martin98:

First of all, the Catholic Church also baptise by immersion. The Catholic Church baptise in three ways. By immersion, by sprinkling and by pouring.
To your point about baptism only by immersion, take a look at the baptism of the jailer and his household in the night. How could they have possibly baptise by immersion at that time.

Acts 16:34 tells us that the baptism was not done inside the house, and so not by sprinkling. Nobody even knew what sprinkling was then and Paul certainly knew that pouring water on someone was not baptism. If it was done by sprinkling, there wouldn't have been any need to go outside the house as Paul would've just taken a cup of water sprinkled on them. We don't know whether the baptism was done in a pool or whatever, but we know it was done outside the house and so it was by immersion.

The method of pouring/sprinkling was introduced much later by the catholic church, and it's not biblical.

driy65:
I don't know why protestant and pentecostal on nairaland like robbing in catholics in any discussion....a church dat has existed 4 two thousand yrs with over 1.3 billion members..??..y dnt u build up your faith and stop rubbin your frustrations on catholics ??...na envy go finish una..

This is not about churches. This is about the salvation of your soul. This is about obeying GOD. Judaism had existed for about 2 thousand years before Christ came and abolished it.

By the time you realise that the way that leads into destruction is broad, and that many people go in it, you'll think again about large populations.

Davidblen:

Thanks For The Website But The Verse U Put Says 'To Preach The Gospel' But We Are Talking About Salvation

Emphasis, if baptism was as important as some as made out to be here, why the apostle say Christ did not send him to baptize? and don't forget, baptism was one of the major reason there was division in the Corinth church (this was not just a congregation, but all the churches in the Corinth state) and Paul in addressing that said Jesus did send him to baptize, but to preach, a man can only be saved or have salvation when he hears and believe the gospel! anything else is a false conversion.

DoctorAlien:


This is not about churches. This is about the salvation of your soul. This is about obeying GOD. Judaism had existed for about 2 thousand years before Christ came and abolished it.

By the time you realise that the way that leads into destruction is broad, and that many people go in it, you'll think again about large populations.

Guy, run ur own spiritual race and leave mine....hw many souls av u won for christ?? instead u are soo fixated on catholics and their activities..leave ur life and let others live thiers .stop takin ur fustration or lack of self satisfaction on others...i av no business with ur pentecostal vieews

Baptism of The Holy Spirit makes you Born Again and it's necessary for Salvation.

driy65:
Guy, run ur own spiritual race and leave mine....hw many souls av u won for christ?? instead u are soo fixated on catholics and their activities..leave ur life and let others live thiers .stop takin ur fustration or lack of self satisfaction on others...i av no business with ur pentecostal vieews

Okay. I wish you all the best.

DoctorAlien:


The books of the Bible existed before the church. They church simply put them together.

The church doesn't have the authority to interprete the Bible wrongly for material gain. The Holy Spirit is given to every believer, and He interpretes the Bible to them.

I wish you well. And I pray that you'll realise soonest that nobody will be admitted into Heaven by church.

Erm! You may want to revisit bible history.It's very obvious that the NT books were written to an existing church.

btoks:

Erm! You may want to revisit bible history.It's very obvious that the NT books were written to an existing church.

The epistles were addressed to specific churches, although they are useful to all Christians.

Don't try to insinuate that the catholic church existed when these Gospels and epistles were written. The catholic church came into existence much later. You may want to revisit your church history.

Ioannes:


Well I'd like to think that they, of all the other "churches", would know how best to do it since they're like 2000 years old.

Really? Catholic Religion is up to 2000yrs?

Even if it is, should that justify what they do?

The organization has never done any single thing in the Bible right.

They perverts every thing.

sportyblinks:
You are all daft on this trend

Mr intelligent guy, its not trend but thread. You see how smart you are?

OlamideGirl:
no......it is not a criteria cause if it is, den what did Jesus come to do den

Even d most common scripture john3:16 says for God so love the world that he gave us his only begotten son that who soever believes in him would not perish but have ever lasting life

meaning all we need to do is to believe which is the only criteria to SALVATION and ETERNAL LIFE

So you call Jesus a liar for telling us to preach and then Baptize in the name of the Father,Son and the Holy Ghost?

OlamideGirl:



That happened before Jesus died

Jesus death, burial and resurrection nullifies all dose things
All we need to do now is to believe

Are you serious? So when was Paul baptized? when was the Ethiopian Eunuch Baptzed? was it before or after Jesus' resurrection? All the resurrections that took place in the Acts of Apostle was done before Jesus died? Na waooo.

ochedikevictor:

is there anything like baptismal class in the bible?
remember not to add or subtract from Gods word as warned in the book of revelation
today if u hear his voice do not harden ur heart

The steps to salvation is simple
hear Gods word. Rom.10;17 faith comes by hearing
believe. Mark.16;15-16 whoever believes and is baptized will be saved
repent
confess Christ.
be baptized gal.3;27 for as many of you that are baptized into Christ have put on Christ

The Gal 3:27 you quoted indicted you.

Ioannes:


So what happens if you meet a pagan in the desert where there's no water body just a bottle of water and he's about to die and requests for baptism from you?

If i remember very well, the Ethiopian Eunuch was Baptized in the dessert and it wasn't done by sprinkling.

Good News Translation Acts 8:36 As they traveled down the road, they came to a place where there was some water, and the official said, “Here is some water. What is to keep me from being baptized?”

The Spirit of disobedience seeks excuses.

Ioannes:


So what happens if you meet a pagan in the desert where there's no water body just a bottle of water and he's about to die and requests for baptism from you?

If i remember very well, the Ethiopian Eunuch was Baptized in the dessert and it wasn't done by sprinkling.

Good News Translation Acts 8:36 As they traveled down the road, they came to a place where there was some water, and the official said, “Here is some water. What is to keep me from being baptized?”

The Spirit of disobedience seeks excuses.

Jesus was immersed, all the Apostles were immersed but the catholic church says we must sprinkle. they try to change everything.

DoctorAlien:


Acts 16:34 tells us that the baptism was not done inside the house, and so not by sprinkling. Nobody even knew what sprinkling was then and Paul certainly knew that pouring water on someone was not baptism. If it was done by sprinkling, there wouldn't have been any need to go outside the house as Paul would've just taken a cup of water sprinkled on them. We don't know whether the baptism was done in a pool or whatever, but we know it was done outside the house and so it was by immersion.

The method of pouring/sprinkling was introduced much later by the catholic church, and it's not biblical.

Pls where did the bible say they were baptized outside the house? The Bible said the jailer took Paul and Silas to his home and the entire household was baptized that night. Acts 16:23-34

analice107:


If i remember very well, the Ethiopian Eunuch was Baptized in the dessert and it wasn't done by sprinkling.

Good News Translation Acts 8:36 As they traveled down the road, they came to a place where there was some water, and the official said, “Here is some water. What is to keep me from being baptized?”

The Spirit of disobedience seeks excuses.

Jesus was immersed, all the Apostles were immersed but the catholic church says we must sprinkle. they try to change everything.

The Catholic Church didn't say we must sprinkle. We either immerse, sprinkle or pour water on the head.

DoctorAlien:


The epistles were addressed to specific churches, although they are useful to all Christians.

Don't try to insinuate that the catholic church existed when these Gospels and epistles were written. The catholic church came into existence much later. You may want to revisit your church history.

Jesus establised one church. This one church later in the first century became known as the Catholic Church to separate it from the heretical groups forming at the time. You may want to read Ignatius' letter to the symaneans circa 110 AD for e.g.
The specific churches you refer to were all one as intended by Christ. Please look to Acts 15 to see how disputes were resolved; by going to Church council (this still happens even in our day).

There were obviously splits from this one Church as is usual amongst human beings (major ones being after Chalcedon council 451AD, 1054AD East /west Schism), but this one church remained.

Please research Christian history to see how all these specific churches held the church of Rome as the preeminent one although some may have disagreed.

There is a lot more to Christianity than the last 100 years of misguided sola scriptura. (You can see that all those who profess Sola Scriptura on this thread have different views on baptism) The matters of baptism were settled centuries ago and infant baptism, baptism by sprinkling, pouring (check out didache link http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0714.htm) are all accepted.

martin98:

Pls where did the bible say they were baptized outside the house? The Bible said the jailer took Paul and Silas to his home and the entire household was baptized that night. Acts 16:23-34

V.34 records that they came into the house, which means they went out. There wouldn't have been need to go out if they did sprinkling.

btoks,

The catholic church may claim to descend from Jesus Christ directly, but their practices say the opposite. The catholic church has gone deep into apostasy, and almost all of her practices today differ from the Bible and what the early apostles did.

Merely uniting a group of churches under the Bishop of Rome doesn't mean descent from the early apostles. Those who descended from the early apostles are those still do as the early apostles did. The catholic church actually clings dearly for its life to apostolic descent to deceive people into thinking that they are not making any mistake.

The catholic church has been polluted by pagan practices like sun worship. The catholic church practises paganism in the name of Christianity. They have replaced GOD's word with the traditions of men.

It's a pity. The same thing Jesus warned against in Matt. 15:9. Have you ever wondered who the woman of Rev. 17 is? She is the catholic church.

Maybe you should study her well.

martin98:

The Catholic Church didn't say we must sprinkle. We either immerse, sprinkle or pour water on the head.

Wait, let me remember how long ago i left Catholic Church. hmmm... not that long. And i never saw any one baptized by immersion. And i happen to come from where there's plenty of water bodies.

Immersion is not part of Catholicism, almost everyone in my immediate and extended family are still catholics, so more or less, am stills in there. There's nothing i don't know about it.

[quote author=laikas post=49667486]
No, I'm not. why do u ask.[/quote your emotional approach to the question made me asked.

DoctorAlien:
btoks,

The catholic church may claim to descend from Jesus Christ directly, but their practices say the opposite. The catholic church has gone deep into apostasy, and almost all of her practices today differ from the Bible and what the early apostles did.

Merely uniting a group of churches under the Bishop of Rome doesn't mean descent from the early apostles. Those who descended from the early apostles are those still do as the early apostles did. The catholic church actually clings dearly for its life to apostolic descent to deceive people into thinking that they are not making any mistake.

The catholic church has been polluted by pagan practices like sun worship. The catholic church practises paganism in the name of Christianity. They have replaced GOD's word with the traditions of men.

It's a pity. The same thing Jesus warned against in Matt. 15:9. Have you ever wondered who the woman of Rev. 17 is? She is the catholic church.

Maybe you should study her well.

I'm assuming you're mormon or SDA. If you're saying that the church Jesus established went apostate then we need not believe anything else Jesus said as you've just implied he's a liar.
It's historical fact that the catholic church has Apostolic succesion, you won't find this with the CLDS or any of the so called sola scriptura adherent churches. The list of Bishops of Rome was recorded from day 1.
Sun worship in the CC!, you've got your facts absolutely wrong.

Also, nowhere do we find that the bible is the only rule of faith. The bible itself required an authority outside of it to declare it as scripture.

With the centuries passed, people in this age tend to forget all the early church persecutions, councils, disputes,ratifications etc to ensure the Christianity survived .you think you've got the answers 2000 years after!

analice107:


Wait, let me remember how long ago i left Catholic Church. hmmm... not that long. And i never saw any one baptized by immersion. And i happen to come from where there's plenty of water bodies.

Immersion is not part of Catholicism, almost everyone in my immediate and extended family are still catholics, so more or less, am stills in there. There's nothing i don't know about it.

the use of pouring was very likely to address a practical issue as the church grew. every nook and cranny of the world does not have living water (i.e rivers ) running through them. You see this pouring as an option in the didache (in effect the first christian catechism) from the 1st century.
The point of baptism is the use of water and the baptism formula (father, son, Holy spirit ) as directed by Jesus, not the baptismal method. Immersion, pouring & sprinkling are valid methods of baptising.

BTW, there are several Catholic Churches with immersion fonts.I was at an immersion baptism in a CC a few weeks ago in UK.

btoks:

the use of pouring was very likely to address a practical issue as the church grew. every nook and cranny of the world does not have living water (i.e rivers ) running through them. You see this pouring as an option in the didache (in effect the first christian catechism) from the 1st century.
The point of baptism is the use of water and the baptism formula (father, son, Holy spirit ) as directed by Jesus, not the baptismal method. Immersion, pouring & sprinkling are valid methods of baptising.

BTW, there are several Catholic Churches with immersion fonts.I was at an immersion baptism in a CC a few weeks ago in UK.

You say this because you do not know the real essence of Baptism to signify, Death, Burial and Resurrection. If we were taught the significance of Baptism we wont be defending falsehood. Until some years ago, i was standing where you are now, saying the exact same thing, in defends of my Church.

When you start reading Bible sincerely desiring to please God, your eyes will open.

These has nothing to do with denomination. At least, for me, it had no connection because i was immobile for Ten years. For those years, i didn't attend any church, so i was forced to read the Bible for myself.
I Desired to know Christ personally first by reading and following what he says. But before then, i almost fell of the religious wagon.

i was angry with God why he'll allow what happened to me happened, then, JW came, l almost went with them too.

I hated myself for a long time. I was right inside fresh flowing water but had soap in my eyes.

Seek God through the eyes of the scriptures. The Word of Gods speaks right back at you. Seek him away from all noisy doctrines.

btoks:

the use of pouring was very likely to address a practical issue as the church grew. every nook and cranny of the world does not have living water (i.e rivers ) running through them. You see this pouring as an option in the didache (in effect the first christian catechism) from the 1st century.
The point of baptism is the use of water and the baptism formula (father, son, Holy spirit ) as directed by Jesus, not the baptismal method. Immersion, pouring & sprinkling are valid methods of baptising.

BTW, there are several Catholic Churches with immersion fonts.I was at an immersion baptism in a CC a few weeks ago in UK.

You say this because you do not know the real essence of Baptism to signify Death, Burial and Resurrection. If we were taught the significance of Baptism we wont be fixed on defending falsehood. Until some years ago, i was standing where you are right now saying the exact same thing in defends of my Church.

When you start reading the Bible sincerely desiring to please God, your eyes will open.

These has nothing to do with denomination, at least for me, it had no connection because i was immobile for Ten years. For those years, i didn't attend any church, so i was forced to read the Bible for myself.
I Desired to know Christ personally first by reading and following what he says. But before then, i almost fell of the religious wagon.

i was angry with God why he'll allow what happened to me happen, then, JW came, l almost went with them too.

I hated myself for a long time. I was right inside fresh flowing water but had soap in my eyes.

Seek God through the eyes of the scriptures. The Word of Gods speaks right back at you. Seek him away from all noisy doctrines.

btoks,

Please, Jesus Christ did not establish the catholic church which we have today. The RCC was established when pagan Rome gave the bishop of Rome its powers. The catholic church claims that its head is the pope, but we know that the head of the true church is Christ, not a mere man(Eph. 5:23). Jesus left a group of people who were obedient to GOD, and lived by the Scriptures.

Organising a group of churches under a certain bishop doesn't mean apostolic succession. This is very akin to the way the Jews continued to reiterate that they descended from Abraham. We know Jesus' answer to them.

Research well, you will see that the rcc is doing sun worship. It's so cleverly disguised as christianity. Satan is clever. Could you please leave sentiments and try to see if your church is going the way Jesus wants it to?

Please, don't even think that the catholic church wrote the scriptures. Paul referred to Scriptures even in his own time. The Bible is the only creed of doctrine, not human traditions.

analice107:


Wait, let me remember how long ago i left Catholic Church. hmmm... not that long. And i never saw any one baptized by immersion. And i happen to come from where there's plenty of water bodies.

Immersion is not part of Catholicism, almost everyone in my immediate and extended family are still catholics, so more or less, am stills in there. There's nothing i don't know about it.

This is an example of ignorance and arrogance, the cc does immersion. read before u speak about things u dont know.

Ubenedictus:
This is an example of ignorance and arrogance, the cc does immersion. read before u speak about things u dont know.

Oh really? From when and why?

Every Catholic Baptism is done inside the church, how do they do the immersion pls?

.

doctoralien

btoks,
Please, Jesus Christ did not establish the catholic church which we have today. The RCC was established when pagan Rome gave the bishop of Rome its powers. The catholic church claims that its head is the pope, but we know that the head of the true church is Christ, not a mere man(Eph. 5:23). Jesus left a group of people who were obedient to GOD, and lived by the Scriptures.

Please let me know where the church Jesus established is today as the gates of hell can’t prevail against it.

Nobody disputes the fact that Jesus is the head of the Church, in fact he is God. We also know Jesus is King. Please go to Matt 16: 19 and see how this parallels Isaiah 22: 15-24 ( where the king in the Davidic Kingdom gives the keys of the kingdom to Eliakim – [prime minister] with all the power to act in the King’s name) This prefigurement is fulfilled when Jesus gives the keys of the kingdom to Peter, whose successor is the Bishop of Rome ( known as Pope) as all the prime ministers in the Davidic Kingdom had successors.

Jesus left no NT scriptures, these were only written and canonized decades after the ascension. He left a Church

Organising a group of churches under a certain bishop doesn't mean apostolic succession. This is very akin to the way the Jews continued to reiterate that they descended from Abraham. We know Jesus' answer to them.

Through Apostolic succession a bishop can trace his ordination to one of the apostles. The apostles ordained Linus, Clement the successors of Peter in Rome, who in turn ordained others; thus Apostolic Succession. The succession can be traced to bishops in our day.
The apostles laid hands on other disciples, not every event is recorded in the bible, we also have to go to tradition to found out what happened.

Please see following quote from St Iraenus in 180 AD ( within a 150 years of Jesus’ ascension) –
Since, however, it would be very tedious, in such a volume as this, to reckon up the successions of all the Churches, we do put to confusion all those who, in whatever manner, whether by an evil self-pleasing, by vainglory, or by blindness and perverse opinion, assemble in unauthorized meetings; [we do this, I say,] by indicating that tradition derived from the apostles, of the very great, the very ancient, and universally known Church founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul; as also [by pointing out] the faith preached to men, which comes down to our time by means of the successions of the bishops. For it is a matter of necessity that every Church should agree with this Church, on account of its preeminent authority,that is, the faithful everywhere, inasmuch as the tradition has been preserved continuously by those [faithfulmen] who exist everywhere.

The blessed apostles, then, having founded and built up the Church, committed into the hands of Linus the office of the episcopate .........[size=8pt]

Research well, you will see that the rcc is doing sun worship. It's so cleverly disguised as christianity. Satan is clever. Could you please leave sentiments and try to see if your church is going the way Jesus wants it to?

Ridiculous statement. If the CC is doing sun worship, why would it pretend it doesn’t!!

Please, don't even think that the catholic church wrote the scriptures. Paul referred to Scriptures even in his own time. The Bible is the only creed of doctrine, not human traditions

.[/quote]

Paul referred to the OT – there were no NT books in his time – these were yet to be declared as scripture.
Even the Bible itself required an authority outside it to declare it as the Word of God and no where would you find in the Bible that it is the only creed of doctrine. Jesus left a teaching church to be guided by the Holy Spirit

analice107

You say this because you do not know the real essence of Baptism to signify Death, Burial and Resurrection. If we were taught the significance of Baptism we wont be fixed on defending falsehood. Until some years ago, i was standing where you are right now saying the exact same thing in defends of my Church.

And how does this make pouring or sprinkling method any less valid than immersion? Where does it say baptism can’t be done that way? i'll take the what has been practiced through antiquity as led by the Holy spirit over your novel interpretations. Christianity didn't start last month.

By the way, you know absolutely nothing about me to conclude that you were once where I am ....... I’ll say just focus on facts and take out sentiments

When you start reading the Bible sincerely desiring to please God, your eyes will open.

Oh yes, it is good to read the bible. What we don't want is to end up with thousands of different denominations with conflicting doctrines because most people just read through their own lenses and interpret personally.
The bible books were written in a time so far removed from ours, it makes sense to read the scriptures within the context of historical Christianity. Jesus established a church to ensure the truth was taught and Scriptures interpreted correctly.

These has nothing to do with denomination, at least for me, it had no connection because i was immobile for Ten years. For those years, i didn't attend any church, so i was forced to read the Bible for myself.
I Desired to know Christ personally first by reading and following what he says. But before then, i almost fell of the religious wagon.

i was angry with God why he'll allow what happened to me happen, then, JW came, l almost went with them too.

I hated myself for a long time. I was right inside fresh flowing water but had soap in my eyes.

Seek God through the eyes of the scriptures. The Word of Gods speaks right back at you. Seek him away from all noisy doctrines.

[/quote]
So for you it's every man and his bible. Is this what Jesus taught? And do you see unity with this approach?

It's like saying every Nigerian should carry the Constitution and interpret themselves. While they may understand a few things, isn't it ultimately the courts that provide the correct interpretation.


How did you decide by yourself that the books of the bible are in fact scripture?