If you are a member of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, let's meet here and share our views, experiences, tesmimonies, ask questions, etcetera.
This thread is also open to all Christians interested in learning and knowing of the true gospel of Jesus Christ in its fullness which is only found in the MORMON church.
Feel free to ask questions about the church and gospel of Jesus Christ.

Black Nigerian mormons?


Can people who live in USA say something about this?

@lb: did you get my mail?

Really! So "mormonism" do reach naija

Jsmyth: If you are a member of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, let's meet here and share our views, experiences, tesmimonies, ask questions, etcetera.
This thread is also open to all Christians interested in learning and knowing of the true gospel of Jesus Christ in its fullness which is only found in the MORMON church.
Feel free to ask questions about the church and gospel of Jesus Christ.

musKeeto: @lb: did you get my mail?

Sorry let me check! I am gonna check now.

Sure....its open to every1 to comment@lb
Mormonism has been in Nigeria for years now.

Logicboy03: Black Nigerian mormons?


Can people who live in USA say something about this?

God is That You? Or the IRS?

So which was it? A direct message from God to the President of the Church of Latter Day Saints? Or – and far more likely – a direct message from the Internal Revenue Service by way of then U.S. President Jimmy Carter threatening to revoke their non-profit status if they continued to discriminate against blacks?

In order to go forward with this discussion, we must first learn the origins of this discrimination against all people of dark skin in the world by Mormon's founding fathers. They call it the Curse of Cain…and there are writings from the founder Joseph Smith, Presidents and Apostles for decades supporting the belief that blacks are born of an evil seed and are not worthy of co-mingling with, let alone allowed in their church.

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be" (ibid., 10:110; emphasis added)
“But let them apostatize, and they will become gray-haired, wrinkled, and black, just like the Devil" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 5, p. 332
Had I anything to do with the Negro, I would confine them by strict law to their own species, and put them on a national equalization" (Joseph Fielding Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, 270; History of the Church, 5: 218; emphasis added).

These are strong and definitive statements without leaving any room for equivocation. A Mormon member asked the question as to whether the Church's position on banning blacks from the priesthood was opinion or doctrine and he was answered by the leadership through an official statement" stating in part….

"From the days of the Prophet Joseph Smith even until now, it is has been the doctrine of the Church, never questioned by any of the Church leaders, that the Negroes are not entitled to the full blessings of the Gospel. "Furthermore, your ideas, as we understand them, appear to contemplate the intermarriage of the Negro and White races, a concept which has heretofore been most repugnant to most normal-minded people from the ancient patriarchs till now. God's rule for Israel, His Chosen People, has been endogamous [meaning 'marriage within a specific tribe or similar social unit']. Modern Israel [the Mormon Church] has been similarly directed.

"We are not unmindful of the fact that there is a growing tendency, particularly among some educators, as it manifests itself in this are, toward the breaking down of race barriers in the matter of intermarriage between whites and blacks, but it does not have the sanction of the Church and is contrary to Church doctrine. "Faithfully yours,

[signed]

George Albert Smith
J. Reuben Clark, Jr.
David O. McKay

The First Presidency
That is their highest authority, again, leaving no gray areas. Here is a partial summary of their doctrine:
Summary of the Curse of Cain Doctrine and Priesthood-Ban Policy

For 130 years (1848-1978), Mormon Church leaders taught the following:
All human spirits were born sons and daughters of God and one or more of His wives, on the planet that God lives on, which is near a star named Kolob (koe-lawb)
Adam and Eve were white people, living in the Garden of Eden in what is now Jackson County, Missouri, who looked like Anglo-Saxons (like 19th century Mormons).
Cain was a white man until he killed Abel, so God changed him into the first Negro.
Also, the "seed of Cain" would also inherit his "cursed" and "mark" and also they would be deprived of the Priesthood until the LORD removed the Curse of Cain sometime after Abel was resurrected, had children, and all of Abel's male descendants received the Priesthood first, then the Curse of Cain would be removed.
The Mark of Cain was a black skin, flat nose, and kinky hair. Cain, a white man, is "changed" by the LORD instantly into the first Negro.
Cain married his sister, and she became the second Negro ever because the Lord also "changed" her from a white Anglo-Saxon looking woman into a Negro.
All the spirits who fought for Jesus against Lucifer in the War in Heaven, before this Earth was formed, but who were "less valiant"–were punished by being born into "the lineage of Cain" as Negroes, and thus "deprived of intelligence", with "mis-shapen" and "ugly" bodies, and destined to be "servants" of the white man, their superiors, until the Curse of Cain was removed by the LORD sometime after the Millennium was over.
Canaan and his descendants went into Africa, and a few to India and Australia and New Guinea.
All Negroes inherit the "Mark of Cain" which is a black skin, flat nose, and kinky hair.
Negroes are banned from the Temple and the Priesthood until the Curse of Cain is removed by the Lord sometime after the Millennium (1000 year reign of Christ on Earth) is over.

This doctrine was known as The Curse of Cain Doctrine. Because of this doctrine, all black Mormons, and anyone with "one drop of Negro blood" was banned from the Mormon Temple and the Mormon priesthood. All male Mormons over the age of 12 hold the Priesthood, and they must have it in order to get into the highest heaven. All Mormons must be "Endowed" and "Sealed" in a Mormon Temple in order to get into the Celestial Kingdom (highest heaven). Without the priesthood and Temple endowments and sealings, a Mormon male can, at best, become a sexless and eunuched "eternal servant" of the Gods in the Celestial Kingdom.
Wow! Quite a story isn't it? So, after reading the origins of their discrimination against blacks and the admonition that to go against this teaching means the virtual end of the Church of Latter Day Saints…are you buying that suddenly, and with amazing coincidence, that the LDS leadership had a change of instruction by God at the very same time that their 501(c) non-profit status was being threatened? No? Me either.

President Carter caused a ripple throughout the religious community in America when he threatened their tax exempt statuses if they engaged in discrimination against blacks and other minorities. A long time social conservative mover and shaker whose contribution to political Christianity still haunts us, named Paul Weyrich had this to say about that tax threat and Christian schools…
Weyrich in an interview in the early 1990s said, "What changed their mind was Jimmy Carter's intervention against the Christian schools, trying to deny them tax-exempt status on the basis of so-called de facto segregation." What caused the [Religious Right] movement to surface," Weyrich reiterated,"was the federal government's moves against Christian schools." The IRS threat against segregated schools, he said, "enraged the Christian community."
"Official Letter 2" was issued by LDS President Spencer W. Kimball on June 8, 1978 making it official that God had come to him in the tower of the Temple and told him that it was time to allow blacks into the Mormon priesthood.

That tax exempt status can apparently even move God to change His mind and reverse scripture.

What is hideous about this is that the shift to "allow" blacks into the church is a shill. Some dear friends of mine told me about their visit to the Mormon Temple several years ago in Salt Lake City. When they stepped up to take the tour a Mormon representative made a flimsy attempt to welcome them by saying it was "okay for you to enter because we let you in" as she ushered them along. Tootie retells it with warranted indignation, repeating the phrase "they LET me in!?" This was a tour that is open to all-comers and the reference was clearly racial according to the whole conversation directed at both Tootie and her husband.

That is my point to this whole article, I far more believe that they "let them in" in order to preserve their tax exempt status. The Mormon church has always been a wealthy one. And that the discrimination built into their original doctrine has not simply disappeared with the compliant decision in 1978.

http://www.politicususa.com/voice-god-irs.html

[color=#006600][/color]
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (the LDS Church or, informally, the Mormon Church ) is a Christian primitivist church that considers itself to be a restoration of the church founded by Jesus Christ . The church is headquartered in Salt Lake City, Utah , and has established congregations (called wards or branches ) and built temples worldwide. According to the church, it has over 55,000 missionaries worldwide and has a membership of over 14.4 million. [ 1 ] It is ranked by the National Council of Churches as the fourth largest Christian denomination in the United States. [ 2 ] It is the largest denomination in the Latter Day Saint movement started by Joseph Smith during the period of religious revival known as the Second Great Awakening .
Adherents, referred to as Latter-day Saints or, more informally, Mormons , view faith in Jesus Christ and his atonement as the central tenet of their religion. [ 3 ] LDS theology includes the Christian doctrine of salvation only through Jesus Christ, [ 4 ] though LDS doctrines regarding the nature of God and the potential of mankind differ significantly from mainstream Christianity. The church has an open canon which includes four scriptural texts : [ 5 ] the Bible (both Old and New Testaments ), the Book of Mormon , the Doctrine and Covenants , and the Pearl of Great Price . Other than the Bible, the majority of the LDS canon constitutes revelation dictated by Joseph Smith and includes commentary and exegesis about the Bible, texts described as lost parts of the Bible, and other works believed to be written by ancient prophets .
Under the doctrine of continuing revelation , Latter-day Saints believe that Jesus Christ, under the direction of Heavenly Father , leads the church by revealing His will to its president , whom adherents regard as a modern-day " prophet, seer, and revelator ". The current president is Thomas S. Monson . Individual members believe that they can also receive personal revelation from God in conducting their lives. [ 6 ] The president heads a hierarchical structure with various levels reaching down to local congregations. Bishops , drawn from the laity , lead local congregations. Worthy male members, after reaching age 12, may be ordained to the priesthood . Women do not hold positions within the priesthood, but do occupy leadership roles in church auxiliary organizations . [ 7 ]
Both men and women may serve as missionaries, and the church maintains a large missionary program which proselytizes and conducts humanitarian services worldwide. Faithful members adhere to laws regarding sexual purity , health , fasting , and Sabbath observance , and contribute ten percent of their income to the church as a tithe . In addition, the church teaches sacred ordinances through which adherents make covenants with God, including baptism , confirmation , the sacrament ( holy communion ), endowment , and celestial marriage (marriage blessings which extend beyond mortality), which are of great significance to church members.

Mormonism has been in Nigeria for as long as I can remember. And I definitely remember them walking on the streets with their (briefcases) in white shirts and black trousers (in pairs mostly) with their name tags on their shirts. There was a church near my school in Ondo in 1989. Their missionaries I guess from the states usually drove Nissan Sunny cars.

I hope you do know that mormons were quite racist to black people

Logicboy03: I hope you do know that mormons were quite racist to black people

That was a problem that occured a century ago but it was resolved by a revelation from the Lord......Blacks are allowed the priesthood and full participation in the church....Today, black Mormons are very happy people....I duno of any type of racism in the church. Even as God commanded Peter in a vision not to discriminate the gentiles so in the church, everybody is equal.

Jsmyth:

That was a problem that occured a century ago but it was resolved by a revelation from the Lord......Blacks are allowed the priesthood and full participation in the church....Today, black Mormons are very happy people....I duno of any type of racism in the church. Even as God commanded Peter in a vision not to discriminate the gentiles so in the church, everybody is equal.

That is good to hear but hard to forgive

Logicboy03:

That is good to hear but hard to forgive

But we all have to learn to forgive as God commanded us to......

Jsmyth:

But we all have to learn to forgive as God commanded us to......

so there was a change in revelation?
Strange!

Jsmyth:

But we all have to learn to forgive as God commanded us to......

Who needs the forgiveness?

God or man?

Was the instruction/revelation God's or man's?

Jsmyth:

That was a problem that occured a century ago but it was resolved by a revelation from the Lord......Blacks are allowed the priesthood and full participation in the church....Today, black Mormons are very happy people....I duno of any type of racism in the church. Even as God commanded Peter in a vision not to discriminate the gentiles so in the church, everybody is equal.

The Mormons actually first came to Nigeria in the early 1960s, but they were unceremoniously kicked out by the federal government over their blatantly racist teachings and practices. They only stopped discriminating against blacks in 1978 when political pressure and their need to expand into new countries like Brazil (and make more money) made the policy untenable.

Meanwhile, they have never repudiated or apologized for their long history of racism. They don't feel they have done anything to be sorry for.

Apparently it was God that told then that blacks had the seed of Cain and couldn't hold any notable position in the church. Luckily, he has a habit of changing his mind at the very moment his decrees become inconvenient for the LDS church.

www.nairaland.com/1061475/there-church-lattar-day-saints

Evil Brain:

The Mormons actually first came to Nigeria in the early 1960s, but they were unceremoniously kicked out by the federal government over their blatantly racist teachings and practices. They only stopped discriminating against blacks in 1978 when political pressure and their need to expand into new countries like Brazil (and make more money) made the policy untenable.

Meanwhile, they have never repudiated or apologized for. their long history of racism. They don't feel they have done anything to be sorry for.

Apparently it was God that told then that blacks had the seed of Cain and couldn't hold any notable position in the church. Luckily, he has a habit of changing his mind at the very moment his decrees become inconvenient for the LDS church.

www.nairaland.com/1061475/there-church-lattar-day-saints

Racism/discrimination is a disease that tends to harbour in some people. Forgive me for saying this, the whites generally have always considered themselves as a better breed thus looking down on people with the darker skin, even as the Jews did to other nations. It is quite unfortunate that the few early Mormons had the same mentality and disregarded the blacks. After much prayer and appeal to God, a revelation(which helps in guiding the church) was given to the then prophet to regard the blacks as equal thus ending racism among Mormons. Today, the church fights against racism and if you haven't heard of any apology from the church, I want to use this medium to assure you that RACISM is not found among MORMONS and plead with those who feel they were discriminated in one way or the other.

Evil Brain:

The Mormons actually first came to Nigeria in the early 1960s, but they were unceremoniously kicked out by the federal government over their blatantly racist teachings and practices. They only stopped discriminating against blacks in 1978 when political pressure and their need to expand into new countries like Brazil (and make more money) made the policy untenable.

Meanwhile, they have never repudiated or apologized for their long history of racism. They don't feel they have done anything to be sorry for.

Apparently it was God that told then that blacks had the seed of Cain and couldn't hold any notable position in the church. Luckily, he has a habit of changing his mind at the very moment his decrees become inconvenient for the LDS church.

www.nairaland.com/1061475/there-church-lattar-day-saints

this god that bend when money pressure comes his way.

So, the gods bend when force to?
Smh.

Did he not know that his decision was wrong in the beginning?

What a short sighted God!

Jsmyth:

But we all have to learn to forgive as God commanded us to......

Who needs the forgiveness?

God or man?

Was the instruction/revelation God's or man's?

truthislight:

this god that bend when money pressure come his way.

So, the gods bend when force to?
Smh.

Did he not know that his decision was wrong in the beginning?

What a short sighted God!

Jsmyth:

Racism/discrimination is a disease that tends to harbour in some people. Forgive me for saying this, the whites generally have always considered themselves as a better breed thus looking down on people with the darker skin, even as the Jews did to other nations. It is quite unfortunate that the few early Mormons had the same mentality and disregarded the blacks. After much prayer and appeal to God, a revelation(which helps in guiding the church) was given to the then prophet to regard the blacks as equal thus ending racism among Mormons. Today, the church fights against racism and if you haven't heard of any apology from the church, I want to use this medium to assure you that RACISM is not found among MORMONS and plead with those who feel they were discriminated in one way or the other.

This your god that made such a mistake, who is he?

Is it true that your God is "bone and flesh"?

If yes, please explain how?

If no, who is your God then?

Can humans see him?

Thank you.

truthislight:

this god that bend when money pressure come his way.

So, the gods bend when force to?
Smh.

Did he not know that his decision was wrong in the beginning?

What a short sighted God!

HEY!!!!.....Mormons are Christians and they worship the same GOD, so, u might wanna be careful wid the language ur using, its totally wrong.....

Jsmyth:

HEY!!!!.....Mormons are Christians and they worship the same GOD, so, u might wanna be careful wid the language ur using, its totally wrong.....

is your God flesh and bone? Yes or no?

(John 4:24).
"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. " (John 4:24).

does your book of Mormon agree with that ^^^?

v

Jsmyth:

HEY!!!!.....Mormons are Christians and they worship the same GOD, so, u might wanna be careful wid the language ur using, its totally wrong.....

@Jsmyth

please, try and answer this question nah! ?

truthislight:

This your god that made such a mistake, who is he?

Is it true that your God is "bone and flesh"?

If yes, please explain how?

If no, who is your God then?

Can humans see him?

Thank you.

@truthislight.......In the Bible, we are made to understand that God created man in his own image and likeness.....what does that tell you? ; That God has 10 legs whike humans have two?why are we often referred to as children of God? ; Can a human produce/give birth to a Dog??.......In LDS, we believe in the GODHEAD - made up of 3 distinctive beings, God the Father, God the Son(Jesus Christ) and the Holy Ghost united in 1 purpose which is to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man... The Father has a body of flesh and bone as tangible as Man, He has an immortal, glorious and perfected body, so is his Son but man has a mortal body with blood subject to pain and weakness, but the Holy Spirit has no body, its a personage of the spirit were it not so, it would not dwell in us.

truthislight:

is your God flesh and bone? Yes or no?

(John 4:24).
"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. " (John 4:24).

does your book of Mormon agree with that ^^^?

Am very much farmiliar with that passage in the Bible, from the translation of this portion by scholars, its very straighforward telling us that God is a spirit.....YES! He is our spirit Father, the natural man is an enemy to God and the Canal mind does not understand the things of the Lord, that's why John admonished us to worship him in spirit and in truth.

Jsmyth: @truthislight.......In the Bible, we are made to understand that God created man in his own image and likeness.....what does that tell you?

that human are intelligent and have freewill.

That We human have qualities that are peculiar to God that animals dont have.

If it is in form, does that mean that chimpanzys are also in God's image?

Afteral, we and chimps have same form. Two legs, two hands, and we stand straight also like Chimps.

Jsmyth:
; That God has 10 legs whike humans have two?why are we often referred to as children of God?

Chimps also have two legs. No?

Why are Chimps not also refered to as children of God? What are the difference in form between chimps and human?

Jsmyth:
; Can a human produce/give birth to a Dog??.......In

can Chimps produce/give birth to dogs? No.

Jsmyth:
LDS, we believe in the GODHEAD - made up of 3 distinctive beings, God the Father, God the Son(Jesus Christ) and the Holy Ghost

allmost all christiandom churches belief in the trinity and so what?

What then makes you unique? Trinity? Oh please!

Who told you that trinity is a bible based teaching?
Look for something else.

Jesus is not almighty God.

(your trinity version erm!)

Jsmyth:
united in 1 purpose which is to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man...

Jsmyth:
The Father has a body of flesh and bone as tangible as Man,

that ^ is not a bible teaching.

The bible says that God is a spirit, no material since spirits dont have material.
In fact, Jesus said that himself.

"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. " (John 4:24).

And:

"No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him." (John 1:18).
..............
So, with that, how did you manage to see your god?

And how do you come to know he is "flesh and bone"?

What we know of the almighty is Jesus revealing and doing.

Dont try na use Jesus actions/revealing in OT and NT and put it to the father.

Jsmyth:
He has an immortal, glorious and perfected body,

God almighty is a spirit the bible says.

Jsmyth:
so is his Son

Yes, the son reveal/explains the father from OT to NT. But NO one has seen the father at anytime Jesus said.

Are you trying to tell me that Jesus lied to us?

"No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him." (John 1:18).
.............
your word against that of Jesus ^.

Peace.

Jsmyth:
from the translation of this portion by scholars,

i hope you are not trying to do what the muslim also do? discredit the bible as to project the book of Mormon?

Your next line will be "if the bible is well translated".

Pleaseeeeeee! If you dont belief in the bible, say so, and dont use the bible to project the book of Mormon only to later maligned it.

Thats ^ fraudulent of you guys.

Jsmyth:
John admonished us to worship him in spirit and in truth.

That was not the words of John but the words of our lord Jesus christ himself.

John only wrote it down and not him admonishing us.

Jesus knew quite well that his father is a spirit.

"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. " (John 4:24).

Do you want to go against the words of Jesus?

Smh.

Ubenedictus: so there was a change in revelation?
Strange!

Not strange, God always repent, regrets, update etc all d tyme ...

truthislight:
If it is in form, does that mean that chimpanzys are also in God's images.

The Bible never said anything about creating animals in his own image....The animals like chimps were created for their own purpose whatever it may be.....God deals with Man(his children) that he created in his own image.

truthislight:
allmost all christiandom churches belief in the trinity and so what?

We do not believe in trinity, trinity says that the 3 Gods are 1person.......we teach that they are 3 separate beings united in 1 purpose.

truthislight:
What then makes you unique?

The Book of Mormon - another testament of Jesus Christ which is found only in our church. The Book of Mormon testifies of the bible to be true and the Bible testifies of the Book of Mormon to be true...Together, they provide the fullness of the Gospel......This is what we have that other Christian dominations don't have.

truthislight:
Who told you that trinity is a bible based teaching?
Look for something else.

I never said anything about trinity or it being a Bible based teaching.

truthislight:
Jesus is not almighty God

Yes!....he(Son) is the second in the Godhead while God(Father) is the head. Jesus Christ is [a]God.

truthislight:
"No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him." (John 1:18)........

And how do you come to know he is "flesh and bone"?.

I hope you agree with me that Jesus Christ even when he had ressurrected had an immortal glorified body of flesh and bone.....He told Thomas(coz he tot Jesus was a spirit) touch me, feel my hands, he ate and dined with them and told them that he is not a spirit for a spirit hath no flesh were it not so he would not av eaten with them.....(John 14 : 9) says ...HE THAT HATH SEEN ME, HATH SEEN THE FATHER, and how sayest thou then, shew us the Father.......(2Cor 4 : 4) ...lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God.......(Philip. 2 : 5-6) let this mind be in you, which was also Christ Jesus ; who being in the form of God.......(Col 1 : 15) ...who(Jesus) is the image of the invisible God...............( Heb 1 : 3) who(Jesus) being in the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person(God)...................many other scriptures tell us that Man was created in God's image, his form, ressemblance....which means that God has a body just like Man.......(James 3 : 9) therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.......(1Tim 3 : 16) ...God was manifest in the flesh ; justified ain the spirit.........I haven't included Book of Mormon scripture passages which testifies of and affirms and adds more knowledge to what the Bible has said alread, since am pretty sure you will outrightly condemn......

Ubenedictus: so there was a change in revelation?Strange!

Flyin' Saucer:
Not strange, God always repent, regrets, update etc all d tyme ...

I don't know what you're saying, but am pretty sure God used to give revelations to his prophets in the olden days and still continues to give revelations to his prophets in these latter days to guide his people.........
"Surely the Lord God will do nothing but he revealeth his secrets unto his servants the prophets"

[quote author=Jsmyth][/quote]

Guy, why not go to the Mod thread and ask how to quote aspects of posters post?

As you can see, i could not really address(quote) or fully comprehend your reply to me as it all appeared quoted.

Better still, remove the part of my post and post yours directly so that your post will be clearer pending when you master how to quote aspect or other posters post.

Peace