₦airaland Forum

nairalanda1:
The thing is, if you want a working refinery, then every product from that refinery has to be sold at a profit. It does not matter if it means we end up buying fuel at N1200 or N12. It is either sold at a profit, or you bring in subsides that long term cannot be sustained because costs of produiction are rising.

That is why that dangote refinery has to work at a profit, not at subsidy prices or subsidy regime

Niger has had a working refinery for over 10 years...and it works because fuel is sold at a profit.Likewise Ghana, which has 2 refineries, and thus enough working. And both produce crude at home...so nothing like importing crude for the refinery(as seen in Azania/South Africa).

And Niger and Ghana have the same corruption and debt problems we have, plus Niger is poorer than we are self. As can be seen

I'm sorry, but fuel is expensive. It does not respect your wallet. Trying to make it respect our wallet since 1973 is why we have the mess we have now.






The thing is, our debt is caused by

1.Subsides, as seen in that Guardian article you have read

.

2. Corruption

3. (this is the main one)...running a resource dependent economy.

Again, you are wrong. If we have refineries why should we sell petrol at a profit to ourselves. What would be the reason for that?

muyico:
K.
osama bdin was american solder nah! B4 he turn to war terro

He was never am American soldier.

nairalanda1:
I think I did.


1. Unfortunately the cost of stuff does not respect our earnings. Fuel is expensive, either way

2. Dangote took loans to build that refinery. He also has to pay workers at rates that would prevent them from japa. Then there is the transport cost which is by diesel truck, which is expensive. If NNPC Had not been forced to accept 40 years of subsidy, it might have had a working pipeline system that would have taken off some of the cost issues. And if our railways had been run profitably since independence., we might have had an alternative to the trucks.

3.And that's why we can't sell fuel for below N100. If we did that, the losses would be massive. And the refinery won't make a profit, and would lose money drastically.

I effing effing wish it was not so.


1. Subsidy is not sustainable because costs of production rise...and I have detailed above why it might rise. That refinery needs to make a profit to cover the rising cost of production. If government keeps paying subsides...problem would arise

2.TO see how subsidy has pushed us into debt, I refer you to the article in the Nigerian Guardian.Reflections on the fuel subsidy regime

3. A common mistake most of you make is that my support for subsidy removal means I am ignorant or denying corruption. It does not mean so.

4.Nigeria is in debt because 80% of our revenue comes from oil. And we produce less than 2 million barells per day. That is not enough for a nation our size...something that Sanusi Lamido Sanusi and Ngozi OKonjo Iweala have pointed out in the past. And it is a big reason why we borrow.

If we want to stop borrowing...we have to diversify our economy, and also become industrial, and export manufactred goods and servicies, and stop sabotaging the power sector by keeping it under subsides, and also improve tax collection. and YES, FIGHT CORRUPTION

(Don't accuse me of defending corruption again ).





On the other hand, keeping subsidy is why we have

1. Lost refining capacity, because it is more profitable to import instead of refining at home.

2.Lost investment in the refining sector

3.Lost lots of jobs as a result

4.Lost billions in smuggled fuel to other countries...like Venezuela does, and even Libya.

5.Gotten into more debt as the deficit widens due to increasing cost of production making subsidy more expensive

I mean we have a lot of countries like the USSR and many other communist countries that were subsidy crazy...and their economies collpased under the strain.

The reason why we are not there is that we subsidisise petrol and power only. We don't do subsides for food, like we used to...until we ran out of cash to do so in 1984.




If you want a refinery to work, it has to operate at a profit, and that can only happen when subsides are gone.

Keep subsidy, and you have the situation where our refining capacoty went down from 400000 ibarells per day in 1988 to 92000 in 2012, to 6100 in 2019.

The problem is, most of you guys (not you) callme agbado, while you miss my point....that if something has to work, it has to operate at a profit.

Right now it costs N1000 at least , AT LEAST...to refine a liter of fuel. We cannot sell it at N100 and expect there to be no deficit in the budget. Meaning more debt.

So you are getting it all wrong. All me need is working refineries. Remember the crude oil is ours. The only expense would be the cost of extraction and refining.
This would mean that we can afford to sell at a very cheap rate.
Same goes for Dangote. We can afford to give him the crude at below market price with the agreement that he will sell cheap fuel.
It's that simple.

Again. I repeat. Subsidy did not push us into debt corruption did.

nairalanda1:
.

1. SO, better apologise to Buhari and tinubu then , their protest in 2012 meant we had massive subsides. Even now, we still have massive subsides.

2.At the end, we have a massive debt, and we lost 4 refineries and until this dangote refinery came up, we lost domestic refining. IN 1988, we refined 400000 barrels in NIgeria. IN 2018, it was down to 6100. Benefits of subsidy

3.We lost billions to smuggling, and billions in investment.

As for me, Buhari and tinubu and their predecessors were wrong to keep subsidies. MIllions more could have been helped with the benefits from removing subsides.






We have always been a poor broke ass nation.

Plus the subsidy had to go, especially since by August 2022, we were using 90% of our revenues to pay debt (This is not a lie.).

If we had kept fuel below N200, we would have totally run out of money. If you think what we are having is bad, think of how it would be with zero cash for nothing

Nigeria is a broke nation because our leaders have not diversifed our economy...especially this current leadership.

Again, if Buhari and tinubu had seen sense in 2012, by now we won't have been in this state.



Because the price controls inherent in subsides means that anyone opening a refinery in Nigeria is going to lose billions of naira with every bit of product sold.

Like now, unless dangote is allowed to sell at a profit, he could lose N300 per liter under tinubu';s subsidy. That is going to make his refinery look like Lucifer's scrapyard in five years.

It's the same thing with power....

At the end, things have to be sold at a profit. If we want subsides, we got to fund them by taxes...massive taxes.

I am not sure you understood anything I wrote.
If you did, you will get the following.
1. There shouldn't be subsidy of imported fuel and yet fuel shouldn't be super expensive because we have large reserves of crude oil and the biggest refinery in the world. We have more than enough crude oil and we can sell petrol for under 100 Naira if we don't have thieves in power.
2. We are not indebted because of subsidy rather we are in debt because we are ruled by thieves. If many useless federal government expenditures are scraped and the FG and NNPC are honest, subsidy will be very sustainable.
3. Removal of subsidy has only led to much more poverty. Industries are parking up at a faster rate than ever before. So yes, it may reduce the governments need for loans but the people are directly paying the price.
4. Lastly, I was against the GEJ government removal of subsidy. All they needed to do was to make our refineries work. How hard can that be for a serious government.

So we should remove subsidy but only after we are capable of producing cheap fuel at home for the Nigerian people. We cannot be subsidizing the lifestyle of senators and the presidency but refuse to do the same for ordinary Nigerians.

nairalanda1:
Has subsidy helped us in any way? NO. We have lost billions, 4 refineres, and potential investment.

Plus it is not sustainable. LOOK...I am by no means a government supporter, I don't even like any of the parties, but I can read and have seen a lot of things.

If what you are saying is right...subsidy should have made us rich. Well, here we are. Poverty capital of the world.

Are you saying that cheaper fuel did not help the average Nigerian? Subsidy with its many faults helped millions of Nigerians who are currently going through hell. The removal of subsidies has only made poverty a lot worse. This is only common sense. We can see the consequence of buying fuel at N600 in just one year. Things are much worse. Now I am not even fighting for but for credibility.
The question should be why are we not producing our own fuel even with the biggest refinery in the world and about 3 other refineries? Your gov owes us a lot of answers

[quote author= post=129862914]GOD BLESS NIGERIA 🇳🇬
We will get there pretty soon ......

Meanwhile,
Dearest Sane Nairaland members,
Sisi Yewande and Madam Ngo on behalf of All of us at MANNABBQGRlLLS are checking on you.

Times are hard
It is for the best future for us all.
No pain No Gain.
Guide your mental health.
Cut down on excesses and frivolity.
Keep joining us to pray for a better Nigeria 🇳🇬.
Slow and Steady we will get to the nation flowing with milk and honey.
A country of our dreams.
God bless you all.
God bless Nigeria 🇳🇬 🇳🇬 🇳🇬

We Love You all ❤️ 😍 💖


Addendum : Enemies of Nigeria, (No matter the part of the country you came from)
Skip this comment, it ain't for you.
Check the first line to see who it was addressed to.
If you do otherwise and quote to be negative or curse sane people here you will be miserable for life.
#No be curse,
Na FACT.
Thanks and Cheers.[/quote]This one is just here to laugh at people's suffering.
Get serious, this isn't time for poems. The only reason why people are suffering is because the enemies of Nigeria are in power.

nairalanda1:
The harsh fact is that almost all our neighbours are paying way above N1000.

Nigeria does not have the cash to keep fuel forever cheap. Make we be honest...this is not about agbado, and even the agbado government is spending trillions to avoid telling themselves the truth.

The painful thing is that if we cut government spending and stop the nasty corruption that is affecting us, the money raised won't be enough to pay for subsides long term. Also, the amount we earn from crude...80% of our earnings...is not enough.

Either we face the truth...or we keep throwing money down a bottomless pit.

We have been told repeatedly since the 1980's...we no wan hear.

None of our neighbors is a top petroleum producer. None of our neighbors has the biggest refinery in Africa.
Look something is very wrong.
Lastly do you know what happens whenever the price of fuel increases? Poverty increases, businesses fold, manufacturing suffers. We have the capacity to produce and sell cheap fuel but for corruption.

DaddyCoool:
Nothing new. Below, 7 years ago

But they have ended subsidy and we have the biggest refinery in Africa.

God1000:
such treatment is bad

Just because you think something is bad doesn't make it bad.
You guys are now going completely off. I understand people criticizing Israel because of the war and we can debate that. But when you start looking for just any reason to criticize, you begin to lose merit.

Faiththatworks:
I'm deeply ashamed at the Whole country of Malawi. We were told our forefathers in Africa were ignorant when the white man came.to pack Africans Into ships and ferry them all over the world to be used as slaves on plantations.
It's bemusing and satanic that 2000 years after the exploits of Mungo Park,some African leaders will brazenly and without any iota of shame allow their citizens to be boarded on slave planes and taken again to another plantation to work for the White Man.
Sincerely Africans are the most shameless people on Earth,I weep for this continent of Africa,I weep because in this same write up, another shameless government official is trumpeting that there's another set of 1500 Malawians ready to board the slave plane to work on the white man's plantation.
If our forefathers were ignorant,these set of New slave masters are the most wicked and despicable set of Black imbeciles.
Why can't these shameless imbecilic government officals force Isreal to open its borders to allows Palestinians back to farm on their plantation or bring their farms to Malawi and export whatever they produce.
If this isn't slavery,I don't know what other name to call it.
God bless my Wonderful country Nigeria.
God bless Africa.

You are Ashamed that people choose to work and feed their families.
Or is your problem with people traveling to a foreign land to look for work?

busomma:
It's no gain saying, Isreal is a very evil place. Nothing good comes out it.

And Nigeria is a very holy land.

Melagros:
COMRADES, Israel dey crez sometimes sef, did they want the Malawians to remain in hard labour for ever?
Nobody who doesn't need or deserve freedom

They have been sent back to Malawi where they can have all the freedom they seek.

God1000:
21st century slavery, I blame the government of Malawi for this nonsense

As a pan africanist, I totally condemn this

When did finding job in another country become slavery? Were they not paid for their labour?

oluwaseyi0:
correct

the bible made it clear that a man shall leave his father and mother and cling to his wife

anything short is an unnecessary interference/stress for the new couple

The bible never said a man should leave his father's house.
Please let's read the verse again.

Mark 10:7-9
For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; and they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

Leaving your Father and mother and cleaving unto your wife says nothing about leaving their house and it could be interpreted to mean so many things.
Isaac did not leave Abraham house to find a wife.
Let's not misunderstand a very simple verse.

God1000:
If you believe that some courses are irrelevant in Nigeria, I will not disagree. Some even argue that even before the internet existed, these courses were what they are now. They aren’t just feasible. The spread of digitisation and technical innovation has made some fields more demanding. Yes, everyday discoveries tend to relinquish the importance of so many fields in schools. Notwithstanding, some courses are still performing exceptionally well in the labour market—both profitable and useful.





https://thenationonlineng.net/eight-highest-paying-courses-in-nigeria/

This looks like another article based on guesswork

Nasri100:
LOOOOOOOL

I actually believe that you are a very charitable guy and that 100s of poor people on Nairaland witnessed you you challenging me. It would be grossly unfair for you to raise their hopes. I beg you with everything you believe in to give the 500k.

Nasri100:
LOOOOOOOL

This would be a great opportunity for you to be charitable. Remember you were the one who challenged me to doing the give away. I am sure a rich man like you will have no issue giving 500k to the poor on Nairaland.

Nasri100:
You keep talkin outta your a s s and i am startin to think you cant read what i wrote earlier properly

Let me explain like you are 5:

I AM NOT DOIN ANYTHING OUTSIDE NAIRRRAAAA LAND.

WE WOULD RANDOMLY SEND MONEY TO PEOPLE ON HERE ON NAIRALAND. I HAVE 500K in the pot.

I dont give two s h i t s who you are in person and we would never meet. Only thing in between us is Nairaland.

I am ready when you are ready.

And yeah i finally replied cause i had something called a "job" to do. I don't spend all my hours on Nairaland, baldy.

Ok let's make it easy. You do your give away here on Nairaland, and post clear evidence of the give away and the amount you spent on the whole thing. Then I will understand your method and follow suit.

Because I am not understanding how to make you accountable on Nairaland. How to we verify your charity. So you go first, I verify and follow your lead.
I guess this works for everyone.

Sangoamadioha1:
Shebi him wan be president. Let him enjoy the gbasgbos as he and his crew are also giving gbasgbos.
He was once a governor and that is what he is being judged on and also his garnishing of Lamba here and there that ticks off people like me.

It's a wasted gbasgbos. Look to the man destroying your country and making life harder for you guys each day. Let me give you a clue, he lives in Aso rock.

Nasri100:
If the slave part is such a big deal i take that back. Drake said a similar line in his diss song with Kendrick and its having a s h i t storm online.

I would never give my details to tctrills or anyone online for any reason. I was advised not to even bother with the philantrophy thing cause you never know what people could do in real life. Imagine i sent someone there and the person got attacked?

If tctrills is refusing to do a giveaway on Nairaland (Where everything started) then he probably got something else on his mind.

Safe.

I am glad you finally replied.
Oga please when are you doing the gave away of 500k. Again if there is no exchange of contact, how do our people meet.

You need to stop being a child here. It's impossible to have a giveaway competition without us or our people meeting.
There must be a form of coordination. Please explain how that happens without the exchange of contact.
If you have a better way in which our people meet without exchanging contacts then I am in. Saturday will be fine.
I will follow your lead and your method as long as my people can verify your 500k give away and your people verify mine.

One more thing, I do business and I give my number out everyday to strangers. It's called advertising.
I understand the fear in sharing your details but then I advise you get a special number just for this operation.
Getting a sim is the easiest thing in Nigeria. You can dispose of it after the give away.

Sangoamadioha1:
The good thing is that most Tinubu supporters are the first to criticize him if he is going wrong which is better than Obidients, who believe their messiah can do no wrong.
Obidients go just mix Hero beer and bitter Obi and start behaving like drunkards upandan 😒

Obi is not the president oga. He is not in power please focus on your bateria.
You guys want to start criticizing someone that isn't in government while you leave the government destroying your lives.

EDUECO:
So Benin,Togo and Ivory Coast can offer every thing you mentioned?

The 3 countries I mentioned above are not better than Nigeria.

I have traveled to everyone of them. If you have also been around let's compare notes.
Even if you make an argument for Benin and Togo not being better than 9ja, Ivory coast is clearly not 9jas mate. Please ask anyone that was here for the last CAN.

EDUECO:
I'm against relocating to countries that are just like Nigeria!

If you're tired of your current state or city in Nigeria,just relocate to a better one!!

English/Pidgin English and Population advantage is lacking in Benin Republic,Togo and Ivory Coast.

Travel and learn then feel free to comment.
If a country can offer good security, good roads, electricity, water, and a healthy business environment, it's so much not like Nigeria. Add to that a steady currency.

bliss750:
"I believe that in Nigeria's current structure, we should focus on questioning our governors about the reasons for underdevelopment rather than solely concentrating on Mr. President. When viewed from a different perspective, it becomes evident that some governors are making progress and working more effectively than others. Despite receiving federal government funds and allocations, certain states remain challenging areas."

It's essential to consider the roles and responsibilities of both federal and state governments in addressing development issues. Engaging with local leaders can lead to more effective solutions and progress. 😊

Your entire premises are wrong. Nigerians critize their governors as we but with a rotten head like Tinubu in Aso rock, even the very best governor can do nothing.

Basicend:
Shebi you are happy now. .

Was that not your prayers before?

Oga this is not the case of an answered prayer. Don't blame God for this one. Blame the fool in Aso rock.

helinues:
Make your comments without always seeking our validation.

Thank you

They need to remind you what your choices have caused. You need that constant remainder. You always talk about the enemies of Nigeria so they need to show you who the real enemies are.

God1000:
Mr Biden should know that US is becoming more and more xenophobic as well with the likes of Donald trump who once threatened to deport immigrants back to their countries if elected president in 2016, the rise of white supremacists in US is worrisome.

You keep talking like a child. Did Trump ever attempt to deport any legal immigrant in his 4 years as president?
Or can you even explain the so called rise of white supremacists? Uncle you no try for this one.

DaddyJapan:
I am sorry if you feel knocked out of stride when presented with new #Facts

You want to talk to be about insults after you charge me with telling lies?

I actually did not feel anything from you. You had zero impact but you clearly felt pained when I pointed out your lies just like any other liar would. But its ok.
I only wonder the kind of man that spends his life researching his fellow men's wealth. Going from site to site to find out what Brand earns. You should be studied

DaddyJapan:
Influence, wealth, Davido, Wizkid?
You frames of reference marks you out as someone who is incapable of elevated reasoning.

Enjoy your Brand fandom.

You are just a kid who is out here to insult and discredit people for no reason. I am sure you will out grow this phase.
You even took the pains of researching Bands earnings. My child you need direction. All the best. It is well with you.
This is a man with more influence than Nigeria's 2 biggest stats put together but you a nobody would come on Nairaland just to discredit for no reason. My boy you no try at all.

DaddyJapan:
Influence, wealth, Davido, Wizkid?
You frames of reference marks you out as someone who is incapable of elevated reasoning.

Enjoy your Brand fandom.

You are just a kid who is out here to insult and discredit people for no reason. I am sure you will out grow this phase.
You even took the pains of researching Bands earnings. My child you need direction. All the best. It is well with you

victory36:
the problem is more countries will eventually follow suit

It's usually the countries that don't matter.