HOLY SPIRIT IS GOD "GOD is SPIRIT, and those who worship Him, must worship Him in truth and spirit" (John 4:24) who shows/manifests Himself in the Heavens, Earth and Under-world as the OWNER AND CONTROLLER OF THE VISIBLE AND INVISIBLE THINGS.
He is the *LIFE* of all *created things*, through *His Breath*, human beings came into *existence* ("then the Lord God formed [that is, created the body of] man from the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils *the breath of life*; and the man became a living being [an individual complete in body and spirit]" Genesis 2:7), through His Flesh {Christ Jesus} the *full knowledge of His mystery is revealed* ("[For my hope is] that their hearts may be encouraged as they are join together in [unselfish] love, so that they may have all the riches that come from the full assurance of understanding [the joy of salvation], resulting in a true [and more intimate] knowledge of *the mystery of God*, that is, *Christ*" Colossians 2:2 amp) and through His Voice/Word(Father-hood) *the completeness of LOVE is experienced* {"For God so [greatly] loved and dearly prized the world, that He [even] gave His [One and] only begotten Son, so that whoever believes and trusts in Him [as Savior] shall not perish, but have eternal life" John 3:16 amp}.
You will only understand Him if you *desire Him and ask Him* to reveal Himself to you as an individual with sincerity of heart {"Now on the last and most important day of the feast, Jesus stood and called out [in a loud voice], “If anyone is thirsty, let him come to Me and drink! 38 He who believes in Me [who adheres to, trusts in, and relies on Me], as the Scripture has said, ‘From his innermost being will flow continually rivers of living water.’” 39 But He was speaking of the [Holy] Spirit, whom those who believed in Him [as Savior] were to receive afterward. The Spirit had not yet been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified (raised to honor)" John 7:37-39 amp} at every tick of time on this earth.
He is Our God yet at the same time; Our Helper always willing, waiting eagerly *till forever* at the door of our hearts to be invited to help us get things done no matter how little they might seem even as little as *thinking/deciding/walking/standing/praying/working/eating/travelling e.t.c* so that He will come into that circumstance and help us get it done with {"And I will ask the Father and he will give you another *Helper* to be with you *forever*" John 14:16}.
Although He is the *breath* of every human being and all created things yet those who do not desire Him and ask for His personal revelation and help towards them, He seems very *far-away* yet *He is closer to every human being* much more than *our skin* is closer to us {"And He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their lands and territories. 27 This was so that they would seek God, if perhaps they might grasp for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us" Acts 17:26-27 amp}. He is the *being* inside each human being that teaches and manifests His own salvation, resistance to sin and worldly passions, Holiness, Righteousness, self-control, love, his gifts, fruits and different services e.t.c to those who give Him *full submission/dominion* in there *whole life* ("And He will also confirm you to the end [keeping you strong and free of any accusation, so that you will be] blameless and beyond reproach in the day [of the return] of our Lord Jesus Christ" 1 Cor.1:8 amp).
His manifestations/expressions is called *grace{the unmerited love/help/support/mercy/intimacy/completeness/fulfillment of mankind/creation}* thus He is called the *Spirit of Grace*(Hebrews 10:29).
Sweet Holy Spirit, I desire and ask for your personal revelation and help to me at this time of need and every tick of time I spend on this earth in Jesus Name. Amen.
Great Grace Brethren!!!

Ihedinobi3:

S/he already did at the link. What does the video say?

It clearly confirmed that there is nothing like *inherited sin/original sin* from Parents to children.
New born babies do not need salvation because they are *pure/unsoiled* like *God* who is there *originator*
Sin *must* be *a commission or omission*
It is when a human being can omit or commit sin then he/she needs *salvation* because *salvation is deliverance from sin*
They used biblical passages to explain all its details and misconceptions about *inherited sin/original sin being unbiblical and against the teachings of Our Lord Jesus Christ*
I will encourage any Christian to take time to download and listen to that video because it is worth sharing and transferring to believers from generation to generation by way of sound teaching and instructions on Christianity.

ochibuogwu5:

It clearly confirmed that there is nothing like *inherited sin/original sin* from Parents to children.
New born babies do not need salvation because they are *pure/unsoiled* like *God* who is there *originator*
Sin *must* be *a commission or omission*
It is when a human being can omit or commit sin then he/she needs *salvation* because *salvation is deliverance from sin*
They used biblical passages to explain all its details and misconceptions about *inherited sin/original sin being unbiblical and against the teachings of Our Lord Jesus Christ*
I will encourage any Christian to take time to download and listen to that video because it is worth sharing and transferring to believers from generation to generation by way of sound teaching and instructions on Christianity.

I agree with everything you said except

"New born babies do not need salvation because they are *pure/unsoiled* like *God* who is there *originator*"

Right from birth, we all sin. Sin is natural to us because our bodies are bodies of sin (Romans 6:6). So, it is not that babies are pure. They are not.

The reason that babies and other children who die before the age of accountability are saved is that all human beings have had their sins paid for by the Lord Jesus, so only those who reject His Sacrifice or who fail to accept it are condemned. Children below the age of accountability have neither rejected the Sacrifice nor failed to accept it, since they are not able to do either. So, when they die at that age, they are automatically saved.

Another way to explain that is that every human being has their name in the Book of Life until they die rejecting or failing to accept the Sacrifice that the Lord Jesus made in their behalf. That is when their names are struck off.

Receive Grace to study, understand, believe and willingly obey the word of God according to Jesus teachings with effortless ease today 1st April, 2019 and everyday of your life on earth under the Holy Spirit influence in Jesus Mighty Name. Amen.

Five Thousand Fed:
1 After this, Jesus went to the other side of the Sea of Galilee (or Sea of Tiberias). 2 A large crowd was following Him because they had seen the signs (attesting miracles) which He continually performed on those who were sick. 3 And Jesus went up on the mountainside and sat down there with His disciples. 4 Now the Passover, the feast of the Jews, was approaching. 5 Jesus looked up and saw that a large crowd was coming toward Him, and He said to Philip, “Where will we buy bread for these people to eat?” 6 But He said this to test Philip, because He knew what He was about to do. 7 Philip answered, “Two hundred denarii (200 days’ wages) worth of bread is not enough for each one to receive even a little.” 8 One of His disciples, Andrew, Simon Peter’s brother, said to Him, 9 “There is a little boy here who has five barley loaves and two fish; but what are these for so many people?” 10 Jesus said, “Have the people sit down [to eat].” Now [the ground] there was [covered with] an abundance of grass, so the men sat down, about 5,000 in number. 11 Then Jesus took the loaves, and when He had given thanks, He distributed them to those who were seated; the same also with the fish, as much as they wanted. 12 When they had eaten enough, He said to His disciples, “Gather up the leftover pieces so that nothing will be lost.” 13 So they gathered them up, and they filled twelve large baskets with pieces from the five barley loaves which were left over by those who had eaten. 14 When the people saw the sign (attesting miracle) that He had done, they began saying, “This is without a doubt the promised Prophet who is to come into the world!”

Jesus Walks on the Water
15 Then Jesus, knowing that they were going to come and take Him by force to make Him king, withdrew again to the mountainside by Himself.

16 When evening came, His disciples went down to the sea, 17 and they got into a boat and started to cross the sea to Capernaum. It was already dark, and Jesus had still not come [back] to them. 18 The sea was getting rough and rising high because a strong wind was blowing. 19 Then, when they had rowed three or four miles [and were near the center of the sea], they saw Jesus walking on the sea and approaching the boat; and they were [terribly] frightened. 20 But Jesus said to them, “It is I (I Am); do not be afraid.” 21 Then they were willing to take Him on board the boat, and immediately the boat reached the [shore of the] land to which they were going.

22 The next day the crowd that stood on the other side of the sea realized that there had been only one small boat there, and that Jesus had not boarded the boat with His disciples, but that His disciples had gone away alone. 23 [Now some] other small boats from Tiberias had come in near the place where they ate the bread after the Lord had given thanks. 24 So when the crowd saw that neither Jesus nor His disciples were there, they boarded the small boats themselves and came to Capernaum looking for Jesus. 25 And when they found Him on the other side of the sea, they asked Him, “Rabbi, when did You get here?”

Words to the People
26 Jesus answered, “I assure you and most solemnly say to you, you have been searching for Me, not because you saw the signs (attesting miracles), but because you ate the loaves and were filled. 27 Do not work for food that perishes, but for food that endures [and leads] to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you; for God the Father has authorized Him and put His seal on Him.” 28 Then they asked Him, “What are we to do, so that we may habitually be doing the works of God?” 29 Jesus answered, “This is the work of God: that you believe [adhere to, trust in, rely on, and have faith] in the One whom He has sent.” 30 So they said to Him, “What sign (attesting miracle) will You do that we may see it and believe You? What [supernatural] work will You do [as proof]? 31 Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness; as it is written [in Scripture], ‘He gave them bread out of heaven to eat.’” 32 Then Jesus said to them, “I assure you and most solemnly say to you, it is not Moses who has given you the bread out of heaven, but it is My Father who gives you the true bread out of heaven. 33 For the Bread of God is He who comes down out of heaven, and gives life to the world.” 34 Then they said to Him, “Lord, always give us this bread.”

35 Jesus replied to them, “I am the Bread of Life. The one who comes to Me will never be hungry, and the one who believes in Me [as Savior] will never be thirsty [for that one will be sustained spiritually]. 36 But as I told you, you have seen Me and still you do not believe. 37 All that My Father gives Me will come to Me; and the one who comes to Me I will most certainly not cast out [I will never, never reject anyone who follows Me]. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but to do the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but that I [give new life and] raise it up at the last day. 40 For this is My Father’s will and purpose, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him [as Savior] will have eternal life, and I will raise him up [from the dead] on the last day.”

Words to the Jews
41 Now the Jews murmured and found fault with Him because He said, “I am the Bread that came down out of heaven.” 42 They kept saying, “Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How does He now [have the arrogance to] say, ‘I have come down out of heaven’?” 43 So Jesus answered, “Stop murmuring among yourselves. 44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him [giving him the desire to come to Me]; and I will raise him up [from the dead] on the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, ‘And they will all be taught of God.’ Everyone who has listened to and learned from the Father, comes to Me. 46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He [who was with the Father and] who is from God; He [alone] has seen the Father. 47 I assure you and most solemnly say to you, he who believes [in Me as Savior—whoever adheres to, trusts in, relies on, and has faith in Me—already] has eternal life [that is, now possesses it]. 48 I am the Bread of Life [the Living Bread which gives and sustains life]. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 50 This is the Bread that comes down out of heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the Living Bread that came down out of heaven. If anyone eats of this Bread [believes in Me, accepts Me as Savior], he will live forever. And the Bread that I will give for the life of the world is My flesh (body).”

52 Then the Jews began to argue with one another, saying, “How can this man give us His flesh to eat?” 53 And Jesus said to them, “I assure you and most solemnly say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood [unless you believe in Me as Savior and believe in the saving power of My blood which will be shed for you], you do not have life in yourselves. 54 The one who eats My flesh and drinks My blood [believes in Me, accepts Me as Savior] has eternal life [that is, now possesses it], and I will raise him up [from the dead] on the last day. 55 For My flesh is true [spiritual] food, and My blood is true [spiritual] drink. 56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood [believes in Me, accepts Me as Savior] remains in Me, and I [in the same way remain] in him. 57 Just as the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, even so the one who feeds on Me [believes in Me, accepts Me as Savior] will also live because of Me. 58 This is the Bread which came down out of heaven. It is not like [the manna that] our fathers ate and they [eventually] died; the one who eats this Bread [believes in Me, accepts Me as Savior] will live forever.”

Words to the Disciples
59 He said these things in a synagogue while He was teaching in Capernaum.

60 When many of His disciples heard this, they said, “This is a difficult and harsh and offensive statement. Who can [be expected to] listen to it?” 61 But Jesus, aware that His disciples were complaining about it, asked them, “Does this cause you to stumble and take offense? 62 What then [will you think] if you see the Son of Man ascending to [the realm] where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh conveys no benefit [it is of no account]. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life [providing eternal life]. 64 But [still] there are some of you who do not believe and have faith.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He was saying, “This is the reason why I have told you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him [that is, unless he is enabled to do so] by the Father.”

Peter’s Confession of Faith
66 As a result of this many of His disciples abandoned Him, and no longer walked with Him. 67 So Jesus said to the twelve [disciples], “You do not want to leave too, do you?” 68 Simon Peter answered, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You [alone] have the words of eternal life [you are our only hope]. 69 We have believed and confidently trusted, and [even more] we have come to know [by personal observation and experience] that You are the Holy One of God [the Christ, the Son of the living God].” 70 Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the twelve [disciples]? And yet one of you is a devil (ally of Satan).” 71 Now He was speaking of Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot; for he, one of the twelve [disciples], was about to betray Him"
{John 6:1-71 amp}

Ihedinobi3:

I agree with everything you said except

"New born babies do not need salvation because they are *pure/unsoiled* like *God* who is there *originator*"

Right from the first birth, we all sin. Sin is natural to us because our bodies are bodies of sin (Romans 6:6). So, it is not that babies are pure. They are not.

The reason that babies and other children who die before the age of accountability are saved is that all human beings have had their sins paid for by the Lord Jesus, so only those who reject His Sacrifice or who fail to accept it are condemned. Children below the age of accountability have neither rejected the Sacrifice nor failed to accept it, since they are not able to do either. So, when they die at that age, they are automatically saved.

Another way to explain that is that every human being has their name in the Book of Life until they die rejecting or failing to accept the Sacrifice that the Lord Jesus made in their behalf. That is when their names are struck off.

The *phrase sin is natural to human being is wrong*,
we were not created by sin rather by *God* who is *pure, holy and unsoiled*
These are some of the clarity done in that video.
Jesus Christ was asked who is the greatest in the kingdom of God, He brought a little child and placed before everybody while telling them that *it is only those who are like a little child* that is greatest in the kingdom of Heaven hence *child-likeness* defines purity/Sanctity/Godliness/Holiness e.t.c.
Adam was not created and he started sinning, he started manifesting sin in Genesis 3 hence chapter 1 and 2, he was without sin; the same way is a child until he/she begins to omit or commit sin.
Adam did not transfer body of sin unto us rather we have the ability to make positive or negative choices based upon the examples placed before a child as he/she grows thus a child with *Christian up bringing might not even manifest these sinful abilities unless he/she moves outside their parental supervision/guide*
Much more understanding of this topic is taking time to watch this video.
Great Grace!!!

Lord lift me up
and let me stand
by faith on heaven's table-land
a higher grace
than I have found
Lord plant my feet on higher ground. Amen.
Praying and singing.....

No power of hell,
No schemes of man,
shall ever pluck me
from his hands
till he returns
or
calls me home
here in the power of Christ I stand. Amen.

Grace,
your grace alone is all I plead for,
grace to serve you aright Lord (Jesus Christ)
Fresh grace to love you more. Amen.

ochibuogwu5:

The *phrase sin is natural to human being is wrong*,
we were not created by sin rather by *God* who is *pure, holy and unsoiled*
These are some of the clarity done in that video.
Jesus Christ was asked who is the greatest in the kingdom of God, He brought a little child and placed before everybody while telling them that *it is only those who are like a little child* that is greatest in the kingdom of Heaven hence *child-likeness* defines purity/Sanctity/Godliness/Holiness e.t.c.
Adam was not created and he started sinning, he started manifesting sin in Genesis 3 hence chapter 1 and 2, he was without sin; the same way is a child until he/she begins to omit or commit sin.
Adam did not transfer body of sin unto us rather we have the ability to make positive or negative choices based upon the examples placed before a child as he/she grows thus a child with *Christian up bringing might not even manifest these sinful abilities unless he/she moves outside their parental supervision/guide*
Much more understanding of this topic is taking time to watch this video.
Great Grace!!!

As I told you on your thread, I don't consider the video of much value.

As for whether what I said is true or not, Romans 5-7 is enough to help anyone understand. In Romans 5:19, we are told explicitly that we all became sinners because of one man's sin. In Romans 6:6, we are told explicitly that our bodies are bodies of sin. In Romans 7, Paul teaches us through the Holy Spirit that while our spirits are pure and incorruptible, our bodies are outlaws that seek to disobey God at every turn.

That is where I stand: on the Scriptures, not on any human ideas.

Chai. Nigerians are here arguing seriously whether sin is inborn or not and people looting the country dry and are enjoying life in offshore in cruise ships in foreign lands while others are advancing in robotic engineering and researching on how to make life easier for everyone. Whoever did this to my country people e no go well for am.

ochibuogwu5:

It clearly confirmed that there is nothing like *inherited sin/original sin* from Parents to children.
New born babies do not need salvation because they are *pure/unsoiled* like *God* who is there *originator*
Sin *must* be *a commission or omission*
It is when a human being can omit or commit sin then he/she needs *salvation* because *salvation is deliverance from sin*
They used biblical passages to explain all its details and misconceptions about *inherited sin/original sin being unbiblical and against the teachings of Our Lord Jesus Christ*
I will encourage any Christian to take time to download and listen to that video because it is worth sharing and transferring to believers from generation to generation by way of sound teaching and instructions on Christianity.

You did it justice ochibuogwu5! Thank you very much!

Dottore:
Chai. Nigerians are here arguing seriously whether sin is inborn or not and people looting the country dry and are enjoying life in offshore in cruise ships in foreign lands while others are advancing in robotic engineering and researching on how to make life easier for everyone. Whoever did this to my country people e no go well for am.

You must think this is our day jobs. Or do you know we are not the "people looting the country dry and enjoying life offshore in cruise ships in foreign lands, advancing in robotic engineering and researching on how to make life easier for everyone"? How serious do you know we are in fact!?

I reckon this isn't done to your country you'd still be bashing twin heads on rocks and selling slaves. What you think, Doc?

Forgiveness of sins from the spiritual point of view



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FUH9t3WOFQ

One thing about this video is not from any human knowledge, it is clearly based on God's word, it might also interest us to know that there is growth in revelations and knowledge of Scriptures, when you are not ready to learn, unlearn and relearn then growth in revelations will be a serious issue for such a person. The term all have sinned did not include *new-born babies* who did not transgress the law because sin is the transgression of the law rather it is referring to the *initiation and consciousness of sin and death in the world amongst every conscious human person not a *transfer of inherited sin*, having the body of sin means every human being became a sinner from *conception* and *God* in whose image we are created is *sinful* because we are what He is thus "In his own image and likeness, He created them, man and woman He made them" {Genesis 1:26-28} from your own *literal translation and I suppose that this is not what you want to say?*. In Genesis 1 and 2, there was no sin or body of sin in Adam until Genesis 3 where he disobeyed God hence the *only time any man or woman has body of sin is when he/she begins to disobey God by omission or commission*. Ezekiel 18:20 "The Children shall not be punished for the sin of their father, the father shall not be punished for the sin of the children rather the soul that sinned shall die". The Death of Christ Jesus was to make us *not become controlled/distracted/manipulated* by the *presence of sin and its effect* in our lives and on those who believe which Adam activated upon the whole of creation, it did not take away sin from the world just like the passage you are quoting. "By one man's sin, all have sinned yet by one man's obedience all will be made righteous", yet after Jesus Christ purchased redemption by His Blood on Calvary human beings still *sin* even those who believe in Jesus Christ some times still *sin*. You can see that sin involves being conscious of sin and getting involved with it which cannot be an attribute of a child however when he/she starts growing conscious of his/her thoughts and actions, he/she needs to be encouraged to reject and denounce sin in all its appearances, accept Jesus Christ as Lord, become baptized so that the Holy Spirit consciousness will *always prevail over the worlds/sinful presence and consciousness* in his or her life through fellowship.

I commend you to God and the word of his grace that is able to make you receive your full inheritance as those separated from sin and worldly passion into Holiness and righteousness in Christ Jesus. Amen.

Grace of God has been given to *every human being free of charge* from Jesus Christ,
this grace helps us to accept salvation/redemption/eternal-life,
this grace teaches us how to resist/say no to sin in this generation that makes sin to appear *less offensive/evil/destructive*,
this same grace teaches us how to resist/say no to worldly passions(lust, addictions, depression, anxieties, diabolical-engagements, cultism, armed-robbery, kidnapping, betting/gambling, yahoo-yahoo, ponzi-schemes, Child/human trafficking, rape, abortion, wars, political-blood-baths, immoral-fashions, pornography, masturbation, gay, lesbianism, homosexuality, transgender, fornication, adultery, incest, paedohile, sexual molestation of minors/mentally-deranged, get-rich-quick-schemes, fraud, money-laundery, witch-craftery, greed, envy, jealousy, drunkenness, examination mal-practice, runz girls/boys, sugar daddy/mummy, gluttony,office manipulations/frauds, lies, cheating, fake-religious-peddlers, impure-desires, vulgar-expressions/speech/utterances e.t.c.
This same grace teaches us how to live Holy, Righteous and self-controlled lives on this earth, in this seeming hard/difficult economy were oppression and looting of the masses is fast becoming the language of political leaders e.t.c
(Titus 2:11-12)
In all these situations *grace* is *sufficient* for every human being.

"Jesus Christ said....There is no excuse for sin" (John 15:22)

Grace is the *secret* of Christian faith that is *unshakable*.
Always ascend the throne of grace inside your heart to seek/ask for *mercy and have grace released unto you* for every time of need.
Every tick of time we spend on this earth is *a time of need*

Inside Jesus Christ we live, inside Jesus Christ we move, inside Jesus Christ we have our existence. Amen.

By the blood of the lamb; Jesus Christ and by the word of our testimony in the gospel of grace and truth, we are victorious today 2nd April 2019 and every tick of time we spend on this earth. Amen.

"[For my hope is] that their hearts may be encouraged as they are join together in [unselfish] love, so that they may have all the riches that come from the full assurance of understanding [the joy of salvation], resulting in a true [and more intimate] knowledge of *the mystery of God*, that is, *Christ*"
{Colossians 2:2 amp}

ochibuogwu5:
One thing about this video is not from any human knowledge, it is clearly based on God's word, it might also interest us to know that there is growth in revelations and knowledge of Scriptures, when you are not ready to learn, unlearn and relearn then growth in revelations will be a serious issue for such a person. The term all have sinned did not include *new-born babies* who did not transgress the law because sin is the transgression of the law rather it is referring to the *initiation and consciousness of sin and death in the world amongst every conscious human person not a *transfer of inherited sin*, having the body of sin means every human being became a sinner from *conception* and *God* in whose image we are created is *sinful* because we are what He is thus "In his own image and likeness, He created them, man and woman He made them" {Genesis 1:26-28} from your own *literal translation and I suppose that this is not what you want to say?*. In Genesis 1 and 2, there was no sin or body of sin in Adam until Genesis 3 where he disobeyed God hence the *only time any man or woman has body of sin is when he/she begins to disobey God by omission or commission*. Ezekiel 18:20 "The Children shall not be punished for the sin of their father, the father shall not be punished for the sin of the children rather the soul that sinned shall die". The Death of Christ Jesus was to make us *not become controlled/distracted/manipulated* by the *presence of sin and its effect* in our lives and on those who believe which Adam activated upon the whole of creation, it did not take away sin from the world just like the passage you are quoting. "By one man's sin, all have sinned yet by one man's obedience all will be made righteous", yet after Jesus Christ purchased redemption by His Blood on Calvary human beings still *sin* even those who believe in Jesus Christ some times still *sin*. You can see that sin involves being conscious of sin and getting involved with it which cannot be an attribute of a child however when he/she starts growing conscious of his/her thoughts and actions, he/she needs to be encouraged to reject and denounce sin in all its appearances, accept Jesus Christ as Lord, become baptized so that the Holy Spirit consciousness will *always prevail over the worlds/sinful presence and consciousness* in his or her life through fellowship.

There is much in your post that I find troubling for any believer, much less a teacher, to say, but I don't think it is my place to correct you. Since you are a teacher, I expect that you will figure it out with the Lord.

What I will answer here I will answer only because I will defend what I have myself offered here as the Truth, and because I think it is the root of the errors in what you teach. Feel free to accept or reject it, but I hadn't responded to you because I was looking for a debate. I was interested in what you had to say about sin as a concept because of the video you shared. My comments have been to clarify my position on the issue. I don't expect you to adopt it, but I believe completely that it is true.

This is what I am going to respond to in your post:

"One thing about this video is not from any human knowledge, it is clearly based on God's word, it might also interest us to know that there is growth in revelations and knowledge of Scriptures, when you are not ready to learn, unlearn and relearn then growth in revelations will be a serious issue for such a person."

There are two things here, so I will split them up.

I. "One thing about this video is not from any human knowledge, it is clearly based on God's word..."

I read your post through, and I did not see why you believe that the video is "clearly based on God's word". I did see your allusion to something you called "[my] own literal translation". That seemed to me to suggest that you did see the things I said that the Bible said in the Bible itself. If I am correct about what that phrase meant, then you know that I wasn't making any of it up. The only trouble is that you do not accept the literal reading in the Bible. The question then would be "why?"

I did not add or remove anything from what the Bible actually says in those passages. It seems to me that you recognize that. But you also reject this literal reading - more accurately put - of the Bible. There are, of course, many situations in the Bible where what is written is not meant to be taken literally, but rather symbolically or metaphorically. In those situations, the Bible itself provides indicators that the reading is to be received symbolically and not literally. An easy example would be Revelation 12 where the Bible tells us that "signs" appeared in heaven. Following this indicator, Satan is described graphically as a huge seven-headed dragon (or snake), and Israel as a woman clothed with the sun, crowned with stars, and given eagles' wings to fly with. Clearly, these are not supposed to be read literally. They were all a "sign", that is, a representation, a graphic, a metaphor, or a pointer to a substantive meaning. Such an indicator is lacking in the passages given. In fact, in Romans 7, Paul used a metaphor - marriage - to explain the relationship we have to our sinful bodies. In other words, if the sinful bodies were the metaphor, then why would he be using another metaphor to explain that metaphor?

This is the first problem: you accept the video to be based on the Bible, but apparently not because it agrees with the Bible. So, why do you while rejecting what I said when it is clearly in the Bible?


II. "...it might also interest us to know that there is growth in revelations and knowledge of Scriptures, when you are not ready to learn, unlearn and relearn then growth in revelations will be a serious issue for such a person."

I completely agree that there is growth in understanding the Bible that does involve learning new biblical truths, giving up lies that you previously thought were truths, and refreshing and confirming yourself in the truths that you already knew. In fact, this is what spiritual growth means in essence. It is also what the Lord Jesus calls all of us to: to learn the Truth, believe it, apply it to our lives, and help others who are willing to do the same.

My concern here is that judging from the rest of your post, you seem to not quite appreciate that Truth is stable and unchanging. It seems to me as if you think that we can read just anything out of the Bible at any time. This is not true. The Truth is stable and immutable. It will never be altered even a little. For that reason, once you learn the Truth, it is not wrong if you never turn around and believe something different. The Truth gets clearer for those who labor in learning it, this is true, but it does not change. So, one does not go from "all have sinned" and "God has bound everyone over to sin so that He may have mercy on them all" to "newborns have never sinned". Either the first is true, and thus the Bible is true, or the second is true, and thus the Bible is false. Unless the Bible indicates somewhere that newborns are excluded from those for whom the Lord Jesus Christ died, it is merely a fantasy to imagine that they do not sin.

As a matter of fact, we all sin from the first breath. It is not for nothing that David said under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit that he (that is, his body) was formed in iniquity, and he was conceived in sin. That is true of us all because our bodies are tainted. Only the Lord Jesus came into this world with a sinless Body, so He never had the urge to sin against God, although His possession of a true free will meant that just like Adam and Eve, He could sin if He wanted to. This is what the Bible actually teaches.

One cannot learn that and then "unlearn" it, without doing damage to one's faith in the Lord. If we have learned what the Bible says, then every further unlearning will really be a refining of what we have already learned, so that it becomes purer and more comprehensive. A simple test to know whether we are keeping safe in the process is to see if the Bible says what we believe. If it doesn't, then we have some "unlearning" to do. Otherwise, we are fine and should only confirm ourselves in what we have learned to be true from the Bible.


In conclusion, I would encourage every Christian - including you certainly - to make sure that what they believe comes from the Bible and to be humble enough to stick to what they have learned from it, rather than allow themselves to be seduced from a pure faith in the Lord to follow after "revelations" and "knowledge" that are really anything but.

Grace be with you.

"Therefore do not be foolish and thoughtless, but understand and firmly grasp what the will of the Lord is." {Eph.5:17 amp}

Ihedinobi3:

There is much in your post that I find troubling for any believer to say, much less a teacher, but I don't think it is my place to correct you. Since you are a teacher, I expect that you will figure it out with the Lord.

What I will answer here I will answer only because I will defend what I have myself offered here as the Truth, and because I think it is the root of the errors in what you teach. Feel free to accept or reject it, but I hadn't responded to you because I was looking for a debate. I was interested in what you had to say about sin as a concept because of the video you shared. My comments have been to clarify my position on the issue. I don't expect you to adopt it, but I believe completely that it is true.

This is what I am going to respond to in your post:

"One thing about this video is not from any human knowledge, it is clearly based on God's word, it might also interest us to know that there is growth in revelations and knowledge of Scriptures, when you are not ready to learn, unlearn and relearn then growth in revelations will be a serious issue for such a person."

There are two things here, so I will split them up.

I. "One thing about this video is not from any human knowledge, it is clearly based on God's word..."

I read your post through, and I did not see why you believe that the video is "clearly based on God's word". I did see your allusion to something you called "[my] own literal translation". That seemed to me to suggest that you did see the things I said that the Bible said in the Bible itself. If I am correct about what that phrase meant, then you know that I wasn't making any of it up. The only trouble is that you do not accept the literal reading in the Bible. The question then would be "why?"

I did not add or remove anything from what the Bible actually says in those passages. It seems to me that you recognize that. But you also reject this literal reading - more accurately put - of the Bible. There are, of course, many situations in the Bible where what is written is not meant to be taken literally, but rather symbolically or metaphorically. In those situations, the Bible itself provides indicators that the reading is to be received symbolically and not literally. An easy example would be Revelation 12 where the Bible tells us that "signs" appeared in heaven. Following this indicator, Satan is described graphically as a huge seven-headed dragon (or snake), Israel as a woman clothed with the sun, crowned with stars, and given eagle's wings to fly with. Clearly, these are not supposed to be read literally. They were all a "sign", that is, a representation, a graphic, a metaphor, or a pointer to a substantive meaning. Such an indicator is lacking in the passages given. In fact, in Romans 7, Paul used a metaphor - marriage - to explain the relationship we have to our sinful bodies. In other words, if the sinful bodies were the metaphor, then why would he be using another metaphor to explain that metaphor?

This is the first problem: you accept the video to be based on the Bible, but apparently not because it agrees with the Bible. So, why do you, even when you reject what I said when it is clearly in the Bible?


II. "...it might also interest us to know that there is growth in revelations and knowledge of Scriptures, when you are not ready to learn, unlearn and relearn then growth in revelations will be a serious issue for such a person."

I completely agree that there is growth in understanding of the Bible that does involve learning new biblical truths, giving up lies that you previously thought were truths, and refreshing and confirming yourself in the truths that you already knew. In fact, this is what spiritual growth means in essence. It is also what the Lord Jesus calls all of us to: to learn the Truth, believe it, apply it to our lives, and help others who are willing to do the same.

My concern here is that judging from the rest of your post, you seem to not quite appreciate that Truth is stable and unchanging. It seems to me as if you think that we can read just anything out of the Bible at any time. This is not true. The Truth is stable and immutable. It will never be altered even a little. For that reason, once you learn the Truth, it is not wrong if you never turn around and believe something different. The Truth gets clearer for those who labor in learning it, this is true, but it does not change. So, one does not go from "all have sinned" and "God has bound everyone over to sin so that He may have mercy on them all" to "newborns have never sinned". Either the first is true, and thus the Bible is true, or the second is true, and thus the Bible is false. Unless the Bible indicates somewhere that newborns are excluded from those for whom the Lord Jesus Christ died, it is merely a fantasy to imagine that they do not sin.

As a matter of fact, we all sin from the first breath. It is not for nothing that David said under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit that he (that is, his body) was formed in iniquity, and he was conceived in sin. That is true of us all because our bodies are tainted. Only the Lord Jesus came into this world with a sinless Body, so He never had the urge to sin against God, although His possession of a true free will meant that just like Adam and Eve, He could sin if He wanted to. This is what the Bible actually teaches.

One cannot learn that and then "unlearn" it, without doing damage to one's faith in the Lord. If we have learned what the Bible says, then every further unlearning will really be a refining of what we have already learned, so that it becomes purer and more comprehensive. A simple test to know whether we are keeping safe in the process is to see if the Bible says what we believe. If it doesn't, then we have some "unlearning" to do. Otherwise, we are fine and should only confirm ourselves in what we have learned to be true from the Bible.


In conclusion, I would encourage every Christian - including you certainly - to make sure that what they believe comes from the Bible and to be humble enough to stick to what they have learned from it, rather than allow themselves to be seduced from a pure faith in the Lord to follow after "revelations" and "knowledge" that are really anything but.

Grace be with you.

Thanks for your contributions so far however, I have observed that you did not watch the video because you are making references to the same Scriptural passages they explained hence there is no need trying to impose my "revelation or knowledge" to you since the video adds no value to you.
Great Grace!!!

ochibuogwu5:


Thanks for your contributions so far however, I have observed that you did not watch the video because you are making references to the same Scriptural passages they explained hence there is no need trying to impose my "revelation or knowledge" to you since the video adds no value to you.
Great Grace!!!

I implore you not to be upset about that. My curiosity was not about the video, but about why you shared it. I already knew what the Bible teaches about original sin, namely, we don't inherit our parents' or ancestors' sins, rather we inherit sinful bodies from our fathers so that we all sin from the first breath. So I didn't see a need to watch the video, especially considering the expense in time.

Furthermore, I don't find it useful to watch people try to interpret the Bible in groups. It is often a democratic exercise, and it never yields much spiritual value. It can be entertaining, but that's it.

If you feel that the video explains your position better than you have done, then excuse my presumption. As I said, I am not trying to debate with you about this. What you believe is your responsibility. It only becomes mine when you accept me as your teacher. As I said, you have presented yourself here as a teacher, so I don't presume that I am responsible for your doctrinal safety.

Cheers.

Ihedinobi3:

I implore you not to be upset about that. My curiosity was not about the video, but about why you shared it. I already knew what the Bible teaches about original sin, namely, we don't inherit our parents' or ancestors' sins, rather we inherit sinful bodies from our fathers so that we all sin from the first breath. So I didn't see a need to watch the video, especially considering the expense in time.

Furthermore, I don't find it useful to watch people try to interpret the Bible in groups. It is often a democratic exercise, and it never yields much spiritual value. It can be entertaining, but that's it.

If you feel that the video explains your position better than you have done, then excuse my presumption. As I said, I am not trying to debate with you about this. What you believe is your responsibility. It only becomes mine when you accept me as your teacher. As I said, you have presented yourself here as a teacher, so I don't presume that I am responsible for your doctrinal safety.

Cheers.

Honestly, my curiosity is rising all the more...
You already knew about *original sin* then you were still *curious to ask what the video was saying?*
Then my main curiosity is
How do you create the biblical balance that;
human beings do not inherit their parents sins, ancestors sins yet they inherit *body of sin from our fathers*; this *fathers are they not part of our ancestors*?
Another question is for *Christians* who have *received the new creation in Christ for all things including his/her body and "the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus* now *married on the altar of Christ Jesus* then give birth to a child that has the body of sin?

Christianity *must* be submerged *under Jesus Christ teachings thus "You search and keep on searching and examining the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and *yet it is those [very Scriptures] that testify about Me*" {John 5:39 amp} not just Paul's letter or Peters or any other authors of the new testament unless *error abounds* even Peter cautioned us about *carefulness in Paul's teachings because it is deep and some people may misinterpret it* thus "...just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given to him [by God], 16 speaking about these things as he does in all of his letters. In which there are *some things that are difficult to understand*, which the untaught and unstable [who have fallen into error] twist and misinterpret, just as they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction." {2 Peter 3:15-16 amp}. The reason why all the *few* new testament epistles were accepted as canonical was because its alignment/agreement with *Jesus Christ teachings in the 4-gospels* not to even mention the removal of those gospel that were presenting Jesus Christ as a magician.

Look at Jesus Christ teachings and sayings about little children
"At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”

2 He called a little child to him, and placed the child among them. 3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, *unless* you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven" {Matthew 18:1-3 NIV}.

"People were bringing little children to Jesus for him to place his hands on them, but the disciples rebuked them. 14 When Jesus saw this, he was indignant. He said to them, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. 15 Truly I tell you, *anyone* who will *not receive the kingdom of God like a little child* will never enter it.” 16 And he took the children in his arms, placed his hands on them and blessed them. {Mark 10:13-16 NIV}

"But when the chief priests and the teachers of the law saw the wonderful things he did and the children shouting in the temple courts, “Hosanna to the Son of David,” they were indignant. 16 “Do you hear what these children are saying?” they asked him. “Yes,” replied Jesus, “have you never read, “ ‘From the lips of children and infants you, Lord, have called forth your praise’?” {Matthew 21:15-16 NIV}

Does any of the scriptural passage define *little children* as *having body of sin* ?

ochibuogwu5:


Honestly, my curiosity is rising all the more...
You already knew about *original sin* then you were still *curious to ask what the video was saying?*
Then my main curiosity is
How do you create the biblical balance that;
human beings do not inherit their parents sins, ancestors sins yet they inherit *body of sin from our fathers*; this *fathers are they not part of our ancestors*?
Another question is for *Christians* who have *received the new creation in Christ for all things including his/her body and "the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus* now *married on the altar of Christ Jesus* then give birth to a child that has the body of sin?

Christianity *must* be submerged *under Jesus Christ teachings thus "You search and keep on searching and examining the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and *yet it is those [very Scriptures] that testify about Me*" {John 5:39 amp} not just Paul's letter or Peters or any other authors of the new testament unless *error abounds* even Peter cautioned us about *carefulness in Paul's teachings because it is deep and some people may misinterpret it* thus "...just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given to him [by God], 16 speaking about these things as he does in all of his letters. In which there are *some things that are difficult to understand*, which the untaught and unstable [who have fallen into error] twist and misinterpret, just as they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction." {2 Peter 3:15-16 amp}. The reason why all the *few* new testament epistles were accepted as canonical was because its alignment/agreement with *Jesus Christ teachings in the 4-gospels* not to even mention the removal of those gospel that were presenting Jesus Christ as a magician.

Look at Jesus Christ teachings and sayings about little children
"At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”

2 He called a little child to him, and placed the child among them. 3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, *unless* you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven" {Matthew 18:1-3 NIV}.

"People were bringing little children to Jesus for him to place his hands on them, but the disciples rebuked them. 14 When Jesus saw this, he was indignant. He said to them, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. 15 Truly I tell you, *anyone* who will *not receive the kingdom of God like a little child* will never enter it.” 16 And he took the children in his arms, placed his hands on them and blessed them. {Mark 10:13-16 NIV}

"But when the chief priests and the teachers of the law saw the wonderful things he did and the children shouting in the temple courts, “Hosanna to the Son of David,” they were indignant. 16 “Do you hear what these children are saying?” they asked him. “Yes,” replied Jesus, “have you never read, “ ‘From the lips of children and infants you, Lord, have called forth your praise’?” {Matthew 21:15-16 NIV}

Does any of the scriptural passage define *little children* as *having body of sin* ?

I would rather not debate with you about this. As I said, I am sure that what I said is correct, and I do not agree with you. If you prefer to believe what you do in spite of the witness of the Bible, I have nothing to say in the matter. But I will answer the questions you asked me.

1. I asked what the video said because I was curious about what you saw in it that you thought was important for us all to know. I didn't know what the panelists said, but I knew the correct doctrine on the issue, so I was not intending to watch it. But I wanted to know what had impressed you in it.

2. A body of sin is a different thing from the specific sins we commit. The body of sin is our body which is corrupted so that we remain in a constant struggle against sin as long as we live in it. Sins are the actual things that we think, say, and do which displease God. Inheriting a body of sin is not then the same as inheriting somebody else's actual sins.

3. Becoming believers makes us heirs to God's Promise of Resurrection when we will finally be actually married to the Lord Jesus in new bodies that have no sin in them, and which are eternal and perfect and powerful in every way, bodies just like the glorious one that our Lord Jesus has right now. So, becoming a believer does not change our flesh right now from being weak and sinful or from producing children with the same taint of sin. It only guarantees that if we remain loyal to the Lord Jesus until the end of our lives, we will inherit new sinless bodies that are like the one our Lord now has.

4. There is no reason to expect the Lord to say anything about children having bodies of sin in those passages when He had already said it elsewhere. What we would expect naturally is for Him to use that opportunity to teach that children are excepted from the principle that not only are we all sinners because we inherit Adam's corrupted flesh, but that they too do not sin. But the Lord Jesus said neither in those passages. He said there that the Kingdom of God belongs to children, but He also said elsewhere that adults must become like children if they will ever be saved. Since salvation is by grace through faith, the Lord Jesus only meant that the Kingdom of God belongs to those who are willing to, just like a child, cast themselves upon God's Mercy and trust Him to save them with the simplicity of a child's faith. It does not mean at all that children never sin, only that they find it ridiculously easy to trust someone else.

Ihedinobi3:

I would rather not debate with you about this. As I said, I am sure that what I said is correct, and I do not agree with you. If you prefer to believe what you do in spite of the witness of the Bible, I have nothing to say in the matter.

You are my friend whom I love with all my heart and all my soul and all my being and emojis and all but you sure are no child!

The Bible did not witness here, Ihe! You did. With your understanding and interpretation of your own reading of the Bible. And not everyone agrees with you. I have to say.

The rest though. I agree.

budaatum:

You are my friend whom I love with all my heart and all my soul and all my being and emojis and all but you sure are no child!

The Bible did not witness here, Ihe! You did. With your understanding and interpretation of your own reading of the Bible. And not everyone agrees with you. I have to say.

The rest though. I agree.

This response is for the sake of courtesy.

This post was a description rather than any kind of interpretation.

Ihedinobi3:

As I told you on your thread, I don't consider the video of much value.

As for whether what I said is true or not, Romans 5-7 is enough to help anyone understand. In Romans 5:19, we are told explicitly that we all became sinners because of one man's sin. In Romans 6:6, we are told explicitly that our bodies are bodies of sin. In Romans 7, Paul teaches us through the Holy Spirit that while our spirits are pure and incorruptible, our bodies are outlaws that seek to disobey God at every turn.

That is where I stand: on the Scriptures, not on any human ideas.

You read in Romans that "your body is a body of sin" and without checking whether your body was a body of sin did you just takes Romans word for it, or did you check your body and find that it was a body of sin like Romans said? I ask because it's your body, Ihe, but here is where I'm confused.

You have not checked other peoples bodies but you seem to have decided that "their bodies are bodies of sin" too because Romans said so.

I don't get how you did that

budaatum:

You read in Romans that "your body is a body of sin" and without checking whether your body was a body of sin did you just takes Romans word for it, or did you check your body and find that it was a body of sin like Romans said? I ask because it's your body, Ihe, but here is where I'm confused.

You have not checked other peoples bodies but you seem to have decided that "their bodies are bodies of sin" too because Romans said so.

I don't get how you did that

Perhaps this is a bit of a confusion for you - I'd prefer to believe that it is - or else it is dishonesty (I hope it isn't).

Your complaint was that I was promoting my own interpretation. I have just shown you that, just like in an earlier conversation with you, I was merely repeating what the Bible says, so even if I have made an interpretation, it is no more than saying what the Bible says using easier words and concepts to provide a bridge of understanding. So, this is actually what the Bible says, not some idea of my own that I am demanding that others submit to.

Now, you have left what you complained about to complain about my faith in the Bible. What that means is that you either would prefer not to admit that you were wrong about your first complaint (or you just forgot to express your appreciation of your error), or else you really don't care if you are wrong so long as you continue to throw obstacles up against accepting what I say as true. The latter is something I expect from antichristians. It is, in fact, why I call some unbelievers antichristians. Knowing what it means for anyone to be antichrist, I prefer to give everyone the benefit of the doubt before treating them like that, so this is me doing that for you. I want to hold a different opinion of you, so I am allowing for the possibility that you just sped past your appreciation of your error.

To equate the truth with the lie is a terrible thing to do to other people. No one is forced to accept the truth as true, but it is wickedness to deceive people about what is true. If I have offered an explanation or description of what the Bible says that is true to the Bible itself, it is evil to say that it is the same as any other interpretation that anybody else is pleased to come up with, because that only means that the Bible is not truth. If the Bible can be made to say whatever anybody wants it to say, it cannot be true. If the Bible is not true, then human beings are hopeless - certainly, those who believe the Bible are doomed.

Therefore, I would celebrate your honesty when you admit that you have difficulty dealing with biblical theology, and condemn your dishonesty when you attack the veracity of the Bible for no real cause.

Regarding your concern about my faith in Romans, first, I believe the Bible because I believe in the Person Who wrote it. To explain, those who conduct their lives according to the Constitution of the United States do so because they believe that the document is good for accomplishing what its authors wrote it for, that is, they believe that if the Constitution is followed, then the States will attain to and maintain the greatness that the authors and revisers envision and promise. In the same way, I believe the Bible because I have total confidence in its Author. So, I assume that everything that I read in it is true because He said it. I don't need to test or check or confirm it. He is worthy of my trust, so I take for granted that He does not lie about anything.

Second, I have a human body, and I live around human beings. I have found that it is a struggle to "stay good" for any length of time at all. So I have already seen proof in my own self that God did not lie about that. Additionally, I have never met a single person in my life who does no wrong. Every single human being I have come across slips up in some way, if they are not really blowing it in some other way. So, I have even more proof that this thing that God inspired Paul to say is true indeed.

Again, if I had NO PROOF at all, I would still believe it, because God does not lie. The proof only strengthens my confidence in Him, so that I have that much more reason to believe other things that He says even before I have proof of them.

That is what it means to be a Christian: to trust God. I trust Him, budaatum. That is the difference (and it is a great big world of difference) between me and you.

Ihedinobi3:

Second, I have a human body, and I live around human beings. I have found that it is a struggle to "stay good" for any length of time at all. So I have already seen proof in my own self that God did not lie about that. Additionally, I have never met a single person in my life who does no wrong. Every single human being I have come across slips up in some way, if they are not really blowing it in some other way. So, I have even more proof that this thing that God inspired Paul to say is true indeed.

This was the answer to my question, ihe, and all I asked for. Thanks for it.

I choose to have faith in people myself. I check the evidence on their body and do not take Paul's word for it that their body is full of sin because Paul never met the people I meet so isn't exactly in a position to be telling me what fills their body. I do not ever think people are being dishonest, lying, deceiving or have bodies full of sin, unless I see sin in their body myself, because once I make the assumption that their body is full of sin it affects how I behave towards them. I'd likely find it difficult to love them if I assumed their body were full of sin already, so I always check their body first and not just assume their body is full of sin.

If I do not check their body first to see if it is full of sin, it's like I'm covering my eyes so I don't see the evidence because the preconceived belief Paul put in my head is the absolute truth and its not possible for me or Paul to be wrong! But covering my eyes and not checking the evidence is like blinding myself, and is, at the very least, an act that would be like filling my own body with sin and while focusing on the speck of sin on the bodies of others. Paul is no excuse to make me fill my body with sin like that!

In my checking first, and not just taking Paul's word for it, I have found lots of unsinful bodied people too. Perhaps because my thoughts of them is they are unsinful they live up to my unsinning expectations. This might be because I live amongst people who don't sin so much because they been learning to not sin for close on 2000 years, but even in Nigeria, I don't tend to find most people I meet have bodies full of sin. I know my body is not full of sin so why would I go about thinking everyone else's body is full of sin?

You are correct about buda, ihe, buda has not got faith in the Bible. Jesus met a lot of people who had 'faith' in the Bible of his day and some of the names he called such people were not exactly those that promote a behaviour I should emulate so my faith is in the Lord God Almighty whom I see not and in my fellow human beings whom I do see, because how
I treat the least of my fellow humans whom I see, "ye have done it unto me". I do not focus on the body because my focus is on your mind.