« #62 on: Yesterday at 09:22:42 PM »

yea right,these pertinent issues do not require long winded quranic verses to explain or justify them,they are simple yes or no answers,

I therefore hope that you can explain if Jesus is a Servant or God by this Verse: ACTS 4 Verse 28; "Jesus your Servant whom You (God) sent". Is Jesus servant; yes or no?

Mark 12 Verse 29; And Jesus said; Hear ye, Oh Israel, your God and my God is but one Lord. Is Jesus and the others God and or Lord, yes or no?

On the hanging cross; Jesus yelled; My God, my God; why has thou forsaken me? Is Jesus God; Yes or no?

At the Garden of Geshemane, in prayer; Jesus prayed that the cup should be removed from his head, but it is the will of God that will be done Prevail, come to pass). Is Jesus the God whose will will be done as he prayed; yes or no?

On the cross as Jesu was giving up the ghost, he exclaimed; it is finished; was it finish, really since Paul who used to be Saul changed everything that Jesus stood on before; yes or no?


Did Jesus really won over the death that you said killed him; yes or no?


LOL, I can give you tons of them, just to beat you down and even do a good stumping while at it.

if you caught me red handed dipping my hands in your pot of soup,with my mouth full of meat,what other explanations is there to do?
will you sit there while i start telling you stories of how i was looking for something in the cupboard,and my hand accidentally went into your pot of stew e.t.c??

If you dont live in my household, I will say you are a darn thief, and your hands deserves the chopping off. But the wife of the hotelier will say the son of the hotelier is having a midnight meat feast. Am sure his father can afford the "niamaAllah" based on his business.

that is what you muslims are doing,answer me with a simple yes or no!!!

Read below for how I am taunting you; and you deserve it, I must say.

1.did mohammed a 52 years old man marry a 6 years old girl and later have sex with her when she turned 9? yes or no,without explanations!!if no i have proof.

No, except that you shall be able to tell me when was Aisha (RA) born relative to her father's acceptance of Islam brough by Muhammad (AS)? Except that you can tell me how old she, was when bethroned to the first potential husband, whose marriage to her was called off because of her father's becoming Muslim? YOu will have to explain yourself, thoroughly, otherwise your Shahadah is coming up: and all the household of the Hotelier will have to accept islam, when you fail without any question!

2.did mohammed leading a band of renegades and armed robbers raid and kill innocent traders,even during the holy month??yes or no,without explanations!!no and i have proof.

No! This shoud be good!

3.did mohammad support the 3 godess,and later abrogate the verses in the medina period??yes or no without explanations, if no i have proof

No. And present your proof and Allah willing, my overwhelming proofs against your lies are coming up immediately after that. After this, I do not want to read from you about your obtrusive lies!

4.did mohammaed indulge in an uncontrollable sexual orgy,both with female slaves and numerous wioves,to the extent that his wives were murmuring?yes or no without explanation if no i have proof

No. And if you now women, except that you only hit the skin and hit the road. If you know, everyone has some Jealousy. So are men. In the past 20 years that I have beeen divorced from my ex, each time I saw her with a man, it was not a great feeling in my heart, even though I dont want her, ever. I dont think you know what good relationship is? Muhammad (AS) was the best of them, of all persons who have ever walked the earth; how do you think that his women will not even be jealous against one another? If my wife were to call my number and she reached a wrong number, and if a woman were to answer, she will ask; whenever she speaks to me: Wale, tani obinrin to gbe aago e? I may have to explain; are you sure you reached my line? I also have my proof when you present yours against Muhammad (AS), I will present mine to destroy yours. While you are the magicians of Pharaoh, I am like the Moses (AS), whose real snake will swallow your make belief lies!

5.did mohammed abrogate the "no compulsion in religion"and the one where he enjoined his followers to let the christians and jews alone save the polytheist with the sword verses??yes or no without explanation,if no i have proof of the sword verses.

No. Now present your proofs, since I will tell you the truth about that verse in Surah Baqarah, an obvious Madina Surah, towards the end of the life of the prophet, a Surah that also talked about Ribah! See am giving the evidence away, but there is more to this than what I just gave!

i dont have time for stories,simply answe these questions straight direct and i will post the second set of questions, your quran is full of gaping holes and contradictions

If you provide relevant questions needing yes or no answers, you will get it as such! But when you ask if a husband has the right to sleep with his wife, a daughter of say "Adenuga", whom he and her willing participated in her marriage, in her acceptance for a husband, I think one should ask you if there was a reasonable explanation that you have for asking considering when you are asked to tell us when was she born relative to her father coming to wealth, and assuning he became wealthy in 1990, and you are saying that the Okoya cant marry her? Lol. An 18 year old woman today is matured and you can take that to the bank. I will marry one if you can offer me my type, only to make your heart sad or sink the more!



[Quote]you are right sire,its just a pity that mohammad and the allah who has gone on an extended break for the past hundreds of years started leading his followers astray a long time before we were born, hence the several bloodshed both in suicide bombing,and the early death of young girls who are forced to have sex as more or less babies following the path of mohammed [/quote]I am certain that the Jewish God or Gods and the Christian definitely Gods have gone on an even longer extended break! Remember Allah and His Messenger (AS), you big time Kufar of Christianity always claim that the religion of Islam, the Revealed Quran and indeed Muhammad (AS) are events more recently, than and after your old age long time archaic Jewish and Christendom, in the history of mankind! No? So I ask you; what have Jehovah/Yahweh combo, remember I am not saying Holy Ghost and or Son God here, so that you dont think I am making fun of your gods, done for you lately, except to debar you from marrying while allowing you to chase Morenike, and Iyabo and Jane and Chichi all over London, trying to get some?

While you are trying to fidjet for a wrong answer, Allah through Muhammad (AS) by His Book and the actions of Muhammad (AS) honoring women, have not since 1960/1970s allowed me to participate in what was common in my time called proom, a kinda of sexual orgy common in my teenage period, in Nigeria. I think each of you Christians who was not a teenager at that time (lol) should ask anyone who was in your lives, and they wil tell you, if they escaped it, as long as they were Christians; and it happened in the afternoon, too, as long as it was weekends!

And in your country called Nigeria, it was Allah and Muhammad that instigated Jacob Gowon and Odumegu Ojukwu to wage the Civil war? It was Allah and Muhammad that caused the Jews to bomb King David Hotel in Jarusalem where many British personnel died? It was Allah and Muhammad that caused the two world wars in Europe between mostly Christians? It was Allah that made Prince Charles perform uncountable illigal sex that ended his marriage? I am giving you what you will definitely must have heard about, and not the remote sillinesses that you call reposes!

Ojukwu married Bianca, I married Zaynab, and while Ojukwu throws his wife out, I keep mine! I have no interest in divorcing my wife or wives at the drop of a hat! Is there a way you can blame Allah and Muhammad on your sexual perversions, or at least or the easy Lizzy sexual maladies that is an epidemic in the Christian communities of the world?

GODSON2009, for your questions, I will onward use the Qur’aan to answer you. I like to abide with the advice given by the Akh, Muhsin. Muslims have been told to engage people like you in a debate in the best manner, so when you persist in insulting our Prophet even after we have explained to you, then the word Kaafir (disbeliever) would not be in the Islamic lexicon if people like you are not around. So good of you continue to disbelieve in Muhammad, questioning why Allaah (your Creator) allowed him to have ‘the carnal knowledge of a nine year old girl’ whom we tell you was his wife. Saying why did he do this why did he do that… continue, good of you!

So I will allow you to fight with the Qur’aan, which is the strongest proof of the Prophethood of Muhammad, if you can stand it.

The Qur’aan is the greatest weapon of a Muslim. If you are a man, do not skip it just read the verses, any way you claimed you have read it before.

Allaah (the Lord and Creator of Jesus) says:

“…but strive against them (by preaching) with the utmost endeavour, with it (the Qur'ân)” [Q25: 52].

As for your doubts and misconceptions about Islam:

Allaah says:

“Truly, the religion with Allâh is Islâm. Those who were given the Scripture (Jews and Christians) did not differ except, out of mutual jealousy, after knowledge had come to them. And whoever disbelieves in the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, signs, revelations, etc.) of Allâh, then surely, Allâh is Swift in calling to account.” [Q3: 19]

And He says:

“ (O you Christians and Jews) mix not truth with falsehood, nor conceal the truth [i.e. Muhammad Peace be upon him is Allâh's Messenger and his qualities are written in your Scriptures, the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] while you know (the truth).” [Q2: 42].


And if you persist in your rage, O GODSON:

“ (then )perish in your rage. Certainly, Allâh knows what is in the breasts (all the secrets).” [Q3: 119].

But you must know:

“And the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) differed not until after there came to them clear evidence. (i.e. Prophet Muhammad and whatever was revealed to him). And they were commanded not, but that they should worship Allâh, and worship none but Him Alone (abstaining from ascribing partners to Him), and perform As-Salât (Iqâmat-as-Salât) and give Zakât: and that is the right religion. Verily, those who disbelieve (in the religion of Islâm, the Qur'ân and Prophet Muhammad) from among the people of the Scripture (Jews andChristians) and Al-Mushrikûn will abide in the Fire of Hell. They are the worst of creatures.” [Q98: 4-6].

So you have no excuse for your disbelief, O GODSON. You have been warned.



But know:

“And had the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) believed, it would have been better for them; among them are some who have faith (in Allaah and Muhammad), but most of them are Al-Fâsiqûn (disobedient to Allâh - and rebellious against Allâh's Command).” [Q3: 110].

And if you persist in your slander of the Prophet, you are not the first and you are not going to be the last but know that:

“For he who makes you angry (O Muhammad), - he will be cut off (from every good thing in this world and in the Hereafter)” [Q108: 3].

littleb:

@GODSON2009
Wrong questions get No answers. Your questions motive shows no sincerity. Why do you want know more about someone's faith with huge arrogance. You want us to give you response to some misconceptions with simple YES or NO. No explanation, no reference from Quran or hadiths. I think you need to be ignored.

lol what has my motive got to do with the cold stark truth?
didnt your mohammad,and sucessive followers pour vitriol on christians even untill today,do you see anyone complaining?
i have given everyone on here ample chance to respond to my questions,but each time they either ignore the question and counter with some worn out mantra about the triune i.e olabowale's style

or they go into long winded one full page quranic recitation,as if i asked for a sermon,me and olabowale and other guys have been on the same thing for almost 15 pages with no headway,there fore i believe the questions i have posed had a yes or no answer.

irrespective of the reasons surrounding it,if i ask you are you male? your answer will be yes, you might now start explaining that your parents were expecting a girl and bla bla,

abulbanaat:

GODSON2009, for your questions, I will onward use the Qur’aan to answer you. I like to abide with the advice given by the Akh, Muhsin. Muslims have been told to engage people like you in a debate in the best manner, so when you persist in insulting our Prophet even after we have explained to you, then the word Kaafir (disbeliever) would not be in the Islamic lexicon if people like you are not around. So good of you continue to disbelieve in Muhammad, questioning why Allaah (your Creator) allowed him to have ‘the carnal knowledge of a nine year old girl’ whom we tell you was his wife. Saying why did he do this why did he do that… continue, good of you!
“…but strive against them (by preaching) with the utmost endeavour, with it (the Qur'ân)” [Q25: 52].

i wouldnt blame you really if you decide to desist from engaging me in a debate,because frankly if i was defending mohammad and all that he did,i will be tired and back off after a while as well,the man has given other religions even polytheists more than enough armour to fight his followers lol
i continue to insult your prophet because first morally he did not behave like a prophet,second he was full of contradictions all through his life,third he was a remorseless murderer and leading about 1 billion people astray, straight into hell,the cherry on the cake is sleeping with a 9 years old baby girl and his followers including aisha had the guts to include it in the quran as an example for you to follow which you are doing,
yes,i know about the greater jihad, that of the mouth and of the hand next!!



So I will allow you to fight with the Qur’aan, which is the strongest proof of the Prophethood of Muhammad, if you can stand it.

The Qur’aan is the greatest weapon of a Muslim. If you are a man, do not skip it just read the verses, any way you claimed you have read it before.

Allaah (the Lord and Creator of Jesus) says:

“…but strive against them (by preaching) with the utmost endeavour, with it (the Qur'ân)” [Q25: 52].

[/quote]
the problem with that is that the quran is a very weak weapon to fight with, its like holding a banana to fight with a man carrying a sharp sword

As for your doubts and misconceptions about Islam:

Allaah says:

“Truly, the religion with Allâh is Islâm. Those who were given the Scripture (Jews and Christians) did not differ except, out of mutual jealousy, after knowledge had come to them. And whoever disbelieves in the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, signs, revelations, etc.) of Allâh, then surely, Allâh is Swift in calling to account.” [Q3: 19]

And He says:

“ (O you Christians and Jews) mix not truth with falsehood, nor conceal the truth [i.e. Muhammad Peace be upon him is Allâh's Messenger and his qualities are written in your Scriptures, the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] while you know (the truth).” [Q2: 42].


And if you persist in your rage, O GODSON:

“ (then )perish in your rage. Certainly, Allâh knows what is in the breasts (all the secrets).” [Q3: 119].

But you must know:

“And the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) differed not until after there came to them clear evidence. (i.e. Prophet Muhammad and whatever was revealed to him). And they were commanded not, but that they should worship Allâh, and worship none but Him Alone (abstaining from ascribing partners to Him), and perform As-Salât (Iqâmat-as-Salât) and give Zakât: and that is the right religion. Verily, those who disbelieve (in the religion of Islâm, the Qur'ân and Prophet Muhammad) from among the people of the Scripture (Jews andChristians) and Al-Mushrikûn will abide in the Fire of Hell. They are the worst of creatures.” [Q98: 4-6].

So you have no excuse for your disbelief, O GODSON. You have been warned.

the problem your mohammad has is his rejection as a prophet,first by the jews and then the christians,if you check the ahadith ibn ishaq 351 he was taunted with questions he couldnt answer,not only that even though he was preaching the same monothesm as the jews he was not accepted as a prophet,to show how much he craved the acceptance of the jews,he even told his followers to start praying on fridays,when jews prepared for the sabath,they were to observe jewish dietary doctrines as well as observe their fast on the day of jewish atonement, go and find out the meaning of "ashura"which means ten as the jewish day of atonement falls on the tenth month, in spite of all this he still was not accepted as a prophet,hence his fixation with all the quranic verses you have quoted, i just pity the man because he probably would have been a great man of GOD whose exploits would have been recorded in the bible,if he had not allowed satan to use him


But know:

“And had the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) believed, it would have been better for them; among them are some who have faith (in Allaah and Muhammad), but most of them are Al-Fâsiqûn (disobedient to Allâh - and rebellious against Allâh's Command).” [Q3: 110].

And if you persist in your slander of the Prophet, you are not the first and you are not going to be the last but know that:

“For he who makes you angry (O Muhammad), - he will be cut off (from every good thing in this world and in the Hereafter)” [Q108: 3].
[quote]

turn the quran 3;110 around,you are the ones that need salvation not the christians,to prove my assertion to you,mohammad has been dead for hundreds of years now,how come nobody has been able to replicate his many exploits??
you muslims dont perform miracles,you dont do signs and wonders,even the night vigil you hurriedly started copying us when you saw the crwod in winners and redeemed, im guessing the next thing you ll say is that the miracles are arranged,well what about the onces in the us which independent doctors confirmed as real, ill challenge you to read and study the bible like i have studied the quran then see if you ll be the same thing, shalom

O GODSON, well I had prepared what I will send now before I saw your latest usual hasty generalization.

I could not still resist the urge to answer some of the questions GODSON had recently raised though I had promised to leave him with the Qur’aan . But when I re-read his points again I was amazed at his ignorance.

Muhsin, please pardon me this time. Yes I understand you analogy about Abu Taalib’s case, that the Prophet strove hard perhaps he would accept Islam but alas, such that Allaah revealed:


“Verily! You (O Muhammad) guide not whom you like, but Allâh guides whom He wills. And He knows best those who are the guided.” [ Q28: 56].

But we should also remember that people like Abu Sufyan, Khaalid bn Waleed, Amr bn al-Aas, etc. (may Allaah be pleased with them all) were enemies of the dear Prophet for about 25 years, they fought him hard, they nearly killed him at Uhud (but truth must prevail) yet most of them later accepted Islam.

In fact on the day Amr accepted Islam, he said: ‘O Messenger of Allah you were the most hateful personl to me before I entered Islam but now you are my most beloved.’

So GODSON and his friends here have only been fighting Islam just some few months back. And I want to believe those areas that seem to be grey to them are their last doubts, Insha Allaah, before they would become Muslims (if Allaah needs them, I sincerely pray so). So Muhsin let us give them the benefit of the doubt.

And as he has partly not wanted me to give him long-winded answers (though his questions are long-winded too), I will make it snappy.

Well I won’t go back to some issues again viz. The marriage of Prophet to Aisha at six, and the eventual consummation at nine – it was as decreed by Allaah. Had it been wrong the enemies of the Prophet then, the Arabs would have capitalized on it, but they did not. They knew the Prophet had married a woman by the standard of their culture. I want you to think on the sociological aspect of that, GODSON. Do you know what the sociologist call cultural relativism.


If Islâm is full of gaping holes as you claim, O GODSON, it would have fizzled out. Those ‘holes’ that you refer to are meant to test people like you.

The satanic verses is based on a story not authentic in Islam. There are lot of stories in Islam but not all of them are authentic. The compilation of the hadith on the least was carefully done, and there are principles regarding acceptability or otherwise of reports. This aspect of Islamic knowledge has its experts, GODSON, you cannot understand. I do not know how to help you understand. I am sorry for you are far from it.

Islam commands fighting the unbelievers. That has been in the Divine Law since Allaah created the heaven and the earth. Moses, Solomon, David, etc. killed the unbelievers of their time, they smote their necks and they cut their fingertips. Had Allaah not decreed that Jesus’ Prophethood would go as it went (just three years, may Allaah bestow peace on Jesus ), he would have smitten the necks of the unbelievers of his time.


For the umpteenth time, Qur’ân does not contain contradictions as does you Bible. Please bring those contradictions. Eg. A verse here says ‘four things’ and the other says ‘eight’ please bring one, O GODSON.

As for the knowledge of abrogation, you cannot understand, not because you do not possess the Holy Ghost (as you claim about the Bible), but because you do not have the knowledge to. Islam is a religion of knowledge. I am sorry GODSON.


Read what I said about Jihaad in that post, please read very carefully, O GODSON. May Allaah show you the light.


“1. Did your prophet indulge in a free for all sexual proclivity?”

No. He married women as did other Prophets like him. He did not even parallel Solomon.


“2.did he covet and eventually take his adopted son's wife?”

No. He was the one that ‘forced’ Zaynab to marry Zayd in the first place when the former did not want to. And when the marriage broke down, Allaah commanded him to marry Zaynab, to put an end to the taboo in the Arab culture that a man cannot marry the former wife of his adopted son; and to put an end to rights ancillary to child adoption in Islam. [Funnily you did not mention another allegation that the Prophet saw Zaynab’s unclothedness that was why he went ‘haywire’ about her. Don’t you subscribe to that opinion?]


“3.did he sleep with slave girls,to the extent that his wives were murmuring?”

Yes. Allaah made it permissible for him to sleep with his slave girls (Maryah and Rihaanah) (not slave girls of others) as Allaah made it permissible for Abraham to sleep with Hagar (Islam says Hagar was a slave girl of Ibrahim not of Sarah), and as He made it permissible for Solomon, and other Porphets.


“4.did he assasinate a poet that satirized him and then later pay blood money?”

I like to see the evidence for this, I am hearing it for the first time. But make sure it is not a fabricated or weak report.


“5.did he murder people in cold blood?”

Do you mean in war time? If yes people could be killed in cold blood in war time. What is known is that Islamic warfare (not as being portrayed by those Muslims you refer to as terrorists) has its rules. Non-combatants are not ordinarily killed, the elders, women, children, unless if guilt can be established against them, as it was done against the Jews of Banu Quraidha (and the likes). And that was even the Judaic Law in the latter case.


“6.did he rob innocent traders?”

That would be bad if he did. But do you mean the antecedent to the Battle of Badr. He only wanted to revenge the Makkans seizure of the Muslims wealth back in Makkah. Remember the Muslims were not allowed to take any of their property when they were living Makkah. So when Abu Sufyan was passing around Madinah with the goods of the Makkans from Syria, so it was an ample time for the Muslims to have just some of their own properties back from the Makkans.





As for your claim that Christianity is the fastest going religion in the Nigeria whereby you cited examples of the attendance at the redemption camps, then I will say you have made the stupidest point so far. Do you count those who came into Christianity through the miracles which they never saw as serious Christians? When your comrades, here, have declared those redemption camps of your pastors as money-making centres, where the innocent ones are being covertly robbed of their wealth. And where are their miracles? Their Ayefele still can’t work, Obadare is still blind, Idahosa died after a cardiac arrest (they are still concealing that).


I remember a pastor whose wife gave birth through a C.S. and he hid it from the members of his congregation (it was about seven years ago at Catholic Hospital, Apomu, Osun State).

And don’t you know that those who become Christians among the Muslims are doing so because of economic hardship prevalent in the country. Let Nigeria gets a good leadership and see what will become of Christianity.

No serious Muslim, who knows the Qur’aan and the Sunnah, would become a Christian. At least I have not seen one. As for the likes you see, yes they are many. My mother was once one of them. She is late now, and Alhmadulillah she died a Muslimah; about for years before her death, she began to believe in Oneness of Allaah, and she began to pray the Muslim way. She searched foe miracles from one church to the others until it became clear to her that it is on Allaah one should depend. In fact she saw the joy of the reliance before she died. May Allaah forgive her of her shortcomings. How I wish she is alive today, and she will enjoy more, for we too are not riff-raff as our Christians neighbours have threatened we would be. In fact they are jealous of us today. Alihamdulillah ala ni’mati-hi.



And you still say, Christianity is the fastest religion in US. Are you not in the UK? Don’t they beg people to come to church on Sundays? Open your heart.


Once again, men and women are spiritually the same in Islam but physically different. Women are better of in Islam than Christianity if you but know.

One of the last means of correcting a stubborn wife is by beating which will not leave any mark on her. And it is the last option, and still Muslims men are told that not to beat their wives (at all for any reason, as the Prophet had counselled ) is better. That is the Divine Law.

And in other places (I mean even in your Christianity) men still beat their women till the point of death. Don’t say you don’t know, O GODSON. O often do we hear of a husband killing his wife in the Western countries?



Quran 33;28:

“O Prophet (Muhammad)! Say to your wives: If you desire the life of this world, and its glitter, Then come! I will make a provision for you and set you free in a handsome manner (divorce).”

There the Prophet’s wives began to make too-much worldly demand on the Prophet, so Allaah called them to order. Is that what you mean by their grumbling? Well they were humans.





‘as for taking his step son's wife to himself’

The Prophet did not take his step son rather Allaah commanded him to marry the former wife of his former adopted son. See the difference.



The Jews did not accept Muhammad as a bonafide Prophet even though they knew he was. They thought their claimed closeness with Allaah would save them on the Day of Resurrection:

“And they (Jews) say, "The Fire (i.e. Hell-fire on the Day of Resurrection) shall not touch us but for a few numbered days." Say (O Muhammad Peace be upon him to them): "Have you taken a covenant from Allâh, so that Allâh will not break His Covenant? Or is it that you say of Allâh what you know not?"” [Q2: 80].

That is one of the reasons none of them did not accept Islam. But have you read about the Islâm of Abdussalam (a former Jew in the time of Muhammad), and Ka’b al-Aabar (after the Prophet died).

Did you think the Prophet would go to Madianh to meet the Jews, if he were a false Prophet while he knew he they would expose him?

[And have you read the answer I gave to Kola Oloye as regard his question about the five pillars of Islâm? Why is your heart so hard, O GODSON?]

And should we use the same principle against Jesus? The Jews did not accept him as a bonafide Prophet, so they ‘killed’ him.




“im not reffering to just battle of badr,which was officially or unofficially the first millitant jihad,i am reffering to the time mohammad arrived in yathrib or medina as it was later known,he could not farm,as the quraysh tribe where he was from were predominantly traders,hence he started raiding and stealing from innocent travellers to make ends meet the question is”

Interesting, can you please bring your evidence. I am hearing that for the first time. And know that if you fail to produce you evidence then you are a liar, as usual.



“well,the difference between the islamic millitants and the lords army in uganda e.t.c is that in the new testament there is nowhere GOD tells or enjoins his disciples to strive against unbeleivers,rather he highlights love and compassion at every opportunity.”

So what about the Old Testamnet? Is the God of Old Testament different from that of New Testament?

And does your statement absolve the Lords Army of Uganda?

Why did you leave out the Crusades? Hey they were too brutal to be referred to Christianity.

“yet we will continue to preach love and evangelize either you like it or not and we love you our brothers and sisters even if you hate us, and i know that makes you people really mad but tough!!!we love you”

Do not pretend, where is the love? When you don’t want us in schools (like the southern universities), you do not want us in government offices. You forced some of our uncles to become Christians before they could be educated, etc. you do not love us, stop the lie. Allaah has exposed you:

“Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him and the Muslims) till you follow their religion. Say: "Verily, the Guidance of Allâh (i.e. Islâmic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance. And if you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him ) were to follow their (Jews and Christians) desires after what you have received of Knowledge (i.e. the Qur'ân), then you would have against Allâh neither any Walî (protector or guardian) nor any helper.” [Q2: 120].

And your friends are the Jews, Allaah has warned us about you. That you have evil against us. You only expressed the so called love on you tongues:

“O you who believe! Take not as (your) Bitânah (advisors, consultants, protectors, helpers, friends, etc.) those outside your religion (pagans, Jews, Christians, and hypocrites) since they will not fail to do their best to corrupt you. They desire to harm you severely. Hatred has already appeared from their mouths, but what their breasts conceal is far worse. Indeed We have made plain to you the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses) if you understand.” [Q3: 118].


Please where is the Christian love for the Muslims in those Crudases?





the socio-religious crises in the Northern part of Nigeria is a deep-rooted ones that i may not be able to explain here while I am not absolving the Muslims from total blame. The Chrsitians too have had their share. What will you say about the massacre of the Muslims by the Christians in the Zango-Kataf crises, and recently that of Jos. What you must know is that most of those crises are political in nature the politicians only used some unsuspecting Muslims and Christians to achieve their ends.
How I wish GODSON, will open his heart, stop being stubborn against your Creator.

olabowale:

« #62 on: Yesterday at 09:22:42 PM » I therefore hope that you can explain if Jesus is a Servant or God by this Verse: ACTS 4 Verse 28; "Jesus your Servant whom You (God) sent". Is Jesus servant; yes or no?

Mark 12 Verse 29; And Jesus said; Hear ye, Oh Israel, your God and my God is but one Lord. Is Jesus and the others God and or Lord, yes or no?

On the hanging cross; Jesus yelled; My God, my God; why has thou forsaken me? Is Jesus God; Yes or no?

At the Garden of Geshemane, in prayer; Jesus prayed that the cup should be removed from his head, but it is the will of God that will be done Prevail, come to pass). Is Jesus the God whose will will be done as he prayed; yes or no?

On the cross as Jesu was giving up the ghost, he exclaimed; it is finished; was it finish, really since Paul who used to be Saul changed everything that Jesus stood on before; yes or no?

as usual,rather than answer the question,you come back with a counter question,the thing is that is it easier to ask questions,than actually answering potentially embarassing questions about your prophets?
you have been recycling the same 6/7 or so points right from the get go,without answering just one of all the embarassing stuffs mohammad got up to,
did jesus kill innocent people or rob people on the highway?
did he sleep with young 9 yrs old girls?
lets be honest,if you had two children and one was quiet,frugal e.t.c like jesus and the other was like a glorified area boy killing sleeping with girls e.t.c like mohammad who do you think any father will love more??go figure

olabowale:

« #62 on: Yesterday at 09:22:42 PM »
LOL, I can give you tons of them, just to beat you down and even do a good stumping while at it.
If you dont live in my household, I will say you are a darn thief, and your hands deserves the chopping off. But the wife of the hotelier will say the son of the hotelier is having a midnight meat feast. Am sure his father can afford the "niamaAllah" based on his business.
Read below for how I am taunting you; and you deserve it, I must say.

guess yo dont get it then, as usual

olabowale:

No, except that you shall be able to tell me when was Aisha (RA) born relative to her father's acceptance of Islam brough by Muhammad (AS)? Except that you can tell me how old she, was when bethroned to the first potential husband, whose marriage to her was called off because of her father's becoming Muslim? YOu will have to explain yourself, thoroughly, otherwise your Shahadah is coming up: and all the household of the Hotelier will have to accept islam, when you fail without any question!

i dont give a flying fig,when aisha was born,or when she started crawling,was she married off to mohammad at 6 yrs old or not??
did mohammad have sex with her at 9 years old or not??
bearing in mind he was 52 years old

olabowale:

No! This shoud be good!


No. And present your proof and Allah willing, my overwhelming proofs against your lies are coming up immediately after that. After this, I do not want to read from you about your obtrusive lies!

why dont you say specifically which one you want me to prove??i have plenty so you ll have to choose,you know as well as i do i have posted more than enough,and i am willing to post them again and more lol

olabowale:

No. And if you now women, except that you only hit the skin and hit the road. If you know, everyone has some Jealousy. So are men. In the past 20 years that I have beeen divorced from my ex, each time I saw her with a man, it was not a great feeling in my heart, even though I dont want her, ever. I dont think you know what good relationship is? Muhammad (AS) was the best of them, of all persons who have ever walked the earth; how do you think that his women will not even be jealous against one another? If my wife were to call my number and she reached a wrong number, and if a woman were to answer, she will ask; whenever she speaks to me: Wale, tani obinrin to gbe aago e? I may have to explain; are you sure you reached my line? I also have my proof when you present yours against Muhammad (AS), I will present mine to destroy yours. While you are the magicians of Pharaoh, I am like the Moses (AS), whose real snake will swallow your make belief lies!

that isnt how this works,prove the questions and concerns concerning your mohammad while i rpove the one concerning my own , you are yet to answer the question i posted,all you have done is to counter with the same old recycled 4/5 questions hs women were jelouse because in spite of the 13 or was it ten sef,that he was married too,he still went snoping around for slaves, im sure you have heard the yoruba saying that never conduct business with a womaniser,so why should i take a womanising man serious as a prophet?

olabowale:

No. Now present your proofs, since I will tell you the truth about that verse in Surah Baqarah, an obvious Madina Surah, towards the end of the life of the prophet, a Surah that also talked about Ribah! See am giving the evidence away, but there is more to this than what I just gave!

you know as well as i do that you have nothing new to show me,both in the ahadiths and qurans that you have not already done,i am not asking much,just a simple yes or no answer whcih wouldnt have taken this much room,as you are here gallivanting and bouncing about lol
again,what proof exactly are you on about,mention them so that i can attach the necessary proofs i have

olabowale:

If you provide relevant questions needing yes or no answers, you will get it as such! But when you ask if a husband has the right to sleep with his wife, a daughter of say "Adenuga", whom he and her willing participated in her marriage, in her acceptance for a husband, I think one should ask you if there was a reasonable explanation that you have for asking considering when you are asked to tell us when was she born relative to her father coming to wealth, and assuning he became wealthy in 1990, and you are saying that the Okoya cant marry her? Lol. An 18 year old woman today is matured and you can take that to the bank. I will marry one if you can offer me my type, only to make your heart sad or sink the more!

well,i beg to differ sire,all the questions have a yes or no answer clearly,
the reason why it is bad and harmful and against all know humane conventions to sleep with a 9 years old is the vvf or whatever ailment where children who are not yet matured enough to have babies are being forced to do so, or is your allah happy that these girls will never be able to pee normally like their age mates in other areas??
is your allah  ok with the fact thata 9 years old would have her childhood stolen and then permanently serve as the sperm tank of a man in his early to mid fifties?
lastly what choice did a 6 years old girl have in whomsoever she got married to,much less being ready to have sex at 9 years old, pls answer these questions,so that we will know what mohammad and allah thinks of the guurls going through the pain of vvf

olabowale:

I am certain that the Jewish God or Gods and the Christian definitely Gods have gone on an even longer extended break! Remember Allah and His Messenger (AS), you big time Kufar of Christianity always claim that the religion of Islam, the Revealed Quran and indeed Muhammad (AS) are events more recently, than and after your old age long time archaic Jewish and Christendom, in the history of mankind! No? So I ask you; what have Jehovah/Yahweh combo, remember I am not saying Holy Ghost and or Son God here, so that you dont think I am making fun of your gods, done for you lately, except to debar you from marrying while allowing you to chase Morenike, and Iyabo and Jane and Chichi all over London, trying to get some?

lets check a few instances of whose GOD is on an extended holiday,
our own GOD defends himself,moreover he heals all that come to him i.e sicknesses,and other ailments e.t.c he heals cancer,deformities,even straightening deformed hands and legs,people wake up from the dead, i can give you instances of americans where you live so that you can check it out,

now how has mohammad defended his own followers?
your allah has falled asleep,hence yhis followers have to defend him by suicide bombing and the rest,you dont have any signs and wonders,ehnce yuou muslims are flocking to different revivals, there was even an islamic man who got his healing in dedemption camp,and then tuned around to say he was not going to convert to christianity,still pastor adeboye prayed for him and he was on his way lol
pls indulge me and show me the islamic men and wome of god who have been doing signs and wonders,

While you are trying to fidjet for a wrong answer, Allah through Muhammad (AS) by His Book and the actions of Muhammad (AS) honoring women, have not since 1960/1970s allowed me to participate in what was common in my time called proom, a kinda of sexual orgy common in my teenage period, in Nigeria. I think each of you Christians who was not a teenager at that time (lol) should ask anyone who was in your lives, and they wil tell you, if they escaped it, as long as they were Christians; and it happened in the afternoon, too, as long as it was weekends!

[/quote]

that is still not comparable to a quran who gives the man a right to thrash his wife with a cain if she does anything bad, a quran who permanently relegates the woman to the background,she can never ver ever lead a mosque no matter her knowledge of the quran,and she can never  pray alongside a man,not even her son where is the equality in that sire??

olabowale:

And in your country called Nigeria, it was Allah and Muhammad that instigated Jacob Gowon and Odumegu Ojukwu to wage the Civil war? It was Allah and Muhammad that caused the Jews to bomb King David Hotel in Jarusalem where many British personnel died? It was Allah and Muhammad that caused the two world wars in Europe between mostly Christians? It was Allah that made Prince Charles perform uncountable illigal sex that ended his marriage? I am giving you what you will definitely must have heard about, and not the remote sillinesses that you call reposes!

no it was not allah,it was satan,but then again are they brn again and broken christians??
if they are not,then what is my business defending them or justifying their actions?the point is that mohammad and his sucessive followers are responsible for the bloodshed by suicide bombers and also the innocent girls who are not ready to have sex talk less of having babies dying in droves
[quote author=olabowale link=topic=328844.msg4705716#msg4705716 date=1255177846]
Ojukwu married Bianca, I married Zaynab, and while Ojukwu throws his wife out, I keep mine! I have no interest in divorcing my wife or wives at the drop of a hat! Is there a way you can blame Allah and Muhammad on your sexual perversions, or at least or the easy Lizzy sexual maladies that is an epidemic in the Christian communities of the world?

well for one,any christian who divorces under any guise needs to rededicate his or her life so count that out of christianity,secondly a real born again christian will stick with one single wife come what may,so now why dont you defend your mohammad and the sexual vices he indulged in, why dont you justify them??

@Godson2009:

as usual,rather than answer the question,you come back with a counter question,the thing is that is it easier to ask questions,than actually answering potentially embarassing questions about your prophets?

Whats embarrassng is your dishonesty! I asked you about Verse 28 of Acts 4, where Jesus is said to be a servant, you laughed. Dis I want to see 32 or a yes he is a servant or no he is not but God, so that I can turn loose the Acts people on you, head to head!

you have been recycling the same 6/7 or so points right from the get go,without answering just one of all the embarassing stuffs mohammad got up to,
did jesus kill innocent people or rob people on the highway?

Se o mo wipe aiye lo bami? Ayinike lo mo, ayini pada ju yen lo. So when you are saying recycling, there was your modus operandi. Did Jesus kill anyone? He killed a tree. He drown pigs and he was ready to fight except that the Jews came as a huge mob, with overwhelming conventional advantage, many many people over that the 12 apostes, less Judas and the deniers, and the doubters on the sie of Jesus cant do nothing. Otherwise it would have been a bloodbath, or can you explain what Sword was being used for, instead of "bags"? Let me tell you, one sword in the hand of Zorro can kill a whole country! Lol.

did he sleep with young 9 yrs old girls?

My younger son will be 23 n November. Yet I could marry a mature 18 year old woman! Now that explains everything. A wife is a wife, is a wife!

lets be honest,if you had two children and one was quiet,frugal e.t.c like jesus and the other was like a glorified area boy killing sleeping with girls e.t.c like mohammad who do you think any father will love more??go figure

Frugality is not a good thing, unless it has a good purpose. Not being married at some adult age is a terrible thing. Neither fits a normal and moderate person. Ohsisi, I dey lie, since marriage is a good thing. Discuss this with your christian brethren, girl!

abulbanaat:

I could not still resist the urge to answer some of the questions GODSON had recently raised though I had promised to leave him with the Qur’aan . But when I re-read his points again I was amazed at his ignorance.

why dont you prove my ignorance for all to see,i asked you 4/5 simple and direct questions which required a simple yes or not,and you are going on and on with stories and litany of events and generic explanations lol

abulbanaat:

Muhsin, please pardon me this time. Yes I understand you analogy about Abu Taalib’s case, that the Prophet strove hard perhaps he would accept Islam but alas, such that Allaah revealed:

“Verily! You (O Muhammad) guide not whom you like, but Allâh guides whom He wills. And He knows best those who are the guided.” [ Q28: 56].

But we should also remember that people like Abu Sufyan, Khaalid bn Waleed, Amr bn al-Aas, etc. (may Allaah be pleased with them all) were enemies of the dear Prophet for about 25 years, they fought him hard, they nearly killed him at Uhud (but truth must prevail) yet most of them later accepted Islam.

[/quote]
im sure you will agree with me that all this drivel does not require a response from me,im guessing you were talking to muhsin

abulbanaat:

In fact on the day Amr accepted Islam, he said: ‘O Messenger of Allah you were the most hateful personl to me before I entered Islam but now you are my most beloved.’

So GODSON and his friends here have only been fighting Islam just some few months back. And I want to believe those areas that seem to be grey to them are their last doubts, Insha Allaah, before they would become Muslims (if Allaah needs them, I sincerely pray so). So Muhsin let us give them the benefit of the doubt.

well,i have tried to see if there was something in islam which could have converted me,but alas i am sorry to say i have burrowed deep into your ahadiths and quran and could not find anything but half truths and contradictions,as for you and olabowale and the rest i have already prayed concerning you and prophecised and i know it is only a matter of time when the holy spirit will arrest you,like he arrested apostle paul,evangelist shitta,pastor hamzat,pastor shittu e.t.c
dont worry you will still testify to the goodness of our lord jesus,you wont be the first or thate last you wait,

abulbanaat link=topic=328844.msg4708283#msg4708283 date=1255207323:

And as he has partly not wanted me to give him long-winded answers (though his questions are long-winded too), I will make it snappy.

well,you cant blame me if olabowale decides to start his normal long winded narrative can you? which you have continues for that matter
YES OR NO ANSWERS!! is that so hard??

abulbanaat:

Well I won’t go back to some issues again viz. The marriage of Prophet to Aisha at six, and the eventual consummation at nine – it was as decreed by Allaah. Had it been wrong the enemies of the Prophet then, the Arabs would have capitalized on it, but they did not. They knew the Prophet had married a woman by the standard of their culture. I want you to think on the sociological aspect of that, GODSON. Do you know what the sociologist call cultural relativism.

irrespective of what name you give it,a paedophile is a paedophile!! did you consider for a moment that these enemies might not have keyed into or picked up on it?

abulbanaat:

If Islâm is full of gaping holes as you claim, O GODSON, it would have fizzled out. Those ‘holes’ that you refer to are meant to test people like you.

well,why dont you help me fill in the gaping hol;es then, because these explanations which are so hollow and devoid of any s intellectual backbone is getting tiresome

abulbanaat:

The satanic verses is based on a story not authentic in Islam. There are lot of stories in Islam but not all of them are authentic. The compilation of the hadith on the least was carefully done, and there are principles regarding acceptability or otherwise of reports. This aspect of Islamic knowledge has its experts, GODSON, you cannot understand. I do not know how to help you understand. I am sorry for you are far from it.

yea right,but its in the quran yes or no?lol because i have a beard you think i am one of these follow follow boko haram that ll believe anything you spew out as long as it is backed up by verses in the quran?lol
you can help me understand by answering YES OR NO!!!

abulbanaat:

Islam commands fighting the unbelievers. That has been in the Divine Law since Allaah created the heaven and the earth. Moses, Solomon, David, etc. killed the unbelievers of their time, they smote their necks and they cut their fingertips. Had Allaah not decreed that Jesus’ Prophethood would go as it went (just three years, may Allaah bestow peace on Jesus ), he would have smitten the necks of the unbelievers of his time.

i will not rise to the bait again, rather than countering questions you find difficult or uncomfortable to answer,admit and then you can ask me yours??
so you agree that mohammad and your allah commanded cold blooded murder,stealing from innocent traders,killing of innocent young boys e.t.c
the fact of the matter was that,jesus did not all through his ministry,even when he had a chance to so you have no basis, is it a must for you to always use jesus and christianity to justify your stance or counter jesus for any wrong mohammad did? lol

abulbanaat:

For the umpteenth time, Qur’ân does not contain contradictions as does you Bible. Please bring those contradictions. Eg. A verse here says ‘four things’ and the other says ‘eight’ please bring one, O GODSON.

a prime example is mohammad in the meccan part of the quran telling you his followers to tolerate other religions apart from polytheists and then turn around in the medina verses to enjoin you his followers to kill,maim and destroy the same people, second i will still bring up the satanic verses again,and then turning round to  castigate polytheists, i have posted enough contradictions so open a thread and lets go toe to toe on that,then i promise you i will post more than enough ahadiths

abulbanaat:

As for the knowledge of abrogation, you cannot understand, not because you do not possess the Holy Ghost (as you claim about the Bible), but because you do not have the knowledge to. Islam is a religion of knowledge. I am sorry GODSON.

lol so this is the new style??lol abrogation is another posh name for contradiction sire

abulbanaat:

Read what I said about Jihaad in that post, please read very carefully, O GODSON. May Allaah show you the light.

allah has shown me the ligh,but his own light is so dim and poor that i have decided to go where the shining bright light is i.e jesus christ

abulbanaat:
“1. Did your prophet indulge in a free for all sexual proclivity?”

No. He married women as did other Prophets like him. He did not even parallel Solomon.

solomon was one of several biblical kings,where in the new testament did any of jesus disciples or jesus himself amass wives indiscriminately like your prophet did?
also,you forgot to justify mohammad sleeping with the female slaves

abulbanaat:
“2.did he covet and eventually take his adopted son's wife?”

No. He was the one that ‘forced’ Zaynab to marry Zayd in the first place when the former did not want to. And when the marriage broke down, Allaah commanded him to marry Zaynab, to put an end to the taboo in the Arab culture that a man cannot marry the former wife of his adopted son; and to put an end to rights ancillary to child adoption in Islam. [Funnily you did not mention another allegation that the Prophet saw Zaynab’s unclothedness that was why he went ‘haywire’ about her. Don’t you subscribe to that opinion?]

in orther words,if you hooked your friend or family up with a girl,and they wernt happy together,your next action will be to step in and snatch the same girl from him right?spot on genius thinking talk less of an elderly man,who was also supposed to be a prophet who should normally have mediated and  solved the issues between them

abulbanaat:
“3.did he sleep with slave girls,to the extent that his wives were murmuring?”

Yes. Allaah made it permissible for him to sleep with his slave girls (Maryah and Rihaanah) (not slave girls of others) as Allaah made it permissible for Abraham to sleep with Hagar (Islam says Hagar was a slave girl of Ibrahim not of Sarah), and as He made it permissible for Solomon, and other Porphets.
n

well your allah must be a love-vendor or his own moral conduct whereever he might be resident is in question,if he can order his servant to commit wholesale rape on his female slaves,both married and unmarried,by the way GOD never ordered abraham to marry hagar go and read the bible, he told abraham to leave every single thing and go to a land in which he will show him,hagar was a little girl by this time but abraham took her with him when he was leaving,by the time she was a young lady and looking attractive and all that he could not resist her, its like a couple in naija with an attractive housemaid, solomon made it permissible to himself not GOD,if you read the bible he consorted with unbelievers and married from idol worshipping nations,all those was not GOD

abulbanaat:
“4.did he assasinate a poet that satirized him and then later pay blood money?”

I like to see the evidence for this, I am hearing it for the first time. But make sure it is not a fabricated or weak report.

here is your proof o misdirected muslim man, Ibn Ishaq 550-51 also read bukhari 5;59 369,

abulbanaat:

“5.did he murder people in cold blood?”

Do you mean in war time? If yes people could be killed in cold blood in war time. What is known is that Islamic warfare (not as being portrayed by those Muslims you refer to as terrorists) has its rules. Non-combatants are not ordinarily killed, the elders, women, children, unless if guilt can be established against them, as it was done against the Jews of Banu Quraidha (and the likes). And that was even the Judaic Law in the latter case.

not in wartime only,in cold blood,i can provide proof if you want

abulbanaat:
“6.did he rob innocent traders?”

That would be bad if he did. But do you mean the antecedent to the Battle of Badr. He only wanted to revenge the Makkans seizure of the Muslims wealth back in Makkah. Remember the Muslims were not allowed to take any of their property when they were living Makkah. So when Abu Sufyan was passing around Madinah with the goods of the Makkans from Syria, so it was an ample time for the Muslims to have just some of their own properties back from the Makkans.

well,here is why i have concerns,the people he was robbng were not the meccans,but traders going to mecca for their own business,he didnt only rob and kill them without provocation,he robbed during the holy months and then conveniently got a revelation to justify himself,like he always does when he wants something really bad,besides the muslims had ample time to pack their stuffs as mohammad and his followers were unchallenged neither were they hounded out of macca untill mohammad planned with the ppl from yathrib to overthrow mecca so your assertion that they were not allowed to pack their stuffs was not correct,the only person that didnt have time to pack was mohammad and his assistant,but i am sure you will agree with me that even in this day and age,anywhere in the world where you committed the same offence mohammad committed"high treason"against a state is punishable by death,even nigeria

abulbanaat:

As for your claim that Christianity is the fastest going religion in the Nigeria whereby you cited examples of the attendance at the redemption camps, then I will say you have made the stupidest point so far. Do you count those who came into Christianity through the miracles which they never saw as serious Christians? When your comrades, here, have declared those redemption camps of your pastors as money-making centres, where the innocent ones are being covertly robbed of their wealth. And where are their miracles? Their Ayefele still can’t work, Obadare is still blind, Idahosa died after a cardiac arrest (they are still concealing that).

that shows your total ignorance of ll things christian,without being insultive as you muslims are wont to be when confronted with the truth, are muslims not converting in large numbers to christianity in nigeria?yes or no?(i know i love this yes or no thing lol)
irrespective of your views either the miracles are fake or not,your islamic children are still converting,redemption camp is still expanding,same as winners and other churches so there is nothing you can do about it really,go to the united states as well olabowale can bear me witness and ask him the size of oral roberts ministeries in tulsa oklahoma,keneth hagin creflo dolla e.t.c go to core islamic nations like indonesia malaysia e.t.c pentecostal christians arew making inroads and muslims are convertong, same as somalia anegypt,and other parts of north africa,just do a little research and you will realise to your anger and disbelief

abulbanaat:

I remember a pastor whose wife gave birth through a C.S. and he hid it from the members of his congregation (it was about seven years ago at Catholic Hospital, Apomu, Osun State).

well,good for them,but i am not catholic so thats not my conern i am a pentecostal christian same as whatever the wahhabi islamists get up to might not be your concenr or the shia sect if you are not part of them

abulbanaat:

And don’t you know that those who become Christians among the Muslims are doing so because of economic hardship prevalent in the country. Let Nigeria gets a good leadership and see what will become of Christianity.

awww, poor them lol why dont we wait till then, if the islamic population in nigeria has not dwindled to less than 1 million, lol lol
how r bout the united states of america?

abulbanaat:
how about europe??btw a nigerian man owns the largest church in ukraine a country where right wing extremists are really strong and the whites hate blacks like anything, uk pastor mathew who was a muslim before now owns the fastest growing black ethnic minority church in the uk


No serious Muslim, who knows the Qur’aan and the Sunnah, would become a Christian. At least I have not seen one. As for the likes you see, yes they are many. My mother was once one of them. She is late now, and Alhmadulillah she died a Muslimah; about for years before her death, she began to believe in Oneness of Allaah, and she began to pray the Muslim way. She searched foe miracles from one church to the others until it became clear to her that it is on Allaah one should depend. In fact she saw the joy of the reliance before she died. May Allaah forgive her of her shortcomings. How I wish she is alive today, and she will enjoy more, for we too are not riff-raff as our Christians neighbours have threatened we would be. In fact they are jealous of us today. Alihamdulillah ala ni’mati-hi.

well i have seen and i will give you prominent examples evangelist gboyega shitta was a core muslim,and they had their own mosque,in fact he was in line to become the imam of their family mosque before he converted to christianity,he prayed for 11 years for his family to convert which they have done now, i am sure you have heard of the popular shitta family in lagos island,that is his family go and find out.

pastor mathew ashimolowo was born a muslim and was a devout islamic man untill he realised and converted to islam.

[astor hamzat as his name implies was a muslim before he converted,he heads a redeemed church.
pastor obadimeji heads another redeemed in manchester,he was a muslim now a christian, how many more examples of devout serious  musoims who converted do you want?

now your turn,please point me in the direction of or mention prominent christians who have converted to islam??
i am sure you realise that the governor of gombe invited pasrtor kumuyi to dine with him and he is even building a church,all of them especially the outwardly muslim ones consult with pastor adeboye,hope you know that or am i lying??lol lol


And you still say, Christianity is the fastest religion in US. Are you not in the UK? Don’t they beg people to come to church on Sundays? Open your heart.

i dont know what part of the uk you are talking about,but uplawal who is your sister in islam and lives in london will bear me witness that pentecostal churches are springing up everywhere in london,an average nigerian pentecostal church  has thousands, evvirtually all young men and women who are muslims attend one redeemed or the other, dont you know pastor adeboye's vision from  the lord??
that a redeemed church parish will be located every 5 minutes drive from each other,is it not happening already? you tell me.

Once again, men and women are spiritually the same in Islam but physically different. Women are better of in Islam than Christianity if you but know.

One of the last means of correcting a stubborn wife is by beating which will not leave any mark on her. And it is the last option, and still Muslims men are told that not to beat their wives (at all for any reason, as the Prophet had counselled ) is better. That is the Divine Law.

And in other places (I mean even in your Christianity) men still beat their women till the point of death. Don’t say you don’t know, O GODSON. O often do we hear of a husband killing his wife in the Western countries?

lol lol lol so your justification for the beating of your own wife and partner or slave like a common rabid dog,is that it is the last resort,can you hear or listen to yourself sometimes??
and you really think that woman will genuinely love you rather than fear you??i remember when i was in primary school when i used to get caned,till today i dont forget the teachers that caned me most or even the times my dad caned me,talk less of a wife you live and sleep with on the same bed, you betgter desist from that demonnic doctrine if you dont want your wife to mix ground glass in your food ne day, show me where the bible tells a man to even touch one hair on a woman's head, and i will show you how jesus treated the women equal,we dont see women as slaves unlike islam that is why we only marry once in life and thats it,and only marry one wife,not marrying millions of wives if you can cope with it,
who do you think will cherish his wife more
a man who has only one?
and a man who has 15 and still looking to marry more?


Quran 33;28:

“O Prophet (Muhammad)! Say to your wives: If you desire the life of this world, and its glitter, Then come! I will make a provision for you and set you free in a handsome manner (divorce).”

There the Prophet’s wives began to make too-much worldly demand on the Prophet, so Allaah called them to order. Is that what you mean by their g

yea right,when they complain his allah conveniently calls them to order,but when he does stuffs against them he is ordered to do so by allah??lol lol
i really think that your allah and mohammad must be in cahoots with the whole fraud going on,and they are both male chauvinists as wellrumbling? Well they were humans.‘as for taking his step son's wife to himself’

The Prophet did not take his step son rather Allaah commanded him to marry the former wife of his former adopted son. See the difference.

of course,why didnt i think of that!allah has to command him to marry a woman he was lusting after,allah didnt command him to marry the old wrinkled women whose husbands had been killed in the various jihads, lol but the young beautiful woman lol


The Jews did not accept Muhammad as a bonafide Prophet even though they knew he was. They thought their claimed closeness with Allaah would save them on the Day of Resurrection:

“And they (Jews) say, "The Fire (i.e. Hell-fire on the Day of Resurrection) shall not touch us but for a few numbered days." Say (O Muhammad Peace be upon him to them): "Have you taken a covenant from Allâh, so that Allâh will not break His Covenant? Or is it that you say of Allâh what you know not?"” [Q2: 80].

i have addressed the reason mohammad was so mad at the jews earlier on this set of replies, its up there somewhere,

That is one of the reasons none of them did not accept Islam. But have you read about the Islâm of Abdussalam (a former Jew in the time of Muhammad), and Ka’b al-Aabar (after the Prophet died).

the reasons from whose point of view??
im sure you will agree with me that makes a lot of difference, you are not talking to a novice,

Did you think the Prophet would go to Madianh to meet the Jews, if he were a false Prophet while he knew he they would expose him?

well that i cant say,they needed him to sort the inter clan and inter tribal wars out and he was the only one who could muster the political and millitary clout to do so, he needed a safe sanctuary for him and his followers so they both got wat they wanted however,that did not stop him running the jewish tribes who did not accept him out of their town even without provocation, i have proof!

[And have you read the answer I gave to Kola Oloye as regard his question about the five pillars of Islâm? Why is your heart so hard, O GODSON?]

And should we use the same principle against Jesus? The Jews did not accept him as a bonafide Prophet, so they ‘killed’ him.

and even at that,he still loved us still so much that he gave us multiple chances to confess our sins and be forgiven, that should show you that he is surrounded and immersed only in love unlike your prophet and his father allah or his oga which ever way you want



“im not reffering to just battle of badr,which was officially or unofficially the first millitant jihad,i am reffering to the time mohammad arrived in yathrib or medina as it was later known,he could not farm,as the quraysh tribe where he was from were predominantly traders,hence he started raiding and stealing from innocent travellers to make ends meet the question is”

Interesting, can you please bring your evidence. I am hearing that for the first time. And know that if you fail to produce you evidence then you are a liar, as usual.

this is self explanatory,all you need to do is to read the accounts of mohammad and his followers when they got to yathrib/medina, is that so hard for you to do or you want me to do all the reading and researching for you, i have made it as clear as one can, however if after your professed knowledge of islam you dont know or have any idea of what happened or the reasons for mohammad indulging in (razzia)then you need a lot more reading to do about your religion, especially if  an individual who has only been reading the quran and hadiths can educate you on that aspect of the medina period


“well,the difference between the islamic millitants and the lords army in uganda e.t.c is that in the new testament there is nowhere GOD tells or enjoins his disciples to strive against unbeleivers,rather he highlights love and compassion at every opportunity.”

So what about the Old Testamnet? Is the God of Old Testament different from that of New Testament?

yes sire,the ways and manners,everything in the old testament is different,hence the reason jeus christ came to right the wrongs of the old testament, even the bible tells us that we are not to go by the doctrines and laws of the old testament anymore,that is why we dont do animal sacrifice anymore,that is why we dont do all the unleavened bread,passover,burn offerings calling a prophet to help us talk to GOD, ALL we need to do is kneel down on our knees pray to our father,and have faith and we r ok, the likes of pastor adeboye will just join their faith with ours and pray

And does your statement absolve the Lords Army of Uganda?

Why did you leave out the Crusades? Hey they were too brutal to be referred to Christianity.

like i said,these events had nothing to do  with christianity,they are simply politics, tompolo the millitant leader in niger delta has professed to be a pastor or prophet or some religious figure,does that justify what he is doing??
the bible  i.e new testament has made its stance cleear on all these issues without any contradiction or ambiguity like the quran

abulbanaat:
“yet we will continue to preach love and evangelize either you like it or not and we love you our brothers and sisters even if you hate us, and i know that makes you people really mad but tough!!!we love you”

Do not pretend, where is the love? When you don’t want us in schools (like the southern universities), you do not want us in government offices. You forced some of our uncles to become Christians before they could be educated, etc. you do not love us, stop the lie. Allaah has exposed you:

really??did these same uncles receive a good education their own government could not provide for them?
where were the islamic states when the christian missions were doing all this?why didint they take over ?
where in the south did admission go on the basis of religion or that is a figment of your lucid imaginations?

[quote author=abulbanaat link=topic=328844.msg4708283#msg4708283 date=1255207323]“Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him and the Muslims) till you follow their religion. Say: "Verily, the Guidance of Allâh (i.e. Islâmic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance. And if you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him ) were to follow their (Jews and Christians) desires after what you have received of Knowledge (i.e. the Qur'ân), then you would have against Allâh neither any Walî (protector or guardian) nor any helper.” [Q2: 120].

And your friends are the Jews, Allaah has warned us about you. That you have evil against us. You only expressed the so called love on you tongues:

“O you who believe! Take not as (your) Bitânah (advisors, consultants, protectors, helpers, friends, etc.) those outside your religion (pagans, Jews, Christians, and hypocrites) since they will not fail to do their best to corrupt you. They desire to harm you severely. Hatred has already appeared from their mouths, but what their breasts conceal is far worse. Indeed We have made plain to you the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses) if you understand.” [Q3: 1Ple

stop being paranoid,the crusades were politicians who used christianity to cover up,even a secondary school history student will tell you that the knights templar were politicians

abulbanaat:

the socio-religious crises in the Northern part of Nigeria is a deep-rooted ones that i may not be able to explain here while I am not absolving the Muslims from total blame. The Chrsitians too have had their share. What will you say about the massacre of the Muslims by the Christians in the Zango-Kataf crises, and recently that of Jos. What you must know is that most of those crises are political in nature the politicians only used some unsuspecting Muslims and Christians to achieve their ends.
How I wish GODSON, will open his heart, stop being stubborn against your Creator.

typical, so that is enough justification for the churches that have been continually burnt by muslims,and they continue to, ak anyone who wwitnessed the kano riots before you r talking about what you dont know about, the reprisal in the jos riots came about because these guys have had enough, boko haram is still there o

olabowale:

@Godson2009: Whats embarrassng is your dishonesty! I asked you about Verse 28 of Acts 4, where Jesus is said to be a servant, you laughed. Dis I want to see 32 or a yes he is a servant or no he is not but God, so that I can turn loose the Acts people on you, head to head!

the point is not you asking a counter question, you are meant to answer my questions sire with a simple yes or no,, i will even allow a short explanation after whcih i will gladly answer yours

olabowale:

Se o mo wipe aiye lo bami? Ayinike lo mo, ayini pada ju yen lo. So when you are saying recycling, there was your modus operandi. Did Jesus kill anyone? He killed a tree. He drown pigs and he was ready to fight except that the Jews came as a huge mob, with overwhelming conventional advantage, many many people over that the 12 apostes, less Judas and the deniers, and the doubters on the sie of Jesus cant do nothing. Otherwise it would have been a bloodbath, or can you explain what Sword was being used for, instead of "bags"? Let me tell you, one sword in the hand of Zorro can kill a whole country! Lol.

so again you are comparing the killing of a fig tree to the killing of hundreds of thousands which mohammad did am i to beleive that you are the same in equality to a fig tree then?
j

olabowale:
esus christ had a multitude that could protect him,by the time he died he had followers running into thousands who followed his ministry, when he fed the multitude with 2 loaves of bread and five fishes,did you think only ten ppl were there?

olabowale link=topic=328844.msg4709030#msg4709030 date=1255216960:

when the woman with the issue of bllod touched him did you think it was just 2 ppl?
when zacheus the tax collector couldnt get to him and climbed on a tree how many ppl did you think was present?
when the disabled broke the roof of the house jesus was in,and his friends lowered him into the room,did you think the door was free of people?
he allowed them to take him so the prophecies might be fullfilled, if you study that part f the bible,judas iscariot actually tought that jesus would disappear of miss from their midst like he had always done before, did you think that was their first time of trying tocatch him??
that was the reason why he went back to return the money , go and study the bible
[quote author=olabowale link=topic=328844.msg4709030#msg4709030 date=1255216960]

My younger son will be 23 n November. Yet I could marry a mature 18 year old woman! Now that explains everything. A wife is a wife, is a wife!

no it doesnt!an 18 years old girl is totally free to marry a 90 yrs old if she so wants to,a 6 years old,9 yrs old has no choice and is still a babay, biology and nature does not lie,thats why the children and dying off when giving birth or having vaginal tear, dont worry i promise you that your son is attending christian fellowships in secret,he will tell you he is a christian soon and there is nothing you will do abut it

olabowale:

Frugality is not a good thing, unless it has a good purpose. Not being married at some adult age is a terrible thing. Neither fits a normal and moderate person. Ohsisi, I dey lie, since marriage is a good thing. Discuss this with your christian brethren, girl!

well jesus christ's frugality had a good and higher purpose, its a shame mohammad didnt follow the same example

[/quote]

@GODSON, I swear by He Who has created me, your reply to my last post really made me laugh. How you evaded those serious questions I raised as counter-offensive. I know you are wounded, I know. I can read that from your writing.

That is one of my aims, at least if you will not accept Islam, then you will be wounded in your faith in divinity of the servant, Jesus Christ. And you are.

But: ‘Aja to ma s’onun koni gbo fere olode’ to borrow elder Olabowale’s style.

So you don’t know that if the Prophet’s marriage with Aisha was wrong his Arab enemies would use that against him.

You don’t know that the Jews in Madinah were not the ones that invited the Prophet there. And you don’t know that the Prophet defeated them intellectually, that was why they resorted to conniving with the idolaters in Makkaah against the Prophet.

Still you blanketly said the Crusaders were not fighting a religious war. What a slap on an historical fact, O GODSON.

Show me where God blamed Abraham and Solomon for their marital actions, if you cannot, then know it is not only the Prophet of Islam that you are slandering. So your crime is multi-faceted.

So at last you partially agree that it was the antecedent of the Battle of Badr that you refer to as the case of the Prophet’s ‘robbery.’ I thought you said he was robbing some of the traders of Madinah.

You do not know that Abu Sufyan was crossing the territory of the Muslims that was why they wanted to seize the goods he was carrying. And don’t you know that even in the modern secular law, you are not allowed to carry goods across a country not yours just like that. Say the Cameroonian government carries its goods across Nigeria, the goods will not go.

Still you cannot explain why Yinka Ayefele is still on the wheel chair and the mentor of your Pastor Adeboye, Obadare, in Akure is still blind, even with all the miracles around. Rather you still came with mentioning more of money-making centers that you called churches. And I can see that you are defending the Pentecostal churches, saying as if catholic Church was not the Church that gave Christianity its doctrines after years of wrangling over whether Jesus was God or not, among other issues. Seun, the owner of this Forum, must hear this O. I think he is a catholic.

And see your folly, in the case of that Pastor at Apomu, I did not say the pastor was a catholic in fact he is one of the pastors of the Pentecostal Churches around. He only took the case to the Catholic Hospital after he had ‘prayed and prayed’ for safe delivery of his wife but alas the woman could not ‘push’. So they hid the information from the Church members because they knew it would affect their business – claims for miracles.

Lest I forget, can you bring out that story of the poet whom our Prophet killed. Bring it out for all to see, I cannot find it. Bring it out GODSON otherwise you receive another medal in your lying business.

What else? Yes the contradictions in the Qur’aan, let me guide you. Say in verse so-and-so of so-and-so chapter Allaah said so-and-so and in another He said the contrary, bring one if you can. I bet it you cannot see one, even if you search from the beginning of the Qur’aan to the last.

And I cannot understand one thing from you. Do you subscribe to those Christians that say Allaah is moon god? That He was one of the idols worshipped in Makkah? Do you? Please let me know, I have some questions for you.

Once again go and read that post I sent to Kola Oloye, and open your heart.

And where are those Muslims that embraced Christianity, I mean the Shaykhs that we all know or on the least learners like me, I mean like mean. It is you that run away from us. I remember when I rediscovered Islam in Kaduna around 1996, on the street where I used to leave some Jehovah’s Witnesses (which I see as being better Christians, for they know the Bible are ready to accept some of the truths of the Qur’aan namely that Jesus is not God. Though they are also Kuffaar because they don’t recognize the Prophethood of Muhammad, among other things.)

Their Kingdom Hall was just around where I stayed, every time they came out of their programmes they would swarm on our streets and our houses ‘preaching the gospel.’ We began to have encounters, then I was very good at Comparative Religion (I am no more because I don’t have time for it, I learn and preach Islam now that is why you will not see me quote a verse of the Bible here, but I know the stories in the Bible), it was not very long that these hot-gospellers (as Deedat used to call them) removed our own house from their points of call because they said ‘there is a boy there full of evil spirit.’

And I remember another pastor who visited our house then, he came from Ondo to Kaduna, to visit my uncle whom I was staying with. He derided my Islam when he found out my religion was Islam. That night of his visit, we spoke to the wee hours of the following day comparing Islâm with Christianity (then I was just back in the pristine Islam), he left our house disappointed and wounded (as you are here), he planned to stay for some days but abruptly left the following day lest he became a Muslim.
So you are the ones that run away from us. So the Muslims have known their religion now, you are exposed!

‘Afefe ti fe a ti furo edie.’ (Apology to elder Olabowale).

“Nay, We fling (send down) the truth (this Qur'ân) against the falsehood (disbelief), so it destroys it, and behold, it (falsehood) is vanished. And woe to you for that (lie) which you ascribe (to Us) (against Allâh).” [Q21: 18].

Any other thing?

GODSON, for the last time read this lest you are destroyed and undertand:

@kola oloye
‘What is the genesis and significance of "the five pillars of Islam".

The five pillars of Islâm are:

One: Testifying that Allaah is the Only Supreme Being worthy of worship in truth, and that Muhammad is His Messenger (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam).

Evidence for that abound in the Qur’ân.

The significance of that is that people will know that Allaah (those who still refer to Him as one of the idols in Makkah are only celebrating their ignorance; do you say the Arabs never knew that there is a Supreme Being?) Only is the Creator that all forms of worship are supposed to be directed to, and that Muhammad is the last of Allaah’s Messengers and Prophets (not as being loosely used in Xtianity) whose explanation of divine phenomenon, as revealed to him, must be listened to. Muslims know that they cannot worship Allaah adequately unless the follow the Messenger of Allaah (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam).

Closely associated with the above is belief in the following:

Belief in the angels – Jibreel, Mikail, Israfeel, Maalik, Malakul-Maut (angel of death) Munkar, Nakir, etc. (Only Allaah knows their number.)

Belief in all the Messengers and Prophets of Allaah (Allaah’s peace on them all). No Muslim will disbelieve in a Prophet of Allaah, say Jesus (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam), and remains a Muslim. (Muslims are in a better condition).

Belief in the Heavenly Books – Torah, Zabur, Injeel and the Qur’aan (that confirms, or otherwise, of other Books.)

Belief in the Last Day (when the truth of Islâm as the religion of all the Prophets, among other things, will be resolved by the Judge - Allaah).

And belief in preordainment (Qadar), that Allaah had foreknowledge of what would be and what would not be; that I am typing these lines now had been preordained. The Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) has said the first thing Allaah created was the Pen, and He said to it: ‘Write,’ the Pen asked: ‘What should I write?’ He said write all what will be till the end of time.’ So all that is, whether good or bad, Allaah had the foreknowledge of them. Our Lord is a Mighty Lord, Above is He from all false things He has been described with.

The points above constitute the bedrock of the Aqeedah (Creed) of a Muslim.

The second pillar is observance of the Salat (Prayer).

It is a commandment from Allaah that the Muslims must observe the Salat five times a day (Sub’h, Dhuhr, Asr, Maghrib and Ishaa).

“Perform AsSalât from mid-day till the darkness of the night (i.e. the Zuhr, 'Asr, Maghrib, and 'Ishâ' prayers), and recite the Qur'ân in the early dawn (i.e. the morning prayer). Verily, the recitation of the Qur'ân in the early dawn is ever witnessed (attended by the angels in charge of mankind of the day and the night).” [Q17: 78].

Observing the Salat is a means of seeking nearness to Allaah; and they are meant to mould a Muslim in his daily life:

“, and perform As-Salât. Verily, As-Salât (the prayer) prevents from Al-Fahshâ' (i.e. great sins of every kind, unlawful sexual intercourse, etc.) and Al-Munkar (i.e. disbelief, polytheism, and every kind of evil wicked deed, etc.)” [Q29: 45]

The Salat is very important in a Muslim life that whoever does not observe it, wholly and knowingly, and calls him/herself a Muslim is not. The Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) has said: ‘Between a man and his becoming an unbeliever or a polytheist is when he leaves off the Salat. Whoever leaves off the Salat has disbelieved.’ (Authentic hadith).

We have other obligatory Salawat apart from the five mentioned above, an example of that is Salatu Jumah (observed once in a week – Fridays; it is not compulsory for women to attend). There are other supererogatory Salat called Naafilah – that accompany the daily Salawat and the pre-dawn prayer (Tahajjud). There occasional Salawat like the Prayers on the occasion of the two Eids (Adh’a and Fitr); Prayer for rain, prayer when there is eclipse, etc. The Nawafil are optional.

It is noteworthy that the number of times a Muslim will observe the Salat in a day was given by Allaah to His Messenger in the latter’s momentous and historic journey to the heavens (Israa wa Miraaj). All the Christians on this Forum would instantly add that to another ‘lies’ of Al-Ameen (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam), poor them. Well unbelievers’ lot are to disbelieve, carry on. The Jews disbelieved, and are still disbelieving, in Jesus Christ (and the Christians loved, and love, them more than the Muslims, what an irony!).
[All the Arabs used to know the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) as Al-Ameen (the trustworthy one; he never told a lie in his life) but they called him a liar when he told them there is only one God. Was it possible that someone who did not tell a lie when dealing with people would tell lie when referring to God? Unbelievable.]

The third pillar is fasting in the month of Ramadan (the ninth month of Islamic calendar).

“O you who believe! Observing As-Saum (the fasting) is prescribed for you as it was prescribed for those before you, that you may become Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).” [Q2: 183].

So it is glaring from the above verse that fasting in Ramadan was commanded so that Muslims will learn more piety. And it is so.

Imagine a fasting Muslim who refrains from eating and having intimacy with his wife while he has the power to do such, especially the former, in secret without anybody bringing him to book, but he will not do that because he knows that the Supreme Being sees him. That is it.

Fasting can also be obligatory or supererogatory. Muslims do not fast in Ramadan alone.

Thus fasting is another means of seeking nearness to Allaah (the Mighty and Sublime).

The fourth pillar is paying the Zakat.

“And perform As-Salât, and give Zakât, ” [Q2: 43].

So giving the Zakat is obligatory on the rich Muslims those whose wealth has gone beyond the Nisaab (the minimum standard of wealth from which Zakat can be given). The Nisaab, which today is according to the gold value, is around N250,000 now (subject to confirmation please). A rich Muslim who has more than that amount in his savings for a whole year without touching it will pay 2.5 per cent of it as Zakat, and they are meant for:

“, the Fuqarâ' (poor), and Al-Masâkin (the poor) and those employed to collect (the funds); and for to attract the hearts of those who have been inclined (towards Islâm); and to free the captives; and for those in debt; and for Allâh's Cause (the necessary and obligatory warfare), and for the wayfarer (a traveller who is cut off from everything); a duty imposed by Allâh. And Allâh is All-Knower, All-Wise.” [Q9: 60].

When the Zakat is properly managed and administered by the Islamic Community, then you will see how Allaah uses the Muslims to enrich one another. Some Islamic countries like Saudi Arabia are trying in this regard.

And if you read the verse above carefully, you will notice that it is not even only the Muslims that receive the Zakat.

In a Muslim State, non-Muslims who are called people of the books (viz. Xtians and Jews) are not to pay Zakat but will pay Jizyah (for the security they receive from the Islamic state). When Jesus comes back (as certain he will come back, no good Muslim will deny this, he will remove the Jizyah because by then the non-Muslims namely the Christians (alive then) will have no option but to become Muslims. You will laugh, GODSON et all, won’t you? That is the truth from our LORD - Allaah.

“And he ['Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)] shall be a known sign for (the coming of) the Hour (Day of Resurrection) [i.e. 'Iesa's (Jesus) descent on the earth] . Therefore have no doubt concerning it (i.e. the Day of Resurrection). And follow Me (Allâh) (i.e. be obedient to Allâh and do what He orders you to do, O mankind)! This is the Straight Path (of Islâmic Monotheism, leading to Allâh and to His Paradise).” [Q43: 61].

The non-obligatory aspect of Zakat is what is called Sadaqah, voluntary alms, which is an everyday activity of a Muslim.

The last pillar is going on hajj.

The Muslims have evidence for Hajj they go to, we do not copy people. But people copy us.

“, And Hajj (pilgrimage to Makkah) to the House (Ka'bah) is a duty that mankind owes to Allâh, those who can afford the expenses (for one's conveyance, provision and residence); and whoever disbelieves [i.e. denies Hajj (pilgrimage to Makkah), then he is a disbeliever of Allâh], then Allâh stands not in need of any of the 'Alamîn (mankind and jinns).” [Q3: 97].

Non-Muslims should know that the institution of Hajj had been a commandment handed down by Allaah to Ibrahim (Abraham) – the Father of Faith.

“And (remember) when We showed Ibrâhim (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah) (saying): "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, [Lâ ilâha ill-Allâh (none has the right to be worshipped but Allâh Islâmic Monotheism], and sanctify My House for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up for prayer, and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to Allâh), and make prostration (in prayer, etc.);” [Q22: 26].

“And (remember) when Ibrâhim (Abraham) and (his son) Ismâ'il (Ishmael) were raising the foundations of the House (the Ka'bah at Makkah), (saying), "Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily! You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower.” [Q2: 127].

Note, Oh Christians, that the Arabs whom the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) met in Makkah never denied that fact even though they would have denied it as they did for other facts, because they knew it was nothing but the truth. But you Christians, here and in other places, you open your mouths and say Ka’bah ‘is a house in Makkah that houses a god called Allaah.’

“Indeed you have brought forth (said) a terrible evil thing. Whereby the heavens are almost torn, and the earth is split asunder, and the mountains fall in ruins” [Q19: 89-90].

It is stated in the Bible (get it right now, the Bible is an admixture of words of God and men [some of you have confirmed that on other threads]; Muslims believe in what comes from God there as confirmed by the Qur’ân and the authentic narrations from the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) [like here O Israel our God is One] and we dsibeleive in what comes from men [e.g. that Jesus is God or that he is son of God {may Allaah be glorified from that}], so please take note.) so it is stated (in the Bible) that Abraham was commanded to take Ishmael (Isma’eel) and his mother (Haajar) away. To where? Please we need your answer.

Meanwhile Islâm has answered that:

Allah said quoting Ibrahim:

“O our Lord! I (Ibrahim) have made some of my offspring to dwell in an uncultivable valley by Your Sacred House (the Ka'bah at Makkah); in order, O our Lord, that they may perform As-Salât (Iqâmat-as-Salât), so fill some hearts among men with love towards them, and (O Allâh) provide them with fruits so that they may give thanks.” [Q14: 37]

Notice Ibrahim’s supplication for Makkah in the verse. Will you understand, O Christians?

So a nation has been born through Islâm Muhammad, a grandson of Ishmael, brought as commissioned by Allaah. The nation is a great one, as the Bible (the one that comes from God) attests to; and the Jews are highly Jealous of it, as it (the Bible) also says.

So Ka’abah was the first house of worship on the surface of the earth.
“Verily, the first House (of worship) appointed for mankind was that at Bakkah (Makkah), full of blessing, and a guidance for Al-'Alamîn (the mankind and jinns).” [Q3: 96]

Back to the issue of hajj being the last pillar of Islâm.

It is obligatory on capable Muslims to go on Hajj:

“That they may witness things that are of benefit to them (i.e. reward of Hajj in the Hereafter, and also some worldly gain from trade, etc.), and mention the Name of Allâh on appointed days (i.e. 10th, 11th, 12th, and 13th day of Dhul-Hijjâh), over the beast of cattle that He has provided for them (for sacrifice) (at the time of their slaughtering by saying: Bismillah, Wallâhu-Akbar, Allâhumma Minka wa Ilaik). Then eat thereof and feed therewith the poor who have a very hard time. Then let them complete the prescribed duties (Manâsik of Hajj) for them, and perform their vows, and circumambulate the Ancient House (the Ka'bah at Makkah).” [Q22: 28-29].

So the hajj is also for spiritual development of the Muslims.

The non-obligatory hajj is called Umrah – it can be performed any period out of the Hajj months (the Hajj months are Shawwal, Dhul-Qi’dah and up to tenth day of Dhul-Hijjah). But it is best performed in Ramadan.

Go to Hajj and see equality par excellence. In Hajj all Muslims (heads-of-state, peasants, traders, labourers, etc) stand, walk, pray side by side.
There is no Muslim that will go on Hajj except that his Faith will increase.

The Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) has said a hajj performed by a Muslim whereby he avoids all forms of sins (arguments, fighting, sexual intimacy with one’s wife {when adorning the Ihraam}) has no reward except that the person will come back like the day his mother gave birth to him – a sinless state. Allahu Akbar! (We do not need somebody’s blood).

These are what we the Muslims worship our Lord with, we are happy we are so guided, we implore those who are not Muslims to reason alongside their Creator so that they know what He wants from them, not what they want from Him.
[‘Inu midun pe moje Muslim’ (I am happy I am a Muslim)].

Peace unto those who follow the guidance.

NB: (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) means: May Allaah exalt his mentioning, and bestow him peace.

GODSON, hey GODSON, leave misguidance and follow guidance.

'and even if We had sent down to you (O muhammad) a message written on paper so that they could touch it with their hands, the disbelievers would have said,' this is nothing but pure magic' Quran 6:7

GODSON O, where are you?

GODSON O, where are you?

'and even if We had sent down to you (O muhammad) a message written on paper so that they could touch it with their hands, the disbelievers would have said,' this is nothing but pure magic' Quran 6:7

@abulbanaat
you are the first islamic comedian i have come across lol
the fact that you reply with long winded retorts point to the fact that you are struggling to defend and justify your fraudulent prophet and religion,
i remember those days in secondary school when i commited an offence and my dad called me to defend myself before i got caned,i will weave all sorts of stories for like an eternity and this is what you are doing.
i answered your question directly that if the enemies of mohammad did not take him up on the fact that he was a paedophile that does not justify his actions,
does the fact that mohammad killed innocent traders and also arranged for assasinations without eyebrows raised justify these actions as well?
remember that these days a lot of barbaric and evil things were condoned not because people accepted it ,but because they could not do much,

the fact that bin laden is still not captured several years later,does it mean that he is generally accepted??go figure!!

abulbanaat:

You don’t know that the Jews in Madinah were not the ones that invited the Prophet there. And you don’t know that the Prophet defeated them intellectually, that was why they resorted to conniving with the idolaters in Makkaah against the Prophet.

i know they invited him to medina to oversee the warring tribes because of his religious and military clout,which in fairness he did,however he spoilt it all by being devious and making sure that he ran the three main jewish tribes out of medina for no fault of theirs,and if you are talking of conivng,mohammad was the king of connivance which he did with outsiders to try and overthrow the meccan leadership,that was what drove him out of mecca in the first place

abulbanaat:
Still you blanketly said the Crusaders were not fighting a religious war. What a slap on an historical fact, O GODSON.

to illustrate my point,is osama bin laden fighting in your cause of islam??
are the boko haram fighting in the cause of islam?
i await your response oabulbanaat

Show me where God blamed Abraham and Solomon for their marital actions, if you cannot, then know it is not only the Prophet of Islam that you are slandering. So your crime is multi-faceted.

[/quote]
what is the meaning of this?when evil stuffs happen,does GOD come down to tell the evil doers off?those that have done evil will at times recieve their rewards on earth then do so in heaven, do you know how old king solomon died?even you will not pray for the kind of end he had,is that not a type of judgement?
lets now discountenance king soolomon and co, remember solomon and christianity made it clear that we are to marry only one wife, mohammad make it known to you guys to marry as much as you can handle,which you are still doing today, any polygamous christian is not doing a biblical act,my dad is a christian and polygamous and i can tell you it is not the will of GOD definitely without any shadow of a doubt

So at last you partially agree that it was the antecedent of the Battle of Badr that you refer to as the case of the Prophet’s ‘robbery.’ I thought you said he was robbing some of the traders of Madinah.

yes i did say so,and both statements are fact,he started his raiding(razzia)expedition when he got to yathrib,i keep reffering to yathrib rather than medina to show you the former name it was known by before medina which culminated in the semblance of the very first jihad i.e the badr battle which gave him the confidence to conduct a full scale war against perceived unbelievers, tbecause of their victory,they gained the confidence to declare full jihad, go and do some reading pls!

You do not know that Abu Sufyan was crossing the territory of the Muslims that was why they wanted to seize the goods he was carrying. And don’t you know that even in the modern secular law, you are not allowed to carry goods across a country not yours just like that. Say the Cameroonian government carries its goods across Nigeria, the goods will not go.

i dont have time for stories,was mohammed raiding innocent travellers or not,simple!!dont justify or start talking from both sides of your mouth abeg

Still you cannot explain why Yinka Ayefele is still on the wheel chair and the mentor of your Pastor Adeboye, Obadare, in Akure is still blind, even with all the miracles around. Rather you still came with mentioning more of money-making centers that you called churches. And I can see that you are defending the Pentecostal churches, saying as if catholic Church was not the Church that gave Christianity its doctrines after years of wrangling over whether Jesus was God or not, among other issues. Seun, the owner of this Forum, must hear this O. I think he is a catholic.

if i recollect it is in the quran,that you cant question allah and his ways,so if you were a devout muslim as you profess to be,will you tell me to question my GOD??
rather than talk about ayefele and obadare who are just 2 out of tens of millions who have been receiving their healings, AGAIN i make bold on this forum to go and research on a man of GOD "john g lake"he did not just do miracles,signs and wonders,the medical world connected a scanning machine to his patients,even with cancerous cells and spokane in the united states was reputed to be one of the healthiest areas of america go and research it, now your turn point me in the direction of one islamic man of GOD who did same thing if your god was alive and not sleeping in some desert,

And see your folly, in the case of that Pastor at Apomu, I did not say the pastor was a catholic in fact he is one of the pastors of the Pentecostal Churches around. He only took the case to the Catholic Hospital after he had ‘prayed and prayed’ for safe delivery of his wife but alas the woman could not ‘push’. So they hid the information from the Church members because they knew it would affect their business – claims for miracles.

well for one let me inform you that no pastor has to hide the fact that his wife delivered in an hospital,because it is not against the word of GOD,or anywhere in the bible that your wife must not be delivered in the hospital,second you and i dont know the circumstances surrounding the pastor,i wont say more than that as i cant judge another man,and my bible tells me not to judge an annointed man of GOD

Lest I forget, can you bring out that story of the poet whom our Prophet killed. Bring it out for all to see, I cannot find it. Bring it out GODSON otherwise you receive another medal in your lying business.

THIS happened concerning the jewish tribe of bani nadir, and the name of the poet was kab ibn al ashraf who composed verses lamenting the defeat of the meccans,and satirizing mohammad,this enraged mohammad and he kab assasinated telling his henchmen who did the job that it would be ok to lie to gain the confidence of their victim in order to kill him, you can find the accounts in ibn ishaq 550-51 if you dont like that then step this wayyyyyy my favourite ahadith, bukhari 5;59-369 now smile if you are satisfied and tell everybody i am the most honest born again christian lol
dont worry i am here to lecture you on your religion, i studied your ahadiths and quran, and i have more proofs olabowale and co will tell you i debate with hard incontrovertible facts sire

What else? Yes the contradictions in the Qur’aan, let me guide you. Say in verse so-and-so of so-and-so chapter Allaah said so-and-so and in another He said the contrary, bring one if you can. I bet it you cannot see one, even if you search from the beginning of the Qur’aan to the last.

yes i can sire, again let me disgrace you,
in the quran53;19-23 meccan side he spoke in support of polytheists,and then turned round to enjoin you his folowers not to mix with polytheists and all that, i have a bowl of yoghurt ice cream in my hands as i am typing so i cant get the verse where mohammad tells you not to wbe like the polytheists

And I cannot understand one thing from you. Do you subscribe to those Christians that say Allaah is moon god? That He was one of the idols worshipped in Makkah? Do you? Please let me know, I have some questions for you.

what has this got to do with the fact of what mohammad did?dont distract me pls, i have directly answered your questions/challenges with proof now get ready to answer my yes or no questions i have been asking since

Once again go and read that post I sent to Kola Oloye, and open your heart.

And where are those Muslims that embraced Christianity, I mean the Shaykhs that we all know or on the least learners like me, I mean like mean. It is you that run away from us. I remember when I rediscovered Islam in Kaduna around 1996, on the street where I used to leave some Jehovah’s Witnesses (which I see as being better Christians, for they know the Bible are ready to accept some of the truths of the Qur’aan namely that Jesus is not God. Though they are also Kuffaar because they don’t recognize the Prophethood of Muhammad, among other things.)

there arnt much christians who accept islam,simply for the practical aspects talk les of the spiritual, this is evidenced by the many churches springing up all over nigeria,for each mosque in the whole of nigeria even west africa,you will get 2 standard sized churchs for each mega mosque,you will get one mighty sized redemption camp which can hold more than 1 million ppl, im sure you heard the last holy ghost conference i nigeria just some months ago had more than 1 million people in attendance, pls apart from the occultic gathering clled hajj where blood is always shed where else can an islamic gathering get that number of adherents, by the way i believe earnestly that there is something demonic about hajj, if not why is it that people must die every single year,its either they are trampled upon or something of that nature, you dont hear ppl dying i jerusalem pilgrimage my supposition is that maybe it is the kaba idols untill you muslims started bowing down to the image as your own idol;
Their Kingdom Hall was just around where I stayed, every time they came out of their programmes they would swarm on our streets and our houses ‘preaching the gospel.’ We began to have encounters, then I was very good at Comparative Religion (I am no more because I don’t have time for it, I learn and preach Islam now that is why you will not see me quote a verse of the Bible here, but I know the stories in the Bible), it was not very long that these hot-gospellers (as Deedat used to call them) removed our own house from their points of call because they said ‘there is a boy there full of evil spirit.’

And I remember another pastor who visited our house then, he came from Ondo to Kaduna, to visit my uncle whom I was staying with. He derided my Islam when he found out my religion was Islam. That night of his visit, we spoke to the wee hours of the following day comparing Islâm with Christianity (then I was just back in the pristine Islam), he left our house disappointed and wounded (as you are here), he planned to stay for some days but abruptly left the following day lest he became a Muslim.
So you are the ones that run away from us. So the Muslims have known their religion now, you are exposed!

‘Afefe ti fe a ti furo edie.’ (Apology to elder Olabowale).

“Nay, We fling (send down) the truth (this Qur'ân) against the falsehood (disbelief), so it destroys it, and behold, it (falsehood) is vanished. And woe to you for that (lie) which you ascribe (to Us) (against Allâh).” [Q21: 18].

Any other thing?

[quote]

well while i really cant vouch for the veracity of your ittle tales by moonlight,if that pastor was sure of himself,then he would rather be trying to deliver you and then convert you, we christians are so secure in our religion that is why we dont care if you muslims shout yourselves hoarse pouring vitriol on us,you are the ones that will behead over anything said against your prophet,you will kill if anyone says anything about your mohammad,people have called jesus black,white green blue e.t.c we dont care because the believ is in our hearts

i wil advice you muslims not to be soooo insecure and paranoid,and love everyone including your enemies like we do

@ GODSON

“you are the first islamic comedian i have come across lol
the fact that you reply with long winded retorts point to the fact that you are struggling to defend and justify your fraudulent prophet and religion,”

You call me a comedian. Do you really know what a comedy is? May be you go and read the Government Inspector and tell me what a comedy is. I am but explaining the truth to you so that you will not suffer everlasting perdition in the blazing fire.

“, fear the Fire (Hell) whose fuel is men and stones, prepared for the disbelievers.” [Q2: 24].

And you always accuse us of long-winded response while yours too have been so. So you expect us to nod yes or no to everything you say. Do you think we are so daft. We must explain things to you so that you will have no excuse for your disbelief.



“i answered your question directly that if the enemies of mohammad did not take him up on the fact that he was a paedophile that does not justify his actions,”

I said if that was wrong by their moral standard they would not let him go.

And what is even paedophilia ? do you understand English at all? The fact that you are in the UK (as you claim anyway) does not mean you will understand English. I challenge you to open a thread and let see whether Prophet Muhammad was really a paedophile. (I have started a thread challenging you on your alleged contradictions in the Qur’ân.)




“i know they invited him to medina to oversee the warring tribes because of his religious and military clout,which in fairness he did,however he spoilt it all by being devious and making sure that he ran the three main jewish tribes out of medina for no fault of theirs,”
So you did not read about the treachery of the Jewish tribes in Madinah against the Muslim State? You know you only want to pervert the truth. That is how people like you do – searching desperately to call a dog a bad name so as to hang it. Poor you.


“and if you are talking of conivng,mohammad was the king of connivance which he did with outsiders to try and overthrow the meccan leadership,that was what drove him out of mecca in the first place”

When it is an historical fact that the Makkans gave him the option of making him the King which he rejected. Another lie from you O Kadhaab (a great liar).


Tactically you agreed the Crusades were by the Christians, let us leave whether they were right or not they were Christians fighting a holy war. Hey don’t forget the war was that of all Europe such that the Kings of Franc and Engalnd partook, hey GODSON.


Once again show me in the Bible where God blamed the Father of Faith for his marital action, and that of Solomon.



Your problem is that you don’t understand Arabic, and I laugh that somebody who does not understand the Arabic Language wanting to criticise a religion whose 90 per cent of its knowledge is still retained in the Arabic Language untranslated (because they are too much.) do you know the effort it will cost the translators to translate volumes like the Fat’hu Baari, Shar’u Muslim, Taaliq Shaakir ala Musnad Ahmad, to mention just a few. And each of them is about 20 volumes! So you just read some translated works and you begin to open your mouth. Don’t be silly (to borrow the elders’ style in Yoruba land.)




“i dont have time for stories,was mohammed raiding innocent travellers or not,simple!!dont justify or start talking from both sides of your mouth abeg”

You do not know that the Prophet actually established a state in Madinah, and all those things you call raids are normal actions of a state. Will you understand? (we may need to open another thread on that).



Heal Yinka Ayefele first and your Obadare then let see, forget about those thousands of miracles that you claim which nobody can verify. Heal Ayefele and Obadare Oooooo!



“THIS happened concerning the jewish tribe of bani nadir, and the name of the poet was kab ibn al ashraf who composed verses lamenting the defeat of the meccans,and satirizing mohammad,this enraged mohammad and he kab assasinated telling his henchmen who did the job that it would be ok to lie to gain the confidence of their victim in order to kill him, you can find the accounts in ibn ishaq 550-51 if you dont like that then step this wayyyyyy my favourite ahadith, bukhari 5;59-369 now smile if you are satisfied and tell everybody i am the most honest born again christian lol
dont worry i am here to lecture you on your religion, i studied your ahadiths and quran, and i have more proofs olabowale and co will tell you i debate with hard incontrovertible facts sire”


If it was Ka’b al-Ashraaf that you have been trying to mention all these days then you have gaffed. Ka’b was a Jew found guilty of conniving with the Makkaans against the Muslim State – and that was a treasonable offence which no government of today will stand. That he satirised the Muslims especially the Muslim women in his poems is another. That enough can pass as a crime if it is meant to undermine the people of a state such that it will cause unrest among them. Once again, the Prophet was the head of a new state that evolved out of chaos, and one of those causing the chaos was Ka’b al-Ashraaf. (If you can read Arabic read Ibn Kathir’s Fusuul Fee Seerati Rasuul [p.143]) . go and read it, but it is in Arabic O. I can’t help you with the translation.







“yes i can sire, again let me disgrace you,
in the quran53;19-23 meccan side he spoke in support of polytheists,and then turned round to enjoin you his folowers not to mix with polytheists and all that, i have a bowl of yoghurt ice cream in my hands as i am typing so i cant get the verse where mohammad tells you not to wbe like the polytheists”

I shall transport this to the thread i have opened on the subject, meet me there.




“what has this got to do with the fact of what mohammad did?dont distract me pls, i have directly answered your questions/challenges with proof now get ready to answer my yes or no questions i have been asking since”

So you are confused whether Allaah is one of the Makkan idols or not. Do not leave your comrades like the phantom G.J.O. Morshay in this principle.




“there arnt much christians who accept islam,simply for the practical aspects talk les of the spiritual, this is evidenced by the many churches springing up all over nigeria,for each mosque in the whole of nigeria even west africa,you will get 2 standard sized churchs for each mega mosque,you will get one mighty sized redemption camp which can hold more than 1 million ppl, im sure you heard the last holy ghost conference i nigeria just some months ago had more than 1 million people in attendance,”

A question for you: In Nigeria, who are in the majority, Muslims or Christians? With proof o.



“ pls apart from the occultic gathering clled hajj where blood is always shed where else can an islamic gathering get that number of adherents, by the way i believe earnestly that there is something demonic about hajj, if not why is it that people must die every single year,its either they are trampled upon or something of that nature, you dont hear ppl dying i jerusalem pilgrimage my supposition is that maybe it is the kaba idols untill you muslims started bowing down to the image as your own idol; “

I think what I wrote to Kola Oloye will answer this go and read it again.

‘A ni se Afefe ti fe a ti ri furo edie.’ (Apology to elder Olabowale).

“Nay, We fling (send down) the truth (this Qur'ân) against the falsehood (disbelief), so it destroys it, and behold, it (falsehood) is vanished. And woe to you for that (lie) which you ascribe (to Us) (against Allâh).” [Q21: 18].

Any other thing?

Salam,

No any problem, abulbanaat. I understand your point. And may Allah, the Exalted, bless and reward you handsomely for the great job, amen.

muhsin:

Salam,

No any problem, abulbanaat. I understand your point. And may Allah, the Exalted, bless and reward you handsomely for the great job, amen.

so you are only praying for your co believer?i though unbelievers required more prayers

GODSON2009:

so you are only praying for your co believer?i though unbelievers required more prayers

Thats true; but not in such a scenario.

Any way, may Allah, the Exalted, guide you to the straight and right path, ameen.

@muslims
I will advice u free this guy called  godson,he is not ready to  be guided to the rite path.

He dat Allah guides will never go astray and he that go astray will never get the rite path.

I will suggest if u can use your time to educate more on Islam instead of wasting on people that are not ready to be  guided

may ALLAH help us through amin

@alimat

Your advice is a golden one but you must know that it is not GODSON alone that we address here, we are reaching out to thousands of Muslims who may have one way or the other been affected by the calumnies people like GODSON spread about. Thus this will serve as a means of reposing confidence in them, and to cause the non-Muslims everlasting perdition if they do not accept Islam.

And we should not lose hope on the GODSON-like people too, perhaps Allaah may soften their hearts.

I know of a sister who is out of Nigeria now who used to be a 'conc' Christian, brothers that Allaah used to bring her back to Islam said then whenever they discussed Islam with her, she would 'beat her chest confidently for Christ' not knowing that she was being wounded from within, at last she accepted Islam. It was very surprising to those brothers. Now the sister has committed the whole Qur'aan into memory (so I learnt) and she can speak perfect Arabic.

Actually there are some other threads wherein we teach ourselves Islam, you can check them out.

@Muhsin, do not mind GODSON, he is marvelling at our sense of brotherhood. Please I need more of your prayers,

Alhamdulillah.

Is there any huja 4 dis word "karaam Allahu wajhahu"

Please I need Arabic softwares that can help me not only to be able to read Arabic because I can do that but that will help me get the intonations right...