₦airaland Forum

Kobicove:
Allegations and counter-allegations!

I am a Christian....and this is what I see. Many of us don't live in or have never seen a Southern Kaduna, but rely on uncensored media reports....so it's a case of who makes the largest noise.

My tots are that the two sects Southern Kaduna indigenes (who are either Christian or probably not) and Hausa Fulani (who are either herdsmen or probably not) attack each other. Whoever can tell his story the "loudest" get attention

OK, Let's wager. How much for whoever can show a true link to the video, or Newspaper report of (Punch, Thisday, The Guardian, The Nation, Sahara Reporters & Premium Times) where such promise was reported.

It is unfortunate that the corrupt oriented people cooked us this lie and spread it round Nigeria.....but that is not and should not be our bother. The govt is setting Nigeria on the sustainable part

candy:
Yes, I'm being soft on the sellers because they are victims of a failed system. If a hunch backed man caries a load, the load will look crooked on his head because of his already crooked posture. The failure is evident everywhere, more like a foundational problem.

I'm not in anyway justifying smuggling, but I'm condemning the system that encourages smuggling, only to punish smaller fish for their failure to combat smuggling.

You're right, the rot in the system is bigger than market men and women. We can only start from a point and sustain it. I believe the current leadership of Customs is starting a cleansing which can only be sustained if we a country has the will

dan2976:
kill which business?

rice is selling at almost N20,000. when importation was permitted under jonathan, it was N8,500. business for who..... is it the so called local farmersat the expense of the masses?

Bros,

I am not ready for "primary-school" type of argument.....

Blue3k:
Too answer both your questions yes illegal operations happen all the time in the north. There is smuggling of of food stuff from Niger Republic to Katsina kaduna and kano. On the Nigerian side gasoline in smuggled along with textile goods. This has adverse effects on Northern manufacturing.

I'll have to add links later on in the morning. I did plenty of research on Niger Nigeria cross border trade.

Bros, No need

1. My question was to point out the mutual exclusivity of the position of the two guys, re: You cannot accuse govt of exclusively "attacking" rice smugglers of the east, in the same breath condemn smuggling
2. I know that there is a smuggling ring up north. Smuggling of cars is rampant in the north too. I also gave an example of how smugglers of textile of Chinese origin were discovered in a Kano Warehouse

ivandragon:
1. you are the one being coy & dragging on about an issue that is pretty straightforward & trying to make Customs seem like the 'untouchables' who can do & undo;

2. http://www.vanguardngr.com/2016/10/customs-lifts-ban-importation-rice/

all the more reason why the raid is been faulted. why raid at 1am when people would not be at their shops to defend themselves? even the constitution says we are entitled to fair hearing.

3. why can't the rice section of the market be condoned off? I think security agencies that can hire 15 trailers to pack goods should be more thorough & professional in its duties & the issue remains, where the owners given opportunity to prove otherwise within reasonable bounds? if those goods were warehoused in a single warehouse, it could be a different matter... not from various shops.

4. Checking at seaport, within territorial waters, airports, land borders or along the road or rail lines... the fact remains, Customs will confiscate your 'probable' smuggled goods if you are not able to present your proper papers at that point (benefit of doubt), but the rice dealers where not given that chance.

look, I believe that your argument is that Customs had a right to seize the rice. on that, no argument...

the issue is the way & manner the raid was carried out especially with the reasonable possibility that a number of those bags of rice entered through proper means.

that's the long & short of the matter...

1. Why are you wasting my time with obfuscation? You reference a news that was refuted by Customs the very next day. I am sure you google-searched the link, The news you referenced was on October 8th 2016, yet on October 9th 2016 in the very same Vanguard newspaper the Customs refuted the earlier published news
http://www.vanguardngr.com/2016/10/rice-imports-remain-banned-land-borders-customs/

2. Why raid at 1p.m? Because the law permit them to raid at any time.

The Customs & Excise Management Act

Section 147. Power to search premises

(1) Without prejudice to any other power conferred by this Act, where there are reasonable grounds to suspect that any thing liable to forfeiture under the customs and excise laws is kept or concealed in any building or place, any officer may, without a warrant, enter that building or place at any time, whether by day or night, and search for, seize, detain or remove any such thing and may, so far as is reasonably necessary for the purpose of such entry, search, seizure, detention or removal, break open any door, window or container and force and remove any other impediment or obstruction.

3. Why can't rice section be cordoned off? The law did not prescribe that in the Act. The law says FORFEITURE. I would have imagined that the logical thing for you to do at this stage is to back your position with relevant aspect of the law. I need to know if my argument with you is from the point of law or from your opinions and conjectures

4. The Act provides for these traders or importers of these Rice to go to the Customs & Excise Board to show proof that they paid all dues. That is what the traders should do if they have proof. The very first question you should ask is, how many of these traders can show proof...virtually none. Why? Importing Rice is ILLEGAL

4

Babamide:
Downloaded, seen. I concede.

Cheers

ivandragon:
Mapet, as always, we are splitting hairs here...

I am reasonably familiar with the Act, but just like every Act, Decree & laws generally, there are always limitations & subject to interpretations in court of law.

Customs has incredibly broad 'powers', but those powers do not include impunity.
at
those goods could have been 'spot seized' & then the owners be allowed to present the relevant papers on request, those who fail to do so would have their goods taken away...

even when Customs board ships, they first of all ask for the manifest & other relevant documents.

only goods that are expressly banned that such a raid can be justified.

its similar to our police... that they have the power to arrest doesn't mean it should be used indiscriminately.

well, let the owners of the goods do the needful, some of them claim to have proper papers, so they should make steps to recover their goods.

1. Where did I even allude to the fact that Customs power include impunity? This is you trying to buttress your argument the coy way
2. Let any of these market women come up and present papers through which the rice was imported? I thought importation of rice is banned. That means (if they are the importers) will have to show that the rice in question was bought before the law banning importation of rice came into being in the first place. Can this be proven?
3. And where do you want to "spot-seize" the goods? In the market? Is that the way Customs are to operate? The forfeiture sections of the Act clearly states what Customs should do when such contraband makes it into the country.
4. Bros, I am not convinced that you have familiarised yourself with the act, else you will not be making fundamentally flawed statements like in bold. There is a difference between the process of checking at the port and seizure of goods outside the port

candy:
Sentimental cry? Yes. That betrayed logic? No.

In response to your points listed above:

1. The market space is occupied by smuggled rice because of poor implementation of policies. When Nigerian government is serious about these market policies, they will enforce them- the right way. It is more logical for customs officers to arrest, detain and subsequently prosecute rice smugglers. Why take bribes from them to encourage them, only to turn round and 'STEAL' these items? Have you ever bothered to ask what happens to most of these seized goods(apart from the few they burn openly)? A renowned rice seller in Ibadan once told me she got most of her stock from custom officers. Why? How?

2. Maybe they are not sincere traders by trading in smuggled items, but then, I once read on this same nairaland the struggle, the sweat and the stress of getting the Lagos/Kebbi rice last December. When will these locally grown rice be available to the common man? Because of the health benefits, I buy my local rice mostly from Ekiti state and I can tell you it's so expensive few people can afford it on a regular basis. Even I have to substitute with these foreign rice these days.

3. Regarding the porous borders, yes, I agree they are collaborators. However, what happens to those whose duty it is to man the borders? My friend and I needed to buy fuel at a gas station sometime when there was scarcity. The queues were so long and rowdy. We remained in the scorching sun until a policeman codedly asked my friend to go park the car across the street if we had a 50L keg. We did, and we paid him N500 for his services. Now, the policemen did it for many motorists that day and we heard that serious fights broke out later. Call us collaborators, but the policeman that was meant to guard, and guide was too corrupt to maintain order.

All in all, slicing off the head is not an antidote for headache at anytime. Like someone pointed out earlier, why not seal off the affected shops, arrest the affected importers and the bribe-taking customs officers on duty the day the affected goods were brought in to the country? I reiterate; what happens to the seized rice and vegetable oil? ? ?

Was there any record of what and what was seized/stolen from which stores? Why didn't they go when they can make arrests? Of course, they arrested the bags of rice and ororo...that's the koko for them.

Well I will take this submission as the soft-side which has little to do with the letter and the spirit of the la

1. Even with corrupt govt, seizure and confiscation of contraband items is standard all over the world. Arrest is different in this context. Arrest is targeted at the smugglers, who in this case are not the market sellers. The law is clear that when the goods makes it to market, it will be forfeited. You make it sound like bribe taking by corrupt Custom officers is an excuse for these people committing the said offence? That to me is living in denial. One, smuggled rice arrive at the doorstep of these sellers at a ridiculously cheaper rate....that should tell anyone that they are contraband

2. The truth is that these sellers know they are trading in contraband. You yourself admitted to this in your writeup. Can these sellers now want to feign ignorance of the law? When has buying contraband goods legitimises selling such goods in the open market? In times past Customs officers (corruptly or legally) raid markets to swoop in on shops selling contrabands, so the market people cannot claim ignorance of the knowledge of the good as contraband or the risk that Custom will come

3. Madam, Lagos-Kebbi did get to the market and will further get to market if we allow it to. This includes clearing the market of illegal ones, so that the system can target these sellers for off-take. The cost model for goods like these first start off with high cost as growers and middlemen will need to off-set their initial outlay, then the price gradually comes down. Kebbi can produce 2Trillion tonnes of Rice, Sokoto & Taraba are poised to produce over 5Trillion tonnes, not to talk of Ebonyi, Anambra and other states. The Economists recently had an article saying "Nigeria,the Largest Rice Consumer in the world, Yet don't grow it. Is that not an economic embarrasement? We have two rice growning season in a year. We need to let these Rice "take position" in our local market and earn of Forex in the regional and global market. We cannot achieve that if we are not as disciplined enough to disallow the "weeds" in contraband to distort the value-appreciation of our local rice

3. Those whose duty is to man the borders are culpable, yet it is more complicated than that. Nigeria has a huge Kilometer of unmanned borders across the country and we are not yet equipped (man-power & Resources wise) to address this. Secondly raids and confiscation is not only a deterent, but also conceptually part of border patrol. The law made provision for stuffs that will slip through the border, that is why the forfeiture sections of the Customs and Excise Management Acts empowers Customs and Police to seize goods that sneaks through the boarder


In this case Ori bibe l'ogun orififo o I am not sure sealing buildings is within the remit of customs, but they are empowered to seize goods

Now without sentiments, Let us look at cases where Customs or Police or Other Agencies have done cases related to smuggling, contraband etc
1. Last 2 weeks, an "Indian-made" Garri made it to the stall of a supermarket. Nigerians cried out in anger. The authorities moved swiftly to action and seized all the Garri found in store. It was discovered that the "Gari" was smuggled in from Ghana......
2. In the days of OBJ, Dangote imported some stuffs and his papers were not complete. Those stuffs made it to his warehouse(aparently someone must have bribed Customs) Customs raided Dangote's warehouse and seized those stuffs
3. In 2016, Customs raided a warehouse in Kano where there was contraband textile materials and seized them all.
These and many other examples are abound. Now we did not hear any hue or cry about these cases, but when it concerns "us", we try to rationalise illegality
Cheers

ivandragon:
what constitutes a smuggled good(s)?

is it not when the owner of a good cannot show evidence that the good is/was not illegally brought into the country that it can be confiscated?

for example, when you travel with your private car & custom officials stop you, the first thing demanded is the import documentation for the car, they do not confiscate your car BEFORE asking for your papers...

that's simple logic... hence they should have been more thorough in their duty of identifying the 'smugglers' & their goods rather than raiding indiscriminately...

& if your blanket assertion is to be followed, even your smartphone is liable to be confiscated without reason or recourse to sensible moderation...

This is simple. Familiarise yourself with the CUSTOMS AND EXCISE MANAGEMENT ACT, where it is stated clearly what constitute smuggled goods, and what is to be done to various categories of such goods

Babamide:
I ask if u work for Nigerian custom service because u are here doing PRO work. Does the law state that the goods should be seized or the offenders arrested and prosecuted. Does the law allow the enforcers to break into shops and warehouses. Is the Nigerian custom service the enforcer of such laws.
The custom service were given one duty, collection of import duty and anti smuggling efforts.
I repeat that breaking into shops and carting away imported goods with the help of the military in the middle of the night remains illegal.

1. Asking if I work for Nigerian Customs Services is a lame question
2. I am here doing PRO work or you are here arguing lame
3. Section 167 of the Customs and Excise Management Act empowers Customs or even police officers or any other authorized persons approved by the Customs Board to seize or detail goods liable for forfeiture......
I don't know why you guys find it difficult to use google to clarify simple things
4. Who told you Customs Services duties are limited to -

collection of import duty and anti smuggling efforts

, you see how your ignorance is just "dancing on a platter"....
5. Are Customs by law permited to break into shops? Hell YES!!!

Section 147. Power to search premises  

(1) Without prejudice to any other power conferred by this Act, where there are reasonable grounds to suspect that any thing liable to forfeiture under the customs and excise laws is kept or concealed in any building or place, any officer may, without a warrant, enter that building or place at any time, whether by day or night, and search for, seize, detain or remove any such thing and may, so far as is reasonably necessary for the purpose of such entry, search, seizure, detention or removal, break open any door, window or container and force and remove any other impediment or obstruction.

ivandragon:
what's your point?

does the law permit security agencies to break into shops & cart away goods without first investigating/verifying if those goods were illegally acquired?

Actually Yes!. The Law permit Customs to seize smuggled goods ANYWHERE in Nigeria

Deseo:
If someone keeps trying to fool you, it's because they are very sure of your stupidity. Whoever is behind that site is very sure Nigerians are foolish.

Classic!!!

Let me also add a quote from the book "48 Laws of Power" by Robert Greene

The great European charlatans of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries mastered the art of cult-making. They lived, as we do now, in a time of transformation: Organized religion was on the wane, science on the rise. People were desperate to rally around a new cause or faith. The charlatans had begun by peddling health elixirs and alchemic shortcuts to wealth. Moving quickly from town to town, they originally focused on small groups—until, by accident, they stumbled on a truth of human nature: The larger the group they gathered around themselves, the easier it was to deceive.

sirfemoz:
Then let's wait and see if this government will do anything "tangible" according to you on that bridge.

If they don't do anything tangible, you and I have the responsibility to bash dem and call for their "heads"

sirlop:
What is illegal. We are not a producer of tyre, we still ban used tyres. Y not ban used vehicles too cos they come with used tires. What I expect them to do is specify the quality of products to be imported not outright ban cos we produce nothing cos of our epileptic power supply. Companies have left Nigeria cos of our governments inability to provide us with steady power supply. Y do u make useless laws when you know you haven't done your part. Billions have been spent on this so called energy sector and we still have nothing to show..."which way Nigeria"

You have moved from a position of crass ignorance to shifting the goal post. You first made a false assertion

The existing local farmers are not given any atom of encouragement by the government

, you then justify smugglers' acts....now you bring in myriads of excuses that are out of context....... is it for the sake of argument

sirfemoz:
We are not quarrelling or fighting. Don't take it too personal. Why is APC speaking from both sides of the mouth? You may not know where this Niger bridge is or even walk on it. But you are here over heating ya self.

Ok Bros,

1. I know where the bridge is
2. I know past leaders even from OBJ to GEJ did absolutely nothing tangible on the bridge

Babamide:
Do u work for the Nigerian custom service?
Let us educate each other a little. Customs are empowered at the borders, entry point route and ports. Any job they do inside a market or shop is illegal.

See how you just showed your ignorance. Bros, there is something called the CUSTOMS AND EXCISE (SPECIAL PENAL AND OTHER PROVISIONS) ACT. Section 3 clearly states "Possession of smuggled goods to be an offence".

1) If any person is found anywhere in Nigeria in possession of any goods to which this section applies, he shall be guilty of an offence unless he proves-

(a) that the goods were lawfully imported into Nigeria or as the case may be, that the duty chargeable thereon has been paid; or

(b) in the case of any person other than a seller of those goods, that he had no reason to believe that the goods were unlawfully imported or that the duty chargeable thereon had not been paid.

(2) This section applies, to any goods, not being goods manufactured or otherwise produced in Nigeria-

(a) the importation of which is prohibited under the Customs and Excise Management Act or any other enactment; or

(b) which have been imported into Nigeria without the duty chargeable thereon having been paid.

(3) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall on conviction be sentenced to imprisonment for one year without the option of a fine.

onyxo76:
which shoddy job? so which inspection did they do at the border after allowing a truck with close to 400 bags land at the border ,inspect the contents collect the mandatory 1000 naira per checkpoint until arriving at the market? I have stayed with a custom officer in the same compound at Ibadan and believe me his wife resells all those seized items in her shop, nobody can go the shop to claim contraband after all she is a custom officers' wife na.

I am uninterested in the illegal acts of corrupt custom officers, neither do the illegal acts of corrupt custom officials legalises the illegality of trading in smuggled goods

Nbote:
Since it's illegal or stolen, why weren't d owners arrested? Make una dey use una head small na.. Isn't it d same custom dat has checkpoints at the various so called smuggling routes? Abeg leave d Internet and seek realities

Unfortunately you are not using your head. It is simple, where and how will the law takes its full recourse? The custom has the perogative to sieze the goods and choose not to arrest. If the owners are so sure of their claims, let them show up and show how the goods came into the country. Shebi there are documentations (port papers, shipping documents and stuffs)

Yes they have checkpoints in various smuggling routes, but my question is, are the customs lawfully empowered to trace and seize smuggled goods that beat those check-points? Absolutely YES!!!

sirlop:

HAH: Sad seeing most comments are sympathising with smugglers economic saboteurs.
Some people are even saying why were they not informed before the seizsure or why did they come by 12am, so when coming to arrest a criminal they should inform them ba? So that they can hide whatever illegal they have, I hear una.

As read from the report even the traders themselves agreed that they are smuggled through land borders and the paid corrupt official 1k to pass so what is the fuss if upright task force confiscate it.

The traders should henceforth look inward on local rice, and how to add value to it

I just laugh at your contribution. The existing local farmers are not given any atom of encouragement by the government. People will have to survive.

And so they should continue in illegal acts? @HAH, see what I mean by our eroded value-system?

candy:
Shey they said we are the second largest producer of rice in the world...why not make the locally produced rice cheap and readily available? Why allow these people to bring in the rice and vegetable oil before forcefully taking the stuff from them? Is it their fault that our borders are so porous? This is why rice will keep getting expensive!

BTW, where are they selling the naija rice they keep talking about? This is so not fair on these traders. The customs officers' action is tantamount to STEALING. I'm sure their wives will start selling the rice at a cheaper rate soon, after causing pain and frustration in the lives of some people.

I don't like sentimental cries that betray logic. Madam, here below are direct answers to your questions

1. How can we make locally produced rice cheap, when the market space is allowed to be occupied by smuggled rice?
2. Why will any sincere trader, trade in smuggled items?
3. It is their fault that the border is porous as thy are part of the collaborators. An illegal act is completed by these traders, they pay bribes to corrupt customs officials, as such they are also culpable as a bribe giver

Lloydfather:
while their Hausa brothers are selling the same smuggled rice here in Alaba rago with confidence they go about harassing our Yoruba neighbors, in the name of smuggled rice. the day this Hausa harassing arm of government will start harassing their Hausa brothers like the do to us I will believe in one Nigeria.

You cannot stoke the fire to incite any hatred. Anybody found selling contraband should be arrested with the goods. Hausa selling smuggled rice in Alaba rago is ruse......if you are sure "whistle-blow" it to appropriate authorities

Jesusloveyou:
what the custom did is bad.
But those traders add curry to the story. Their money did not loss

There is nothing the Customs did that is not within the ambit of the law.

HAH:
Sad seeing most comments are sympathising with smugglers economic saboteurs.
Some people are even saying why were they not informed before the seizsure or why did they come by 12am, so when coming to arrest a criminal they should inform them ba? So that they can hide whatever illegal they have, I hear una.

As read from the report even the traders themselves agreed that they are smuggled through land borders and the paid corrupt official 1k to pass so what is the fuss if upright task force confiscate it.

The traders should henceforth look inward on local rice, and how to add value to it

Bros,

Welcome to the world where our value-system has been so eroded; children of today reason like lost souls

Guyman02:
Peter Obi warned but you Yoruba Muslims condemned him for speaking out

You're simply reasoning like a classic irridentist bigot. Even Peter Obi dare not support smuggling

Guyman02:

Emycord: :
They want to use it feed idp camp while someone collects money on contract from fg for thier feeding. And yet they are fighting corruption. Now its yoruba watch as everyone will condemn it but if its ipob goods then its normal

I expect Yoruba Muslims to justify this one, because if this action had happened in Onitsha they would be here to defend it

1. I am Yoruba but not a muslim.
2. Smuggling is illegal, buying smuggled goods is equally illegal regardless of whether it is Yoruba, Hausa or Igbo. I support the Customs to act within the ambit of the law, even if it happens in my backyard.

so what else?

LarryBeryl:
Same thing happened at Gbagi market in Ibadan last week Wednesday/Thursday. If the goods are truly contraband, those traders are not justified.

Herein a rational contributor. I don't understand how people reason from their foot. We know the law, we break the law, the law takes it course and we start some needless sentimental cry. Many of the rice traders have been patronising smugglers from time immemorial. The customs are waking up to their responsibilities in a long time.

I also wonder how you want the aspiration for local production of rice to be successful if we allow smugglers to kill the business

Babamide:
Nigeria is the most lawless country in the world. How can custom officials assisted by soldiers start STEALING in uniforms. They overlooked their duty at border patrol to start raiding shops in the middle of the night.

Stop twisting logic. The Customs did their jobs. The soldiers provided security cover in case the custom men face resistance and are out numbered.

Customs are empowered by Law to inspect goods that have crossed the bothers and seize the contraband ones even in supermarkets. They did same during the days of Obasanjo

effty:

Feraz: :
I remember people accusing Igbos of playing the victim when customs were seizing bags of rice and extorting travellers.

Thank for this. This is simply an illegal operations. Makes me wonder if no smuggling happens up north.

@Feraz,

You are still playing the victim mentality......

@effy,

Mr. "an illegal operations" - Which one? Is it the people selling smuggled rice or Customs seizing the goods?

sunnyside16:
Authorities on illegal mission always look for excuses. If they rice were smuggled in, were they not through the borders? Evil people in position of authority all over Nigeria.

and why will someone willingly engage in the business of buying smuggled rice? is that legal?

Nbote:
So d way d govt wants to force don prices of commodities is by breaking into ppl's shops and warehouses by force.. Did d traders cross d bother to steal the items or what are their crimes exactly?
1984/85 is here again..

Your question turn logic on its head. So if some brings an illegal or stolen goods to you shop and you buy it, police or custom should leave you because you did not go to steal it?

Feraz:
Keneking sef! Welcome back!

Nigerian military and paramilitary sef! Breaking into people's shops when everywhere is dark to confiscate goods which should have been been at the border and using soldiers as shield. This looks like a legal robbery. Why not wait to do it when people can see you?

These goods cannot enter if there's no insider among them. Man the borders well, una no gree...

ivandragon: :
as stated in the write up, the proper thing would have been to seal/post guards at the 'offending' shops & then carry out a thorough check on the alleged contrabands.

those guilty of flouting the law should then be arrested & goods seized...

Do they understand these laws? They're not the only one. See EFCC that will use red paint to deface walls of seized buildings under investigation instead of using that tape used to seal off an area.

I wonder what people will say since SE is not affected unlike last year December when they were accused of always bringing in contraband. I remember people accusing Igbos of playing the victim when customs were seizing bags of rice and extorting travellers.

Are you both quoting Nigerian Laws or another country's?