Emusan:


Now see the irony of your post!
1. Humans (Including Jesus) don't have anything that lives on after they died.
2. Jesus died and gave His body(SOUL)...meaning, the day Jesus died nothing on Him was live.
3. Jesus' body was never found...since Jesus didn't take it back...
4. Yet Jehovah didn't leave Jesus body in hell...which you tactically change to RESURRECTION...
5. Also, Jehovah RESURRECTED Jesus Christ...

Now, in line of this, WHAT ACTUALLY DID JEHOVAH RESURRECTED from the dead Jesus Christ? Since, Jesus body is gone and no soul that survived the death....

Look at what your own organization has to say about resurrection "In the Bible, the word translated as “resurrection” comes from the Greek
a·naʹsta·sis, which means “raising up” or “standing up again.” A person who is resurrected is raised up from death and restored to life as the person he was before. —1 Corinthians 15:12, 13



If Jesus didn't take the body back, what then did Jehovah take out of hell since he didn't leave Jesus soul(body) in hell?

Why is simple English so hard for you to understand



Imagine, and you can lie without shame like this.

Jesus means both BODY and SOUL are the same.. yet the preceding statement read... "and fear not THEM which KILL THE BODY, but are not ABLE to kill the SOUL: KJV

And do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, fear him who can destroy both soul and body in Ge·henʹna. NWT

This verse is so self explanatory enough that people can KILL the BODY but can't KILL the SOUL but it's only God who can destroy both Body and Soul.

So why did Jesus separate body from soul in the first part?



But the preceding statement was cleared that Jesus spoke about people who kill the body but CAN'T kill soul...

Why would Jesus contradict himself by saying the BODY can be kill but the soul can't be kill by people if both soul and body mean the same thing?

I believe you never see this coming....

The spell from GB must clear from your eyes...it's so evident that watchtower and awake has blocked your eyes from Biblical truth.

OneJ:

source : biblehub.com (nephesh)
Definition
a soul, living being,life, self,person, desire, passion ,appetite, emotion"

Nephesh , soul means life. Therefore its stupidity to quarrel with NWT

The soul that sinneth shalt die but the soul justifieth righteous shall live.
Christ pointed out that the soul can be destroyed, that's proof of mortality , block heads !
Where una see spirit being in the definition of soul (nephesh)?

"The bread I shall give is my flesh in behalf of the life of the world" John 6:51.
"for the son of man....give his life as a RANSOM for many" Mark 10:45
"the SACRIFICE of the body of Jesus Christ once for all Hebrew10:10.

Ransom
". To redeem from captivity, bondage, etc by paying a demanded price"
Sacrifice
"Christ offering of himself "
Source: dictionary.cambridge.org

When u give offering today, shey U go collect am back by fire by force?
What u give as sacrifice ( call am sow seed or any name u want, shey U done take am back?
Una stupidity get PhD. , professorship.

What did Christ voluntarily gave as ransom? His perfect life( soul,flesh).
"Christ was put to death in the flesh but made alive (resurrected) in the spirit"
"It is sown a natural (fleshly) body,it is raised a spiritual body... the first man Adam became a living being (living soul), the last Adam (Christ) a life giving spirit" 1 cor 15:44-47.

He was resurrected with a spiritual body, with the power to materialize into human body (Luke 24:36-39) that is why his apostles couldnt recognize him . Angels did that too when they visited Lot ,Abraham etc. Lazarus was resurrected with same body he died with . He never sacrificed his life as a ransom for the sins of many, which Jesus did.
Receive sense.

MightySparrow:
pls read Heb. 10: 1 - 10; John 6: 22 - 51 and explain. the discourse is getting interesting.

Emusan:


I should read, without knowing the point I want to derive from there...

MightySparrow:
Taking heb. 10: 10 and john 6: 51 only seem not to go along with the trend, just an observation

Emusan:
Now see how you stylishly boycotted Matt 10:28 in your reply.

Jesus said BODY can be kill BUT SOUL can't be kill...

Isn't this enough great evident that SOUL is different from BODY?



Now you've said SOUL=LIFE even when it's obvious from the definition you gave...isn't this delusion?

So if soul means LIFE then we can equally say SOUL means EMOTION, PASSION, desire...

I didn't quarrel with NWT but stating the reason why NWT used LIFE instead of Soul...
Life, Emotion, Passion can be POURED but a soul can't be poured according to your rejection of the personhood of the Holy Spirit.



Christ ONLY said the SOUL can be destroyed BY GOD only, He said people can kill the BODY but can't do the same to the SOUL.

Why are you so dishonest with that verse?



But you're the one who quote Psalms to prove that Jehovah didn't leave Jesus SOUL in the hell.

So isn't SOUL supposed to be the ACUTAL PERSON again?

That was why I asked, what did Jehovah do with Jesus body... the only thing you can do is to change SOUL to mean RAISED in spirit life.

Yet you're still fighting tooth and nail that SOUL IS the Body.




All you're doing here is putting you into more confusion.
Your claim is SOUL is actually the PERSON now for you to explain away Jehovah not leaving Jesus SOUL in hell away, you change it to SPIRIT life...

You're still perambulating,

1. Jesus has a body without anything that survived after death
2. This body went to the grave which means NOTHING exist about Jesus again (base on your logic)
3. Yet Jehovah resurrected the dead Jesus (remember nothing about Jesus exist again)
4. What then did Jehovah resurrect from Jesus Christ?

Your claim here is perfectly fit into RECREATION not RESURRECTION which your organization also agreed with.

So basically you people go against Scripture because Bible never teaches recreation.

orisa37:
.


Right. He shed the Earthly Mould and had The Heavenly Apparel to resurrect with.

Emusan:


I have said it here times without number that the way you JWs show your dishonesty to someone's article is the same way you do to Bible.

The articles have already established that SOUL is PART OF a PERSON! So if the article later went further to talk about soul LIVING IN A BODY, how do you suppose to interpret it?

You are very dishonest.

The article didn't just talk about soul living in a body. It says the person is that soul.

" every PERSON you have ever met is a Soul " !!!

Living persons this is while they are alive not just dead . I will revisit the loopholes in your first response.

Read the above again and again

The other site states " YOU ARE A SOUL " , who is You ? Soul. It now adds " You have a body "

Both emphasized that the Soul is the actually person . but having a body.

But you neglected the first point of the article and hold on to next phrase in the same breath, is that not dishonesty?

What if article like this was found in Watchtower or Awake and people quote the part that suit them, will you have agreed with them?

What is the name of that BODY?

Because of his anguish, he will see and be satisfied. By means of his knowledge the righteous one, my servant, Will bring a righteous standing to many people, And their errors he will bear. For that reason I will assign him a portion among the many, And he will apportion the spoil with the mighty, Because he poured out his life even to death And was counted among the transgressors; He carried the sin of many people, And he interceded for the transgressors. Isaiah 53:11-12 NWT


Where does the word SOUL appear in your own translation?

My question still remains unanswered!

Emusan:


This is the actual part I want to address because here is your mistake, you added your own assumption where the writer didn't.



From the above two link you provided I came with this part that either you deliberately ignored or couldn't understand.

compellingthetruth.org "The human soul is that part of a person that is eternal —the part that lives on after the body dies and decays."

gotquestions.org "Simply stated, the human soul is the part of a person that is not physical."

What was your own assumption? You assumed that THE PERSON is mainly the SOUL whereas both articles established that the SOUL is PART of that person.


NOTE: Emphasis must be placed here, the only condition SOUL can be also referred to as PERSON is after DEATH where the SOUL is now the actual person in the SPIRIT REALM.


You got it wrong when you think people only refer to soul as person including when the person is still alive.

gotquewtions.org said this "The human soul is central to the personhood of a human being.

To your question, Jesus person died for our sin by giving His BODY!

Now my question, if SOUL is just the person, why did Bible never use the word SOUL for Jesus sacrifice?

OneJ:
1) To quote U "Jesus said body can be kill but soul can't be kill"
Christ pointed out " Be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul & body in hell".
If Arsenal can not beat Man Utd but Chelsea beats Man Utd, does it mean that Man Utd is Unbeatable ?
Receive sense..
Hebrew word for body 'quivah ' meaning living human (that is, a person, living being ) This is synonymous with nephesh (soul,person, living being). If a living being,a soul lives, likewise, dead being, a dead soul exists.
Receive sense !
Why are U guys afraid of references to Hebrew & Greek? The answer is obvious. It's is the authentic means to expose your lies.

2) U said "If soul means life, then we can equally say soul means emotion,passion, desire" Yes.
But in the context of Matt10:28, soul strictly means life, person, living being.
For instance," Engaged" means busy or 'about to marry'. If someone asks "what's your marital status", but U being a married man replied 'i'm engaged' . It's way out of context.

3) U said" Jehovah didn't leave Jesus soul in hell". Don't get it twisted out of context.
That statement means that " the person (the soul) we call Jesus was resurrected as a spirit being ("made alive in the spirit" by Jehovah God. 1 Pet 3:18.
In other words, God brought Christ (resurrected him) back to existence with the body of a spirit (spiritual body like that of angels). 1 cor 15:44,-47.
Receive sense..

Barristter07:


It's not an exagerration to say you are confused yourself .

Am addressing the Red part , Biggest dishonesty ever exhibited.

The Website refers to a living person as the Soul.

Every PERSON you have ever met, Is a Soul

While they are alive contrary to your claim.

You later admit the Soul is the actual person , But added a Clause , after death .

Gradually it would be exposed.

The question regarding that phrase: part of a person is:

If the Soul is just the part of a person ,For the person to be declared dead , Will the soul not die ?

Is the person dead if the persons part is alive ??

REGARDING the clause. After death



The same person that once have a body ?

Barristter07:




You are very dishonest.

The article didn't just talk about soul living in a body. It says the person is that soul.

" every PERSON you have ever met is a Soul " !!!

Living persons this is while they are alive not just dead . I will revisit the loopholes in your first response.

Read the above again and again

The other site states " YOU ARE A SOUL " , who is You ? Soul. It now adds " You have a body "

Both emphasized that the Soul is the actually person . but having a body.






their Real intent has been exposed above , Yoi are Soul . just having a body



Just a body the Soul [ Jesus] lives in.

' You are a soul , You HAVE a body ' got question

So clear

No amount of dribbling can save you out of this . NWT footnote " OR SOUL " .


Therefore I will divide him a portion with the many, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong, because he poured out his soul to death and was numbered with the transgressors; yet he bore the sin of many, and makes intercession for the transgressors. " Isaiah 53:12 ESV , KJV too

So Can you see his Soul have to die?

Emusan:


Your delusions are getting clearer.

So the soul is the person but what of the body
Can you see where your ignorance exposed?

Without the body can you know the person of the soul on this earth?



I can't stop laughing at you...
So Jesus POURED his soul(body) to death, how can a person be poured?

Like I said to your brother, one of the reasons why JWs rejected the personhood of the Holy Spirit is because they said Bible describes Holy Spirit as being POURED upon people. Then concluded a person cant be poured.

But here you're trying to claim now that a person was POURED to death.

The reason why the content of that scripture supported life than just ordinary BODY is because of the preceding statement POUR OUT...that's why even your NWT could use LIFE...

Emusan:


I have shown how your. dishonesty is about those articles.

Soul can't die

What I mean by after death is...why the soul is still inside the body, the body expresses the IMAGE of the invincible soul inside after death the physical image is gone leaving the invincible image of the soul which can only be seen spiritually.

Emusan:


This statement of yours is the one that buried your argument..."To quote U "Jesus said body can be kill but soul can't be kill"

See your wack analogy, Arsenal and Man Utd.

The statement of Jesus indicated that NO HUMAN CAN KILL the Soul even though they can kill the body but TO DESTROY the Soul, it's what ONLY GOD can do.

Notice the interchange words KILL and DESTROY




So you mean Jesus didn't know what He was saying when He said "And do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul;"

It's very evident that Jesus sets the distinction between BODY AND SOUL in the verse but you twister twisted it to suit your lies.



But the person (the soul) we call Jesus was no more IN THE GRAVE...what then did Jehovah resurrect?

Nothing of the person we called Jesus was in the grave;
>His body vanished
>His soul was actually the body that vanished

Then what was in the grave that Jehovah resurrected

alBHAGDADI:
All these JW guys, I thought we already settled this.

Jehovah's witnesses say the human is the soul and that when a person dies, that is his end because the soul dies. They believe the soul doesn't go on living. That means if a man kills a Jehovah's witness, he has destroyed his soul. But is that what Jesus said?

Mathew 10:28

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


If the soul can be killed by humans, why then did Jesus say they can't destroy the soul? The above verse shows Jesus putting a clear distinction between the body and soul. But heretic Jehovah's witnesses say the soul dies when a man dies.

Barristter07:


Shows how confused they are , I never assumed anything.

Based on this statement made by compelling truth , " every person you have ever met IS A SOUL , living in a body . emphasis on " living in " shows clear distinction that the body is not the person.

The person is that Soul , living in that body ... Do you agree with this ?




Means he never died .

He was living in a body , Agree ?



It did . Isaiah 53:11,12

OneJ:


Context is key. Nephesh or soul in the bible is strictly about the earthly realm of life. That word nephesh,soul never refers to spirit being

alBHAGDADI:
So, as Jesus has paid the ransom for our sins, he can't have his body back. That means his body is with who now? Satan?

God didn't leave Jesus body in hell, He resurrected it. Otherwise it would mean Jesus didn't conquer death and our hope is in vain.

1 Corinthians 15:14

And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.

You believe Jesus resurrected. Then how can you say what resurrected is different from what died? Isn't that a scam?

What you are saying is that Satan is now in possession of Jesus, so God formed a new Jesus and sold that to us as the resurrected Jesus. Let man be a liar.

@bold Why are you lying on Jesus like this? You say Jesus said the soul is not immortal. Then how come some will have everlasting life and others everlasting punishment?

Mathew 25:46

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Matthew 13:41-43
The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

@bold2

If you say Jesus confirmed that both body and soul are together, and that when one is killed, the other dies in the process, how come Jesus said we shouldn't be afraid of those who can only kill the body but not the soul? Doesn't that show that after the body dies, something goes on living?

During the resurrection of the righteous and the wicked, the wicked are then thrown both body and soul into hell, which is the second death where they face eternal punishment. The righteous face the opposite which is eternal life. The word eternal which you find in ETERNAL PUNISHMENT shows that they won't die. If they were just gong to die off, then there would not be anything eternal about the punishment.

Eternal life means life everlasting, it doesn't end. Eternal punishment means everlasting punishment, it doesn't end. How then can the Bible say God is punishing someone eternally when the person is dead and no longer existing? Can you see your flaw?

Jozzy4:


Face the issue Oga ,

Let me shock you.



King James Bible
And that day Joshua took Makkedah, and smote it with the edge of the sword, and the king thereof he utterly destroyed, them, and all the souls that were therein; he let none remain: and he did to the king of Makkedah as he did unto the king of Jericho. " Joshua 10:28

Didn't Joshua destroy souls ?

U lack understanding. Did Jesus soul die or not ?

@ Purple : Chairman, people died and their Bodies go to hell ? I need answer o .

OneJ:


These your wayo assumptions were addressed in my first post on this thread. The bible does not support pagan ideas of ancient Greek philosophical thought.
Take your time to read & digest the truth.
To your last question:
Isaiah 53:11,12
"After the suffering of his soul, he will see the light of life..... my righteous servant will justify many and will bear their iniquities.... "

sonmvayina:


But the suffering servant in Isaiah is Israel... Why are you relating it to jesus?

alBHAGDADI:
Look at how happy you are thinking you have caught me in a tight corner. Didn't someone just showed you all that the Hebrew word for soul which is Nephesh means different things e.g soul, life etc? Now you quoted the below verse just to bust Mathew 10:28 which distinguished soul and body.

King James Bible
And that day Joshua took Makkedah, and smote it with the edge of the sword, and the king thereof he utterly destroyed, them, and all the souls that were therein; he let none remain: and he did to the king of Makkedah as he did unto the king of Jericho. " Joshua 10:28


According to you, since Joshua destroyed the souls of those mentioned, it means that was their end, no part of them went on living. Isn't that a contradiction if Jesus words below?


Mathew 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to
destroy both soul and body in hell.

Jesus said mankind cannot destroy the soul, they can only destroy the body. It is only God that can destroy both body and soul. Are you now trying to say Joshua is God because the verse you quoted said he destroyed the soul of some people, soul which also means life and many other things?

Can you now see your wrong?

OneJ:


Pls pick up your Bible & read that entire chapter 53 of Isaiah.

OneJ:


Pls pick up your Bible & read that entire chapter 53 of Isaiah.

alBHAGDADI:
Look at how happy you are thinking you have caught me in a tight corner. Didn't someone just showed you all that the Hebrew word for soul which is Nephesh means different things e.g soul, life etc? Now you quoted the below verse just to bust Mathew 10:28 which distinguished soul and body.

King James Bible
And that day Joshua took Makkedah, and smote it with the edge of the sword, and the king thereof he utterly destroyed, them, and all the souls that were therein; he let none remain: and he did to the king of Makkedah as he did unto the king of Jericho. " Joshua 10:28


According to you, since Joshua destroyed the souls of those mentioned, it means that was their end, no part of them went on living. Isn't that a contradiction if Jesus words below?


Mathew 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to
destroy both soul and body in hell.

Jesus said mankind cannot destroy the soul, they can only destroy the body. It is only God that can destroy both body and soul. Are you now trying to say Joshua is God because the verse you quoted said he destroyed the soul of some people, soul which also means life and many other things?

Can you now see your wrong?

Barristter07:


Shows how confused they are , I never assumed anything.

Based on this statement made by compelling truth , " every person you have ever met IS A SOUL , living in a body . emphasis on " living in " shows clear distinction that the body is not the person.

The person is that Soul , living in that body ... Do you agree with this ?




Means he never died .

He was living in a body , Agree ?



It did . Isaiah 53:11,12

Jozzy4:



See what , which wrong

Oga address the verses .

For your information, same Nephesh that Joshua destroyed is what Jesus is referring to.


My question still there : is it Jesus that die or ordinary representation ?

OneJ:



Hahahahahahaaaa .

Destroy, (definition)
"End the existence of some thing.."

Kill, (definition)
"put an end to something.."

Both, adverb. ( definition)
"Used before the first two alternatives to emphasize that the statement being made applies to each other (the other alternative being introduced by 'and').
For example "both body and soul" have the same meaning oooo...

"What good is it for a man to gain the whole world, yet FORFEIT his SOUL?" Mark 8:36.

Forfeit, definition
"To LOSE the right to do or have some thing.."

Source : dictionary.cambridge.org


In Mark 8:36, that man who "forfeit his soul" , forfeits (lose) his life (he died).
Jesus gives further proof that a soul dies.
The soul is mortal , NOT immortal.

Let the truth set U free.