Balleriina, say wetin?

Missing my heart's delight

i don join

Mine your heart every day, it's like a treasure-trove of gold

stew

sped

sued

curd

@OP: Or do you mean your TASK MANAGER?

If you mean Device manager, try going to RUN and enter devmgmt.msc (or you can do Windows+R, then enter devmgmt.msc)

If you mean Task Manager, try right clicking on your task bar. Is Task Manager greyed out? If so, you probably have a virus or something running.

Let me know how it goes,

ford

fold

Part 1:
[flash=400,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkxieS-6WuA[/flash]

Part 2:
[flash=400,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8wNL0wtGQk[/flash]

What do you think?

Sole

*oops the spambot deleted my post "soma". Why? it means body!*

coma

@tiatma: WOW! I am just seeing the posts! Believe me!! Who is Recognize? I think I will like to read more of his posts, but, sigh, no time! no time!! Now, don't even go down that "Mavenbox is the same person as Recognize" path, or the "plagiarism" path. LOL. If we say the same thing, it only means that we have apprehended the truth in the same manner. Thanks to the Holy Spirit's revelation, and all Glory be to God through His Son Christ Jesus.

@noetic: I'm so sorry for the long post. LOL. I don't usually have much time on Nairaland due to my busy schedule so I try to make up with long posts. Time is very short, you know, and the fields are over-ready for harvest.

Besides, NL does not have a section for articles, most of people's posts are DISCUSSIONS, not articles. I most often write articles, but I enjoy discussions too. Point taken!

@mazaje: Are you saying that a distant star or another planet cannot be shaken off course and plummeted into the earth, regardless of the fact that it is larger than this planet, earth?

kolaxy:

I can't but laugh at the above red bolded words,

I see that you have edited your post. I must make it clear that I am a Christian, and a Bible-believer. The fact that I believe the Bible is what makes me read between the lines, precept upon precept. Now, tell me:

1. How old was Adam when he was created? Was he a helpless baby, requiring the usual nurture like infants do? Was he a young man (in today's respect), agile and full of energy; responsible enough to tend a garden and have a wife, and wise enough to attend to instruction? Or was he a middle-aged man? By today's expression of age in years, would you say he was 12 years? 25 years? 50 years? 100? Or would you say that he was ZERO years old? Herein is that limitation of time as measured by mankind once again. We want to state the age of Adam JUST before he sinned, but because time is measured between two time references and we do not know how old he was when he was made, we cannot truly tell. Or maybe Kolaxy knows?

2. How old was Adam when he left the Garden? this age will be the sum of his BIRTH-AGE (I presume, a timeless quantity, with respect to our human measurement, unless you want to arbitrarily assign him an age) and the amount of time he spent in the garden before sinning. God told Adam that he would (surely) die on the day he eats the fruit (Gen 2:17). And surely, the day they sinned, he and Eve were banished (Gen 3:24) and time started telling on him, he "surely died" (i.e. his future death became an established truth, his days began counting) that moment. Now, the amount of time between their banishment in Gen 3:24 and their operations as men disconnected from God (i.e. their death) in Gen 4:1 is not known, but we see Adam and Eve having children, and the first-mentioned is Cain. At this time, the ages of Adam and Eve are yet unknown.

BUT THE FIRST REFERENCE TO ADAM'S AGE IS IN Gen 5:3

Gen 5:3  And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:

The word "lived" there is châyâh חיה

and it means to revive, to keep alive, to recover, to be nourished and preserved. This means Adam kept alive for 130 years BEFORE giving birth to Seth. But how old was he before the clocks started counting?

Gen 5:4  And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters:
Gen 5:5  And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.

Gen 5:5 counts all the years that Adam  châyâh חיה
"lived" and kept alive by summing his 800 post-Seth days with his 130 pre-Seth days. But if Adam had not sinned, he would not have died. So he would not have needed to "keep alive". This is why I believe that in the realms of the Garden of Eden, time was not measured how we now measure time.

If this is so, and time was not measured the same way before and after Eden, then telling me that Adam's X years in Eden + Mankind's Y years after Eden can be summed up together is erroneous. What is the result when you add 3 apples with 4 oranges? Is it 7?

So how can you add time measures when man never existed (to whom time makes meaning, and who is bound by time), to measures of a time when man was present in time, but not AGING to death (I believe this means the time scale may have been distorted after the fall of man, increasing slope and making men age faster), and add that to our current definition of time?

Now, I will not belabour the issue of the pre-Adamic man that you scoff right now, but there is Biblical evidence for it and maybe we may discuss that on another thread (one such is Genesis 2:5 where there was not yet a man to till the ground that God made, making it clear that man already had the role before Adam).

Going further, when Adam had not yet existed and God was the only sentient being, was time also running the very same bound scale of 24 hours, seeing that God is not bound by time?

^^^ lol

^^^^^
Well, comedy was not my intent. Maybe I was trying too hard to make you see my point. Cheers.

All Bible references are obtained from the New Testament, The Message Bible, (c) 1993

We know only a portion of the truth, and what we say about God is always incomplete. But when the Complete arrives, our incompletes will be canceled. When I was an infant at my mother's bosom, I gurgled and cooed like any infant. When I grew up, I left those infant ways for good. We don't yet see things clearly. We're squinting in a fog, peering through a mist. But it won't be long before the weather clears and the sun shines bright! We'll see it all then, see it all as clearly as God sees us, knowing him directly just as he knows us! But for right now, until that completeness, we have three things to do to lead us toward that consummation: Trust steadily in God, hope unswervingly, love extravagantly. And the best of the three is love. (1 Corinthians 13:13)

The above was originally written in Greek by the Apostle Paul, and in 1993 transliterated into English by Eugene Peterson (titled “The Message”) using contemporary English with an idiomatic style. This entire article was God’s birthday gift to me on my birthday at the beginning of 2009. I was very overwhelmed as He taught me that day, all I could do was note the points I could possibly forget. Now I’m writing it into a full note, and I want to share it with you.

Everything required to be successful, please God and enjoy life has been delivered into our hands. So why don’t we all prosper by it? Why do some suffer and experience sorrow and disaster? It’s because this provision is an invitation (2nd Peter 1:3), an invitation to represent God, the best invitation we ever received! When you receive an invitation, you need to sign an R.S.V.P. (a readiness response). Let me explain with an analogy.

Your name is Jack Robinson, cousin to Michelle Obama (nee Robinson). This evening, the U.S. President wants to give someone the privilege of representing him at an executive conference. He discusses with Michelle and she introduces you (suggests you). He is confident because he loves and trusts her, so he sends you an invitation with the presidential seal, having R.S.V.P. information. You are expected to respond, and if you will be too busy to attend, (no hard feelings!) there are a million people ready to replace you. If you agree to respond, that means you are saying you are ready to make Barack Obama proud by conducting the meeting in ways he would do himself, and ways he would approve of. If you do not respond on time, maybe there will be a next time. Just maybe. But tomorrow is too late sometimes.

2nd Peter 1:3 says, “Everything that goes into a life of pleasing God has been miraculously given to us by getting to know, personally and intimately, the One who invited us to God. The best invitation we ever received!” Similarly, Eph 2:18 speaks about the One, Jesus, “He treated us as equals, and so made us equals. Through him we both share the same Spirit and have equal access to the Father”, and Eph 3:12 says about our Faith in God, “When we trust in him, we're free to say whatever needs to be said, bold to go wherever we need to go”.

Bros Paul in the introductory verse, has helped us describe three items you need to tick on this marvelous R.S.V.P., “But for right now, until that completeness, we have three things to do to lead us toward that consummation: Trust steadily in God (translated ‘the God-kind of Faith’), hope unswervingly, love extravagantly (translated ‘Charity’). And the best (greatest) of the three is love.” These three indicate our expected conduct in order to consummate the God-character using this invitation to the God-life.

Faith, Hope, Love. Let us consider the ordering carefully. When you consummately represent the Father in matters of Faith (trusting steadily in God), only God knows because it’s an inner-man R.S.V.P. you are completing. Few spiritual men may understand, but they are just scratching the surface. Faith is an internal matter. On the other hand, matters of unswerving hope can be seen or understood by man as well, because hope can often be reasoned out, it’s a matter of the soul. This unswerving hope can only be God-like if the Faith matters had been previously addressed with God on the inside. Representing the Father in matters of charity (extravagant love) is the required item that is most easily understood by all men! Once again, you cannot truly love extravagantly if your faith and hope indications are not settled. Such persons that attempt such are just wasting their time! (Read more at 1st Corinthians 13:1-8, the passage that begins our introductory verse).

To understand our “Jack Robinson & Obama” example, let me further describe some roles. This is NOT a teaching on the Trinity, it is an analogy to help me express my point. Michelle Obama represents the Son, known on earth as Christ Jesus. Barack Obama represents the Holy Spirit, and the President of the United States of America represents God the Father. Do you get it? Michelle loves Jack and recommends him, inviting him because there is a blood relationship between them, and because of her, Jack is both welcome to the Obama family at the White House, and to the office of the Presidency of the United States. The President loves His first lady, so he accepts her rich invitation of Jack. Now, only Barack Obama (Holy Spirit) knows what goes on in the heart of the United States President (The Father), so when Jack agrees to attend the conference, he goes to the White House to get a briefing from Barack Obama. It’s Barack Obama, and not the president that he speaks to, because He doesn’t treat him “officially”. He tells Jack what to do in place of the President that will make Him proud. It doesn’t end there, he keeps his private line open to you so that if you are ever in doubt at any second, you can place a call through to Barack Obama, he will tell you what the President (represented by Jack) is ought to do. Yes, there was a time when the only open line available to Jack was Michelle’s line, and Jack would have had to ask her what to do, but this is a far better helper!

Hope you are not shocked? You are actually representing God. Yes, in all the weightiness of the possible descriptions! And that is what informs the assurance of your success. So where do eight cardinals come in? I found out that all of the above was just scratching the surface of the matter. Going a little deeper, one discovers (with understanding) eight cardinals with which your degree of consummation can be measured; gradually providing un-ignorable success and proving an assurance that you will not trip, stumble or fall, and the road before you will widen out for you. But that’s not all, these eight also provide trusted antidotes against two deadly poisons: blindness (an inability to see far, and an ability to quickly forget all that God has saved one from, or ignore His provisions) and barrenness (being of no use, making no impact in life, and having an inability to produce awesome results).

The cardinals are: Faith -> Virtue -> Knowledge -> Temperance -> Patience -> Godliness ->Brotherly Kindness -> Charity

If you recall, I early said there was a progressive tendency from Faith to Love, as the attributes get more apparent to human beings. Those three attributes are like landmarks on the eight cardinals. The more you move to the right, the more attributes man appreciates in your life. The more you move to the left, the more attributes God appreciates in your life. E.g. Heb 11:6 “It's impossible to please God apart from faith. And why? Because anyone who wants to approach God must believe both that he exists and that he cares enough to respond to those who seek him.”

On the other hand, Romans 13:8-10 says, “Don't run up debts, except for the huge debt of love you owe each other. When you love others, you complete what the law has been after all along. The law code--don't sleep with another person's spouse, don't take someone's life, don't take what isn't yours, don't always be wanting what you don't have, and any other don't you can think of--finally adds up to this: Love other people as well as you do yourself. You can't go wrong when you love others. When you add up everything in the law code, the sum total is love.”

In between these two (Faith and Love), lie the remaining six, and the progression is the same direction (from Faith to Love). I will quickly describe these attributes, using definitions that I reasoned out. The definitions have been done in a way that explains all possible means (I think) for each word.

FAITH: [/b]Complete confidence in a person or plan. Loyalty or allegiance to a cause.

[b]VIRTUE: Holy Living. Admirable qualities, attributes and traits. Moral excellence. The quality of doing the right and avoiding the wrong.

KNOWLEDGE: A better understanding. Knowledge is the (psychological) result of perception and learning, and reasoning. Each of these three (perception, learning, reasoning) are in three steps:

      Perception:-
   1. Initial sketchy notion {esthesis} involved when detecting a pattern
   2. Becoming aware of the supposed/ambient truth about the pattern
   3. An insightful formation of a concept via this initial experience

      Learning:-
   1. Making enquiries to ascertain truth of concepts perceived
   2. Acquiring skills that will provide deeper insight and greater certainty into the pattern
   3. Gradually committing the ambient truth to memory

      Reasoning:-
   1. Acquiring research skills in the development of the extents {constrains & intentions} of the pattern
   2. Imparting the research findings in a way that will intelligently present logical and coherent truth even to those who do not know the pattern
   3. Becoming the pattern itself

TEMPERANCE: Sobriety, abstinence, avoiding excess, saying no

PATIENCE: Hopefully waiting, not giving up, tolerating delay and incompetence, delaying in enforcing rights/claims/privileges, good-natured refrain from acting

GODLINESS: Living righteously and God-like. The outward appearance of an inner consecration to a Deity. Having or showing or expressing devotional reverence for the Deity.

BROTHERLY KINDNESS: Possessing marked motivation for the alleviation of suffering. To be considerate, sympathetic, warm-hearted, humane, forgiving and giving (directed towards those who love you)

CHARITY: Love. An act or activity that benefits the public at large.

How do they wrap up together? Simple: men do not want to hear about your brotherly kindness or godliness or patience or even knowledge if you do not display extravagant charity (lower on the scale). God does not want to hear about your virtue or knowledge or temperance or patience if your faith (higher on the scale) is lacking. And so on… I’m sure you get the pattern.

I really need to stop now, but I wish I could write more, there’s so much on my heart!

(c) Mavenbox 2009

@kolaxy: Referring to your post above, see this:

Gen 2:16  And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, You may freely eat of every tree of the garden;
Gen 2:17  But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and blessing and calamity you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.

What did it mean when God said Adam will surely die? I put it to you that, besides an eternal separation from God, it meant he would start aging,  i.e. time as an element will have the pleasure of acting on him, rather than the aeonian experience he was used to in the ageless primeval realm, the Garden of Eden, a spiritual location where Adam and Eve were. In the Garden of Eden, time was not of consequence

As such, the day Adam and Eve ate of the fruit, they started aging. Until they died. So, I accept that from the day they ate the fruit till today, is 6000 years. But man himself is not 6000 years old (since he existed before he sinned), let alone the earth itself!

Now tell me two things by the Biblical account:
1. How much time passed in the Garden of Eden before Adam and Eve disobeyed and ate the forbidden fruit? This will tell us how old Adam was when he left the Garden of Eden. Don't tell me 130 years, because that's not what the Bible says in Gen 5:3 (it says Adam gave birth to Seth AFTER 130 years of leaving the Garden)
2. How much time passed AFTER the earth was created but BEFORE the first man (not Adam, but even if you want to argue for Adam it's fine) was created by God? Did time even exist before man was created? Did time even have our assumed meaning prior to the existence of mankind?

Thus, I say if T1 is the answer to question 1 and T2 either tends to infinity, or it is the answer to question 2, then

the age of man is T1 + 6000 year[/b]s and
[b]the age of the earth is the sum of three quantities: T1 + T2 + 6000 years.

What do you think?

@DeepSight:

Deep Sight:

Remember that the activity referred to here is God's activity. Thus the "days" referred to are such periods as would be days for a transcendental being like God. We are made to understand even from the Bible that in the view of God, a thousand earth-years may be as a single day. I do not believe that this refers specifically to 1000 years on earth, but is simply metaphorical for a stupendously long period. An era, if you like. Personally, i believe that God is entirely timeless and so the "days" in question are mere parametres for recording divine activity over very long periods of time in such a manner as to be understood by humans.

That's the proper understanding.

The sabbath being on the sixth human day, is merely a human reflection of what the divine had done. Much as man himself is said to be a small reflection of God, or made in the "image and likeness" of God.

So Kolaxy - understand clearly - nothing in the bible suggests that the Earth is 6000 years old.

It is many millions of years old, and this is a fact.

I agree with that, which is what I also meant when I said man's means of measurement of time is essentially flawed: one can only measure time between two references of time. How do you measure time, then, when the upper limit is unbounded above?

@Kolaxy: I don't think man may be able to put a number to the age of the earth, but it is definitely greater than 6000 years. Permit my analogy, but it's like a caged bird trying to determine the size of the house in which it lives. As much as it may estimate the size of the room in which it is caged, the size of the house is an entirely different matter. Man cannot exist in time, and also attempt to use that same medium of time to estimate the age of the world in which he exists.

Nothing can be grasped without a kind of faith or the other, my dear Goodass, be it in science, religion or any other human endeavour

^^^ Krayola do you know what that "fixed" price of rice in China is? Okay, off-topic. LOL

@Chrisbenogor and Ethanol: Points taken, sirs. I simply took it as an exercise in abstract logical reasoning. But I don't think my God has a problem with my many usual questions.

no, ethanol, i understand you perfectly but you seem to have misunderstood me or so. Nothing and Existentiality are mutually exclusive because the lack of existence is nothingness and the lack of nothingness means existentiality has occurred. If you say they are not mutually exclusive, that means there is an intersection between the two. Pray tell me, what altogether exists and is also nothing? And why would this entity, quantity or substance nullify the role of the prime mover?

let me throw some questions into the mix, it may make us consider some interesting perspectives.

I do not firmly agree with the YEC but I wonder if our definition of the age of the earth is not corrupted by the fact that we imagine that time as we know it has always been in existence (or, more correctly, that the universe has always experienced a translation in time since its inception)

When, with respect to the Universe as portrayed by the Bible, was the time continuum established? Was it shortly after God began all the work, or, because time only made meaning to a finite man and not an infinite God, did the clocks start ticking when the aspects of the universe that would be TANGIBLE to Adam's experience started existing? I.e. Gen 1:3

So can it be possible that the earth and universe all came into existence in space without a passage of time as we know it, and the time continuum began ticking somewhere between Gen 1:1 and 1:3, which would still place the earth's age at roughly 6000 years as far as the limitations of man's measurement of time? (man can only measure time between two established references of time. What happens when the supremum, the initial reference, is unbounded above or does not exist? How do we measure it then? Mathematically speaking, what do you get when you subtract negative infinity from, say, 1000?)

@Ethanol: No more verbose posts for now.

"nothing" and existentiality are mutually exclusive. If prior to existentiality, NOTHING wasnt, the Prime Mover would have no reason to be a prime mover. Think about it.