₦airaland Forum

GeneralShepherd:
So God appeared from nothing . A being purportedly more complex that the whole universe, now if this God can exist without cause why can't the universe?

If the universe has always existed,
then time has always existed, for matter
has always existed and presumably was
not entirely inert (i.e. events would occur by which the passing of time could be measured). This implies that an infinite number of events have occurred prior to now, as there was an infinite time prior to now for them to occur.

Rilwayne001:
I will take the above as a YES i.e. According to the bible Ishmael was a child. now lemme quickly treat you guys of your ignorance.



Really?



From the bible



It was the bible that said so, i never claim the Quran said so.



Yes i keep wondering too how can an old woman put a 17year old boy to the back but lets read the bible together.

HOW OLD WAS ABRAHAM WHE ISHMAEL WAS BORN?
Genesis 16:16
Abraham was eighty-six years old when Hagar bore him Ishmael.

HOW OLD WAS ABRAHAM WHEN ISAAC WAS BORN?

Genesis 21:5:
Abraham was a hundred years old when his son Isaac was born to him.

Now Truthman and Malvisguy do the math from the above.

I got 14 years old i.e Ishmeal was 14 when isaac was born,

NOW HOW OLD WAS ISAAC WHEN HAGAR AND HER SON WERE SENT AWAY .

Genesis 21:8 The child grew and was weaned, and on the day Isaac was weaned Abraham held a great feast

Typically, Isaac would be around 2-3 years old when he is weaned and we see in the proceeding verse they the following day after the weaning that which makes Ishmael about 16-17 years of age when he is expelled from Abraham's home...

1) Now, the bible left us with a problem as malvisguy noted up there, can you guys please solve the problem for me? in malviguys voice "how can an old woman back a boy of 17years old?

2) It is possible that Ishmael is devoted to the God of his father for he is not a small boy at the age of 17, furthermore if he took the way of a pagan, God woudnt have reiterate his promise to Abraham as seen in verse 13 and also to hagar in the desert of Paran.

you say ishmael was 17 years old, you get this information from a book that you claimed is corrupt and you believe,but the verse that say Jesus is Lord, you don't believe it.

You can't comperd there state of perfection and nowadays humans.

Rilwayne001:
Don't worry, i'll school you after truthman reply me.





Truthman2012 do you agree with this ignoramus?

Are you also asking me the above question?

ok, don't forget to give the quranic reference that say he was 17 years.

Rilwayne001:
Ishmael was 17 when he was driven out from Abraham family and I dont think a 17years old would not know and practise what his father worshipped.

Furthermore, how come it was both Isaac and Ishmael that buried Abraham? Also God bless his nation exeedingly, can God bless the nation of those who are not devoted to him?


Don't evade my questions.

where do you get this from? ishmael was 17? Quote the quranic verse let see.

“And Abraham rose up early in the
morning, and took bread, and a bottle
of water, and gave it unto Hagar,
putting it on her shoulder, and the
child, and sent her away: and she
departed, and wandered in the
wilderness of Beersheba” (Gen 21:14).

He put a 17years old boy on an old woman back?

davien:
You are disagreeing with the op here or have you accepted that a "nothing" as commonly understood cannot be pinned down?

scientific evidence proof the universe had a beginning, and there are many verses in the bible that indicate God is acting before time BEGIN,
I believe this link has the answer to your questions. http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/why_is_there_something.html
are handled on another page. However,
what most skeptics don't know is that the Bible, written mostly by a bunch of sheep herders, makes a number of scientific claims that are remarkably correct - even though many were not even confirmed to be correct until within the last 100 years.however, the bible was not written for the purpose of science, It was written to explain spiritual principles - the nature of mankind, the nature of God, and how people can have a personal relationship with God.

macof:
Well that's not what a pagan is...that's how ur pastor teaches u rubbish about us

Pagans are native tribalist, people who adhere to the traditions, language, culture and spirituality of their ethnicity...these TLCS usually stretch back to thousands of years...to no definite point in time, because they follow the people as they go from one generation to the other, from one land to the other....sometimes certain aspects of their TLCS evolve, due to loss in cult and record keepers, new initiatives and innovation, assumed better understanding...

The whole world was once pagan, we all worshiped the Creator but of course in different traditions, languages and culture but spirituality remains the same
Every pagan regardless ethnicity beliefs in A creator

who created you?

macof:
First of, most of the reverts did research before realizing the fraud of christianity
everything I know about Christianity was from my days as a Christian not after

Second, most reverts tend to stick it to the man who kept them in delusions for years...in this case the man is christianity

that is the point I want you to know, they failed to do research on Islam . With all the evidence in the quran that pointed to the worship of pagan, still people wanted to chose Islam ahead of Christianity, who preach to them? Bible say
In Romans 10:14
"How, then, can they call on the one they
have not believed in? And how can they
believe in the one of whom they have
not heard? And how can they hear
without someone preaching to them?"

macof:
What do u understand by "pagan"?

pagan are idols worshippers that go against the law of there makers (God).

Rilwayne001:
What makes you think your own is the best and the rest are false? which diety splitted them in the first place? what makes you think other are not possesed by holy spirit?



I dont need to, I have answered you on many occasions on this, i can't just waste my time replying you all over again.

I give you the opportunity to defend Allah.
Ask for proof and I will give you.

macof:
Lol see mumu...of course most reverts are ex-Christians nd as such they tend to attack christianity more because they have the knowledge of it...you think we are like u who dives into what he knows nothing about?

Like u attack pagans when u know absolutely nothing about paganism

so the internet ban you from knowing the truth about Islam,but you are free to do a research about Christianity?

Rilwayne001:
You've summarized all jargons the OP wrote with your comment below.



Now which diety is responsible for the splitting of xtianity to thousand sects?

1 Timothy4:1
The Spirit clearly says that in later times
some will abandon the faith and follow
deceiving spirits and things taught by
demons.


2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when people will
not put up with sound doctrine. Instead,
to suit their own desires, they will gather
around them a great number of teachers
to say what their itching ears want to
hear.

Why dint you ask for proof of pagan worship in Islam? You know it true, dint you?

GeneralShepherd:
So what caused God?

God is the first caused.

macof:
As a pagan, I attack all religions and dogmatism even if based on Ifa...Ifa preaches against dogmatism and personalising the Spirit of the universe(which religions erroneously call God)
When I have the chance, I show the lies and fraud of both religions, which are a big menace to the world

most pagan are to soft in attacking pagan, infacte rossikk (a pagan) has never question Islamic belief, he only attack Christian, I ask him why? He gave a lame excuse, he say '' he was born as a Christian, so he no nothing about Islam".
but he can search the internet for wrong information about Christian but fail to do the same in Islam.

I believe the same deity that is control of pagan is the same with Islam.

macof:
Every religion has it's origins in Paganism

where in the bible does it say Christianity has a pagan origin? Evidence from the quran and hadith prove Islam is a pagan religion.

manmustwac:
This is headline news all over Europe but this topic will not make the homepage here because its bound to cause friction between muslims and Christians and seun dose not want to hurt the feelings of his muslim members

they preferred darkness over light, this news make headlines around the world, but the moderator on nairaland are sleeping and to lazy,if it a news about a Christian convert to Islam, it will be on the homepage.0AM4J why?

plaetton:
Ok. So god exist by faith alone.
Good.
So, what is faith ?
Faith is something that you convince yourself of. It does not have to make sense, right?
Good.

Therefore, outside of faith, god does not make sense, and therefore does not exist.

what religion explained faith like the way you do? I believe that is not how Christians are advice,Christianity is not a blind faith;
" Do not quench the Spirit; do not
despise prophetic utterances. But
examine everything carefully; hold fast
to that which is good…( 1 Thessalonians
5:19-21)"

Skepticism is important to the Christian
faith; skepticism causes us to examine
what we believe and search for the
evidence that confirms our beliefs.

Christians Are Called to be Convinced
of What They Believe;
Let each man be fully convinced in his
own mind. ( Romans 14:5)

Christians can be "case makers" precisely because the Christian faith is an evidential faith. When we, as Christians, argue for the truth of the Christian Worldview, we are not sharing an opinion. There either is a God, or there is not. Jesus is that God, or He is not. Salvation comes through Christ alone (as Jesus Himself maintained), or it does not. This is not a matter of opinion, personal preference or wishful thinking. The Christian faith is grounded in evidence that can be assessed and evaluated. The Christian faith is an evidential faith.

Remitee4uall:
why do you(christains) like abusive words. cant u adhere to the rules(2) of the forum

quote were the op abuse Muslim. Evidence prove Islam is a pagan religion.

ShaheedBinAliyu:
Does miracle means a point to believe in something or someone? if u believe in miracle as a proof to authenticity, then u dnt av faith. go read muhamad \s.a.w/ biography. he did many miracles, spliting moon in his pocket and many more. Believe in one God, Believe in all his prophets and that makes u a muslim. islam is the only path to paradise. no matter facts and proofs i provide to make u believe, that doesnt mean u will believe. it all depends on God will. May Allah show you the way. God Bless Bro

how is splitting the moon a benefit to mankind? This is magic and not miracle. More than twenty quranic verses indicates when ever the Arab challenge muhammed to performed miracle, he say HE WAS JUST A HUMAN.

Rilwayne001:
My question is who splitted them to 41000sects?


All of the above listed up here i posses them as well, do you consider me to be your brother, do you considered the Pope that entered the turkish mosque out of humility and love to pray with muslims as your brother?



LOL.

Trying to digress the discussion here is'nt it?
Answer my question biko

you are too boastful. Your question has been answer. You are only derailing the topic, if it Islam section, you will be ban, but here you are free to wrestling with the truth. Thank you for your time, I will not reply you again.

Rilwayne001:
What do you want me to reply?

He said the devil is controlling muslim and atheist.

Amd I ask who splitted xtianity to 41000sects? kindly help him to answer it.

you can make it 5million sect. Christians knows the message of the cross.
This is how to identified your brother in Christ.
Galatians 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy,
peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness,
faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-
control. Against such things there is no
law.

Now the sects in Islam, what causes it? How do you know true Muslim?

Rilwayne001:
So your tiny brain can only come up with that the site was edited, i.e most of those denominations are not existing? and have you click on those denominations to verify if they are existinh or not?

wikipedia cannot be edited?

Rilwayne001:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations

as usual , no attempt to reply the op, only derailiing .

Rilwayne001:
Yes, they are not existing, I inserted them to the site

LOL

na wikipedia nah, anything is possible, anyone can Edith it.

lepasharon:
Why? Maybe those who say they saw Jesus are lying and this boy speaks the truth

are you a Christian? Do you really believe he went to heaven and did not see Jesus? Do you believe there are sex in heaven? Only one man 72 virgin? Does the Muslim even believe in the 72 virgin females?

truthman2012:
The source itself does not list the 41,000 sects. That someone wrote something he could not prove does not mean is the truth.

the liist in that link does not reach the 41000 he claimed, and I believe most of the denominations are not existing.

truthman2012:
Muslims like to deceive themselves.

If allah is the same as Yahweh, why was Muhammad to fight Yahweh's worshipers.

they are sooo confused. Only God will saved them.

lepasharon:
So if he said he saw Jesus and not Allah,he won't be lying huh ?

yes my sister.

Nobleval:
I THINK YOU ARE VERY WRONG,I was raised up in a christian home,but my Dad has made me to understand that Allah is same as our God. I have muslim friends and they worship the same God we worship,although they don't give Jesus the respect christians give him. He is just another great prophet named Isah according to them,but the greatest prophet ever to walk this earth is Muhammed and they believe that he and Jesus were all sent by Allah (GOD)

So you see,it could be that you are cursing the name of God in Arabic ,it's just like saying that Ol*wa or Ch*neke is a murderer or whatever just because you can't understand yoruba and Igbo language respectively.

when a book that you claimed comes from the true God contradicted the other, one must be wrong, we must ask this question, are they the same deity? Bible say Jesus died for my sin.quran say it's a lie, Allah make the Jew believe Jesus was killed, are they the same? Do you think God will wait for 600 years and later send muhammed to say ''they crucified him not'' what about thoes that died believing Jesus was killed, wh will be blame for there unbelief? Allah or satan? Friend, Allah in the quran and God in the bible are not the same.

Is your dad a born again Christian? If yes, is he well versed in the bible and quran? If yes, he will not say this to you.

Nobleval:
I hope this helps.

[b]The One God of the Jews,
Christians, and Muslims[b/]
Jews, Christians, and Muslims
believe that there is only one
God.
In the Jewish scriptures, God is
called by many names in the
Hebrew language, since those
are Hebrew texts. The most
famous of these names is the
name Yahweh. The basic creed of
the Jews is found in the Bible in
the Book of Deuteronomy 6:4 as
follows:
“Listen, Israel: Yahweh our God is
the one, the only Yahweh. (The
New Jerusalem Bible, Deut. 6:4)
Notice in the above verse that
God’s name is Yahweh. That
name eventually fell into disuse.
The same verse above is quoted
in the Christian New Testament,
but without the name, as follows:
“Listen, Israel, the Lord our God
is the one, only Lord"(Mark
12:29)
Notice that this verse from Mark’s
gospel is identical to the verse
from Deuteronomy, except for
one obvious difference. The
name Yahweh occurred twice in
the Deuteronomy verse, but
never in Mark’s quotation. Mark,
being a Greek writer, replaced
the Hebrew word Yahweh with
the Greek words ho kyrios
meaning ‘the Lord,’ and kyrios
meaning ‘Lord.’
One translation of the Bible
renders the above verse from
Mark as follows: “Hear, O Israel,
Jehovah
our God is one Jehovah” (Mark
12:29 New World Translation of
the Holy Scriptures, Published by
Watchtower Bible and Tract
Society, 1961, revised 1984).
Notice here that now, instead of
Yahweh, the name Jehovah is
substituted.
The Qur’an also insists there no
god but One God. In the Qur’an,
however, we notice two
significant differences from the
previous scriptures. The first
difference is that the book
addresses not just the Israelites,
but all mankind. In the Qur’an it
is no longer “Hear O Israel”
alone, but rather “O Mankind.”
The Qur’an says for example: “O
Mankind! Worship your Lord,
who has created you and those
before you” (Qur’an 2:21)
The second difference from the
previous scriptures is that the
Qur’an, having been revealed in
the Arabic language, uses the
Arabic name for the one true God
– Allah. The Qur’an says for
example: “Allah! There is no god
except Him, the Alive, the
Eternal” (Qur’an 2:255).
This name of God is used by
Arabic speaking Christians and
Jews and by Muslims of every
language. The New Encyclopedia
Britannica says: “Allah is the
standard Arabic word for “God”
and is used by
Arab Christians as well as
Muslims” (Britannica, 1990
edition, vol. 1, p.276).
So here we have in various
languages three names for the
same God – the one true God
who was worshipped by
Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and
Muhammad (peace be upon
them)

you quote the scripture, but it was the same allah that say you should fight thoes that has been giving the scripture;
Fight against such of those who have
been given the Scripture as believe not
in Allah....(Quran 9:29)

So Allah is telling Muslims to fight Him?

Nobleval:
I'd like to remind you that Allah is God,just like Jehovah,Yahweh,Oluwa,Chukwu, e.t.c


Your thread is not worth commenting on,because that's a load of jargons you wrote up there.

allah is the devil that come to kill steal and destroyed.

ShaheedBinAliyu:
I am the one saying that statement. i dont wana be arguing about religion anymore. . . i have argued alot in the past, even though you xtian know its true, you wont believe. There are so many miracles and proofs that prove islam valid but you will never believe. All i wana be doing now is just stating the facts

miracle in Islam? Muhammed did not performed miracle when he was challenge to do one.

ShaheedBinAliyu:
Like I said, its your choice to believe it or not.

to believe or not? Does the quran made this statement? Verse pleased.