Afam4eva:

I understand your position and as much as you're right about the nomenclature that these groups go by, our classification should be based on what is and not what was. If Sunday Oliseh says he's not Igbo, it should be respected like I've always advocated but what irks me is the lies and half truths that are spewed just to support such positions. No need to tell us that you migrated from Benin or you were colonies by Igbos when the reality makes such assertions sound idiotic.

The reality is we do not have a documented history so the question of what it means to be "Igbo" is not quite the same as what it means to be a black person. Are we talking of those who speak a language,have cultural attributes or is there a genetic basis. How many small groups have actually disappeared or dissolved into larger groups because they were too small or too weak to assert their identity . e,g the Egun people in Lagos will probably disappear if they are not "protected" . What is the definition of "Igbo" many approach it from a very superficial level but the truth is colonialism has wounded all of us. What is most likely is there were thousands of peoples in Nigeria and they have been deleted slowly over time while the most dominant remain

omonnakoda:

The reality is we do not have a documented history so the question of what it means to be "Igbo" is not quite the same as what it means to be a black person. Are we talking of those who speak a language,have cultural attributes or is there a genetic basis. How many small groups have actually disappeared or dissolved into larger groups because they were too small or too weak to assert their identity . e,g the Egun people in Lagos will probably disappear if they are not "protected" . What is the definition of "Igbo" many approach it from a very superficial level but the truth is colonialism has wounded all of us. What is most likely is there were thousands of peoples in Nigeria and they have been deleted slowly over time while the most dominant remain

We're saying the same thing. That's why I said that the opinions of people who claim or disclaim being Igbo should be respected. If being Igbo was genetic, we would have put all these argunent s in who is Igbo to rest but its not. Being part of an ethnic group is just a sense of belonging coupled with the similarity in culture. There's no gain saying that Oliseh speaks a dialect of what is referred to as Igbo but since he doesn't feel like an Igbo then he is notm. But another person from his village who feels Igbotic is Igbo. So, it all boils down to individuals and not groups.

Afam4eva:

We're saying the same thing. That's why I said that the opinions of people who claim or disclaim being Igbo should be respected. If being Igbo was genetic, we would have put all these argunent s in who is Igbo to rest but its not. Being part of an ethnic group is just a sense of belonging coupled with the similarity in culture. There's no gain saying that Oliseh speaks a dialect of what is referred to as Igbo but since he doesn't feel like an Igbo then he is notm. But another person from his village who feels Igbotic is Igbo. So, it all boils down to individuals and not groups.

We are speaking English here........ I can feel English all day long ,it won't make me English .We were colonized.Is there a suggestion that some colonies are now trying to find themselves in the East?

omonnakoda:
We are speaking English here........ I can feel English all day long ,it won't make me English .We were colonized.Is there a suggestion that some colonies are now trying to find themselves in the East?

You have another language other than English which is presume is Yoruba. So, that rules out feeling like an English. Where Oliseh comes from, they only know one language and it their dialect of the Igbo language.

Afam4eva:

You have another language other than English which is presume is Yoruba. So, that rules out feeling like an English. Where Oliseh comes from, they only know one language and it their dialect of the Igbo language.

You claim it is a dialect of the Igbo language.What is the Igbo Language? Is there such a thing

Why are Yorubas not claiming Ugbodu people in the same Delta state who bear names like Ifeanyi but speak what sounds like Yoruba, First we must define "IGBO LANGUAGE" I know may who would dispute that there is such a thing

omonnakoda:
You claim it is a dialect of the Igbo language.What is the Igbo Language? Is there such a thing

Why are Yorubas not claiming Ugbodu people in the same Delta state who bear names like Ifeanyi but speak what sounds like Yoruba, First we must define "IGBO LANGUAGE" I know may who would dispute that there is such a thing

In my previous post, I referred to it as "The language referred to as Igbo" because I knew you would ask me what is Igbo language. To make it simple Igbo language is any language that is at least 50% intelligible to the language spoken by Onitsha natives. Thats a definition off the top of my head.

Yorubas will not claim Ugbodu because even though they migrated from somewhere in today's Ondo state, they speak Igbo more. Very few of them speak Okukunmi. On the othrr hand, Abavo, where Oliseh is fromfrom is not recorded as a settlement of people that migrated from somewhere in the south east and they speak that language that is similar to what is spoken in Onitsha.

Afam4eva:

In my previous post, I referred to it as "The language referred to as Igbo" because I knew you would ask me what is Igbo language. To make it simple Igbo language is any language that is at least 50% intelligible to the language spoken by Onitsha natives. Thats a definition off the top of my head.

Yorubas will not claim Ugbodu because even though they migrated from somewhere in today's Ondo state, they speak Igbo more. Very few of them speak Okukunmi. On the othrr hand, Abavo, where Oliseh is fromfrom is not recorded as a settlement of people that migrated from somewhere in the south east and they speak that language that is similar to what is spoken in Onitsha.

Torubas will not claim anything fill stop.Ot is others that claim Yoruba. The truth is Nigeria is such a crowded space it is impossible to imagine that we are not all linked so the idea of any pure people is just fantasy.
Why is it called Olukumi and not Yoruba .Because really there is nothing like Yoruba and I daresay the same applies to Igbo

omonnakoda:
Torubas will not claim anything fill stop.Ot is others that claim Yoruba. The truth is Nigeria is such a crowded space it is impossible to imagine that we are not all linked so the idea of any pure people is just fantasy.
Why is it called Olukumi and not Yoruba .Because really there is nothing like Yoruba and I daresay the same applies to Igbo

But Yorubas claim the Yoruboid groups in Kwara and Kogi and even though a Yoruboid group is more likely to claim Yoruba than an Igboid group doing same with Igbo, there is no gain saying that people feel affinity to groups that that share a lot with.

I also agree that there are no pure people and by understanding that, you will understand how ethnicity differs from tribe.

oluwalfa:


Here is a scoop for you: There was never any such thing as "Ika" until after the war
Their name was Ika-Igbo
They dropped the Igbo part so as not to be marginalised in Nigeria but they can't drop their Igbo names or language or cultures
Ika-Igbos made up the bulk of Biafran field commanders

The bolded is a decision taken by a people. I think its good that their decision is respected.

The word 'igbo' was definitely coined out one day too. Today its respected as a tribe in general. So if the Ika say they are Ika people and not igbo people, I feel its best they are left alone as ika people.

There was a time Urhobo, Isoko, itsekiri, Etsako as different tribes never existed, they were all just clans in the benin kingdom with diFferent ways of speaning. Today they are identified for what they say they are.

Goodmorning bro.

Afam4eva:

But Yorubas claim the Yoruboid groups in Kwara and Kogi and even though a Yoruboid group is more likely to claim Yoruba than an Igboid group doing same with Igbo, there is no gain saying that people feel affinity to groups that that share a lot with.

I also agree that there are no pure people and by understanding that, you will understand how ethnicity differs from tribe.

Yorubas do not claim them and this is where you show your ignorance. Those in Kwara along with Oyo are the REAL Yorubas even more than Ekiti or Ijebu who are more distinct. Oyo Ile or Old Oyo would be in Kwara and Niger states. However it is FOR them to be what they want. There is nothing like Yoruboid either they are Yoruba or they are not. Stop trying to create fictitious parallels with your Igboid analogy

CAN YOU NAME ONE GROUP that are being called Yoruba against their will as is the case with Ibos. Stop trying to be clever by half. Claiming is when you are insisting they are and they say they ARE NOT.

Like I already said Yoruba groups in Benin republic are not claimed by anyone . The main difference is that Yorubas claim a common ancestor and also common origin to Ife ,which is probably weak factually but that is what those who are now known as Yoruba say as is the case with the Anago people in Benin.
Peoples rather have identified as Ijebu,Ekiti,Egba,Igbomina,Oyo etc. So stop this Yoruboid nonsense. That is the usual Eboe spiteful manifesting again. You have a problem and want to make it seem everyone has that problem.We do not claim anyone as Omo Oduduwa. Anyone who says he is not Yoruba IS NOT and even those who claim to be must show particulars

omonnakoda:
Yorubas do not claim them and this is where you show your ignorance. Those in Kwara along with Oyo are the REAL Yorubas even more than Ekiti or Ijebu who are more distinct. Oyo Ile or Old Oyo would be in Kwara and Niger states. However it is FOR them to be what they want. There is nothing like Yoruboid either they are Yoruba or they are not. Stop trying to create fictitious parallels with your Igboid analogy

CAN YOU NAME ONE GROUP that are being called Yoruba against their will as is the case with Ibos. Stop trying to be clever by half. Claiming is when you are insisting they are and they say they ARE NOT.

Like I already said Yoruba groups in Benin republic are not claimed by anyone . The main difference is that Yorubas claim a common ancestor and also common origin to Ife ,which is probably weak factually but that is what those who are now known as Yoruba say as is the case with the Anago people in Benin.
Peoples rather have identified as Ijebu,Ekiti,Egba,Igbomina,Oyo etc. So stop this Yoruboid nonsense. That is the usual Eboe spiteful manifesting again. You have a problem and want to make it seem everyone has that problem.We do not claim anyone as Omo Oduduwa. Anyone who says he is not Yoruba IS NOT and even those who claim to be must show particulars

That Yorubas don't have identity crisis like Igbos does not in any way negate the fact that some Yorubas will tell you that those in Ilorin and environs are Yorubas. It may not be as pronounced as some Igbos claiming Ikwerre for instance but you will be lying to yourself by saying it doesn't exist. I've even seen some Yoruba folks clajm (maybe not the right word) some groups in Edo state who for some reason bear Yoruba names but don't speak the language. And tell me that you have never heard any Yoruba person utter statements such as "We have Yoruba people in Togo, Benin and Brazil". It's not just about the term " Yoruba" but about what it has come to mean which is the description of a glaring similarity.

Like I said, the denial of Yoruboid groups of being Yorubas may not be as pronounced as that of the Igbos but its there nonetheless. There are also some Igbo groups that Igbos don't claim like the ekpeye. Have you asked yourself why?

Afam4eva:

That Yorubas don't have identity crisis like Igbos does not in any way negate the fact that some Yorubas will tell you that those in Ilorin and environs are Yorubas. It may not be as pronounced as some Igbos claiming Ikwerre for instance but you will be lying to yourself by saying it doesn't exist. I've even seen some Yoruba folks clajm (maybe not the right word) some groups in Edo state who for some reason bear Yoruba names but don't speak the language. And tell me that you have never heard any Yoruba person utter statements such as "We have Yoruba people in Togo, Benin and Brazil". It's not just about the term " Yoruba" but about what it has come to mean which is the description of a glaring similarity.

That is because they are Yorubas ,No one is CLAIMING them that is the difference. Today a Yoruba person is one who claims descent from Oduduwa and Ife it is that simple. Any person who says they are not Yoruba is not. Yorubas will not come out abusing anyone who says he is not Yoruba. The difference is you folk claim people because they speak "YOUR" language or use "your" names

omonnakoda:
That is because they are Yorubas ,No one is CLAIMING them that is the difference. Today a Yoruba person is one who claims descent from Oduduwa and Ife it is that simple. Any person who says they are not Yoruba is not. Yorubas will not come out abusing anyone who says he is not Yoruba. The difference is you folk claim people because they speak "YOUR" language or use "your" names

They don't speak our language or use our names because they have no other language. That your name is John does not make you English if you have a Yoruba name and you're from Ile Ife. If these people had a language other than the language they currently speak, it would have been a different issue but they don't. BTW, I don't believe in claiming people who don't want to be part of a group. I'm only playing the devils advocate here by explaining to you how things really are. You can see me telling these people to leave Sunday Oliseh the heck alone.

Afam4eva:

They don't speak our language or use our names because they have no other language. That your name is John does not make you English if you have a Yoruba name and you're from Ile Ife. If these people had a language other than the language they currently speak, it would have been a different issue but they don't. BTW, I don't believe in claiming people who don't want to be part of a group. I'm only playing the devils advocate here by explaining to you how things really are. You can see me telling these people to leave Sunday Oliseh the heck alone.

Let them speak for themselves that is all

for those you denying igbo! especially Ika! I will continue to see you as my brother whether you like it or not, until you come back to your root!

here is what Typical uroboh take you for. This same thing goes to ikwere, in rivers state, check out what they called wike when he was contesting election!

Ahead of the 2015 governorship election in Delta
State, the Urhobo apex social-cultural group, the
Urhobo Progressive Union (UPU) is not leaving
anything to chances as they have berated the
Aniomas over their governorship quest, saying
that they are insensitive to the injustice done all
Deltans, by the siting of the State capital at
Asaba.
Chief Joseph Omene, the first Deputy President
General of UPU, at a world press conference in
Mosogar recently, said that the Aniomas, being
the seat of power cannot also take over
government house, noting that it would amount
to the total materialization of other two
senatorial districts.
He also accused the people of Delta north of not
being their brother’s keeper, as they have
hijacked all Federal Government appointments
meant for the people of Delta State, in total
neglect of other ethnic groups who had been
turned literarily to onlookers, in the project
called Delta.
According to Chief Omene, the Urhobo through
the support of other senatorial districts in the
state will produce the next governor of Delta
State, come 2015, for the sake of fairness and
equity, since the Delta south senatorial district
just completed its eight years.
According to him, Aniomas are presently holding
twelve top federal positions while they also have
the Delta State Capital which is Asaba, while the
Urhobos (Delta Central) and south are left with
no federal position to show for their loyalty to
the Federal Government.
While emphasizing the need for other senatorial
districts to support the Urhobo governorship
aspiration, he stated that; “UPU and the entire
Urhobos shall work with any political party that
will pick an Urhobo as its governorship
candidate.”
He noted that the Aniomas are using the
influence their eastern brothers’ at the federal
level to hijack all the Federal appointments due
to the state and the Urhobos and Delta South
senatorial zones are left with no federal
positions which he declared as unfair to the
Delta Central and South senatorial district.
He stated further that even though the UPU is
83years old, which goes to show the oneness
and unity of the Urhobo people, it is sad to note
that in the ongoing national conference, the
Urhobos were given just a slot as the second
largest tribe in the south-south region, while
Aniomas (Delta North) have about five
representative at the conference.
Adding that, it is good to set the record straight
that in the 2011 presidential election, the
Urhobos gave President Goodluck Jonathan over
800,000 votes, while expressing his
dissatisfaction over the President’s failure to
appoint an Urhobo person as minister in spite of
Urhobos support to the Federal Government over
the years.
Continuing, he said the UPU and the entire
Urhobo nation are urging the Aniomas to
consider and support (Delta Central) to produce
the next stage Governor, since they are aware
that marginalization of the Urhobos has suffer in
recent past.
While noting that the Aniomas also have the right
to contest for the governorship position, he
however appealed to them to support the
Urhobos in 2015, so that the Urhobo will also
support them when it comes to their turn.
Chief Omene further noted that, “the position of
the UPU is binding on all the Urhobos because, it
was agreed at our stakeholders meeting,’ and
urged Urhobos to close ranks irrespective of
their differences.
Below is how the Aniomas has hijacked all
federal appointment which was meant for all
Deltans:
Delta North Senatorial District
Federal Government Positions:
1. Amb. Joy U. Ogwu- Nigerian Ambassador to
the United Nations
2. Prof. Sylvester Monye-Special Adviser to
Mr. President on Performance Monitoring and
Evaluation.
3. Mrs. NgoziOlejeme-National Social
Insurance Trust Fund (also SURE-P)
4. Mr. Peter Idabor-Director General of the
National Oil Spill and Detection and Response
Agency.
5. Prof. Epiphany Azinge-Director General of
the Institute of Advance Legal Studies
6. Dr. Cairo Ojougboh-Chairman Export
Processing Zone Calabar
7. Dr. Eugene Juwah-Executive Vice
Chairman/CEO Nigerian Communication
Commission.
8. Dr (Mrs.) Esther Uduehi-Chairman of the
Board of National commission for Mass Literacy
Adult and Non-formal Education (NMEC)
9. Engr. Gabriel Amuchi- MD/CEO Federal
Roads Maintenance Agency (FERMA)
10. Mrs. Mariam Ali-SA to Mr. President on
Inter-Governmental Relations
11. Mr. Godwin Emefiele-Confirmed Governor
Central Bank of Nigeria
12. Dr. (Mrs.) Ngozi Okonjo Iweala -Minister of
Finance and Coordinating Minister of the
Economy.

fr3do:
I will advise SEners insulting Aniomas who deny being Igbo, to exercise restraint.
Flinging insults at your Kinsmen will only be falling prey to divide and conquer tactics.

Let those denialers know that they claiming not to be Igbo has not helped them politically.

Guy,we judge your patriotism based on majority.....80% of Anioma deny being IGBO....This is a fact some Igbo don't want to believe.

excusemyfrench:
You igbos are very funny. The guy has said he's not igbo, cant you people respect him for what he chose to be? In Edo State, there's a tribe there's a tribe called Oza. An Oza person can speak and understand Bini fluently but a Bini person might find it difficult speaking Oza but will never find it difficult understanding Oza but they chose not to be called Binis. The Binis have decided to address them the way they want to be addressed. Igbos should do the same to ikwerres, ukuannis, igbankes or any tribe that claim they're not igbos.

Go and sit down! Edos and Yorubas were empire builders, it is not out of place to have non Yoruba or Edo people who were colonized by Yorubas and Edos now speaking Yoruba and Edo as a first language.

But Ndiigbo were never empire builders. We never colonized any non-Igbo group, any group that speaks Igbo does so because it has always been Igbo speaking, no one imposed it on them.

Any Igbo speaking group is Igbo. We have non - Igbo speaking towns in SE, and we Don't address them as Igbos, since they don't speak Igbo as a first language.

excusemyfrench:
You igbos are very funny. The guy has said he's not igbo, cant you people respect him for what he chose to be? In Edo State, there's a tribe there's a tribe called Oza. An Oza person can speak and understand Bini fluently but a Bini person might find it difficult speaking Oza but will never find it difficult understanding Oza but they chose not to be called Binis. The Binis have decided to address them the way they want to be addressed. Igbos should do the same to ikwerres, ukuannis, igbankes or any tribe that claim they're not igbos.

Go and sit down! Edos and Yorubas were empire builders, it is not out of place to have non Yoruba or Edo people who were colonized by Yorubas and Edos now speaking Yoruba and Edo as a first language.

But Ndiigbo were never empire builders. We never colonized any non-Igbo group, any group that speaks Igbo does so because it has always been Igbo speaking, no one imposed it on them.

Any Igbo speaking group is Igbo. We have non - Igbo speaking towns in SE, and we Don't address them as Igbos, since they don't speak Igbo as a first language.

Your Oza example is not apt for the Igbo and SS Igbo speaking groups.

pazienza:


Go and sit down! Edos and Yorubas were empire builders, it is not out of place to have non Yoruba or Edo people who were colonized by Yorubas and Edos now speaking Yoruba and Edo as a first language.

But Ndiigbo were never empire builders. We never colonized any non-Igbo group, any group that speaks Igbo does so because it has always been Igbo speaking, no one imposed it on them.

Any Igbo speaking group is Igbo. We have non - Igbo speaking towns in SE, and we Don't address them as Igbos, since they don't speak Igbo as a first language.

Your Oza example is not apt for the Igbo and SS Igbo speaking groups.

you're really confused. Shouldn't you be out there stealing or engaging in one criminal act or something? Isn't that what you igbos are known for.

CHM11:


The bolded is a decision taken by a people. I think its good that their decision is respected.

The word 'igbo' was definitely coined out one day too. Today its respected as a tribe in general. So if the Ika say they are Ika people and not igbo people, I feel its best they are left alone as ika people.

There was a time Urhobo, Isoko, itsekiri, Etsako as different tribes never existed, they were all just clans in the benin kingdom with diFferent ways of speaning. Today they are identified for what they say they are.

Goodmorning bro.

So if tomorrow Oliseh's son starts ranting "My name is Oliseh but in fact I'm not a Black African, I am from a town called Dortmund in Germany", we should all just respect his "identity"?

Stolen:



Ok, like the Americans speak English but are Americans or the Australians speak English but are Australian?


Did Oliseh tell u wat he is? I dont know your age so, i will not go further. (Meaning i will not call u names.)

The man said he is not Igbo but you are all contesting that why

kettykin:


If you make a little effort you would realise that Raph Uwechue was the president of ohaneze ndigbo nigeria, biafra was made up of Ijaw, ibibio, Efik but these are not igbos.

My exact point, but some people feel hurt if a minority person from the SE region says he/she is not Igbo. Sentiments have clouded reason.

Oliseh has made his bed. He must be prepared to lie on them. Goodluck to him.

The level of Igbophobia in Anioma is alarming, I had mentioned this before.
Don't take my word for me, go to any of the Anioma facebook pages and witness a level of Igbophobia you can only expect from Yorubas, it's an eye opener. I would recommend the Ukwuani and Ika ones.

It cannot be ignored, because it poses a big problem and risk. When you have a group of people you are not guaranteed of their trust, you are just planning to fail.

I also understand that there are voices of reason amongst the Anioma people, I see them put up pro Igbo argument in those groups, by they are often in the minority, far outnumbered by the anti- Igbo groups.

I hope IPOB are aware of this situation. One of the many reasons for Biafra failure, was the presence of fifth column within us.
I see this talk of SE plus Anioma and I just shake my head. Something is not right somewhere.

sweetgala:


My exact point, but some people feel hurt if an efik person says he/she is not Igbo. Sentiments have clouded reason.

You are making things up. No one feels hurt when Efik people say they are not Igbo. Everyone knows they are not.

sweetgala:


The man said he is not Igbo but you are all contesting that why

Because he refused to tell us what he is

sweetgala:


My exact point, but some people feel hurt if an efik person says he/she is not Igbo. Sentiments have clouded reason.

efik is certainly not Igbo as efik is a tribe

excusemyfrench:
you're really confused. Shouldn't you be out there stealing or engaging in one criminal act or something? Isn't that what you igbos are known for.

I wonder o, he shud be engaging in one criminal act, and after he gets paid, he travels to either Italy, Amsterdam or Edo state to hire a witch for one of his male dogs.
U know Edo punanies are dog-healthy.

excusemyfrench:
you're really confused. Shouldn't you be out there stealing or engaging in one criminal act or something? Isn't that what you igbos are known for.

You have no answers to my questions.

At what point did Ndiigbo impose our language on Oliseh and his ancestors? We were not empire builders!
Nigeria speaks English today because we were colonized by the English, Brazil speaks Portuguese because they were colonized by the Portuguese.
So, at what point did Ndiigbo colonize Ika?

We traded with smaller ethnic groups like Ogoni and Andoni, those two groups still retained their language till today, only few Igbo loan words in their language remains as evidence of their interactions with Ndiigbo.

How then can Ika start speaking Igbo overnight only because of Igbo missionaries and trade interactions? The same Igbo missionaries preached at Andoni and Ogoni.

And I can't understand how this has managed to reach 6 pages as if it is anything new. Sunday Oliseh isn't the first Ika man to say he isn't Igbo and he won't be the last.

sweetgala:


My exact point, but some people feel hurt if an efik person says he/she is not Igbo. Sentiments have clouded reason.

Lol. No one feels hurt when Ogoni, Andoni, Efik, Ibibio, Annang etc say they are not Igbos. Because they are not, their languages are simply not intelligible to the Igbo man.

pazienza:
Oliseh has made his bed. He must be prepared to lie on them. Goodluck to him.

The level of Igbophobia in Anioma is alarming, I had mentioned this before.
Don't take my word for me, go to any of the Anioma facebook pages and witness a level of Igbophobia you can only expect from Yorubas, it's an eye opener. I would recommend the Ukwuani and Ika ones.

It cannot be ignored, because it poses a big problem and risk. When you have a group of people you are not guaranteed of their trust, you are just planning to fail.

I also understand that there are voices of reason amongst the Anioma people, I see them put up pro Igbo argument in those groups, by they are often in the minority, far outnumbered by the anti- Igbo groups.

I hope IPOB are aware of this situation. One of the many reasons for Biafra failure, was the presence of fifth column within us.
I see this talk of SE plus Anioma and I just shake my head. Something is not right somewhere.

Online is not real life
Those that say that they are not Igbo should say what they are
Ika and Ukwuani are clans not tribes
A referendum is the best way to show what people are and before the creation of the mid western region region, a referendum was organised and all Anioma voted to join Igbo in the East but were overulled

Jobless ppl everywhere.