davidnazee:


Since u like giving references why don’t u give a reference or show any academic work or documentations that says the Benin Massacre and the Benin punitive expedition is the same thing. [s]show just one and then maybe I will give u the many references that u so desire.
they are 2 different events that are related (one led to the other).

The massacre that was referred to in Benin Massacre is the massacre of captain Phillip and his entourage and this led to the Punitive Expedition.. But u too dumb to understand.[/s]

TAO11:
It's been some time that I've been hoping to create a quite detailed academic thread on the primacy and the imperial might of ancient Ife in the West Africa region.

People generally tend to over-focus their attention solely on Oyo and Benin kingdoms, thus often ignoring the fact that before these two kingdoms attained "imperial" status (or even before they were founded), the West African region had a military, economic, artistic, and religious advanced super power --- Ife.

In fact, the insult gets more worrissom when some even dare to ask who is greater Ooni or Alaafin? Some even ask Ooni or Oba of Benin?

It's no more than asking which is brighter: a sunny day or a moonless night?

These unfortunate comparisons pop-up on Nairaland, I think because, most discussions about ancient Ife almost always centers around the mythical aspects only with little or no academic substantiation.

It's hightime amateurish non-acadamic pseudo-historical narratives are dropped for good, and history is presented as it was, and as is been preserved in extant historical sources.

Someone should please guide me with a simple step-by-step procedure to creating a thread.This topic is long overdue.

I am obviously not very savvy with interacting with this platform.

Thanks!

cc:
Olu317
Obalufon
ImperialYoruba
Sewgon79
2fine2fast
Amujale

gregyboy
ghostwon

ghostwon:


The story about ife is a myth.
There is no record of ife being any kind of power.
The british made the ooni of ife relevant and he served the british interests, he was very faithful to the british.

Oyo was never recorded as an empire, too much rewriting of history is going on.
The only empire recorded in the south is Benin

But out of low self esteem nigerians all want to create their own version of history in which their ancestors were conquerors.
As if that would change anything in their lives.
Let us just accept history and stop distorting it.
We can't change the passed but we can build the future.
Israelis are all descendents of slaves, yet their country is very powerful today (among the strongest 8 nuclear world powers).
History is important, because when you know your history, not some fables, nobody can push you around and say things like: "blacks had no civilisation before the whites arrived" or "blacks lived like monkeys before the coming of the whites". A lot of black youth have an incredibly low self-esteem because the fables being told to them do not withstand the test of logics, and when they understand that they have been told a lie, they fall from a very high horse and lose all self-esteem.
So people, stop passing fables as history.
Let us teach the actual history to our kids and adults.

Thank you.

TAO11:


Hey insecure little one, listen up:

First of all:
In response to your blasphemy and sacrilege against Ile-Ife, I hereby present the following topmost tip of the ice-berg before you, prior to my intended post which I will publish perhaps tommorrow:

"... Oba Oguola (Oba of Benin) --- supposed to have reigned about A.D. 1280 --- applied to his spiritual overlord, the Oni of Ife, for the service of a bronze founder to teach his people to make the memorial bronzes formerly imported from Ife, ..."

Reference: Margaret Plass, "The Art of Benin: An Evaluation Based on Discussions with William Fagg, Deputy Keeper of Ethnography in the British Museum"

See also: https://www.penn.museum/sites/expedition/the-art-of-benin/) for details.

Secondly:
Talking about low self-esteem, who must deem a kingdom as imperial before you (ghostwon) will agree to regard it as such?? Who??

Moreover, I am waiting patienyly for the evidence to support your imagination that only Benin was an empire in the southern Nigeria region.

In fact, Benin is more known merely as a kingdom than as an empire by most authoritative historical sources in contrast to Oyo.

But to strangle you with some very obvious facts anyway, the Great Oyo Empire is so referred even by some of the sources from your slave-masters, viz. Encyclopaedia Britannica.

See https://www.britannica.com/place/Oyo-empire and also see attached screenshot.

For Ife's primacy and imperial status, that is not obvious except to academic historians, and that will be the focus of my intended post.

Please don't attempt to hasten my punishment on you.

ghostwon:


The story about ife is a myth.
There is no record of ife being any kind of power.
The british made the ooni of ife relevant and he served the british interests, he was very faithful to the british.

Oyo was never recorded as an empire, too much rewriting of history is going on.
The only empire recorded in the south is Benin empire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp8flCwvoAU&t=110s

But out of low self esteem nigerians all want to create their own version of history in which their ancestors were conquerors.
As if that would change anything in their lives.
Let us just accept history and stop distorting it.
We can't change the passed but we can build the future.
Israelis are all descendents of slaves, yet their country is very powerful today (among the strongest 8 nuclear world powers).
History is important, because when you know your history, not some fables, nobody can push you around and say things like: "blacks had no civilisation before the whites arrived" or "blacks lived like monkeys before the coming of the whites". A lot of black youth have an incredibly low self-esteem because the fables being told to them do not withstand the test of logics, and when they understand that they have been told a lie, they fall from a very high horse and lose all self-esteem.
So people, stop passing fables as history.
Let us teach the actual history to our kids and adults.

Thank you.

ghostwon:


(1) I thought you had given up your lying and deceptive ways and was finally ready to actually study history. Rather than that you are still hanging up to your fanatism.

(2) For your information in 1280 nobody who could write had visited west our region. So the story which you are telling is just another story, a myth.

3. [s]Look, I don't know how old you are but stop wasting my time. This is not a game for me, in my spare time I would actually love to educate you guys whose nigerian education has failed very badly. Once again recieve sense:[/s]


(4) No need to reply me.

[s]You are uneducateable. Too much fanatism in you. To you, this is a fight, to me this is a researche for the truth, with proof.[/s]

(5) Keep quoting blogs and illogical texts...

[s]But ask yourself what your real aim is: you know I am too smart to fall for your antics, and you know you are blinded by your yoruba-centric feelings.

So what is the point of talking to me ?
We are not following the same rules, we are not of the same intlectual calibre.

You are a clown who knows nothing he talks about and relies extensively on google as a substitution for your lack of knowledge and sense.

Get an education kid. Google will never replace education. Let me show you a glimps of whom you are talking to. Your dreams of your ooni being an overlord of anybody what so ever are just dreams.

It is cool to dream. But when you start confusing your dreams with reality and using google as a substitution for a brain, then you have a problem.[/s]

TAO11:


Warning!!! The following comment contains logic, reason, proof, and historical references:

I'm about to explain how "infinitesimal calculus" works to a "pre-schooler". Isn't that a "failed" mission even before beginning at all? Lol.

I will proceed, anyways, only for the sake of the unsuspecting and untrained readers whom you're all out to deliberately trick.

(1) Now that you've began your comment above with accusations of lies and deception, by the end of this comment we would have seen to what extent your accusations hold water.

Having said that, to what extent are you, the accuser, even truthful, straightforward, and consistent with your successive claims? Let's find out:

(a) You had noted that it was the bRiTiSh who made the Ooni of Ife relevant.

You have, however, shamelessly failed repeatedly to substantiate the foregoing insanely ridiculous claim with any shred of historical evidence. How truthful and straightforward of you!

Oh I have an idea! The evidence you're too shy to provide could be that the British monarchy originally derives from Ile-Ife, hence the unwavering loyalty of the British to make the Ooni relevant, and rubbish Ovonramwen in contrast.

(b) You had noted that Oyo was never recorded as an empire, and that the only empire recorded in the south of today's Nigeria is Benin.

Well, just like the above you've repeatedly failed up to this point to adduce even one letter of the alphabet in an attempt to substantiate this utterly ridiculous grandiose claim, despite being challenged to do so, and despite the Encyclopaedia Britannica evidence to the contrary. How truthful and straightforward of you!

Need I continue on your truthfulness and straighforwardness?

You noted that you had expected me to be "finally ready to actually study history", which obviously means that I should prioritize the submissions of the experts, historians, archaeologists, et al. over and above my personal wish (which is what I do anyway).

However, you couldn't wait to contradict your self when, in point number (2), you noted that the account I had culled from "The Art of Benin" (by Margaret Plass and with heavy inputs from William Fagg) is a myth.

How could you possibly, with a stable mind demand historical accounts and then turn around to scream "myth" when your request is put before you citing "The Art of Benin" an academic article published in The Penn Museum's Expedition, Vol. 1, Issue 4, Summer 1959, with inputs from experts --- Margaret Plass and William Fagg??

The only logical explanation behind why you became unstable is that you personally passionately dislike what the account says.

Let me know if there is a different reason why you became unstable.


(2) Furthermore, you noted that nobody who could write had visited the West Africa region in the year 1280, hence the account of the historians (which I only cited, and with verifiable referencing) is false.

Not only are your claims here obviously mutually contradictory, laughable, and without any shred of right thinking whatsoever; how you manage to beleive you're right and the experts of Benin History are all wrong is still beyond me.

Anyways, I am happy to educate you, and obliterate some of the ignorant assumptions behind your laughable and mutually contradictory claims here.

(a) The earliest Portuguese seafarers (led by João Afonso d'Avieros) who visited in the year 1480 are not the earliest literate travellers to visit the West Africa region.

(b) Literate travellers, chroniclers, historians, or seafarers, et al. have visited the West Africa region and documented customs, etc. prior to the 1400s.

(c) In fact, the explorer and scholar Ibn Battûta documented in his 1352 Voyages to Asia and Africa about the Mâlli kingdom and its wealthy sovereign, as well as about the Ife country and its "powerful" sovereign.

The popularity, in Europe, of his account on these West African monarchies led the Europeans to beleive that one of them may be the legendary Prester John.

(d) Furthermore, it is utterly absurd and unthinkable to contend that extremely important names, events, and customs about the year 1280 would have been completely wiped off the memory of every living individual in the West Africa region at the time Ibn Battûta visited the region.

(e) Moreover, contrary to your amateurish subtle spinning, the account does not definitively establish the year to be 1280. Rather, as is to be expected, it was given along the professional lines of circa1280.

(e) However, what is most important in the final analysis is that:

If presented with the options of choosing between what you (ghostwon) have to say, and what the academics and experts (i.e. Margaret Plass, William Fagg, et al.) have to say on the Ife-Benin relationship; every right thinking, stable, and sane human being will go with the experts and forsake you.

And as I have cited earlier, the submission of the experts in this regard (which you obviously strongly dislike) is that:

The kings of Benin kingdom acknowledge the kings of Ife as their overlord --- spiritual overlord for that matter.

Reference:
Margaret Plass, The Art of Benin: "An Evaluation Based on Discussions with William Fagg, Deputy Keeper of Ethnography in the British Museum", The Penn Museum's Expedition, Vol. 1, Issue 4, Summer 1959, p. 2.

See also attachment below.

(4) Did you just say no need to reply you??

Is this how you will plead for mercy?? Lol. Anyways, there is no need pleading with me not to expose you for the fatuous liar that you are.

As it is obvious from all the foregoing and the following, your pleading clearly fell on deaf ears.


(5) Okay, now at this point you need to be clear and specific. Which of my references is the "blog" and which one is the "illogical texts"?? Lol.

Is it the Penn Museum academic article published in Vol. 1, Issue 4, of Summer 1959 Expedition publication you refer to as "blog"/"illogical text"; or the Encyclopaedia Britannica??

You clearly have some tough explaining to do here!

One last thing, you whined so much about "Google", whew!

Now get this straight, "Google" is a web search engine which assists with searching for text in publicly accessible documents offered by web servers.

In other words, it is a portal to diverse resources (academic or non-academic, "good" or "bad" ) on the World Wide Web.

It opens up the virtual alternative to your much beloved physical buildings called libraries which also contain diverse resources (academic or non-academic, "good" or "bad" ).

It's pathetic that I have to walk you through all of these about "Google".

Remind me what your problem with "Google" is one last time.



I wish you all the best in your ongoing battle with reality.

Yours faithfully, a logical person.

cc:
Sewgon79
2fine2fast

ghostwon:


I thought you had given up your lying and deceptive ways and was finally ready to actually study history.
Rather than that you are still hanging on to your fanatism.
For your information in 1280 nobody who could write had visited our region. So the story which you are telling is just an other story, a myth.
Look, I don't know how old you are but stop wasting my time. This is not a game for me, in my spare time I would actually love to educate you guys whose nigerian education has failed very badly.
Once again recieve sense:

ghostwon post=87620796:


The story about ife is a myth.
There is no record of ife being any kind of power.
The british made the ooni of ife relevant and he served the british interests, he was very faithful to the british.

Oyo was never recorded as an empire, too much rewriting of history is going on.
The only empire recorded in the south is Benin empire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp8flCwvoAU&t=110s

But out of low self esteem nigerians all want to create their own version of history in which their ancestors were conquerors.
As if that would change anything in their lives.
Let us just accept history and stop distorting it.
We can't change the passed but we can build the future.
Israelis are all descendents of slaves, yet their country is very powerful today (among the strongest 8 nuclear world powers).
History is important, because when you know your history, not some fables, nobody can push you around and say things like: "blacks had no civilisation before the whites arrived" or "blacks lived like monkeys before the coming of the whites". A lot of black youth have an incredibly low self-esteem because the fables being told to them do not withstand the test of logics, and when they understand that they have been told a lie, they fall from a very high horse and lose all self-esteem.
So people, stop passing fables as history.
Let us teach the actual history to our kids and adults.

Thank you.

No need to reply me. You are uneducateable. Too much fanatism in you. To you, this is a fight, to me this is a researche for the truth, with proof. Keep quoting blogs and illogical texts...
But ask yourself what your real aim is: you know I am too smart to fall for your antics, and you know you are blinded by your yoruba-centric feelings.
So what is the point of talking to me ?
We are not following the same rules, we are not of the same intlectual calibre.
You are a clown who knows nothing he talks about and relies extensively on google as a substitution for your lack of knowledge and sense.
Get an education kid.
Google will never replace education.
Let me show you a glimps of whom you are talking to. (I tried posting some of my work, but they are all too big for this forum, it didn't go through).
Your dreams of your ooni being an overlord of anybody what so ever are just dreams.
It is cool to dream. But when you start confusing your dreams with reality and using google as a substitution for a brain, then you have a problem.

TAO11:


Warning!!! The following comment contains logic, reason, proof, and historical references:

I'm about to explain how "infinitesimal calculus" works to a "pre-schooler". Isn't that a "failed" mission even before beginning at all? Lol.

I will proceed, anyways, only for the sake of the unsuspecting and untrained readers whom you're all out to deliberately trick.

(1) Now that you've began your comment above with accusations of lies and deception, by the end of this comment we would have seen to what extent your accusations hold water.

Having said that, to what extent are you, the accuser, even truthful, straightforward, and consistent with your successive claims? Let's find out:

(a) You had noted that it was the bRiTiSh who made the Ooni of Ife relevant.

You have, however, shamelessly failed repeatedly to substantiate the foregoing insanely ridiculous claim with any shred of historical evidence. How truthful and straightforward of you!

Oh I have an idea! The evidence you're too shy to provide could be that the British monarchy originally derives from Ile-Ife, hence the unwavering loyalty of the British to make the Ooni relevant, and rubbish Ovonramwen in contrast.

(b) You had noted that Oyo was never recorded as an empire, and that the only empire recorded in the south of today's Nigeria is Benin.

Well, just like the above you've repeatedly failed up to this point to adduce even one letter of the alphabet in an attempt to substantiate this utterly ridiculous grandiose claim, despite being challenged to do so, and despite the Encyclopaedia Britannica evidence to the contrary. How truthful and straightforward of you!

Need I continue on your truthfulness and straighforwardness?

You noted that you had expected me to be "finally ready to actually study history", which obviously means that I should prioritize the submissions of the experts, historians, archaeologists, et al. over and above my personal wish (which is what I do anyway).

However, you couldn't wait to contradict your self when, in point number (2), you noted that the account I had culled from "The Art of Benin" (by Margaret Plass and with heavy inputs from William Fagg) is a myth.

How could you possibly, with a stable mind demand historical accounts and then turn around to scream "myth" when your request is put before you citing "The Art of Benin" an academic article published in The Penn Museum's Expedition, Vol. 1, Issue 4, Summer 1959, with inputs from experts --- Margaret Plass and William Fagg??

The only logical explanation behind why you became unstable is that you personally passionately dislike what the account says.

Let me know if there is a different reason why you became unstable.


(2) Furthermore, you noted that nobody who could write had visited the West Africa region in the year 1280, hence the account of the historians (which I only cited, and with verifiable referencing) is false.

Not only are your claims here obviously mutually contradictory, laughable, and without any shred of right thinking whatsoever; how you manage to beleive you're right and the experts of Benin History are all wrong is still beyond me.

Anyways, I am happy to educate you, and obliterate some of the ignorant assumptions behind your laughable and mutually contradictory claims here.

(a) The earliest Portuguese seafarers (led by João Afonso d'Avieros) who visited in the year 1480 are not the earliest literate travellers to visit the West Africa region.

(b) Literate travellers, chroniclers, historians, or seafarers, et al. have visited the West Africa region and documented customs, etc. prior to the 1400s.

(c) In fact, the explorer and scholar Ibn Battûta documented in his 1352 Voyages to Asia and Africa about the Mâlli kingdom and its wealthy sovereign, as well as about the Ife country and its "powerful" sovereign.

The popularity, in Europe, of his account on these West African monarchies led the Europeans to beleive that one of them may be the legendary Prester John.

(d) Furthermore, it is utterly absurd and unthinkable to contend that extremely important names, events, and customs about the year 1280 would have been completely wiped off the memory of every living individual in the West Africa region at the time Ibn Battûta visited the region.

(e) Moreover, contrary to your amateurish subtle spinning, the account does not definitively establish the year to be 1280. Rather, as is to be expected, it was given along the professional lines of circa1280.

(e) However, what is most important in the final analysis is that:

If presented with the options of choosing between what you (ghostwon) have to say, and what the academics and experts (i.e. Margaret Plass, William Fagg, et al.) have to say on the Ife-Benin relationship; every right thinking, stable, and sane human being will go with the experts and forsake you.

And as I have cited earlier, the submission of the experts in this regard (which you obviously strongly dislike) is that:

The kings of Benin kingdom acknowledge the kings of Ife as their overlord --- spiritual overlord for that matter.

Reference:
Margaret Plass, The Art of Benin: "An Evaluation Based on Discussions with William Fagg, Deputy Keeper of Ethnography in the British Museum", The Penn Museum's Expedition, Vol. 1, Issue 4, Summer 1959, p. 2.

See also attachment below.

(4) Did you just say no need to reply you??

Is this how you will plead for mercy?? Lol. Anyways, there is no need pleading with me not to expose you for the fatuous liar that you are.

As it is obvious from all the foregoing and the following, your pleading clearly fell on deaf ears.


(5) Okay, now at this point you need to be clear and specific. Which of my references is the "blog" and which one is the "illogical texts"?? Lol.

Is it the Penn Museum academic article published in Vol. 1, Issue 4, of Summer 1959 Expedition publication you refer to as "blog"/"illogical text"; or the Encyclopaedia Britannica??

You clearly have some tough explaining to do here!

One last thing, you whined so much about "Google", whew!

Now get this straight, "Google" is a web search engine which assists with searching for text in publicly accessible documents offered by web servers.

In other words, it is a portal to diverse resources (academic or non-academic, "good" or "bad" ) on the World Wide Web.

It opens up the virtual alternative to your much beloved physical buildings called libraries which also contain diverse resources (academic or non-academic, "good" or "bad" ).

It's pathetic that I have to walk you through all of these about "Google".

Remind me what your problem with "Google" is one last time.



I wish you all the best in your ongoing battle with reality.

Yours faithfully, a logical person.

cc:
Sewgon79
2fine2fast

davidnazee:


It seems the title "spiritual overlord" is exciting you and thereby confusing your small brain.. You don't even know what spiritual overlord implies because you are dumb like I said.. Please go find out what that term really means..
The pope in early times was spiritual overlord to kings of England, France and many European countries.. Does that mean Vatican was a powerful kingdom/empire or the pope greater than those kings?
Boy you are really dumb.. Go learn some more before you keep talking rubbish..
Nobody knows Ife.. Even you dont know Ife, only times Ife is mentioned is when discussing Great Benin..
Ife was never a kingdom, only a place of worship.

TAO11:
It's been some time that I've been hoping to create a quite detailed academic thread on the primacy and the imperial might of ancient Ife in the West Africa region.

People generally tend to over-focus their attention solely on Oyo and Benin kingdoms, thus often ignoring the fact that before these two kingdoms attained "imperial" status (or even before they were founded), the West African region had a military, economic, artistic, and religious advanced super power --- Ife.

In fact, the insult gets more worrissom when some even dare to ask who is greater Ooni or Alaafin? Some even ask Ooni or Oba of Benin?

It's no more than asking which is brighter: a sunny day or a moonless night?

These unfortunate comparisons pop-up on Nairaland, I think because, most discussions about ancient Ife almost always centers around the mythical aspects only with little or no academic substantiation.

It's hightime amateurish non-acadamic pseudo-historical narratives are dropped for good, and history is presented as it was, and as is been preserved in extant historical sources.

Someone should please guide me with a simple step-by-step procedure to creating a thread.This topic is long overdue.

I am obviously not very savvy with interacting with this platform.

Thanks!

cc:
Olu317
Obalufon
ImperialYoruba
Sewgon79
2fine2fast
Amujale

gregyboy
ghostwon

davidnazee:


If you want to be excited I can tell u stories of Benin’s many wars in Yorubaland.. our many conquests and enslavement of Yorubas.

davidnazee:


I won’t give u any reference because it’s obvious it won’t make any difference to u especially as you don’t even know how the name “Benin Massacre” came about.
FYI “Benin Massacre” is title of the book written by the survivor from captain Philips crew. That’s when that name was first used, he wrote a book describing the events of that day. He was the one that named that event Benin Massacre and since then people like you confuse it to mean the punitive expedition.

If you are wise you will know that the British will never use the term “Massacre” to describe any of their atrocities in Africa.

Anyways like I said earlier, you are dumb and won’t understand so bye little boy.

Sewgon79:
That is reason Ijebu was not colonised till today.

Sewgon79:


See you, you are shouting here as if it is only Benin that fought British Colonial. Have you heard about Imagbon War. Maybe you should do. Ijebu are not coward that will just kill unprepared British soldiers, we ijebu fight them battles for battle. That is reason Ijebu was not colonised till today.

The British army all sleep off and disappeared till today. Nothing to write stories about. British were stop at entry of Imagbon coming through Benin into Ijebu.

Go and confirm, our king didn't need to run, we were not conquered.

TAO11:
It's been some time that I've been hoping to create a quite detailed academic thread on the primacy and the imperial might of ancient Ife in the West Africa region.

People generally tend to over-focus their attention solely on Oyo and Benin kingdoms, thus often ignoring the fact that before these two kingdoms attained "imperial" status (or even before they were founded), the West African region had a military, economic, artistic, and religious advanced super power --- Ife.

In fact, the insult gets more worrissom when some even dare to ask who is greater Ooni or Alaafin? Some even ask Ooni or Oba of Benin?

It's no more than asking which is brighter: a sunny day or a moonless night?

These unfortunate comparisons pop-up on Nairaland, I think because, most discussions about ancient Ife almost always centers around the mythical aspects only with little or no academic substantiation.

It's hightime amateurish non-acadamic pseudo-historical narratives are dropped for good, and history is presented as it was, and as is been preserved in extant historical sources.

Someone should please guide me with a simple step-by-step procedure to creating a thread.This topic is long overdue.

I am obviously not very savvy with interacting with this platform.

Thanks!

cc:
Olu317
Obalufon
ImperialYoruba
Sewgon79
2fine2fast
Amujale

gregyboy
ghostwon

ghostwon:


The story about ife is a myth.
There is no record of ife being any kind of power.
The british made the ooni of ife relevant and he served the british interests, he was very faithful to the british.

Oyo was never recorded as an empire, too much rewriting of history is going on.
The only empire recorded in the south is Benin empire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp8flCwvoAU&t=110s

But out of low self esteem nigerians all want to create their own version of history in which their ancestors were conquerors.
As if that would change anything in their lives.
Let us just accept history and stop distorting it.
We can't change the passed but we can build the future.
Israelis are all descendents of slaves, yet their country is very powerful today (among the strongest 8 nuclear world powers).
History is important, because when you know your history, not some fables, nobody can push you around and say things like: "blacks had no civilisation before the whites arrived" or "blacks lived like monkeys before the coming of the whites". A lot of black youth have an incredibly low self-esteem because the fables being told to them do not withstand the test of logics, and when they understand that they have been told a lie, they fall from a very high horse and lose all self-esteem.
So people, stop passing fables as history.
Let us teach the actual history to our kids and adults.

Thank you.

ghostwon:


I hope you know Jebu is part of Nigeria, meaning you guys were colonized ! So why are you speaking such nonesense ?

Your king surrendered to a mere captain. A mere captain and his few troops defeated your should I say "rebellion" ?
Benin lost to an admiral ! You get the difference.

Also you don't seem to understand the British were attacking Benin during Igue Festival. It is a well known military strategy to attack your enemy when he is least prepared. And the British did it to us.

Also when your capital is being overwhelmed by enemy troops it is military custom for the King to retreat while so that the fight can continue. That is what the emperor of Russia did when he faced Napoleon in Moscou. And in the ending he won.
In the case of Benin, the King came back and surrendered in order to stop the bloodshed I am told.

Also the Jebu were defeated in 1892 while Benin was defeated in 1897. 1897 is after 1892 ! This debunks your "British were stop at entry of Imagbon coming through Benin into Ijebu." claim.

Sewgon79:


Maybe you need to read the story very well, they made attempts, no avail. British went to gather army from Ghana, Sierra Leone, Hausa légion just to attack Ijebu. But they later reach agreement, not defeat or ransacked or banished like your kingdom.


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Battle Of Imagbon





British-Ijebu War of 1892 (Battle Of Imagbon)
The final battle by which Ijebu fell took place on 19 May 1892 at the village of Imagbon. This short war claimed the lives of up to a thousand Ijebu.

The Yoruba country had been connected with England throughout the 19th century, since the days when the slave-trade on the West Coast of Africa flourished. And the connexion had been maintained, and in latter days on happier lines. The Yoruba country lies to the west and south of the River Niger. Its western boundary was the French territory of Dahomey. On the north it extended almost to the Niger, while on the south the Atlantic Ocean washed its sandy coast-line. A break in the coast-line indicated the entrance to the lagoon and the situation of the island of Lagos. To the north-east of Lagos lay a patch of country about 40 by 40 miles in extent, covered with dense forest, and watered by numerous streams and rivulets, which found their way to the great lagoon on the south, and finally into the Atlantic.

This country was occupied by the Jebu tribe of the Yoruba nation, numbering perhaps 200,000 around 1900 — a tribe not living in huge towns, as the Egbas did in Abeokuta, and the true Yorubas in Ibadan, but scattered for the most part through their country in villages and tiny hamlets, each with its clearing in the forest where the land as been claimed for purposes of cultivation. The country was governed by a king holding the title of Awujale, who lived in the chief town, Ijebu Ode, a town then containing perhaps 15,000 inhabitants.

The Jebus had figured prominently in the history of the Yoruba nation, and they considered themselves superior to the other tribes of the nation, and acted accordingly. They closed their country largely to friendly external intercourse, and while Jebus moved freely over the whole Yoruba country buyin and selling (for they were keen traders), they did not freely extend the same privileges to others. A journey from the north through the Ijebu country was not infrequently attended with difficulty and danger to property or life, and the Jebus were feared by many.


This condition of things in the Ijebu country at length came under the notice of the Lagos Colonial authorities, with the result that an agreement was made with the king of Ijebu Ode allowing travellers to pass up and down the country in safety. The agreement, however, was soon violated. A native messenger, returning up-country through Ijebu Ode, was robbed and killed. Carriers were molested and hindered, and other serious irregularities were perpetrated.

During the years 1888-1892 the Ijebus had shown an increasing contempt for the whites as exemplified in their treatment of the officials of the Lagos Government and the missionaries who traveled through their country. They had a tradition which revealed the root of their contempt, and indicated their view of the origin of the whites. Many centuries ago a male and female albino were born in different parts of the Ijebu country. African albinos are white, and when these people grew up, no black person would engage to marry them. They were therefore brought together, placed in a canoe, given a supply of food and water, and sent away across the lagoon. When after many years the white men came to the Ijebu county it was thought that they must be the descendants of the albinos whom they had driven out. Absurd as this tradition is, the Ijebus treated white persons as if they believed it to be true.

In 1891, the Ijebu tribe, dwelling between 50 and 60 miles north-east of Lagos on the Magbon river, set a blockade on the trade route from the interior into Lagos, which was a crown colony, and charged customs dues which served as their income. The Awujale, the traditional ruler of Ijebu, closed down the Ejirin market, cutting off Lagos from a source of up-country trade.

The British government persuaded the Awujale several times to open the blockaded route but the Ijebu ruler remained adamant. However, in May 1891, a British acting governor, Captain C.M Denton C.M.G, together with some Hausa troops (mostly slaves who fled the North to South and were recruited by the British army) went to Ijebu kingdom to make an agreement with the Awujale on opening the blockaded route and allowing the free passage of goods into Lagos.


The treaty was broken almost as soon as it was signed, caravans were robbed, white men assaulted, a mailman was murdered, and a peremptory demand sent to the Ibadan chiefs for the heads of the Revs. Tom Harding and D. Olubi (a native minister) of the Church Missionary Society. This was intolerable, and a punitive expedition was sent into the Ijebu country. In 1892 a small British expedition was sent up to the Ijebu country to enforce order. The Jebus opposed the expedition, were defeated and submitted. The Awujale resisted, but after much persuasion and pressure, the Awujale agreed in January 1892 on the terms of receiving £500 annually as compensation for the loss of custom revenue.

Shortly before the military expedition left Lagos for the Ijebu country, special services were held in some of the Lagos churches for humiliation and confession, and for prayer for Divine guidance to all concerned. Some Christians at Lagos felt that if the influences of all professing the name of Christ in the colony had been consistent with their profession, and if there had been more earnest efforts to send the Gospel into the Ijebu country, the state of its people would possibly have been very different.

The agreement didn’t last long. A white missionary was denied access to pass through the kingdom and was sent back. The British government were provoked by the action of the Ijebus and authorized the use of force on the kingdom. Britain gathered troops from Gold Coast (Ghana), Sierra Leone, Ibadan, and Lagos (the Hausa troops nearly 150). Colonel F.C. Scott C.B was the commander of the troops of 450 men piled up by Britain. On the 12th of May, 1892, the captain and his men, including some carriers, sailed up the Lagos Lagoon and landed at Ekpe. When they got to Leckie, another carriers about 186 in numbers were recruited. On the Ijebu side, 8000 men with old rifles would be fighting the British.

A British representative was placed in Ijebu Ode, the country was opened, trade began to stream up and down the country, and a forward movement in things both material and spiritual began, advancing at first very slowly, but which increased in power as it progressed, and was such that a European Government official, who knew the town soon after its first occupation, and who returned to it after a long absence, said that he could scarcely believe that they were the same people.

Even before the opening of the country various attempts had been made from time to time to reach the people. As long ago as the 1850s Rev. C. A. Gollmer had tried to open up work on the outskirts of the country, but had failed owing to the opposition of the people. In the 1880s the Rev. James Johnson, who was himself of Igebu extraction, ventured to enter the country with a view to begin work among them; and a few years afterwards a further attempt was made by him and another to get into Ijebu Ode from Lagos. These two succeeded in obtaining from the king permission to send a teacher, who was supported by them, but the people generally refused to have the teacher, and he had to leave.

In spite, however, of this exclusiveness, the Christian religion was not entirely unknown. A story is told of a girl who went to Lagos, learned to read while there, and brought back a Bible to her home. Her friends in inquired what she was reading, and on being told, took the book from (her and destroyed it. At the time of the opening of the country there were a few in Ijebu Ode who, like this girl, had in the course of their trading journeys come into contact with the Christian religion and had been favorably impressed by it; and when the district became somewhat settled, these few sent to Lagos to ask for some one to be sent to Ijebu Ode to instruct them further.

The Ijebus were divided into two sub-divisions, Ijebu Ode and Ijebu Remon; and the chief of the latter, subordinate to the Awujale or head chief of the former, was killed with ceremony after a rule of three years. Dr. Frazer, in his "Early History of the Kingship", gives numerous instances showing the rise of the head magician to the rank of king, accompanied not infrequently by his enforced death after a certain interval, in order that the divine power residing in him should not be weakened through approaching age.

The lesson taught by thd expedition to the arrogant king and chiefs of Ijebu was not lost upon the other members of the Yoruba family, and in a short time all roads were opened to trade, and had never since that time been closed. A period of prosperity set in at that time which continues to increase. Ijebu proved to be one of the "open doors" to the forces of education and Christianity, albeit those doors were opened by a military expedition.

A sample of pitch was received at the Imperial Institute in February 1904, accompanied by a letter from the Colonial Secretary, Lagos, stating that it was obtained from the Ijebu Territory of the Colony, and requesting that it should be chemically examined with a view to ascertaining whether it possessed any commercial value. The specimen consisted of a rather soft and adhesive pitch which melted fairly completely at 65° C.(i49° F.). The material contained, distributed throughout it, portions of dried twigs and leaves, and patches of earthy matter. These last were found by microscopical examination to consist of clear quartz grains embedded in a mixture of decomposed organic matter. The crude pitch had a somewhat unpleasant odour resembling that of guano.

A commercial expert to whom the pitch was submitted reported that it was suitable for electrical purposes and for the manufacture of street-paving. It was suggested, however, that in order to save freight the foreign matter should be separated on the spot, and only the purified material exported. The latter would command a price of from £4 to £4 10s. per ton in the UK. These results show that this Lagos pitch, when properly prepared, would possess some commercial value.

ghostwon:


I hope you know Jebu is part of Nigeria, meaning you guys were colonized ! So why are you speaking such nonesense ?

Your king surrendered to a mere captain. A mere captain and his few troops defeated your should I say "rebellion" ?
Benin lost to an admiral ! You get the difference.

Also you don't seem to understand the British were attacking Benin during Igue Festival. It is a well known military strategy to attack your enemy when he is least prepared. And the British did it to us.

Also when your capital is being overwhelmed by enemy troops it is military custom for the King to retreat while so that the fight can continue. That is what the emperor of Russia did when he faced Napoleon in Moscou. And in the ending he won.
In the case of Benin, the King came back and surrendered in order to stop the bloodshed I am told.

Also the Jebu were defeated in 1892 while Benin was defeated in 1897. 1897 is after 1892 ! This debunks your "British were stop at entry of Imagbon coming through Benin into Ijebu." claim.

Sewgon79:


Sorry to disappoint you. There is documentary with fact that shows the superiority of Ife Kingdom over Benin Kingdom.

Check this out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQY_Jd--pwI

ghostwon:
What is it with you people and quoting of blogs ?
Facts:
1) ijebu were defeated by a mere captain
2) ijebu were defeated in 1897

You are talking about what happened to Benin empire as if I should be ashamed,band they makes me laugh.

Actually the capital of Benin empire is called Benin city and it was burned to the ground. The King upon his surrender was sent into exile by the enemy (the British).
Guess who else was sent into exile,: Napoleon Bonaparte. Also the emperor of Germany (although by his own people).

Sewgon79:


See you, you are shouting here as if it is only Benin that fought British Colonial. Have you heard about Imagbon War. Maybe you should do. Ijebu are not coward that will just kill unprepared British soldiers, we ijebu fight them battles for battle. That is reason Ijebu was not colonised till today.

The British army all sleep off and disappeared till today. Nothing to write stories about. British were stop at entry of Imagbon coming through Benin into Ijebu.

Go and confirm, our king didn't need to run, we were not conquered.

Sewgon79:


So Ijebu is not even Capital of Yoruba. Ijebu is like Clan or Another Yoruba town. Just reason it, if Ijebu can give a whole British Governor this kind wàhálà. I believe that they won't try move close to Ife (the source).

Baba, according to history and archive Ijebu have to bargain with British with payment just to allow trading in our land.

I guess that is not your case. Your were banished, his palace were ransacked. He run for his life.

ghostwon:
What is it with you people and quoting of blogs ?
Facts:
1) ijebu were defeated by a mere captain
2) ijebu were defeated in 1897

You are talking about what happened to Benin empire as if I should be ashamed,band they makes me laugh.

Actually the capital of Benin empire is called Benin city and it was burned to the ground. The King upon his surrender was sent into exile by the enemy (the British).
Guess who else was sent into exile,: Napoleon Bonaparte. Also the emperor of Germany (although by his own people).

ghostwon:

I keep having the same debate with you yari.bas.
You guys always come up with the same arguments.
I don't even know how many times I have already debunked that video.
It is not a documentary, it is a bunch of videos put together and whose speakers are not known for most of it. It is just an other quack job.

This is why no Edo wants to talk to you guys, you repeat the same debunked claims over and over and you don't have enough intelligence to see you are quoting trash.

Sewgon79:



Even your current Ọba late father testify that Oonirisa of Ife is greatest of all Ọba.

ghostwon:


(1) Margaret Plass did not hold a PhD. She was just a person who had a large collection of African arts.


(2) I shouldn't have to discuss about her credentials, rather I should be discussing about her logics, which I did when I pointed out the facts that in 1280 nobody who could write had visited the region, therefor the claim of the Oni of ife being anybody's overlord is just stupid and also nobody came from ife to teach anything in Benin! I shouldn't have to do this but you don't listen to logics.

(3) Once again, Margaret Plass didn't hold a PhD, she was just a person with a large collection of African art. Look at whom you are hyping just because she happens to tow your line.

(4) Google is playing tricks with your mind or rather your lack of mind. With Google research, any fool can find a person supporting his conspiracy theory.

Now leave me alone. If you like, go and look for an other quack supporting your claims.

Sewgon79:


Good afternoon Ọmọlúwàbí,

As per written an article on Ìfẹ́ dynasty and history. I will suggest you watch this documentary. Most of highlighted history are topnotch.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQY_Jd--pwI

I believe this will help.

Also I will advise you go on expedition to Ilé Ifè and Ife Palace, they will attend to you and feed you with true and fact.

Thank you in advance for doing this

TAO11:


Lol. I obviously crushed your already deflated ego with my foregoing comments.

In an attempt to cover up you shameful lies, you ironically resorted to more lies.

How do you even think of covering up a hole by digging up another bigger and deeper one before realizing it? Just how?

Anyways, let's see how far your latest lies will fare before you will be ultimately caged for good, just as you've unceremoniously keept shut on your prior lies highlighted in italics below:

(a) There is no record of Ife being any kind of power.

Not only could you not provide any shred of evidence, proof, or reason to back up your imagination here; I'm also quite proud of you that you dared not say a word in response to my citation of Ibn Battûta's 1352 Voyages to Asia and Africa wherein he documented on the Ife country and its "powerful" sovereign.

(This will be explored full-blown in my upcoming post)

(b) The Ooni was made relevant by the bRiTiSh.
Again, not only could you not adduce even a strand-like evidence for this joke, you also dared not say a word in response to my exposition of the ridiculousness of the joke.

(c) Oyo was never recorded as an empire. The only empire recorded in the south of today's Nigeria is Benin.

... blabla.... blabla

ghostwon:


The person he was quoting (Margaret Plass) obviously didn't know what she was talking about. She didn't even hold a PhD. She is just a person who printed stories from the Yoruba guys who swindled her into believing they were feeding her with historical facts.
Don't fall into his game.
The Oni of ife was nobody's spiritual overlord. Jeez

ghostwon:


Margaret Plass did not hold a PhD. She was just a person who had a large collection of African arts. I shouldn't have to discuss about her credentials, rather I should be discussing about her logics, which I did when I pointed out the facts that in 1280 nobody who could write had visited the region, therefor the claim of the Oni of ife being anybody's overlord is just stupid and also nobody came from ife to teach anything in Benin !
I shouldn't have to do this but you don't listen to logics.

Once again, Margaret Plass didn't hold a PhD, she was just a person with a large collection of African art. Look at whom you are hyping just because she happens to tow your line.

Google is playing tricks with your mind or rather your lack of mind. With Google research, any fool can find a person supporting his conspiracy theory.

Now leave me alone. If you like, go and look for an other quack supporting your claims.

ghostwon:
.