₦airaland Forum

Oh, just read your post again, you did not say the Quran was open minded. But it is still the truth

@9ijaMan

Chrisd,

Nobody wants to hear your chit-chatter anymore because all you do is critisise the christian body. If you got a problem with the church, you have a problem with God too, in revelation God talks about churches, the truth of the matter is no church is perfect and if they are doing something totally against christ, then God will deal with them when judgement day comes. So why don't you give it a rest or take it up with God?



That's the point here. If you need the holy spirit to gudie you through the Bible. All I need to read the Qur'an is an open mind and pray for God's Guidance. Softee, I've told you not to be too emotional when you want to engage in an intellectual debate.

I apologise if this sounds derogatory. But it's the truth and I'm not afraid to say it the way it is.[/b]

You didn't hear me out properly. I said the Holy spirit is a [b]HELPER. You don't need the holy spirit to read the bible but he can help you to understand it more and to be honest any praise is better when the Holy spirit is present. As soon as you accept Jesus as your Lord and Saviour the holy Spirit comes into your heart. That is a lie, the koran is not open minded, if it was open minded it will not say non-muslims are your greatest enemies. The Koran is teaches a lot of violence and only teaches love to other muslims and that is a fact.

Once again I'll state that you do not need Holy spirit to understand the message of Islam. it's simple, practical, realistic and very just.[color=#990000][/color]

It is statements like these that make me feel a christian should not be learning islam. I don't think you have any idea what you are talking about, chrisd is a christian and you talking bad about his faith isn't really a smart move, thats if he sees it that way. Also, you don't need the holy spirit to learn the message of christ. The Holy spirit is a HELPER. The holy spirit guides your life as a christian. So before you start making statements, at least make sure they are true.

May God bless you.

chrisd:
I understand your point. Perhaps it's because I live in London and am more aware of those things. Hey, I know great people from all denominations too. Would like they unite bit more. Yeah I suppose they get against each other but I think Islam as religion and rules applies across the board. There seems is going to be another split for homosexuals having homosexual sexual activities to become pastors. I don't think it's what the Bible says. In a way Muslims do allow that, yeah they can be bit more radical. Here people talk only on right and not much on their responsibilities. That's only my opinion.

Chrisd,

I live in london too and i'm aware of those things but you have to make a choice. You can let all the hypocrites affect your faith and be drawing people to islam instead of christianity or you can just live a Jesus-like life and know in hearts or hearts what God is going to do to all them hypocrites. Its your choice?

exu:
Really?

Please share. What is it?

Ask him yourself

Qur'an 2:191 now follows thus: "And kill them wherever you find them, turn them out from where they have turned you out, Such is the recompense of the disbelievers".
Qur'an 2:192 States: "But if they cease, then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

And you can kill them aswell and allah forgives you!

So you guys can beat someone who started on you to death until they are FORCED to believe in allah

9ijaMan:
Qur'an 4:101:
[center]"And when you (Muslims) travel in the land, there is no sin on you if you shorten your Salat (Prayer) if you fear that the disbelievers may attack you, verily, the disbelievers are ever unto you open enemies."[/center]

Please don't just pick a few words out of a verse, whenever you intend to reference the Qur'an in the context you trying to prove. The full verse there states that muslims are permitted to shorten their prayers whenever they perceive threats of being attacked (physically assualted), and these people who would be attacking the muslims are being referred to as open enemies. In fighting against the enemy during a war you are not supposed to let your guards down.

Qur'an 2:190 states: "And fight in the way of Allah those who fight you, but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allah likes not the transgressors. "
Qur'an 2:191 now follows thus: "And kill them wherever you find them, turn them out from where they have turned you out, Such is the recompense of the disbelievers".
Qur'an 2:192 States: "But if they cease, then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
Qur'an 2:193 follows as: "And fight them until there is no more Fitna (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allah (Alone). But if ther cease, let there be no transgression except against the Az-Zalimun (the Polytheist, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

All these verses are generally relating to the occurrence during the time of the Prophet (SAW) when Islam started to gain strong footing and all the arabians polytheists were ganged up to fight against Muslims.

Besides, the verses started with: And Fight against those who fight you".
I'll have no cause to fight against anyone who does not rais an arm against me.
Note that Allah was also warning the muslims against transgressing beyond the needed limit.
Please note that you will appreciate the Qur'an better if you read the whole chapters, and read about the circumstances surrounding the revelation of every verse. It'll do no good to just pick a few line and try to harp on it.

Kindly let me know if I've been able to answer your questions.

It wasn't a question to start with and there is still plenty of violence in there:

This was your saying:
Besides, the verses started with: And Fight against those who fight you".

Wether they started fighting you or not 'allah' is teaching to fight back and that kufarrs (non-belivers) are your worse enemies and 'allah' is also teaching you to slay them wherever you catch them and to fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression and there prevail justice and faith in God!!

This religion is toxic and violent, i will stand by my word.

God bless

I'm a christian but i don't go church!

Lets make this place Holy Spirit filled!

Kismat,

You people won't stop at anything to break christianity apart. Even if Jesus didn't do it (Which he did), kneeling down is just simply RESPECT. Is kneeling down a sin?, does it fill Gods heart with pain?, is it an abomination, NO, So whats the problem with it? Also, praying in the toilet, God said pray to him in secret[b] (Matthew 6:6 But when you pray, go away by yourself, shut the door behind you, and pray to your Father secretly. Then your Father, who knows all secrets, will reward you)[/b] so if the toilet is the only secret place you can get then God dosent care, he just wants you to talk to him!

Also, (Pray at all times and on every occasion in the power of the Holy Spirit. Stay alert and be persistent in your prayers for all Christians everywhere). God said pray at all times, so all times can mean anywhere!. Next time come back with a better arguement because this one has no meaning nor a point.

Islam:
Dear softee,
I think u misunderstood or misheard somebody because Islam is also about caring for other religions and to understand their points of view,
infact our prophet Mohamed (gods prayers and peace may rest on him) have said more than once to care for other religions, so does our holy book the Qur'an.
so please may u ask the person u heard this rumor from to give u evidence nationally bcause 1 persons actions is a different issue.

Islam,

I didnt hear it. I read it! A

4:101 ", For the Unbelievers are unto you open enemies."

(Christians are your most enemies because this is the most leading faith in the world, whenever a situation happens with muslims, it is a chance to kill christians to "FIGHT IN THE NAME OF ALLAH"

2:190-193 "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you , And slay them wherever ye catch them , And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression and there prevail justice and faith in God , " )

Nobody in this forum can say who is not and who is going to heaven. All we can say that TRUE, OBIDIENT Christians are saved and have a place in heaven. But as for people who are not born again christians, we do not know thier situation. Just remember God sees your heart. For people who just cannot (for whatever reason) give their life or learn the teachings of the bible. For example, A severly disabled person cannot read the bible and learn the teaching of God. These people have got a place in heaven. Another example is a person who is born in a strict, violent muslim family, she wants to be a christian, but if she does, they will beat, rape and stone her to death. So she prays to christ in secret but she never does see the face of a church. Many of you will say God will deliver her, But what if God does not deliver her? This girl has a place in heaven. God sees peoples hearts, if their hearts are commited to jesus then they will go to heaven. Also, I belive during Judgement day, there is going to be second chance to choose who deserve it. If you read revelation it talks abou the last temptation of the devil and the people who don't fall for it are going to be saved.

God Bless

KAG:
No.

You have got to explain. What do you believe etc.
.

Grizzly,

No, No, please do not stoop to her level. It is not worth it. Now you yourself are getting angry. Quite frankly this girl has no respect for others so let her keep on cussing people out that don't share her opinion. God will deal with her.

Why Do Muslims Hate Christians So Much, Could This Be The Anti-Christ Coming?

kismat:
You know its amazing how christains read the bible and do the total opposite of it. totally opposite in the sense that if it says do this, you don't do it.

"Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is[b] good–except God alone[/b]."

Did Jesus ever say "I'm God"? If you quote me that directly from the bible, i'll become a Christian. No Joke.

1. Ok, If Jesus displayed the attributes of God, then how come he cried on the Cross "oh God, why have you forseeken me?"

Your God has no Knowledge of himself. Who was he crying to? Himself? A "God" that doesnt is unaware of himself. That he was going to die for all your sins.

2. Did jesus ever say I am doing this (healing the born blind, leapers and raising the dead) or did he say its by the grace of his father that he's capable of doing all those miracles? Read what Jesus said.

3. A God with Geneology? Two different Genenology? Matthew 1:1-16 and b. Luke 3:23-38.

4. If Jesus is God, then all those around him SAW God right? But according to your Bible;

"No man hath seen God at any time John 1: 18 (b) " (God) whom no man hath seen, nor can see .,."I TIMOTHY 6:16 (c) "And he (God) said, Thou canst see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live. EXODUS 33:20

5. If Jesus is God and possessed Godly powers, then he should be able to do everything right? As you rightly said, he possessed Godly attributes. But according to the Man/"God" himself;

"I can of mine own self do NOTHING . . ." JOHN 5:30

How shameful. Your God says he can't Do NOTHING. So you are lying too. He didnt possess Godly powers. For Jesus to make such a statement, there must be someone who is more powerful than him.


I mean can you see the flaws in these belief? You believe in onething and Jesus says the opposite of that. Dont you have the intelligence to realise that what you believe in is not actually a belief but program ingrained in your system/thought/feeling since childhood and doesnt pass any test when properly looked at?

Tell you what. Tonight right before you go to Bed, Get down on your knees, put your face on the ground (just as jesus did up the mount) and pray. Just say "God, show the right path. Enlighten me. Bring me close to you and save me from hell fire".

With sincerity and with no reference to anything. No Jesus, no facial images of Jesus. No nothing. Just Pray and don't try and picture anything.

1.) A lot of people find understanding the Roles of Jesus and God confusing. Jesus is not God. He has Gods spirit in him [b](John 17:21 That they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me.)[/b]. Jesus was exactly like God. The forgiving and loving Jesus we read about in Bibles, is exactly how God is like. The reason why Jesus says him and God are ONE is because they share spirits. Thats the easiest way i can put it.

2.) Yes Jesus cried on the cross " Father why have you forsaken me ". Just remember Jesus was a human just like you and me, even though he had Gods spirit in him, that does not mean he does not feel pain. He cried out on the cross in pain. You are great at quoting the bible why don't you quote the other things he said while he was on the cross. ('Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.') Yep thats right, he was praying for us (MAN) why we killed him!

[b](John 10:18
(No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This charge I have received from my Father." )[/b]. Jesus clearly said here that he choose to give his life on his own accord!

3.)When jesus said he can do nothing, he meant he can do nothing without God, he is saying that he can only do it by the will of God who has sent him. [b](I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me)[/b]

I Hope this helps! [b](Colossians 4:5 Live wisely among those who are not Christians, and make the most of every opportunity. Let your conversation be gracious and effective so that you will have the right answer for everyone).[/
b]

God bless!

kismat:
Please read the verse again and understand it. This is talking about a precise moment during the time of prophet muhammed. The quran was not revealed in one go. It was revealed to prophet Muhammed at a specific time and due to a specific reason. This verse talks about those who disbelieved and made the lives of muslims difficult, torturing, killing them and taking their property. They wanted Muslims to turn back to idol worship instead of worshipping only One God.

Same as above. As you can see, idol worship and not the people of the book is what is being refered to. The people of the book are Christians and Jews.

The statement in brackets are your own or a comment made by someone trying to press a point which is just bogus. Read the first verse. Those who figh Allah, will fight not HIM directly but the believers hence as a believer, you have the right to defend yourself. This is not "turn the other cheek" sort of justice. I and certainly any person with reasonble common sense will defend themselves when physically abused. There's no compulsion in religion. Why is it that Islam is the fastest going religion in the world? Look at the U.S., why are they converting en-masse? because american muslims have daggers underneath their throats or sending them mail bombs? no. Unlike many, they buy the quran, read it and understand it.

Whats your point?

None of what you said convinced me one bit that islam is a peaceful religion, infact you just made me believe me it even more.

4:89 They long that ye should disbelieve even as they disbelieve, that ye may be upon a level (with them). So choose not friends from them till they forsake their homes in the way of Allah; if they turn back (to enmity) then take them and kill them wherever ye find them, and choose no friend nor helper from among them
[color=#990000]

So just because they made life difficult for muslims allah teaches you to kill them? Somehow that does not seem like the actions of 'a religion of peace'.[/color]

[b]5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; (Anyone who resist Islam is deemed to be making war with Allah)


The statement in brackets are your own or a comment made by someone trying to press a point which is just bogus. Read the first verse. Those who figh Allah, will fight not HIM directly but the believers hence as a believer, you have the right to defend yourself. This is not "turn the other cheek" sort of justice. I and certainly any person with reasonble common sense will defend themselves when physically abused. There's no compulsion in religion. Why is it that Islam is the fastest going religion in the world? Look at the U.S., why are they converting en-masse? because american muslims have daggers underneath their throats or sending them mail bombs? no. Unlike many, they buy the quran, read it and understand it. [/b]

Still violent, This just sums up war, So if someone bombs your country because you are muslim, allah teaches you to bomb there country back? You see this is violence it just backs up my claim that islam is not a peaceful religion it is in fact a violent one. As for islam is the fastest growing religion. This is because islam is a fashion religion, expecially amoung teenagers (as i am one myself) many teenagers want to fight and because they know that islam allows this. They have no problem converting. Also, every situation that happens against muslims they take it as a chance to kill the kufarrs and believe allah is happy. Yes islam is the fastest growing but Christianity has the most believers. So this means that after islam grows people see the truth and come to God! Glory be to God![font=Lucida Sans Unicode][/font][/color][color=#990000]

Gotutripin,

Why are you starting trouble with innocent people that think abortion is murder? May i remind you that this forum was not made for you but for opinions on abortion and if thats lateefah's opinion, whats that got to do with you? Your acting like a 10 year old now. Yes God forgives but that language is not nice

, He has a creation far more better than a mouth

@ exu

God is the creator of mouths

Chrisd,

There was no need for that comment.

Softee:
allonym,

Nope Gods holy spirit talks to christians (which i have expirience myself). You cannot do that. But anyways i have better things to do than argue about how i know God is real. If you really want to know, open your heart and all is revealed. If you just want to argue than please don't choose to do it with me!

A big apology for the way i acted earlier, i was a bit stressed and just felt like i was being patronised by you. I'm sorry because i didn't act in a very christian way.

Colossians 4:5-6
Live wisely among those who are not Christians, and make the most of every opportunity. Let your conversation be gracious and effective so that you will have the right answer for everyone.

But he said islam is 'purer' why would you want to be in something thats not 'pure'?

I THINK YOU SHOULD CHECK THIS OUT

4:89 They long that ye should disbelieve even as they disbelieve, that ye may be upon a level (with them). So choose not friends from them till they forsake their homes in the way of Allah; if they turn back (to enmity) then take them and kill them wherever ye find them, and choose no friend nor helper from among them

4:76 Those who believe do battle for the cause of Allah; and those who disbelieve do battle for the cause of idols. So fight the minions of the devil. Lo! the devil's strategy is ever weak.

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; (Anyone who resist Islam is deemed to be making war with Allah)

5:72 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For evil-doers there will be no helpers.

So chrisd, what exactly is your point?

You see unlike you, i do not constantly worry about what[b] some[/b] christians do. I will wait for God to judge the hypocrites. If you go through faith watching what other people are doing, what time are you going to have for you and God. God said come unto him in SECRET for a reason. So tell me chrisd? If you have so much problems with christians, why are you still a christian, why don't you just be a muslim since you think they are purer?

I don't understand your ways. You are a christian yet you are defending and teaching something that is saying your saviour, your reason, your excuse IS NOTHING MORE THAN A PROPHET?

Maybe my love for Jesu is too much because i really don't understand,

allonym,

Nope Gods holy spirit talks to christians (which i have expirience myself). You cannot do that. But anyways i have better things to do than argue about how i know God is real. If you really want to know, open your heart and all is revealed. If you just want to argue than please don't choose to do it with me!

God does not keep silent. His holy spirit is the guide, the speaker, the advicer etc. Its only if you open your heart to Jesus that God's holy spirit will live in you and speak to you (Through people, through dreams, directly to you, through books etc.) I think the subject should be why God does not talk directly to the world. The answer for that is that life is a test, a test to see if we are worthy enough to be in heaven with the Body in Heaven, to see if we can overcome temptations. Originally i don't think God intended the world to be like this but because he is mighty God he has the power to turn the devils nasty work into Good work. The talk God has with the world is the Bible. If you read the Bible you will see Gods word. Its amazing,

AMEN