries
say that Muhammad borrowed from
other religions or fables? Why do today's scholars make the same exact charge? What is the basis of their accusations and statements? Do they have ground to stand on? I think they Do:

There is a passage in the quran that have it origin in Mishnah.here is it :
This passage is Sura 21:51-71.
The Mishnah passage is found in
Rabbah Genesis.
Here is the Quranic story:

Surah 21:51-71
We formerly bestowed guidance on
Abraham, for We knew him well. He said
to his father and to his people: "What are
these images to which you are so
devoted?" They replied: "They are the
gods our fathers worshipped." He said:
"Then you are your fathers are in the
grossest error." "Is this the truth that you
are preaching," they asked, "or is this but
a jest?" "Indeed," he answered, "Your
Lord is the Lord of the heavens and the
earth. It was He that made them: to this I
bear witness. By the Lord, I will
overthrow your idols as soon as you have
turned your backs." He broke them all in
pieces, except their supreme god, so that
they might return to him. "Who has done
this to our deities?" asked some. "He
must surely be a wicked man." Others
replied: "We have heard a youth called
Abraham speak of them." They said:
"then bring him here in sight of all the
people, that they may act as witnesses."
"Abraham," they said, "was it you who
did this to our deities?" "No," he replied.
"It was their chief who smote them. Ask
them, if they can speak." Thereupon they
turned their thoughts upon themselves
and said to each other: "Surely you are
the ones who have done
wrong." [Confounded as they were, they
said to Abraham:] "You know they cannot
speak." He answered: "Would you then
worship that, instead of God, which can
neither help nor harm you? Shame on
you and on your idols! Have you no
sense?" They cried: "Burn him and
avenge your gods, if you must punish
him!" "Fire," We said, "be cool to
Abraham and keep him safe."

Here is the quote from the Mishnah
Rabbah, Genesis (Noach) (CH 38:11-13)
Vol. 1, pp. 310 -311, Soncino Edition,
Soncino Press London, Editors Dr H
Freedman and Maurice Simon. [28]

13. AND HARAN DIED IN THE PRESENCE
OF HIS FATHER TERAH (XI,28). R Hiyya
said: Terah was a manufacturer of idols.
He once went away somewhere and left
Abraham to sell them in his place. A man
came and wished to buy one. 'How old
are you?' Abraham asked him 'Fifty years'
was the reply 'Woe to such a man!' he
exclaimed. 'You are fifty years old and
would worship a day old object!' At this
he became ashamed and departed.
On another occasion a woman came with
a plateful of flour and requested him,
'Take this and offer it to them.' So he took
a stick and broke them and put the stick
in the hand of the largest. When his
father returned he demanded, 'What
have you done to them?' 'I cannot
concealed it from you' he rejoined. "A
woman came with a plateful of fine meal
and requested me to offer it to them.
One claimed 'I must eat first' while
another claimed 'I must eat first'.
Thereupon the largest arose, took the
stick, and broke them." 'Why do you
make sport of me' he cried out; 'have
they any knowledge!' 'Should not your
ears listen to what your mouth is saying'
he retorted. Thereupon he seized him
and delivered him to Nimrod.
'Let us worship fire' he (Nimrod)
proposed. 'Let us rather worship water',
which extinguishes the fire' replied he.
'Then let us worship water!' ' Let us
rather worship the clouds which bear the
water.' 'The let us worship the clouds!'
'Let us rather worship the winds which
disperse the clouds' 'Let us worship the
wind!' 'Let us worship human beings,
who withstand the wind' 'You are just
bandying words' he exclaimed; 'We will
worship naught but fire. Behold, I will
cast you into it, and let the God whom
you adore come and save you from it.
Now Haran was standing there
undecided. If Abram is victorious, (he
thought), I will say that I am of Abram's
belief, while if Nimrod is victorious I will
say that I am on Nimrod's side. When
Abram descended into the fiery furnace
and was saved, he (Nimrod) asked him,
'of whose belief are you?' 'Of Abram's' he
replied. Thereupon he seized and cast
him into the fire; his inwards were
scorched and he died in his father's
presence. Hence it is written, AND
HARAN DIED IN THE PRESENCE OF ('AL
PENE) HIS FATHER TERAH.

Scholar8200:
Insightful analysis! However, I may not fully agree because of the clarity of Daniel's 70 weeks prophecy. The break between the 69th and 70th week, the church age/time of the Gentiles we are in now which will culminate with the rapture, is/was a mystery to OT prophets and may not be easily reconciled with your analysis. The rapture which will signal the end of the Church age and the commencement of the 70th week is a period the end of which is only known to the Father.

thank you my good friend.