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Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] - Politics (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by omowolewa: 8:27am On Jan 19, 2017
The man is simply saying grazing reserves aren't available.
Okay, if grass was to be made available, would it be from Benue or Oyo State?
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by greenermodels: 8:41am On Jan 19, 2017
Ioannes:


Since I'm new to this can you pls enlighten me what the difference is between a ranch and a grazing reserve in this regard.
a ranch is a plot of land often fenced with barbed wire where the cattle are permanently kept. grasses and crops like maize are planted for feeding the animals. it's the most productive form of animal production while grazing reserves means that land is reserved all over the country and cattle move all over the country to graze at those places, in other words,it's a normadic form. the truth is all over the world, normadism have or is been banned, for example in the USA, due to constant clashes between normadic cowboys and farmers, the government banned normadic grazing and ordered that all cowboys should own a ranch, that's exactly what we are demanding in Nigeria.that Fulani herdsmen should rear their cattle inside ranches, probable fenced with barbwire like other tribes, we have ranches here in anambra and people live peacefully with each despite the huge amount of cows contained in this ranches. it also makes it easy to adopt modern means of management.farmers also keep cattle in fenced plots in the north, i even know an igbo trader in Niger state that is into it while living peacefully with his neighbors. I'll explain more later in response to any of your questions.

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Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by obailala(m): 9:18am On Jan 19, 2017
coolscott:


What I am saying is that the suggestion that are grass and forages are not nutritious enough is so nonsensical that the only wonder is why this is not 1960, with some one-eyed educated politician fraudulent spilling gabbage to the largely blind populace.

Please, let me help you understand the grossness of the stupid idea and why it feels just too difficult for one too bear.

Firstly, the approximate nutrient content of every herb, grass or forage identified as being able to serve as food for farm animals is known and properly documented. The process for determining nutrient content is called PROXIMATE ANALYSIS.

Do you know the nutrient composition of our legumes and grasses as compared to those found elsewhere? Do you know what makes them high in nutrients and what may make then not so rich in nutrients?

If we assume some factors are affecting our grasses so they are not as nutritious as they should be, so the solution is to import the grass right?

Our rice production has not been up to par with that of many other countries worldwide and what did the fed govt do? It banned the importation of rice. It banned it because everybody knows that with improved cultural practices the rice (which we consume) will yield more.

Now our healthy grasses are doing very well and someone comes up with the lie that they are not doing well and because they are not doing well, we should allocate millions upon million to import...?


Now let me let you know that legumes are always rich in nutrients. It is in their nature to.

As for grasses, when they are young, they are very nutritious. When they grow older, they lose their nutritive value but the fiber content does increase and fiber is also good for the animals.

Grasses that grow among legumes can benefit from the legumes as the legumes provide a nice supply of nitrogen to the soil, which is good for other plants growing in the same soil.

Genetically modified plants are looked down upon in the developed world. In fact, just about all of Europe has banned THE IMPORTATION of all genetically modified agric produce, and for good reason too. Beef from cattle that got feed genetically modified plants will not be spared the contamination and categorisation as GM product because genetically modified material was involved in making it.

I know the govt and minister did not mention anything about GM grass and that is just your inclusion but it is good to make it clear that any kind of rigmarolling only brings us to the conclusion that the whole idea came from a profoundly stupid place that the rest of us still cannot identify or explain.

There are only 2 options here: Either stupidity or fraud.
To the best of my knowledge, most of the rice Nigeria plants today in the current rice revolution were imported improved hybrid rice seedlings which are flood resistant. Except I dont understand the narrative, nobody says the grasses in Nigeria aren't good enough for cows, but getting improved hybrid grass seedlings which when grown, would have more packed nutrients and can probably survive harsh drought conditions, that doesnt sound like a stupid idea as long as we are importing just for production and not consumption.
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by ZoneBslayer(m): 9:38am On Jan 19, 2017
Ioannes:


Lol. I will accommodate your bragging. You are comparing apples and oranges.

Igbos have a very radically different tradition (way of life) to the Fulanis.

If you were brought up to value cattle rearing more than formal education and to hold in high esteem the practice of roaming with your cattle, then yes you will not see anything wrong with grazing the land rather than importing grass.

Sometimes, you need the ability to be able to put yourselves in others' shoes just to understand.

You esteem trade, that's why you think it's more superior to cattle grazing.

Yet I'd prefer to have a nation of cattle grazers who will be able to provide quality beef, hide, milk, manure, and poultry feeds from cow horns for export than a nation of traders who only import so as to sell at higher prices.

Both complement each other, the producer and the trader, and both deserve the support of government.

Your lifestyle of trading is not superior to other lifestyles. Take note.
you missed the point, if cattle rearing was an Igbo culture, they would have gone a more modern route by now..the Igbos welcome change and progressive ideas..do you know the the energy and meat those cows lose everyday as a result of their constant movement? that alone is very counterproductive for anyone who is serious about getting value for his money..why are those Fulani herdsmen averse to progressive change? even the educated among them still thread the same path... I just tire..

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Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by Nobody: 9:59am On Jan 19, 2017
ZoneBslayer:

you missed the point, if cattle rearing was an Igbo culture, they would have gone a more modern route by now..the Igbos welcome change and progressive ideas..do you know the the energy and meat those cows lose everyday as a result of their constant movement? that alone is very counterproductive for anyone who is serious about getting value for his money..why are those Fulani herdsmen averse to progressive change? even the educated among them still thread the same path... I just tire..

There is a reason why cattle rearing isn't an Igbo culture. And that's the point I'm trying to make.

If cattle rearing by nomadism were to be an Igbo culture most of you would be illiterates, because your parents would be moving you around so much you won't be able to go to school.

And it's when you are educated that you think of using technology to change your lifestyle.

I hope you get it now.

You consider yourselves traders right? Do you think the way majority of you guys trade is actually the best way to trade? But it's working for you right? And you probably don't feel the need to improve beyond that or probably incapacitated by funds to improve right?

Now apply the same formular to the Fulani cattle rearers.

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Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by Nobody: 10:16am On Jan 19, 2017
greenermodels:
a ranch is a plot of land often fenced with barbed wire where the cattle are permanently kept. grasses and crops like maize are planted for feeding the animals. it's the most productive form of animal production while grazing reserves means that land is reserved all over the country and cattle move all over the country to graze at those places, in other words,it's a normadic form. the truth is all over the world, normadism have or is been banned, for example in the USA, due to constant clashes between normadic cowboys and farmers, the government banned normadic grazing and ordered that all cowboys should own a ranch, that's exactly what we are demanding in Nigeria.that Fulani herdsmen should rear their cattle inside ranches, probable fenced with barbwire like other tribes, we have ranches here in anambra and people live peacefully with each despite the huge amount of cows contained in this ranches. it also makes it easy to adopt modern means of management.farmers also keep cattle in fenced plots in the north, i even know an igbo trader in Niger state that is into it while living peacefully with his neighbors. I'll explain more later in response to any of your questions.

Thanks.

Now here's the problem. And I think it's the fundamental issue underlying this constant spate of violence.

Fulani nomadic herdsmen roam their cattle not only because they are looking for green grass, but more significantly because it is a way of life, a very important one for them.

It was a practise of necessity and survival, now I suspect it has become a cultural norm.

Asking them to abandon that way of life is going to be tough. Humans abhor change.

They could be asked to limit their grazing to their states, but that would negate the freedom of movement and rights to live and do business in other states as guaranteed by law.

Hence a grazing corridor could be established that would lead them from one ranch to another spread all over the nation so their cattle can have pasture even in dry season.

We can't always copy what we see in the west.

Nigeria is a peculiar country with a peculiar mess (also known as penkelemes), so our solution can't be expected to be cut and dried and imported from the US.
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by greenermodels: 10:57am On Jan 19, 2017
Ioannes:


Thanks.

Now here's the problem. And I think it's the fundamental issue underlying this constant spate of violence.

Fulani nomadic herdsmen roam their cattle not only because they are looking for green grass, but more significantly because it is a way of life, a very important one for them.

It was a practise of necessity and survival, now I suspect it has become a cultural norm.

Asking them to abandon that way of life is going to be tough. Humans abhor change.

They could be asked to limit their grazing to their states, but that would negate the freedom of movement and rights to live and do business in other states as guaranteed by law.

Hence a grazing corridor could be established that would lead them from one ranch to another spread all over the nation so their cattle can have pasture even in dry season.

We can't always copy what we see in the west.

Nigeria is a peculiar country with a peculiar mess (also known as penkelemes), so our solution can't be expected to be cut and dried and imported from the US.
other nations forced their nomadic tubes to settle and it's the best for every body, there's no way you can set up ranches for nomads since the ranches would collapse without a private ownership to maintain it.also settled life means education for their children, more security from cattle rustlers and ability to monitor the herdsmen since they can't commit a crime and disappear the next minute.nomadism is dying lifestyle, we must adapt to the times.there are also other problems involved.
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by richeso: 12:37pm On Jan 19, 2017
abeg make una no vex oo. is this cattle thing a federal goverment business ?
as the feds dey give this people lands as grazing reserve and even dey think of importing grass ( lol )
all this for a private business of a particular persons ? or for government ?

why the feds no do same to other sectors ? like bring big machines for us to dey produce most things them banned ?
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by Nobody: 3:50pm On Jan 19, 2017
greenermodels:
other nations forced their nomadic tubes to settle and it's the best for every body, there's no way you can set up ranches for nomads since the ranches would collapse without a private ownership to maintain it.also settled life means education for their children, more security from cattle rustlers and ability to monitor the herdsmen since they can't commit a crime and disappear the next minute.nomadism is dying lifestyle, we must adapt to the times.there are also other problems involved.

Easier said that done.

You probably haven't seen where a group of people fought to the death to protect and preserve their way of life.

Good luck to the Nigerian government.
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by Nobody: 3:56pm On Jan 19, 2017
For every legal import made, a politician benefits. Importation of grass is another legal means by which some politicians hope to enrich themselves.
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by coolscott(m): 8:01am On Mar 23, 2017
DelGardo:


You appear to have some idea about these matters but a few questions will reveal that you have set out to mislead people here on.

- Can you please mention one type of grass that we have in Nigeria that compares with alfafa (mind you alfafa is not the grass targeted) in terms of meat and dairy production?

- are you aware that non of the grass grown traditional produces seeds?

- Are u aware that because they don't have seeds only vegetative propagation is possible with local grass and that that makes growing them very problematic?

- Are you aware that only grass seeds will be imported for growing in Nigeria based on FG's proposal not actual grass?

- Are you also aware that the biggest cattle farm in the world in Saudi Arabia feeds the animals with imported grass?

- Are you aware that Cassava and Palm oil producing countries imported seeds from Nigeria and have gone ahead to overtake us in production of these crops?

If properly done we will witness reduced friction between herdsmen and local communities, experience higher yield in meat and milk as well as have export potentials that will grow GDP and foreign reserves.

Stop all the sensationalism.

It is very false that our grasses do not have seeds

And also false that the vegetative propagation of grasses (and plants in general) is problematic.

On the contrary, we have what is referred to as noxious weeds (noxious because without planting or cultivating them, the keep relentlessly propagating themselves ).

Falsehood + falsehood just makes one bigger ball of falsehood
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by Fx55(m): 8:28am On Mar 23, 2017
byrron:
Nigerians arrived at that level through collective stupidity.
I disagree with you. I and my people weren't part of that stupidity. We screamed and shouted to the roof tops but the Zombies were baying for more blood.
Re: Just Wondering How We Came To This Level Intellectually [photo] by Nobody: 11:56am On Mar 23, 2017
Fx55:
I disagree with you. I and my people weren't part of that stupidity. We screamed and shouted to the roof tops but the Zombies were baying for more blood.

Your assertions are valid!

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