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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? (17096 Views)
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Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by Janosky: 1:35am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills:2 Corinthians 11:2 . I promised you to one husband, to Christ, so that I might present you as a pure virgin to him." Oga, were the Corinthian believers redeemed @ Revelation 14:3 & Virgins @ Revelation 14:4 to rule with Christ? Oga, were all the Corinthian believers virgins ? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:36am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:It's clearly written, they are Christ's entourage to follow him everywhere he goes. 4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. Again, Revelations 14 did not say these men were with Christ in heaven. They stood with him on mount Sion. Up till now you have not pointed me to where the bible says only these men would be in heaven |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 1:36am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Revelation 14:4 [4]They have kept themselves as pure as virgins, following the Lamb wherever he goes. They have been purchased from among the people on the earth as a special offering to God and to the Lamb. Do you think the kingdom is just for boys in there late teens or early twenties that haven't had sex? What bout people like Paul, Peter Mary and the First 120 people that were baptized with holy spirit? You think Peter is still in the grave now waiting for resurrection while some boys are ruling with Christ? tctrills: |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:37am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky: 2 Corinthians 11:2 very very clearly figurative. I agree no argument. Is your point that every verse in the bible is figurative? I guess Mary was a figurative virgin |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:41am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:I would say, you are making my point, These 144000 are only are part of the kingdom, Christ entourage. Were they special? Yes. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. Were they the only ones to make heaven? No, the bible never indicated such. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 1:44am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills: What does firstfruits unto God mean? Revelation 14:3 [3]This great choir sang a wonderful new song in front of the throne of God and before the four living beings and the twenty-four elders. No one could learn this song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. If i were you i would compare versions of the Bible not stick to KJ versions |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:48am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:It means that God has more than one fruit. Being the first doesn't mean the only fruit. Or the only fruit in heaven. As I said, these were clearly men of great importance in the kingdom. Again, there was no female in this group. They were Jesus's choir. Note the bible didn't even say they were in heaven but mount Sion. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 1:49am On Jan 24, 2022 |
See it's not about making heaven to enjoy. These people get work for there. They are kings and priests. And they are coming to earth to restore things. tctrills: |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:49am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:Can we both agree on something despite our differences? Can we agree that the bible never said these are the only people going to heaven? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 1:54am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills: The point is these people will be resurrected first before the rest and rule with Christ. This the first resurrection. The others will be resurrected when the kingdom comes to earth to fulfill God's will. But the won't go to heaven but live on earth forever! |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:54am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:That they are Kings and Priests, I agree. Everyone that overcomes would be given a crown. I am not reducing the power of these 144000 I am only saying that we are not told they are the only ones to make heaven. I understand it's your doctrine and you believe this, I am only saying that it's not taught in the bible. If you have other scriptures that teach your doctrine, I would be happy to read them and pray about them. But as long as you have only used the bible It would be wrong for me to claim that such is written in the bible |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by Janosky: 1:56am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills:Revelation 1:1, Jesus presented the revelation in signs to John. . 2 Corinthians 11:2 were the Corinthian believers virgins? Oga, shine your eyes. 2 Corinthians 11:2 & Revelation 14:4, are saying the same thing- virginity is in the spiritual sense. Oga, is there gender in the spiritual realm where Jesus is dwelling? You can't convince yourself that every believer in Corinth is a virgin. tctrills: @ 12:05am, you already said "the 144000 were not the only people in heaven" Why do you contradict your own statement? Oga, Mount Zion is a scriptural reference for heaven, Psalms 74:2. Every event in Revelation chapter 14 took place in heaven. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 1:57am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:But they won't go to heaven but live on earth forever! How do you know that these won't go to heaven. Christ would rule over both heaven and earth. Is it written that those on earth cant go to heaven? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:01am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky:I already told you that I agree 2 Corinthians 11:2 is figurative and not literal. I am only saying that revelations 14 is not figurative. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:02am On Jan 24, 2022 |
John 5:28-29 [28]Don’t be so surprised! Indeed, the time is coming when all the dead in their graves will hear the voice of God’s Son, [29]and they will rise again. Those who have done good will rise to experience eternal life, and those who have continued in evil will rise to experience judgment. Daniel 12:2 [2]Many of those whose bodies lie dead and buried will rise up, some to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting disgrace. Their eternal life will continue on earth. tctrills: |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:05am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky:First, are you saying that every word in the bible is figurative? what is your point? So when the bible says Jesus was raised from the dead it means something else? @ 12:05am, you already said "the 144000 were not the only people in heaven" Yes the bible never indicated figuratively or otherwise that these are the only people meant for heaven. the bible did not even mention heaven when talking about them |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:08am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:Their eternal life will continue on earth. I agree that both heaven and earth would be filled with those living eternal life. This has never been the argument. It was you that created an arbitrary number for heaven. That is the discussion. Again we are never told that those on earth would be barred from heaven. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by Janosky: 2:08am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills: Friendship with the world" is adultery in the spiritual sense.. Virginity in Rev 14:4 & 2 Corinthians 11:2 is not literal, but in the spiritual sense, that is, "spotless from the world" |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:10am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills: Revelation 14:3 [3]This great choir sang a wonderful new song in front of the throne of God and before the four living beings and the twenty-four elders. No one could learn this song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. Where were the 144000 learning the song, heaven or not? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:10am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:I need your honesty here, Did the bible in any way set a number for heaven? can you point to any verse that teaches only 1440000 would be in heaven? Again, why only 144000? Doesn't this make God a super failure? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:12am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:We already agree that these 144000 would go to heaven. They were clearly in a heavenly choir. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:14am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Bro you need to read the bible from beginning to end. When this Kingdom comes to earth with Christ, they remain on earth. Revelation 21:2-7 [2]And I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven like a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. [3]I heard a loud shout from the throne, saying, “Look, God’s home is now among his people! He will live with them, and they will be his people. God himself will be with them. [4]He will wipe every tear from their eyes, and there will be no more death or sorrow or crying or pain. All these things are gone forever.” [5]And the one sitting on the throne said, “Look, I am making everything new!” And then he said to me, “Write this down, for what I tell you is trustworthy and true.” [6]And he also said, “It is finished! I am the Alpha and the Omega—the Beginning and the End. To all who are thirsty I will give freely from the springs of the water of life. [7]All who are victorious will inherit all these blessings, and I will be their God, and they will be my children. Go read 1 Corinthians 15:24-28. Read from versions with simpler English not KJV. tctrills: |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:15am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky:Since you believe the entire bible is a figurative book, you can clearly make any verse to be what you want it to be and I can't argue with that. If you tell me Christ's death was figurative, what can I say? These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. not figurative. Please what is the figurative meaning of women here? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:16am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills:. That's good |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by Janosky: 2:17am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills:Jesus Christ raised from the dead is simple and straightforward. tctrills:Revelation 14:1, Where was Jesus Christ going on earth when he gave revelation to John? Psalms 74:2, mount Zion is heaven, simple and straightforward. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:17am On Jan 24, 2022 |
tctrills: It's not and i don't think he meant that. But some phrases are clearly figurative. |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:18am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky:Oh, you only choose to make some verses figurative? Good for you |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:19am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky:2 Samuel 5:7 mount zion city of David |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:21am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy:I agree with you, some phrases are clearly figurative. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. Now in this phrase what is the figurative meaning of women? |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:22am On Jan 24, 2022 |
How many people on earth do you think were virgin till death? Paul didn't marry but we are not sure if he was a virgin before conversion tctrills: |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by cornelboy(f): 2:25am On Jan 24, 2022 |
cornelboy tctrills: |
Re: Are Jehovah Witnesses Right About Their Belief Against Blood Transfusion? by tctrills: 2:26am On Jan 24, 2022 |
Janosky:To the church in Hebrew, paul describes Mount Zion as their membership of the church. Hebrew 12.22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, |
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