Affiliated:

As within so without... One thing that puzzles me is why Africans are quick to complain about racism and yet majority subscribe to the ideas of the most racist Gods

lol good observation

Affiliated: What's with all the hidden posts? This is driving me insane

I think it's the spambot

@greatgenius, were you banned? Complain to them on this thread, it seems it's the spambot:

www.nairaland.com/505782/questions-comments-complaints-talk-moderators/52

greatgenius: i understand your point and your concerns but yes God can be explained logically and reasonably.

the problem with you and alot of people is they see God as seperate from them. And also your believe of who and what you think God is has been so ingrained in you that it is hard for you to let go of your limiting beliefs and accept the truth of who and what God really is..listen whereevr you are is where God is. wherever you are is the center of the universe.you are God in flesh....but before we get into all of that and the logical explanation of God and the whole one soul into the many thing let me take you to the beginning and let me tell you a story.
In the beginning, that which is, or God is all there was, and there was nothing else. You can call all that which is God/energy/the creator/universal intelligence/universal force etc

Yet all that is/God could not know itself because God is all there was, and there was nothing or no one else. And so you could say All That Is, was not. For in the absence of something else, All That Is or God is not.

Now all that is( I keep repeating and using all that is because I want you to see that all that is/God is everything in existence and not just one being somewhere in the sky) knew it was all there was but this was not enough, for it could only know its utter magnificence conceptually and not ecperientially.
Yet the experience of itself is or what is means to be God is what God longed for. She wanted to know what it felt like to be so magnificent. Still, this was impossible, because the very term “magnificent” is a relative term. Therefore God or all that is could not know
What it felt like to be magnificent unles, that which is not, (magnificent )showed up.

Because in the absence of that which is not, that which is, is not…think about this for a minute and you would realize the deep meaning.

The one thing that all that is or God knew is that there was nothing else or no one else. Therefore God could, and would never know himself/itself/herself from a reference point outside of Itself. Such a point did not exist. Only one reference point existed, and that was the single place within. The “Is and Not Is.” The I Am and Not I Am.

Still, this energy, the all of everything, God, chose to know Itself experientially and experience Itself as the utter magnificence It was. So in order to do this she realized he would have to use a reference poin within.
God reasoned quite correctly, that any portion of Itself would necessarily have to be less than the whole and that if it simply divided itself into portions, each portion being less than the whole, could look back on the rest of Itself and see magnificence.

And so God or all that is divided Itself, becoming, in one glorious moment, that which is this and that. For the first time, this and that existed, quite apart from each other. And still, both existed simultaneously. As did all that was was neither, here or there
Thus,three elements now suddenly existed…that which is here …That which is there and that which is neither here or there but which mjst exist for here and there to exist.
It is the no-thing or the unseen which holds the everything. It is the non-space which holds the space. the all which holds the parts.

So now in creating that which is “here” and that which is “there,” God now made it possible for God to know Itself. So n the moment of this great division from within, God created relativity. Thus it is thriogh relativity or relationships God’s greatest gift to us that we can all experience and know ourselfves..time was also created as the elements of all raced forth, for a thing was firt here then it was there, and the period it took toget from here to there was measurable.

Now lets talk about love and fear since every human activity stems from or a derivative of ither love or fear.

Now God knew that for love to exist and to know itself as pure love, the exact opposite of love had to exist as well. So God voluntarily created the great polarity, the absolute opposite of love or everything that love is not…fear..
In the moment fear existed, love could now exist as a thing that could be experienced..

It is this creation between love and its opposite which our various human mythologies refer to as the birth of evil, the fall of man, the fall of Adam, the rebellion of Satan etc etc...just as we have chosen to personify pure love as the character we call God, so have we chosen to personify fear as the character we call the devil.

We have established elaborate mythologies around this event( creation of the opposite of love) complete with scenarios of battles and war, angelic soldiers and devilish warriors, the forces ofgood and evil, of light and dark etc..
These mythologies has been our (makind)early attempt so to speak to understand, and tell others in a way that they could understand, a cosmic occurrence which the human soul is aware(the soul knows all secrets of the universe because there is really one soul the soul of God) of but of which the mind can barely conceive or really understand( by mind here I mean the conscious mind)…

Ok so let me get back to my original story..
so now in rendering the universe as a divided version of itself, all that is or God thys produced, from pure energy, all that now exist both seen and unseen.in other words, not only was the physical universe thus created,but the metaphysical or spiritual realm as well..

Now the part of God which forms the othr half or second part of the I am/Not I am equation also divided or exploded into an infinite number of units smaller than the whole. These energy units we call spirits...in some religious mythologies it is stated that God the father had many spiritual chikdren. Once again it seems to be the way that the masses could be masde to hold in their reality or you could say conscious mind of the suddewn appearance or existence of spirits in the kindom of heaven or the spiritual reaml…

There is only one way for the crteator to know itself experincetially as the creator and that is to create. And so God gave to the counteless part of itself the creative power to create just as it has as the whole.( this is what our religions mean when they say that we were created in the image and likeness of God)…

The creator’s purpose in creating us or should I say dividing itself into many parts was for the creator to know itself as God. God has no way to do that expect through us.( its divided but because there is no one else but God)..Thus it can be said and has been, many times that God’s purpose for me and you (Mr. Anony) and everyone is that we know ousselves as God…




Now there is a reason why we are here in physicality and have chosen to forget who you are but I think I will end here for now and see if you can grasp what I said so far and then I will continue if you want me to… I haven’t completely answered with this story why the one soul became the many souls but there are hints in there..

first,you started by telling me that the problem I have is that what I think God is has been ingrained in me. The funny thing is that I could argue the exact same for you. Anyway that bit is irrelevant because it doesn't matter how one came about what he/she knows, what matters is whether or not it is true.

Now let us critique your premises......

Imagine someone was to describe me to you and he started by saying "there is someone called Anony who is and is not...." or to stretch it further the person continues that "Anony is tall and short, black and white, fat and slim e.t.c. I don't know about you but I will come to the conclusion that it is either the person does not know Anony or Anony does not exist.

The law of non-contradiction states that a thing cannot both be true and untrue at the same time and in the same sense. God cannot both be and yet not be at the same time and in the same sense. The whole notion of "is and is not" simply makes no logical sense. Even if you substitute the word "God" for "all that is" it still doesn't excuse you because all that is cannot at the same time not be. It is either all things are or nothing is. You can't have it both ways.

Let's move on to where it becomes more bizarre. You say God (all that is) was pre-existing as a single form (or non-form) but didn't know itself so it decided to split itself into parts which is everything we see and don't see. Now we have a problem here, please explain how something chose to know itself. How can something which is unconscious of it's existence make a choice? Choice would mean that it knows - mind you there was nothing existed at the time for it to know. The only thing it could possibly know was itself yet you claim that it did not know itself but then made a decision (How?)......This is logically incoherent.

So you have made two illogical statements

1. That something both is and is not
2. That the being devoid of consciousness made a conscious decision.

Love and fear (I will not deal with this now because it will lead us on a tangent. We can come back to you later.)

We move on to God's purpose:- essentially you're saying that there was once/there is a being who didn't know itself so they decided to divide the self that it didn't know so that the constituent parts can know the self that doesn't know itself.
Even funnier is the constituent parts don't know this being by default, they only know themselves as individual entities. In fact there are some entities that are inanimate and therefore don't even know that they exist or anything at all for that matter. The parts that are self-aware have to be taught by other self-aware parts that they are part of the being that they don't know. Even worse is that some of this constituent parts cannot communicate in any way with some other constituent parts that are all from one and the same conscious (and unconscious being). I am sorry but your thesis makes no sense at all.

Your one-soul thesis comes up next but I'll leave that for now and focus on your concept of God which is really almost the same really and so far is inadequate.


I am sorry I have delayed in responding but I have read your stuff and re-read it yet lacks any form of logical coherence.

Mr_Anony:

So you have made two illogical statements

1. That something both is and is not

I think "God" in this case is God as "pure energy" and not everything else. in other words only God as pure energy existed and nothing else did. and God as pure energy later became everything else. So on the question of whether "God" exists or not, for God to exist it has to be relative to something which isn't God. In that sense, there is both God as pure energy and not God as relative to something else which isn't God... Sounds confusing to me who is even typing it I think the summary of what I'm trying to say is that the idea of God as relative to something else which isn't God doesn't exist Yet God itself as pure energy exists as everything and once something is everything it isn't something in particular because it is all there is. You can't call it something such as God or whatever because once you do, it has then become something. Try to grasp you mind around the idea of infinity.

Mr_Anony:

So you have made two illogical statements
2. That the being devoid of consciousness made a conscious decision.

I don't think the idea was that God as pure energy was devoid of consciousness. I think it was that God as we call it didn't know itself as God because there was nothing to compare itself to.

Affiliated:

I think "God" in this case is God as "pure energy" and not everything else. in other words only God as pure energy existed and nothing else did. and God as pure energy later became everything else. So on the question of whether "God" exists or not, for God to exist it has to be relative to something which isn't God. In that sense, there is both God as pure energy and not God as relative to something else which isn't God... Sounds confusing to me who is even typing it I think the summary of what I'm trying to say is that the idea of God as relative to something else which isn't God doesn't exist Yet God itself as pure energy exists as everything and once something is everything it isn't something in particular because it is all there is. You can't call it something such as God or whatever because once you do, it has then become something. Try to grasp you mind around the idea of infinity.

@ boled thats the point he seems to have a finite idea of God..to me the idea and concept of God is so simple really but its kind of funny the way people have a hard time understanding these things...

Affiliated:

I don't think the idea was that God as pure energy was devoid of consciousness. I think it was that God as we call it didn't know itself as God because there was nothing to compare itself to.

good point. you are understanding the concepts and i am very glad.

Affiliated:

I don't think the idea was that God as pure energy was devoid of consciousness. I think it was that God as we call it didn't know itself as God because there was nothing to compare itself to.

So why would it want to know itself as something else other than what it is?

Affiliated:

I think "God" in this case is God as "pure energy" and not everything else. in other words only God as pure energy existed and nothing else did. and God as pure energy later became everything else. So on the question of whether "God" exists or not, for God to exist it has to be relative to something which isn't God. In that sense, there is both God as pure energy and not God as relative to something else which isn't God... Sounds confusing to me who is even typing it I think the summary of what I'm trying to say is that the idea of God as relative to something else which isn't God doesn't exist Yet God itself as pure energy exists as everything and once something is everything it isn't something in particular because it is all there is. You can't call it something such as God or whatever because once you do, it has then become something. Try to grasp you mind around the idea of infinity.

Bros, this is even more confusing but then your statement here makes my point which is that if God isn't anything in particular, then God is nothing i.e does not exist. At best all you have done is provide a synonym for the word "everything" and call it "God".

Mr_Anony:
So why would it want to know itself as something else other than what it is?

if you have an idea or concept of yourself as kind and loving... how do you even know in the first place if your kind or not?

Mr_Anony:
Bros, this is even more confusing but then your statement here makes my point which is that if God isn't anything in particular, then God is nothing i.e does not exist. At best all you have done is provide a synonym for the word "everything" and call it "God".

lol ok i see the root of your problem... To you no-thing means non existent... another question for you.. is air something or no-thing? is outer space although a vacuum really empty. is it really nothing?...

since the word nothing really confuses you, just substiute it with un-seen.. becuase i tell you what the metaphysical exists.
God is every-thing and no-thing. the seen and un-seen..Also to make it easier for you again substitte God with pure energy..God is Energy and it is all there is and all that is. The I am and I am Not. she is everywhere and nowhere..

Mr_Anony:
Bros, this is even more confusing but then your statement here makes my point which is that if God isn't anything in particular, then God is nothing i.e does not exist. At best all you have done is provide a synonym for the word "everything" and call it "God".

Ok. Let's not use the term God. Let's use the term "Fabric of the Universe" as it is known in China. That is the material on which the whole universe or infinity is built. Really try to grasp the idea of infinity then answer my question. What can be infinite? What I feel the answer should be is nothing, because once you try to describe it, it has become finite... Now that "nothing" which is infinite is actually something to you which you can now call God.
On a related note i think our minds are also infinite but once we try to describe our mind or ourselves, for example when you accept a name or an identity you mind has stopped being infinite and become something which is the identity you have accepted. The Buddha tried to explain this when he talked about the the state of nirvana which means to stop being or to lose your identity and attain a mind state of everything. If that state is attained, Mr_Anony exists yet doesn't exist in the sense that you are now everything so for all intents and purposes you no longer exist as yourself and yet if i tried to describe you, you would be Mr_Anony even though you are still capable of being anything else

Or better still in the subatomic world it is possible for subatomic particles such as photons to materialize out of nowhere for no reason whatsoever and disappear after a while. Such subatomic particles when disappeared still exist as "everything" in their world yet they can become something somewhere for one reason or another. That everything in their world is a field or a wave. Electrons for instance exist as a field all around an atom and yet they can become a particle for a while. If we assume that the field around an atom is all that exists then that electron is nothing in particular because it is everything and yet it can choose to become something separate from everything else

greatgenius: if you have an idea or concept of yourself as kind and loving... how do you even know in the first place if your kind or not?

You see, that's the problem you have. I cannot know that I am kind and loving or what kind and loving means if I am all alone (who am I loving and who am I kind to?). I won't even have any concept of kindness. Why then will I want to acheive something I have no concept of in the first place?

To bring it home to you: You have no concept of what an invisible green car is (a car cannot be invisible and yet have a color). How then can you set out to build an invisible green car that you have absolutely no concept of?

Hmmmmm, this is getting more interesting!

Imagine someone was to describe me to you and he started by saying "there is someone called Anony who is and is not...." or to stretch it further the person continues that "Anony is tall and short, black and white, fat and slim e.t.c. I don't know about you but I will come to the conclusion that it is either the person does not know Anony or Anony does not exist.

well if the contention and reality was that Anony is a finite bieng with the ability to be one thing only or few things then your proposition is right. then he cannot be something else other than what and who he is...but if Anomy has infinite abilities and possibilities then there is nothing that he cannot be..

greatgenius: lol ok i see the root of your problem... To you no-thing means non existent... another question for you.. is air something or no-thing? is outer space although a vacuum really empty. is it really nothing?...

Air is not nothing, air exists same as space. It is not nothing. Nothing has no properties.

since the word nothing really confuses you, just substiute it with un-seen.. becuase i tell you what the metaphysical exists.
God is every-thing and no-thing. the seen and un-seen..Also to make it easier for you again substitte God with pure energy..God is Energy and it is all there is and all that is. The I am and I am Not. she is everywhere and nowhere..

My friend stop with the logical contradictions. Even if God/pure energy was in space (which you call a vacuum) she would still be somewhere. She can't be everywhere and nowhere at the same time.

greatgenius: well if the contention and reality was that Anony is a finite bieng with the ability to be one thing only or few things then your proposition is right. then he cannot be something else other than what and who he is...but if Anomy has infinite abilities and possibilities then there is nothing that he cannot be..

Even if Anony was infinite, there is no way he can be and yet not be. For instance we perceive space and numbers as infinite concepts but it is logically incoherent to claim that numbers exist and yet do not exist. That is terrible logic.

Affiliated:

Ok. Let's not use the term God. Let's use the term "Fabric of the Universe" as it is known in China. That is the material on which the whole universe or infinity is built. Really try to grasp the idea of infinity then answer my question. What can be infinite? What I feel the answer should be is nothing, because once you try to describe it, it has become finite... Now that "nothing" which is infinite is actually something to you which you can now call God.

Actually no, numbers are similarly infinite. Physical things cannot be infinite but non-physical things can.

On a related note i think our minds are also infinite but once we try to describe our mind or ourselves, for example when you accept a name or an identity you mind has stopped being infinite and become something which is the identity you have accepted. The Buddha tried to explain this when he talked about the the state of nirvana which means to stop being or to lose your identity and attain a mind state of everything. If that state is attained, Mr_Anony exists yet doesn't exist in the sense that you are now everything so for all intents and purposes you no longer exist as yourself and yet if i tried to describe you, you would be Mr_Anony even though you are still capable of being anything else

My friend, this bit still makes no sense. If indeed one loses his/her identity, then such a one has ceased to exist and what now exists is the "everything" that he/she has melted into. You can't have it both ways. You cannot lose your identity and still have it, you cannot be and yet not be. You can't eat your cake and have it.

Mr_Anony:
Even if Anony was infinite, there is no way he can be and yet not be. For instance we perceive space and numbers as infinite concepts but it is logically incoherent to claim that numbers exist and yet do not exist. That is terrible logic.

We all know there are such things as Numbers however imagine a civilization that is totally oblivious to the idea of numbers. Numbers don't exist to them because its not in their reality however numbers which our ideas have made real to us are simply representations of the real thing and really do not exist at all. That's the way everything is. representations of the real thing that exist to us because our ideas have made it so. It's not terrible logic if i claim that numbers exist and do not exist just like everything else

Mr_Anony:
Actually no, numbers are similarly infinite. Physical things cannot be infinite but non-physical things can.

Once again numbers are representations of the real thing

Mr_Anony:
My friend, this bit still makes no sense. If indeed one loses his/her identity, then such a one has ceased to exist and what now exists is the "everything" that he/she has melted into. You can't have it both ways. You cannot lose your identity and still have it, you cannot be and yet not be. You can't eat your cake and have it.

But you can have it both ways. If you are going to agree to that logic, then the author claimed He did it.

[quote author=Mr_Anony]
You see, that's the problem you have. I cannot know that I am kind and loving or what kind and loving means if I am all alone

walaa exactly and that's why we are in this game..why God "created" relativity in order to experiece itself... he is all there is, she is alone..there is no one else...the only way to experience himself of who he thought he was, was to divide himself into an infinte number of beings...relationship and the illusion of seperation was thus created...God is really playing a game with himself.. [quote](who am I loving and who am I kind to?).

basically you will be loving yourself..that is why it is said that what you do unto others you do unto self and what you do unto self you do to others... imagine yourself having coming up with a great script and dividing your very being right now into it individual cells and acting it out. the truth is you are all alone there is no one else. there is only one of us( i know i have been repeating this a lot its become a cliche but its the truth)..

I won't even have any concept of kindness. Why then will I want to acheive something I have no concept of in the first place?{/quote]a concept is just what it is. a concept. an idea. do you not have a concept of who you are at all?

[quote]To bring it home to you: You have no concept of what an invisible green car is (a car cannot be invisible and yet have a color). How then can you set out to build an invisible green car that you have absolutely no concept of?

everything starts of as a concept my fried..everything that you ever created and been started of us an idea in your head. from the invinsible, your thoughts.

Affiliated:

We all know there are such things as Numbers however imagine a civilization that is totally oblivious to the idea of numbers. Numbers don't exist to them because its not in their reality however numbers which our ideas have made real to us are simply representations of the real thing and really do not exist at all. That's the way everything is. representations of the real thing that exist to us because our ideas have made it so. It's not terrible logic if i claim that numbers exist and do not exist just like everything else

How can you define this civilization as "them" if there is absolutely no concept of numbers. The concept of numbers are not contingent to our world but are necessary to all possible worlds.

Affiliated:

Once again numbers are representations of the real thing

It seems you have shifted your argument here because if we follow what you are saying, then nothing can possibly exist because all a thing really is are the properties that define it. For example if I said define a ball, You would say a spherical object. A sphere is not a ball but a "representation". If abstract properties such as the number "1" and "sphere" do not exist, then a ball cannot exist therefore abstracts must exist.

But you can have it both ways. If you are going to agree to that logic, then the author claimed He did it.

Anyone can claim anything

Mr_Anony:
Air is not nothing, air exists same as space. It is not nothing. Nothing has no properties.

ok so we getting somewhere.we are getting to the root of the root of your problem... nothing has no properties is debatable but thats for another day.. but for now i want you to define what you think nothing means?

My friend stop with the logical contradictions. Even if God/pure energy was in space (which you call a vacuum) she would still be somewhere. She can't be everywhere and nowhere at the same time.

you speak of logical contradictions but you are the one making it..dude if God is every where then she cannot not be nowhere.. it seems like a contradiction to you because you are looking at this from a relative stand point. i am looking at this from a sublime state.

Mr_Anony:
It seems you have shifted your argument here because if we follow what you are saying, then nothing can possibly exist because all a thing really is are the properties that define it. For example if I said define a ball, You would say a spherical object. A sphere is not a ball but a "representation". If abstract properties such as the number "1" and "sphere" do not exist, then a ball cannot exist therefore abstracts must exist.

Erm. Where to start?
1. I haven't shifted my arguments
2. Refer back to beginning of topic where we were asking if anything really exists
3. A ball itself is a representation of what it is made up of [atoms] [which at its most basic is energy] just like a sphere itself is the representation of what it is made up of [ideas] [which at its most basic is also energy]. this energy can arrange itself in whatever pattern it wishes to. Plato said something along the lines that He could look at a rose and see beauty and also look at a woman and see beauty. He concluded that both are representations of the goddess of beauty

Mr_Anony:
Anyone can claim anything

Yes I agree and I would have left it at that if you claimed the state of nirvana cannot be attained. I haven't attained it myself so I can't be certain of it. You can't however dictate what happens in that state when you yourself haven't attained it. If you say it's possible then I think its wiser to listen to who claims to have attained it

greatgenius: ok so we getting somewhere.we are getting to the root of the root of your problem... nothing has no properties is debatable but thats for another day.. but for now i want you to define what you think nothing means?

lol, see question!
Definition of nothing = nothing, no thing, nada, zilch. When I say nothing, I mean nothing not a place where things that don't exist go to hang out. Nothing has absolutely no properties immediately you give it properties, you have defined it and it has become something.

you speak of logical contradictions but you are the one making it..dude if God is every where then she cannot not be nowhere.. it seems like a contradiction to you because you are looking at this from a relative stand point. i am looking at this from a sublime state.

Really? Please what do you mean by relative and sublime states?

Mr_Anony: lol, see question!
Definition of nothing = nothing, no thing, nada, zilch. When I say nothing, I mean nothing not a place where things that don't exist go to hang out. Nothing has absolutely no properties immediately you give it properties, you have defined it and it has become something.

There is no such thing as that

Mr_Anony:
How can you define this civilization as "them" if there is absolutely no concept of numbers. The concept of numbers are not contingent to our world but are necessary to all possible worlds.

Unless you can remember building all the worlds that exist, how do you know this?

I think I now understand the problem. Mr_Anony takes nothing in particular to be nothing. But by nothing and nowhere in particular we mean everything and everywhere hence the "IN PARTICULAR"

Affiliated:

Erm. Where to start?
1. I haven't shifted my arguments
2. Refer back to beginning of topic where we were asking if anything really exists
3. A ball itself is a representation of what it is made up of [atoms] [which at its most basic is energy] just like a sphere itself is the representation of what it is made up of [ideas] [which at its most basic is also energy]. this energy can arrange itself in whatever pattern it wishes to. Plato said something along the lines that He could look at a rose and see beauty and also look at a woman and see beauty. He concluded that both are representations of the goddess of beauty

I don't remember asking if anything exists. I am quite convinced that I do and you do and God does. Each of us distinct from one another. You guys are the ones arguing that God is and is not. I say that's logical nonsense.

Now let us come to energy. A ball is not energy, a ball has energy. A ball is matter. I know you might argue that matter and energy are the same but really they are not, energy is a property of matter. To measure energy, there must be a mass and a velocity of the motion of the mass. Without these, energy simply isn't there.
That said, Ideas are not energy. to claim that an idea is energy, you must give the physical mass of the idea and than tell us at what speed it is moving.

Yes I agree and I would have left it at that if you claimed the state of nirvana cannot be attained. I haven't attained it myself so I can't be certain of it. You can't however dictate what happens in that state when you yourself haven't attained it. If you say it's possible then I think its wiser to listen to who claims to have attained it

My friend, whatever Nirvana is, if it is not logically coherent, it doesn't exist. You cannot lose your identity and yet have it at the same time.

Affiliated:

There is no such thing as that



Unless you can remember building all the worlds that exist, how do you know this?

By possible worlds, I mean that there is no scenario whatsoever - real or imagined - where the concept of numbers does not exist. You can try. Imagine a world with no concept of numbers (first of all it won't even be a world to start with because "a" signifies the number "1" ). Feel free to try

Mr_Anony:
My friend, whatever Nirvana is, if it is not logically coherent, it doesn't exist. You cannot lose your identity and yet have it at the same time.

Ok. I respect your opinion.

Mr_Anony:
I don't remember asking if anything exists. I am quite convinced that I do and you do and God does. Each of us distinct from one another. You guys are the ones arguing that God is and is not. I say that's logical nonsense.

Now let us come to energy. A ball is not energy, a ball has energy. A ball is matter. I know you might argue that matter and energy are the same but really they are not, energy is a property of matter. To measure energy, there must be a mass and a velocity of the motion of the mass. Without these, energy simply isn't there.
That said, Ideas are not energy. to claim that an idea is energy, you must give the physical mass of the idea and than tell us at what speed it is moving.

1. You didn't ask if anything exists, I was the one asking the thread if anything physical really exists.
2. I respect your opinions. When I however did my research on what matter is made up of i found out and agreed with the fact that when you break matter down to its most basic form there is a string of energy vibrating in a certain way that creates that reality [string theory]. This theory hasn't been proven but my unconscious mind accepts it to be true so its true for me. please respect my opinions too. Moving on to quantum physics which is too complex to be explained here but one of the possible interpretations according to scientists is that our thoughts or consciousness which are vibrations affect subatomic particles which is because they are made up of the same thing [energy].
Disclosure: Other possibilities explanations of the quantum world according to the same scientists is that
1. Particles move backwards as well as forwards in time and appear in all possible places at once
2. The universe is splitting, every Planck-time (10 E-43 seconds) into billions of parallel universes
I think the thought explanation makes more sense

Mr_Anony: lol, see question!
Definition of nothing = nothing, no thing, nada, zilch. When I say nothing, I mean nothing not a place where things that don't exist go to hang out. Nothing has absolutely no properties immediately you give it properties, you have defined it and it has become something.

lmao@ bolded had me laughing.. im glad we having fun with this a little...but lets get serious a second... so in other words rephrasing everything you said "nothing is something with no properties" and hence to you does not exist...

like i said i now know the root of your problem and i could just go ahead and tell you the error in your view of things but i want you to see the error for yourself... To you since "nothing"is not seen in reality it does not exist( which is really a contradiction from your part based on the fact that you seem to believe in an invisible God in the sky somewhere but this is for another for anothr time )

so lets go with this revised definition" nothing is something with "no properties" ".... but my question to you then is does that really mean nothing does not really exist? does nothing really has no properties? is an idea nothing? is the abstract nothing? is the invisible really nothing? does an idea or concept before it becomes reality really has "no properties? does the something with properties not come from the nothing or the invisible? does your thoughts really have "no properties?..if you have a thought or an idea to build a house or car. does the contents of those ideas really have really have no properties? how does your building come about then? does the building come from the somthing/building or the nothing/ideas?

i tell you what everything that you see came from the nothing... without the nothing or unseen there is no something! you create your reality. your concepts/ideas and beliefs creates your reality..That is a fact..the nothing will always create the somthing.

Really? Please what do you mean by relative and sublime states?

you only observe and perceive in relationships. to you it is either this or that and not both. you are in the illusion.i see unity.. when you step out of the illusion you see from all angles and see it for what it really is..