₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
Just QUOTE the word "TRINITY" in any version of your choice and save yourself the stress of all these epistles!

That is the blasphemy Jehovah's witness organization has taught you.

gohf:
even husbands are Lord

Afterall Paul also wrote the head of the woman is her husband and the head of the husband is Christ and the head of Christ is God 😊

Notice how she dodges questions by bringing up irrelevance.
Since Jesus is the one Lord does that mean the father is not Lord. So according to your own words, the christian woman has two Lords, which are christ and her husband?

gohf:
everyone who read the Bible knows that the word of God is eternal, it existed before the creation of our world and like Grok puts it, it's God's agent and means it creation.

Did the word of God come into creation? Yes the word became flesh

And it is not OR, but an the word was already present when the world was made.

Is it hard for you to understand that God brought forth his word and sent forth his word.

Lol soon you will want me to ask Grok how God used the word to create everything and where was God before everything was made.

Abeg see dodging, you have still not answer the question, you started using Grok what happen now, all of a sudden you can't use Grok, or you have seen the answer all ready but don't know how to twist it.

What is hard there? So madam, just asked Grok that according to greek interlinear of John 1:1 if the word came into existence or he was already present.
The beginning actually means the beginning of creation not the beginning of our world only, but the beginning of all things, since without Jesus nothing made would have being made. It means the beginning is the beginning of creation itself.

gohf:
guy I will keep telling you repent, you don't even see your own deceptions. You haven't changed because you haven't genuinely repented

This is exactly what you wrote Ask grok to do an unbiased analysis of "In the beginning was the word" using the greek interlinear to determine if the word was created at the beginning or already existed at the beginning.

why is it so hard for you?
If something existed at the start of something does it mean the thing came into existence at the start. If a mother existed at the beginning of her child's birthday does that mean the mother was born at her child's birthday?

Let me make it more simpler ask grok if the word came into existence or he simply was already there?

Don't give me long story. Type it word for word and give me answer.

Maximus692:
He is not my BROTHER in faith so continue the argument with your fellow worshiper whoever is not one of Jehovah's Witnesses has nothing to say about our own God that's why i keep asking any of you to first mention the name of his or her church before i engage you if you can't do that then you are all on the same page to me!

So you are free to group all non Jehovah witness as one but fumes when you are also grouped with those who have similar belief? Whether you like it or not? To me you, bookmark and gohf and brethren you guys are the same belief as far as rejecting Christ deity is concerned. You guys infact are one with muslims

Maximus692:
This is really getting funnier than i thought!
Moses was addressing the Israelites not Pharaoh in that verse:

“Listen, O Israel: Jehovah our God is one Jehovah" Deuteronomy 6:4

But if you can't grasp that did Jesus also forgot to tell his followers that God is three persons?

Can you explain how this disprove the trinity?

Boomark:
And it is the Father that made Jesus a Lord. Did you see that he was made a Lord by his God? He is one Lord to us but not to his God. The Father is One God to all including Jesus.

Acts of the Apostles 2:36 NLT
[36] “So let everyone in Israel know for certain that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, to be both Lord and Messiah!”


So by abandoning your One God definition of trinity and switching to one Lord shows that your trinity is falsehood that is not in the bible. You can't define it with one God and you can't define it with one Lord according to the scripture.

As far the bible is concerned, trinity is a baseless falsehood from satan and the antichrist, prepare for people to reject God the Father as One God.

One God is God the Father (1 Corinthians 8:4-6). Trinity Is falsehood and philosophy of men.

I asked you a simple question, Is Jesus being the one Lord exclude the father to be Lord?

gohf:
Jesus is anointed king and Lord over all expect God, and all are commanded to worship him. Every knee shall bow and say that Jesus Christ is lord

MaxD come and see your fellow trinity denial saying that God has commanded everyone to worship Jesus. Do you agree?

gohf:
If you read you would have realized Grok already did that. But since it's you steep let me just restate:

Ἐν ἀρχῇ (en archē): A prepositional phrase meaning "in the beginning" or "at the start." ἀρχή denotes the origin or initial point of something.

Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ Λόγος: This sets the temporal context ("in the beginning" and states that ὁ Λόγος (the Word/Reason) existed at that time. The author is stating that the word existed at the start.

Syntactic Structure:
The first clause, Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ Λόγος ("In the beginning was the Word", establishes the temporal existence of the Word

That is not what I asked you. You see that you are not sincere, show that chat where you asked grok if Jesus came into existence in the beginning or was already there in the beginning.
Yes the word existed in the beginning that is is not the question, the question is if the word came into creation or the word was already present why is this too hard for you?

gohf:
according to Grok, which grok? Steep you still read like this?

grok confirmed that the trinity is from the bible.

MaxInDHouse:
Excellent!

Moses who served as God in Egypt {Exodus 7:1} and Jesus of Nazareth who served as God in first century Judea {John 1:1} both said:

“‘Hear, O Israel, Jehovah our God is ONE Jehovah" Mark 12:29; Deuteronomy 6:4

Ọmọ go on jàre you sabi God pas the two of them join together!

Moses was merely representing God to Pharaoh.

gohf:
you can't tell the difference between activity and appearances. God acting through his son, acting through his spirit is different from appearing as a son or a spirit

It is you that cannot tell the difference according to grok the trinity was a doctrine that was derived from the activity of God ( meaning his activity as father Son and Holy Spirit) in the bible so in other words grok actually could analyze that God acts in three distinct persons.
The only difference between grok and the doctrine of the trinity is that God is not just acting as three persons but he IS three persons.

gohf:
before asking me this did you read the conversation

https://www.nairaland.com/8506184/chat-grok-ai-cofirms-gospel#136586259

https://x.com/i/grok/share/1vuwUxMU9D48QKyY9sP5RHEiU

If you haven't go and read it

I don't think you understand what I wrote. Grok has already confirmed to you that Jesus is divine by nature mean he is God by nature. I asked you to focus on christ pre-existence at creation.
Ask grok to do an unbiased analysis of "In the beginning was the word" using the greek interlinear to determine if the word was created at the beginning or already existed at the beginning. Come back and let me know the answer from grok.

gohf:
it won't be a problem if he is a God by God's definition not by human definition because to humans there are many Gods, to pharaoh Moses was a god but not to the people of Israel.

Grok pointed something interesting out that the Jews called angels God, elohim and at times referred to them as YHVH but they never believed any of them to be the YHVH or the God but representatives of God. That's why Paul spoke about some in Colossians 2:18 that worshipped angels as God.

Like you said even judges and humans have been referred to as God, even Paul and Barnabas.

When Grok brought up the time Thomas said to Jesus my God and I asked him about Genesis 18, he did a cross reference of even more verses and said it was a Jewish cultural reference to address a divine being representing God as God or YHVH and none were ever corrected


Now for Isaiah 9:6-7, I don't know what Grok would say about this, but before there was AI I had septuagint version and their interpretation of that version is different and I have also pointed out in one of some threads a point no one has refuted that Isaiah was talking about a name not names, and the second point is having el in one's name doesn't make them God. Gabriel is similar to mighty+God or Elijah my God is YHVH, several names have el in them, doesn't make them God.

If you say Eli, which means my God, it doesn't mean I or the person referred to is a God. So the calling a name is not the problem as you said to me it is the commandments. You shall have no other God except me. The one true God. No images, don't take things you see in heaven and earth as a God, worship only God as God.

So while Jesus is worshipped Lord and anointed king like David was or more than David ever was, he is never worshipped as God, as creator.

You still has more work to do. Ask grok to give to the greek interlinear of John 1:1. Now the focus for now should be what is the must accurate rendition of "In the beginning was the word" does it mean the word was created or came into existence in the beginning or the word and what is the implications of this.

Boomark:
1 Corinthians 8:4-6 NIrV
[4]...“there is only one God.” [5] There may be so-called gods either in heaven or on earth. In fact, there are many “gods” and many “lords.” [6] But for us there is only one God. He is the Father. All things came from him, and we live for him. And there is only one Lord. He is Jesus Christ. All things came because of him, and we live because of him.

Deuteronomy 6:4 LSB
[4] “Hear, O Israel! Yahweh is our God, Yahweh is one!


The bible made it clear that there is ONLY ONE GOD. Even though there are many who are called Gods. That "One God" is the Father.

What you defined as trinity is not in the bible. It is against the position of God the Father who the scripture declared as ONE GOD over all.


So tell us from the bible where you got your ONE GOD as 3 persons?

Chibuezem, Ken4Christ watch

Paul also said there is one Lord, Jesus christ does that mean the father is not Lord.

gohf:
if you type boomark's question in Google, their AI would respond with

The Trinity is a core Christian doctrine stating that one God exists as three co-equal, co-eternal, and co-substantial divine persons: the Father, the Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit. This concept asserts that God is one in essence but three in person, a mystery of faith rather than a logical equation where 1+1+1=1. The doctrine is rooted in the New Testament's depiction of God's threefold activity as Creator, Incarnate Son, and indwelling Spirit, and was formally articulated in early Christian creeds, notably the Nicene Creed.

Do you notice that usually the AI attaches bible references to biblical questions but it doesn't do that for that question what is Trinity, it just links it with it's true origin the nicolatian doctrine that Christ Jesus hates.

Even A.I tells you that the doctrine of the trinity is rooted in the activity of God in New testament.
According to A.I the doctrine of the trinity does not contradict the laws of logic. Ofcourse you ride on emotion not logic.
A.i says doctrine of the trinity is biblical and does not contradict the laws of logic.
One God three persons.

Boomark:
What is trinity?

ONE God (divine being, Godhood) three persons ( The Father, Son and spirit).

Steep:
If only you people could properly settle and learn what the trinity properly is.

John was pointing us back to Genesis 1, in the beginning of creation the word was already present, he didn't come into existence but he was already present meaning he is uncreated.

"The word was with The God and the word was God
Theos means the very essence of deity. While "The God" refers to a person who is the father.
In Greek the definite article "The" is used to specify.
So it is something like this, In the beginning(start of time) was ( already present) the word and the word was with (face to face) The God (The person of the father) and the word was God (the state of being God, Godhood)

.

gohf:
it's all good let's see what they have to say about the conclusion from an AI analyzing the Greek text

This is Grok's conclusion:
Thus, we cannot say that ὁ Λόγος(the Word), though described as having divine nature, is τὸν Θεόν ("God". The text portrays ὁ Λόγος as a distinct entity with divine qualities, existing in close relation to τὸν Θεόν in the beginning.


Like it's amazing how consistent this is with the new testament that tells us that children of God have God's nature and are sons (and daughters) of God but they(we) are not God.

If only you people could properly settle and learn what the trinity properly is.

John was pointing us back to Genesis 1, in the beginning of creation the word was already present, he didn't come into existence but he was already present meaning he is uncreated.

"The word was with The God and the word was God
Theos means the very essence of deity. While "The God" refers to a person who is the father.
In Greek the definite article "The" is used to specify.
So it is something like this, In the beginning(start of time) was ( already present) the word and the word was with (face to face) The God (The person of the father) and the word was God (the state of being God, Godhood)

achorladey:
Their darling NWT says......

So God said to Moses: “I Will Become What I Choose* to Become.”*p And he added: “This is what you are to say to the Israelites, ‘I Will Become has sent me to you.’”q


Interpreting this will mean their Jehovah became Jesus to bring salvation to the nation of Israel and the whole world

Jesus said..............

I have come in the name of my Father, but you do not receive me. If someone else came in his own name, you would receive that one.

Moreover, the crowds going ahead of him and those following him kept shouting: “Save, we pray, the Son of David!i Blessed is the one who comes in Jehovah’s name!j Save him, we pray, in the heights above!”*

The question becomes can Jehovah chose to become Jesus to save his people?



You know him now, jumping from pillar to post to twist the conversation na their mode of operation.

I tire for max. The blindness is real. If Jehovah "can become anything to fulfill His purpose" Does that not mean he can also become a man? That is exactly what Christianity said that they are fighting against it.

MaxInDHouse:
God can become whatever it takes to fulfill His purpose but no man has seen Him which means He never appear to any human!

you have shifted to seeing God.
The context of what John was saying is the father. No man has seen God means no man has seen God in his spiriual form but does not mean God has not appeared before.
God appeared as the angel of the LORD but it doesn't mean he is an angel, he appeared as fire but it does mean he is fire, he appeared as pillar cloud it does not mean he is pillar cloud and so on and so forth. People have encountered God but that does not mean they actually saw him in is true heavenly form which is impossible for man to comprehend.

MaxInDHouse:
He is the one coming not Jesus because Jesus is coming to do God's will that's why he also said he is coming. Revelations 22:20

For instance when God said:

“I have certainly seen the affliction of my people who are in Egypt, and I have heard their outcry because of those who force them to work; I well know the pains they suffer. I will go down to rescue them out of the hand of the Egyptians and to bring them up out of that land to a land good and spacious, a land flowing with milk and honey, the territory of the Caʹnaan·ites, the Hitʹtites, the Amʹor·ites, the Perʹiz·zites, the Hiʹvites, and the Jebʹu·sites. Now look! The outcry of the people of Israel has reached me, and I have seen also the harsh way that the Egyptians are oppressing them. Now come, I will send you to Pharʹaoh, and you will bring my people the Israelites out of Egypt." Exodus 3:7-10

The person coming to do His own will is God but the person who will represent Him is Moses that's why God told Moses that he (Moses) will appear before Pharaoh as God! Exodus 7:1

So when God told the Israelites that He will still send another prophet like Moses to them {Deuteronomy 18:18} Peter explained that Jesus is that prophet who served as servant of God but acted as God in the midst of God's people! Act 3:22

what you fail to understand is that it was God that actually came down from heaven by himself.

Exodus 3:2 And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.


Exodus 3:4 And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.

God called him from the fire so God actually came down.
I can even show you from Jehovah's witness publication that Jehovah can become anything to fulfill his plan.

This present earth and heaven will be totally wiped of, there will not be any trace of it left at all. However, God will create a totally new one in which only those who are righteous (the righteousness that is from Jesus Chris will dwell.
Before the destruction of the new heavens and earth, Jesus will reign in this old one for a thousand year and fulfill all the remaining prophecy of this earth. Satan would be bound, Jesus will restore the adamic paradise on earth, humans will live very long time but there will still be death, The nation of Israel would be restored, all those of his servants who had loses on earth due to following him would be compensated, Jesus would appoint those Christians who are worthy to govern the earth they will rule according to Jesus laws and decrees. No sinner would ever get any position of power again, sin shall have instantaneous judgment, alot of prophecies will be fulfilled, and at the same time angelic judgment would be going on, for the Saint will be the ones handling it. Jesus will rule with an iron rod during the millennium but after it ends Satan would be released again and he will deceive the unsaved people and they will try to take over the holy city but will meet their abrupt end.
After then this the whole universe would be destroyed and removed out of existence and at the same time the white throne judgment would take place.

Omoawoke:
A good one

The truth remains that Africa is gone and gone.

In 2025, even the Yorubas don’t even know what Isese means… to them, it is evil and Jesus Mohammed is their lord and savior.
Talk of a lost race!
Chai

But it’s pathetic that with all the resources available to do simple research, or just use a little particle of atom of brain left in their head, they can’t… how will a people worship something that was used to enslave and colonize you… worst of all, the colonizers no longer follow this path.
If you have white friends, or white colleagues… you will realize they don’t even carry Jesus. They rarely or don’t even go to church. They don’t even have Bible

But a full grown adult in Nigeria will be singing and be saying the god of Abraham, Jacob and Isaac they will serve. What of the God of your ancestors?
God of people that don’t bear your names

Lastly, why Africans no to get sense like that… especially this generation of pastor jerrry followers and co… the word “Ancestor” automatically means evil to them.. like just tell them, your ancestors be blessed, they will say God forbid, wetin be ancestors!!! Like for real man!! These people are krazzzzy… and they want to have children and great grandchildren… and descendants, not knowing that they are the ancestors of their own future descendants…

And lastly for the last time

See the Queen Elizabeth whey bring Christianity come meet you, watch a video of Queen Elizabeth undergoing her ancestral initiation… same people whey carry missionaries give you oo, they are practicing their own. Even when she died, they did their traditional rites for the queen….

See below


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WUtGN2rdyw&pp=0gcJCf8Ao7VqN5tD

Did your ancestors use phones, internet? Why are you using it? Look at the way you are hyperventing for what you are guilty of? Did your ancestors speak English? Did they write in English? Practice what you preach hypocrite.

The Bible never specifically addresses the issue of abortion. However, there are numerous teachings in Scripture that make it abundantly clear what God’s view of abortion is.



Jeremiah 1:5 tells us that God knows us before He forms us in the womb. Psalm 139:13–16 speaks of God’s active role in our creation and formation in the womb. Exodus 21:22–25 prescribes the same penalty—death—for someone who causes the death of a baby in the womb as for someone who commits murder. This law and its punishment clearly indicate that God considers a baby in the womb to be just as much a human being as a full-grown adult. For the Christian, abortion is not a matter of a woman’s right to choose to have a baby. The baby is already present and living. Abortion is a matter of the life or death of a human being made in God’s image (Genesis 1:26–27; 9:6).

What does the Bible say about abortion? Simply put, abortion is murder. It is the killing of a human being created in the image of God.

A common argument against the Christian stance on abortion is “What about cases of rape and/or incest?” As emotionally difficult as it would be to face a pregnancy resulting from rape or incest, is the murder of a baby the solution? Two wrongs do not make a right. Intentionally killing the unborn child is not the answer. Also, keep in mind that having an abortion is itself a traumatic experience. It seems nonsensical to add an additional trauma to the woman. Too, abortion can be a means of rapists covering up their crimes. For example, if a minor is molested and becomes pregnant and then is taken to have an abortion, the molestation could continue without penalty. Abortion will never erase the pain of rape or incest, but it very well may add to it.

A child who is conceived through rape or incest is made in the image of God the same as any other human. That child’s life should be protected just as much as the life of any other human being. The circumstances of conception never determine the worth of a person or that person’s future. The baby in this situation is completely innocent and should not be punished for the evil act of his or her father. Depending on the situation, the mother might choose to raise the child. If she does not already have a community of support, she can turn to many organizations and local churches prepared to walk alongside her. Or she might place the child for adoption. There are many families, some unable to have children on their own, who stand ready to receive and love a child from any background.

It’s also important to keep in mind that abortions due to rape or incest account for a very small percentage of total abortions: only 1 percent of abortions can be traced to cases of rape or incest (Torres and Forrest, cited by Physicians for Reproductive Choice and Health and the Alan Guttmacher Institute in An Overview of Abortion in the United States, October 2001, www.abortionfacts.com/facts/8#cite-1, accessed 9/9/21).

Another argument often used against the Christian stance on abortion is “What about when the life of the mother is at risk?” Honestly, this is the most difficult question to answer on the issue of abortion. First, let’s remember that such a situation is exceedingly rare. Dr. Landrum Shettles, a pioneer in the field of in vitro fertilization, wrote, “Less than 1 percent of all abortions are performed to save the mother’s life” (Landrum Shettles and David Rorvik, Rites of Life, Zondervan Publishing House, 1983, p. 129). Dr. Irving Cushner, Professor of Obstetrics at the UCLA School of Medicine, when testifying before the U. S. Senate, was asked how often abortions are necessary to save the life of the mother or to preserve her physical health. His response: “In this country, about 1 percent” (testimony before the Senate Judiciary Committee’s Subcommittee on the Constitution of the United States on October 14, 1981, quoted in The Village Voice, July 16, 1985).

Other medical professionals go further, stating that abortion is never necessary to save the mother’s life. Over 1,000 OB-GYNs and maternal healthcare experts signed a statement in 2012, saying, in part, “As experienced practitioners and researchers in obstetrics and gynaecology, we affirm that direct abortion—the purposeful destruction of the unborn child—is not medically necessary to save the life of a woman” (Dublin Declaration on Maternal Health, www.dublindeclaration.com, accessed 9/9/21). Further, in 2019, “medical leaders representing more than 30,000 doctors said intentionally killing a late-term unborn baby in an abortion is never necessary to save a mother’s life” (www.lifenews.com/2019/03/05/30000-doctors-say-abortion-is-never-medically-necessary-to-save-a-mothers-life, accessed 9/9/21).

Second, let’s remember that God is a God of miracles. He can preserve the life of a mother and her child despite all the medical odds being against it. Third, even in the small percentage of abortions performed to save the life of the mother, most of those abortions can be prevented by an early induced delivery of the baby or a C-section. It is extremely rare that a baby must be actively aborted in order to save the life of the mother. Ultimately, if the life of the mother is genuinely at risk, the course of action can only be decided by the woman, her doctor, oftentimes the father of the child, and God. Any woman facing this extremely difficult situation should pray to the Lord for wisdom (James 1:5) as to what He would have her do.

The overwhelming majority of abortions performed today involve women who simply do not want to have the baby. As indicated above, just 2 percent of abortions are for the reason of rape, incest, or the mother’s life being at risk. Even in these more difficult 2 percent of instances, abortion should never be the first option. The life of a human being in the womb is worth every effort to preserve.

For those who have had an abortion, remember that the sin of abortion is no less forgivable than any other sin. Through faith in Christ, all sins can be forgiven (John 3:16; Romans 8:1; Colossians 1:14). A woman who has had an abortion, a man who has encouraged an abortion, and a doctor who has performed an abortion—all can be forgiven by faith in Jesus Christ.


www.gotquestiom.org

MaxInDHouse:
If they never existed before the creation can the same God return them to their former state of oblivion when they proved worthless or he must keep them alive somewhere tormenting them for not proving worthy of the purpose for which they were created? John 3:16

It is called justice. People are sent to hell as a punishment for their sins. Sin against an eternal God is everlasting punishment.

Matthew 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

tctrills:
I am asking from a Christian perspective. Before our birth and our lives as humans, did we preexist? What does the bible say about this?
Many religions believe that man is an ancient being that preexists earth life does Christianity agree?

No human life did not prexist his mortal life. When God created Adam he made all the component of human life in him, which was to be subsequently activated and formed into humans later on.
So human life begins when the seed of the man and of the woman unite together from then the formation process begins.

She should make peace with God by accepting Jesus Christ as her Lord and saviour so that she would receive the gift of salvation. Perhaps God may spare her life. Life is brief so that most important choice a man could make is to accept eternal life through faith in Jesus Christ.

Michael547:
So if I see that you would make a choice today to be a thief before you were even created, can you avoid being a thief today?

yes. Even if the person cannot stop being a thief buy you could help him.

Michael547:
So when God said he would die, did God tell him that he would go to hell fire?

yes, God told them they would die. Hell fire is also part of that dieing.

Gmone:
Read to the end with scriptural reference. Bible is guild to Christians

The problem of Roman catholics is not speaking in tongues, it is about knowing the truth.
Tongues are not what you just speak it is an utterance given by the Spirit. The Tongues that the apostles spoke were understood by men. Paul said if nobody can understand your language then keep quiet and spake to God only. The only advantage of Tongues is that people of other Tongues can understand the gospel but however if that purpose is not fulfill then it just become self edification. The idea that Tongues makes you spiritual or mature or confuse the devil or make you pray longer is not taught in the scripture.
By the way not every Christian speak Tongues in the early church. The reason why Tongues were common then was because it was a sign to the unbelieving jews but since the gospel shifted from the Jewish nation the gift of Tongues became very rare.

Michael547:
If God saw that Adam would eat the fruit before creating him, was it possible for Adam to obey God by not eating the fruit?

It was possible for Adam to obey but he disobeyed not the less. God's sees the choice people make but he doesn't make the choice for them instead he provides a way so that even if they make bad choices they could still be redeemed. We all make bad choices nobody is perfect acknowledging this and turning to God makes all the difference but people would not turn to God for help because of pride hence God leaves them to their device but however not without enough warnings through the human conscience and otherwise couple with his patience.