₦airaland Forum

grandstar:
What many fail to even understand that when a World Banker was the finance minister, a large part of the international debt was paid off ($30bn), and $20bn was left in the Excess Crude Account.

The economy of Ivory Coast is doing well under the president who was once with the IMF.

A best gauge of the poor understanding of economics that people generally have can be seen in Burkina Faso, when the strongman there, Ibrahim Traore, nationalised a British owned goldmine.

Many were celebrating his action. Nationized companies become white elephants. A South African said he hoped Malema could do likewise.

I asked him if he wanted the goldmines to be another Eskom? The only reason why South Africa suffered from load shedding was because it was government owned. In private hands, that would never happen.

A Nigerian cheered the action as well. I asked if he wanted NNPC to takeover Shell and Chevron? What does he think would happen thereafter.

I got fed up and realised many have a poor understanding and unready to learn.

Oshiomole, who fought OBJ for 8 good years, preventing him from ending the fuel subsidies,regretted his actions upon becoming a governor. He then realised the enormous damage the subsidy was doing, and supported the petrol price increase in January 2912.

show evidence of the bolded pls.

Not too much to ask right?

omohayek:
And here we see a sterling example of all the sorts of inanities I was referring to. You should feel proud of yourself - it's quite an accomplishment to display every single idiotic issue I raised in your incoherent, abusive ranting.

yet more babble and vapid nonsense.

Show yourself approved, why dont you?

Answer the question up there, if you actually have any sense at all, or just go chew on some damn corn, and spare us all the maladorous BS🤣

You're a goner already.

This thread and the question is all the proof needed

🤣🤣🤣

omohayek:
You put up a valiant effort, but what I've learned from years of wasted effort is that there are few creatures as uneducable as Nigerians faced with economic realities they would prefer to deny. When confronted with matters of simple logic, they either resort to special pleading ( "economic laws that work everywhere else don't apply to Nigeria" ), reach for tired old tropes about "corruption" (as if zero corruption would make 1.3 million bpd last as long for a population of 200 million as 2 million bpd used to for 70 million), or, when these gambits fail to blunt the critiques they don't want to hear, they sink to ad hominems ( "agbado" ) or shopworn conspiracy theories about institutions like the IMF and the World Bank (even though the ranters typically don't have the first clue what these institutions actually do).

Sad to say, Nigeria is in the economic mess it is because its leaders are either drawn from the same mass of economically illiterate, entitled loudmouths, or they are so scared of the wrath of said loudmouths that they lack the courage to do what is right for fear of protests and the inevitable, idiotic agitations for some strongman in khaki to leave the barracks and come "save" the country from "corruption" (as if soldiers have ever been less corrupt than civilians). Nigerians have exactly the calibre of rudderless, unprincipled leadership they want and deserve, quick to pander to their stupidest beliefs even when they know full well said notions are impossible (just look at how Atiku and Obi have been pretending that subsidy abolition was done the "wrong" way, even though all of them were for immediate abolition during the electoral season).

Frankly, it's a waste of time trying to put forward reasoned argument on this forum. Most participants are too stupid and uncouth to be worth all the trouble.

Lol. Agbado! When you are ready to apply your brain, come back and tell us how T-pain managed to increase domestic debt by 45trn naira and foreign debt by around $20b all in just one year, despite supposedly removing electricity fuel, and education subsidies, and also turning the naira to tissue paper.

Shouldn't debts be shrinking and more money saved per your theories?

Show yourself approved, why don't you? No be by English, you no Sabi English rish LordAdam even in the off-chance say you sabi am pass me🤣

Zionmdde:
What kind of nonsense achievement is that
Ok rice consumption
Car sales
Consumption of Everything that makes a common Nigerian comfortable have all crashed under tinubu
And that is an achievement



Anyway vote apc for 2027
The direction we are going, we must hit oil

more like, hit the earth's core. Lol

Nlfpmod coman see what reforms and progress looks like in 9ja

It is progress

My pals, Nairalanda1 and grandstar are pleased as it is a sign we are on the right path, and these reforms are yielding dividends. Our move back to using chewing sticks too (in place of toothpaste) is notable progress🤣🤣🤣. Na to dey swing on trees like old times remain. Swing, swing, like Spiderman all the way to work. Hehehe

When you are on the right path, everything must turn to zero or be comatose💯

T-pain, na you biko.

grandstar:
Defend the Naira with what money? It cost dollars to defend the currency. The CBN was owing purchasers of foreign exchange $7bn. There was barely $3bn in real terms in the reserve as all the other money had been pledged.

You don't seem to realise how bad the economy was.

What Tinubu did was what in economics is called Shock Therapy. End all subsidies at once and free their prices, rather than do things piecemeal which most people prefer. Shock therapy is bitter but it ensures a more solid recovery, encourages massive investments, and improves the governments fiscal position quickly as well.

Poland was a communist country. In communist countries, prices are arbitrarily set by the government. Prices have no relationship to cost or market forces. Everything is basically subsidized, at times, heavily subsidized. Likely most subsidized goods, there were always shortages, and people had to queue to get things, or wait for years.

To get a car in the former Soviet Union, you have to wait 7 years.

Poland, decided to free all prices at once, rather than do so bit by bit. From 1989 to 1992, the pain was much. But afterwards, the economy began to boom. It is now the Germany of Central Europe. During the 2008 Global recession, the Polish economy was still rather strong.

But why is freeing prices and making it market determined necessary? The answer is simple: it encourages investment, massive investment.

To understand it better, look at the GSM industry. In 2001 when the licences were sold, MTN, Airtel won, and one was given to MTEL. The government allowed them to fix their prices. MTN and Airtel (then Econet), fixed their prices at N50 per minute, while MTEL fixed theirs at 22/minute, the peoples price.

MTN and Econet invested massively in their network while MTEL disappeared. Later, GLO and Etisalat joined the industry. Today, the country has over 100m lines from the 400,000 that was available in 2001.

Should the government have fixed the price at N22 for everyone? This would have discouraged many from investing. Investors are only keen on investing their money where the prices are freed. They want to fix their own prices.

Look at Dangote refinery. He commenced the refining of AGO and kerosene sharpily because their prices were liberalized. Meanwhile, petrol which has the biggest demand was neglected. Why? Because the prices was fixed and subsidized. He is only producing petrol today because government is either selling it from him a special price which makes it possible to produce and make a profit, or they purchase the petrol from him at the market price, and resell it to marketers at a subsidized price. That was why NNPC was the sole offtaker at one time.

20 licences have been given out since 1999 to build refineries but how many have been built? The only refineries built are those refine only kerosene and diesel. These are small refineries.

If you think the telecom industry changed this economy, wait till you feel the effect of a higher developed downstream economy. Had the subsidy been removed decades ago, Nigeria would be refining at least 3m bpd by now. Nigeria has a highly developed upstream oil sector. Their are huge oil rigs offshore worth billions of dollars. Nigerians have invested billions of dollars in marginal oil fields, in large oil wells and so on.

he didn't defend it and still managed to balloon d the huuge debts maalu Buhari left behind....increased domestic debt by 45trn naira and foreign debt by 20b usd in one year only after the shock therapy of removing electricity subsidy, fuel subsidy, and letting the naira rot. What great savings, what marvellous improvements! Oya explain this conundrum with plenty English abeg. I dont know why you theoreticists have all decided not to address this simple conundrum i have pointed out since yesterday.🤷‍♂️

Shebi now that the naira became zim dollar 2.0 like i called it in our discussion over a year ago, investors are coming in in droves? Shebi investors are rushing to zimbabwe now. By the time a 15yo in the US can use 100usd buy the same house you used your whole working life build, maybe we go get sense in this country, because this una love for self immolation as una own way forward is not ordinary. Una own way forward is everything must go very bad, fuel must be very expensive, food must be out of reach, and our money must be like 10000 naira to a dollar. That is una definition of progress.

Carry on na.

Una never ready.

nairalanda1:
You need to realize that everyone who does not share your views supports oppression.

The reason why I oppose subsidy is simple. TO pay for subsidy for petrol for this year, so that it can cost N200....it would have cost our budget something like 17-20 trillion naira.

(And note that it won't stop smuggling. Every country I know that has a subsidy has smuggling...that means millions of losses.)

So, imagine spending 17 trilluion even something like 12 trillion...which was the estimated cost of subsidy for 2023, assuming PIA did not take effect.....that means a huge hole is in our budget...which would be filled with loans.

Add the fact that by August 2022, we were spending 90% of our revenue on loans and more loans payment. Revenue for next year's budget.

So, if we did as you want, we would be a year from now, out of money totally, and the IMF would not borrow us any more. The kind of anarchy that would result eh?

But you, Kukutenla, Lexy2014, LadyExcellency, Kukutente, Deepsight, SIlasGreenback, and a host of others do not see it that way, so, I leave you to your ideas.

This is the internet. Everybody is right after all.

I take my leave.

Good night, and enjoy the borrowing.

200 is all in YOUR head. You are the only one talking 200 naira here. If naira wasnt turned to tissue paper, fuel would be around 500 now, and all hell won't have been let loose.

You are the one masturbating on 200 naira in every post, meanwhile it is all in your imagination

IbeOkehie:
Because you earn 15 million per year in Nigeria you're a success 🙌

You campaigned and voted for Buhari, that shows how intelligent you are.

Oga 15 Milla we don hear.

Good Luck to Nigeria

lol. I know say e small, and i'm very grateful for it.

Why aren't you yet a millionaire in dollars in the most prosperous country in the world after over 4 decades? Look inwards and tap into more inner greatness sir....you have the knowledge afterall..

Wetin remain na the know-how.

Knowledge is one thing, know-how is another.

Nairalanda1, the difference between knowledge and know-how is that commonsense I have been talking about. A mix of an understanding of the uniqueness and nuance of experience and experiences

nairalanda1:
I understand both of you, let's keep borrowing....that is what you want.

And yes, it is good he is pressing my neck. I am not in this site to be loved or to be popular. Many people who were unpopular were proven right eventually. I despise rude people though.

yea, I despise silly nonsense too

Like basically advocating for an implosion, as the SOLE solution

Or a time when we would have only one fuel station dispensing fuel per state cos everyone else can't even afford to buy one tanker. When was the last time you bought fuel without queueing?

Or a time when everyone will be either be hungry or dead....all to.please you and your hogwash theory.

I know your type. You no fit do business. You would fail so miserably...cos you dey follow theory. Ask Ibeokehie, he came to do business in Nigeria when it was booming sef, and still failed miserably and ran back to the US and is now a heckler online, cos he was also using textbook theory. Problem is, textbook theories don't work here, commonsense does.

Lol. You no get solution to this problem., Rest

As I've always maintained, remove the subsidy, defend the naira till at least one or two refineries come on stream, this keeping things controlled, and not spiralling out of control as has now happened. All of this shi we're going through now, was totally avoidable with just a lil dose of commonsense,which clearly isn't common

https://www.nairaland.com/8017949/how-nigeria-people-govt-got

As I wrote on my status.

20/10/2020

4 years later, nothing changed!

Moral of the story, don't kee yourself for this kwantry.


Nuff said

Kukutente23:
Deng, Park and Kwam will kill all our looters and ensure their loots are confiscated to govt to start with
Why do you love to defend corruption though

gbam! You dey press the neck well o my brother...covering all bases.

Na man you be jare💯💯💯

nairalanda1:
So we should borrow more money?

Thanks. You have done well, Lord Vader. And now I await your report on the Death star. We shall soon test it on the Nigerian economy in line with Darth tinubu and High Lord Biharis plans...hahahahah

Tinubu supposedly removed subsidy and in one year has increased the domestic debt by over 45trillion naira and the foreign debt by around $20b.. my explanation for that is simple. CORRUPTION, but OP no feel say corruption na front burner issue, na only subsidy removal be the Koko... paragraphs upon paragraph on one message and that message only.

Oya write paragraphs on the above. Shebi you like theories. Explain the above with one of your verbose theories

The subsidies cost the so called 40 trillion cos they abandoned common sense and devalued the naira. First maalu Buhari and now this clown.

Obasanjo paid subsidy
Jonathan paid subsidy
Yaradua paid subsidy

Nigeria didn't collapse.

Jonathan left debt that the so called subsidy removers have multiplied x4.

Tinubu supposedly removed subsidy and in one year has increased the domestic debt by over 45trillion naira and the foreign debt by around $20b.. my explanation for that is simple. CORRUPTION, but OP no feel say corruption na front burner issue, na only subsidy removal be the Koko... paragraphs upon paragraph on one message and that message only.

We dey here dey watch😁

Kukutente23:
A corny afternoon to the corn hustler.
I intend to make some quick corrections but first let me tell you what corruption which you so easily dismiss in favour of some phantom economic theory has done to Nigeria. According to a research by Chatham House in 2019, $582bn has been stolen from Nigeria since we got independence in 1960. Let that sink in, 2019. Now we know that corruption is an ongoing enterprise in Nigeria so you can imagine what the figures will look like if we update it to September 2024. Now if that 2019 figure was to be invested in a sovereign wealth fund as countries with natural resources and leaders who have love for country usually do, Nigeria will be number 4 on the list of countries with SWFs after Norway, UAE and China as at 2019. Just imagine having a SWF in 2019 that's yielding just 6.5% interest p.a. That will imply that as at 2019, Nigeria will make a cool $3.25bn from the SWF returns which will translate to N1.5trn as at the going official exchange rate then. How much did you say we need for power again? N17trn? That means by now 2024, if we use the present exchange rate, we will have N5.2trn we can invest into our power sector. This means by 2027, we would have completed the 17trn without breaking a sweat or needing any economic grammar!! Let that sink in. That's what corruption has done and is doing to our country Nigeria!!

Now for the corrections,
1. Nigeria is not the only nation that subsidizes health and education. Almost every nation does it. In fact, that's why japa is so alluring. When you become a UK resident, your kids can go to school up to high school without you having to pay a penny for quality education. Same applies in the USA. The UK has the NHS while the US has Obamacare

2. Energy subsidy is a leveler. One factor of production that's never mentioned in Adams Smith's theory but which is very critical is energy. Energy determines how much technological input you can employ in your business and by extension impacts the cost of doing business and output efficency. High energy costs translate to high business costs. A lot of big business have exited the Nigerian scene due to devaluation which led to high input cost for them in the last year. How much more small business? A good number of grocery stores are packing up. Just look around and you'll see. So how is your govt expected to generate more revenue from tax when businesses are folding up? Is it PIT you're banking on? Really?

3. Nigeria based on present statistics is earning a lot more income from non- oil sources than oil. Taxes and other sources have exceeded oil income since 2021. The edge oil income still holds its that it is the main source of dollars. Now if the non-oil income has exceeded oil income, and our exports have exceeded imports since 2022 as well, basic economics tells us that Nigeria should be having a favorable trade balance and an uptick in currency value as well as more money for government to spend on social services. But here in Nigeria, it is shocking that the reverse is the case!! You may ask why? Let me help you. Our first lady donated the sum of N1bn to her alma mater a few weeks back. In a sane country, that should set alarm bells ringing at our IRS. Her tax records should be under the microscope now to see if she has been making filings and returns commensurate to such earnings. Secondly, it was reported that she had spent a whopping 700m to "buy" dollars for her foreign trips. That's just her o. We have not heard about others like governors and senators etc etc. You see how mismanagement of our resources is killing us?

Tend to your corn. Don't let it burn. You can come back and reply later.

Treadway DeepSight lexy2014

me I don give up on nairalanda1 tey tey.

If fuel never hit 2k, he no go happy. All the other issues and nuances no matter to the nigga, na sha make fuel cost increase be the Koko. By then sha when the fuel hit 2k, and full tanker na 100million and maybe only 1 station per state na im dey dispense fuel as per say all fuel stations don fold up, we go see whether problem don dey solved or whether dem don create another fresh and worse one. Till then, me jus dey ignore im posts.🚶‍♂️🚶‍♂️🚶‍♂️

As I've always maintained, I don't even mind the removal of subsidy, but devaluing the naira at the same damn time, was just nothing less than a mad decision by a mad man/men.

Remove the subsidy, and defend the naira at least till one or more expected refineries come on stream. That is what a sensible human being that isn't CORNfused and has dung for brains would have done, given our circumstances. No be textbook theory apply in this case, na common sense apply.

To be net exporter of finished products isn't a day thing, infact in our case, it isn't even a decade thing.

Cos a legion of never-do-wells enthroned a corrupt bitch and a failure.

Obasanjo sat on that seat in this same country, and moved the country forward

Yaradua sat on that seat in this same country, and moved the country forward

Jonathan sat on that seat and moved the country forward

All of them were corrupt, but still had functional brains evidently

Maalu Buhari came in and took the country backward.
Now the ugly bozo is there and taking the country backward so fast, everyone's head is spinning.

When you have a rotten, empty, worthless head, that is what happens. All he knows and has ever known is thievery and corruption. He has nothing else to offer anyone

Kukutenla:
1. What is the relationship between subsidy and homogeneity? Is subsidy in any way linked to history or culture? Subsidy is an economic term that's linked to economic stability and societal equality. No subsidy and class inequality gaps gets wider! That's why you have subsidies in critical sectors of an industrialised economy. Most of you run to industrialised countries without realising that they all became what they are through subsidies. The West built their age of civilisation on the back of cheap labour provided by slaves harvested from Africa. They transpired to the industrial age through the exploitation of cheap raw materials using colonialism. That's how they built the societies they have today. Don't get me wrong. They were highly ingenious and creative. But ingenuity alone does not provide the abundance of materials that's required for the level of industrialisation of the West.
2. You think Nigeria's economy is not free? I beg to disagree! The Nigerian economy is free. Most Nigerians get by with little or no government interference. As a matter of fact, government interference complicates things just as we presently have with the whole issue of subsidy. The basic fault with fuel subsidy is corruption. We can't even say how much we consume with confidence. We talk of smuggling, oil theft, bunkering and we ignore all that to complain of subsidy? OK. The subsidy removed since last year, over a year now, where is it? The claim was that we spend N400bn every month on subsidy. It's over a year now that it had been removed. That's N4.8trn. Can you point to any cogent thing that has been done by this govt that you think can amount to just N2trn? So where's the money?

what's even more alarming is the corrupt bitch and dumbfvck in just one year has almost doubled both the domestic and foreign debt that maalu Buhari had already shot through the roof....all this while screaming thru the rooftops that money had been saved thru subsidy removal. 😁

Where'd all the money go?

I never imagined a day would come that the naira would be this worthless.

Jeez

I already addresed this and made a correct diagnosis a year ago.

https://www.nairaland.com/8017949/how-nigeria-people-govt-got


But some dumb mofos and neophytes no gree accept or comprehend am. They are the same dumb shitfvcks that expected Dangote to sell fuel at 300 or less.

Kukutenla:
Don't you have solar or gen?

I thought you're a rich man that can afford high fuel price

lol naso

If e didnt dey, e didnt dey😁

Most of the APC e-rats here are just that...Rats and scroungers. Just a lil patience and they eventually show their true selves/colours.


The 'I can feed your entire lineage' crew. Upon all the mouth, ordinary inverter dat nigga doesn't have in 2024🤷😁

ivandragon:
Kperogi has as usual, made very valid observations and points, but I do not fully agree that the worldbank and IMF are fully out to impoverish Nigerians.

It is just that they keep underestimating the level of corruption and incompetence of the leaders and followers.

Until corruption is reduced to a reasonable extent, good economic policies cannot work in Nigeria.

wrong

The west and western institutions including the world Bank have one goal and one goal only for Africa, to keep Africa impoverished and destabilized so they can get our resources cheap. Africa is the supplier of raw materials to the world,and they need those resources dirt cheap. They will do everything to ensure Africa remains where it is.

This so-called reforms, will guarantee just that. The fuel is expensive but there are still queues everywhere and there has been since May 30, 2023. When will Nigerians just exercise their brains and think a little? The fuel is fucking expensive now, but there are queues everywhere cos only few players can stock the product due to the cost of buying the product. Even those few players can not afford to do that consistently, as before. Does that look like a problem solved? Does that look like something that would get better? If a full tanker costs 50m and only few people can afford to buy that tanker to dispense at the pumps , causing queues, would it becoming 100m for a tanker make the the situation better?

I forecasted what's playing out now over a month ago. How people are incapable of deductive reasoning like this is surprising to me. Should we say it is the effects of watching too much telly? Cos I can't understand why people can't seem to see things for what they are

Na wa o.

They know what they are doing.

They want to render the country completely naked and useless.

It is common sense. For years and till now they have been getting our resources dirt-cheap. Their MO is to keep Africa impoverished, in turmoil, destabilized all so they can steal the resources or get it dirt cheap. The plan is to get anything they want for almost free. They want it to get to the point where they can buy any and everything almost FREE. A time when 1 dollar bill go fit buy car sef.

Make we siddon dey look

LadyExcellency:
We were told that safety measures and checks were satisfied and approved before any conversion. So? Who is in charge of the Quality Control of the conversion firms?

Rubbish reporting. What has "local fabrication" got to do with the accident? The problem may not even be from the cylinder but the fittings starting from the valve down overfilling.

local fabrication of a lpg cylinder sef is madness, much less a CNG cylinder.

A CNG cylinder is made from very very thick metal cos CNG is very high pressure gas, and the shape (it is shaped like a capsule) is different from a lpg cylinder. The pressure in a CNG tank is 200 bar, compared to 7.5 bar for LPG. What this means is if you use a CNG cylinder that is not up to code, it certainly will explode cos it can't handle the gas pressure.

officialwdhtv:
Give your salaries as first fruit - Pastor Adeboye's son Leke

Take a listen!!!

#wetindeyhappentv


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W5wvYl0h8U

lol. Joker

Cos you walk on water abi..or cos you're levitating above the rest of us mere mortals.

Well na your willing audience you dey follow talk sha. No qualms

After all said and done, Trump is winning in November.

Wait and see.

SmartPolician:
Emefiele did nothing as Nigeria was still defending naira at the time. However, Tinubu floated the naira before appointing Yemi Cardoso. No CBN governor since our return to democracy has ever faced the kind of challenge Yemi Cardoso is dealing with. If Nigeria was a country where people take positions because they want to make an impact, Cardoso wouldn't have accepted that appointment.

lies. Maalu Buhari and Emefoole floated the naira also in 2016. It backfired miserably and they backtracked months later. The present maalu in office obviously has a learning defect,Ashe obviously did not learn from even recent history (kinda like you). Cardunce-o is a dunce!

https://dailypost.ng/2016/06/15/breaking-cbn-officially-floats-naira/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nairametrics.com/2016/07/30/chart-shows-the-naira-is-now-officially-floating/%3famp=1

Alayiwola:
Abacha? You are young then.

lol. I packed sawdust for our abacha stoves then...as bad as Abacha times were, aside the lack of freedom to talk anyhow, Nigeria was still far better then (as bad as it was), than it is now.

We thought Jonathan times were bad too, wasn't that why most yearned for change? But the difference is clear now.

There is bad, and there is worstestest!

frankmoney:
Floating the naira was a very stupid decision by BAT

sometimes most of this economic policy looks good on paper but when you put them in practice there are many variables that you don't plan for , especially for a country as unstable as nigeria.

Buhari as terrible as he was didn't yield to the pressure of IMF to float the naira

he floated the naira. And then backtracked a few months later when shit hit the fan.

Why don't most people seem to remember this very recent history? Google Buhari/emefiele floats naira..it was 2016 and that was what made the naira plunge from 180's to a dollar to 400's to a dollar.

Infact let me just drop links here

https://dailypost.ng/2016/06/15/breaking-cbn-officially-floats-naira/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nairametrics.com/2016/07/30/chart-shows-the-naira-is-now-officially-floating/%3famp=1

Past 11:30pm, when normal people should be indoors and asleep.

Una wan chop awoof, with highly flammable gasoline for that matter, despite the obvious risk to your life.

This is just a mass suicide as far as I'm concerned. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Past 11:30pm, when normal people should be indoors and asleep.

Una wan chop awoof, with highly flammable gasoline for that matter, despite the obvious risk to your life.

This is just a mass suicide as far as I'm concerned. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

diamond68:
Alagba 👀 forget that thing oooo. Na trolling and jolly jolly I Dey do for here ooo. I no Dey support anybody. Me na spiritual economy and spiritual principles I Dey follow not man’s economy or man’s politics or politicians. Abi where you Dey when I make this thread below

https://www.nairaland.com/8212478/leaders-been-hijacked-intergalactic-demons

o pari!

Nlfpmod